Perry Groves | Law Of The Jungle

14:30Undr The Cosh Hosts:And if I get a shot, I remember this big star shape coming towards me and smothering me, honestly, knocking me over and booting the ball. He said, too slow, sunshine. Get the boy out your feet. when you're in playing at the top level, you ain't going to get out of time, and he booted it. And I think that's why my finishing was shit. When I got older, do you know what I mean? I felt PTSD when I was like, fuck, you know? But yeah, he's my hero.

14:49Perry Groves:You mentioned being apprentice, and especially first year, it's intimidating. Did you go in and you were seen and not heard? Did you keep your head down?

14:59Undr The Cosh Hosts:No, I was... I'm ginger. You have to front it, didn't you? And I can remember, because when you're an apprentice, it's the local paper, it's the Evening Gazette, obviously the local paper. So they come and just do a little interview with you, a new apprentice signing for Culture Star. And I can remember having a picture taken with a broom because in the old days you did the baths, didn't you? The changing rooms, you did the pitch, you did the stands after the game had played, whatever. So I remember with a broom and standing there with my apprentice training kit. and in the interview they said you know what are your ambitions whatever so I actually said and there was two really good remember Roger Osborne you scored the winning goal for Ipswich in the FA Cup in 78 against Arsenal I weren't involved oh you weren't involved flipping I'm like last of the summer why not yeah so Roger Osborne scored the winning goal for Ipswich Town in the 19th Cup final against Arsenal and he was playing in centre midfield so he's obviously a good player and in the old days the top players used to drop down the leagues didn't they because they still needed to earn the money.

16:08Undr The Cosh Hosts:And I sent him a midfield player called Steve Leslie and I remember saying in the interview, yeah, I'll give you a couple of months, but I expect to be in the first team by Christmas. So they printed that in the paper and imagine all the senior players going, who the fucking hell? Is this ginger or fucking twat? I could hear him talking about me in the dressing room because in the old days, well, you used to have a knock on the dressing room to go in and put the pot of tea, didn't you, on the front and then pick the kit up and they go, put it over there, fucking put it over there. So, yeah, if you look back, I wasn't media trained.

16:37Undr The Cosh Hosts:Do you know what I mean? If I look back, you think, calm yourself down just a little bit. But yeah, and it's tough. It tests you because everybody, you're trying to take other people's jobs. You know what I mean? When we apprentice, you're trying to take the pros' jobs. Second year apprentices have been there and I was the worst apprentice. I was useless. Jobs and stuff. What, you're going to be jobs? I was like, fuck your jobs off. I didn't come here to be the best broom sweeper ever. I ain't come here to be the best bath cleaner. I used to get called up to the manager. Bobby Roberts was the manager.

17:10Undr The Cosh Hosts:And I used to get called up to his office probably three or four times a week and say, you lazy bastard. You've been told like Tom Chaney was the groundsman who I was in digs with. And a kit man used to say that you're not doing your jobs properly. And I was 16. And even then I said to him, I remember saying to him, I ain't come here to sweep the terraces. I ain't come here to. And he must have thought, you flash little twat. Yeah, so I say, I've come here to be as good a footballer as I can be. I bet deep down he loved it though. Me. Yeah.

17:42Perry Groves:He's got to come down on you quite heavy, but I bet in the back of his mind he's like, fair foxty here.

17:46Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, but the thing as well, what it does is you end up being that brash, you end up putting yourself under pressure as well. Yeah. Because then you have to, you have to mean, and I did generally think I was playing in centre midfield and I was looking at the pros in the team and I was actually thinking I'm better than you. but if you don't if you don't believe it what's the point do you know what I mean you ain't gonna drive yourself on so I can remember just being over at the community area where I was just whacking the ball up against the wall right foot left foot and they were doing their jobs and like trying to find me when I was just hiding

18:20Perry Groves:were you true to your word by the way did you get in the first team yeah

18:23Undr The Cosh Hosts:so I got in the team three weeks before my 17th birthday yeah I'm just walking in like that yeah you want that I took the Gazette with me and went, told you.

18:37Perry Groves:Clean them, son. With the boots.

18:39Undr The Cosh Hosts:But yeah, I made my debut at Layer Road against Bournemouth. And Bournemouth were flying at the time. And in my head I'm thinking, well, this game could be in the papers tomorrow because they're going to win the league. And I've hit the post, so I might get a mention. I've never been in local papers, never been in national papers. and I bought about 15 national papers and it was the old news of the world and there was a little report about that big, like I said, Bournemouth, coached to one Bournemouth two and then the next little paragraph was debut making 16-year-old Terry Grouse. Hit the inside of the post.

19:17Undr The Cosh Hosts:I'm like, fucking Terry Grouse. I'm trying to tell people that's me. So every time for like, for mates that are like, Terry Grouse. So all my mates are like, all right, Tezza, Grousey. That was about six months. I thought, thanks for that.

19:32Perry Groves:What was the crap with the car after your debut?

19:35Undr The Cosh Hosts:Oh, what? The Vauxhall Viva? Yeah, my old man said that if I got in the first team before I was 17, he'd buy me a car. And I thought it'd be like a Capri, you know what I mean? And he bought me this old shitty Vauxhall Viva for about 80 quid. And it was the old one. Remember the Opportunity Knox where you had the club on when it used to go up like that? So that was the speed on when it used to go like that. If you get to it, it's like 50. You're doing like 55, you know what I mean? Shuddering.

20:00Perry Groves:By the way, back then the Capri's like the bollocks.

20:02Undr The Cosh Hosts:Oh, full Capri gear. Oh, yeah, with a big long bonnet. That was like, girls, all right, ladies. I bought one in the end when I got my first pro contract. Fair play. He played with Tony Adcock. Yes. At the time, did you think all the scouts were coming to watch him? 100%. By the way, we were the ginger ninjas. He played up front and Tads was unreal. I was playing. And what happened was I got in the team really quickly. And then another manager called Cyril Lee took over. And he used to be Bobby Robson's number two when he was at Ipswich. And Cyril Lee was all about running. And I was a midfield player.

20:40Undr The Cosh Hosts:I was like, get it, give it. And he dropped me. He bombed me out of the team. And I didn't play for about a year. And lucky enough, I had a two-year... Because they saw me as a prospect. When I signed Pro 17, they gave me a two-year contract, obviously 17 to 19. But he bombed me out. I remember Sir Lee pulling me in his office and I hadn't played in the first team for a good three or four months. And he went, we're going to let you go. Right. So I'm like 18 and a half ish. Still got a bit of bollocks as well like that. So what do you mean let me go? He said, we decided you ain't going to get in the team, you can go.

21:14Undr The Cosh Hosts:So I said, well, I've still got nearly a year on my contract. If you can let me go, I want some money. And he sort of went like that. I'm like an 18 year old guy. Really? like that i said yeah i said i'm on uh i was on 100 quid a week a week on that 75 pound a week i was on so i said well you got give me about three three and a half grand and he went you cheeky fucking ginger whatever you thought we're gonna pay you to go i went well what do you mean you just go for nothing so he said well you're never gonna play in the first team whilst i'm here so i went all right see you later so i just went out and then in my head my attitude changed because I was, even though I was, you know, wanting to be as best I could be, I was a team player as a putter and in the end I thought, bollocks.

21:55Undr The Cosh Hosts:And he played me out of position on purpose so he put me from centre midfield onto the right wing because I was really quick to fuck me over basically. You know what I mean? I'll put you out there and like, and it's the best thing you ever did because I started playing for myself and I was really quick and then I got back in the team within about three or four months and started playing on the right wing. Then he said Tony Adcock was scoring bundles of goals up front and all the scouts were watching we used to play Friday nights at Laro which was fucking because you got the weekend off so fucking brilliant but there was always scouts there loads of scouts there because they got their mileage didn't they like pretending they were watching the game and they took their mistresses there on a Friday do you know what I mean that's what I was all their girlfriends so I'll take you out on a Friday we're going

22:37Perry Groves:Colchester again

22:40Undr The Cosh Hosts:but they all come to watch Tad's because he was scoring bundles of goals like he was getting 20, 25 goals for Christmas. And then I started playing really well. And then you get a bit of a reputation then goes, you know what I mean? So the two ginger, ginger ninjas up front.

22:56Perry Groves:But at that time you blasé to all the reputation and stuff, are you just happy that you're playing?

23:01Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, I'm... Playing well. Yeah, and then what happened was, then your confidence grows. Because I was, fuck it, he don't rate, money don't rate me anyway. So if he bollocks me, ain't going to make a difference to me, do you know what I mean? Start playing with more freedom. Yeah. And as well, again, it's a ruthless thing. I just thought I'll play for myself. And if I'm playing for myself, I got a bit greedy where I was like taking fullbacks on 1v1 and I was quick and whatever. And you put me back in. So then I started to score a few goals as well. So then your reputation then builds up, you know, from other clubs.

23:36Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah. So and then I was tapped up by Crystal Palace because I'd scored, I think I scored 10 goals one season. No, 12 goals one season. And then I was in the middle of scoring 15 goals the next. Where were Palace at that time? Second division. Yeah, so it was Steve Koppel was just taken over. So they were going to be like the team of the 80s, do you know what I mean? Where they had all the young players playing. And they had a coach called Alan Smith. Not big, no, it was Alan Smith. I played with like for Arsenal, but Alan Smith. I remember him phoned me up and saying, Perry, it's Alan Smith here.

24:10Undr The Cosh Hosts:And I pretended I knew it was, but I didn't jump. I'm like, all right, how is it going? He said, yeah, I'm at Crystal Palace. I went, oh, okay. And in my head I'm thinking, Palace, Palace, Palace, second division, not bad, like fourth to second. And he went, we've been watching you play. We know you're very raw and you're unbelievably quick. He said, but we're changing things here at Palace. We've got a good young set of players. He said, and we want desire and hunger, which you have. He said, but we're going to play you as a centre forward. and trust me, because of my dad, I can hit a cow's ass with a banjo.

24:44Undr The Cosh Hosts:Do you know what I mean? You know when people go, they're centre-forwards and they're right? I wasn't the centre-forward. No way. And he said, we need to play up front and we've just found this young black centre-forward playing in non-league football in South London called Ian Wright. Fuck knows what happened to him. Yeah, so again, they were going to play me up front with Wright. He just got him at Palace. And they said, we put in a bid, I think they put in a bid about 40 grand. And coach said no. But I wasn't allowed to know that I knew. Do you know what I mean? Because they tapped me up. You couldn't push for it.

25:16Undr The Cosh Hosts:No. And it's a weird thing as well. In my head, I just thought, I wonder if they're sending out scouts out and I wonder if they're watching me train. Do you know what I mean? So I didn't go, oh, I'm going to get a move. I'm the best player. I always trained to my maximum just in case anybody was, I thought in my head, in case anybody was watching, see what your attitude would like. Do you know what I mean?

25:40Perry Groves:And if you think back, being an Arsenal fan, was it just a pipe dream that eventually Arsenal are going to come in? No, it wasn't a pipe dream.

25:49Undr The Cosh Hosts:Confident? No, no, no, I didn't. I wanted to be, I knew, again, I did another interview when I said, I think I need a media agent. But because I got to, at that time I was 20, yeah, 20, 21, and I thought I'm too good for culture. I was too good for the fourth division. Do you know what I mean? You know when you think, I want to go and test myself. I want to go and step up a level. And I thought, this is my time now. So I put in loads of written, in the old days, you put in written transfer request, didn't you? And they go, fuck off, you ain't gone anywhere. And then, so because my uncle Vic, Groves was captain of Arsenal in the fifties, all my family are gooners, all the way.

26:31Undr The Cosh Hosts:I was going to ask that,

26:32Perry Groves:because obviously you were born West Ham bit, weren't you?

26:34Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, yeah, I escaped. I didn't have the West Ham misery. do you know what I mean? Yeah, so I was born, but because obviously my dad used to go and watch Vic Rose play and with my granddad and all that, so they were all like gooners, like proper gooners.

26:48Perry Groves:You think it was a wind-up when you got the call?

26:50Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah. Well, I had randomly, I had a financial, he's blessed, he's not with me anymore, a financial advisor called John Hazel. So he used to give me advice about my finances, charge me for it, even though I had no fucking money, do you know what I mean? But he was brilliant. He was like mortgage advisor, when you're 20, 21, you don't think about pensions. You're like, whatever. But so he got in contact with me on September the 4th, on a Tuesday, and he said, oh, Perry, culture just accepted a bid of 75 grand. And I thought he said, I'm going to Palace, because I've been tapped up by Palace. So I'm thinking happy days, I'm going to Palace.

27:28Undr The Cosh Hosts:And he went, Arsenal have just come in for you. I said, stop right there, John, you can fuck off. I said, that don't happen. Because he knew I was a goon. He knew that what it was. And I said, don't be doing that. You're not funny. it ain't funny I know we're going to Palace he went dickhead he said we're going to Arsenal on Thursday September the 6th so I didn't tell my dad because I still thought it might be a wind up do you know what I mean so I didn't know so I went up on the Thursday and he was going through on the train like what we're going to ask for ask for this and they kept to that still thinking it's a wind up yeah yeah yeah because I said whatever John don't be daft and then we got to Arsenal Tube Station and you get to Arsenal Tube Station on the Picardilly line and you turn left and you go up, right up Avonel Road.

28:10Undr The Cosh Hosts:And I then started thinking, oh, I know, because this is a meeting, clandestine meeting sort of thing. Crystal Palace, a South London team, we're meeting in North London. Do you know what I mean? We're meeting in North London, so no one knows what's going on, blah, blah, blah. It's like just in my head. And we walked up, and in the old days, they used to have this commissioner outside the old marble halls called Nobby, and he had all the regalia on, like, uniform. It looked like he was in the army, basically. so he said to John Hazel good morning Mr. Hazel welcome to Highbury George Graham we'll see you up in his office like that and I thought well he knows him because John had Ian Allinson as his agent and then Allinson was at Colchester he'd gone from Colchester up to Arsenal so I thought you know and he went good morning Mr.

28:49Undr The Cosh Hosts:Groves welcome I went fucking he knows my name that geezer knows my name how does he know and then it was just a blur it was just like oh my god like going in the marble halls Herbert Chapman bus going up the marble staircase and going to see like the gaffer. He made brilliant. He'd go through this big oak door. You can smell the history. Do you know what I mean? It's like, and do you remember Wizard of Oz where he sits in that massive chair, right? So George Graham's this, this fuck off massive chair like that. And he puts you on like a little stool about that big. Yeah, he's like Dennis Waterman.

29:22Undr The Cosh Hosts:Write the theme tune too, but he's sitting there like that. And in my head, I'm thinking, I can't wait to tell my dad. I can't wait to tell my dad where I am and what's happening here. I'm just looking around and he's talking about what he's going to do with the club. He's going to change the culture. He's going to bring players with heart and desire, get rid of a few players, you know, who are just going through the motions, blah, blah, blah. And I remember him saying to me again, it's again sliding doors moments. He said, I've been watching your career with great interest. He said, I first saw you play when you were 16 for Coach United Youth Team against QPR Youth Team in the old FA Youth Cup.

30:01Undr The Cosh Hosts:at Loftus Road. Do you remember it? It was just, you know, these four 5G pitches now. It was concrete with a bit of carpet. That was it. We're like the plastic pitches. Sand on it. Yeah, that was it. Yeah, and used to bounce and the bounce, they'd go over the stand. You know what? You go, right, we need to go to balls, no multi-balls. We only got a ball, go, it's gone in the fucking road. All right. So I remember him saying, and we lost that game 7-0 because QPR had about five England youth internationals and we had me and Andy Gooding and all the other lads were going to college. So we didn't have even full-time like apprentices.

30:32Undr The Cosh Hosts:So I said to him, we lost 7-0 that game. I said, I must have played well in midfield. We went, I have no idea you fucking played. So I'm like, what? He went, I have no idea. I went, well, you just said, remember, he said, from the first minute to the last minute, you didn't stop moaning at the referee, moaning at your own team, moaning at your coaches. He said your knees were bleeding, you were doing slide tackles. And what he said, what he said was, obviously ginger air help, but he said, your attitude was exactly the same at 0-0 as what it was at 7-0 when you were losing. So that stayed in his head.

31:03Undr The Cosh Hosts:And then obviously in the old days, I used to get all the old, like the Greenland was our local football paper. They got the pink and whatever. So I used to read all reports. And so that's when obviously I started playing well and he used to phone up all the local reporters to see what your attitude was like. So that was the detail he used to go into, yeah. It's mad that, isn't it? Yeah.

31:23Perry Groves:But he had what you needed, what he wanted at the time. Yeah, that desire. It's just stuck in his head. Yeah. Yeah, well, he said, I remember as well, I can remember him saying,

31:32Undr The Cosh Hosts:he said, I will make you better. He said, you're rough around the edges, do you know what I mean? Which I was like, he said, I can make you better technically. I can make you better tactically. But one thing I cannot do is put desire into someone. He said, I cannot put a heart in. He said, and that's what you've got. And I'm going to change the culture here. And so I was like, normally, George Graham had only been there since the summer. So this is September. So normally your first signing is a big marquee signing it. It was like centre-forward squad. And they were like, who the fuck is this ginger-haired fucking...

32:03Undr The Cosh Hosts:Terry Grouch. Terry Grouch from fucking Cultures United. What the... And so the Arsenal fans were like, really? But what he did, and he did exactly what he said, because they had some really, really top players, like Kenny Sansom, Charlie Nicholas, Graham Ricks, Viv Anderson at right back, Dave O 'Leary. But what he said he was going to do is he was going to ease those players out and get in hungry players. So he changed the cut. In the end, you end up signing Lee Dixon, Steve Bold, Brian Marwood, Alan Smith, Nigel Winterburn, Kevin Richardson, all from like, you know, I think Smitter was Leicester, Dick Owen, Boldy were from Stoke.

32:42Undr The Cosh Hosts:So that was the first signing where he was going to change the culture.

32:46Perry Groves:And all them lads coming in ticked that first box, I imagine. Yeah, heart. Hunger.

32:52Undr The Cosh Hosts:You have to like the hunger. And I remember sitting in and he said to me, I was on 150 quid a week at Colchester. And so then it gets to contract what he's going to offer me. So my dad always said to me, when you're going in for a contract, I had John Hazel with me as well, do not accept the first offer. It's like buying and selling a house. Do you know what I mean? The sellers want it as high as possible. The buyers come in as low. And in the end, you end up negotiating. So he said to me, I'll give you 350 quid a week. And I'm like, fuck me. I got my helicopter. like a brand new Capri because I know it down sound a lot but 150 to 350 is a bit back then was big like jump 150 % yeah and he goes I'll give you Carol Valdeman and he's on fire where'd he go about that was good you can be my agent later on we're not going to be at the end of this though

33:43Perry Groves:are we

33:43Undr The Cosh Hosts:yeah yeah so then he went we'll give you a three year contract I never ever had more than a two year one so I thought wow He said, we give five grand signed on fee and we'll give you£5 ,000 relocation fee. So I'm like, whoa. And then my dad's thing came in, like, do not accept the first offer. So in my head, I went through what I was going to say. What I'll tell you is, thank you, Mr. Graham, for your first offer. But I think I'm better than that. I want 450 quid a week. I want seven and a half grand signed on fee. And I want seven and a half grand relocation fee. So that's what I thought I was going to say.

34:17Undr The Cosh Hosts:What came out of my mouth was, thank you very much. Thank you very much. Thank you all inside. I was like, yeah, I was like that. Like hugging him, kissing him, like love bites everywhere.

34:26Perry Groves:The alphabet 300 will start with dad.

34:28Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, exactly. I actually got a light swim, exactly, yeah. But then I can remember thinking, like, oh, my God, I just signed for Arsenal. What the fuck? And John Aisle come down. So I ran. I said, I've got to go find my dad. So I ran down the marble staircase, ran out of the marble halls. And in the old days, the young kids wouldn't know. There was telephone boxes. You know, like the pay phone. So I had my 50p. So I phoned my dad and he was running a pub in Ipswich at the time, which I was living with him in the pub in Ipswich. And so I phoned him. I went, you all right, boy? I went, my name's fucking Perry.

35:03Undr The Cosh Hosts:I went, all right, boy, how's it going? So I went, yeah, yeah, it's how it goes. So he doesn't know anything about I'm going to Arsenal. So I went, dad, dad, I just signed for Arsenal. And he went, you ain't that fucking good. I went, oh, cheers, dad. Thanks a lot. And he went silent and he's not an emotional right man, really. And I could hear the emotion in his silence, if you know what I mean. I could hear that he was a bit choked up, whatever. So he went, oh boy, that's a good boy, isn't it? That's good. I went, yeah, dad. I went, dad, I've made it. He went, have you fucked? You're their worst player.

35:37Undr The Cosh Hosts:All right, cheers. But he was right. So I went from Colt's best player with Tony Adcock to Arsenal's worst player because then you have to, you know what it's like when you go to a club. He's giving you that fire again,

35:45Perry Groves:isn't he? who's saying, yeah, you're signed for Arsenal. Calm yourself down.

35:48Undr The Cosh Hosts:You've got to start again. Yeah, and I can remember turning up, training at London, Watford training at our training ground now because Arsenal brought all the land next to it. So that was on the Thursday. So on the Saturday, Arsenal playing against Spurs in the, obviously, North London derby. And he said, look, you normally train with reserves, but just come training tomorrow at London Coney. so I used to have to drive A12, M25 and I had this old MGB GT like the old like vintage sports car which was a bag of shit but I thought I looked the bollocks in it and I can remember it was flipping steam coming out the bonnet fucking so I came in the training ground at London Coney I was like the clamping sort of like that and I can remember Charlie Nicholas, Viv Anderson and Kenny Sansom standing there and all this smoke coming out of the fucking engine or whatever and I got out and I went morning like that and they went, all right, mate, yeah, the groundsman's office over there.

36:45Undr The Cosh Hosts:So they thought I was the new grounds boy. So I said, no, I've just signed for Arsenal. I'm just going around. And they went, oh, how are you doing? They didn't know I was. Didn't have a clue. Yeah, so then it's like, and you know what it's like when you go in training, you're on trial. First of all, you're in the dressing room. They're all looking at you, see how big your knob is first, and everyone looks around like that. And then the next thing is you're training, and they're thinking, the fucking hell is this? We'll see. so you have to even in training you have to prove yourself again

37:14Perry Groves:how do you think you did improving yourself that first few sessions did you fit in did you think I'm out of my day

37:21Undr The Cosh Hosts:I did have a bit of you probably gather when I was at coach I had a bit of arrogance bit of swag but I can remember going oh what a great boy I was telling everybody what a great boy he was oh brilliant well played Rocky David Roe Castle oh Charlie what a touch that was oh sorry about that that's my fault just saying please thank you to all of them just trying to get on their side basically yeah so it's looking back I don't think I really realised the magnitude of it like say fourth division to first division to Arsenal I think I was just so sort of taken away by the emotion of it and it's like didn't really have time to think and he said and he said to me you ain't going to play in the first team for about a year because he need because this thing is what I'm going to go on a bit of a rant here right this closing down now this Gengar pressing, you know, counter pressing.

38:12Undr The Cosh Hosts:They think this is all new. Liverpool and us were doing that back in the 80s. Ian Rush was the best fucking presser that you've ever seen. So George Graham had a real distinctive way of playing. It was the front two. It was always 4-4. So everybody played 4-4-2. So the two front players pressed. You show people inside. Then you got them inside. And then you went and pressed again. So it was all for tactically for me to take that on was quite a lot. Do you know what I mean? and the pace of the training was like up tenfold, like the way they passed the ball and how quick it was and they could see pictures, you know, what they was going to do in the next third pass.

38:49Undr The Cosh Hosts:So getting used to that was quite, but I was lucky because I was quick, then I fitted into how he wanted to close down, do you know what I mean? And because I'd run and close and be a nuisance. So I wasn't lazy at Colchester, but I wasn't bothered about tracking back four, you know what I mean? I'm too good to track four back, fuck off, I'm going that way. But you're at Arsenal. Yeah, Arsenal, you don't track back. You're done. Do you know what I mean? So, yeah, so I had to prove yourself again. I played my first game for Arsenal Reserves. I remember we beat Palace 5-2 and I scored twice. And what you do is you think, that just calms me down.

39:28Undr The Cosh Hosts:Do you know what I mean? It just shows people that you're good enough to be here sort of thing. So it just takes the pressure off a little bit. I remember sitting in the car and my dad sitting, like I was 21 at the time you know right boy like I'm thinking I'm buzzing I'm thinking fucking hell I've just scored twice in reserves first game and he gave me the how do you think you played like talk and I'm thinking oh fuck off dad he went how do you think you play boy so I went I did all right I said a couple of good crosses took me goal was right right all right he went give yourself a mark so I went seven he went what out of 20 and I think I'm 21 I don't need the fucking talk in the car.

40:07Undr The Cosh Hosts:Every kid goes through, doesn't it? Like, how do you think you played? Did you do that? Whatever. Yeah, so, and then lucky enough, like the Gafford said, I wouldn't be anywhere near the first team for about a season and Graham Ricks got injured and he pulled me in his office because I played well in the reserves, that, and then played. And after that game, normally, even then, it was a Tuesday, you'd have the Wednesday off and I got called in for extra training on the Wednesday and you automatically think you've done so. I think, fuck, what have I done you know what I mean what have I done wrong like normally when you get called in for extra training it's a punishment isn't it it's like what the fuck so I didn't Theo Foley came in and we had the youth team and we went through my position without the ball like how where he wants me to start where he wants me to press where he wants to get in slide across you know with the other four three midfield players protect your fullback went for about an hour and it didn't register in my head I just thought oh maybe I wasn't doing that right in the game and I got punished and then he kept me after training on the Thursday did the same thing and Graham Ricks got injured and George Graham the gaffer pulled me in he said oh Grovesy he said like what you're doing in reserves he said I know you're right winger have you ever played on left wing so I went yeah about a season and a half I've never played on left wing in my life you just lied didn't you because Graham Ricks got injured

41:25Perry Groves:he didn't fucking watch me that much did he no exactly yeah he didn't read your papers did you what are you doing did you know Graham Ricks is injured yeah

41:31Undr The Cosh Hosts:I think he'd done his his calf for his Achilles, but it didn't register with me because I just thought I'm a right winger. Do you know what I mean? I made my full debut against Nottingham Forest. I remember Kenny Sansom. So I'm shitting myself. I don't know about you guys, whatever, when you play. I don't believe players when they say they don't get nervous. I don't believe them. I don't believe that you don't get that feeling in your stomach, whether it's nerves or excitement. Do you know what I mean? Because if you don't, it means you don't care, doesn't it? It means you don't give a shit. So I remember feeling really nervous.

42:03Undr The Cosh Hosts:And then Kenny Sansom, as we walked out, he was a captain bounting his ball like that. And he went, oh, just like I say, boys, congratulations to Grovesy making his full team debut for the magnificent Arsenal Football Club. They just like round of applause. And he went, oh, he looked at me, he went, Grovesy, if in doubt, panic. And he just walked out. Cheers, Ken. But he was unreal. Words to the wise. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, so Ken was unreal. He was like, Gaff wanted us to track back or whatever. And he said, don't worry, stay up there. I'll be all right because Ken was that good. Do you know what I mean?

42:38Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, so I go from playing for Colchester at the beginning of that season and all of a sudden I'm playing for the Gooners, which is ridiculous.

42:45Perry Groves:AI is moving fast across the enterprise. But without visibility, it's just chaos. Different tools, different models, different teams using AI in completely different ways. ServiceNow turns that chaos into control. With the AI control tower, you see all your AI across the business in one place. What it's doing, what it's done, and what it's about to do. So you stay in control. To put AI to work for people, visit servicenow.com. We've had a lot of lads on from the Palace team, Ian Wright and Bright, and they said they were the main men, ran the dressing room. What was his right like when he came to Arsenal?

43:27Undr The Cosh Hosts:Right, he was, me and him had a bit of an altercation first time, first time he came, because he was obviously, him and Mark Bright were the two big stars at Crystal Palace. So Bright, he came, I think at the time it was about 2.5, 3 million, which was like a British record at the time. And what happens is, it doesn't matter, I was like an average player. and then you had the international players which were like obviously like to step up you had like obviously Paul Mersons Tony Adams as I mentioned Rocky Roecast or Alan Smith whatever but the thing that was brilliant about us we had no hierarchy there was no big time Charlies do you know what I mean there was no real stars who think yeah I can do what so everybody slaughtered everybody you know what I mean when you're like the team spirit everybody's caning each other or whatever so and even me me and Merce were probably the ones giving out the most taking the piss out of what people wore or anything I mean so when right he came obviously we knew who he was and he was like top striker but again going to arsenal it's a different level so we just said look what we're going to do is he's going to come here like easy and right um we'll give him the yellow bib every training session because then the old days yellow bib if he was the worst trainer you wore the yellow bib like the next day so we did it on a friday so that's the only day we used to do uh have a little five aside on a Friday.

44:49Undr The Cosh Hosts:It'd be North, East, South or Old, V, Young, whatever it was. After the game, you always voted for, and it was always whoever lost the yellow bib. Do you know what I mean? But I just said to all the lads, fuck that. It doesn't matter if he's on the winning team, right, he gets the yellow bib. He gets the fucking yellow bib. We did it for a month, every Friday for a month, getting the yellow bib. And I got the kit man, Tony Donnelly, Vic Akers was there. I said, Vic, do us a favour, have a look when we finished the five the side and when you when you see finished just come out we're all in the group and just shout out righty phone call for righty means you had a night minute phone call righty phone call uh and bring two yellow bibs out with you so he went oh all right yeah so he came out all the lads waiting so vic comes out righty and right is what the fuck what what the fuck would you want said phone call mate phone call you had to stink up get yourself in here's yellow bibs like that and he went fuck off the yellow you're not right fuck off the yellow bibs like threw them on the floor but like and he lost it completely and so we're all laughing and joking think fucking hell didn't think he was gonna react like that whoa what's that one here and in London Coney we had um like showers in two dressing rooms eight first team players in one dressing room eight in another and then at the end of the corridor you had five like proper baths where you can go and have a bath so back then I'd like obviously ginger barnet whatever so I remember getting in the bath there It was me, Dave O 'Leary, Tony Adams.

46:13Undr The Cosh Hosts:I think Quinny was in there. So just having a chat, having a laugh. So I go, wash my hair, go down under the water, you know, to get all the soap out or whatever and the shampoo out. Come back up. Right, he stood there in his full kit. So I'm like, all right, right? I mean, you, you ginger fucking twat. I've had enough of you. Fucking you haven't left me alone for fucking three weeks. Get yourself out now. Me and you, we're fucking having it off like that. So all the other lads being the, they go straight under the water. They're all like, fuck, here we go like that. So I'm like, shut up, right?

46:45Undr The Cosh Hosts:I said, don't be dafted. What's this going to be? What's going to be women in love? Like Olive Reed and Alan Bates, where they wrestle in front of the fire and all that bollock naked. I went, fuck off. I said, and if it's grapping, you better bring your fucking mates with you. Because you have to front it. You can't back down. Like, Bartman, he went, you fucking ginger, you little fucking ginger. And he like walked out. So all the lads then all come back up. They went, fuck, and that was a bit lively, grozy, wasn't it? Fucking like, so I'm like, oh, fuck's sake. Has he not got it? So I'm thinking, is he waiting for me?

47:14Undr The Cosh Hosts:He went waiting for me. So the next day, we used to go to South Arts Golf Club pre-match, playing at home, have your beans on toast and whatever, game snooker. So I always like to get there early. So there's one car in the car park and I pull up and it's right his car. So I got out of the car. He gets out of the car and we start, like what's Spaghetti Western? Walking towards each other. and I'm thinking, oh, fuck me, here it goes. My dad always said to me when I was a kid, again, he's like tough. He said, boy, if you look like it's going to be a fight, you get the fucking first one in. You don't wait.

47:49Undr The Cosh Hosts:So I've got my fence. You cocked? Yeah, yeah, I've got it ready to go. I'm like that, ready to go like that. I'm thinking, I've got to clump our fucking British record. And he come up to me like that, and as he got close to me, he put both his arms out, put his arms around me, give him massive fun, went, Grozy, Grozy, he saw about yesterday I lost my head a bit blah blah blah he went right and I just got out and I gave him a hug like that and I thought I said righty I said we're only mucking around do you know what I mean it's like and I know because what righty wasn't used to is getting that much stick and band probably off the Crystal Palace players because quite rightly they ruled the dressing room and I said we're all the same righty and me and him are real like big mates get on great and he got it and he's a big character you know he's a big character so he loved the fact that everybody like in him was slaughtering each other.

48:36Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, yeah. So I was... Do you think you'd have had him? Do you think you'd have had him? What? Yeah, yeah. He's not here, is he? No, he's not here. He's not here. Ian! Come on out, Ian! And yeah, your special guest. But yeah, so it was just...

48:55Perry Groves:Sorry, on the training, you know how you said, I can just remember that Arsenal team, like your Winterburn, Dixon... Bold, Adams, yeah, yeah. it always seemed like they were so well were training boring

49:09Undr The Cosh Hosts:if I'm being honest it probably was a bit like

49:12Perry Groves:Tony Pulis with us it was boring

49:14Undr The Cosh Hosts:but the thing is what happens is with Tony Pulis I know he's like famed for the long balls and getting in corners who'd have thought he allowed to score from free kicks these days and corners who'd have thought do you know what I mean but when you play 78 % of it is memory recall you just go into this mode where you know where you should be at certain times, especially for set pieces. And it was more on the functional play. We did loads of team shape. Do you know what I mean? Where, as you said about the back four, where they slide across, the full backs don't ever drop in behind the two centre halves because we were brilliant in the old days.

49:49Undr The Cosh Hosts:Offside was offside. It was just what it was. Do you know what I mean? But then you would protect. And the back four were unreal. We had John Lukic at first. And then, obviously, we had Viv. The old first back four was Viv Anderson, Dave O 'Leary, Tony Adams, Kenny Sansom. And that changed what you said there to Dicko, Rodders, Tony Adams, Boldy and Nigel. And they were a brilliant back four with Dave Seaman. But fuck me, they got protected. Do you know what I mean? And George Graham said that he felt that he sent her off especially and the back four in your careers. If the team is defending properly, you should all play over 500 games.

50:25Undr The Cosh Hosts:And he's right. They all did. But if you don't protect your four, like Dicko, me, Dicko on the right or was it Rocky Roadcastle? And as Limpard came on the left or me or Brian Marwood, if you didn't protect your fullbacks, you were done. And it is, but we knew what we were doing Monday, Tuesday, off Wednesday, Thursday. We knew every session that we were going to do week in, week out. But it made us into a team that was unbelievably difficult to play against.

50:54Perry Groves:You mentioned there that you got Wednesdays off and I'm sure you get a lot of people asking about the Tuesdays, the day's out, the night's out. Any stories in particular that? Can't remember.

51:04Undr The Cosh Hosts:Genuinely. No, but the Tuesday, this is a strange thing. And obviously it's been documented about my alcoholism and I'm in recovery now, whatever. The five founding members of the Tuesday Club were Paul Merson, Niall Quinn, Steve Bold, Tony Adams and myself. Three of us were in AA, so that went fucking well, didn't it? That was a good thing. If you're going to do it, do it properly. Do you know what I mean? but the Tuesday I was teetotal before I went to Arsenal I wasn't a drinker I wasn't because my dad said to me when I was a kid Ben boy if you want to be a footballer no drinking no women I listened to him on the drinking the women fingered I'm a footballer I've got to kick the arse out of this you know what I mean so when you're a footballer you like when you're single you go for it you're like here we go but then I got to then the Tuesday club and then Merce who's like best mate he was coming through the youth team and in the reserves and me and him started being good mates and then so we went out on the Tuesday but we only went out if we won we never went out if we drew or got beat ever because it's not fair the fans think you don't give a shit do you know what I mean so that's where you see our celebrations on the Saturday we're all kissing each other hugging each other because we know we're going to go out on the piss on the Tuesday yeah so so I was like when I when I joined Arsenal I was Cliff Richards when I left Arsenal I was Keith Richards do you know what I mean was fucking and then and then played like Wendy Richards.

52:30Undr The Cosh Hosts:And is it right you used to train at Highbury on a Tuesday? Yes, on a Tuesday. Yeah, again, in the old days, because we were banned from Europe for five years because of the Heysel night disaster, which weren't great because obviously we didn't play, no English teams played in the European competitions, but on the positive side was there was very rarely any midweek games. You might play a League Cup game on a midweek and then you had the Mercantile credit, they had a couple of cups that they invented, you know, to give you more games. So we knew if we won on the Saturday, then we knew we'd have Sunday off.

53:05Undr The Cosh Hosts:If you was injured, you went in for treatment. Monday at London Coney, doing all your team shape and whatever. Tuesday, running your bollocks off at Highbury, doing all the stands, you know, random pitches. And you'd be done by 12. And it was like, gloves are off, chaps. Here we go. All got our glad rags on, bit of Paco Rabanne. The thing is, the gaffer actually loved it. He encouraged it.

53:27Perry Groves:You know, just going back to what you were saying about Ian Wright and him having to go through that initiation of acceptance, but you were established at that point. Did you have to go through that similar acceptance?

53:40Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, the thing is there was, again, not that there was cliques, but they had a drinking school, which was Charlie Nicholas, Kenny Sansom, Graham Ricks, Rhys Wheelmott, the old, bless him, the old reserves. So they used to drink on a Sunday around Totteridge somewhere. But I wasn't, I hadn't had the rites of passage. I was still a young up-and-coming player. Yeah, so they were the established players. And then when they moved on, then we became this senior. Do you know what I mean? So I never went out with them drinking, apart from when we went away on club trips or whatever. But then that Tuesday club came in with the players that came in, I said before, you know, like with Alan Smiths and...

54:24Undr The Cosh Hosts:uh lee dixon's and but they we used to call them normans and like the norman normals the borings oh god in our heads we couldn't get why you'd come out for just four or five pints what's the fucking point you're like go on go and do the washing go and go and you missus do the ironing oh fuck off and you think no they've got it they're the ones that are good right what

54:42Perry Groves:was it that nigel we had nigel winterburn all right and he used to always say he was buying a washing machine or something didn't he he used to have to make an excuse it was always something to do we're buying a household appliance yeah yeah i'll come out for one and then i've got a

54:56Undr The Cosh Hosts:dishwash here or something the best actually the best one h dave seaman used to um you know he loves his fishing right but when he came to us so he used to tell his missus that he was going night fishing go and set up his rods and his little tent and he's like um alarms all that and then come and meet us and get bang on it and have a few beers and then he'd go fuck i bet Mrs is bringing me some something to eat so then you have to go back because he's bringing his sandwiches and whatever you go I've got to fucking go at half 11 12 o 'clock so he pretended so this H loves fishing at first it was a load of bollocks do you know what I mean it was just she was scared out of the bus

55:32Perry Groves:just imagine him pulling his waders over his shits and pants

55:36Undr The Cosh Hosts:all he needed is a picture and send it to your Mrs I don't know there weren't phones there it's a bit much being in these fishing rods just standing in the right you ain't got to make us believe I've just seen

55:47Perry Groves:J.R. Hartley he's rod and his neck in his box exactly

55:51Undr The Cosh Hosts:is it right

55:53Perry Groves:Tony somebody of you want to tell the story was partial

55:57Undr The Cosh Hosts:getting flung downstairs I think I was there that was at Rara's I think yeah where he got thrown down the stairs yeah it was at Rara he got thrown down the stairs because he's just been a pest basically do you know what I mean seems pretty drastic like yeah yeah he did all his smashed all his head and his eye but again when you look back it's madness insanity but because we was all drinking there was always someone who was going to be in a bit, we thought it was hilarious. There was always someone who was in a bit of trouble. Do you know what I mean? I can remember the time that we used to call him, what I meant, a bit of be like, because he always made stories up rather than Tony.

56:33Undr The Cosh Hosts:He was like a fucking, I loved him. And by the way, he should get a knighthood because the lives that he's sporting chance clinic has saved down in Hampshire of men and women with addictions, whatever, I think you should get your honours for what you do away from sport, not necessarily. So he should be Sir Tony Adams. Honestly, he's like unreal. But I can remember he, again, this is madness. You remember he got done for drink drive and he went into prison in 1991 season. It's madness, isn't it? Like Christmas, he went in to Chum's Nick. But he had been at a barbecue in May at the end of the season.

57:12Undr The Cosh Hosts:And I remember we were flying off to Singapore to play, I think it was against South Korea in an end-of-season friendly. So we were all meeting at Heathrow Airport and used to have this special area where, because it was a massive group, it was Arsenal, we didn't have to go through the normal customs or that sort of stuff. So we all got our passports with our blazers and ties on. And we were like, where the fuck is Rudders? We'll say, where is him? And we're all sitting down and standing in this little bit down in Heathrow Airport. and then all of a sudden we see Rodder's coming down the escalator on his own.

57:46Undr The Cosh Hosts:So he's got his club, but his tie's all over the place, his barn, it's everywhere. So he goes and starts talking to George Graham, Ken Fry, who's our club secretary, and Gary Lewin. And you see him going, oh my God. So then he comes over, wait, where the fuck are you? What's the matter with you? He went, lad, you're not going to believe this. He said, I've just gone through my windscreen in my car. We're like, that's fucking good for you, Rodgers. And he went like that and he shook his hair and all the glass came out of his hair. And we're like, what the fuck? And that's when he'd gone through the traffic lights, looked around and lost control and gone into the house.

58:24Undr The Cosh Hosts:And that's when he ended up going in prison in the December because the court case kept getting put off for reports on his character and, you know, and people sticking up for him. And it got to Christmas. And I think his court case, it was about December the 14th, 15th. And we had our Christmas due. We were all going out on that Tuesday. And I remember going to Highbury and there was only the ticket office. those two girls in the ticket office, Sue and Lynn. So I go up the marble stairs into the marble halls like that and Sue and Lynn are there, they're crying their eyes out. And I'm like, what's the matter?

59:06Undr The Cosh Hosts:What's you two? They're coming out with us. I said, you make excuses, come out. And he went, Tony's just been put in prison. And I'm like, fuck, don't be daft. Don't even put the Arsenal captain in prison. What are you fucking on about? And he went, no, he's just been put inside. He's just had his court case today. He's been been in prison for um for three months whatever i'm like really so i walked down the hallway and in highbury you go past the away team dressing room then the physios room then the home team dressing room so all the lads are sat in the home team dressing room with their heads down like that and i'm like it's a baldy sat there mercy we're ready to go out like i went is that right what lynn and suja said he's gone been put in prison they went i can't believe it yeah he's just been bloody put inside.

59:48Undr The Cosh Hosts:So I'm like, fucking hell. So we're all sat like that. And after about two minutes, Boldy says to me, Grovesy, I said, yeah, you're right, Boldy. He'd want us to go out, wouldn't he? He went, yeah, fucking. So we're thinking, we can't fucking not go out on our Christmas tree. So it's like, so then we go and we, we found out, we thought we'd found out that he was in, it was either Pentonville I think we thought he'd been put in Pentonville Prison like overnight before he was going to where he was going so we, Paul Davis said I know a bar along there so we went to a bar there and every hour we'd go out and because Pentonville Prison looks out onto the road with all the bars you know where all the cells are we'd go, we'd just shout out runners!

1:00:34Undr The Cosh Hosts:Cheers mate, think to you and then go back into the bar so he was definitely in our hearts and our minds do you know what I mean?

1:00:41Perry Groves:It's a classic It's just that somebody had to say something, didn't they? Yeah, everybody was thinking it.

1:00:46Undr The Cosh Hosts:The thing is, everybody was thinking it. You know what I mean? Thinking, well, we can't, we've fucking got to go out here. What's happening here? But that is, when you think, like, that's like Martin Odegaard going in prison on Monday

1:00:56Perry Groves:for like six, seven weeks.

1:00:59Undr The Cosh Hosts:You know what I mean? That was over that Christmas period. It was like, it was crazy. Absolutely crazy.

1:01:04Perry Groves:What were his dress sense like back then? Because he wears some questionable gear. In the dark.

1:01:08Undr The Cosh Hosts:He always got dressed in that fancy dress. Oh, so he was bad back in the day as well. Yeah, yeah, he weren't the best. But now he's gone, he lives down in the, I love Rodders. Honestly, he's such a top man. But he's gone like country gentrified and he's like three-piece suits and they could be green, red. Yeah, but when you think no one else is going to be dressed like that, do you know what I mean? But he is, he was a top man when he was going out, when he was in the madness. But he's a top man as a human being. He's like up there, he's just top, top boy.

1:01:36Perry Groves:Were you there with him when he wore tagging caprice?

1:01:39Undr The Cosh Hosts:Do you know what? that's when he had a Ford Capri. He used to come in and go, I'm shagging a priest. I know you've got a Ford Capri time. It's fucking completely different. When he told us that, we were just like, oh, fuck off, Tom. No, you're not. You've got a Ford Capri. We've all got one. 1.6 fuel injections. Fuck off, do one. Yeah, yeah. So, yeah, so he talked, but we just didn't believe him. We were like, yeah, whatever. Yeah, he just told stories all the time.

1:01:59Perry Groves:What was the crack in Portugal with the Marines?

1:02:02Undr The Cosh Hosts:Oh, that, flipping now, that was, that was crazy. That was really crazy. We went at Portugal and the gaff always you say to us we we went away we was going away before my bar was like fashionable we was going to my bar probably three or four times a year because he'd say to us if we're going on a good run and you win on the saturday boys if you win today we're away like we go on the sunday go to tuesday wednesday and basically go on the piss and then the last day you go on a run when you have to sweat it all off whatever and that yeah we went to portugal and we was in a nightclub and obviously we're the goonies, right?

1:02:38Undr The Cosh Hosts:And we think like Brad Pitt, do you know what I mean? I'm flipping going out. We can like get all the girls and that. And there was loads of girls there and there was some American Marines in there. We didn't know there was in there. So obviously they had these group of four or five girls that they were trying to like get on with. And then the girls were ruthless and went, oh, I'll still pray. They come straight over to us. So we like, they're girls basically. And we were like, all right, ladies, how's it going? right you know you're dancing whatever and then you could see there was a bit of tension but we weren't really aware of it and then we went outside and this bit he was massive he must have been about six four six five he went you bowed you think you are fucking coming in here think you're the dog's bollocks fucking you're gonna get it blah blah we're fucking gonna do you whatever and we're just reese wilmot the um the reserve team goalkeeper he was quite a bit mad bit tough he's a fuck off you do like that and we're like golly fuck off we got no chance here this is SAS who dares win and they fucking win by the way and then they we were walking up the street up the road and as they they were in a car and they tried to run us run us they actually aimed for us you know like Mr.

1:03:49Undr The Cosh Hosts:Mercedes went they come for us and we like dived in the side and Rocky they nearly got Rocky and then they turned their car around and then they come back for us again Jesus So Charlie Nicholas had this bottle of whiskey in his coat. He was like swinging like that. And he just went, as they come to us, he's got his bottle of whiskey and just threw it straight into the windscreen. Like the windscreen fucking smashes everywhere. And they go inside. And we're like, being the brave ones, we're like, we just run. We're fucking, we're out of there. And we just like went for breakfast the next morning.

1:04:18Undr The Cosh Hosts:And we're like, fucking what about that? That's mental. Like, I think it's funny. Do you know what I mean? It's a story. And we're sitting at breakfast. And all of a sudden, like a police car pulls up outside the hotel. and another van, police van, another van, another van. So it's like all sirens going. We're like, what have they done in here? It's no tell. Someone nicked something because we have no idea it's for us. And they'd obviously gone to the old bill because their car was all like completely smashed up. And one of them came in and he picked five of us out. It's him, him, him, him, him, him, him, him.

1:04:51Undr The Cosh Hosts:So the old bill were like, you're in the police vans. And we're like, oh, fucking hell, we're going to get slaughtered here. And then apparently the gaffer was playing. He loved his golf. That's why we're with Albert Führer. And apparently he was just on the 17th green, just about putt to win his match. And then it would come out like Desert Storm in the golf buggies. Four of them, five of them just been arrested fucking like that. And he's like, oh, really? So then we get taken to the police station. We put in individual cells. And thing is, we were shitting it because we're like, what's happening here?

1:05:24Undr The Cosh Hosts:And then they were mentioning that we heard them come in and say attempted murder. and obviously they'd like ramped it up because, you know, you're frying a bottle into a windscreen, whatever. And we just said, no, we're not. You know what I mean? Straight away you go, no, we're not. And then the guffer came, they had a chat, then it got us out. And I think we had to, it was quite funny actually, we had to pay in the end, it was about back then, which is a lot of money, it was about 1 ,300 quid because they obviously wanted their car like repaired and then they'd like say no charges. And we ain't got that money on us.

1:05:57Undr The Cosh Hosts:Do you know what I mean? We ain't got that money. And remember the film Quadrophenia, where Sting's in the thing when he gets his fine in the court, then he pulls his coat out and he's got a big wad of money. Charlie Nixon went, don't worry, I'll pay that. And he fucking had all the money in his coat and went, there you go, paid it. And then we had to pay him like when we got back. Interest. Yeah, to England. He said we had to pay 300 quid each. Again, which looks like a week's wages. But he still says to this day that Paul Davis still ain't paid him. So you can work out the interest on that. like you're looking Dr.

1:06:29Undr The Cosh Hosts:Ryan who worked that one out over like flipping 35 years now

1:06:32Perry Groves:at any point are you thinking I'm just going to say it with Charlie through the bottle it with Charlie no no no

1:06:38Undr The Cosh Hosts:because there's this old there's this strange like you don't I was taught you don't rat on your mates do you know what I mean if you're going to be in trouble you take it like all together but I can remember coming back coming back to the hotel and obviously I'm like fucking hell he's going to slaughter us like the gaffer's going to go mental here and he sat at his five stands and said, what do you think you're doing? You're a fucking disgrace. You've let Arsenal down. Let yourselves down. You don't do that when we go away. Blah, blah, blah. And he was right. And everybody walked out. And I was the last one walking out.

1:07:07Undr The Cosh Hosts:And he went, Grozy. And I turned around and he went, you're mixing with the wrong people. And they just walked out. Basie was saying to me, they're going to be fucking gone. If you want to stay here, you make sure you don't mix with them. Do you know what I mean? So I was like, all right, Gaffer. Yeah, I got it.

1:07:22Perry Groves:It's actually surprised me that George Graham were into the drinking. I would have thought he was trying to get it from it. For the team bonding side.

1:07:32Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, he loved it. He knew where we were. He knew. He had spies everywhere. Even if there's no mobile phones. He knew where we were on a Tuesday. He knew what clubs were in, what pubs we'd been in. But at any time, which on a Tuesday, we talk about the Normans, like the Alan Smiths and the Lee Dixons and the Nigel Winterburns used to go home after four or five. but there could be at any time on a Tuesday the second generation which was that team that I mentioned with Rocky Roadcastle Michael Thomas you know what I mean coming for youth teammates whatever they'd be 17, 18 in the same pub you know because then again there's no mob by phone you'd have to tell someone where you were at a certain time so we'd have to make sure in the pub and we'd all be having a laugh and then be like the Red Arrows everybody going to do their different stuff but yeah the team spirit it was unbelievable, really like proper bonding.

1:08:25Perry Groves:Yeah. You mentioned you and Merson were thick as thieves. Does that mean you two would leave each other alone when it came to the pranks?

1:08:32Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, we would, yeah, we wouldn't sort of prank each other. But it's a weird thing with me and me, like again, best mate. When I was in trouble, he was always there. When he was in trouble, I was always there. Do you know what I mean? We was always like doing the same sort of stuff.

1:08:48Perry Groves:Because I've just got to hear that Merson left a shit in your pillow.

1:08:50Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, that was a way... That's not a prank. Yeah, but the thing is, you look back and you just think... I actually caught him doing it. Do you know what I mean? I'm like, what are you fucking doing? What kind of method did he go for? 12. He had a 12... I was thinking I did the old cave. It was good to firm as well, to be fair. But again, that's when you drink... Again, when you drink it and you think it's going to be fucking hilarious, don't you? What I do is shit on your pillow. And you're like, what are you fucking doing? It's like ridiculous. Yeah, yeah.

1:09:21Perry Groves:quick break in play gentlemen that's usually my job but carry on have you heard about talk sport bet no i know talk sport well they are our new partners but as you said we've all heard of talk sport well talk sport bet are sponsoring the whole of this series unbelievable it's exciting it's and like you said you've just made me aware of it john but they're sponsoring the whole series and, it's another and, as under the cost listeners and viewers, they're providing an unbelievable offer. I'm talking bet£10, get£40 in free football bets. Not just that. They do super boosts, daily price boosts and best odds guaranteed on your horses, which is a very, very good special.

1:10:08Perry Groves:All you've got to do is head to talksportbet.com slash UTC and you get that unbelievable offer on sign up. 18 plus terms and conditions apply. I'm excited. I think we're going to do some magical things. Give us a fist pump then.

1:10:30Perry Groves:Going back to the football for a second. I mean, I think I was six at the time, 88, 89, final day of the season. So it bypassed me as a spectacle. but reading back through that day and what happened, could you just talk us through what it was like for you at Anfield? Do you know what?

1:10:49Undr The Cosh Hosts:It was really weird because, again, I talk about sliding doors moments in your careers and even for teams. That is one of the – it's an iconic game. Like, maybe 26, 1989, up at Anfield, we had to be beaten by two clear goals, won the first title for 18 years. They'd won the FA Cup. And we were romping it round about Christmas time. I think about 11 points clear. and they went on a 22-game unbeaten run. And the two games before that, we were playing at home and it was in our hands. So three games of the season, we should win the title. We get beat at home by Derby 2-1. So Dean Saunders always said, because he's a big Liverpool fan, he scored Derby's two goals.

1:11:24Undr The Cosh Hosts:And he was like, oh, I'm the player that won Liverpool the title. He thinks he's won it. We draw two against Wimbledon at home on the Tuesday. So out of those six points, we get one. So if we hadn't have won that game, we'd have been accused of being bottlers do you know what I mean because it's in your hands that like and you're feeling that pressure as well in the papers the fans yeah you know what not really I'll tell you why because no one ever went to Anfield and beat Liverpool by two goals it didn't happen our era even though there was no European football they had the best team in Europe they were like unreal but I think because we had to beat them by two that took the pressure off a bit do you know what I mean because we'd gone up there in middle of the season and we played them in the League Cup and we batted and we drew one all.

1:12:09Undr The Cosh Hosts:Rocky scored a well-dee top corner, but we could have beaten three or four. And that gave us the belief that we could beat them. And if there's one team that Liverpool didn't want to play, it would have been us. Do you know what I mean? Because we didn't, the old time at Anfield, it was like throw another ball. You never got the flippity. I mean, you always got beat three or four. So I think because it was 2-0, it took the pressure off a little bit. But George Graham, like he made, my dad is my hero and George Graham made my career as well. He was an unbelievable cut tactically best I've ever played under and I don't think anybody's better than him.

1:12:45Undr The Cosh Hosts:And I can remember him coming in on the Wednesday, Liverpool played West Ham on the Tuesday night and they beat West Ham 5-1. And Leroy Rochini, obviously Liam's dad, he scored the goal for West Ham and he tells everybody that he won us the title because if he doesn't score, we've got to win by three. so the gaffer I phoned most up again this old landlines I went fucking hell that's us coming second we're going to get slaughtered do you know what I mean because you've got no chance the gaffer sat us down at London Cone he put them on these benches we're all sat on these benches and he comes in he went lads great result last night fucking hell give us a massive chance we go up to Anfield everybody thinks we're going to get beat the pressure's on them they're going for the double I really fancy our chances we're going to play three centre halves like Dave O 'Leary Steve Bould Tony Adams Nigel on the left And first of all, we're all looking at each other.

1:13:36Undr The Cosh Hosts:And Merce is looking at Bolden. He says, is it on what I'm fucking on here or what? It's like, we're playing three centre-halves. Because going to win...

1:13:42Perry Groves:You see on what I'm on here.

1:13:43Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, exactly. So it's like, three centre-halves. Why are you playing next to centre-half when we've got to go and win by two clear goals? To us, we're like, that's a bit weird. That don't make sense. And he said, we played... Because, again, it was always 4-4-2. We'd hardly ever played, like, three centre-backs. So we're going to go there. He said, pressure will be on them. And he said, we'll close them down. He said, Nigel, you get tight on Ray Houghton. Dicko, you get tight on John Barnes. Not man for man, but you go tight with them. We'll be really nice and tight. He said, Merce, you play up front.

1:14:15Undr The Cosh Hosts:We'll try and play off you. And I remember him saying, he said, we've got to get in nil-nil at halftime. If we can nick a goal, great. He said, but worst ways out, it's got to be nil-nil. Because if they score, we ain't scoring free, which is true. So he did all this team talk. we went off running off with Theo Foley our coach and we all started doing chicken as if he'd gone like loopy I said your mate has he gone fucking mad and to be fair to the gaffer he was the only one who really really believed that we could beat him 2-0 do you know what I mean he was the only and his positivity you look at someone like that and you think wow yeah perhaps we can do you know what I mean it was him who was the leader and he told us and then played the game and you probably won't remember it but as a mark of respect, we all run out with bunches of flowers before the game, obviously for the Hillsborough disaster.

1:15:08Undr The Cosh Hosts:So we run out and we disperse and put the flowers into the crowd. And the Liverpool fans went from... And it done us a favour because it quelled it. You know what I mean? You're going into enemy territory. And for the first 15, 10, 15 minutes, it was respectful from the Liverpool fans who thought, oh, that's a brilliant gesture. First half, nil-nil, get in. And his team talk was the only time ever, I was there for six years, that I heard him praise every single player. And he said in the team talk on the Wednesday, he said to us, what we do, we'll keep it tight, nil-nil. Second half, they'll get a little bit nervous because they're going for the double, going for the title.

1:15:52Undr The Cosh Hosts:What'll happen is we'll be a bit more expansive. We'll nick a goal. He said, and they'll shit themselves. He said, then the nerves are coming. He said, and we've got Grozy and Aze. so then we'll go all out I'll put them two on and then we're going to go for it and I'm like really? so then Smudge scores off his nose like Nigel like if you watch it it's a free kick that we used to do all the time you know bending it in with your left foot from the right and Tony Adams is like a complete nuisance he just smashes everybody like that he falls over smashes everybody actually these days that would probably be just VAR would probably look at it and go nope you failed so he smashes everybody comes to Smudge he gets it off his nose and then there's a big Ferrara as he touched it so Liverpool fan players around the ref David Hutchinson the referee's name was so they surround him as if say he ain't touched it and then at Anfield you're thinking he's going to disallow this normally referees bottle it and he walks over to the linesman and they have a chat like that and the linesman sort of nods his head and he points to the centre spot goal so he the referee showed big bollocks actually and he did smudge headed it and then you could I could sell they had top top players like Steve mine playing centre midfield Anna Hanson obviously at centre half Peter Beardsley come on a sub that's how good like Liverpool were with John Barnes Ronnie Wendt you could tell that they they were getting tense even players that good they got a little bit nervous and then I had the Raven ump because he put Martin Ayes on before I'm like what the fuck are you putting him on for I should be going on I've got the ump do you know what I mean I'm thinking fucking better than him what are you doing putting him on So Aze goes on and then I go on.

1:17:30Undr The Cosh Hosts:And if you watch the goal, the Aguero goal, right, is a great goal for Man City. But they're playing against Kupar. Kupar, shit, they could have got relegated. Michael Thomas is well above that for the stature of the game and the time and the finish and what it meant to us as a club historically. and if you look at the goal, they have the ball in the right corner and John Barnes has got it. Now, he should be going into the corner flag to waste time. And he thinks he can score. So he does a swivel. Little chicken legs, Kevin Richardson, he's got his socks down, he's breathing out of his ass, his legs are gone.

1:18:12Undr The Cosh Hosts:So he nicks it off him and he gives it to John Lukic. You're thinking we've got 30 seconds to go. Luka, you've got to fucking boot it He throws it. Goalkeeper never threw it, did they? They never threw the fucking ball out in our ear. They didn't throw the ball out to fullbacks. And we're like, what the fuck are you doing? And Luke, he says, I was knackered. He said, even as a goalkeeper, the tension, he said, I had nothing in my legs. I knew I wasn't going to reach halfway line. Dicko's running away on the right wing because he don't fucking want it. He's like that. I don't want it. So then he throws it to Dicko.

1:18:43Undr The Cosh Hosts:But the move, we talk about functional play. You do fun play all the time, don't you? When he goes into the fullback, goes to the winger, puts it in the channel, goes into the centre forward. We did that move thousands and thousands of times in shadow play. So Dicko gets it. His first look is, can he go forward? Can he get it in the channel? So I make a run across Smudge. I take the whole fucking back four away. They were dangerous. Do you know what I mean? They all come with me. So I leave that massive gap. Come on. Fuck off, Hanson. Hanson comes with me like that. I'm like, come on then, let's go.

1:19:14Undr The Cosh Hosts:But then, so I make the run and now I'm watching. I'm watching it as he's running through. And as he's running through, Tomo is the world's most laid back fucking player ever. Trust me. He could sleep on a razor blade. We flew to Australia once. He slept for 24 hours. Didn't even get off. In the old days, you know, when the plane stops, you get off, you get back. He just stayed on the plane. He just fucking didn't move. And then he woke up and went, well, yeah, yeah. We go, yeah, Tomo. We're in Australia. We're outside the world. So he runs through. And if you watch him, he waits and waits. And I'm like, fucking, I've turned now.

1:19:47Undr The Cosh Hosts:I'm a fan. I'm going back to Guna. I'm on the pitch. I'm a fan. Watching him going, fuck, are you going to fucking shoot? And in a minute, you've got Ray Houghton coming in from behind him. You've got Alan Hansen coming one side, Steve Nichol, whatever. And if you watch him, he waits, waits, waits, waits, waits. And Bruce Grobbler stands and just goes to his right. And he flicks it like with his outside his right foot. And it's like, oh, my fucking good God. He's just scored. What the fuck? And then it's like everything. You lose your shit. I if I was better me to change I'd have run he does a silly like caterpillar sort of celebration he needs to boot Nigel in the face Nigel runs around the back of the goal I just go straight to the Arsenal fans over in the far corner and dive in there and it's like oh fuck we've got to kick off yet so then we kick off and then the referee we think come and blow referee and then the ball drops out of the air on the edge of the box and Tomo just brings it down and flicks it back to normally you just fucking boot it and then Lukey clears it Smudge gets it I try and do Steve Nichol gets it in the right back position so I slide in and I try and do him because even in my head in the old days you used to get a letter from the FA if you got booked didn't you three points or four points I think fucking hell if I do Steve Nichol I'm going to get a letter from the FA fucking from this game it's going to be worth fucking fortune I don't mind paying

1:21:04Perry Groves:the 15 pound five

1:21:05Undr The Cosh Hosts:exactly yeah and I'll sell it later on so I try and do him and I miss him and the referee blows the whistle and then it's like fucking hell and everybody just like runs everywhere but the reason that's the great I'm biased because I'm a gooner the reason it's great to finish is Tomo missed a sitter about 10 minutes before on the edge of the box and he should have scored and he missed so for him to put himself in that position you guys know what it's like that takes a lot of bollocks because if he'd missed it he'd be remembered of the Arsenal player that missed the chance to win the title you know what I mean like Gordon Smith Brighton's always remembered against Mani Knight and he's the centre forward that misses the chance that Brian could win like the FA Cup and Mercer's got a brilliant theory where Merce always says it fell to the best player because Tomo wasn't the best finisher in the club by a long way.

1:21:51He wasn't the best finisher, but if he'd have missed it,

1:21:54Undr The Cosh Hosts:he wouldn't have give a fuck. Because me and Merce, we'd have been fucking in AA straight from there. Do you know what I mean? Because he was so laid back, it had just gone, oh, I missed it, right, don't matter. But other, you know, normal people, normal brains, that had kept me awake for fucking four years. Do you know what I mean? So it fell to the right player at the right time. And then people say about the celebrations, like these days there's champagne everywhere. And I remember we got the trophy on the pitch. The Liverpool fans stayed at the Kop and they clapped us, which was unreal. Like I don't think they'd have clapped if they'd only win the title once in the next 30 years.

1:22:34Undr The Cosh Hosts:Do you know what I mean? So they showed us respect. So we go in the dressing room and again, there's no mobile phones. In the old days, there was just like a camcorder. So the club photographer was their camcorder. and there's some footage you see us and the Liverpool players to be fair to them showed they actually come in the dressing room and went congratulations lads well if it was me I wouldn't give a fuck do you know what I mean I'm fuck off but they had a load of champagne they gave us their champagne so we've got it in plastic cups and I've got one of the I'm sitting down with one of the Barclays trophies I think Boldy's got one and we're all walking around and there's no like and I think we're in a I think we're just in a daze thinking has that just happened?

1:23:16Undr The Cosh Hosts:Have we really just you know what I mean? Where you can't really compute what's gone on do you know what I mean? And it's like whoa and we're all walking around and I remember we was on the coach it took us a good four and a half five hours because all the Arsenal fans as we're going down the M6 all the Arsenal fans cars all around on the team boat like we've got beer on the coach whatever so we get a um on the old days there was the uh they were the cb radios in there at the front of the coach so we as we're driving off i'm thinking what we're going to do when we get so we got wind that there was a club called winners in southgate was going to stay open for us when we got back so as we get to southgate and we think there'll be about you know five six people there there's probably about a thousand people would heard that we were coming so we got off the team we're like the beatles oh got the team coach we're fucking right just seeing who's there all right yeah coming in yeah see you in a minute yeah so yeah so we it was actually the place was called winners randomly yeah so we was in there till probably half five six in the morning again the wives don't know where we are because there's no more my phones and they're thinking they ain't coming home do you not mean they're fucking they're just

1:24:27Perry Groves:out so yeah it was out then i bet it because he only flicked it didn't he i can remember the goal They only flicked it. Just flicked it over. From the edge of the box to it going in, it must have felt like days.

1:24:38Undr The Cosh Hosts:And it felt... And Ray Houghton actually says that he was going to bring him down, but he thought he'd remembered that he'd missed the chance before and he thought, oh, I'll bother this. So he could have brought him down for a penalty or outside the box, you know what I mean? And he thought, no, he won't. I say it fell to the... I just said about the gaffers, George Graham. I used to call him Paul Merson Rain Man because he remembered who we were playing, when we were playing, who they'd played, what the score was. and it was more like he's having a bet basically when he knew what was happening but George Graham had that brain as well like a Rain Man sort of computer game we'd played QPR earlier on in the season round about October November time and I'd come on a sub last 20-25 minutes we're 3-0 up Dave Seymour was actually in goal for QPR front of North Bank I run through we're 3-0 up I should square it Anders Smith taps it in but I think oh fuck it you know we're not 3-0 up I'll shoot fuck that I'll get myself a goal shoot Dave Seaman saves me it goes for a corner after the game we win 3-0 so the gaff says well played lads could have been better in possession and we always had a debrief on the Monday morning you know because it's too raw after the game so we all go in on the Monday morning all up in the physios Gary Lewin's room where we do the debrief George Graham comes in so he's got the training schedule which we knew we were doing anyway and he always had rolled his paper up so he's like banging saying right lads sit there He said, really good performance Saturday.

1:26:04Undr The Cosh Hosts:He said, going forward, great in the final third, like good quality balls in, kept the clean sheet. If we're going to win the title, we need to win a clean sheet. And he said, we're going to do this training. We do these set pieces. And he went, oh, and by the way, and he pointed at me and he said, you, he said, if this fucking goal's to go difference at the end of the season, you'll never play for this club again. Fucking ever, right? So this is November. So we're laughing, going, oh, gross. He's going, oh, gross. Fucking hell, right, gross. like that and so we win it we win it on goal scored actually people think it's gold different but it's gold scored I think we scored eight more goals than Liverpool right so coming getting off the team coach at the winners Southgate we've always wore club blazers way games always club blazers tyres whatever so we get off so everyone's going see you later yeah enjoy it we've got an open top bus parade on the Sunday I think it was see you Sunday boys we're done fucking brilliant get off Merce's before me so he's second from us so I'm last Merce gets off goes down the coach those steps like that he said well done Murs top manager see you right as I get off the gaffer always sits at the front the manager always sits front so he sat like that immaculate and he went Grovesy and I turned around and he went lucky weren't you I was like fuck he'd remembered it he'd fucking remember fucking from November so fuck Michael Thomas scoring the greatest gather he saved my fucking Arsenal career seriously I was like whoa I was like Medusa I was just like that what the fuck yeah so he'd remembered it from early on in the season unbelievable Isn't it?

1:27:30Perry Groves:And I suspect his blueprint for the game went to the T as well, didn't it?

1:27:35Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah. To say tactically, if you could, Arsene Wenger was an unbelievable manager on letting players express themselves, knowing good players and playing a different sort of football. If you could put them two together, you would have the perfect, do you know what I mean? The perfect manager because tactically George Graham was up there. And again, all these days, these algorithms, logarithms and all that sort of stuff they do. Football did have tactics back even when we played, even though it was probably a bit more basic. Do you know what I mean? But that's the top players. You have to take that information in.

1:28:11And if you don't, you're done.

1:28:14Undr The Cosh Hosts:Do you know what I mean? And you have to be able to handle the pressure because you're judged on a different level. Like remember Adam Smith came and he didn't score for his first three games. and in the paper it says Smith's a waste of money, not good enough for Arsenal, got to get another centre forward, Kerry Dixon they're going to sign. And Smudge is like, fucking hold on a minute. I just scored for three games. But if he doesn't score for three games for Leicester, Leicester fans care, but no one else does. Whereas he's, and then the fourth game, Charlie was playing up front with Smudge and Charlie wasn't, Charlie Nick was sort of unbelievably technically gifted, like ball into him, he could turn, vision, but he wasn't a closer, he didn't want to do the closing down.

1:28:52Undr The Cosh Hosts:so the guffer left him out and he played me and Smudge up front against Portsmouth at home on the Saturday and Smudge we won 6-0 and Smudge got at-trick so I saved his fucking career every time he becomes an all-time Arsenal great like Smudge should be up there with Omri and Bergkamp he scored the two times he won the title he won two golden boots both seasons 88-89-1991 I think he scored 23 goals in 88-89 I think it was 21 or 22, 1991, and one penalty. That's amazing, isn't it? Like to win two golden boots. So he, because his name's Alan Smith, and it's a bit boring name, isn't it? Alan Smith.

1:29:34Undr The Cosh Hosts:If it's Aliano Smithiano, it'd have been, you know, and by the way, if you Google Alan Smith, he's the second Alan Smith.

1:29:41Perry Groves:My new one.

1:29:42Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, yeah, he's first. I'm like, you're not even the fucking first Alan Smith. But he's, so much should be up there with, like obviously Henri and Bergkamp the great and righty Smudge should be in that yeah that exalted like position as well without a shadow of a doubt

1:29:57Perry Groves:we mentioned Winterburn and it was mad when we recorded with him because he's like that yeah he's not the tallest but I remember watching him just being hard as fuck yeah in a tackle and that

1:30:07Undr The Cosh Hosts:he was Nigel was one of the most I don't like saying underrated because he was rated by like us and but probably and Arsenal fans will but from the out you know the other fans Nigel's always never went below I was seven out of ten, ever. What about the ones you played against? Because there were some hard bastards. The hardest player, without a shadow of a doubt, was Stuart Pearce. Yeah, yeah. But Stuart wasn't, I'm going to break your legs hard, or verbally, like, I'm going to do this, do that. He was like the silent assassin where he didn't say anything, but you knew full well when the ball was coming through.

1:30:38Undr The Cosh Hosts:You'd feel it. It'd come through you, the ball, take you everywhere. And there was a game, quickly, a game at Highbury. and at that time Merce was playing me and Merce were playing on the wings so I was either left wing Merce was right wing or like vice versa and we're playing at home against Nottingham Forest on a Tuesday night and we hadn't scored for about five or six games so it was like quite a bit of pressure so we meet at London sorry South Arts Golf Club and when you go into the meeting and me and Merce sort of know we're going to play but we don't know what wings we're going to play on and you go into that and you're thinking please don't be fucking right wing for fuck's sake please don't be right wing I just don't want to be right wing.

1:31:18Undr The Cosh Hosts:So then you go for your meet and you have your pre-match, you have your toast and all that sort of stuff. And then the old days, it was like a flip chart, wasn't it? The flip chart. And you're looking at this and you're all sitting there like that and Murs is there, I'm here. And you're looking at the flip chart and thinking, no, don't be like fucking, please don't be right wing. Please don't be right wing. Gaffer flips the charts up. Paul Murson, right wing. Perry, left wing. I'm like, thank fuck for that. Murs looks over me like that. He's shaking his head. I'm like, oh, unlucky. So the gaffer says, Merce, you go up against Stuart Pearce on the left hand.

1:31:50Undr The Cosh Hosts:He said, just sit a bit deeper. If you remember, Pearce, he used to play one-twos with Nigel Clough about 50, 60 yards. And he like roll it into him and then fucking just run. You think, oh, I've got to run with him. So he said, you sit off him. He goes, Groves, you go against Brian Laws on the left-hand side. Take him 1v1. You'll quicken him. You know, you'll get past him. So then after 20 minutes, he said, what we'll do, you can swap over. You can swap over and then just keep saying how it goes. like that. So in my head I'm thinking I ain't fucking swapping over. You got no chance, right? So they go running out and in the old days not every player, this is weird, but not every player went out and warmed up before the game.

1:32:24Undr The Cosh Hosts:Some players did didn't they with the ball, some didn't sat there whatever. So Pearce used to come running up. He had his shorts fucking pulled up to there didn't he? Right up there. He was massive thighs, tattoos on his arms. No one had tattoos. Did they? Like shorts about that big and he used to run over to the Nottingham Forest fan. They go, psycho psycho and he's like and you're like oh fucking hell so mercy's on the right wing so he's getting booted everywhere I'm against Brian and I was like that and used to have that massive clock at Highbury at the clock end so mercy's watching it like countdown gets the 20 minutes and he's like grovesy grovesy swap over like fuck off I ain't coming over there he went you're fucking out of order bro you get yourself over there he went fuck off I ain't coming over there so we're rowing and then after about 35 minutes we get a corner ball comes in randomly I'm on the six yard box I'm marked hits me on the head goes in we go one new up so it's our first goal we scored again it's like a big goal because the first goal we scored for like about nine hours whatever right so then the corner comes and so Merce is taking the corner we always add right footer from left side left footer like it's like Arsenal do now like whipping it in so Merce is thinking I'm on the edge of the 18 yard box and he's thinking I can get on the fucking left wing here Groves is inside I can get out on the left I'll take the corner I'm just fucking running like that so as he runs up the left touchline I just run with him I'm like that there's me and him both on the fucking left touchline right he's going Groves get over there I said you fucking get over there I ain't going over there you should be over there he went it's out of order Groves I've been over he's boot me so George Graham's going with one of you fucking twats get over that fucking side there.

1:34:05Undr The Cosh Hosts:So we're having this row. So the whistle goes one new up half time. We go in and at Highbury, you had the old concrete steps going up the plaza tunnel and you turn to the left. So you've got the away team dressing room. You've got the physio's room and then you've got the home team dressing room. So I'm walking up the steps, going like that. So I go, Gary Lewin is our physio. I go, Gaz, calf muscles, a bit stiff here, like that. So I'm like that on the physio's bed. So Merce comes walking past the physio room like that. He comes walking past and he comes back in he went what's the fucking matter with you i said i've scored i'm not going back out i've done my fucking job so i was just sitting like that he went you're such a fucking twat so he had to go out and get booted everywhere by pierce did you come off yeah i'll come off at half time i'm like fuck that i ain't going back out there yeah but pierce used his thing as well is when he fouled you he'd come over to you and rub you on the top of the head like so he looks to the referee like he's saying sorry and he go sorry about that fellow but i'm We'll do it again in a minute.

1:35:06Undr The Cosh Hosts:All right, Piercy, cheers for that. Yeah, so he was, yeah, tough. Do you have any run-ins with Julian Dix? Julian Dix was different. He's got a story that he tells, which is a load of bollocks, and I've got a story of the same situation. So we're playing at Upton Park, and I'm playing on the left wing, and obviously Julian Dix is left back, and he was tough. He used to boot people. He was a good player as well, by the way. He could play, get forwards, score goals, whatever. So when, come running out at Upton Park, and as you come running out, he was stood with a ball like that, and you go run out to him up, he'd go, Oi, ginger bollocks, like he took me.

1:35:42Undr The Cosh Hosts:He said, you come near me, fucking near me, I'm going to break your left leg. You come near me again, I'll break your fucking right leg. Come near me again, I'll snap you in half. I went, fuck off, you little fat twat. I said, look, there's the studs. I said, that's all you'll be seeing, because I'll be fucking running away. You won't be able to get him. So anyway, you know it's coming, right? You know the first 30 seconds. So what he does, so I get the ball, comes to me, and I know it's coming, so I just flick it and ride the chat. He comes like steaming in, fucking fouls me. I'm on the floor.

1:36:08Undr The Cosh Hosts:But in those days, you didn't stay on the floor and roll around because you didn't want to let them know that they've hurt you. Even if your fucking ankle's hanging off, do you know what I mean? You'd be like fucking hell. And you might go like that later. So he like booted me. So that happened through the whole game. We watched the game on the Monday, the old video. So it was video to go through it. and he fouled me 18 times and didn't get booked until the 61st minute, right? So he's going through me, going through me. So Brian Hill was a member of the referee. He was the referee in the FA Cup final, Wimbledon against Liverpool, really good referee.

1:36:43Undr The Cosh Hosts:So as Julian Dixie's like booting me, I go, Brian, you fucking any danger? You're going to fucking get him booked. Get him off the pitch. Get him off the pitch. Fucking fat thug. Fucking don't do one. So he's like, oh, just play on Gloves. You play on like that. So he hasn't done anything. for an hour, hasn't booked him for an hour or whatever. So in the end, you think, I'm going to have to do it myself. Do you know what I mean? Because when you're a player, you know how to do somebody. So he gets the ball, he goes to play up the line and it's the old, where you leave your foot there. So he boots the bottom of your foot and then my left foot takes him at the ankle.

1:37:14Undr The Cosh Hosts:So I just like, completely come across, like two footed. So he's on the floor, you know, you have right, right, like square up to each other. So he comes running over and it's not the other cards, but he's just like, no, but it's like, you, do it Julian you're booking it's like you Groves I went what are you fucking booking me for so it's my first tattoo he went nah saw what he did booking him I said get him off the pitch the fat fuck he's fucking useless he's gonna ruin my career fucking break fucking get him off like that so he goes running away and Julian's got like the fucking psycho eyes and he's just like looking at you like that Norman Bates eyes so I go get him off the fucking pitch and Brian Hill the referee right he calls me over like that he went one Perry can you calm your language down please?

1:37:57Undr The Cosh Hosts:He said, and two, he said, I can't send Julian Dix off here. I said, what do you mean you can't send him off? He went, we were at Upton Park. He said, if I send him off, it's going to be a riot. Honestly, I'm like, what? He went, no, I can't send him off. So I went, what do you fucking do then? He keeps booting me, right? And this is the referee, Honest Gospel Truth. He took about 10 seconds and he went, I know. I said, what do you know? He went, why don't you and my name swap wings for 10 minutes? Seriously, like that. I went, what? He went, swap it, you go over. And he went, that's a great idea.

1:38:24Undr The Cosh Hosts:It's a referee. That's a right idea. He said, if you go over there, it'll calm it down for five minutes. Martin A's come over there. Everybody will settle down. I went, are you taking the piss, bro? And he went, no, it's a good idea, though, isn't it? So I went, hold on, leave him with me. So I walked over to the dugouts. So George Graham is like, well, we're tuning up at the time. George Graham, what the fuck do you want, Groves? I said, guffer. I said, just a bit of a request. I said, you won't mind awfully. It's just for five minutes that I went on to the left wing. Martin A's come on to the right wing because it'll calm all the crowd.

1:38:54Undr The Cosh Hosts:like that and he went are you taking the piss Graves or like so he looks past me so Brian Neal the referee's in the middle he went can I chop like that so the gaffer goes what the fuck so he goes I'll just come off so I've got the hook so I've got substituted so I've been substituted for being shit before substituted for being injured I've got substituted because the referee wanted to calm the crowd down right so I'm sitting on the fucking in the dugout you know when you sit like that I'm thinking has this just happened what the fuck we won like we're in 2-0 we're going to win the game So the West Ham fans decide that they're going to get the game called off.

1:39:29Undr The Cosh Hosts:So they invade the pitch. So they come on from the chicken run, right? They invade the pitch. So there's about, I don't know, three, four thousand West Ham fans on the pitch trying to get the game like counts called off. So, you know, just sitting there thinking, oh, fucking hell, it's going bad for worse. So I'm just watching it. So then the police came on. They was like on the horseback. So they come on to try and shepherd them back. So then there's the dog handers come on. They got those Alsatians fucking like wolves, like snarling. to send all the fans back. So they're pushing all the fans back.

1:39:56Undr The Cosh Hosts:So they get all the West Ham fans back behind the goal. And all of a sudden, this Alsatian breaks the leash of this copper and goes fucking steaming into the West Ham fans and just dives in. Honestly, like a rate. He's like, and you think, fucking hell, this will be carnage. So the West Ham fans part, and after about 30 seconds, you hear, and they throw the dog back onto the pitch. And one of the West Ham fans had bit the dog's ear off. Fucking bit his dog's ear off. The dog's gone by like that. and all the old people go fucking hell and they fucking go the other way it's fucking genius yeah so he bit the top of the dog's ear off and that's because Brian Hill couldn't be bothered to send fucking Julian Dipser it was his fingers wasn't it yeah it was that one yeah it was great a little switch yeah you'll be alright

1:40:39Perry Groves:I'm not getting told I had to fucking play by a referee

1:40:43Undr The Cosh Hosts:yeah wingers don't switch having a laugh yeah so yeah that one Julian's got his version of that story but that's exactly because he says that I asked to come off and it's like Fuck off, you don't do that. Do you know what I mean?

1:40:56Perry Groves:A quick break, gents, from one of our favourites. The creme de la creme of VPM services. Nord VPN. The best in the business. If you don't know what a VPM service is, allows you to vouch your location anywhere in the world. Anywhere in the world. And where have we been lately? Swindon. We didn't need it in Swindon, but we did need it in Dubai. I did need it in Swindon because I went on the hotel Wi-Fi. ah oh Scandinavia yes because that's another thing about no VPN security absolutely unbelievable and when you go in on those you know the yeah hotel Wi-Fi's just go with that everybody everybody can get involved yeah public Wi-Fi's that's your boy security no none of them hackers get into your bank details your passwords no no no I'll tell you what I'm watching at the minute er I'm going to say I'm going to er on my honeymoon soon I've started watching Dominican Republic who wants to be a millionaire.

1:41:56Perry Groves:Yeah. Because obviously there's going to be times where she's getting ready and that. I'm going to be watching the telly. You've seen all the millionaires over here. Yeah. So now you've got Aunt Domi. I'm on Dominican Republic ones at a minute. Well, that's the thing. You can bounce your location anywhere in the world. So even if you're in the UK and you want to watch Dominican Republic millionaire, you can get it on over here. Just bounce your location over to Dominican. I can watch anything I want, Chris, from around the world because I've got NordVPN. Sports series. Millionaire. Cut the tosh, lads.

1:42:29Perry Groves:What is the script? Do we have an offer? Of course we've got an offer because, as under the cost listeners, you've just got to follow the link in the description and you get a heavy, heavy discount and, get this, a 30-day money-back guarantee. So if you don't like it, get your money back. That's why they're the goats for me. you tell yourself no one wants your college era band tees but on depop people are searching for exactly what you've got you once paid a small fortune for them at merch stands now a teenager who calls them vintage will offer that same small fortune back sell them easily on depop just snap a few photos and we'll take care of the rest who knew your questionable music taste would be a

1:43:18What were it like leaving Arsenal to go to Southampton?

1:43:22Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah, I probably left too early. I dropped down because what happened was, even if I wasn't in the side, I was always on the bet. In the old days, it was only one or two subs. So I was always around the first. I say to people, I think I played 203 games. 120 were starts, 83, like coming off the bench. And people go, oh, you're just a sub, you're super sub. I said, do you mind? They're impactors now. We'll finish it. I definitely want to fucking finish it. I know that much. But what I say to people is, at that time, I had to be at the top of my game every week just to get in the 12 or in the 13, let alone obviously getting in the starting 11 because we were the best team in the country or one of the best teams.

1:44:07Undr The Cosh Hosts:And I'm trying to get international, I'm trying to get top in national. David Rodecastle on the right-hand side. Brian Mywood came. Anders Limpar came from Cremonese. It was unbelievable in that 1991. So I have to play at the top. I wasn't one of those players that I could have a bad half or a bad game or take it easy in training. I had to be the top every single time. But what happened then, I started dropping down to Peckin' Order where I wasn't even getting in the matchday squad. But I wanted to play. I wanted to play because you're coming into your peak times at 27. do you know what I mean where you've got the knowledge and the experience and your body can still do stuff so I just went to the gaffer and said I'm not getting in um you know I want to go and I'd asked to leave if he only as Matt for spite even the time I was asked to leave but I was just because he'd left me out do you know what I mean I used to go home and go you're fucking out of order gaffer leaving me out I just went he went yeah you're right but I'm the fucking manager fuck off go on get out so I went and saw him said I want to go and then they said that Southampton had come in, they accepted a bid of 750 grand.

1:45:09Undr The Cosh Hosts:So he pulled me in on a Friday before I was actually training. And he said, Groves, when they say they've accepted an offer, that means they don't want you anymore. And he did say to me, if it doesn't work out, come back. You know, you're always like, welcome here. We'll put you in the squad, whatever. So when you go, you know, it's like, fuck off. They don't want you anymore. And I went to Southampton and I didn't, again, I sat with Ian Bramford, who's our manager, and asked him how they played. He said, oh yeah, we play like then 4-4-2, but we want wingers getting forward. And I didn't realise he was a long ball merchant.

1:45:41Undr The Cosh Hosts:He just like smacks it in the corners, which is fair enough. It's the way you play.

1:45:45Perry Groves:Didn't play to your strength.

1:45:46Undr The Cosh Hosts:No, and I got injured. Like I always say to people, I snapped my Achilles tendon on my 15th game up at Erson Park, Middlesbrough's like ground. And I thought I nicked the ball with my head and headed it and went to turn. And I thought one of their players had boot me in the calf. So, you know, you just got like that. Jimmy Phillips, I think, was a left back. And I'm like that. I thought you just boot me in the calf. So I go off and Don Taylor was the physio. And he said, what's the matter, Groves? I went, fucking knobhead, just boot me in the calf. And Terry Urlock said to me, he's the three. Groves said, you can do the three.

1:46:16Undr The Cosh Hosts:He said, it was the three, the number three. I won't tell. So I'm off trying to get me, walking on down the touchline and my foot's a bit loose. So I'm trying to run up and down. And then they just go, Don Taylor, the physio, goes, you all right, go back on. I went, I'm struggling here. My calf, I can't feel. that was on the Tuesday so I'm on team coach coming back and they had a bed at the back you know if he was injured so I had a bed so I'm on the bed at the back with me foot up and Lou Chatterley who's the first team coach comes up the aisle of the coach and I'm sitting there and he went Grozy he said what's happened?

1:46:52Undr The Cosh Hosts:I said he's booting me in the flipping calf and again in the old days it was a video so they put the video of the game and they were looking at it and he went we've just had a look at it there's nowhere near yeah she hasn't booted you but he was saying was he didn't believe that i was it they thought i was frying a moody and they thought because it's anson park fucking pissing down the rain they they didn't know my character so they're thinking that i've thrown it in that i didn't fancy it so that was on the tuesday on the i have treatment like the old you know you have the ultrasound treatment didn't you know the old hot and cold and all that sort of stuff so that's on the thursday so don taylor the physio says to me grozy you're gonna be right for saturday i said i can't and what happens is they call it plant infection I couldn't even walk up the stairs so what you have to do is you have to put I put my right foot that way because I had no power I couldn't do anything and I couldn't go on the I put me on the bike and I was like doing it on the bike I'm doing one leg because I can't get me leg in so I had to go and see Ian Brown for our manager on the Friday and he said well Don says it's you know you've got a bit of a stiff calf you should be right tomorrow I went Gaffer I can't fucking walk let alone run so that was on the Tuesday where I got me injury.

1:47:59Undr The Cosh Hosts:Saturday, I don't play. See the doctor, club doctor, Dr. Lawrence on the Monday. So you go back to the Dell. The doctor comes in and he goes, what's the matter with you? I went, I've got booting in my calf. I said, calf's bit sore. I said, I can't really walk. So he laid me flat facing down on the physio bed with my two feet at the angle at the end. So he pinched me left Achilles and he went, yeah, that was right. And he pinched me right Achilles and his feet, so his fingers went straight through like my Achilles. He said, you've got a fucking big hole in your Achilles. He said, you've got a 90 % rupture there.

1:48:34Undr The Cosh Hosts:So that was on, so they didn't diagnose me. That was on the Tuesday in the game. They didn't diagnose me that I'd snap my Achilles until the Monday. Jeez.

1:48:42Perry Groves:Did Jimmy Phillips get one as well?

1:48:43Undr The Cosh Hosts:Hey. Did Jimmy Phillips get one? I never got a chance to book. I didn't play. That was it. I was done. I thought one of the other lads might have. Yeah, yeah. Terry, they got sent off. Terry, so I was in the bath. the green clump clump you know the old aluminium studs and I go what's the matter to her he went oh it's a fucking diabolical he used to call me blood nut he said blood nut diabolical fucking liberty he said I fucking got there as soon as I could I went alright so me and him were just sat in the bath and then I went and had the op and in the old days they'd put you in a boot sorry in a in plaster cast and what they do they put you in a plaster cast for two weeks then you come out and then they put another put your foot another angle put your plaster cast so I came out of the plaster cast after I think it was about six weeks went home with my missus at the time so my missus gets out the car with two boys Lewis and Drew they they run in the house so I've got my shirts that hang up back the car so I pick the shirts at the back of the car so instead of putting my crutches on I hop on my left leg so I hop going into the house as I hop my left foot catches the step and I put them all my weight goes on my right foot bang just there's this big like shotgun noise and I'm like, fuck, and I'm lying prone in the hallway and in my head I'm thinking, I wonder, I'm trying to be positive, thinking the adhesions have broken or something and my foot was just like that.

1:50:09Undr The Cosh Hosts:So my missus is like, should I call an ambulance? I was crying with pain, you know what I mean? You know when it's pain, real pain. And I was like, no, I'll be all right. And again, the madness of the drinking head. so my foot's like that so she said I've got an ambulance you've got to get your hospital I went no I'll be alright I'll be fine I said I think it's just taking all the adhesions around it I'll be alright so I on the crutches I went out on the piss on the Friday with my mates in Colchester so I wasn't going back to Southampton until the Monday go back on the Monday go and see Don Taylor Physio he goes like he goes you snapped it completely so I snapped it so what happened the kid is it snapped and it shoots up so that was it then I was dull I was in plaster again for another 10 weeks.

1:50:54Undr The Cosh Hosts:But what had happened was I'd lost a half a yard to a yard of pace. And I was running with a pebble in my shoe, basically, because I was like, couldn't sprint properly. So when you're a footballer at any level, you have to have something different. And my pace was different. I was a better player because I had to slow down a bit, but they weren't interested. They were like, and Alan Ball became manager. I remember trying to get back fit in the reserves. Dave Marrington was the reserve team. and he was brilliant with me actually, got back in reserves. And then they played me for the first team pre-season against Leighton Orient.

1:51:29Undr The Cosh Hosts:And they played me at fucking left back. And I'm like, what? And they did it to make me look out of my depth that I wasn't, because they wanted the money. Do you know what I mean? They wanted the insurance money for me packing it in. So football, you know, it's like football is brutal. It is ruthless. I remember sitting in the, and I was trying to get back fit, but no other club would take me because I couldn't get insured. And other clubs would only take me for a month at a time on a contract. I mean, because I didn't want to take the chance. And I've got two young kids, like Lewis was five, Drew was three.

1:52:06Undr The Cosh Hosts:So in the end, you think I've got a mortgage to pay. I've got, you know, young family. So I remember being called into the office with Laura McManamy and Alan Ball. And Alan Ball was a hero, obviously, for Well Cup. like my dad's favorite player, but he was self-havening manager. But they just went on business mode. Back then, no one give a fuck about the human being. You were just a commodity. You were just like, so they didn't know that I knew. So they had me insured. They bought me 750, they'd have me insured for 500 grand. So if I pack in playing for injury, they get 500 grand. So I'm just sitting there thinking, right, if I pack in, that's my career finished.

1:52:44Undr The Cosh Hosts:I'm 29, 30 at the time. so I can't play freshman football anymore and the right thing to do which I think is they get 250 I get 250 that's what I think is the fair thing I go and sit down Loretta Manning comes in and he goes Grovesy you're not the same you look pebbling shit I said well I've been out for fucking like 18 months only two years I'm not going to be the same and I knew that they wanted me to pack it in and he said yeah I'll be thinking about it said what we'll do is as a gesture of goodwill we'll give you 75 grand and I just looked at him Both went, you fucking butt. Both bunch of fucking CUN.

1:53:19Undr The Cosh Hosts:I said, you kidding me? 75 grand? That's what you're going to give me? That's my career finish. Go fuck yourself. Stick it up your ass. And I walked out. I remember going back to my missus and she go, what happened? I said, I told them to fuck off, stick it. 75. She's like, you can't do that. I said, 75 grand. They're going to get 500. I said, because if I, then I started playing the game of dare with them. So then it waited, waited, waited, waited. Don't take the first offer. Hey, don't take the first offer. Exactly, yeah. Unless you're signing for Arsenal. Yeah, yeah. I take it. Exactly, yeah.

1:53:49Undr The Cosh Hosts:But in the end, I got them up, I think it was 125, which again was quite a lot of money then, but they allowed me to get a house, which was paid for. But the only thing that they, I lost respect for them because I know football's brutal and I know you're a commodity and that's all about business. but then they didn't think of the like the human side of it like retiring at 29 30 yeah but worse ways out if they had 300 grand and i had 200 do you know what i mean yeah because they're they're still getting money um but the only thing that i always say sorry to southampton family i'm like because i was fucking useless for some waste of money but kerry dixon and day speedy were worse than me so that would make me feel a lot better speedo wanted to beat everybody up was fucking Angry little man, exactly, yeah.

1:54:41Undr The Cosh Hosts:But nicest man away from Pitlow, how are you? On the pitch, fucking Tasmanian devil. And Kerry Dixon used to bring a doctor's note in every Monday and say he's got a bad back and then fuck off back to Luton. I'm off. Yeah, so them two are worse than me.

1:54:54Perry Groves:And all a push for time. Did you say you had a Graham Roberts?

1:54:57Undr The Cosh Hosts:Yeah. So playing Chelsea, Graham Roberts, another hard man. So playing Chelsea at Stamford Bridge. And I'd been in the team for a while and I'd come back and I was playing again. for some reason the gaff was playing me up front and after about 10 minutes throwing comes in so I chest it head the ball like off and Robbo comes in probably about two minutes later and just goes smash and smashing me straight across the nose blood like Clara nose everywhere he's done he's done me and um so then your eyes are a little bit fuzzy for a while don't they you're like Fucking hell. And I knew it was him. So I'm thinking, right, I've got to do you.

1:55:38Undr The Cosh Hosts:Because that – I don't mind – you know when you play – if someone – you get hurt, but you know someone's generally going for the ball. Then you're right of it. But you know when someone's done you. Do you know what I mean? You know when they've done it and you just think, you fucking – you're getting this. You can actually Google it. Just Google Graham Roberts – Perry Grose tackle on Graham Roberts. It is horrendous. It's like a fucking assault. Honestly, Eric Cantor's got fuck all of me. Trust me. So Robbo's got the ball in the centre circle. and as he's got the ball, being the big brave winger that I was, so I come from behind him and I launch myself, left foot at his knee, right foot at his ankle and completely capitulate him.

1:56:14Undr The Cosh Hosts:He goes onto the floor and he's like, he doesn't move. You know when fucking no one moves, you just think, shit, he's in a bad way here and it's a proper bad two-footed tackle, lunge, whatever. So Ray Lewis was the referee and he was really, randomly he was from a place called Great Bookham, couldn't make it up, could you do you know what I mean so I knew him because he he was running a sportswear company so I sort of knew him he used to come to Colchester when I was playing there so he comes running over and Robbo and I'm not really worried about him I'm looking at Robbo thinking if he gets up I'm in for a fucking long 70 minutes do you know what I mean I'm thinking fuck me please don't get up please get up so I'm looking at Robbo he's just prone on the ground so the referee comes over and even then I'm thinking I could go off here even it was that bad a tackle and he comes over and went I went, Grozy, it's bang out of order.

1:57:03Undr The Cosh Hosts:You're late. You're coming for a while. I'm going to book you. And I went, right. He said, well, because I saw him. He elbowed you, didn't he, in the corner. He'd come across and like, I went, what do you mean fucking? You saw him. I said, why didn't you fucking book it? He went, don't take the piss. He said, I could be sending you off. So I went, all right. So I'm looking at Robbo. Robbo with the physio. There's only one physio. So Robbo's limping off. And he's going, you ginger, see you enter. I'm going to fucking do you. You fucking think you're doing. You fucking think you're right. You wait where...

1:57:30Undr The Cosh Hosts:So the game's going on. So Robbo is running up down the touchline and he's like limping, like, are you ginger? I'm fucking going to come on. Fucking do you. And I'm thinking, oh, please don't come on. Please don't come on. Just look at the ball. And in the end, it was that bay. He didn't come on. So I'm just looking at him thinking, fuck that. Was you all nil-nil? Game finishes. Shit. Like, Stamford Bridge used to be a shitter. Like, the pitch was shit when it was miles away from, like, the stands. You used to go and get the ball if it went behind the goal. So we're in the dressing room afterwards.

1:57:58Undr The Cosh Hosts:so the gaffer's doing his debrief saying good battle informants said Groves you did well and all of a sudden there's a knock on the door so the gaffer blanks it he's just going through and all of a sudden door opens and you don't come anywhere near that is sacrosanct the changing room, nobody comes in the changing room so the door opens and this geezer comes in and he goes I'm Commissioner William Hurst of the Metropolitan Police and so George Graham goes what the fuck are you doing in my dressing room? Like to the commission, our chief commissioner of petrol. So get out of the fuck. He went, no, it's very serious, sir.

1:58:36Undr The Cosh Hosts:He said, Mr. Groves, you'll stay there afterwards because we had death threats against you. So two of my officers will be outside the dressing room waiting for you. You will not be going on your own. So gaffer does it. You know what, lads? Like, fucking Groves is going to get fucking killed. They're snipers. So they fuck off to the bar because, you know what I mean, they leave me on my own. So I'm thinking, this is fucking ridiculous. It can't be that bad. I'm saying to the two old people, I went, lads, this is what he went. No, honestly, Mr. Groves, this is serious stuff. I went, don't be fucking daft.

1:59:05Undr The Cosh Hosts:No one gets killed at fucking football games. Do you know what I mean? No one's a sniper. Do you know what I mean? It's nothing like that. So then we walk out and the team coach is there. And there's about 3 ,000 Chelsea fans around the team coach. Like, you God, Ginger, I'm fucking going to do you. You fucking do that to Graham Roberts. so I'm like I thought I can't take the fuck off do you know what I mean because it could go proper so I'm just putting my head down go on the team coach up the stairs the team coach turn right go and sit in the back so I'm just sitting in the back minding my own business like that thinking this is mental I can't wait to tell people I've had a fucking police test but all of a sudden the coach starts swaying fucking side they're batting on the coach fucking bottles coming on the coach it starts swaying from side to side so and the driver's at the front so I'm like well at least I've got the driver with me do you know what I mean if we could fuck off and all of a sudden I hear and the doors open and the driver goes down and I went Oi Ben where you going and he went you can fuck off I'm a Spurs fan I ain't fucking getting healed for you so he fucks off off the coach and I'm just sat there like that the coach going sideways like that and me and Rob just I finished this story so Robbo is a hard like proper he was never the same again he didn't ruin his career but he struggled with injuries and it was because of that so I'm playing for Southampton Robbo's manager of Weymouth and we've never, this is four years later and we haven't come across each other at all.

2:00:28Undr The Cosh Hosts:I'm come out, one of the few games places at Hampton, I'm at the office, I'm walking down, he's walking towards me, me and him again, got me fish ready because me old man said get your fucking first one in because I think he's going to go for me here because of what I've done. As I walked past and we got close to him, he went, good one, wasn't it? So I went, yeah, it was all right to be fair it wasn't bad was it he said you fucking coward he said you did it from behind and we just had a chat i mean we're like proper mates with really good mates yeah yeah so but he knew he'd done so many people yeah do you know what i mean it's just it's just a lord of jungle isn't it like he'd elbow people and dumb people yeah exactly yeah so it started the ball in motion

2:01:09Perry Groves:comes around exactly yeah so lord of the jungle that's the title right I could sit here Two coppers is not enough By the way Yeah

2:01:19Undr The Cosh Hosts:The thing is

2:01:20Perry Groves:I wasn't important enough

2:01:21Undr The Cosh Hosts:If it was Merce He'd probably have About five or six Wouldn't he He'd have helicopters Coming around Drones everywhere Honestly Absolutely brilliant Thank you My pleasure Brilliant

2:01:36Thank you.