The King and AI

25:35I think it's part of the world. You don't want to live without AI. It would be a big risk as well, you know. You just want to make sure that you balance things and you slow down in your house, actually. And where do you, it's always interesting to people, speaking to people who are investing in this stuff, so aware of a lot of the product rollouts and the new models and what they can do. And they probably have, you know, you may well have your own sort of logins or subscriptions with various AI services yourself. Has there been a latest development in your day-to-day use of this stuff that you all of a sudden have gone, blimey, I've just used that for this reason and that's worked a treat for me?

26:14Yeah. So I think the models that we use the most are actually perplexity and entropic on a day-to-day basic. and that's two companies we invested in that carry. If you look at the same, for example, Perplexity doesn't try to build the best model. It uses the best ones and focuses on the product people actually use. So nobody asks them to slow down. I think that's a good example of what we were talking about. And on the other side, Databricks that we use as a company as well, they doesn't build model. It helps basically most of the Fortune 500 run AI safely on their own data and they've raised a lot of money.

26:51So I guess from an investor point of view, it's, you know, I think a good bet. And from, I would say, a user point of view, you want to have them on your daily basis because it just basically helps you do everything. So you don't want to raise that from your day to day. Wendy, as ever, great to talk to you. Wendy Souvanara, who is the chief executive of that investment business, Carre Partners, the French business there, investing in various AI companies amongst others. Joe, Joe De Silva is with us this morning. in Ross at McGregor's Hospitality in Inverness. Joe, when you talk about using AI and AI being, you said earlier, obviously it's good for everybody.

27:34Do you find, whether it's on your own personal phone or within the business, that there has been a use in recent times again? And it feels like a question we ask every few weeks, but the advancements are that fast that all of a sudden it's now really helping you in a way you didn't think before. Yeah, definitely. Definitely. I mean, I never imagined when I came to the forefront, it seemed to be something that was, you know, something that we wouldn't really use. And then the more I have begun to understand what it can do, I mean, just simple things like collating reports or, you know, it sends me a report every Monday morning on, you know, hospitality trends and so on.

28:13so there are a number of pieces of information for us that we get access to that on a day-to-day basis would mean I didn't have time to get access to is brilliant. Do you act on it because I guess that's a key thing a lot of people might feel this is how I've been questioning my own use of AI that when Bill Gates talks about you know sort of addiction not so much as a companion but just like this idea of oh I must be being more productive because it's sending me lots of very interesting things, but am I actually putting it into action? When you get that trend report and it's AI giving you something great, do you find you're acting quicker?

28:52I think I probably use it as another voice to listen to. Does it make me act quicker? It probably does, actually. You know, there'll be trends that we see. For example, a prime example, the sales of gin are down, and there was a big boom for gin for a good few years back there. And we kind of saw this trend slowing down. And, you know, these things come in and it just reinforces. I would say I use it to reinforce questions I'm already asking. So it probably does increase the speed that I will make that decision rather than change the decision I would necessarily make. 85058, do keep your thoughts coming on all we are discussing.

29:38Plenty of oasis and music messages to get through as well. Jane Sydenham here with us from Rathbones this morning. Jane, the front page of the Financial Times, the main splash there, is about interest rates. And I will dig out that message that somebody sent on interest rates and petrol prices in a moment. But the headline is about American borrowing costs. Ten-year Treasury yield tops 5 % as inflation fears batter bond markets. What's changed again in the last day? because this has been a bit of a theme of recent weeks. It has. I mean, the yields on US bonds have been rising over the last few weeks particularly.

30:15So worries about inflation caused by rises in fuel costs because of the Iran war. You know, worries about food prices caused by sort of weather and other problems. Competition for capital. So you've got all these AI companies demanding huge amounts of money to invest. You've also got the US government needing to borrow money. So they're having to sort of put pressure on raising money. So there's a whole series of reasons that the yields are rising and some worries about the US and the way that it's managing the economy. So all of those things together have combined to push up yields for investors.

30:56Yeah, we had a message come in and say maybe it's a coincidence with the interest rates around the world going bonkers. They are thinking of pulling back from their investments, asks one. And another getting in touch about AI says, will rather doomily in Brighton. AI learns and behaves by scraping all the internet on any given topic. It, they, it says, he says, must be reading all these current concerns across media and making their plans already. Genie is out of the bottle. P.S. in other news, he says, why is my local fuel station saying 199.99 a litre for diesel? Do let us know what you are seeing.

31:33There have been big jolts, which we will discuss very shortly, in the cost of petrol and diesel again in recent days. Are you starting to see what we'll see in some real eye-watering numbers that really make you question why they are that level? Let us know. 8505. September's always busy. Whole Foods Market can help. Their September Stock Up event makes it easy to load your pantry and freezer with flavorful, nourishing food. Even better, there are hundreds of sales. Get dinner going with canned soups and veggies. Lean on frozen pizzas, pastas, and seafood everyone loves. Their Build Your Own Family Meals feeds four for just$35.

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32:50Wake Up To Money with Sean Farrington. Good morning. Wake Up To Money on BBC Five Live. of getting you ready for your day ahead. Save the unwinding until a bit later. We've got lots to get through. We're talking about advancements in the world of artificial intelligence. We've had loads of messages coming in about Oasis and the impact their resurgence is having on the music industry. Who's up for paying lots of money to go and see them? Who is thinking money might be better spent elsewhere? It's very interesting. Lots of people getting in touch, putting it into perspective, the amount of money that people might send.

33:31Hundreds of pounds to see Oasis, says Jim in Hertfordshire. That's for one night and one stage. Last week, some were moaning that Glastonbury tickets will be£408, forgetting that it's four to five days of 90-plus stages. You can't please everyone, I guess. And another getting in touch about how much of a boost for Glasgow this will be. Who's this getting in touch here? Mark in Glasgow. Thank you very much for your message, Mark. He says, the five opening nights of Oasis at Celtic Park is as much about economic regeneration for this part of Glasgow. For example, a local record shop has opened this year on Toll Cross Road, East End Records.

34:07I was talking to the owner yesterday about how we get him to trade during these gigs. In terms of Glasgow Celtic, football club's a big shift for them. They've got a lot to do. Upgrades to food vending areas in concourses. Serving alcohol is going to be tricky. Match day and gig going experience There are going to have to be possible upgrades to turnstiles as well. Community engagement will be critical. Where the stage is placed is critical and could impact in other upgrades as well. Mark, thank you so much for that message. 85058, your thoughts on all the various consequences of what might happen if Oasis comes to the town or city around the world where you are?

34:47What about the spending levels? Are you up for it as well? And even though our dear Wake Up To Money editor, Henry, said to us, no Oasis puns this time round, please. Fran the man's been in touch. Says Rice's Hotel in Points Pass in County Armagh serves Oasis soup. You get a roll with it. I like it, Fran. We'll allow that one. 85058. Only puns from listeners, I think. That keeps us safe here at Team Wake Up To Money. Let's talk about petrol prices. Fuel prices have hit their highest level since the Iran war began in March, hovering now around a four-year high. You will have probably noticed already.

35:25Certainly those getting in touch saying they've seen 199.99 for diesel have noticed that. All because of the war in Iran. Disputes have that control of the Strait of Hormuz, of course. So on average, these are the official figures. This is why you may well see numbers higher than this around the country as well as a bit lower. Petrol now averaging 170 pence a litre, diesel around 192 pence, according to the RAC. How do hauliers react to this as well? The businesses that rely on them to transport their goods around the country. Leslie O 'Brien is the Managing Director at Freightlink Europe, which is a logistics business based in Yorkshire, operates and owns a fleet of 33 vehicles.

36:04Leslie's also Regional Council of the Road Haulage Association. Morning, Leslie. Good morning. What's it feel like to you seeing the cost of diesel at the moment? Well, this is an ongoing story, isn't it? Of course, yes, it's reached an all-time high. And, you know, it's one of our highest costs. And, of course, it's not just us, is it? We have to pass it on to the consumer. If I look at the cost of diesel today, as compared to what it was at the beginning of the year, it's gone up 51p, that's 48%. 48%. And what that means to my bottom line is£33 ,000 per month. And of course, we just cannot absorb that.

36:45And it's not just that, that£33 ,000, if I include that, if I add that on that, that comes to£64 ,000. And what does that do to my cash flow? Because we're paying for our fuel on 7, 14 days, and you just cannot absorb that. And that's why so many transport companies are going to the wall. In the last two years, there were 1 ,000. In the first seven months of this year, there were 254, and you can understand why. Does it mean fewer lorries on our roads? Well, yes, it can mean fewer lorries on our roads. And if the UK supply chain is weakened, operators just cannot remain viable. And that impacts on increases costs of goods on your supermarket shelves.

37:33So it will increase the cost of the goods to get them onto those shelves. Are you starting to see issues with supply because of this? Well, we've always got a problem with a driver shortage and that's another problem for us. But supermarkets could start to see a shortage in supply if there are fewer operators. And the needs to be looking at how they can support the transport industry as other countries have done. So the government needs to recognise the urgency and they need to introduce some steps. What we're looking for is an essential user rebate. We certainly don't want the 5p duty freeze to be reduced, to be taken away, because 5p increase in duty would be another 6p at the pumps.

38:29If you look at what we're paying for our fuel, 44 % of that is VAT and duty. So of that 64 ,000 that I pay, including VAT, just over 28 ,000 of that goes to the government in VAT and duty. So, Leslie, what are the conversations? When you get this extra spike, you've talked about the general increases in costs that you've seen with these higher petrol and diesel prices, but given how regularly you'll be sort of setting prices and talking to your customers, can you give us almost an example of what you're having to say to a customer about how much more it's going to cost them now to get their goods from A to B?

39:13Well, for a long time now at Freightlink Europe, we've had a fuel surcharge escalator. So our customers are very much used to, on a Monday, we will tell them what the fuel surcharge will be. And when we negotiate our contracts, we put in what the base rate for fuel is. And as fuel goes up and down, our fuel surcharge will go up and down. But the great difficulty for us is, obviously, our other costs are going up as well. Our maintenance, our heating, obviously, we're still kind of suffering from the increase of national insurance and the minimum wage. And all these increases are becoming more and more difficult to pass on because customers are seeing the fuel surcharge as the increase, and it's not.

39:59And I really don't know another industry that invests so much, you know, the cost of vehicles for such a small margin. You know, it was said that, you know, currently, the net margin of a transport industry is less than 3%. And you can understand why so many are suffering. And we really do not value the transport industry, which is the, you know, the backbone of our country. And I was at a conference last week, where Rachel Taylor, MP, and head of the all party parliamentary group for transport and logistics said, when the transport industry succeeds, industry succeeds. And if it struggles, the impact is felt by everyone.

40:38And the government needs to take that on board and decide what they're going to do to help our industry. Leslie, do you see major changes, maybe you're making them yourself, in the stock that's making up your fleet? When we hear about whether the airline industry over many decades have looked to be getting way more efficient planes for what they're trying to achieve, households around the country have heard people get in touch about thinking about electric cars more as the petrol and diesel prices stay higher for longer, if they're able to afford to do that. What happens in the freight industry?

41:20Well, first of all, the infrastructure has to be there if we're going to move on to electric. But let's look at the cost of these and let's look that if, you know, the Road Haulage Association will say that the vast majority of its members are operating, I think it's 12 vehicles or less. And those are small family businesses and they just cannot afford to invest. The vast majority of them survive on buying secondhand vehicles. And in the kind of alternative fuels, those secondhand vehicles are not there and they cannot afford to buy new ones. We cannot afford to buy new electric vehicles. So what we're going to see is the small family businesses disappearing, you know, the SMEs disappearing.

42:08and then it will be just the biggest. And, of course, that in itself could form some kind of a cartel and costs go up. Leslie, thanks for your time this morning. Leslie O 'Brien there reflecting what many hauliers will be feeling around the country as the prices and the cost of fuel get ever higher at the moment. Leslie O 'Brien, Managing Director at Freightlink Europe. We've got Joe De Silva with us this morning, Company Director at McGregor's Hospitality, Pub and Events Vineyard in Inverness, Whiskey Bars in Obernon, And, Jo, as we discovered earlier, not just a passing interest in Dolly the Sheep, as you were trying to put into a bit of context when we might have been a bit frightened that the end of humanity was nigh in the past.

42:52Well, do you know, Jo, your in-depth knowledge of what happened back then and your interest in it has got Dr Bill Ritchie to message into the programme, who was the lead embryologist on the Dolly the Sheep project. And we've got Dr. Ritchie on the line now. Bill, good morning to you. Good morning. How are you? I'm well, thank you, Bill. I mean, thanks for listening. Thanks for getting in touch. Always great. Just fascinated to ask you what you think about all of this, given what Joe was trying to say earlier. We often get a little bit spooked by amazing advancements in technology. How do you view all this?

43:31Well, I think clothing is slightly different. And the media clearly thought that as we'd cloned a sheep, it'd be easy to clone every other animal that we could think of. But, you know, it's very different when you talk about cloning. You know, you would need to make the clone. You would need to use a surrogate. And that would take nine months until the child was born, then 15 or 20 years until it reached adult. So that's very different to the potential time frame with AI, which might be very much quicker than that. So that is one difference. Did you get people at the time, Bill, saying to you, friends, family, what on earth are you doing here?

44:24Could you be ending the human race at some point? Well, yes. I mean, that's the thing about the media, isn't it? But they're looking for, they initially start off with, you know, look how good this is for society and what could we do with this? And then a little bit later they start going, well, what are the downsides of this? Could this lead to something that was bad? And I don't think that any scientist goes out to do anything bad. But these are the kind of things that happen when you kind of break the mould. And Dolly certainly broke the mould. It changed science and now medicine is starting to move forward with some of the ideas behind Dolly the Sheep.

45:21Well, Bill, we were talking a bit earlier how Bill Gates, co-founder of Microsoft, has been sort of expressing some of his concerns now, changed his mind a little bit on some of AI, but he's also been emphasising how much of a benefit it could do for health around the world, for poverty around the world as well. And something that has repeatedly happened whenever we talk about artificial intelligence and when we've discussed some of the major advantages of it, we have people getting in touch saying how it is helping them. Martin in Ipswich has been in touch this morning saying, regarding artificial intelligence, I'm blind.

45:56I use AI every single day for researching, going through long documents, various government reports. The 52 pages looking at this report here or there. AI helped me summarise it, understand it, critique against, this was talking about the Reform UK proposals, critique it against historical welfare reforms, he says, and being able to look at all of this stuff. I also use it for creative writing. I write the story because I'm blind. I can't see various things in scenes. So AI may flash out a scene for me, all the colour, all the background, all the ambient stuff that I forget's really good, playing around with it all.

46:31Bill, do we sometimes forget amidst all of this that the advances for people who might not have been able to have this technology in the past, It can really change people's lives in a way that, you know, it might not be the automatic monetizing way, but for so many individuals, it can be such a boost to how they are able to go about their day-to-day life. I think that's very true. I mean, what we've maybe seen already is that some of these AI packages are now looking at things like breast cancer and they can find most of the positive breast cancer scans and things like that. So they can look for things in medical slides and things like that.

47:38So it certainly has some things already which are very positive for science. But having said that, I know that something I read recently, someone did a profile of my life and mixed up my Bill Ritchie with another Bill Ritchie. And my profile has two different Bill Ritchies in it. You've been clowned. Yes, and what they actually seem to do is, if it doesn't know the answer, it can make it up. Yeah, you've got to be careful of that. Joe, Boston McGregor's Hospitality, there you go. You've got us the lead embryologist on Dolly on the show. That's amazing, isn't it? That's amazing. Oh, my power, my power.

48:33I'm going to be across the infernest shortly, and I'll be looking you up. Oh, well, there we go. Oh, please do, Bill. Please do. There's a pint on the bar for you or whatever you fancy. It'd be lovely to see you. Dr. Bill Ritchie, lead embryologist on the Dolly the Sheep project. Thanks so much for getting in touch with us this morning, Joe. Thank you for the shout out of Dolly the Sheep. It just shows, Joe, it's a small old word out there. It's a small old word. So I did want to ask you at some point, Joe, what might Bill have lined up when he pays a visit to one of your gaffes at the moment?

49:10Where is the growth bit? You've got a few different venues. We do. We do. But the heart of everything is good Scottish food, music and drink. In a nutshell, that is it. So we're very much about people getting together. You know, the complete opposite of AI, but it's about people getting together and having a human connection and doing that with really good Scottish produce. Music's just at the heart of everything we do, whether it's youngsters or if you're ever up, you've got to come up, Sean. and visit us on a Sunday because that's when we have our big music session. We have music every day, but on Sundays we are inundated with musicians.

49:48So it can be everything from seven to 27 musicians all playing traditional music and traditional instruments. So it's quite a spectacle. And of course, amazing Scottish. We'll pitch it, Jo, to the Wake Up To Money powers that be. Could we squeeze in an away day in Inverness? How good would that be? Yeah, that would be pretty good. We'll see. We'll put it on the long list rather than meeting room on the fifth floor, which many people who work in offices these days might be more familiar with post-COVID the world's changed, doesn't it? But you could be going and having a boogie with Jo at one of her venues there.

50:22You could be off to one of these. Oasis announced another international stadium tour for 2027.

50:33So the band are going to play 32 stadium gigs across the UK, Europe, North America, they're going to return to Nebworth in Hertfordshire, in England, of course, the site of those legendary concerts from the 90s. What does Brian Cannon make of this? The designer of Oasis record covers from the 1990s all the way through to today, including for that debut album, Definitely Maybe, back in 1994. Brian, did you think you'd put your feet up and now, here you go, they're back? Here we go again. Yes, never ends, does it? Does it feel like that now? Does it feel like almost a career re-energised? Well, I mean, I didn't know it was going to happen last time.

51:16That took me by surprise, but I think this was pretty nailed on. I think they're obviously going to do it again. And is there a big machine around it now? When you were surprised last time, are people getting in touch with you? Are you getting in touch with other people going, right, the business of Oasis is back? we need to be on top of this? Well, it's changed compared to what it was back in the 90s, obviously. There was a lot more people involved, it seems now, a lot more branches. It was just, life was much more simple back then. I would have meetings with Noel Gallagher, we'd do the artwork, the record company would pay for it, and that would be the end of it.

51:53Whereas these days, there just seems to be more of a corporate machine involved. Everybody sticking their oar in. You did the programme, didn't you, for last year's tour. you designed that. So what, are you expecting to be involved in design for what's coming up next year? Well, I would hope so, but nothing's been said yet. But then again, the announcement was already made yesterday. And last time round, the announcement was made back end of August and Noel rang me in December. So who knows? I mean, there's plenty of going. He's very busy, I guess. Well, I'm very busy, but you're a very important man, Brian.

52:29I mean, does everybody close to you, do they know? that, you know, the Definitely Maybe cover was designed by yourself? Does everybody what, sorry? Does everybody know, you know, is this a key part of your life? I'm just bringing up, not that I needed to, I'm just bringing up the image of the Definitely Maybe cover in front of me. I mean, designing that, blimey. Well, yeah, I mean, the way this is obviously the project of my career, I mean, it'll never be topped no matter what happens. I'm not due to retire at all, but I'll never beat that, I guess. So it's kind of life-defining as well, really.

53:07It's always been there for the past 30-odd years, I suppose. And, yeah, it's been great, though, I mean. Life-changing. Life-changing. I mean, I know you say they only announced this yesterday, but are you still in touch with Noel O 'Lear more generally? Yeah, I mean, I knew about this since April, but sworn to secrecy, obviously. But, yeah, I knew it was coming. I mean, everybody, it was rumoured, but I did know. And yeah, I'm in touch with Noel still on a regular basis. What is it about this tour, when you look at it, that jumps out for you? Well, this time round, unlike the last time round, there's no sort of...

53:48Well, going into the last one, there's a few unknowns, wasn't there? You know, they hadn't been together for a while. Are they going to fall out? What's going to happen? Are they going to turn up? Noel was very stressed. I think that's public knowledge now. but it's a lot more relaxed now. Everybody uses to smash its success last time, won't it? So, you know, it's presumably the same again, really. Now it's party time. Time to cash in for everybody. Relaxing and enjoying it. I hope you get to, Brian. I suspect we might chat to you again before. It is all done and dusted. Brian Cannon there, designer for Oasis album covers.

54:21That is it from Wake Up To Money. Wake Up To Money from BBC Radio 5 Live. BBC Sounds. Music, radio, podcasts. In the early 90s, women's tennis was having a moment. This is a match that will live in the memory of all of us forever. Steffi had been so dominant, suddenly along came Monica Sellers. She hit the bar big, she hit two hands off both sides. And just when tennis fans were licking their lips at the prospect of a rivalry that would push the sport to new heights, One of the strangest and most shocking sporting crimes brought it to a grinding halt. Monica Seles has been stabbed by a spectator.

55:03This man stole her story from her. Sports' strangest crimes. Tennis' darkest hour. Listen on BBC Sounds.

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