20 Years, 1000 Episodes: The Man Behind PodQuiz

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1:17hey what is up people of the internet welcome back to a bonus episode of the waveform podcast we're your hosts i'm marquez i'm andrew and this week andrew i got to do an interview last week on the main channel and i hear you did an interview with someone who's kind of a celebrity at the studio. Yeah, like a studio favorite. Remember the podcast, it's called Pod Quiz that we all did on, I think I introduced everyone to it on the studio road trip. The Thousand Mile Road Trip. The Thousand Mile Road Trip and everyone got real into it. It got us going pretty good. It did. So James Carter, the host of that, just reached his 1000th episode of Pod Quiz, which is wild.

1:57And I decided to reach out to him to see if he'd like to do an interview. you and in that process waiting to hear back i looked back on how many episodes he's done and how long that's been and was just dumbfounded by he started this podcast in 2005 is this weekly every week weekly 2005 a thousand episodes because there's only 52 weeks in a year it's a long time we've been we're on i think this is episode 235 for waveform and think about how long it feels like we've been doing this. Wow. Half of my life. This is a lot. Yeah. So he's been doing it for almost 20 years. Um, podcasting started in 2004.

2:36So he was right there. So, so when he agreed to do it, I was very excited. Kind of like your first interview with Kobe, my first interview, the Kobe of, uh, trivia podcasts, James Carter. I was very excited for it. Um, he was super cool. We talked all about all sorts of things. Uh, so if you don't know about pod quiz, It is a trivia podcast. It is the trivia podcast in my eyes. But because he's been doing it for so long, we talked about the early stages of podcasting. We talked about how he stayed so consistent for 20 years because the podcast format is almost exactly the same since the first episode in 2005.

3:13Nailed it. Yeah. Right from the start. We planned on him never wanting to post anything on YouTube, which I thought was a really interesting answer. And most importantly, I asked him in this new age of podcasting if he considers Waveform a real podcast. No pressure or anything? No pressure. I was very worried about his answer for that. So it's very interesting. And one last thing before we jump in. This is my first totally solo interview. So please give me any feedback on what I could improve in. I plan on doing some more in the future. But James is a fantastic guest. Really excited for you all to hear about it.

3:49And hopefully you all start listening to PodQuiz soon because it's one of my favorite podcasts. And he's clearly one of the OGs. He is the OG, I feel like. Exciting. I'm excited for this one. Cool. Let's jump into it.

4:05James, welcome to the show. I'm a huge fan of PodQuiz, so I'm very, very excited for you to join us. Thank you for joining us. Hi, Andrew. Thanks. For those of you who aren't aware of PodQuiz or maybe know the show but not the man behind it, would you give us a quick introduction of you and PodQuiz? Yeah, sure. So yeah, I'm James. I'm a software engineer from York in the UK, and I've been running a weekly trivia quiz podcast for nearly 20 years now. That's incredible. So yeah, I reached out because I've been listening for years. And like you said almost 20 years you just hit your thousandth episode which feels so cool i remember like a hundred episodes ago being like wow a thousand coming up that's pretty cool but it's gonna be a while before that and then my wife and i were listening the other day and we're like oh that's like in a in like a month or two now it's it's getting it did creep up on me really um i mean like yeah waveform itself is at 230 and it feels like i've been doing this for for a very long time but a thousand just like how did it feel to finally hit that milestone i mean it it definitely felt like a a big thing um it had been obviously it's it's on a schedule so i knew it was coming um but yeah it was sort of like two or three weeks out it was suddenly oh yeah this is this is coming and it was it was just so great to have have all the listeners contacting me with messages of congratulations a lot of them have been listening for for nearly all of them or all of them um yeah lots of people who say you know they were listening to pod quiz before their children were born and they're now listening to them together you know all that all that sort of stuff it was i was just i was just asking around the studio trying to see if there's anyone who worked here that was younger than pod quiz and i think everyone's just a little bit older but um we were pretty close to a couple of them um have you felt like are there any other big milestones in this journey to a thousand that you specifically remember maybe like a hundred or episode 500 episode 500 um i remember we we made a bit of a big deal there yeah um we got um lots of of listeners to to ask questions um and even some of the sound effects uh oh yeah if you if you listen to the quiz there's a sort of bell sound effect between each round and that was for that 500th episode that was recorded by one of the children of a listener, Alex who just had a very cute six year old voice said ding ding and then yeah Alex's dad was in contact again for the thousandth episode to say that he'd remembered that so that was really nice Yeah.

7:02I really liked in this thousandth one, how you had like, you had people doing the covers for things. I know you've done stuff like that before. You do a phenomenal job with bringing in listeners to doing different things with like guests categories and rounds and stuff like that. So it's fun. And I'm sure for you seeing that all come down to episode a thousand is like the cool culmination of all of it. Yeah. Do you think we could go back a little bit though? because a thousand episodes means, like you said, 20 years ago this started. And pretty much around when podcasting itself had started, not too far off.

7:38Yeah, within a year or so, yeah. Yeah. So it was 2005, correct? When you started. That's right, yes. The first episode was, I think, the 25th of February. I was going to ask if you remember the exact date. So that's awesome. I'd love to know how you kind of thought of the idea of starting this. Obviously, I'm assuming you like trivia beforehand, but what made you think of putting it on the platform of podcasting? And especially back then when podcasting is a year, less than two years old. Yeah. Well, to be honest, I've never been a real trivia head. I've never been in a team, a consistent team over years.

8:21I've never taken it that seriously. But I did enjoy it. And it was listening to the Daily Source Code, Adam Curry's podcast, and like one of the first big podcasts, really. And he had a very occasional trivia segment in that. Okay. And I was just listening to that and thought, well, that's quite close to a pub quiz, which is a thing I enjoy. And would that be something I would want to listen to? yeah so that's that's how it started really and so you called that a pub quiz we in the u.s we don't really call them pubs but now that makes sense so is that what sparked the name for pod quiz versus pub quiz that's right yes yeah that's so that's like one of those things that seems pretty obvious when you hear it but but until you hear it it's a mind-opening experience that's that's cool have you mentioned that on the the pod itself or i'm not sure i ever have there's i don't explicitly remember doing that yeah probably something that's just like i think there's a slightly um different feel between maybe trivia in north america and a pub quiz in the uk in that but the impression i get is that it's taken very seriously and and you know everyone obeys the rules to the letter and and all of this whereas in the uk is much more relaxed um people are there to have a chat and a drink mainly and and the the quiz is a is a a little aside and a chance to win some some extra drinks yeah i i've participated in very few of them like you said i've done them they're fun but i don't seek myself out looking for them all the time but I do listen to Podquiz hundreds of episodes at this point.

10:13So I don't know. I've never found them too, too intense, but maybe I'm just doing the more low key ones and not the weekly, extremely competitive ones. Back when you started Podquiz and you said you were listening to some early podcasts, do you remember kind of, or can you explain to us, I'm sure a lot of our audience were not listening to stuff back then, but what was the podcast landscape kind of like and what had you interested in it that made you think you want wanted to push the platform with your own stuff it was it was a very sort of amateur affair um back in those days um there were no professional podcasts at all um and uh certainly no sort of corporations producing podcasts um so i suppose the reason i got into it is what i was i was a bit interested in the technology of it the delivery of audio via RSS.

11:11And that got me into it in the first place. And then I just, the early podcasts were mostly just couples and groups of friends just sitting around having a chat.

11:26And I just enjoyed the informal nature of it. People would build up a small audience, but it would be, they'd all be very involved. It was very much a community. It sounds not that much different, and Marquez would have been able to speak better on this, but the earlier days of YouTube, he said he started because there used to be... You used to all talk inside of the comments, and the way that they created videos just seemed like this very tight-knit group of people watching videos and watching other videos and then commenting on all of them. There is kind of a magic behind that small-knit community of stuff like that.

12:03I can totally see and I kind of wish I got to experience that back then because it sounds like a lot of fun. And I'm sure in these days, every company or person is trying to create that next niche magical moment that feels like it. Absolutely. But the thing is, success kind of ruins it to a degree. sure and i'd love to talk about that later and see what your thoughts on podcasting is in today in comparison to back there but um i'd like to like podquist to me feels i'm gonna hype this up a little bit here because i i truly love the show and i really like want you to know how much i appreciate it but i kind of describe it when i'm telling friends about it is like, it's almost magic in this way that it can take a long car trip or no one likes driving for more than an hour.

12:57And when I take a longer car trip like that, turning on PodQuiz feels like it can just melt away that time of what the boring sitting on a highway for hours on end, that I get so excited knowing that, hey, my wife and I are driving to X place. That is four PodQuiz's away. And by the time I get there, it was like, I kind of wish we got stuck in traffic and we could do one more because maybe we didn't do very well on the last one. And what I was most surprised about, and like you think a thousand episodes, you find your flow and you've created that perfect show and like time and everything. But I went back and listened to the first episode and it is almost exactly the same to the T in terms of timing of everything.

13:44It's 20 questions. It's four categories. It's music first round. Other than you sort of explaining the rules more so in episode one, because it's brand new, it's almost exactly the same. How did you come up with something that worked so well so long ago and have been so consistent over that long? Sorry, that's a lot of questions in one. I think there's quite a lot of dumb luck there always is but I think part of it was that it does very closely follow the format of the pub quiz or the pub quiz trivia down to normally it's four rounds and that sort of thing normally there's a break in the middle so that was a lot of it I think it has developed a little bit over the years um those those first episodes were quite a bit longer just because there were bigger gaps i was a bit slower but the basic format hasn't changed just because i've not felt it needed to really no i mean it's great is did you always know and maybe uh maybe it's different with pub quizzes in the uk but as is it always music rounds and stuff out there is that something you consciously decided like you thought was a really fun way to start an episode off that that is again it's a fairly normal okay um structure that even even down to it being the first round very often okay it's either a picture quiz which doesn't work so well as a podcast not quite or or music yeah okay interesting yeah the couple i've been to here in the u.s we don't have those and the the music uh category is my favorite of every episode um sometimes it can make me be a little bitter towards the rest of the episode if i do really poorly off the start i'll be like oh i feel like we've started this one bad already maybe i should just skip to the next but i'll always push through it um but i guess i love music and and you do a great job and i think it's a really fun way to start it each episode yeah i think i think um the issue with with music is is that it divides people by generation very often.

15:59So the feedback I'll get is, oh no, you did all music from the 2010s. I got nothing. I'll never be able to do that. And very occasionally I'll do classical music and obviously there's a lot of people that don't like that. But yes, it's just trying to get a balance over the course of many episodes, I think. For sure. But I think at the same time, some of the like some episodes I don't remember the specific episode but I remember trips in which we were playing and one of them was it was me my wife and my mom we were road tripping up to see my sister and I remember it specifically because it's the first time between the three of us that we'd gotten all 20 questions right and we were really proud of it and it like kind of made the rest of the trip but I think a reason of that is I it was probably like a connection or something where there were a lot of different eras of music and because of two generations working on it at the same time we figured it all out and when you get the first five right you're like okay we're rolling we can we can do the rest of it you've got your sights set on that 20 exactly yeah do you get a lot of people reaching out to you being like i hit 20 this time or is that a big accomplishment yes yes i do um and equally i get i get people saying i've been doing podquiz for 10 years and I've never managed to get 20 out of 20.

17:20That's awesome. I do encourage people to sort of feedback the scores. And so you'll see a small community of people on the website who post their scores each week, which I find really useful just as a feedback mechanism. So, yeah. 20 out of 20 is an achievement, though. It's not something that people get every week, certainly. That's awesome. And I noticed that looking back at previous episodes, you have episodes that are probably from pre-2010. And there are people from 2020 plus still commenting on some of those, putting down answers and stuff like that. And I thought that was really, really cool.

18:01I mean, I love your website. It's very like Web 1.0 and just so easy to go back and see everything. Yes, my front-end web development skills are 20th century vintage, and that definitely shows. I love it. But yes, I'm amazed the number of people who will get in contact and say, I discovered Podquiz a couple of months ago, and now I've listened to them all, just listening to a dozen a day, which I couldn't put up with my own voice for that long at all. so I don't know how they do it. That brings up an interesting question is when you first started this and you were editing, and like I've done it too, when we started Waveform, I kind of pitched it to Marques and I had to be the one, I was editing everything.

18:51He's used to his voice. I am not used to my voice. And that is a strange thing to hear for the first time. And not just the first time, maybe the first a hundred times. Absolutely, yeah. So doing that often - I think everyone hates their own voice, don't they? Yeah, because it's so different and you're just like, oh, is that how I talk? And did you get to, do you think you got to a certain episode where you're like, okay, I've listened to myself enough, now I'm used to it? I think so. I don't think it took all that long, really. But yeah, I'm also told by my partner that I have a pod quiz voice.

19:25It's a fantastic voice. That's different from my normal speaking voice. Oh, interesting. I don't know what that means, but apparently it's softer spoken than I normally am. And I suppose subconsciously, I'm just trying to make it as understandable to a wider range of people as possible. People do struggle a bit sometimes with my accent and I try and tone it down as much as possible. I mean, that's going to happen with any accent from when you have people around the world listening to it. I mean, I think the voice is fantastic. I think it is a big part of the show itself. I hope there's some people who come and listen to this episode because we are a video and are like I finally got to see who the man behind pod quiz is and the voices if this voice is the same as your pod quiz it sounds very similar now so I don't know if this is your speaking voice or you've got the pod quiz voice on right now I don't think I think it's my normal speaking voice but you know I find it difficult to judge but yes she tells me there's the pod quiz voice Awesome.

20:30You mentioned, and maybe this has to do with the way you pronounce things and your voice on there, but you said earlier episodes were quite a bit longer and you do feel like it's changed a bit. Are there any specific things you remember? I know we've said the format has stayed the same, but maybe the way you cut things together so it's quicker, maybe the way you said pronouncing things, maybe you have feedback from that. Are there any big changes you've seen that you feel like happened despite us you know seeing 20 years of 20 questions i mean i've definitely got more proficient i said over the years that that first episode i think i spent about eight hours recording and editing it recording it took a ridiculously long time you know i'm down to an hour and a half or two hours to really so yeah um so that's that that's a big thing i i think certainly now I make a lot more effort to make it international than I did when I started because when I started you know I didn't have a particular audience in mind I was just playing it to friends I mean it took it took a long time to get up to 100 listeners you know and and so I wasn't I wasn't thinking about the internet international yeah of it at all so that's that's certainly changed over the years but um it hasn't changed a huge amount no i mean it's it it kind of works as it is yeah i think people like the consistency um but i think people like that they can listen to a five-year-old episode or a 10-year-old episode and and not have to learn new rules or yeah so for sure i mean yeah it's it's always just like small changes can make things slowly better over time but I think consistency definitely is key and like yeah going back you definitely have a show where the back catalog is almost sometimes just as important as the new ones because what people love finding podcasts and going through a back I mean I'm one like that I probably found around like episode 800 and then just kept going backwards through the Spotify library until it cut off I forget where where it's cut off on Spotify but now I've had to dig into the website to listen to previous episodes.

22:49When you were starting out, so you said you were originally sending it to friends. I know even in today's world, podcast discoverability isn't really the greatest thing. Back then, so did you send it to friends and it's just friends of friends and word of mouth started getting out? Or did you make any more deliberate pushes towards trying to grow an audience? Or was it always just more of a hobby that you were doing and if it goes, that's awesome. It's always been a hobby. Yeah, absolutely. So I've never spent a huge amount of effort on growing an audience. Early on, I did spend a little bit of effort appearing on other people's podcasts.

23:31I think that's a really good way. In both directions, actually, having other podcasters appear on your podcast is a good way of intermingling the audiences a bit. So I definitely did a lot of that in the early years. But more recently, you know, there's plenty of people listening. Yeah. I love my listeners. They're great. It's a really great community. I don't feel the need for it to grow. I think it does gradually over time. I've not had any big pushes to do it in recent years now. That's awesome. And also a really cool, just that doing something just because you love it is always the best way to keep pursuing through making some form of content.

24:18Because if you are just pushing for just the audio or just the listeners or the engagement or the growth, that's when burnout happens. And I think you're a testament to someone who hasn't hit burnout. Maybe that's me assuming, but a thousand episodes is extremely impressive. Thank you. and I don't feel burnt out yet although people have been saying I'm looking forward to the 2000th episode and I'm thinking I'll be 70 then that seems that's a wild thing to think about it might be a stretch right now, it's just good fun I enjoy doing it and that's why I do it I like how you're saying it might be a stretch not that is a stretch and that is a very very difficult thing to hit.

25:07So that's awesome. I look forward to as far as you're willing to go before hitting burnout, whatever episode that may be. I think something you do extremely well is just the variety of difficulty you have in all of your different questions. It's when I'm listening and a category happens or a round happens, it feels like there's always one that I have a shot at getting at least a guess in, even if I know nothing about the category. And if I know a lot about the category there's always one where i'm really scratching my head how long or is there anything you specifically do to try and have variables for the difficulties of the questions i do think about it yes i always think for each round there should be at least one question that almost everyone will be able to answer um that's usually but not always the first question oh really okay um and similarly i i want to have at least one question around where i think you really need to know your stuff on the subject in order to be able to answer it um but because too far otherwise no fun for anybody for sure trying to have that balance across across each round is what i try and do but um don't always get it right we're gonna take a quick break and when we come back we're going to see how James develops all of his different categories.

26:27Be right back.

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29:11So when you're thinking of a category, are they things you're fairly knowledgeable about or are you going out and looking for maybe something happened just within the last month that you think is interesting and that's how you select a category? I find writing questions for things I know about harder than writing questions for things I don't because if you know something about a subject, I think it's much more difficult to assess how difficult the questions are because they all seem relatively easy.

29:47But, so yes, generally, I don't know a great deal. I mean, I couldn't possibly know a great deal about everything. I've asked all the 20 ,000 plus questions I've asked over the years. But, yeah, no, it's usually it's just a case of the difficult thing I find is coming up with the topic, not coming up with questions. Because I don't have a perfect record, but I try to avoid repeating myself. Which, again, is becoming more and more challenging. But once I've got a topic, then finding questions is just usually a case of hitting Wikipedia. Yeah. Kind of like the Wikipedia game. You start at the topic and then you find links that are associated with it and go through there.

30:35Yeah. That's awesome. In terms of sort of current affairs, I try to avoid that. and because again because people go back 10 years to listen to old episodes and um stuff that's that's current affairs now will be really obscure trivia 10 years time um so again it's it's difficult to completely avoid that um but i i try to where possible well one really interesting way you've done it and I wanted to throw a couple like categories that you've created that I think are really creative at you is one you did some a segment called old news which is where you play a news segment I know I'm just saying this for you but our audience might not know playing a news segment that has some some sort of piece of news and you have to guess approximately the time it happened in but I think what's so interesting about that is rather being when did X event happen as just the question, you have this more context to maybe guess something like that.

31:40Because if you don't know the very simple question, maybe you could figure it out. So me being a production person, sometimes I'm like, oh, well, that microphone definitely is like pre-1990 or something like that. So how do you come up with more fun ways of categories rather than just a very black and white question? I'm not sure I've got a good answer to that. I can list off a couple of my other favorites and maybe that would help. Or maybe you can, if you remember how you came up with those specific rounds. Certainly for, well, for the old news, it was, originally I thought I would just ask questions.

32:17It's sort of more like a history round of asking questions about specific events. And then in the course of researching that, I ended up on YouTube watching an old newsreel, I think it was. And I thought, well, hang on, that's quite interesting in itself. And so I thought I'll pick that up and actually use the audio clip instead. Yeah, and it helps because if you don't know a specific event, maybe in that clip they mention a president or a prime minister or they mention something else that happens that you do know about. So it gives us as the listeners way more opportunities, which is so much more fun.

32:55Or you can recognize the speaker. you can say oh that's walter cronkite so it'll be in a certain time period or whatever yeah yeah that's what's so fun i also really enjoy um like who am i is rather than just who is this person that's x it's five different questions with varying levels of difficulty to get to somebody is that something that's um popular in in pub quizzes or is that something you develop no that's um that's something i came up with i'm just making sure that's true because a lot of a lot of these rounds have been listener suggestions oh cool over the years um but i think that was that was one and again it was sort of one of those things where i was you know i often ask questions about famous people um and if it's just a single question about somebody you can't really sort of dig into the the details of that person and it's difficult to vary the the difficulty a bit whereas that sort of structured round where you get more and more clues they're getting more more obvious over the course of the round it allows people who who really know about that person to get really quickly and and to and to feel like they they've cracked the code as it were there's a there's a really good feeling if you actually do make the guess i think it's happened once which was a total uh or at least since i've been playing one time on like the date and where they were born just total guess and then like the next question you're like wait i think i'm still on the right track and then you get to the end you're like okay cool that was very lucky but so much more fun um and then my other favorite category i always love this one is natural world where you play animal sounds and rather than guess the exact species it's how many legs do they have which is brilliant and so much fun yes i've done similar rounds with uh with um vehicles of various sorts yes yeah how many wheels they've got um which um part of that is because it's actually very difficult if you play the sound of an animal to say what species is it because they also there's a large number of different animals that sound alike and also it's it's it's just a bit of fun i think um yeah it's yeah it's fun and even like you get to guess then right there's only probably so many wheels or so many legs or a lot of times they're multiples of two so you have somewhat of a guess it's like multiple choice but not quite multiple choice uh that's one of the animals one is my favorite i like a lot of the categories where you play sounds and guess things um maybe that's just me like to listening to stuff like that uh do you have any particular like category favorites that you've come up with or topics i don't think i've got specific topics i do like My favourite, I think, are the quickfire rounds.

35:42It's a category of things. So the questions, it might be like, for example, directors' first films or something like that. So it's just a list of – the questions are just a list of directors and you have to name their first films. And maybe that's not the best example. No. I feel I can get quite creative about that. And also it's quite easy. It's quite easy. that's um i know you said music so music rounds are my favorite um and i know you said that's because a pub quiz generally starts with that but have you you've come up with i'm assuming some of these or maybe audience ones all these different ways you play the music round so whether it's uh what year they're out maybe a connection some of the connections are so much fun and feels like you're solving like a detective case on them.

36:37I think one was all different. It was like a king, queen, prince between all the names of everything. And finding that one out was awesome. I personally love Terrible Twins because hearing when two of them play at the same, I believe that's same artist, two songs at the same time. It's really easy to pinpoint one if you recognize it, but even though if you know the band to a t guessing the second one when you already are hearing one in your brain is something that's so hard to uh like explain so that's why i love it so much but uh are there any favorite music rounds you have or how'd you come up with like some of these ideas for a lot of them is just trying to find a way of making it different because because there's a music round every week for sure yeah i feel it just get boring so yeah I do try and come up with new rounds there's a new one coming actually again it was a listener suggestion in a couple of weeks time I think we're going to have a round where the vocal's been removed and you have to guess just from the music but I think my favourite music round is a very very occasional one I do called La Di Da which which is just me trying to reproduce a song really badly with no instruments.