Poppi founders on marriage, parenting & building a 2 billion-dollar brand (without raising entitled kids)

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24:20Start your risk-free Greenlight trial today at greenlight.com slash two parents. That's greenlight.com slash two parents to get started. Greenlight.com slash two parents. One of the things that really landed with me that you said, Stephen, part of what allowed your relationship to thrive was the common understanding between what each of you were doing. So if there was a bad day because there was a big issue with the retailer, Allison didn't need to come home and explain to you that the vibe was low. And so just paralleling that to couples who don't work together

25:08and encouraging them to go a layer deeper into what's happening in their day-to-day and looping their partner in to keep them on the same page, that seems very powerful. Now, Allison, you did mention, though, that your relationship often did come number three. And so we'd love to hear a little bit more about that. And over the 10 years of building Poppy, what was the hardest thing that your relationship went through? And how did you navigate that?

25:43Stephen Ellsworth:Yeah, and I say, look, we are still madly in love. We have three children. And we have a great marriage. But I think is what we let go was the expectation of what people do in their marriages. I was like, okay, I'm good if we don't do Valentine's Day and I have flowers. Like, we need to get this PO off. The guilt. The guilt that all relationships do at some point of we haven't done a date night this month. Right? Yes, I know you need to connect. But we're together, like, all day. We're with the kids all day. I think it was different because we were together so much that I finally one day I was like, let's just let all the guilt go.

26:21Stephen Ellsworth:And so a lot of it was that piece of the expectation was kind of just gone for that perfect what society makes marriage think it should be. So then when we do go on a date or I did get flowers on a random Tuesday, it was almost so much more special because it wasn't for my birthday, for Valentine's Day, for Christmas. you know what I mean and so I think it was like that piece where it was like okay kids are happy they're in school camps well-fed loved business is thriving and then I'm okay if I don't have flowers it was like that type of understanding but I mean people always ask us um you know go going back to would you guys do this again and we are constantly talking about that like we are the yin to the yang the partnership he's so good at the things I'm not good at and so I 100 % don't think I would ever do it not with him you know what I mean and um we're actually struggling a little bit with that right now because he's kind of more out of the business of poppy I'm still like one foot in one foot out and still helping advise on creative and stuff and so he's like three months ahead of me on doing a bunch of other things and he's doing stuff that I don't know what's going on.

27:38Stephen Ellsworth:And so it's this new dynamic. We're actually having to relearn how not doing everything together. And so that's a new challenge in our relationship that we're constantly talking about it. It's good. I think it's healthy. But you're coming along because if not, you're going to get left. Literally. Wait, so you're doing you're doing something that different now? Yeah. I mean, well, we're pretty active in the CPG sort of startup and investing scene, I guess, if you will. But But no, I think part of that is just helping other entrepreneurs. We had a lot of help, and so sort of paying it forward. And we've learned a lot, so taking those lessons and putting them to work is really exciting and gives me a lot of energy.

28:18But yeah, we definitely have a cool idea that we're working on in the background right now, which is pretty exciting. I think we get more and more excited about it every week. How long has it been since you – like, what are you – they're like okay so the next which i admire no i think that's cool so you guys have like another idea did you know they had another idea how did i know that i don't know i was like i thought i was gonna ask is the relationship now like taking priority but no we're just gonna it

28:50Stephen Ellsworth:honestly is like you know funny story we had the time wrong for coming on y 'all's podcast today we came two hours early and we're like wow let's go to lunch and we had it to our lunch and we're We're both sitting there. We're like, this is so nice. I don't remember the last time we could do that. But now if I think about it, we've done that a couple times in the last month and a half. We never did that before. So it's a delight and a surprise getting to know each other, like actually having conversations and planning and talking about stuff. So before we kind of just blew through and just did stuff and kind of FYI'd each other afterwards.

29:26Stephen Ellsworth:And so it's kind of fun having conversations again. And look, Stephen is, to your point earlier, he's so hands-on. As a father, very involved. He was raised, he's one of six, lots of kids. They have great family values. So many kids. So he's a good dad. And so I think we'll, there's a lot of unknown though still right now. How much of the lunch was spent talking about the new idea? None. Wow. Yeah. we were actually talking about a Labor Day getaway with the family where are you guys going to go? we don't know we were chatting to you between oh that's what we'd love to do is the chat what are the family friendly places you can go discovering all these new things that we can actually go on a family vacation because for like 7 and a half years we didn't do that you did not go on one no because we would go on vacation and we would get our schedules aligned So I would work in the mornings and he would work in the afternoon and we would switch and watch the kids.

30:29Stephen Ellsworth:And so anytime we'd, if we'd go to the lake house or something like that for the week. And so we never actually spent time together. It was, we would travel. You babysit in the morning, I'll babysit in the afternoon. We'll swap. Yeah. And so I think it's good for people to hear this. Everyone's like, you guys, it looks so good. Your marriage was perfect. And your kids and the success. It's like, no, it's hard. It's hard. But we were really good at making it work. And the communication I think is always key. What was the biggest fight y 'all had while building Poppy? I mean, we always say it was like the sugar thing.

31:00Yeah, who was right?

31:02Stephen Ellsworth:Yeah, him like adding in sugar to Poppy. I was like really against for a long time. And he was right for sure. I hate saying that. But I would say like another one was I was traveling a lot, a lot, a lot, a lot. And I kept saying yes to like huge speaking gigs and like going across and being at every Poppy event. and he was just like you need to be home more and I you know and I was like no I can't we're like it's busy um and so I would say that was like kind of a difficult time too but I'm so glad we had that conversation and I learned how to say no and I was home more and it made me so much happier it made me like a better person and a better mom to be home more yeah just okay you know like when I was on the road it was I was killing myself to get home so if I had to go to New York I'd go there and back in a day.

31:51Stephen Ellsworth:And then you're just, you're running on empty. But then also it was like, I feel like there was a level of guilt that you had for you showing up and saying yes. Like you wanted to build the business and your personal brand, but like you felt there was also like this, I don't know, this sense of guilt for like going away from the kids because you also are a great mom and you want to continue to be a great mom. So it was like, it was just sort of recalibrating. okay so speaking of the kids i want to go somewhere really quickly like you mentioned not being able to pay the bills at one point and i don't know if that's like an exaggeration or if that's real but okay so so from not being able to pay the bills to fast forward to like a an almost two billion dollar exit right and now you've got your three boys how are you thinking about raising them with this money it's a constant conversation i'm sure scary yeah yeah like how are they not little turds you know yeah honestly like i think we haven't officially aligned on this but i'm going to say that we've aligned on it um if we record it it could be yeah yeah let this be on the record yeah uh no i think we're aligned that the the one characteristic that we want to raise our kids with is grit right and grit doesn't come from a life with the silver spoon And so I think, like, listen, we've been able to get some help.

33:14We even got some help while we were building the business. As the business grew, we could afford a little bit more just to sort of outsource some of the things that we shouldn't be spending our time on. However, like, we have someone that comes regularly, and they're like, no, she'll just do it. And I'm just like, excuse me, no, you're going to pick up your trash now. You're going to make your bed now. And so they've got chores every single weekend.

33:40Stephen Ellsworth:And when they... Stephen lays down the law. Yeah. I have no time for entitled kids. And so it's just helping them understand the value of hard work and the value of money, honestly. I mean, I'm on board for that. It's just I'm not... I'm just a kind of a pushover. I'll be honest. When it comes to the kids, they just look at me with their eyes and I'm like, just give me a hug. I love a good hug, too. I know. But I'm definitely more of a pushover when it comes to that stuff. but I do want that. So I'm like, yeah, you do it. You do it. Yeah. Yeah. She was literally putting, putting our youngest one to bed yesterday.

34:15Yeah. Yeah. Last night. And she literally walks up the stairs. She goes, your youngest son needs discipline.

34:23Stephen Ellsworth:You need to come down here. So we switched, but we have an understanding. Well, that's delegating. I know. And it's not, he just like dad's there and he like gets in bed. Like, and I'm like, he just doesn't do that. He knows. How about, how about you guys? Who lays down the law? Who knows? It'll be me. It'll be you. It'll be me. You'll lay down the law. Don't you think? For our first, yeah. I mean, she is like - Especially since it's a little girl, right? She looks at him and he's like, you can do whatever you want. I'm like - Just like melt - Yeah. She melts him. Yeah. Oh, it's unbelievable. It's so hard.

34:55Well, it's probably because they're your little boys, right? Where it's his little girl. Maybe there's something to do with the opposite gender. I don't know. Yeah, mama's boy, daddy's girl. Yeah. Yeah. But I'm just like, no, I'm like you. Yeah. You're the one who enforces schedules and nap time. So I'll be the enforcer. Yeah. Did you have another question about raising kids? I was going to ask if you gamify chores at all. Oh.

35:20Stephen Ellsworth:Our kids are independent. Cash. Cash. Yeah, but do you put cash rewards behind? Yeah. We tried the beans. We tried the stickers. You get what you want, candy. We tried like all of those things where it's like one of them. Yeah, like a cute one that was you have a bucket of beans and every time you do something good, you hand full and you fill up your jar when your jar is full, you get something. They were like, this is taking too long. They want that immediate gratification. And so our three year old would not sleep through the night the other night. We had just gotten back from vacation, was a little bit off.

35:52Stephen Ellsworth:And he kept up, Steven, like two nights in a row. And I was working or whatever. And so I couldn't like really stay up with him. And finally, the third night, I was like, he was exhausted. to my three-year-old, I go, I will give you$5 if you just sleep through the night. He slept through the night. Slept through the night. And the first thing he said to me next morning is, where's my$5? So it's good. That's so funny, though. Because the kids know the power of money. But then I take the$5 and I put in a swiggy bank, and then the next time I bribe him, I just give him the same$5. But I honestly like it.

36:23That's my way of gamifying it because I think it also, as I said, it teaches them the value of money and the importance of money and sort of keeping it in its right context. right it's a tool it's not the end all end all be all um but it's really funny they're learning negotiating tactics hey uh will you go make your bed clean the game room upstairs clean your room wipe down your sink how much are you going to give me i go hmm i'll give you five dollars 20 dad oh i need 20 i was like excuse me well it's gonna be five otherwise there's no screens for the rest of the day is typically the balance.

37:00But it's fun to see them really negotiate and understand that and understand that the harder they work, it produces the ability to earn money. And then we hold that money and allow them to go pick out things, save up for things, whether it's a packet of Pokemon cards or whatever. You guys, before discovering Skims, I never wore bras. It was the truth. I would wear a sports bra, and that was about it. But now through discovering Skims strapless bra and their everyday triangle bralette, it has truly changed the game. I'm wearing it right now, actually, because whenever I'm wearing the triangle bralette, whenever you get home, you're not like, oh, I can't wait to take off my bra.

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38:16Stephen Ellsworth:There's a layer to it because, like, for example, we've worked really hard. and I know there's always the conversation like first class like flying first class for example I would love to talk about that and he's like the I didn't get to fly first class the kids shouldn't but then that means I can't and I've worked really hard and I want to fly first class yeah I didn't fly first class I was like 35 okay so Stephen's like no no no no we're not doing it and I'm like I'm sorry but the kids are not going to know any different of us going and coach on the way here and then go staying in a five-star resort and then like on the news everyone's saying that we're the poppy founders and we just sold for two billion dollars i'm like them not flying first class isn't changing the reality of they know what's going on so i think it goes back to just teaching them like that's the only thing we really can do it's pretty public everyone i've been to their schools and i'll have people come up to me little five-year-old six-year-old seven-year-old kids and they're like you're a billionaire no like i'm not like it's not the reality it's just so public uh-huh so i'm like just let me fly first class yeah yeah would you guys fly first class with your kids well we were talking about it on the way home because so right now she sits on our lap and we were flying first class on the way back from vancouver to um austin but i was And I was like, so what happens when she starts to know?

39:45And we didn't get much further than that. What happens? We can just do it right now. We can just, do you want to, I don't know what we're, I don't know what we're going to do. So one piece of advice. Cause I'm like you, I want to stay. I want to go up there.

39:55Stephen Ellsworth:Yeah. Yeah. And quite frankly, so do I. Cause it just, traveling takes so much energy, especially with kids and you're cramped and the whole thing. So I think it just makes all of our lives easier. But someone told me it's how you, I don't know, how you treat those sort of nice things in life and the people surrounding it, right? I think if it's expected and you treat people a certain way because of it, I think that's where you can start to go wrong and sort of they get complexes on sort of us versus them, if you will. And so I think that that's one of the things. That didn't really make a lot of sense.

40:36But like, for example, like a flight attendant. If you're in first class, it doesn't entitle you to treat that person any different. So it's please and thank you. Thank you so much. I appreciate you. All of that. And so I think the way that we show up as parents to everyone in our circle or in our surroundings, regardless of status, you just treat everybody with respect. And I feel like that goes a long way in sort of teaching them that we're no different than everybody else. Yes, we have some of these things that we can afford, but it doesn't entitle you or give you uh permission to act a certain way are you ever going to say things like mom and dad worked really hard for this money but it all the time okay yeah that's like i've always thought that was like mom and dad worked really hard for this but like it doesn't mean that you get to be

41:23Stephen Ellsworth:an asshole or something we were raised not with money both of us right like yeah norma was raised by a single mom who worked a minimum wage job but i never really thought we were poor even though looking back we were probably lower income because there was just so much love in our home and so I just feel like we remember that we have those memories we want to instill in like hard work like this is our money we made this like what are you gonna do um and then I think the scary thing is that comes in is like we can teach our kids but it's like their kids is it's the generations after that like gives me more anxiety I'm like okay I can I can at least control this situation with my own children.

42:03Stephen Ellsworth:Yeah. I think for me, it's so funny. I think like one of the things that comes to mind because I have three boys is like, oh my gosh, I'm going to be psycho once I start dating. Oh yeah. It's like all these girls. That's so funny. like so public, like that stuff gives me anxiety. But I got to let them be and hopefully they'll just fall in love with the sweetest people ever. Well, it'll still be our money, not their money. They haven't made any money. There's guardrails around that. They have no money. They're still broke. Yeah. You're just reminding them that at the Thanksgiving table. Don't forget.

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43:54Stephen Ellsworth:Like advice now to that person or like my younger self? Like you can. Like knowing what they know now, talking to them. So there's a great like little thing that I saw. And it was if Allison in June of 2016 was going to meet Allison of today, what would Allison of today tell June 2016 Allison? What advice would you give her? one piece of advice I think I would give her first is have more kids we wish we would have more kids which we might still it's not over it's not over um because it's a lot better if you just do it quickly while they're all young and like once you get out of the phases that's a big thing right like and even knowing how hard it it was with kids I would have been like had to have two more.

44:49Stephen Ellsworth:I think another one was don't lose yourself because along the way with Poppy, we had so much change that I was fearless. I was so ready to take on the world. And there was a kind of a phase along the way with Poppy. I kind of lost myself because we brought in a lot of people that quote unquote, I thought knew more than me. And that doesn't mean I can't grow, change and get better. But I lost my confidence kind of there in the middle. And then I got a business coach, and I found my voice again, and I found my confidence. And once I did that was better for the business, it was better for the cultures, better for the people, better for our marriage.

45:35Stephen Ellsworth:But I do think, you know, I look back and I'm like, don't lose your confidence. Don't let people change who you are and now I'm back there now but I think that's the thing a lot of entrepreneurs go through right they feel like they have they take bad advice all the time those type of things what about you um yeah I think I think I would probably what you said resonates with with me I think you get a round of people that have been there done that I think they have a skill set entrepreneurs have a certain skill set as well and so to to sort of maintain in that voice and confidence throughout the whole process.

46:11The other thing that I would say is enjoy the process. Document the process a little bit better. But really, like, enjoy the process. And I think it's easier to do now, and I sort of reflect on all of the things in my life, but it's pressure is a privilege, right? And so I look back fondly on some of the darkest days while building the brand, where I'm at a warehouse in Harry Hines, Dallas, which is like a bad part of town at like two in the morning because the equipment broke. And I have a purchase order that needs to go out by 4 p.m. the next day. And we have to wake up and we have to, you know, fill the bottles and get the product out the door.

46:57Like those are like dark days and babies at home screaming like the whole like the whole thing. But I look back on those days and those are really like the days I look back the most fondly of because those are the days that really tested my character and sort of like reset my baseline for what I knew I was capable of accomplishing. And so I would say enjoy those moments. Enjoy those moments because those are the moments you grow the most. It makes me like ready to run through a wall.

47:27Stephen Ellsworth:Journal. I wish I would have journaled. Journaled more? What do you mean by document more? Yeah, like, you know, our whole journey was online, right? Like with TikTok, we have 3 billion views, like, on my face on TikTok. It's crazy. It's not that, but I almost wish those internal note-taking for me, different stages of the business, so many emotions. You have so many high highs, so many low lows. It's such a thing that you forget. It's almost like, you know, childbirth. you're like oh that was horrible fun amazing exciting and then you like forget about it and then you do it all over again like that was easy yeah yeah exactly no it wasn't you like kind of just forget so i think for me it would i wish i would have journaled which i am not a journaler i like won't even write an email oh so you just wish you would just write something down yeah voice note something yeah yeah like this was a really like the like the nights like the harry But like you forget a lot because you were saying like we couldn't pay the bills.

48:30Stephen Ellsworth:And he told he tells me stories sometimes. And I'm like, wait, that happened. I don't remember that. But it was it was we, you know, couldn't make our mortgage one night. And the check came for our tax return the next day. And we were able to make our mortgage. And just like and I'd never really I was like, oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The money burden was something that was top of mind always for me. But yeah. Yeah. Like, I'm the creative. He's always kind of kept the wheels on. We always say I'm jumping off the cliff and he's catching me. It's typically like how our businesses, I can just, anything's possible.

49:08Stephen Ellsworth:Sky's the limit. I will try literally anything once. And I think that goes back to the changing, what I was saying earlier of, I always have this mentality of change, you know, but then I thought, oh, maybe this is the way things are supposed to be. And that's not who I am. So when we do it next, I probably will go crazier than we did this time, too. That's pretty cool to hear, though. I'm really excited for what's next. I also love how the first reaction was family focused and family oriented. And despite all the success that y 'all have had, what it all comes, the first thing that you come back with is.

49:47Of what you would tell your younger self, how she said have more kids. Yeah, I thought that was cool, too.

49:50Stephen Ellsworth:I would have six kids I just don't want to be pregnant again Girl preach They're wonderful little things when they're here But man, being pregnant sucks Anyone that tells you that they enjoy it That is a special person And bless you, but it sucks Especially in Texas, y 'all, it is hot here You're not going to hear it from me It's 100 degrees We're just cheerleaders on the sideline on this one Just please As many as you will Yeah, you won five You want five, right? How many kids do you have? You want five kids? Four or five. But I'm like you. So somebody gave us this great advice, which was don't think about now.

50:28Think about your Thanksgiving table in 25 years. How many people do you want around it, right? And I was so sick every day that I was pregnant, right? And I just hated it. But, you know, it's like, okay, you just do it again. I mean, you've done it three times. So that's a lot more than my one, right? But still, girl, I hear you. Some people are like, I felt so connected to my body and all my ailments left. I was like, what? My body was like attacking me. And I'm like, that was not my journey.

50:55Stephen Ellsworth:And you know what? Every pregnancy is different. All three of mine were so wildly different. So hopefully your next will be better. Hopefully. That's a good, I'm glad to know that they were all different. And they were all the same gender. Exactly. So like there's no, that's a wise tale, right? Like if you have a boy, maybe it doesn't take as much as your hormones. So you're not as sick. I don't think that's like a real thing. Well, yeah. And my third, there was like, it's just gets easier each time. No, my third was my hardest. He was 10 pounds, two weeks late. And I do like all natural birth.

51:25Stephen Ellsworth:And so it was, it was just like a little bit of a, that honestly scarred me or we probably would have had another one. So, so they're all different. Let's just say that. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. That's good to know. Um, I'm just going to go back to her. Do it. Yeah. On the, on the advice and confidence piece that really lands, especially because one of my takeaways has been um like pregnancy in entrepreneurship how different the path is for so many different entrepreneurs but one of the commonalities that i see with a lot of folks who give advice is um they take their experience and really swear by it and that experience really may not be right for you right and especially if when you look at your value system and if your value system is more family oriented and relationship oriented than taking advice from someone who's three divorces deep and hasn't been to a kid's birthday in, you know, 24 months, um, may not be right for you.

52:29Or if you're more of a, a brand built behind IP versus a brand built behind, um, uh, you know, some other form of defensibility, like it, so that's the other thing I've struggled or that has resonated with me is definitely like what may have worked for you very well may not work for how we're doing things. And I see how taking the wrong advice has hurt my confidence and the process of finding your voice that you're confident in. Well, I like that you said, I thought these people knew more than me, but in fact, like Poppy is y 'all's DNA. So it's like you knew the most. you just for a second thought maybe they did and then you realize like no I do yeah and then I

53:14Stephen Ellsworth:think coming out of the other side the better mental space to be is a collaboration between where they have a common respect and you also have a common respect and it's a partnership right we wouldn't have gotten this far without all the people and our employees and everyone that we've worked with but it was learning process for them as well right you have these entrepreneurs coming in that have no traditional say like operations marketing they're all traditionally there we would step back from a lot of the stuff also being like oh they know more than us where as an entrepreneur you have a lot of grit and willingness to learn and try different things and so I think they had to learn that and in the value of what we brought in the same and then once we kind of we had like a rocky six months that it was like that and then once they kind of figured it out is really where our explosive growth came and we just had such a mutual respect but it was it was kind of crazy there for a bit but I'll be honest like Poppy was so stressful with it with the growth and and I think a lot of entrepreneurs with like their egos as well nobody likes to be wrong or to ask for help but I think that it's important that you do have lots of voices at the table for sure yeah it doesn't seem like you guys have an ego at all i mean i'm sure i do i feel like you have in different ways you have confidence but it doesn't i think there's a difference between confidence and ego maybe that's the wrong read i think that's a great way like we have a lot of confidence but i think that's been one of the biggest things is as an entrepreneur you can't have an ego it hurts the business and it hurts the people that work for you.

54:52Stephen Ellsworth:I mean, we have 250 employees. Poppy is our DNA, but we can't run this engine by ourselves. And to have that mutual respect, I think a lot of entrepreneurs forget that, forget that piece. It's a nice, yeah. Yeah. I think like the ego would show up as like, you have a team, you can't do it without the team and you want to empower them to do it their way and to be creative and run the business. And so I think ego can show up in that way because you're like i know i'm right but yet i want to empower you and so that's where it can show up sometimes where it's like i'm right i know i'm right i can make this decision if i want to but like you know want to make sure that that you that you're bought into the idea as well or just let them let them do it so i think that that's a way that you know i want poppy to be successful without us yeah right totally you know what i mean i need i want and need the brand to stand on its own um we sold 100 % of our company, you don't sell your house and keep the keys and then like tell people what flowers to plant.

55:52Stephen Ellsworth:You know what I mean? The beauty is they do want us to still be involved and respect that value that we do bring, which is we're almost getting the best of both worlds right now. Oh, I didn't. Okay. So you're still going to be like, you said you're, you're still more involved. Yeah. So like all, I ran all of our creative and brand at Poppy. And so I'm still heavily involved in the creative side and the brand and the social and the face of and all of that. But I don't have a team anymore. You know, you're not doing the mid-year reviews. You're not doing the day-to-day like in the weeds. So it's just like any advisor, which is kind of nice because it's the fun, big like stuff that can really make impact on.

56:31Have you been bored?

56:32Stephen Ellsworth:You know, my new norm, I will say I'm a little bored, but I'm finding like health and wellness exciting again wanting to work out I would say you know I think I worked out seven times the first two weeks after selling poppy I didn't work out seven times last two years yeah wow you know like stuff like that I am excited I'm guest shark on shark tank that's exciting right yeah like so we're working on a lot of investment he's leading a lot of the investments but we both when we're looking at an investment it's what can he bring on the business and operational side and then how how can I help with the creative and brand, which is a really great thing that people also want us, right?

57:14Stephen Ellsworth:You're getting like a two for one. So we've been focusing on a lot of deals as well. I'm excited about, I can't talk about if I did or did not make a deal yet. Oh, okay. Juicy. Air for a little bit, but super excited about it and being the first person to have gotten a deal to go back and be a shark. Like the full. It's so full circle. It's really cool. It's the American dream. Totally is. A lot about y 'all's story is that. Um, okay. So did you guys bring a bicker of the week? Oh gosh. Yeah. I, I, I heard about that. We always do a bicker this week. Sometimes, you know, like it can be something like blot versus rub.

57:53Do you swerve when you see a pothole? Like something that you guys have a differing opinion on.

57:58Stephen Ellsworth:Kids? No, I'm just kidding. Parenting styles? No. It can be that. That's, that's, that works too. I'd be curious. When you're annoyed with me. The bicker of the week. um we're house hunting right now oh so there's plenty of things that are healthy debates as we look for for a new home i don't know if that's been the the bicker of the week oh we have we have one with that primary bedroom upstairs or downstairs in canada they're all upstairs in oklahoma they're all down and i think they should be down down down down yeah down one way why would you want to subject yourself to walking up the stairs yeah privacy no because the kids The kids' bedrooms are up there, too.

58:40It's like not. But if there's people at the house and you're hanging in the kitchen, upstairs. I think this is like ludicrous. I was like, why would the primary bedroom ever be upstairs? And he was like, they all are in Canada. And I was like, oh, hmm. Well, you pulled that one out because we have not actually online bickered about that. Oh, here's a good bicker for us. Here's a good bicker. Okay. How we vacation. Oh, okay. So I'm the kind of guy, very laissez-faire, go with the flow, allow time to breathe and be spontaneous. Allison's like, okay, it's 1.12 and 29 seconds, we're going here. At 1.17 and 15 seconds, we're going here.

59:24And literally the entire trip is like micromanaged the entire way.

59:29Stephen Ellsworth:This day from 9 to 12 is you want that downtime, that's when you can do it. Scheduled downtime. I want days of downtime. It's like scheduling in chaos. Like can live in that. So I do what you do. Okay. You guys are so – I have a caveat. Okay. Which is everything is cancelable. Oh, okay. Totally. So like we will have a dinner reservation every night. We will have a breakfast place to walk to every morning. But if like we're tired and we just want to have breakfast in bed, then like that's the path we'll go. I like that happy meeting. There will be like scheduled downtime. And then the consistent fight that we have, and I move it from a bicker to a fight.

1:00:16This is elevated. I never program enough time for Alex loves to get ready. He loves to get ready. And I'm very much like we're going to walk around this area, like get back to the hotel at 445, like kind of change outfits and leave at 5. No. And she wants to be back at like three, you know, do the two-hour relax.

1:00:41Stephen Ellsworth:You've got to have time to shoot content. You want to get ready. I like to have like a glass of wine. So this is when I go to the gym. It's like our favorite time. Yes, it's me. Right? So she gets back at three. Then I'm solo. I've got an hour, hour and a half to gym and sauna. Because I'm just watching the kids while I'm trying to get ready for two hours. That's the new thing. Those are details. Those are details that are tough. Small details. That's been the new big one. I'm like, oh. what's going on there i have a couple other questions okay we're um were you involved in the alex early all yeah of course okay i'd love to hear about that partnership because it is all over my tiktok yes okay so what we loved look we were always like a creator first brand our first year in business we basically didn't do a paid ad we didn't have a pr agency we weren't even really i think we were like doing some paid on amazon but our really big bucket was influencers and creators like really leaning into that from the beginning and keep in mind poppy launched march of 2020 the first week of covid so everyone's stuck at home desperate for content to share that was better for you shelf stable all of those like covid we think back feels like forever ago um and i just remember alex drank poppy in college before she blew up So she was already like a fan of the product.

1:02:03And I remember even like Jake Shane, for example, was drinking Poppy when he had 90 ,000 followers.

1:02:07Stephen Ellsworth:I love it. You know what I mean? And so we've always done really good at just understanding the incredible creators before they blow up and just had partnerships. And it's usually they are drinking it and that's where we reach out, right? It's like this discovery way that we've always worked with our partners. And so Alex just consistently loved the product. and then we just started doing a regular deal with her where it was like do some posts and she was just loving it and then we've really when it comes to investment at poppy you've had one big investor and then the only other people we allowed in were celebrities and influencers so um when we were doing a round it kind of got out we were talking who wants to be in it and Alex wanted to be a businesswoman right and so she ended up investing in poppy we did an equity deal with her.

1:02:56Stephen Ellsworth:We've also paid her on top of it. It just was this like organic relationship that we just started working through. And she's just a business woman. She is incredible. She's so professional. She's so sweet. She genuinely loves the product works hard. And so it just consistently kept building over the years. And I think a lot of people see it now overnight and we're doing so much stuff with her, but it's been, I mean, we've been working with her three, four years, right? And so now it's fun. We just launched our own can with her at Walmart. We just did a big sorority push she's doing an internship and a lot of that was like her idea oh that's really cool yeah so she designed the can i got on a call with her and she literally drew on an ipad like what she wanted the can to look like and stuff oh i love that yeah so it's just like i when you get that kind of like support and love for a brand on both sides makes for the best relationships if you work with talent and they just want a paycheck we've never really been down for that like we want true partners and And it worked out really well.

1:03:52Stephen Ellsworth:And she's just, she's a baddie. I think it just comes down to like you like to work with people you like. And I think it was just like sort of this natural evolution as she talked about. And from her team to Alex, it's just they like to work hard. They like to be good people. She seems like she really likes to work hard. She works hard. And has a good head on her shoulders. And she has fun while doing it, which I'm obsessed with. Like don't take yourself too serious. Correct. And she never does. and it's very relatable but aspirational at the same time. And yeah, I think that's really, everything you said, I'm glad to hear you say, but it's like what I was hoping you would say about her.

1:04:30Yeah, there's nothing worse when you have like this image of someone and then you meet them, you're like, oh, bummer. It's so great when they exceed your expectations of your preconceived notions. It's one of my favorite things. Yeah, it's so funny. When you meet somebody, you're like, okay, here we go. And then afterwards, you're like, they were awesome. Yeah, love that. Yeah, is that not the best feeling ever? It's so good. Especially with social media. You have these personas online that you think you're going to see or meet, and then sometimes you meet them and you think, okay, a little different than I was thinking.

1:04:59Sometimes you meet them and you think, so much more personality in person. It's fascinating. It's a fascinating world we get. Yeah, it's a collaboration that really seems to have nailed for both sides. It's mutually beneficial. Totally.

1:05:13Stephen Ellsworth:I know. We've not had the best luck with some others, which I won't mention. You can. There's a couple swing and a misses. There's a couple swing and a misses. And that is where we learned why that method works so much better. She's such a home run that you had to kiss a few frogs before you got there, it sounds like. And that's worth it. Totally. 100%. And a lot of the times people starting a business, one of the first questions that they'll ask me is, should I raise money? and it feels like a lot of entrepreneurs hear very scary stories about raising money and so obviously you guys have gone down the path of raising external capital.

1:06:00Our company's gone down the path of raising external capital. I'd love to hear how you answer that question.

1:06:10Stephen Ellsworth:I'm going to say something and then you actually take the question. I think that as an entrepreneur, you don't start a company to have people tell you what to do. The second you take money, you have people tell you what to do. So. Great. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think. It's true, though. Yeah. I mean, I think that's right. As soon as you take investors, I think like the biggest thing for us is we always wanted to be. We always wanted to have the business be a certain size within sort of a relatively reasonable time frame. And with that, it just typically requires capital, particularly in beverage.

1:06:49But what I would say is just be very intentional when you take a big check from someone. I think angel investors or, you know, smaller seed investors, like that's different. but you start to take 10, 15, 20, 25 million dollars, like you want to pick the right group.

1:07:09Stephen Ellsworth:But it changed our lives. I do not regret it. For a second, it got us to where we are. And I think with Poppy, we made a really big intentional point to spend a lot of money for growth to get brand new. I mean, we did a Super Bowl ad like our third year in business, right? I remember that. We're the only Shark Tank deal to ever have done a Super Bowl ad. Right. And so that's expensive. And so we made those decisions and we held hands and it was the deal we did. And so like I was saying that, like, but that comes with people telling you what to do. And that doesn't mean like telling you what to do necessarily change your business, but you have to then be fiscally responsible.

1:07:50Stephen Ellsworth:You have to have board meetings. You have to do a lot of those things that make you a business once you take someone else's money. so um i am a big fan of it just getting to get into it with someone that respects your values and allows you to be you back to that earlier conversation and yeah and raise it at the right time yeah from the right people but but i don't regret regret it because you know when we when we started there was another guy that i met at a farmer's market as well and he was didn't really want to change, didn't want to adapt, didn't want to take money, and he's out of business.

1:08:27And we sold our company for$2 billion. And so I think it's a balance, especially when it's your first at-bat, right? A lot of the times you need other smart people, you want other smart people around the table.

1:08:41Stephen Ellsworth:Even if we start a company, we would take on investment. We're not going to just pay for it all ourselves. It's just we will now have a little bit more control over that, if that makes sense. but I think you have to. It's also nice to have people in the trenches with you. Totally. Yeah, that's true. Okay, I have a last question. Okay. Are you proud of yourselves? I'm really proud of you. Thank you. You're welcome. You know, it's hard. It's hard because like I'm proud as an inspirational mom. I'm proud to be the largest exit of a female founder in beverage history. I'm so proud to be the first guest shark to have gotten deal to come back.

1:09:16Stephen Ellsworth:Like there's a lot of those like big things that I'm really proud of. But then I look at myself, I'm like, man, like, can I do this again? Or like you get scared. Like the imposter syndrome is still real. And I think that just makes me human when it comes to like you just did this. And then you're saying, like, can I do it again? That's so crazy. I know because it's it's also like, oh, that's a lot of work. That's just I'm proud. I am proud of myself, but I'm still very like humble, I think, to not let it go to my head. Like I'm just a girl kind of like you're like, is that how you feel? like I'm just a girl or no no I don't think I'm just a girl I think like my success it has nothing to do with me a woman or not a woman I think it's just sorry that's a TikTok trend like like do you know what not like I'm just a girl but like um okay you haven't seen the trend it would make sense you know what I mean like you say these crazy things and then you say like I'm just a girl okay so it didn't land sorry it's okay I'm surprised you didn't know that I know I usually The other TikTok trend you did was I met my younger self for coffee and then I told.

1:10:16That was a trend.

1:10:17Stephen Ellsworth:Wait, are you proud? Yeah, thank you. Oh, am I proud? Hey, I want to hear this. Yes, I'm very, yeah, I'm proud. I'm proud for sure. I think I could be better about stepping back and smelling the roses a little bit more. And I think that's, for me, that's a learned behavior. um i also like and it's so cheesy it's like i'm i'm of the growth mindset uh it's so cliche to say but yeah i always think that there's an opportunity to still show up the next day and be better but absolutely and there's nothing more special to me than having some of those moments where it it feels like sort of everything comes together and you're you're able to sort of step back and almost have this out-of-body out-of-body experience to say like wow the only way that i'm able to do this right now where i'm at with these people is because of what we've done and so that's that's pretty that's pretty special i think it's just we're not done yet and so like we there's more in us so it's like yes we're proud but we're not done there's this there's i like that though proud but never satisfied yes yes so it's that yeah and that's like a sentiment that i'm really gathering from you guys is like um very humble very not finished and very just like you guys are doers like your family oriented doers and I think it's really it's inspiring and like comforting to hear kind of I don't know that comforting is the right word but it's close to comforting relatable yeah or like a lot of people no I think like authentic relatable is like what we hear and I'm not saying like I am that but you know there sometimes people don't want to talk about this stuff and they're not as real and it's like I think more people should be authentic and real and tell like real stories and not, everyone's like, what books do you read and what's your inspirational and what's your daily routine?

1:12:07Stephen Ellsworth:I'm like, I don't know. I listen to podcasts. Yeah, that's like, but that's the trend. Like that's the, I'm just a girl's like, I'm very humble. Like I did XYZ. I was a badass, but then at the end, and that's like, I don't know what my morning routine is. It's not a 12 step. Like I don't sauna and then I don't do a seven step skincare routine and then like, and then meditate. Like it's not that. Like I don't have time for that. I would love to do that, but I don't have time. Wouldn't that be nice, right? You should do it for like a week. You deserve it. I know, I should. But then you'd get back to your next thing.

1:12:35I'm up at 3.30. I jog for five miles. I come back. I wash my face. I hit the gym for an hour and a half. Actually? No. Oh, I was like, geez. No, no. That is like the opposite. That is the opposite. I'm like woken up by my kids, like just trying to make coffee. But see, it's so funny because online the trend is like in order to be successful, you must start with your morning routine. and now it's like no dude just get up and get after it yeah just survive yeah um okay you guys were amazing thank you so much for coming thank you um yeah i think it's going to be like a very aspirational inspirational real kick in the ass interview let's go thanks for having us thank you for coming thank you and thank you for being vulnerable thank you for saying like relationship was the third because sometimes we get these pr answers and it's very like everything was perfect and it was all sunshine and rainbows.

1:13:26And it's like, no, it wasn't, but it was fun. It was awesome. Yeah. No regrets. And I still love him. Yeah. That's obvious. There's an underlying theme of love. I know. Sometimes. And more, yeah. When he lets me shop. When he lets me shop, I love that. Okay, well, thank you all for listening. We love you guys. Thanks for listening to another episode of Two Parents in a Podcast, powered by Just Media House. If you enjoyed the show, don't forget to like, subscribe, comment, rate, and review. Stay connected on Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, and Facebook at Two Parents in a Pod. Welcome to our home. Sorry it's so messy.

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