Were Lewis Hamilton and George Russell shafted in Zandvoort?

0:02This is a global production. Is it fair? Was it right? No, I'm going straight in. I couldn't believe what I was watching. I couldn't understand. Mercedes were making decisions for the team and Ferrari were making decisions for the drivers. I never heard Lewis Hamilton so angry. He never curses. Never. They're so scared of losing, they can't win.

0:31Up to speed.

0:36It's Will. It's Naomi. It's David. It's Jolie. Welcome to Up to Speed. Oh my God, I love that. I love it when you say that. You know what it means? It gives me a tingle because I feel connected. All of us are here. We've not all here. It's full house, baby. Yeah. That's going to say, first part in review of the second half of the season. And we're all here. And what a race. to come back with Lando Norris. Back-to-back wins. We're going to get to that. We're going to get to Max Verstappen crashing out at the end of the first lap. But first, gang, I think we should probably delve into the controversies.

1:16Because they were two, they both involved a driver switch or a lack of a driver switch. So should we start with the actual driver switch at Mercedes? And I guess the opening gambit and the opening question is, at this stage of the season, is it fair? Was it right? No, I'm going straight in. I couldn't believe what I was watching. I couldn't understand. I, for once, and I will say for once, really felt for George. You guys know how much I love Kimi. And I just, I didn't think it was right. You know, 11, 12 second gap, you know, however many laps remaining, I just didn't think that it was the right decision.

1:53And I, you know, props to George for coming out afterwards, obviously, on the radio at the time that it happened, you know, he was saying, is he fighting for the win? questioning it. He went ahead, he swapped. And afterwards, I thought George would come out and say, look, that really wasn't fair. But he didn't. And I was so shocked because I was still annoyed for him. Are you still angry this morning? I'd love one of you to disagree with me and try and make me see the other side because I'm still struggling. Well, I mean, look, I think the hindsight is always 20-20. And I think when you look at the picture later on maybe sometimes it looks a little bit different obviously in the moment you you always feel for a driver I think as a driver when you're in the car and you get asked to switch with your teammate it's literally the last thing that you ever want to hear however I think I do understand why they made that decision and I do think it was the right call the reason I say that is because of the fact that firstly you know when that last vac came out George and Lando opted to stay out they opted for track position rather than fresh tires and Kimi amongst others um decided to pit for for a fresh set of softs so Kimi was inevitably always gonna get to George but I think what they were mostly concerned about as Mercedes was if these two start battling each other for position is that going to drop them into the clutches of both of the Ferraris behind who are also on new softs so I do think it was the right thing to do and even though it's a tough pill to swallow in the moment.

3:24I think George will appreciate that that's what they did because I'm sure they discussed it in advance anyway. And if the tables get reversed somewhere down the line, they will do the same thing for him. Yeah. With you on that, Naomi, I think when you've got somebody on fresh tires, there's the opportunity to go and hunt for the win. You know, that's why they pulled him in. That's why they put him on that strategy was to give him the best chance of it when George and Lando didn't have the fresh tires. So it's, yeah, Yeah, I totally understand it. And I think from a positive perspective, what you have here are two drivers who listen to their team and who just take it first time.

4:02Yeah, OK, there's no arguments. There's a little bit of questioning from George, just so he could sort of rattle it through in his own head. But a team that is well drilled and that's how you win races. That's how you win championships. so um you know sometimes you get people to kind of reverse positions later on if the driver who's been let through hasn't been able to um to actually make that position up but given that george was under so much pressure at the end i don't think that was ever really a consideration and and kimmy was too far down the road so a tough pill for george but i totally understand it from a strategic perspective cc you're gonna come in and back me up here because i'm uh feeling alone well jolly i i hear you and i feel you um from a fan's point of view it it it's not cool it's not cool but what i have to say when i raced there was no official team orders and we used to do that under the table and it was horrible and there's been various examples of team orders that just didn't land with with the audience one particularly it stands out is austria Will Will Will Tell is the year when Schumacher was given the win by Rubens Barrichello, and the crowd were booing as he went on the podium.

5:13So an audience does not like to be kind of misled. What I think in this modern era, I'd say this, Mercedes, Toto, team principal, Bradley Lord, deputy team principal, the way they handle it and the way they discuss it and the openness of which they explain it, is just actually the way to do it. Because at a certain point, if you look at Ferrari, you had Lewis being held up by Charles and that affected the outcome of that race. Mercedes, they play the long game. They'll sort it out in the end. If George was, you know, okay, he held on and it could have turned out very differently, of course. He could have been fourth.

5:56But that wasn't the result. The result was he was still on the podium and they did the right thing for the team and the drivers and employees of the team. So they don't turn up and go, hey, I'll work for Mercedes this weekend. They are multi-million air paid drivers. And, you know, if it wasn't for the car being quick, they would be, you know, whoever, Fernando Alonso, who did an amazing job getting ninth. But you know what I mean? There's a two-time world champion who's been struggling to get in any one of the points. So on that, shall we talk Ferrari? Because you have an example of Mercedes doing something clinically, whether you agree with it or not, it was effective.

6:41And Ferrari effectively bumbling, certainly to Lewis's opinion, what should have been a simple request, what should have been a simple switch to allow them to get themselves onto the podium. They didn't put it into effect as effectively as they should have done. and Lewis, you know, thinking that it cost them a better result. Is this, you know, is this an example of a team that is operating with kind of with finesse and clarity versus one that isn't? Or is the scenario different? I tend to think that Ferrari across the weekend didn't execute very well. And I think that started from the very beginning when they decided not to put on the new floor for FP1, albeit they thought it was going to be wet and they didn't want to risk damaging it.

7:27And then I felt that they chased their tails from there throughout the weekend. They were kind of on the back foot because we did get the sense, particularly in the sprint race, that they had that race pace, but they just were never in the right position for it. And I think that automatically has a knock on effect to your weekend. But to your point about whether their decision making throughout the race was as well executed as it possibly could have been, I think no. And I don't know why Ferrari seem to, I don't know, I feel like there's this air of hesitation on their part to make decisions. And I don't know if it's like because everything that they do gets criticized so heavily in Italy that maybe they are a little bit paralyzed by their own, you know, I don't know, will to do things right for everyone.

8:17And they're so scared of losing. They can't win. Exactly. I feel like there's an air of that a little bit. But yes, obviously there was a tire offset as well between George and Lewis. And when Lewis had the fresher set of tires, he was stuck behind Charles. Sorry, did I just say George? Gosh, I've forgotten that those two aren't teammates anymore. He was stuck behind Charles, who was on less fresh tires. So they absolutely lost time there. I know Fred Vasseur was saying that the reason for that was that at that time they had planned to go long with Lewis and so they didn't want him anyway to wear out his ties but he wasn't aware of that because they didn't want the competition to know of that so I don't know it seems like the convenient thing to say at the end isn't it?

9:02Naomi you are absolutely right when we see a quote here from Hamilton he went well we saw during the race he shouted we're just losing time and then he said afterwards a great way of wasting time guys good job I'm here to win it's difficult when you look ahead and you see the two Mercedes drivers and they get the call and it's done and they execute straight away and it's not the same here. It's a little bit difficult. I think he's got some valid points. I never heard Lewis Hamilton so angry on the radio. I've never heard him raise his voice. He almost swore and he never ever swears on the radio ever.

9:38He never curses. He did still hold back as he was going for it. And we saw that video obviously of Charles shaking his head kind of at Lewis at the end as well. I mean, I wouldn't, I mean, part of me would have loved to have been a flaw on the wall, actually, I should say. Is this Ferrari's first real test of the Charles and Lewis relationship? Boom. You said it. Do you think? Didn't we see it in China already last year a little bit? But yeah, but this is kind of, it's further down the line now, you know. I think, well, if not a test of their relationship, a test of how the team handles it. because Charles is the golden child, right?

10:17Always has been. He's Ferrari through and through. You know, he's probably never going to race anywhere else. Like it's his place and he's been there since he was a kid. And then you've got Lewis, the GOAT, seven-time champion. And you can't please both, right? On an F1 team, one driver's going to be pissed, one driver's going to come out happy. That's just how it works out, especially in these kind of scenarios. and you kind of have to take your medicine sometimes and realize that you're going to piss one of them. You can't keep both of them happy in every single eventuality. Like it doesn't happen.

10:53And Lewis has experience of a team that executes immediately at Mercedes and he wants that world championship winning mentality at Ferrari because unless you have that, you're never going to win a title. So I can see the frustration in Lewis of being like, you know, guys, we're making ourselves look like dicks here. This is stupid. because he has experience of the other side of the coin. So I don't know. Is it a Ferrari problem? Is it a Charles Lewis problem? How quickly do they have to nip it in the bud? Do they have to just figure out what they're doing, actually get it written down, or understand that the level of execution that they have at the moment just simply isn't what the championship winning team has?

11:36What you just said to me highlights that yesterday at least, maybe even longer term than yesterday, but yesterday specifically, Mercedes were making decisions for the team and Ferrari were making decisions for the drivers. Yeah, Mercedes are thinking solely about what's best for the team and Ferrari are dithering on the pit bull because they're trying not to upset their driver. You know what? It's a little bit McLaren, isn't it? Oh, can't upset the drivers. What do we do? Because we've got to keep both happy, two number ones. And then indecision is still a decision. I agree with that. So you're coming out with these quotes, left, right and centre.

12:14He's awesome. He's practicing for end of season, drive to survive. Here's the thing. Talking about drivers, how awesome was Landon Norris? How brilliant was it to see the world champion, stealth-like, just go and say, hey, kids, remember me? Look, I think it's a great time to talk about the fact that this world championship is definitely not over. In this time last year, Max Verstappen was over 100 points behind at this point after the Dutch Grand Prix. And now, you know, Lando's less than 90. He knows. I mean, he said it on the radio himself. Afterwards, kind of backtracked a little bit and said, you know, we're not looking that far ahead, whatever.

12:57But I love that fight. I've missed that fight from Lando. I've missed that competitive nature. Do you know what I liked about Lando in Zandvoort was that he didn't back into the win. He had to go out and take it. He had to fight for it and he had to pass Beautiful passes, even one that he didn't need to make Because the strategy meant he was going to pit anyway Yeah, at one point he overtook himself Just to show how cool he is

13:25Clearly his summer break trips in Ibiza Have given him a new lease of life Do you know what? I thought that he might be a little bit tired after his holiday But he'd look like it didn't slow him down at all um yeah great great from McLaren I mean McLaren also they've been obviously making strides it obviously took them a couple of races at the beginning of the year they were on the back foot being a customer to get to understand their power unit properly and how that embeds within their chassis and making the package work for them but ultimately they've had two back-to-back victories yes the last two circuits kind of suit their car suit their package but Lando did a great job yesterday and even on those hards at the end I mean the lap times he was able to to get out of them right until the end was impressive so I've got to say well done to him and I think what is really exciting about this second half the season I mean Toto came out and admitted that the second half of the season is going to be much harder for Mercedes because they don't have the money to develop their championship contender at the pace of a McLaren and a Ferrari the teams that he used and I think look it's easy to come out with an excuse ahead of time is Toto going too early giving excuses who knows I mean Kimi is only 59 points ahead well he has extended his championship lead this weekend so that is a positive thing but yes they are waiting for themselves to put themselves back in this development race Toto says it's going to be a couple more races before any significant upgrades come to their car.

14:56And so therefore they're just going to have to survive it. But again, were those two races maybe an anomaly for McLaren, given that those two racetracks and their characteristics suit the car? I certainly hope not, because as Jolie said, this championship feels wide open. And I think that yesterday was actually a very good example of how good Formula One can be in 2026. And I hope we'll see more racing like we saw yesterday, because it felt like the old Formula One that we love. I think you make a really good point, Naomi, and it's really interesting to bring up Toto's comments about not being able to respond as quickly as Mercedes might like to because they don't have the money.

15:36But I think it's important to clarify what that means. Like, they've got money, right? It's not like Mercedes are suddenly turning into Minardi and they've got their cash. Poor Mercedes, they're cash-strapped. um it's getting our violence out yeah i know it's that under the budget budget cap they've already allocated for the year the points at which they're going to spend the money and how they're going to spend the money on on upgrades so whereas before you'd kind of you could be constantly developing now under the budget cap you have to kind of plan out in advance um where and when you're going to have your upgrades depending on which circuits are coming along next and it's all it's all theorized and it's all planned out and it's all plotted so mercedes kind of stuck to that planned route now um which is which is really really fascinating i think from that perspective um but i you know the fact that we've got a championship fight on i think is brilliant and um i was actually with zach brown over the weekend in in washington dc and we were talking about lando and zach was explaining how he's seen a change in lando not necessarily since the summer break um because i don't think he's really seen him much since the such since summer break because he was in america this weekend not zanvo but um since winning the championship and it's something that we've discussed on the show is how different lando feels this year there's this there's a bit of a freedom to him yeah less pressure less points to prove all of that and you could kind of see that over the last two races i think particularly in in zanvo as well there's just that that kind of that fun uh that kind of just exudes for him when he's out on track he's just he's a lighter released, freer it's great to see and that in turn makes a driver more potent so it's mega I think what we saw was exactly why I love Formula 1, we saw a driver at one with his car, at one with his team and I don't really like to do this with you all but I feel it's important for our up to speed listeners to be reminded i did predict that lander would win you did you did you did and you predicted that kimmy would be second so dc got two out of three he did he did he did well done dc we don't shy away from giving credit where credit is due i thank you it's a long time a long time since anyone said well done well done dc didn't uh lander equal your um record for wins as in you know you guys are Oh, God, I'm so pissed off.

18:10So pissed off. He's a world champion and got 13 wins. No, he was awesome. He deserves it. Talking about giving credit where credit is due, and I think obviously there was loads that we should give to Lando, but let's also talk about George for a second. No, none to you. I thought you were going to say me for predicting Fernando Alonso points. I was going to go for Alonso as well. Oh, yeah. Fernando Alonso got ninth place. How cool was that? He did. Yeah. If you would allow me to make my point, gorgeous George. Gorgeous George. Is he back? I mean, I think there's a little bit of credit due there as well.

18:49He had a great weekend. He was on top form. I mean, obviously at the end, he wasn't on the top step. He wasn't on the second step, but it feels a little bit like he's come back from the summer break in a different frame of mind. and actually even though it's only been one race and yes Kimi is going to take a penalty in Monza so that will work in George's favor as well I all of a sudden I'm starting to think is being the chaser in the second half of the season going to be the better position to be in because he could mount a lot of pressure on Kimi and Kimi was already saying he's going to start to change the way he goes racing avoiding any risk and thinking of the longer term so this is George's time to put pressure, isn't it?

19:30I'm going to start with a penalty. And Toto, after the race, was saying, yeah, we're taking a penalty in Monza. How frustrating is Formula One and the old regulations that were put in place to try and encourage manufacturers to be reliable, that we go to Monza with the world championship leader. He will have just turned 20 years old. And he's really stuffed basically at the back because he has to take an engine penalty. I think, boo-hoo, shame on Formula One regulations. We need to change that. We need to go into another phase. We'll take us out of this phase. Bring back qualifying engines that only existed for qualifying and you can blow them up at the end of it.

20:19Yeah, one engine per weekend for qualifying. and let's turn everything up. Oh, it's different times now, isn't it? Maybe it's just confidence. It doesn't matter where Kimi starts. He's still going to bloody win the thing. Maybe that's what it is from Mercedes. Listen, guys, in terms of the championship and does George have the advantage coming into the second half of the season, I'm going to look at this in a slightly different way. The fact that you've got, you know, George might be back on form for the second half of the season, but guess what? Lando's turned up and proved that he's still on form for the second half of the season.

20:50Ferrari have been a threat all the way through the year. And if they can get out of their own way, then there's no reason why Charles and Lewis can't win races in the second half of the season. If Max and Red Bull get it all together as well, there's no reason why they can't win races the second half of the season. What might be the best chance that Kimi has of winning this championship is not just his consistent brilliance that we've seen in the first half of the season, but that no one clear rival emerges in the second half of the season. And that multiple do. because then they take points off each other, which allows Kimi to maintain that advantage.

21:26And that could be a very, very real thing here. Okay, well, don't go anywhere because in just a minute, we're going to give Will the credit that he deserves for guessing that Aston Martin and Fernando Alonso would score a point in Zanford as they did. So we'll be talking about that in a moment. In the meantime, please head over to your social media platforms to follow us. It's at uptospedshow. let us know what you thought about the team orders when it came to the lack of that at Ferrari and the decision made by Mercedes and please make sure you head over to YouTube and hit that red button subscribe do you know how many 50 year olds sorry do you know how many 45 year olds you just aged him there, Jolie.

22:13Be careful. Didn't you just recently do a photo shoot with him? I did. And also, Fernando and I were born the same year, Jolie, so be careful what you're going to say. Let me start again. Do you know how many 45-year-olds in the last 50 years have scored points in Formula One? Just the one. Just the one rookie. Just the one rookie, Fernando Alonso. Not you, DC. No, no, no, no. I saved the whole world from any, any pain by retiring at 37. He is a phenomenon. He's phenomenal. And then when I saw you looking all young and hip, doing a photo shoot with him at the beginning of the year, he actually is age defying.

22:57Why does he, is it because his head is really big for his body that makes him look younger than he actually is? It's got a bubble head. Imagine his head with your jawline.

23:12You probably look like that thing behind you there. I love how unhinged this episode's getting. I love it. I love it. I've got to be honest, guys. I didn't think my prediction was going to come off when I saw qualifying. But the result is P18 to P9, right? Incredible. But I think the upside for Aston Martin, I don't think it's necessarily the result. I think it's how they got there. because the weekend started off pretty hard for them. Sprint wasn't easy. Qualifying wasn't easy. But it's how they kind of worked their way through it and made it through the weekend to a positive conclusion. I think that's probably the best thing they can take out of this weekend.

23:58Also, the fact that the upgrade package that they introduced before the summer break is a big improvement, that the engine has shown improvement as well with its upgrades. So, look, while they're not going to be up there fighting for podiums and wins straight off the bat, the most positive thing is while their qualifying position was pretty regular for them, the gap to the rest of the midfield was much improved. And then the way that they progressed through the weekend was very, very positive. So I think, you know, the green shoots of recovery may be there. You know why? Why? Because Adrian Yu water-killed at my wedding.

24:38wearing a kilt unleashes performance i can vouch for that i guess we're gonna have to organize a couple more weddings and a couple more kilts yes i don't know how soon they'll be scoring another point um yeah look fernando defied the odds as you said he i mean what can you say about him he's one of the greats that's why he's been holding a seat in Formula One for as long as he has. No doubt about that. I get the feeling from the team that maybe they were expecting a little bit more from the upgrade and that there's still some issues that they're dealing with in terms of drivability of the engine.

25:16But again, I think we can be really buoyed by the fact that they are moving in the right direction because the start of the season was just dismal for them. And things are looking on the up for the second half of the season. So good job, everybody at Aston Martin and Honda. I feel like another good job, we're giving out credit here, left, right and centre, but deserving of it is Lawson, you know, stepping in. I mean, before I dive into Lawson, I mean, Yuki being out since Abu Dhabi and then finishing just outside of the points. I really love Yuki. I was so pleased for him. But, you know, Lawson after, you know, being fired essentially after just two races, I feel like he made a real statement with his drive.

26:02And even throughout the media, through everything online, through the socials, he seemed, they just felt a lot less pressure. I mean, I know that, you know, he's not been fully hired back by Red Bull at all in that sense, but I just felt a karma Lawson. Yeah, a karma Lawson, but I don't think you can underestimate or undervalue the pressure that would have been on him, that he would have been putting on himself to step back into a team where he had turned up and tried everything, but summarily, as you said, been fired after two races. If he turned up there and qualified back at the grid and been pee nowhere all weekend, that's pretty much career done.

26:45This was an opportunity to have a right of response, right? Right, exactly. So to turn up, to drive the way that he did, to race the way that he did, qualify the way that he did, I was really happy for him. And actually his radio message after the race, it was very sweet. And there was a lot of honesty in that. And I think it was just this, for him as well, like just a weekend of catharsis to put all of that horrible experience behind him and move on. And always kind of show the world and show Red Bull. Like, look, you know, look at what you could have had kind of thing. Like it was nice. What I think was really good about it, and I think that Liam has, I think he performed brilliantly.

27:27I think what he did in qualifying was super impressive. Having the same power unit was probably a big help for that transition. But I think the maturity of the performance was the thing that really stood out and reminded us why he got the opportunity to be in Formula One. I think if we're being critical, we've got to say there's been moments where he hasn't quite delivered on the promise of what brought him. but what he did at the weekend reminded us that he is a quality driver who deserves his place there and then poor Yuki I mean Yuki gets to jump in for the weekend which is again a great opportunity but unfortunately there isn't just a lot of places to go at the moment in Formula One Isaac Hatch is going to be back well we assume it's going to be probably for Monza but let's wait and see how things evolve on that front if he is back in Monza then that puts Yuki back out of F1 and I think he did a great job as well to just put himself back in the minds of people and I thought that he did a great job to deliver because whilst what Liam did was great as well because we know that car is on a knife edge and that it's still a difficult car to drive, Yuki hasn't driven this iteration of Formula One cars on track in a competitive session you know ever.

28:39So that was a really great performance from him and I think that he'll be he'll be very happy with what he was able to do. Okay, well, don't go anywhere because in a moment we are going to talk about that hair-raising moment, the craziest moment of yesterday's Grand Prix.

28:57Well, crashes aplenty at the start, or spins aplenty at the start of the race. Max Verstappen, I think, obviously, the biggest headline coming out of the race weekend, so much expectation on him to have a great result in the last ever Dutch Grand Prix, but it was over at the end of lap one. And Guy is like, Max doesn't make many mistakes. I can't recall in his career that many times that he's gone out under his own steam. But there it was, you know, caught the inside line, still a little bit damp and it's game over before the race had even really begun. This will go down in history for many people as the only time they've ever seen Max Verstappen crash a car.

29:34Especially one at that magnitude. He's straight out, you know, straight onto the radio. I'm okay. All of the drivers coming around saying, is he all right? Is he all right? Is he all right? It was a big crash. Yeah, it was huge. I mean, the ones that I could think of are all wheel-to-wheel racing incidents. This was very different, obviously. I don't know how, by the way, can I just say this? We've avoided competitive sessions with wet weather this season. Somehow there's always the threat of it, and it never really happens. But we did start the race with sort of a drying track, mostly dry. But there were damp patches here and there.