Rob Mayhew on the untapped creator opportunity in B2B, London vs New York and using social media as a brand

0:06Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to a bonus episode of Uncensored CMO. So this week, I'm catching up with my good friend and returning guest, Rob Mayhew. If you haven't come across Rob, quite frankly, where have you been? He is one of the funniest people on TikTok and LinkedIn and is an awesome content creator. Now, Rob has just moved his life over to New York. So as I was in town, I thought I'd catch up and find out what New York is like and how the US is treating him. But also what's going on in the world of social media? What makes great content? What's the life of a content creator like?

0:37And most importantly, perhaps, how can brands work with content creators to get their message across their audience? Rob, as always, is brilliant and funny. So here it is, my interview with Rob Mayhew. Before we begin, can I just say thank you on behalf of everyone for giving CMOs a platform? Because outside of their salary and their thought leadership, it's nice to see them on video. Yeah. It's nice to... I'm joking, it's great. I love what you do, John. And I'm a regular viewer listener. Yeah, talking about viewer listening, you're going YouTube, I think, aren't you? I am going YouTube. So, should I give you the story?

1:19Yeah. Shall we start with why we're in New York? We're in New York right now in a private members club. Massively exclusive. Very exclusive. So exclusive, there's only you and I here. I'm going to give them a shout out in case they want to give me a free membership. Zero Bond. Zero Bond. um so two memberships two memberships so that'd be great so we yes we're in new york i moved to new york from london last year uh because whenever you're doing really well in a city like london which i was i was doing really good leave that city and come to a city where no one really cares about you that's always a good career and where they may ban the platform that you really kind and it became your cell phone.

2:01So yeah, so we moved to New York and it's been a journey. New York's very different to London. It's the most exciting city I've ever been to and lived in. But I would say this, unless you're rich, the quality of life isn't as good as London, is my opinion. And I'm not rich, so it's less. But for instance, the groceries are very poor. The restaurants are fantastic. The bread is horrible. High street bread, grocery bread's got sugar in it, John. Ooh, that's a good tip. So that just tastes weird. And I missed the Cadbury's chocolate. Another shout out. I know. That is the thing, isn't it? Yeah. So I've got so much airport Cadbury's chocolate, I spend hundreds of pounds every time I fly back.

2:45So I came to New York and I was working at an agency called Movers and Shakers up until a few months ago, and then I decided to go full-time content creator. Whoa. Which is very exciting for a 45-year-old man to say. And, yeah, it's really good. I mean, it just means that, like, New York is a very exciting city to be a content creator in. I think it's very welcoming and everyone wants to help you and introduce you to people. So it's a really fun time for me being in New York. I just love it. It's an exciting city. The comedy here is fantastic. I've been trying to drive, trying to get Nils Leonard to come to the comedy cellar with me to watch some comedy, but he's too busy upstate.

3:30You know, I've cracked. I haven't cracked, but I love TikTok. It's been so good to me. I'm going to continue to post every day on TikTok. LinkedIn equally has been fantastic to me. It's my fastest growing platform for my sketches. And I've always been interested in YouTube. I consume so much YouTube. I'm like a 17 year old boy at home, just consuming YouTube. And what made me think, what can you remember TFI Friday, John? We're of the same age. We're a similar genre. So TFI Friday, the big breakfast, there was an energy around, it felt like event TV, live TV. And outside of podcasts like this, they were just buzzing with energy.

4:18I was thinking that's kind of missing on YouTube. So I'm going to create a show, or I am creating a show, I'm filming a pilot this month called Friday Revival Club. And the idea is that Fridays used to be the most fun day at work. You'd be hungover. You'd start drinking in the afternoon. It's not around booze, but, you know, it would be the most inspiring day. It would be, you kind of would stop work a bit early. You'd be messing about. Music would be on. And I feel like we've lost that. people don't go into the office on Fridays anymore. So I'm bringing back Fridays. I'm making Fridays fun again.

4:52And I'm going to be filming every week from a new office, from a company's office. And it'll be an entertainment show with music, comedy, me hosting with someone else. And it will be prerecorded, going out live on Fridays, and eventually we'll have it live once I've got some sponsors, John. You know? Yeah, sponsors. Anyone listening watching? Anyone listening wants to sponsor me. And you're doing this in New York. Doing this in New York. I've got my first company. I'm going to be at Mojo Supermarket. I'm going to be hosting the first episode. And yeah, it's really exciting. I'm looking forward to doing it.

5:30It's going to be like late night TV, but kind of in an office, as you can imagine. So it should be fun. It's still kind of within my niche, but I feel like there's, you know, I want it to be a bit more entertaining. Yeah. But I'll still be continuing to do my comedy, holding a mirror up to the agency world. Well, expect nothing less, mate. You're right about New York, because I get to spend lots more time here than I used to. Yeah. And the connections and opportunity is just, it's some energy about, like, everyone wants to help you. Everyone wants you to succeed. Everyone will kind of make things happen and talk about what's possible.

6:07And you just don't get that same energy in London, do you? Not really. I just it just feels so noticeable here and everyone's so encouraging and you know you can just meet you'll have one meeting and they'll introduce you to two more people and that's really exciting especially sort of where I'm at now with just becoming a full-time creator I'm you know and this is a new city for me so I'm looking to kind of go and you know I'm literally going door to door of agencies introducing myself and meeting brands and and you know understanding kind of who I should be sitting down with and that people have been incredibly helpful there.

6:41And it's been great. I love it. It's just a good city. It's good fun. It is great. Does the comedy translate? Is there any differences in the sense of humour? Yeah, well, people over here in New York, they take their jobs, I'd say, more seriously. I think there's a reason for that. You know, your healthcare is wrapped up in that. You get paid a lot because it's very expensive. It's so expensive here, John. It's crazy, isn't it? So just going to Pret-a-Manger. Compare it, like you go and buy a sandwich and a Diet Coke and a cookie, it's like$24. Yeah, it's not do you want fries with that, it's do you want a mortgage with that.

7:15Yeah, it's ridiculous, it's a good one. It's just so expensive. So yeah, people take their jobs very seriously. And I think that, you know, there's less of a work-life balance. I think your career is really important here. I'm not saying it isn't in London, but I feel like, you know, there's a bit more of a pub culture. It's probably more family friendly. you know it's it's good which is you know why i've decided to be a full-time creator here because i can't keep up with everyone in the workplace i always wondered why like americans are always talking about their successes and what they've achieved and i realize now it's because they're worried about getting fired yeah it's like it's a constant walking cv oh my god i did this i closed this deal i know this person how do you get at least in english you'll get a month um whereas here it's like if you're fired you're out yeah that's it you're gone and now no health care so So good luck.

8:00Off you go. Have you picked up any US clients yet? I have, yeah. I've been working with some brands on their TikTok playbooks and helping some with their LinkedIn strategy. So I'm doing two things. So my content creation is like 80 % of my time and then 20 % I'm calling special projects because it sounds more fun rather than freelancing. And that's, yeah, I'm sort of helping some brands with like creating a TikTok playbook that's more representative of where they need to be in 2025. like the days of jumping on trends, the days of just trying to hijack culture on TikTok are kind of gone and people want more original content.

8:38You know, like the nutter butter is an original idea, driven long-term, you know, that's taken a year, two years to kind of get it to sort of be an overnight success. And so it's kind of, I'm helping some brands over here with that transition. I think it's really fun. And that's actually one of the reasons why I, with YouTube for instance you know I see a real opportunity now for branded content on YouTube that to me is a really exciting platform that you're starting to see more of it now but I feel like you're going to get more brands creating original TV shows or you know YouTube shows that they can kind of sponsor you know it might be like the best properties for sale kind of house show or I'm trying to think of an example for you now John off the top of my head if Moonpig were here, which I think they might be now, you know, they could do a, you know, a pig at the party, I don't know, you know, a spontaneous party thing on YouTube.

9:34So it'd be like a long form comedy because people are watching YouTube on the big screen. That's kind of how they're watching it now. I had to say Fineri from Google actually on the podcast recently. I heard that one. Yeah, she was telling me about the stats and I think it's like 40 % of people watch YouTube or 40 % of YouTube content is watched on the big screen. And when you combine the ability to target getting personalized, you're like, this is literally like the power of TV with the power of the ability to target. And you can really target, you know, people's interests quite specifically.

10:03It's incredible. It is incredible. And I think that, you know, moving into longer form is where brands are going to, because it doesn't have to be really expensive now. So I think that's where creators can play a part as well as getting some creators to sort of front this, these shows. So that's why I'm doing Friday Revival Clubs. Hopefully then a brand will come in and offer me a lot of money. The bit that blew my mind was, you You know, last year, Ryan Reynolds and Hugh Jackman did Deadpool versus Wolverine, right? And then Sophie showed me the creators they partnered with to launch. Now, you'd think they'd be, you know, doing the rounds on traditional TV.

10:35Yeah. But they were like doing Chicken Chop Date, for example. You know, with seven or eight million subscribers. And, you know, it's more important for them to do that than it is to kind of be on TV. You know, that's where the people, that's what people are watching now, what they're consuming. And it's just more relevant now. That's how you become part of the conversation. It's just, yeah, it's exciting time. I think it's a really exciting time to be a creator. And, you know, being in America, I really hope TikTok doesn't, you know, it's the end of TikTok here. What do you think is going to happen?

11:02Because the ban was like the shortest ban ever. Yeah. The last 24 hours, I think. 24 hours. I think slightly badly managed. But, yeah, it's very sad that it could be Trump that saves it. But, yeah, I think it's too big to go away. I think that they need to keep it. They need to keep it with the algorithm. You can't just buy TikTok without the algorithm. So, yeah, I don't think it's going to go away, and I hope it doesn't, because everything you see on social media kind of comes from TikTok now. You know, Instagram is basically just TikTok repurposed. And so it's just the most exciting platform for brands as well to be on where they can experiment, they can have fun, they can sort of tell their brand story.

11:48and I don't think there's really other platforms that can do that maybe apart from YouTube. LinkedIn are even trying to do the, they've got the video stream, haven't they now? They have, which is great. And I think that's really good because your content as well, John, is like, it's so much easier to consume if you can actually watch it. And I think it's very generous with the algorithm on LinkedIn when you can actually see the videos because people want to be entertained even when they're on LinkedIn looking for a job. I know. I think it's what everyone gets wrong in B2B. This is why you are the perfect articulation.

12:23We all assume we have to be serious. Why do we have to be serious? Just because we're talking about business to business, right? No, exactly. And it's about, you know, you're telling a brand story, whether you're B2B or B2C, you're still telling your story. Just bring some humor or some relatability into that, because that's what's going to, you know, drive people's connections with it. So yeah, I'm seeing that there is a change. And I think LinkedIn's on a journey there now. I think they're sort of starting to take video seriously. They're starting to take creators seriously. I was over there at their office a few weeks ago.

12:55They've got a great office. They want to know what it's like being a creator on there. And, you know, I'm just such a big fan of it. It's just been great for me. I'd say most of my brand deals that I do now are on LinkedIn. I love LinkedIn because it genuinely works, right? You have to put the effort in. I mean, it's probably like two or three years of groundwork you've got to do. But the amount of inquiries that I get from LinkedIn is just incredible. Yeah, and I think what's nice is that people always give LinkedIn a hard time because you always see the thought leadership pieces or the people bragging or that, but that's not right.

13:29You can still curate your own sort of, you know, network on there. And there's so many people I follow on there who I just, you know, who I get smarter from every day just following it. And again, I'm there to be entertained. I want to be entertained on there, which is why I watch your clips on there as well. Thanks, Mike. You're welcome. We're talking of funny though. LinkedIn did this, I don't know if you saw their own ad. So LinkedIn's own ad was quite funny. They had this kind of like, you know, forklift truck driving into a meeting room and lifting the table and pulling it out. Yes, I have seen that.

13:58Yeah, yeah, it's fantastic. Anyway, so it's really funny. So I thought I'll chuck it into system one and see how it did. And it did pretty well. So I did a little write up about why it was, I think I called it at last a funny B2B ad sort of thing. And LinkedIn approached me and said, oh, could we promote that post? So you've got this weird thing where I'm doing a review of LinkedIn's ad and then they're promoting my post. Isn't that wonderful? Isn't that crazy? Isn't that like a weird world? Now, when you say chucking it into system one, what is that process? Do you just hit play on it? Yeah. Tee it up?

14:24Yeah. So quite literally, just upload it to our system. And it takes care of everything automatically. But what it does, it sends out 250 people. They watch the ad. They press some buttons to tell us how they feel, like happy, sad, angry, whatever. Sort of a bit like the faces. All very simple. And then we just collate all those emotions. And then we also get them to watch it and tell us when they felt that emotion. and then we put this like trace of the emotional journey of watching the ad and you kind of see the emotions change second by second so i want to be one of those people yeah yeah well i can send you a link i'd completely railroad it to be honest yeah not funny not funny not funny yeah not funny exactly where's the where's this laughing face i mean we measure basic emotions like happy sad etc right but we did this study looking at what kind what makes up happiness and there's different like 15 different types.

15:14Like you feel happy because you're proud or you're uplifted or, you know, there's different types. Number one form of happiness in terms of effectiveness with advertising is humour. There we go. Yeah, see? So it's like, hence why, like, actually why more B2B ads should be funny. There's like, there's actual science behind it. What's the last funny ad you saw apart from LinkedIn? Oh, God. The last funny ad I saw.

15:46Did you see Mountain Dew's ad with the sick? Yeah. That was a bit weird, but it was quite funny. Do you know what? A lot of absurd at the minute. Yeah. And I think that's interesting. I wonder when we get tired of that, though. We get tired of, like, the absurd. Do we get tired of the celebrities? One thing I've noticed about being in America, and no offence, I'm not having a go at America. I love it here. Please don't get rid of me. during the day normal day the tv ads are health care and legal ads basically pretty much 90 of what i watch that's what it is and then one day of the year i'm not going to say what day it is super uh the big game day is when they um they bring all the humor into all the ads yeah and i find that it's like oh okay that's interesting like we lost our sense of humor for the other 364 days.

16:34It's like, what's going on? I do wonder, like, with celebrities, though, is it going to get exhausting? Like, does it become numbing seeing all these? Because there's no surprise anymore. No. You're going to get Snoop Dogg with someone who you wouldn't normally see him with. It just feels like, oh, yeah, I'd expect that. Yeah. It's interesting to see where we'll evolve from that. Yeah, the other thing I noticed, so I went to Miami for the first time last year, and on the drive from the airport to the hotel, I think the first six posters I saw were all for insurance salespeople. Yeah. Like, I've been in accidents, phone Bob.

17:07But that's the reality. 011, double fourth, double five, hashtag accidents. I mean, they must have a lot of accidents on that road. Yeah, no, that is a lot of the TV now, and it's all medical. And I did a post about this the other day, about that is what the reality is of the kind of TV here, the ad. So, you know, it's just different. It's just different, John. Yeah. It's a different thing. So talking to your posts, what has got the biggest reaction on your LinkedIn? Because every now and then there's one that totally takes off. So for me, it has been just the hot topics, I think, that I can jump on quite quickly.

17:45So, you know, you'll see there'll be rumblings about WPP in the four-day week. So I can jump on that and talk about, you know, come back in because of the culture. And, you know, and then the culture is, you know, there's no coffee left. and there's people in the meeting rooms, you can't get a desk, that sort of thing. So I like to play on those. Those ones people just immediately go crazy for because it's just, we're all thinking that. Whether you agree with being in the office or not, everyone's got a different view on that. But I think we can all relate that a lot of the businesses aren't set up for us being in the office anymore.

18:14So I think those ones do really well. I've been leaning into a lot of how things used to be as well compared to now. So like what Fridays used to be like, you know, going out drinking on a Thursday, used to be different and people are just you know reminiscent of those days uh that that content does well but i'm i'm never going to run out of ideas john i've said this to you before that there's just every time i think i'm gonna i must be drying up now it's like no there's just so much going on that i can kind of um hold a mirror up to and yeah it's it's just hilarious to me do you have a little process i mean or do you just react to what you see or is there like a formula that you apply to so so my prep my my golden rules are have i experienced it has it happened to me i wouldn't like for instance be able to do a lot of stuff from a media agency because i haven't worked in a media agency and then secondly is it something that people would talk about now um and then is it is it funny like is there is it just relatable or is it is there a joke there that i can make quite interesting they're they're kind of my rules and then yeah my process tends to be i'll write it in my notes in my phone and then when i can grab five ten minutes film it with my green screen in the bedroom and then yeah it's uh you know if i've got a new jumper to wear i noticed that yeah thank you rowing blazer there we go very good very nice how many are you up to now um probably up to about 25 now yeah yeah it's not healthy is it healthy but like it's like new york being here has been exciting it's i do miss london i do miss uh obviously friends and just I'm starting now to get booked for doing live performance here as well.

19:57Some agencies are booking me to do stuff, and I was at Advertising Week. I'm going to be at Brands and Culture next month doing some keynote speeches, as you can imagine. So that's fun. And, yeah, it's just kind of building what I had in the UK up here and just keeping doing what I'm doing, basically. Are you seeing any trends out here that maybe are ahead of where we are in the UK? Do you get to spot? Because often a lot of people come over to America and see things emerge in culture, don't they, that then end up popping up in the UK. You see anything here that's caught your eye? From a creative perspective, I think there seems to be more of a bravery around, for instance, you look at brands like Duolingo.

20:44The success of them is because they don't have a sign-off process. They've just given the autonomy to the team to create and post. And that model we all talk about, but we don't actually do in the UK. So I feel like that could be something that could be applied a lot. The shift really on branded content with YouTube, I think it's going to be happening. Bigger investment on making more creative original content for brands as well. More in not just jumping on culture, but actually trying to create something that might be sort of newsworthy in its own right. Yeah, I think, you know, creators invent, and we say Mr.

21:23Beast or something, right, inventing something, right? Or we were in LA a couple of weeks ago talking to Rare Beauty and what Selena Gomez has created, you know, in terms of her own beauty range, the potential for that. See, there you go. That would have been a good answer from me, actually, is the creator economy and them being brands in their own right is way ahead over here. and you can just see that. I can't really think of the UK equivalent of creators turning what they do into brands into a business in the UK in quite the same way. Not really. I'm sure the viewers and listeners will have about a thousand examples, but no, not really.

22:00I think over here, being a creator isn't an embarrassing thing. Being an influencer isn't sort of looked down upon. I think that they see there's money there now and where there's money, there's opportunity. So I think that there's a big kind of, there's a huge market for that over here. And I think that's going to, they're going to definitely be something you'll see. So you'll spot over in the UK. It would be interesting to see where like Chicken Shop Date, what that becomes. And those kind of almost event TV shows are now living on those, you know, on YouTube and stuff. And like, what can she turn that into?

22:38It would be really interesting. Yeah. I had the founder of Poppy, Alison Ellsworth, on the podcast. And the number one tip was get on TikTok as early as you can. But she's become a huge TikTok sensation. And that's probably one of the fundamental reasons that that brand has succeeded is because they've built genuinely following on TikTok for their brand in incredible ways. And I mean, it depends how you look at the data, but they would be probably the fastest growing soft drink ever in terms of like getting to where they are turnover wise in such a short space of time. I've got a TikTok going live tomorrow.

23:13which is my appeal to Poppy to send me a vending machine. Because they got some backlash over that. And I'd like to say this actually. We should talk about that actually. Because that's like, that was slightly unfair. I think that's very much. Yeah, it's very, the thinking there is people are going to be having Super Bowl parties. Let's send them a vending machine. It kind of makes sense to send it to like the Jake Shanes and those people. I really liked it as an idea. And everyone was like, well, you should have sent them to dorms. and, you know, it's like, well, that's not what they're trying to do.

23:46I thought it was a great idea and I would welcome one. Yeah. And I think the backlash, there's always going to be backlash over, you know, always. But I think we're always looking for things to be angry about. Yeah. But I thought if the Super Bowl is such an extravagant event and so many brands do such extravagant things, on the list of brands doing crazy things, that doesn't even make the list. It doesn't. And they also loan the vending machines for the day, right? It wasn't like they were giving these things away. They were kind of loaning them just for the Super Bowl. I'd want to be sent one, though.

24:18Yeah. My wife would be so happy with that. The Wants of Dats, Rob's address. Yes. So that's going live tomorrow, my appeal for a vending machine. How much do you design your content? Talking about that, that story is huge here right now. So it's in the New Yorker. I think it's in a whole lot of major press over here. Probably not in the UK. So how much do you make your content now with an American audience in mind? I'm starting to a little bit. I think my YouTube will be with an American audience in mind in that I'm going to be in New York companies filming it. So I think my content is still very much aimed at my UK audience.

24:52But at some point, I'm going to have to start thinking about, well, how can I play into the fact that I'm here more? But I think a lot of my content, whatever office you're in, is the same things that are happening. It's very relatable throughout the board. Even people will come up to me. I had it in Brooklyn the other day. that a hairdresser came up to me and said that she loves my content. And, you know, she's a hairdresser. So it's not just agency people, which is interesting. Is that your LinkedIn or your TikTok content? TikTok, yeah. Do you have a different audience, depending on which? I do make some things exclusively for LinkedIn, but I tend to, my audience on LinkedIn is very, very niche business, kind of agency people, brand people.

25:34I think my TikTok audience is probably a little bit more varied, I think, and maybe excuse a little bit younger. Yeah, I was chatting to Rory Sutherland the other day about this as well, because he's like blown up ridiculously on TikTok. Do you know what? And I said this to him when we met him in Cannes a few years ago. I said, you need to get on it because people are posting your content. Yeah. Because he's just very charismatic and he says just lovely little insights that can completely change your view on something. So he's made for TikTok. He totally is. Yeah. He seems to be doing very well on there.