KevOnStage Keeps It Real on Touring Economics, Tubi, and Ownership

0:04Dan Runcie: I'm Dan Runcie, welcome to Trapital, and you're about to hear another conversation from our Trapital Summit, and this one is with the comedian and actor KevOnStage. KevOnStage has been a guest on this podcast before, but this is our first time doing it in person at the Summit Stage, and as you can expect, Kev brought it. The purpose of this conversation is to talk about audience loyalty, and we broke down his business, everything from his touring, his streaming deals, his partnership with Tubi, how it all works together, how that's evolved since he and I last did a podcast conversation in 2022, and a few of his gripes with some of the larger companies in both ticketing and event promotion in the industry.

0:46Dan Runcie: Kev kept it real, as I said, and this was one of the favorites across the board from the summit, so I hope you enjoyed it as much as everyone in that room did that day. Here's Kev on stage. This episode of Trapital is presented by Chartmetric, which recently launched its new AI agent, Flow. One thing I run into all the time with data, especially in entertainment, is that I know the question I want to answer, but getting there can take some time. Maybe I want to know which markets are overperforming for a particular artist, what's more causal versus correlated, and more. And that's what Sharp Metric is now solving with Flow.

1:23Dan Runcie: You could ask those nuanced, multi-layered questions directly, in plain English, and Flow works through Sharp Metric music data to give you the analysis instead of making you hunt through a bunch of different dashboards. Sung Cho showed me Flow, and we discussed it on stage at the Trapital Summit, And the most interesting part is how much easier it makes you going from asking the question to an actual decision that can improve your business. If you work in music, try it out. Check out the link in our bio.

1:57I forgot I chose this song. I was like, this is my jam. I totally forgot I picked this song. I was like, oh, yeah, I did. I did choose this. Oh, yeah. You kind of like this. I love Olivia Dean. I want to be the man I need as well.

2:13Dan Runcie: I appreciate you as always. Thank you. As we were just talking backstage, this feels full circle in a lot of ways. I remember, because I think we first connected on Twitter years ago. Yeah, I just got to take, I'm going to interrupt you, Dan, and I know that's wrong. I love you. I love you. I love how you talk about business. I love how you break it down. When I saw that flywheel, I was like, yes, this is what I'm trying to do. And then you had broke me down. And I called my dad and I said, man, Dan Runcie, dad. So sorry. I just wanted to say this is very full circle for me. Many more me than you.

2:47Dan Runcie: Yeah. No, well, I appreciate that. No, I do. I do. That means a lot. And I mean, even from the early days, like the first time you and I had talked, I mean, you were already extremely successful then by that point. Yeah. But I remember one of the things that you had said to me, whether it may have been at your studio one of the times I came through, you said, you know, everything is good here, but I still want that studio deal. I still want that deal. deal and I was like really you still feel like you need that yeah he's like hey that's the North Star since then you've partnered with BET yeah you've partnered with Spring Hill yeah and you have now signed the largest creator deal that Tubi has done with anyone how do you reflect on that now just thinking about a few years ago you are now doing the things that you wanted to do You know what's crazy?

3:34I don't do a good job of reflecting. I am always pushing. And this is not like, you know, like my weakness is how hard I work. I should do a better job. But I am grateful. I know for Melissa and I, my wife, our main goal was like, we got to stop financing these things. As much as they're dreams, it's like our kids are about to go into college. So we're like, we can't take these big financial risks for these shows. You know, we were spending hundreds of thousands of dollars to put these shows on. And I'm grateful to God that spending that on Churchy is what set me up. But I was like, I can't take risks of that magnitude anymore.

4:11So after Churchy, we scaled down. We took a much smaller risk on the hospital and we were able to sell that. And that's the last time that we've had to finance something of our own. So this to be deal, you know, it's allowed me capital to create, you know, shows I get to maintain ownership. I get to maintain creative control and I have back end participation if, you know, we reach certain metrics and you usually don't get all of those in Hollywood. You either get some money or you get ownership or you get creative control. But it's like one of these cancels out two of the others. So to get all four is huge.

4:48You know, owning media, you're able to exploit this over and over and over. There's there's so many platforms that I can sell this to. There's no, you know, exclusivity isn't as big of a thing as it used to be, you know, where it's only going to be on Hulu or it's only going to be on Netflix. You know, you can license these things over and over and over. And these are like little monopoly houses that I own, you know. So for me, that was a big thing, maintaining ownership. And I don't have to own them all. Like, I'm okay with you owning some because, you know, because what you're going to pay to own it is a larger piece of the puzzle, right?

5:24So it's a great opportunity to do everything that I want to do. I'm able to create. I'm able to hire people. I'm able to own some properties. And I get to do what I want without having to spend the cash myself.

5:33Dan Runcie: And I assume that timing is probably a big piece of that, right? Because if you had wanted to do this type of deal with any type of company five, ten years ago, you may not have been able to have the ownership terms that you may have. Oh, absolutely. For sure. I mean, I think with Churchill, we proved that we could create quality programming on our own. There's a very different conversation where you're going to a network and you're saying here's eight completed episodes of a TV show versus a pilot or a script or a log line or a deck. Networks, by and large, are much less risky. They're much more risk averse than they used to be, especially now in the IP wars.

6:08If you don't have like a verified IP, it's harder and harder to get things made. So what opens the door for us is having completed projects. AMC is now offering this new deal starting in 2027 where they'll have distribution deals for films that are fully financed and completed. So they're saying, we'll put you in theaters, but you're going to have to take the first risk. But that's great. Like for people like me, if you can make it for X amount of dollars, I can go straight to the people. That way you've now eliminated the middleman if you can make it yourself. So those opportunities are things that I'm trying to exploit.

6:42Right. That's that Taylor Swift and Beyonce AMC distribution deal. Absolutely. But you open it up to people like me. Like I sell tickets all over the United States. You know, that's why Tubi is great for me, because I can say, oh, hey, you like this show? Click here. No credit card info. You don't have to sign up for anything. You can be watching it in one minute. Right. Because there's so many streaming platforms, people are less likely to start a new one. It's not just your show. Like I've got to watch Netflix. If I watch your show, I need to watch all these other shows for me to pay that bill.

7:12HBO Max, the less broad that platform is, the less likely a user is going to pay to watch your show. So for Tubi being free, it really helps me because people don't have to pay for it. They can just check it out. And that's really beneficial to what we're trying to do.

7:28Dan Runcie: And do you feel like the paid SBOD services were more likely to want to maintain more of the ownership of the product if you were to partner with them or if you had similar conversations with them? No, I've had similar conversations. The good thing is when you pay for it, you have more leverage. Right. So for Churchy, you know, it's not on the table that you own it. Right. Now, they also not paying as much, but it's not on the table that you get to own it because I paid for it and created it. So, you know, back in the day, they get to own it because they financed it. But I've already taken that first risk.

8:01So now you can exploit it. You can distribute it to your audience, but you're not going to be able to maintain ownership. So, you know, Churchy and the hospital and Tubi, these are licensing deals to these platforms. So some of the Tubi shows I get back in four years, some I get back in one year, some I get back in seven years. But, you know, Ryan Coogler just had a huge deal for centers and that was 25 years. It reverts back to him. You know, so right now I made stuff in 2020 on the Kevin on stage studios app that I'm able to exploit on to be infused already. And I just, you know, that was just four years ago.

8:31So for me, anytime I can have these things, it's like little houses earning equities. Some are small houses and maybe a part of the United States that doesn't grow as fast. And some are like huge houses in, you know, California, Florida, New York, where equity rises quickly. So that's kind of how I'm thinking about it because, you know, the residual game isn't as lucrative as it used to be 10, 20 years ago. So you kind of have to find ways to exploit these things to kind of create your own residuals.

8:56Dan Runcie: And if we zoom out, you and I had done a podcast episode four years ago. And when we look at your overall business, you told me at the time that 60 % of your revenue came from touring. 20 % was actually Patreon, I believe. And then 20 % from podcasting. Obviously, you have different partnerships now, but what does that mix look like? Live touring is still reign supreme. The thing is, live touring, there's much less overhead. You know, sometimes you spend$2 to make, I mean, spend$1 to make$2 on touring. But show-wise, man, you might spend$1.75 to make$2. You got so many more people to cover, pay for insurance, actors, equipment rentals, food, all that stuff.

9:42Right now on the tour I'm on now, grief sucks. It's me, a tour manager and a photographer. And that photographer is creating a documentary that I'm gonna license to Tubi and put out on YouTube to help drive towards a special. I don't think there's a smaller tour out there. Taylor Swift, for example, she's got trucks and musicians and gear. I have a very small footprint. So right now I would say it's still probably 60 % live touring. Patreon is huge, it's still probably second. Podcasting is important. Interestingly enough, the TV shows are probably the least lucrative. These are I kind of consider them mixtapes like this is just to help, you know, build my resume, help people be more interested in me.

10:22I'm very early in the media part of my thing. I'm not really making a lot of money cash through these shows, but I'm still making them because I'm building that part of my business. The hope is that they all work together like you see me live. Then you say, oh, he has a show on to me. Let me go watch that. Oh, he has all these shows on to me. Let me watch that. oh, he has a podcast and they sort of feed together like the flywheel that we talk about. But right now, the TV aspect is not as lucrative, but it helps with my credibility and where I'm trying to go as a player in the media game. But as far as actual cash, it's not proven to be lucrative to me really at all yet.

10:58Dan Runcie: Fascinating. In some ways, not that surprising, but I want to unpack that. But first, on the touring side specifically, it sounds like it's still a majority. But one thing that we've seen in the live music side of things is that the revenue that the biggest acts have been able to make on tour from the post-pandemic first year of like 22 to 23 versus now has skyrocketed because of how many people want to go and see these people on tour, how much they're willing to pay. In your world with comedy and these tours, do you feel like it's been similar where the rooms that you're performing to are larger, the dollar amount that you're charging for tickets are larger, therefore a night in Manchester, UK, or a night in New York City is driving more revenue overall than it was, you know, two, three years ago.

11:40Yeah, absolutely. I think this current tour is just resonating in a different way than anything I've done. I think it's a combination of I'm bigger and this subject matter is just different. So I put a show up on sale at 1130 on Sunday night. By noon, Monday morning, that was sold out. That is unusual for me. Selling out in London, two or three shows, Manchester, which I never performed, setting up a show in South Africa. all these sellouts generate more excitement. I've sold, you know, I'd sell like 3000 tickets in DC and people are like at a second show because it was sold out months ahead of time.

12:15So I absolutely have been selling more tickets there. I haven't really raised the cost of the tickets because I kind of want to make sure it doesn't cost crazy to see me. I just feel like people's expenses are going up gas rain, all that. I don't want to be like, oh, now it's 175, 200,$300 to see me. I'd rather try to sell more tickets than to, you know, continue to raise the price of the tickets for my audience. But Mojo Brooks, Nate Jackson, Matt Wright, these people are selling gargantuan amount of tickets, you know, and it's good to see people from social media selling tickets like traditionally famous people were.

12:50You know, back in the day, if you didn't have a movie, Dev Comedy Jam, you know, Tonight Show, something like that, it was nearly impossible to sell tickets. But now you can build that interest online and it translates directly to ticket sales. in a way that prior to the pandemic, you didn't see outside of traditionally famous people.

13:05Dan Runcie: And you mentioned that the team you work with is pretty thin for the touring side, and that's intentional. But do you also work with a touring agent or a promoter? So right now, luckily for me, I just am able to talk directly to Live Nation. I have promoters who work with Live Nation or AEG, and I don't even have an agent. Like, I was in the green room one day, and I realized all my agent did was call this guy for Live Nation and whoever his counterpart is at AEG or Outback. And I thought, if I have his number, why am I paying 10 %? That 10 % can be used for flights, costs, anything like that.

13:43So I'm talking directly to Live Nation. I would actually love to eliminate Live Nation, Ticketmaster, but that's a tough gig. That's like the mafia. They're like, what you mean? Even if you don't work with them, the venues are owned by Ticketmaster, which brings you right back into Live Nation. So my work around there is I've been doing shows in churches, the Lord's Nation. So I do a clean set. My next tour will be at a church because churches have similar venue capacity, great equipment, a lot of big mega churches. If a church seats over a thousand people, they traditionally have really good backline support and they don't have to rent it right through Live Nation.

14:23I don't know if I'm going to get in trouble here, but this is the point of these things.

14:27Dan Runcie: I wish you could be here for our afternoon conversations with the global president of Ticketmaster.

14:37I honestly would love to talk to him because it's cost prohibitive. It's cost prohibitive to people. You know, you really have to either sell tickets for me to make like Kevin Hart level money from ticketing. You either have to charge much more, right? Charge$150 to$350, or you just have to sell so many tickets, 6 ,000, 7 ,000, you know, tickets. 85 South does a good job of this, but they're able to play in like C &D markets where Live Nation, you know, sometimes they're not playing in that area at all. They're able to rent the old venue and eliminate that. But for me, I just can't make the numbers make sense.

15:15If you don't have another option, there's nothing you can do. But because I have the churches, I'm like, I'm sorry, Ticketmaster. I like Eventbrite. Those fees are like fixed,$2.50. Ticketmaster's like the more the ticket is, the more they get. The customer doesn't like that. So one of my marketing thing was like, if you pay$50, your ticket price is$56.50. People love that. You pay$56 for Ticketmaster. I'm sorry, but y 'all can tell them this. That ticket price jumps up to$80,$90 with fees and all that stuff. Where does that money go? It doesn't come to me. The customer doesn't have a better experience for that.

15:48So you're with Live Nation or Ticketmaster, you get sucked into the vortex. Great business model for them. Not so great for me, Kevin. So you can't really beat them at that. So when it's time to partner, I will. But if I don't have to, I won't.

16:02Dan Runcie: Well, when you're ready to have that conversation, put you in touch. Put me in touch with the mafia. It feels like that to me. It feels like you can't escape them. Again, great business model for them. Not good for me. Not really good for the customer. Competition is great for them. But you really only compete with either Live Nation or AEG. You're not competing. You can't come like you can't have a show in a thousand seater in L.A., New York, any of the A markets. You cannot do without Live Nation or AEG. It is impossible. There is literally no way to do it unless you own the venue and they own or have access to all the venues.

16:38This is the crazy thing. No funny stuff. It is better for me to sell 300 tickets in a church in San Jose at$50 than it is. I can make more. This is not a joke. Selling 300 tickets at 50 bucks. Right. With a church, sometimes then selling a thousand seats, a thousand dollars worth of tickets at a venue in New York. Once you pay you like some of these fees will be$80 ,000 in fees and you can sell twelve hundred tickets. And I'll make more by selling 300 tickets in San Jose or 400 in Nashville. It's not even close. And that's what tickets going from$52 to$120. And not to mention these venues get, they take 30 % of my merch sales.

17:26And I have to bring my merch, have a seller for my merch, just because I'm using their space. I have to give them 30 % of my merch sales. All right. My only other option to get 100 % of my merch is to sell it literally outside. Right? Right. So they get all the parking money, all the alcohol sales. If you take a charger, they get money for that. All I get is a portion of the ticket sales and I have to pay for all the fees. I can't say, hey, I only need like this shows only three people. I don't need any stage hands or maybe I need to doesn't matter. You have to have eight or ten or whatever with the churches.

17:59I could say, hey, do you mind having volunteers or I bring my whole team in? So for me, it just doesn't make sense. The fees are just killing you. So you have to sell merch or whatever. Even at comedy clubs, they give you a big percentage of the door because they're taking all the alcohol. So they are much more okay to share the tickets. That's why a lot of touring comedians who can sell arenas have decided, I'm going to just do five nights at the Funny Ball. Because it's a little bit better share-wise to say, you host me, little to no fees, keep the alcohol, I keep the tickets. We both win. There's a two item minimum.

18:36You have to buy two items. The audience accepts that, but they at least get to eat or drink. So they skip dinner, have a few drinks. Everybody wins. At Live Nation, they're taking all that stuff. Churches don't sell merch. They don't they don't care about any of that stuff. They just want to have a nice, fun event for their community. So that's what I'm trying to exploit for as long as I can. I mean, as a businessman, all you can do is find your angle and exploit it, which is what Live Nation and Ticketmaster have done. Shouts to them. I mean, most people don't want to do it, but they don't have it.

19:02they don't have a choice. Literally, you don't have another option. And Live Nation is the biggest and the best.

19:07Dan Runcie: Let's take a break for our Chartmetrics stat of the week. Kev on stage walked out to Man I Need by Olivia Dean at this year's summit. Olivia Dean has seen astronomical growth in her live touring, specifically with her most recent tour. In 2025, when she headlined her North American tour before Man I Need blew up, she mostly played in venues that were holding around 1 ,000 to 2 ,000 but under 3 ,000 fans, like the Warfield here in San Francisco, just over 2 ,000. But one year later, she returned to many of these same venues playing shows in arenas, multiple arena shows. She went from one show at the Warfield the year before to two shows at the Chase Center where the Warriors and Valkyries play.

19:51Dan Runcie: She went from two shows in LA at a small venue to two shows at Crypto.com Arena in LA. The list goes on. Across comparable markets, her available headline inventory increased roughly 10x to 20x in 12 months. Four shows at Madison Square Garden, four shows at O2 Arena. It says a lot about where touring is today and the demand that there is for Olivia Dean. Let's get back to the episode. But I do want to talk about the churches because it also reminds me of other conversations we've had about Tyler Perry specifically, who also was very heavy in the churches. But I also think it's relevant for you because you and I have talked about how ownership minded he is.

20:35Dan Runcie: And I think that was probably the impetus for some of the flywheel conversations that we had. And granted, his ownership in many ways, I know that he's obviously been criticized for maybe taking it to a fault where, you know, producer, director, playwright, stagehand, like all of the things that I probably forgot a few of them there, but look at like what he's been able to do for sure. So is that still something that you are looking towards where you're looking? Okay. What, where, what is Tyler doing? Where is he moving? And you know how that, I think there's a lot of similarities, but I wouldn't say it's a one-to-one, right?

21:06So say this, we're working on a movie right now that I went and it's, it's heavily music based. And I just had a call with one of the big labels. And I was like, man, in order to license music, It's very expensive. You know, a 32nd placement might be thirty thousand dollars at the budgets I have. I can't compete at those rates. Right. I don't have millions of dollars per film. So my option, again, is to say, OK, I'm actually going to write original music because I have that ability and it allows more budget for the show. But, for example, last night I realized, oh, this song that I need, I actually know a songwriter who wrote a song that might work.

21:40So I'm I called her and said, hey, I might want to license this song from you for my movie. I can also probably pay you to be a singer in it. You know, when we sync, we'll be syncing to you. I don't have to do that. But for me, it's important to my community to put money in their pockets as much as I can, right? I might spend, say,$5 ,000 or$6 ,000 of that budget and give it to her. I would have spent$30 ,000,$50 ,000 to give it to some big conglomerate. The artist might not even see that money anyway. But for her, she's a part of my creative community. I can put money in her pocket twice as a performer and as a writer.

22:13and then she can license me. And then also because of my platform, it puts some shine on her music ability. For me, that's an important part of how I do business. I don't see the value in, and I'm not saying Tyler's doing this for clarity, but I don't see the value in saying, I'm gonna do every single thing and take all the money. For me, it's important to say, okay, Dan can do this and she can write this and this person maybe license their song. It's important for me to spend some of my money in my creative community because the reason I'm here is because somebody did that with me. So for me, it's also about the enjoyment of the experience.

22:51And it's not all profit and loss when it comes to that. When it comes to Live Nation and touring, it is all profit and loss. But when it comes to creating, I want to pay people as much as I possibly can when I can. I know I can't compete right now. The budgets, maybe Netflix and Hulu and HBO and Amazon are, but a lot of people that I work with, they're not getting looked at by these people anyway. so it might be their first sync or their first placement or their first songwriting credit on a movie and that's important to people. So as many places I could do that, I try to.

23:20Dan Runcie: And that tracks with other people that I would consider your peers in doing this as well. Issa Rae and I were on the same stage two years ago and she specifically talked about this, right? I think she referenced Jay-Z's verse in Pound Cake where he's like, you know, day made millions, big made millions and like name it all and that's what she wants. And I know that you've talked recently about Keenan Ivory Wayans and how he has done that, obviously with his whole family, everything from Live in Color. And that, to me, felt like that sounds like Kev on stage. And again, you're doing your own thing.

23:50Dan Runcie: I'm just taking the different aspects. I'm like, yeah, that sounds like what he's trying to do. What Issa Rae has done, she's probably my most closest OG pioneer to me. I remember watching Awkward Black Raw on YouTube and the amount after she hired and her tree of directors, wardrobe, music, She spreads it out throughout the community as much as she possibly can. That's kind of the track that I'm trying to follow. She's probably more into music than I am. I probably lean more towards comedians because that's my thing. But I think the process is very similar of spreading that money and those looks throughout the whole artistic community.

24:29For me, that's an important part of how I want to do business. That makes sense.

24:33Dan Runcie: the other part that i wanted to get back to you on was you talked about how to be specifically in just these tv deals or these other types of production deals aren't a huge revenue driver for you at least right not right now you're building up towards that and in some ways that seems a bit similar to what we hear on the music side here as well for a lot of the folks in this room where because the people on tour and doing live shows have just made so much more money it It had been that way the past 10 years or so, but it definitely exploded the past four years. And then you see that impact some of the business decisions that they make.

25:09Dan Runcie: So while you're saying that, hey, this is important, but touring is still kind of the bread and butter here, we've seen that play out where an artist like Taylor Swift is saying, hey, TikTok, Universal Music Group, I know you have your whole thing going on here, but I need to promote this tour. I need to be on this platform. So you have this tension where one side sees this as a promotional tool and the other sees this as a key revenue generating tool. Yeah. And I guess for you, obviously, Tubi, it may be a little different, but I'm curious how that plays out for you. You think long term, especially with what your incentives are and what your business partners' incentives are?

25:42Absolutely. I think for me, I consider both my social media content day to day on all platforms and Tubi and BET as a musician. They almost are all giving away free music. for the most part, the amount of money they make from streaming, it's not zero, but it's much less than when you sold physical albums. If I fall in love with Beyonce's latest album, and that doesn't cost me what feels like anything. Technically, I'm paying$15 to Apple Music, but I don't actually buy Beyonce's album. But when she comes to LA, I spend$500 to$700 on a ticket. I spend$100, $200 on merch. I buy her, you know, signature drink that free album that I got.

26:23I've now put that money back into her pocket when I went to her tour. That's how I look at to be. If you watch safe space, you're like, man, I really think that guy's funny. Let me see what else he's got going on. Okay. He's a podcast. You start following my podcast, still free. And then you look and say, Hey, I'm actually coming to your city. Okay. Now it's been, you know, to be and podcasting and Social media, I've given you all these things for free. So now I'm trying to earn your ticket purchase, right? Or just by watching my stuff, I can monetize you via the platform, right? If I'm bringing all these eyeballs to Tubi, I cannot negotiate for a huge amount of the money, right?

27:02So I have to monetize my audience in a free way and either capitalize on them through ticketing or by bringing value to those platforms. So I think that's why I produce so much content. That's why I was backstage editing a video. As soon as I get off here, I'm going back to my studio. The only reason I can't stay is because Tuesday is podcast day. But for Dan, I said, I shot two podcasts this morning. I threw this cardigan on. I'm very hot. I'm getting in the car, taking this cardigan back off. I'm going to shoot two more podcasts with Tony Baker. And in the car, I'm going to post a video that I made yesterday because that's how I keep people in the ecosystem.

27:36I got to use the algorithm to always be like, Kev is funny. Kev is funny. Kev is funny. Kev is funny. That's what I'm always trying to remind people. If I've been laughing at him on Instagram, oh, he's got a show. Okay, let me check that out. Now, Kev is funny. Kev is funny. Kev is funny. For years, I've been saying that. So now when it's time to buy a ticket, oh, this guy's making me laugh. Even though you haven't seen me do standup, you've just associated my face with laughter for years and years and years. And then when you come see me live, if I deliver on that laughter and you're like, oh, he is really funny in person.

28:06And then at that show, I say, hey, this thing's going to be on sale there. Check me out on Tubi. So now it's the other way. If you never even knew I had a show on Tubi or don't follow me on social media, you just came with your girlfriend or whatever. He's like, oh, this guy's funny. Where else can I find him? Kevin's funny. Back on YouTube. Because I might only come to your city once a year, but I can make you laugh on social media every single day. So that's why I kind of pump out so much content because I want to remind you, this guy's funny. I love what he's doing. I want to support him. And then I flip my narrative in and that starts working too.

28:36Dan Runcie: Final question for you. As your audience continues to grow, you have millions of followers on Instagram and on other platforms as well. Does it ever get tougher or do you feel like the stakes get higher in terms of what you post? I am going through that literally as we speak. I have to remind myself that the audience doesn't see me as I feel. I feel like a regular person. iPhone announced they're making a duo. I made a video. I'm getting the duo. I am a consumerism guy. I'm an advertiser's dream. One commercial hooked, whether it's Applebee's, you know, they have released a quesadilla cheeseburger.

29:11I was like, I drove to Applebee's and bought it that day. I was like, that's a great commercial. I want to eat that. Drove and had it, had a great time. It was delicious. So I made a video about the iPhone duo. Like, yo, I'm going to get this. I just don't know what I'm going to do with the case. I saw a few videos of me getting dragged of being a consumer and what about the children and lithium. Person was like, he doesn't need a new iPhone. My iPhone, I cracked two months ago. I've been waiting for the new iPhone anyway. I was just going to get whatever the new phone was because my phone was cracked and I don't want to pay.

29:42And I got dragged for making that video. And I was like, all kinds of people said they were excited about the iPhone. Marquise Brownlee got it in his hand. Like why he can get the new iPhone he's not getting yelled at I made a video today supporting Ryan Clark's pivot to his own YouTube page it's super great like I was like we gotta support that brother I got videos like we need to support these women too why didn't you say that I was like I didn't I didn't know that one I just I know Ryan I didn't know this person had a YouTube page so it's like the bigger I get no matter what I say it can be turned negative the good part about that is I've been coming dead inside and callous I get yelled at for everything so much so that nothing even phases me anymore because no matter what I do in my intentions if I say man show show love to Dan Runzey's trapital why don't you show love to Sally Jeffrey Raphael's snapital I don't even be knowing what people are talking about and I'm getting yelled at so I can't let that dissuade me from showing love, but it does kind of make me have a cold, callous, manhunter heart.

30:51Dan Runcie: Well, I'd love to keep going, but we will have to pause there. But I'm sure you and I will talk again soon. But ladies and gentlemen, Kevon Stage. Thank you so much, guys. And that is a wrap. Thank you again to Kevon Stage for joining us. Thank you to Sean T. Smith for capturing the audio and video at this year's Trapital Summit. Thank you again to G. Eric Rowana for making this episode possible. and most importantly, thank you for listening. If there's one person you know that would really enjoy Trapital, get a lot out of the show, then send them a link to the show. And if you're not already, make sure that you tap that follow button, subscribe so that you get the next episode, whether you listen on Spotify, Apple, wherever you get your podcasts, that's where Trapital is.

31:33Dan Runcie: Thanks again. Talk to you next time.