Tupac’s murder: solved at last?

2 Sep 2026 · 33 min · 19 chapters

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In short

The episode revisits Tupac Shakur’s murder and the long-awaited Nevada conviction of one of the men charged: Dwayne Keith Davis (“Keefe D.”). It opens with Tupac’s 1996 shooting after the Mike Tyson fight in Las Vegas, his death six days later, and the 30-year lack of accountability amid enduring conspiracy theories.

Guests

William Shaw, a writer who researched the West Coast hip-hop scene for his book Westsiders and met Tupac in Beverly Hills after his Dannemora prison release; and Jessica Hill of the Associated Press, who covered Davis’s trial in Nevada.

Key claims

prosecutors relied heavily on Davis’s own words (memoir Compton Street Legend and prior statements) rather than forensics; Davis was convicted of first-degree murder with a deadly weapon though the gunman’s identity remains uncertain.

Notable examples

Tupac’s prison sentence for sexual assault; his 1994 New York shooting; the Tyson-night altercation involving Davis’s nephew Orlando Anderson; and the jury’s three-hour guilty verdict.

Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.

Chapters

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Conviction Announcement

0:09 to 0:25

Announcement of a conviction related to Tupac's murder case.

“Today, finally, a conviction for one of Tupac's killers.”

Tupac's Background

0:25 to 0:49

Overview of Tupac's career and impact in the music industry.

“and we are at a Nas concert at the Nassau Coliseum in Queens, New York The show has been halted midway through for some big breaking news 6 days earlier, Tupac Shakur had been shot in a drive-by ambush in Las Vegas.”

Tupac's Rise to Fame

0:49 to 2:02

Discussion of Tupac's achievements and his cultural significance.

“He was just 25, and already one of the biggest artists in America.”

Introduction of Guest William Shaw

2:02 to 2:39

William Shaw discusses his experiences with Tupac and the hip-hop scene.

“Meanwhile, his legend has only grown, along with the conspiracies surrounding his death.”

William Shaw's Encounters with Tupac

2:39 to 4:23

William recalls his meetings with Tupac and provides personal anecdotes.

“the life, death and legacy of Tupac Shakur.”

Tupac's Childhood and Family

4:23 to 4:52

Insights into Tupac's upbringing and the influences on his life.

“They had artists like NWA, Snoop Dogg, people like that.”

Tupac's Impact and Gang Culture

4:52 to 7:11

Exploration of Tupac's involvement in gang culture and the environment around him.

“How would you describe what it was like growing up?”

The Violence of Los Angeles

7:11 to 10:40

Discussion on the violent climate of Los Angeles during Tupac's rise.

“And Los Angeles was the first city to really take the focus away from New York in the hip-hop scene.”

Tupac's Psychological State

10:40 to 12:43

Exploration of Tupac's mental health and self-awareness regarding violence.

“says, you know, in any kind of way, challenges, I have to fight.”

Tupac's Death and Its Impact

12:43 to 14:00

Recollection of the day Tupac was shot and the cultural impact of his death.

“What had he achieved in such a short career?”
Show all 19 chapters

Cultural Impact of Tupac's Death

14:00 to 15:00

Explore how Tupac's death resonated culturally and personally.

“It was a sports bar so there was a big TV screen and we all just kind of watched it just like you know just dazed.”

The Trial of Dwayne Davis

15:00 to 22:20

Detailed coverage of the trial surrounding Tupac's murder and its context.

“Jessica Hill, you're a reporter for the Associated Press and you have been in court in Nevada in the past few weeks covering the trial of the only man to ever be charged in connection with Tupac's murder.”

Evidence and Testimonies in Court

22:20 to 26:00

Discussion on the evidence presented and witness testimonies during the trial.

“I'm going to keep it from the cold of the streets.”

Verdict and Implications

26:00 to 28:00

Reflections on the jury's verdict in the context of Tupac's legacy.

“Coming up, will a guilty verdict put the two-pack conspiracies to bed?”

The Context of Tupac's Murder

28:00 to 29:02

Explore the social dynamics and familial connections surrounding Tupac's murder.

“guy and said, you're from the South, which is a gang thing to say.”

Reflections on Celebrity Trials

29:02 to 29:55

Discuss the implications of the recent verdict in the context of celebrity culture.

“That's not the smartest thing to do, is it?”

Societal Issues Around Violence

29:55 to 30:50

Consider the systemic issues related to violence in communities and the lack of accountability.

“Davis will put all of that to bed once and for all?”

The Cycle of Violence in Los Angeles

30:50 to 31:41

Examine personal experiences of violence and the broader implications for youth in Los Angeles.

“went on at that time, because the police were absolutely hopeless at the time.”

William Shaw's Perspective

31:41 to 32:20

Hear from novelist William Shaw on youth and violence in society.

“hadn't been a victim of violence, who hadn't had a close friend or relation murdered without ever finding out who did it.”
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Transcript

Automatic transcript. May contain errors.

0:00This is The Guardian.

0:09Today, finally, a conviction for one of Tupac's killers.

0:24It's September 1996 and we are at a Nas concert at the Nassau Coliseum in Queens, New York The show has been halted midway through for some big breaking news

0:486 days earlier, Tupac Shakur had been shot in a drive-by ambush in Las Vegas. He was just 25, and already one of the biggest artists in America.

1:05He'd just released a huge album, All Eyes On Me, which spawned two number one singles.

1:22He'd worked with some of hip-hop's greatest.

1:33and starred in Hollywood films. I see you finally decided to join us. Make a dress. It seemed he could do anything. You would? I put it down. I put it down. If it's about rap music, if it's about acting, whatever, I try to get, I want to get into the head seat, to the front seat. So I do what I got to do to get to the front seat. I got to excel at it. It can't be a small thing. And then he died. For 30 years, no one has been held to account for his murder. Meanwhile, his legend has only grown, along with the conspiracies surrounding his death. Then, on Monday afternoon, in a Las Vegas court, came a resolution.

2:13Of sorts. I find the defendant, Dwayne Keith Davis, as follows. Count one, murder with use of a deadly weapon. Guilty of first-degree murder with use of a deadly weapon. dated this 31st date of August 2026. Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, is this your verdict as read? So say you won, so say you all? Yes.

2:37From The Guardian, I'm Helen Pitt. Today in Focus, the life, death and legacy of Tupac Shakur.

2:47William Shaw, in the late 1990s, you were spending a lot of time in Los Angeles researching your book Westsiders about the West Coast hip-hop scene. And you actually met Tupac, didn't you? Take us back there. What was it like? I did on a couple of occasions, actually. Yeah, I was being sent to interview him by an American magazine. First time was actually in the Beverly Hills Hotel, in this swanky, swanky restaurant, just after he got out from his prison sentence up in Dannemora Prison. So we were at this restaurant having a meal, and he's like, look, look over there, he's going. and it was Emma Thompson and Anthony Hopkins.

3:23And of course, he was a huge Anthony Hopkins fan. So it was a bizarre contrast for him. And he was, you know, he sat, I almost remember the sort of like peach coloured tablecloths and the fine cutlery. And it was just this bizarre conversation talking about his time in prison and then putting this luxury life in Los Angeles. So remind us what he was in prison for. So he was serving a prison sentence for sexual assault on a young woman, a sentence, I think, from between 18 months to four years he was going to serve. and it had been allegedly a very brutal assault, and the judge specifically said it was a brutal assault on a young woman.

3:58He always denied it, and he was out on appeal from the prison in Dannemora. Suge Knight basically bailed him out with all the money he was making from the record business. He really wanted Tupac on his label, so he got him out of prison literally with money. Yeah, and Suge Knight's real name, Marion Suge Knight, was the boss of Death Row Records, which he co-founded with Dr Dre and others, And it was a massive label in the 90s. They had artists like NWA, Snoop Dogg, people like that. Yeah. So Tupac was finally out of prison. He was leading his best life, really. He was leading his perfect sort of life, the one that he'd yearned for for a long time, where he had a great position to make a lot of music, a lot of people around him.

4:41And here I was in the Beverly Hills Hilton having a very posh dinner with him and quoting Robert Frost's poetry at me because he was an incredibly erudite man. Came from a very rich cultural kind of family. Give me a characterisation of your childhood. How would you describe what it was like growing up? I was the total opposite of what I am right now. I was quiet, withdrawn, I read a lot, I wrote poetry, I kept a diary. His mother was Afeni Shakur, one of the Black Panthers. She had been tried in the 70s, I think, as one of the sort of principal Black Panthers. and had called him Tupac Amaru Shakur, naming him after these South American kings.

5:25Something which he regarded as, he was proud of, but he also kind of regarded as a massive burden. And obviously everybody at school took piss out of him because he was called Tupac, One Pack or whatever. They just, and he had, so he had to carry around this thing of coming with this incredible political legacy of his shoulder of black resistance. His mother had then descended into kind of a terrible period of cocaine addiction. He was carrying a lot, but he was also incredibly well-read and understood a lot of the history around that. So you met Tupac in 1995. How big a star was he by that point?

5:59He was becoming massive at that point. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome acclaimed rap artist and Grammy nominee, Tupac.

6:15I'm not a massive hip-hop head, weirdly enough. I was really interested in the whole hip-hop scene around Los Angeles at the time. And so I was chasing around, asking my editor, can I interview hip-hop stars? Because I was really fascinated with what was going on in that West Coast hip-hop scene, which you have to remember at the time was quite reviled by a lot of the East Coast. Then suddenly you've got these people like Tupac moving from the East to the West to be with that sort of new energy, which was a very narrative-based rap. And so he was suddenly blown up into the biggest rap star in the States at the time.

6:53Tell me about the West Coast world of LA that he entered into when he moved over. I mean, I moved to Los Angeles to report on what was going on there because it became really obvious when the first of the gangster rappers McCann coming through that something very bizarre and very dark was happening in Los Angeles. And Los Angeles was the first city to really take the focus away from New York in the hip-hop scene. The West Coast scene was narrative, and they're describing all these kind of outrageous murders. And when it was first reported over here, people really took it on as a kind of, oh, they're just making up these really violent gangster fantasies.

7:29And then I went to interview people. I remember interviewing Coolio. And of course, Coolio was sort of like thought of as pop rap. Gangster's paradise.

7:41I said to him, have you ever seen a dead body? And he began to list all the people he'd seen killed, actually witnessed murders of. And at that point, the penny started to drop that this was a real cataclysm going on in Los Angeles. And the Reagan legacy was to cut a lot of welfare to the inner cities. And that had thrown people on the black economy, which meant car washes, all those sort of things like that, but also a lot of drug sales. Other gangs can't come here and sell dope in your area. You control this area. They're the infamous LA gangs, known across the country for their violent criminal activity, drive-by shootings, drug dealing, and fierce turf rivalry.

8:22The place had really become balkanized. And there's a really interesting sort of cultural logic you can follow in Los Angeles from this ghetto that had been established when workers were invited there in the 40s and 50s to work in all the factories and the industrial Los Angeles and then the Jim Crow laws that forced them into these ghettos and the decline in standard of life and the competition between individual neighbourhoods for basic resources which kind of fed into these gang conflicts which eventually ended up being labelled in the in the colours wars of the bloods Why being a gang? What's in it for you?

8:55What's in it? I mean, you get killed, right? Yeah. You mean some of your friends have been killed? Yeah. What a simple cause. What's the simple cause? Of being a blood. Going down with the blood. And this was a maelstrom. At the time, I can remember just looking at murder figures and thinking these are absolutely outrageous and trying to do the calculations. And I was working out that in America, during that period that I was there, if you compared it to the Vietnam War, the death rates amongst the African-American population were between 150 % and 200 % higher than the entire Vietnam Cull. And the real point, I think, what Tupac was going into was it was an open wound at the time of this horrendous amount of death rate happening on those streets around really geographically not a huge part of California.

9:45You've described so vividly the violent world that Tupac found himself in. Did he get involved in any of that gang culture or was he just rapping about it? No, he got involved in it. He got involved with the Mob Pyroos, which was from Suge's neighbourhood. They were surrounding him as bodyguards and stuff like that. So he was sort of like, he was around those people. They were the sort of people that were surrounding him when he was in Can-Am Studios. He admitted himself he had a very fragile sense of his own masculinity. When we went to Can-Am Studios and he was talking about that, he was just surrounded by it and we He's playing me tracks from the upcoming album.

10:18He was talking a lot about that, about his need not to be challenged and his need to prove himself as a man. And he's talking about his father a lot and his upbringing because he didn't know his father. And another person who his mother lived with was supposedly his father and he believed it was his father. Then he found his biological father. He was really messed up by a lot of that. And he said, I cannot, if somebody challenges me and says, says, you know, in any kind of way, challenges, I have to fight. And he said, this is weird and I shouldn't be doing it. I know. But he was in that kind of mindset.

10:51I mean, he was a young man in his 20s. Interesting that he was self-aware enough to recognise that. Definitely. He was definitely self-aware about that sort of thing. I mean, he was kind of slightly horrified, but he also, you know, he said it has a kind of, you know, he was talking about how his, you know, in his dreams, he'd wake up gnashing his teeth and stuff like that. And he knew there was something completely unresolved in him about all that stuff. And, you know, I think that was shared by a lot of young men at the time. And I don't know how well that works psychologically, but there was obviously a huge amount of absent fatherhood within that sort of community.

11:22There was also other amazing things in that community. I mean, the extended family network in a lot of those African-American communities in Los Angeles was phenomenal and strong. But, you know, there was a query about what was causing male violence. And at the time, a lot of the explanation was going on to absent fatherhood and Tupac certainly believed that was a major part of his own psyche. I needed a male influence in my life and these were the males. The other males who could have been a more positive influence on me were too scared to come where I was or they didn't have the money or they didn't have the heart or whatever.

11:54So Tupac had already been the victim of gun violence in 1994 because that is when he was shot five times and robbed in New York in the lobby of Quad Recording Studios. He survived and he long believed that it was all a set up by figures in the music industry. Did he seem kind of paranoid or hypervigilant when you met him? So we drove from the restaurant to Can-Am Studios and I'm pretty sure I was in Tupac's Jaguar. Yeah, I was in and he was he had this Jaguar. It was an open top Jaguar. So I was driving down the streets with Tupac and a car backfired and he flinched. And I noticed that and he talked about it afterwards.

12:32And he said, I said, did you think that was a gunshot? And he said, yeah. So he was kind of, you know, he was primed and he was laughing about it afterwards. But yeah. And he was only 25 when he died. Yeah. Shocking, isn't it? What had he achieved in such a short career? I mean, I think even before his death, he had become an iconic and incredibly charismatic. he was one of the most beautiful men of the time i mean he was incredibly he was really gorgeous you know i met so many other sort of female pop star uh hip-hop stars who kind of was him yeah me and tupac we had a thing you know he was he attracted people because he was a great actor as well and that's kind of forgotten he did a couple of films where his acting is really great and i'm sure if he'd lived his acting career would have carried on because the camera loved Tupac.

13:20And that might have been a way out of for this kind of very confrontational life that he'd got himself stuck into. Let's talk about the 7th of September 1996. Chakor was shot four times after leaving the Mike Tyson boxing match in Las Vegas in a car driven by Marion Suge Knight, the head of his label, Death Row Records. When did you first hear that Tupac had been shot and then when he subsequently died a few days later. I remember hearing that evening and I can remember being aware because it took a while for the importance of it to to register in here but having been in Los Angeles you kind of thought this is going to be huge and this is going to really affect people a lot.

13:58When I heard that Tupac died I was cooking in a restaurant. It was a sports bar so there was a big TV screen and we all just kind of watched it just like you know just dazed. A lot of people that worked at the job that I worked at didn't understand Tupac I didn't understand the music so we're looking at us like what's what's wrong what's the big deal get over it and it's like nah this is a really fucked up day for the longest it becomes a cultural moment doesn't it a death of somebody or other who seems to embody so much of the zeitgeist at the time especially when he dies by the very thing he's talking about I mean I do remember I just want to say that when we were in the studio that same day, the first time I met him, he said, I know I'm going to die in violence.

14:44And I said, you know? And he said, yeah, I know. And that wasn't an extraordinary thing to say in some ways, because a lot of young men did. But on the other hand, he also kind of, he clearly wasn't running away from some of that conflict at the time.

15:04Jessica Hill, you're a reporter for the Associated Press and you have been in court in Nevada in the past few weeks covering the trial of the only man to ever be charged in connection with Tupac's murder. Set the scene for us. What was it like being there and just how big a deal has it been? Yeah, for sure. So it's definitely a big deal. People have thought about this for close to 30 years, tons of people have shown up, you know, some very dedicated fans from all over the country have taken a bus or flown just to, you know, be part of this trial. Tupac's family has been present during the entire trial as well.

15:39And there's just a lot of tension sometimes throughout the whole trial process. But, you know, a lot of people have talked about how this could finally come to a resolution after 30 years. It's been a major, notorious cold case for so long. So tell me about the man who's been on trial, Dwayne Davis. He, by his own account, is a former L.A. gangster and a drug dealer from Compton. He's 63 years old now and was charged with effectively orchestrating Tupac's murder and handing the gun to the person who shot him, which under Nevada law constitutes a murder charge. Yeah, so Dwayne Davis, also known as Keefy D., is a self-proclaimed former gang leader at the Southside Compton Crips.

16:17His defense attorneys say that he has left the narcotics trade and worked like a normal job for several years until illness forced him to retire. And so take us back to the 7th of September, 1996. So almost 30 years ago, the day that Tupac was shot. Remind us what happened that day. Yes. So Tupac was in town for the Mike Tyson fight at the MGM Grand. And then he got into an altercation with Dwayne Davis's nephew, Orlando Anderson. And after that, they had left. And apparently, allegedly, Orlando Anderson had informed Dwayne Davis through some of other members of the gang that he had been beaten up.

16:56And in order to get retaliation, they decide to try to find Tupac Shakur and Marion Suge Knight. Yeah. And Suge Knight, of course, was the boss of Death Row Records, which signed Tupac among many other very famous rap artists at the time. Yes. Dwayne Davis and three other people, they had gone to a club where Tupac was going to perform and waited around for Tupac and Marion Shugnight. They did not come. And so then they left and went to a liquor store. And then on their way, after leaving the liquor store, they had run into Tupac, Shakur, and Marion Shugnight in their BMW. and they were at like a red light near the Las Vegas Strip and a white Cadillac pulled up to the side and shots were fired from this white Cadillac at Suge Knight and obviously Tupac Shakur.

17:47Suge Knight survived his injuries and Tupac Shakur died six days later. Crucially for this case, Dwayne Davies is the only living witness from the car from which shots were fired at Tupac Shakur. He was riding in the Cadillac with his nephew Orlando Anderson. and some others. And in the other car was Tupac and his record label boss, Suge Knight. Yes, that is correct. And I think what was so fascinating about this trial was the evidence that the prosecution used to convict Davis, because it wasn't forensics or CCTV or anything like that, was it? It wasn't even people who saw him at the scene. There was kind of nothing conventional at all, actually.

18:25Yeah, so prosecutors made this pretty clear from the beginning during jury selection that the kind of evidence that jurors will be seeing is different from, you know, a murder case that might be happening right now. We're not seeing blood that was found at the scene that connects Davis to this crime. There's something like that. There's very little, you know, physical evidence that we've seen so far. Yeah. But what there was, was Davis's own words. And he wrote a memoir called Compton Street Legend, which I imagine he now regrets. It came out in 2019. And he talked in detail in this book about the day that Tupac was shot.

18:57Tell me about it. Yeah. So in this book, he actually co-authored it with Yusuf Jha. And the defense has said, you know, there's no way to know which parts he has written versus which parts Davis has written. But the book kind of goes into Davis's background, his growing up in Compton, how he joined and got involved in the Southside Compton Crips. And then it goes into some pretty lengthy detail about what happened that night from his perspective. He has like called it in media interviews, like the real truth of what happened. he describes you know what what i just said you know going to las vegas that night he was also there to see the mike tyson fight um he had gotten it through like a scalper different tickets for him and his friends um he talked about hearing that his nephew was beaten up and then how they need to get you know revenge he had said something about like you know we couldn't let any like studio rap wannabes do us like that and we had to you know get revenge and my nephew was just a kid he described how he passed the gun to the back seat um his like segments kind of vary depending on which interview it is or the book in the book he doesn't say who actually pulled the trigger he just kind of says that he tossed it to someone in the back in other interviews that he's done with police he has said that it was his nephew that did actually pull the trigger yeah i mean i was just looking at some quotes from the memoir and it's pretty unambiguous and as you as you said that he's distancing himself from this book now.

20:25I'm just going to read a few quotes from there. So one of the stories ends, the moral of this story is that real gangsters are nothing to fuck with. Them jumping on my nephew gave us the ultimate green light to do something to their ass. I mean, what do you make of those kind of statements? Yeah, I mean, it's pretty blatant in this, like how he was feeling at the time and his like justification, allegedly, if we believe if what he says is true. There is one part of the book too, where he said like he regrets what has happened and that, you know, he feels bad for Tupac's mother. And you've referred to a few interviews that he has given over the years.

21:00So was it not simply the memoir that the prosecutors used to say that he was guilty of his part in the murder? Yeah, that's correct. Prosecutors have really relied on previous statements that he's given. In 2008, he participated in a proper agreement. So it allowed him to talk to them without fear of being prosecuted for what he said in this interview.

21:25And so in that interview, he gave a similar story as to what he said in the book. That actually became like a major part of this whole trial and like leading up to the trial was whether or not this interview could be used during the trial when in fact this agreement was that what he said here couldn't be used against him. However, prosecutors argued that that agreement kind of went out the window when he decided to make public statements and decide to write the book. And then throughout the trial, we've seen a bunch of different interviews with the media, some documentary folks that were, you know, making murder rap, for instance.

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22:11And I have never told nobody he is. Murder rap. And like a BET documentary that he participated in. Who shot Tupac? I'm going to keep it from the cold of the streets. It just came from the back seatbelt. And so under Nevada law, given all of the evidence that the prosecutors had against him in his own words, how was he able to plead not guilty? His defense has basically argued that, you know, my client was just trying to make money and that none of this was true and that there's no physical evidence tying Davis to the crime. Davis has said that he wasn't even in Vegas that night. And what we've seen throughout the trial is really prosecutors just relying on these words.

22:55And you're not seeing so much physical evidence. His defense lawyer, who seems to be quite a colorful character, Michael Sanft, has said that Davis had a habit of talking, quote, bullshit. it. Yeah. So he actually said that like outside of court to a bunch of reporters were basically asking like, you're just trying to say that your client is a liar. And he's like, yeah, like he's just talking bullshit. And we're all like, okay. In his like opening statements, he had like a slideshow that said like fact versus fiction and, you know, made this case at the beginning that his client is just lying.

23:30Yeah. Which is the opposite of, it's an upside down case, isn't it? The opposite of what a defense lawyer would normally do is like, believe my client. Whereas this guy's like, don't believe my client. He's full of bullshit, to use his word. Yeah. And it's like, that argument makes sense since like the only thing that prosecutors seem to really have is, you know, Davis's own words. Tell me a bit about the witnesses who were called to this trial. So the prosecution called 25 witnesses and the defense only called three, but I think there was a huge list of maybe hundreds of potential witnesses. whose evidence struck you as most compelling and did anybody say that they actually saw davis kifidi in the car or even in las vegas that night yeah so we have not seen that um there were some witnesses that they were trying to get to come to the stand who had previously said that uh that they had seen davis in las vegas um however one person has not like responded to the subpoena to come and appear in court and obviously as you know like mary and shug night has said that he wants no part in, you know, testifying in this case.

24:31And he's the person that I think would make like the biggest difference if he weren't testified, because he's the only remaining, you know, person that was around. He was there. He got shot that night, didn't he? Exactly. He got shot and he survived. And now he's in prison for a hit and run. Is that right? A fatal hit and run. And could they not have compelled him? Why didn't they compel him to give evidence? I mean, they could compel him to come to court, but they can't compel him to like say what they want him to say. You know, he could just like take the fifth each time. And that is kind of what he has said in media interviews, that if they do call him to the stand, he's not going to be helpful.

25:01And so from a taxpayer perspective, is it worth bringing someone all the way out from California if you know that they're not going to be helpful? And so as you've told us, Keefe D. Davis has written and said previously that the person who did shoot Tupac was his own nephew, Orlando Baby Lane Anderson. How much evidence is there that he was indeed the gunman? I think for the same kind of evidence that's being used against Davis is that there's not a lot of physical evidence that is tying anyone to this crime. It's all, you know, word on the street, rumors, what people have said in the past. And again, like Davis's own words.

25:38But given that his name has been circulating for decades now, was the finger of suspicion really pointing at him? And was he sort of cast out of the scene at the time? What happened to him? So Anderson was actually shot and killed pretty close to the murder. It was in 1998 he was shot and killed in an unrelated gang incident at a car wash in California.

26:05Coming up, will a guilty verdict put the two-pack conspiracies to bed?

26:36He looked at me and he said, if something ever happens to me, release the AI. Your husband goes down an AI rabbit hole. How do you pull him out? I just kept asking myself, what is happening? Black Box, The Chatbots, a new series from The Guardian Investigates about the strange things happening between AI and us. All episodes coming soon. Search for Black Box wherever you get your podcasts. William, on Monday, a jury in Las Vegas took just three hours to convict Dwayne Davis of murder. I'm sure you are watching it. following the verdict. What did you make of it? I thought it was astonishing myself.

27:18It's clear in retrospect exactly what happened, because Dwayne Davis was stupid enough pretty much to write it down in his own book. Yes, he must regret that now, yes. We don't know who pulled the trigger. That's the only thing we don't know. Tupac was there after the Tyson fight, absolutely pumped up. If you think Tyson had come out of prison not long before, and now he's on top of it. And Tupac saw himself as exactly that. You know, I'm the man on top of the world. Coming out of prison, I can prove that we can still run the world, whatever they throw at us. And Tyson had just knocked out somebody in some ridiculously short post time.

27:49And he was absolutely pumped. Everybody who he's with, including Suge Knight, who was with him at the time, was really pumped by this. And they meet this one guy who they know is a known gang member. And Tupac was the one who took it on him to go and confront this guy and said, you're from the South, which is a gang thing to say. It's all about location. And so he was a Southside crip, Orlando, and he initiated that controversy. So we know now that that after that, Dwayne Davis, who was the big kingpin, a massive drug dealer at the time. And Orlando's uncle, of course, yeah. Yeah, and Orlando's uncle, yeah.

28:19Took this as a massive slight in the fence and kind of it looks like he felt that Orlando should settle a score. Orlando, from what his brother Pooh said, was nothing like that. He was a massive Tupac fan, quite well-educated boy. Everybody was involved to a certain extent, especially if you're Keefe Davis's nephew, you're involved. But you can just see that whole scenario of you have to make this right. It's a terrible sort of, you know, Italian, New York Italian movie kind of scene, isn't it? You know, you've got to somehow justify the honour. And somehow they all got into a car with guns and found Tupac and shot him.

28:51Who pulled the trigger is almost kind of irrelevant because everybody else in the car who might have pulled the trigger is dead. Well, indeed. And you said that you were astonished by the verdict. And yet, as you say, as you said, Keefe D laid it all out in his memoirs. He talked about it on podcasts. He talked about it to the LAPD. That's not the smartest thing to do, is it? I mean, you know, Kivy D made a lot of mistakes in his life. You know, he bragged about being a drug dealer, which wasn't a very good idea either. And apparently all the Colombian cartels threw up their hands and said, we're never dealing with this idiot again.

29:23He's bringing too much heat. I'm astonished mainly because, you know, being a man of a certain age, I've seen so many celebrity-related American trials just go nowhere. But I just think the clarity of it, first-degree murder, I mean, that's pretty brutal. We're 30 years on from the murder. Davis is going to be spending a long time in jail, potentially the rest of his life. He's 63 now. As you say, we still don't definitively know who pulled the trigger. There are plenty of theories still swirling. There are people who don't believe Tupac is even dead. Do you think that this guilty verdict for Keefe D.

29:56Davis will put all of that to bed once and for all? There's no accounting for conspiracy theories and nutcases and this, and they will so we'll never put it to bed i hope it's time to examine what happened and what went wrong around that time and things went massively wrong and people weren't looking and people didn't care i mean the thing is in the 24 hours after tupac was murdered three other people were killed lots of people were injured nobody cares about their names either and that was exactly the same thing going on tupac was just the celebrity and that sort of thing and i think you know that type of expression of manhood, which went really unchallenged at the time.

30:34There was no way in which you could say to Tupac, yeah, but what do you consider, is this the right role for young men to be doing? There wasn't a dialogue about that. But, you know, I think it needs to be recontextualised. And I suspect that won't happen because, you know, it's a pop legend story, isn't it? But it's sort of time for people to start almost sort of mourning everything that went on at that time, because the police were absolutely hopeless at the time. They went off running after all sorts of other conspiracy theories. And it was about a bigger thing, really, wasn't it? It was about this terrible, terrible situation of massive drug cells going on in there, which was funding massive going by.

31:10And then this fact that this community was incredibly historically maltreated. You know, the legacy of everything that happened since the reconstruction, since slavery was all sort of condensed in these tiny communities who were being forced to fight for schooling and housing and stuff like that. It was crazy. That's how we feel. We die, it's like we go kill one of them. And then it's a feud until they don't want no more, until everybody just drop it. But ain't nobody gonna drop it. I never met anybody who was under 25 in Los Angeles, who hadn't witnessed violence, who hadn't been a victim of violence, who hadn't had a close friend or relation murdered without ever finding out who did it.

31:49It wasn't just Tupac's murder that nobody found out. Nearly all the murders happening in South Central at that time went unsolved. So I suppose the remarkable thing is we found a murder that, you know, there's a solution to this murder. You're willing to die for whatever this cause is? If that's what it takes. Yeah, I'm not saying you want to, I'm saying you will. No, I don't want to. How old are you? I'm 17. That was William Shaw. He is a novelist these days and his latest book, The Burning Tide, is out now. My thanks to him and also to Jessica Hill from the Associated Press. and that is all for today this episode was produced by guys affman saskia collette ruth abrahams and tom glasser and was presented by me helen pidd sound design was by ross burns and executive producer was hummer khalili we will be back in your feed this afternoon with the latest

32:43this is the guardian 1

From the publisher
Thirty years after Tupac Shakur’s death, a man has been found guilty of killing the hip-hop legend. William Shaw on the star’s life, legacy and untimely death. Help support our independent journalism at theguardian.com/infocus

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