Don’t Ask Google's AI for Advice!

43:44But to have a little more knowledge here about RabinR1, we've covered it a lot and we have one. Seeing him do it was really cool. If you don't know him, though, if somebody's doing a video or if you're the subject of a CoffeeZilla video, it's not a good thing. No. No. And this was, I think after we did the R1 stuff, there was a couple tweets about how Jesse was part of an NFT project beforehand, but not a lot came out of it. So we never reported on it because it was like a couple tweets. Seems like coffee went in a lot deeper and did report on that now. We don't want to go too, too deep into everything, but we'll talk a little bit about both videos.

44:21But you should definitely go watch both of these. The first one is mostly about an NFT project that Jesse was a part of called Gamma and the company that owns Gamma got changed into Rabbit. So there is a connection here between a non-delivering NFT project I also want to note that on a previous episode a long time ago, I had mentioned that Rabbit had only been created like eight months prior. And a lot of people in the comments section were like, you're wrong. It's actually been around since 2020. But what actually happened was Gamma was around since 2020. It's not called Gamma. Gamma is the project and cyber something.

44:59Cybernetics. Whatever. Yeah. Yeah, they just changed the name of their corporation to Rabbit Inc. eight months prior to recording the episode. The Cyber Manufacturer Company. Yeah. So like it wasn't it is a completely different product. So just because you just because you changed the name of the company and you're saying that it's the same company, like it's a different company, but whatever. It's the same company under the law, but completely different company functionally. yeah yeah um so yeah first first video was about the nft project that and some weird crypto coin that never happened so they never technically made a crypto coin but they wanted to make a uh what was it a like green and it was a um carbon negative neutral carbon negative a carbon negative coin yeah sounds cool right yeah so i just i i've i've been a no i've been ignoring nft projects with my whole heart for so long yeah so i did i people had tweeted at me oh did you know that jesse the co-founder of rabbit is was also doing this nft project honestly no i didn't know i didn't care i whatever a lot of people did nft project but then i watched the coffee zilla video of the nft project that they bailed on and i'm watching it i'm like how did anyone think any of this was a good idea well that's the question about every nft project you can ask that about literally i have to say the gamma one was actually not the craziest one i've ever heard of yeah yeah there's a there's a spectrum of how ridiculous they sound and it starts with you sound dumb and it gets even dumber from there and some Some of these were like further than normal, dumb sounding.

46:48Yeah. So I, yeah, I totally. I think I can answer your question because no one cares what the NFT project does. They care about how much money they can potentially make off of said NFT project. Off of other people that invest in the NFT project. And I think when he says on Clubhouse things along the lines of like, we really believe in this. If you don't believe in us, I'll buy back your whatever. Like he made all these interesting statements that felt very much like they were going to go through it. Right. He said those are the right phrases you're supposed to say to make it sound like a good investment.

47:19To feel confident. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then we saw how that went. We did. And then the second episode for everyone that watches us and is more interested in Rabbit was way more about the Rabbit R1. As a product. And large action models. And the lamb in the background. And yeah. Or if there's a lamb in the background. ground um which you might know a little bit more about uh vaguely um i'm not one of these people that had like gone into the rabbit and like checked out what they were using uh in the video he describes the fact that they are using this application called playwrights in the cloud in the vm which is basically manually going around a website and clicking on areas so the way that they described the large action model in the first place was that it just semantically understands what buttons are what buttons so that it doesn't and he said this it doesn't he says it doesn't matter if they change their ux design because it semantically understands that's the play button so if it gets moved five pixels to the left it's still there uh but what people were now saying is that they're basically just using this playwright application which is like a scripting application where you manually tell the program this is where the play button is click this button so like an enterprise program that's used a lot yeah or it's like auto hotkey that kind of stuff but for like websites and they're not hiding that they're using playwright but no i guess the question not anymore now well yeah not anymore but the question is where along the line is the large action model if it talking to the if it exists yeah talking to the playwright and the auto clicking script.

48:57Right. Because like a perfect example of what you just said, how it not working is didn't DoorDash break already because something changed? Uber broke, DoorDash broke. Yeah. Uber introduced like a captcha and it just stopped working because it couldn't figure out how to do the captcha. And I think DoorDash moves some things. So when you ask it to order DoorDash, it's just like DoorDash is under maintenance right now. And we'll say the DoorDash rabbit is under maintenance. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, which means it's not working. The one of the four things that it actually sort of can do. So Rabbit says that, yes, they use Playwright, but they use it in tandem with LAM.

49:31And look, this all just starts to feel more and more sketchy because on the day that the R1 actually came out, there was a big leak where people were saying the LAM doesn't exist at all. And then Jesse made a statement saying, well, the reason that you didn't find it is because the lamb is in a separate server somewhere else. And it's just accessing that server. She goes to a different college. She goes to a different school. Yeah. Yeah. And it's just like, I don't know. The problem is they won't just come out and show and like say and show everything. Yeah. They just say a lot of things like it totally exists.

50:14but they won't show anything and when pushed on this their response was basically we don't really want to tell you how it works because unless you're an ai engineer you're not going to understand it and it's not going to be a value to you yeah bad response it's like if you have nothing to hide then don't hide it just put it out there i also wouldn't have to understand how it worked if it worked yeah yeah valid exactly and so i don't know i i also think that uh the product itself was sold on all of these false promises in the video that he did he basically did the commercial versus reality thing where he asked it every query that they asked in that really hype sizzle video where they were blurring out what the rabbit actually looked like during ces that was like order an Uber.

51:03Oh, and also tell my friends I'm going to be late. That was delicious. What can I have for dessert with it? And he tried every query. It was so funny because when he was like, tell my friends I'm going to be late, the rabbit was basically like, do it yourself. Yeah, one of them was like, we suggest you do it. I suggest you manually text your friends and it was like, okay, cool. So what it seems like The world's greatest assistant. What it seems like is it seems like the rabbit is just a chat GPT box that is using a scripting tool to manually interact with websites. Didn't we determine it's a perplexity box?

51:38It's both. It has both. They added perplexity right before they dropped it. But, very funny thing, there's also a line in the code that says, do not say, do not disclose that I am a LLM created by OpenAI. They explicitly blocked out its ability to say i'm a chat chippy t box which i found very funny also one other funny fact yeah if you're playing spotify on it and you say play anything they also manually wrote it in so that it always plays the beatles which is a choice well i think they did that because if you said play anything i don't think that spotify has a function to just play anything on spotify i think if you ask spotify to play anything it could if you literally just said play anything on spotify they could play something horrible.

52:30Oh. Something like in all of Spotify's library, it might be safe and pick a top song or it could pick something truly horrible. My theory is different. It would find something with the word anything and play a song called anything or a band called anything. In a literal world, but if you go to YouTube, for example, and if you shuffle and play any video, it could be anything. It could be literally anything. Well, I love the random button on Wikipedia. do you think that's curated or truly random it's that is random really freaking yeah but but what are their guidelines like people can't just i guess i don't know i get what you're saying there are some messed up youtube videos there are probably some messed up audio or just like yeah not nice for your ears not even music audio on spotify you're telling it to play anything like that's kind of on you right uh that's like saying people will associate it like negatively with rabbit if you say rabbit play anything and then it plays you like a speech for some like old political but i said dictator thing you're just like why did rabbit i think there's just not a function to do that right because like spotify itself doesn't have a random song on spotify but in a large action model not figure out what it just means i mean something random theoretically there potentially is no large well yeah yeah but i'm saying i think this yeah this was their solution to being safe about it where if someone says play anything that person is probably just testing it and let's just give them a beatles song something safe like there's a huge catalog of things we could play for them and they'll try it once or twice and it'll be nice and it'll give them a beatles song and they'll move on with their life and if we that's like the safe way of doing it and if you truly had a function that could play anything and you just trusted it to literally play anything that could go wrong in a lot of ways for them so i think they're just like let's be safe so my question is like the idea of a large action model actually does make sense and i think it is something that you could build so my question now is like did they just launch this because they wanted to like build on the hype and get all the funding from the really hype moment of everyone talking about ai and they were afraid they couldn't get funding later and they just figured let's just hard code this stuff until we figure it out i think is that what they're doing i think if you ask me you know i've i i also had like a bit of hope for this idea like the large language model seemed to make more sense than other versions that i'd been seeing but i think it's this company felt the pressure of investors and the pressure of the timing and the pressure of all these things to just release something before io before wwdc before whatever and they got something out but as we said in our review is just nowhere near what they were promising and they had enough hope that they could say the right things long enough to get them some time to They keep pushing some updates to make it do more stuff.

55:20And so they could show progress and they could show, hey, trajectory. If we keep going at this rate, we'll have the... They had the ability to say the right things for a long enough time. I think a perfect example of like, again, we've talked about how bad the product is itself, but like Coffee did the thing where he kind of did like commercial versus reality. Before we got the Humane Pin or the Rabbit R1, we were like, a banger video is going to be like our old assistant battle of like rabbit and humane versus google assistant we had both of them in and i was like marquez was doing a content we were like all like talking about content coming up and i was like oh are we doing that video and marquez is like why neither of them do anything like it would just be so boring to just watch them do nothing it's not even a competition we just never made the video because it wasn't worth it yeah i imagine that they're just trying to buy time to actually build the product because they are they are a company right like they they're a legit company that sells hardware and they have 100 000 users or whatever how many they actually sold and they can't they're not just like an nft project where they can just rug pull you and disappear into the ether and nobody knows any better and you were using a pseudonym the whole time like his profile is out there like he's a very public ceo their name is attached to it they build people yeah people yeah so it seems like it would be way riskier to never plan to actually build the thing that you promised at all and i imagine that they're just trying to buy time to actually build it he did it with gamma already though with his name yeah like i would i would argue the opposite of that is just because he had an nft project doesn't mean he can't build something cool but the fact that he had a project that he promised and never delivered on and now has a new project that doesn't meet the promises on i have a hard time believing he'll deliver on those products.

57:09Because within the last three years, he already proved he's willing to not deliver on the products. I'm going to get halal food for lunch, and my lunch is going to be so much more in tandem with lamb than anything rabbit is ever going to do. You lean towards the microphone like eight times. Is that what you've been? No, I had an even worse joke, actually. That one just came to me. The worst one is, what do you call it when you ask the rabbit something and it doesn't respond to you at all? Which happens sometimes. It's the silence of the lamb oh my god okay all right good take the microwave oh my god that was a that's a great youtube title that's a it is a good silence of the lamb well if they go out of business we can make a video okay um my analogy for for the rabbit is they have shown us all a cgi video of a humanoid robot walking around doing a bunch of cool stuff yeah but then they accidentally promised they had to ship it tomorrow so what they shipped was a human in a robot suit a tesla human dancer where it like can't really do any of the things yeah Actually what it really is is a marionette.

58:18It's like one person trying to control everyone's and it clearly can't do everything. So it fails most of the time. And if you ever pull back the curtain, you just see that it's like not what you were promised. Yeah. So, yeah. Could we argue? So like they released something that had about four functions, right? It had like the four connections. It had four apps, but only like two of them worked at all. And they said more are coming. Yet since it released, two of those are now broken, right? Correct. So it literally has less than what happened when it first got shipped. Can I still go to hold.rabbit.tech?

58:49Great start. Yeah. It's still around. It still works. Yeah, but I'm just, I'm wondering if there are any new applications in there by now. I doubt it. I'll check my rabbit hole. But so, right, DoorDash broke, and what is? Uber. Oh, and Uber broke. So, yeah, it could do four things, and now it can do two things. Yeah, not great. Nice. My favorite thing about all of this was just before the videos even came out, coffee tweeted a picture of like a police officer interrogating someone who just says is the large action model in the room with us right now um he also though jesse did reply to all of this and said that he believes coffee is biased and that he didn't include all the stuff that they exchanged in emails and then coffee did a video on his second channel literally reading every single email so if you want to see what all the emails are you can go see it it's 45 minutes and it's a long one so i doubt most people will watch it but i did watch the whole thing and it seemed like he reported on everything that they told him and made the corrections that he needed to make so yeah i don't know the interesting thing about this is that jesse's like persona around all of this like when he came to our studio and talked to us about this he was saying how like oh you know you know like 99 of startups fail and there's a very high chance that will fail and that at the time almost made him seem like more down to earth when you compare yourself to like humane it was just like we are the future of technology you will all use our new product uh however now kind of looking back on it it's like considering he's such a serial startup ce like ceo guy and he just like makes a ton of money off of investors and people who are just like buying into his product being okay with the fact that your company fails as much as possible and just moving on to the next thing and keeping like making money off investors is pretty lame i i think to put it lightly that felt like the uh that reminded me of like the elon spacex comment a long time ago of like spacex will probably never really work but like we are going to create all these things that someone down the line and it makes we'll like be able to use and then we're helping that forward because we really believe in it it feels more like a like look at me mr down to earth yeah he And it's actually really good marketing.

1:01:12He said that about Tesla, too, because for a long period of time, people are like, why are you like investing in all of this technology that other people can just come in and use? And then you have all these like all these competitors that will make Tesla like less relevant. And he's just said multiple times, like, well, if it moves us towards a more green earth, then that's like really the goal of Tesla. Like, I don't really care about the company, but I he cares about the company. You know, you know, we're in a dark place. if we're like, you know who has some really ethical business philosophies compared to this guy, Elon Musk?

1:01:45Touche. Yeah. So I don't know, man. We'll see if they run out of money because I don't think anyone is buying any more of these rabbits from here on out. There has been so much negative press about it. They probably sold their last R1 at this point. Everyone should go watch the videos and come up with their own conclusion on it. Go watch the CoffeeZill videos, watch our reviews, watch what people have said who owned the thing see how rebert responds to all of it as well yeah and also watch trivia have you just that was pretty good that's pretty good that was good after the break miles is going to join us to talk about porsche which i hilariously miswrote as proche in my notes um porsche and as some of you may know porsche actually has a design studio that makes consumer products very expensive so expensive that maybe consumer is the wrong they're insane they're unbelievably expensive but when we come back for answers i'm going to sure sure you i'm going to sure you i'm going to show you four porsche design studio products and you have to tell me which one is fake that's interesting i recently looked through the entire porsche design catalog shoot change the question absolutely not but it's such a big catalog that I'm going to misremember something probably it's like hundreds and hundreds of things they have sent us a lot of things as well to the point where I had to be like you're thinking of well okay you're thinking of Porsche design like collabs like a Huawei Porsche design Mate 30 Pro it's with the studio is that what you're referring to because Porsche also has a store of like a porsche handbag a porsche umbrella porsche so i'm not sure if that's the same design studio or not but i am in fact i'm i don't have any phones on my list i figured that was too easy okay uh but i am referring to the design studio that collabs yeah so like an example that's not on the list that i can confirm is real uh porsche design studio and the famous german piano maker bosendorfer have made several yeah just gorgeous pianos like a million dollars i don't know if they're that much it's so expensive it's the kind of thing that that you're not buying unless you're really about that life yeah um but we'll have to get to that we'll brainstorm it yeah so start thinking and uh we'll be back after the break

1:04:28I'm Christian McCaffrey, pro running back, and Abercrombie is an official fashion partner of the NFL. I'm not kidding when I say NFL by Abercrombie broke the internet last year, and I think this season's lineup is even cooler. And so does my wife, who keeps stealing all my hoodies. Stay fit for the season and Abercrombie's newest arrivals. Shop NFL by Abercrombie in the app, online, and in store.

1:05:00When did making plans get this complicated? It's time to streamline with WhatsApp, the secure messaging app that brings the whole group together. Use polls to settle dinner plans, send event invites and pin messages so no one forgets mom's 60th, and never miss a meme or milestone, all protected with end-to-end encryption. It's time for WhatsApp. Message privately with everyone. Learn more at whatsapp.com.

1:05:52Installed by independent contractors. See associate for details. Contiguous U.S. only. All right, welcome back. We are joined by Miles, and David's still here with us, and we're talking cars again. We have some new car announcements this week, actually, and we mainly just want to talk about one of them. Yeah. I'll summarize the announcement, and then we can talk about our thoughts about that. Yeah, let's do it. So Porsche announced the newest generation of the 911, Their iconic sports car, Porsche 911 gets updated every couple of years and there's a huge lineup, but they gave us two of the base cars, the Carrera and the Carrera GTS.

1:06:32And it's a hybrid for the first time. Now, this car has not been a hybrid in its entire existence. The 911 has always been internal combustion, whether it's turbocharged or not. But this first hybrid version people were very curious about because Porsche always makes the tiniest refinement changes to the 911. And this hybrid thing has a reputation for making cars heavier and maybe a little bloated and a little over technical. And so we were curious how Porsche was going to do it. So they gave us these two base cars. They have way more total horsepower than before. They seem to have a pretty solid solution, small 2 kilowatt hour battery.

1:07:11two electric motors, I believe. One of them is working with the single smaller turbo instead of having twin turbo. It seems like a pretty good solution, only adds 50 kilograms to the cars. And they also changed some design elements to the front, to the back, to the interior. And that's the new cars. We don't know what the rest of the 911 lineup, like the Turbo or Turbo S will look like. That's later announcements down the road. but and also we don't expect a fully electric 911 anytime soon that might not be another two generations but we have the first hybrid sports cars from porsche now our feelings on them i i'll start with my thoughts i never thought i would become that guy because i've i've watched so many porsche videos like this is what happened when i when i went into like deciding if i wanted to buy this car or not is I watched every video that's ever been made about the 911.

1:08:08And there is this section of YouTube where it's, it's like purists who only like the older generation 911s. And they're like, the new one, that thing sucks. The old ones, that's where it's at. And I'm like, geez, I like the new one. It's tech, kinda. I feel like I'm into the new one. And I'll probably always be that guy. And then they announced this new one. And I think the hybrid drivetrain is actually probably the best part of it but the interior they changed a couple things that i specifically dislike that i don't have any good reason to dislike other than the current one is better so the first thing is every 911 for many many years has had a twist like not an actual key to twist to start but they've had the ignition on the left side of the steering wheel and this is the first one that they're making just a like a plastic push button start just like a macan or a cayenne and i just i don't like that at all the other is the tachometer is just an all digital display now which is that's most cars these days let's be honest like they just have screens but the current generation 992 actually has a real like physical needle and it has screens to the left and right but has a real needle tachometer and i love something about that like it's just like a watch like i've never had these feelings about any device before and now i see like a fully digital one and i'm like oh that's not the same like i yeah i've never and i'm the dude who's wearing an apple watch like i don't want a rolex seems like the dumbest thing ever to me so i'm like i didn't think i would become this guy but i really feel this way yeah miles how do you feel about the new 911 my feelings are exactly the same the fact that it's a hybrid system which you know makes it faster but it's now heavier bigger and more expensive that's not like what my problem is with this car which is what some people are saying is an issue they'll just prefer to just be pure ice it's just the fact that they're like you said changing things that we have known and associated with Porsche just to say hey this is new and different it's funny because I was filming the new Cayenne just last weekend and I was talking about the push start button I'm like it's a Cayenne okay fine I'll deal with it but the 911s right they're gonna leave that alone they're not gonna there's no way they're gonna change the ignition switch right so with the older Porsches like you said you used to be able to just take your key put it on the left and then crank it to start the the engine and then with 992 they changed it your car where it's like a knob it's a knob twist where the key would be so it's like yeah and that actually makes a bit more sense with a modern car and it's still the same thing you get the same effect it was a nice hybrid between a push button digital thing and like an old school key I don't have to have a key but I still get the satisfying like physical motion right so that was great apparently this is what porsche customers want according to porsche so it's so funny i happen to have a porsche customer sitting right here next to me so dr brownie you have a porsche no that's andrew in the last episode yeah that's fair yeah so so dr brownlee i have to ask you yeah do you actually want a push to start button so in a car that has an engine i get it but no and the thing i think they're i think when they say this is what porsche customers want i think what mathematically they're saying is well lots of people bought cayenne's so seems like people are okay with it and mathematically they're probably right and people will still buy it and use it and it'll be fine but i couldn't possibly argue in any way that it's better other than maybe being simpler physically to manufacture but it's porsche we're talking about when does that have been a concern yeah it wasn't a concern until now this is the first time where i've seen porsche announce a new car and me just be like this is just not good for a nonsensical reason like all these other companies are making their engines smaller and doing all these things to comply with like emissions laws and things like that that's totally understandable but this is just one of those things where it's like they're just changing it for essentially no reason and i don't think there's anyone on earth who's like yes this is the better version so let me ask you again apparently porsche customers requested that the gauge cluster be fully digital really yes requested i mean that's why they did it they say this is what porsche customers wanted they wanted their gauge cluster to be fully digital you can also just say things they can also just tell they can also just say that people said that I will say I've watched a lot of videos on the last couple of generations of 911 and I didn't hear anyone ask for that.

1:12:49What I did hear about the 992 is the gauges were a little bit too wide. And so they were kind of hidden by the steering wheel. Almost every car reviewer like mentioned that at some point. I don't think I translated that to make this all digital. I just heard that as like I have to figure out anything wrong with this car. And it seems like that's one thing that everyone finds wrong with it. But the thing is, that was the side menu. So that wasn't, they weren't talking about the tack in the middle, which was the only element that was still analog. And then they said, no, that's digital now too. Yeah.

1:13:21Doesn't translate for me. Do you think that's more expensive or cheaper to do? A completely digital screen versus an analog tack? I think it's cheaper because it's one screen. So before we had the analog tack in the middle, which I'm sure they make a ton of, and it's not super hard to manufacture, but then they had one screen on the left and one screen on the right. And now you just have one big screen. And I think we also saw an article something about how they're going to have like deeper integration with CarPlay. I haven't seen what that actually looks like yet. I'm sure it'll just be you can have the map in front of you instead of just on the screen to the side.

1:13:52Cool. Great. I just I think it's just a little cheaper to make one screen instead of two. But that's another thing, right? When they announced the the whole next gen CarPlay thing and they announced that Porsche was going to be the first people they're working with. It's like I feel like I don't know anyone who owns Porsches who wants their UI to look like an Apple car. Maybe Cayenne. I mean, I think, yeah, I don't know anyone else who wants that either. I think there's a lot of people who just want it to work like their phone and that's good enough. And CarPlay is that for most people. But there is also a specific subset of Porsche buyers.

1:14:27Because let's be honest, like most people buying a Porsche are buying a Cayenne or a Macan and it's just the one that they wanted and it's a casual commuter, whatever. But there's a subset of those people who are like purists who really, really care about, you know, the driving dynamics and the weight of the car and the way it handles and all sorts of smaller things that are more traditional. And those people didn't ask for that at all. They never, I don't think I heard any of them ask for that. So it seems like they're listening to group number one over group number two, but it's the 911. So it feels like there's less of group number one buying the 911.

1:15:00It's kind of weird. That is true. I have a question. Yeah. so the porsche 911 is fast right that's like why people like it you mentioned that because now it's that that it's hybrid it's heavier does that affect how fast it is is it now slower as well so it'll be faster so here's the here's the fun part of the driving dynamics i think it will drive better and i'm i'm gonna speculate even a little bit on like the turbo and the turbo s later but they've already shown like the nurburgring lap time of the gts and it's like just as fast It has more horsepower than the outgoing turbo. Than the non-S turbo.

1:15:37Yeah, the turbo. So it is a more powerful car. But the thing about turbos is they take time to spool up and actually accelerate faster. There's just an inherent lag. And you can deal with it with your gearbox by always being close to on boost. And they've been really good at that. But it's not lag free. When you drive a Taycan or an electric car, that instant torque is totally different from the feeling of a turbocharged engine. And I think this hybrid system is going to give, like we talked about in our hybrid video, it's going to give people that instant acceleration feeling when they hit the pedal.

1:16:15It won't be full-on all of your power, but it'll feel more responsive. And then, of course, when you combine the power of the engine and the electric motors, you will have more total power and accelerate faster. So it'll feel like a more responsive car. and I think that's good for most people. I think they'll enjoy it. They managed to kind of minimize weight gain. 50 kilograms isn't nothing, but it's a tiny battery, so it's not a disaster. These aren't the featherweights of the car world, so I feel like it'll drive better. But yeah, it's just the little interior things kind of got to me. So you are Porsche's demographic, right?

1:16:51You're the person who they're targeting with their sports cars, right? Yeah. I think Marquez is like 45 years younger than the person that they're targeting with their sports car. Well, normally because people his age don't usually have a quarter million to spend on a sports car. But if they could pick their ideal, they would want everyone who's buying other, people who are buying Lamborghinis and McLarens and other things, they would want them to buy that too and then be a repeat customer for however long they're alive. Ideally. My question is, what does Porsche have to do with the yet-to-be-revealed turbo to make you feel like you would want to upgrade and buy it.

1:17:28Wow. It's all about the drive. It would have to drive that much better that it overcomes the things that I dislike about the interior. Again, there are other things that are fine about it. Most of the interior is still going to be the same. I don't have as much of a problem with the facelift as some other people do. There's these new active aero flaps in the grills at the front, and they replace the dedicated blinkers with like just the headlights blink. So it's a simpler face. Some people hate it. I think it's fine. It's mostly a similar car. It's very recognizable. I just want to know how much faster and how much better it drives.

1:18:05That's really most of what I want to hear about with the Turbo S when it comes out. It'll be like a year before we hear about it. But I want to hear battery size. I want to hear total power. I want to hear like responsiveness, zero to 60 times. I want to hear that type of stuff with that car. I think from now until this car comes out, we should all get familiar with how driving a Porsche 911 feels by taking turns with a certain person who has one. I do my best to describe it, but like, I don't know. If you watch videos of turbocharged cars driving, you slam on the accelerator pedal in an EV and you just go.

1:18:48you just go. If you slam on the accelerator pedal in a naturally aspirated engine car, it can feel pretty close to that level of responsiveness. If you slam on the accelerator in a turbocharged car, a twin turbo car, it will start to accelerate. And then as you climb and revs and build boost pressure, you surge forward in like a crazy way. Who was in the speed tail? Was it just you? You were in the speed tail? No, we were talking about the lack of turbo lag because we had both also done the p1 together the p1 so we had like a really good reference point of like because the p1 is like fast off the line and then the turbo kicks in but the the speed tail was just so these are both hybrids the p1's a hybrid too yes oops i sound pretty stupid no but these are both turbocharged hybrids that we are driving and this is also a turbocharged hybrid that we're talking about but if you drive a non-hybrid turbocharged car uh there are a couple that are nicknamed the widow maker because you could be driving around a track and you could you could hit what you think is the right point to accelerate and then you get this boost that gets gives you way too much power and you just kick the tail out like i don't want to say it's unpredictable but the way the power comes on with the turbo is way more of a surge right than what an EV will give you.

1:20:08The Speedtail and the P1 at least both give you a really solid warning, because right before you get kicked, it goes... Yeah, the intakes go crazy. It's... Yeah, that is the feeling. No, but that's exactly what it is. It's a symphony of a bunch of different things happening at once that make you go faster. Did you see the picture of the drivetrain they published with all the press photos? Porsche? Yeah. It's a very silly looking photo. I'm just gonna bring it up right now yeah they did a they did a whole like unveiling live stream video on youtube that we watched and it was very german it was like one person going i heard you made it a hybrid tell us about that and then like some trance music as they do like a transition to a different part of the same room and he goes it is a hybrid and then he starts explaining it it's great i was hoping they would do like an apple transition where they like do a drone shot to like a different part of the same room they didn't do it though it was great you brought up the word a widow maker and that brings me to like one of my final points with the 992.2 there's been one car that everyone is kind of just like forgot about which one is that gt2 rs gt2 rs so the term widow maker like the gt2 rs that was the original widow maker like back in the day because it was just a rear wheel drive rear wheel drive turbos like 500 something horsepower but like no nannies right so it's just like if you screw up you screw up no what no nannies no nannies like mary poppets no handhold yeah no handholding i get it now just like no like a lot of people these days think they're good drivers that's just because there's all these like because traction control is amazing there's all these traction control systems that like allow you to feel confident doing kind of like stuff you maybe shouldn't be doing on the public road but this is a car where it's like you just have to be good and so i think this is going to be like an 800 horsepower all the power to the rear hybrid you think gt2rs will be a hybrid too yeah because they're going to need something crazy because what's coming out this summer is the corvette zr1 right which is going to be like kind of the similar philosophy what is the comp in porsche's lineup of the zr1 is that their gt2 rs or their gt3 rs some would say i think most people would say gt3 rs okay but then porc corvette's also going to have zora which is going to be they like z's they like their z's okay it's going to be an even more extreme version of zr1 so okay so force induction z06 motor plus hybrid jesus yeah it's gonna be scary so in order to compete this is also the other thing is i'm sure porsche feels some level of competition from other cars coming out in their price brackets and so yeah if you're gonna try to be you know competitive speed wise it feels like you have to electrify your your lineup at some point and the purists at the very pure purest end of it are like no no electricity no hybrid system we need it to be naturally aspirated etc but uh i think the hybrid is a good move for these cars it's just a matter of like keeping it 911 yeah i think if we've learned anything this week it's that or last week it's that evs could be pretty good well pretty fun i think by the time this pod comes out that video is out yep do you want to talk about your experience with that car is it the best okay so miles and i both test drive a lot of the cars that you see us review on autofocus and so as a result we've both driven a lot of different cars and shared notes on them and this last car that we reviewed which is called the lucid air sapphire i think is the best driving electric car ever made and maybe the best driving sedan ever made it's amazing hot take and that's a that's a hot take because when i say best driving ev ever made i'm including all evs i'm including the rimac nevera i'm including the tycan turbo i'm including all evs i've ever driven and the lucid air sapphire i think tops that list it's incredible at disguising it's incredible weight it's really good and then on top of that best driving sedan ever i don't i haven't driven as many sedans i'll be honest there's a lot of gas sedans i've never driven but damn it would be really impressive if another gas sedan could match 1100 daily horsepower and like the level of traction control and handling and suspension that that car has i thought it was one of the best cars ever so the story with that car is lucid did two long-term rentals of what most like enthusiasts would consider to be the best driving sedans ever made prior to the sapphire and that was the bmw m5 cs and the cadillac ct5v blackwing both of which i've driven and you know i'm definitely like an ice guy i think the sapphire like outclasses it's it's honestly no contest i mean if you like noises then i mean yeah obviously there's no replacement for that but you could just kind of think of like the noises you make when you're accelerating to kind of like you're holding a breath yeah because it's it's honestly incredible and it's not necessarily the fact that it's so freaking fast because if you want to go just a smidget faster you could spend like 2.5 million extra dollars and get a nevera but it's the fact that you've got a frunk a trunk a super spacious backseat super spacious over 400 miles of range honestly like a usable actually daily drivable car so like the new tycan turbo gt y sock that could be a better driving car i guess we're gonna find out like having driven months yeah but but no backseat no back seats it's like that's not a tycan crazy anymore you know it's it's honestly kind of a silly car to be honest that you can't really recommend to a normal person Whereas this, if you're rich, you can recommend this to a normal person.

1:26:21Yeah. Just to go fast. How much does this car cost? $250. The Sapphire? Yeah. But I mean. But for the best driving car ever made. And I mean, you're going to, at a stoplight, nothing will beat you. Nothing. Like. It's nuts. You're smoking Bugattis off the line. Smoking every Porsche, every. every what i was gonna say like a tesla a plaid just gets just walked by this like everything in a straight line when did you drive this alice i haven't gotten a drive i haven't gotten to drive it but i've driven with miles and what's so crazy is that you can do all that and the last time miles picked me up in it we had it was we fit so many musical instruments in there like it's actually so we had a xylophone we had two saxophones we had a flute we had all of our backpacks.

1:27:11Nice. And it was there was still plenty of room in the car. Interesting. Yeah. Front trunk. I will say I also think it looks very very nice. Really? Yeah. I really like the way that car looks. Yeah the Lucid's kind of interesting to me. It's got a good look in that spec. I've seen some ugly Lucids. And they're all the brown one. Hey! The brown one? The brown it looks good. The eggplant Lucid. I'm not with you. Yeah I think the two tone Lucids are not really my thing. Same. This one is like the this is the stealthiest most uh really aggressive looking it's a beautiful color it's a it's got that carbon spoiler and no sky sky ceiling carbon roof instead yeah yeah the thing is that surprised me is just how many looks it got from just like non-car people really like there's a there's a school right by where i live and so i was getting home right as the school was letting out and all these little kids were just like peeping the lucid i'm just like it's cool hey yo like i did not realize it had that kind of like it's got a light presence yeah but i mean they all do now you know it also kind of looks like it probably does not look like a cadillac or anything but it looks like a fancy car that's being stealthy and i look at fancy cars that are being stealthy it has big cadillac energy for sure it does it okay good i don't really know anything about cars it's It's a big car.

1:28:33Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I can see that. Just more like the, like, you know, casualness and the fanciness. Here's my hot take for the episode, because I know people like my car takes on the pod. The Sapphire has better suspension than the 911. Better daily-able suspension than the 911. Whoa. In that it is more compliant, and I wish I could control it more. Like, PASM lets me switch between the most sporty and, like, a little softer. but i i when i was driving the lucid i was like i can't believe this car weighs 5 000 pounds like it's got this firm and confident but very compliant suspension that was amazing on new jersey roads with potholes and like expansion joints and all kinds of weird stuff i was like this is a great suspension i don't i don't think that's a hot take i think 911s have always just used more simplistic sporty driving focused suspension systems whereas like the lucid is a bit more complex but still very good for not being air suspension like it's using steel springs which is so crazy pretty wild to me and like i feel like if you put someone like jano in the car who drives like a plat or model s with air suspension he probably wouldn't know honestly yeah how is lucid doing as a company is that bad well here's the thing i think what's so great about this car is they've clearly spent a lot of engineering time and money to make this car incredibly efficient and really really good and lucid does not make money as a company right but they're also backed by a basically infinite wallet of the saudi investment fund and so it kind of doesn't feel like it matters yet interesting i don't know that they have any sort of pressure or ticking time bomb behind that but it's like they just keep losing money and keep making very highly engineered cars and i guess that's fine for now i i think so i mean i whether they're going to be around forever is like because this is the same question i have like every six months with mclaren which is also literally 100 backed by the yeah you know by the like some like saudi like financial group oh i want them to stick around but at the same time i think about like how cheap a sapphire would be if this company no longer had aftermarket support if they had some sort of pressure to sell cars more then it wouldn't be 250 grand but i don't think my take is that i don't think if you're a car journalist if there are any car journalists watching this you should not be allowed to own this car and you should not own this car firstly it is incredibly easy to put yourself in a go-to-jail situation there don't ask me how i know that secondly secondly i feel like it just establishes like a precedent of like what speed and capability in a car supposed to be that is just beyond what is it ruins you beyond the norm for like even supercars where it's just like i feel like if i were to drive this car for a month straight and nothing else the second i get into literally anything else i'm just gonna be like yeah i talked about that with plaid like and plaid was not as fast as this but i feel like that ruined a lot of cars for me i told you about the nsx we had the nsx type s here for a couple weeks maybe a week or two and that's a fast car like that's a really incredible car and i remember getting into it after like a year of owning plaid and thinking oh man this car is really nice it's too bad it really lacks top end like it's not that fast and then i watched i read some other reviews of it and they're like this is a ballistic fast car with an incredible like this is the best performing nsx ever and i was like oh i've i've been ruined your expectations like i've been ruined by it the thing that's different for me like i haven't driven the plaid alive driven like yours like around back like once i've been in brandon's a bunch of times it doesn't it's incredibly fast but it doesn't drive like a lot of my favorite sports cars drive and so that's what i feel like is the differentiator the fact that it just is such a good driving car overall all the steering is incredible the handling is incredible like it's incredibly like capable there is a video on YouTube of somebody doing it taking a test drive and he's driving around in sapphire mode and he has a lucid representative in like the front seat and he's like he gives it I think it's miles per hour maybe he did this video yeah he gives it a few like obviously like pulls and it's like this car is insane and then they get up to like a stoplight and the guy they get they get to the front of the red light and the guy's like you're taking this left right here start turning left floor it mid-turn and he's like okay and then he does and the car just carves out of the turn like as if he's stuck to the it's on rails or something it's crazy so the traction control is unbelievable in that car and yeah it drives like a dream it's great can i say one thing about the lucid yeah i want them to take all of these things that you love take out like two-thirds of the speed and then make a mybach competitor with the platform because i love being inside that thing so much and if they made like an ultra comfy like you don't need to go fast the suspension is really great version of it yeah but that's just like the gt the other airs are in that no no but i mean like super luxury interior like i want like only four seats get rid of that middle back seat you know i want i want what are my bot come with the champagne flutes you know it's funny in the fridge when i first tested the lucid before they started shipping any airs i sat in an executive option back seat that's exactly what you're describing damn but then i don't think they ever ship that or maybe it's like super late and they might ship it later i want the toyota century of lucids i've i've been loving these like nba analogies where people are like Wemby is the Michael Jordan of Bull Bulls.

1:34:52Wait, wait. Yes, yes. Think about it, though. Think about it. Wemby is the Michael Jordan of Bull Bulls, and I think the Lucid Air Sapphire. That's such Tim Duncan disrespect, but okay, continue. This is all jargon. The Lucid Air Sapphire is the Rimac Nevera of Model S plaids. or it's the Taycan or it's the 911 of plaids something like that I'll work on that one but it's up there I think the Lucid Air is

1:35:28the Sapphire

1:35:35is the yes of yes there it is you heard it here first we don't have anything bad to say about this car other than the key fob. And it doesn't come in brown. It doesn't come in brown. I think that's, yeah, the Sapphire literally only comes in Sapphire. But I think that's it. That's really all we want to talk about. The new Porsche, the hybrid, and then our recent car experiences. Go subscribe to the Autofocus channel if you haven't already. We've been all over the map, all kinds of fun cars over there. And if you want more thoughts on auto, that's where we focus on it. And with the power of editing, I will now be replaced with Andrew Manganielli.

1:36:09Whoa! Jesus! Crazy. I don't know where I came from. Well, you're back just in time for trivia. Oh, great. I can get all of them wrong. Oh, wait. That was not the call, was it? No, that was perfect. Yeah. Trivia. You just have to say the word trivia. Trivia. Someone have a whiteboard? There wasn't one. Three times. There's two here. Oh, nice. Thanks. Do you want a pen? I have three. So, quick update on the score. Trivia. Marquez with nine. Andrew with eight. David with nine on a fake eraser blowing the sleet blowing it Andrew alright first question how much RAM does the Spotify car thing come with how much protein is this closest do we think it has more or less than the Humanae eye pin it has more protein should we think it has any at all oh sure yeah we'll do whoever's closest the Delta

1:37:12google aloe google plus r.i.p that was just off the top of my head all right flip them and read what you got oh oh oh i said four gigs of ram four gigs feeling juicy it's probably not nope we both said one one gig one gigabyte do you want to give a more specific answer i will allow this wait uh 1024 megabytes 1024 that is a gigabyte i know i don't know why are you allowing this why don't we just because he basically just said one so what do you think i also said one okay so do you want to change your answer wait you can change your answer no but you'll see i'll change my answer right now i feel like you're trying to do a tiebreaker yeah exactly i'm trying to do a tiebreaker how about one of us goes less than one one of us goes over one okay what do you want 1.2 i'll go under so 1.2 yeah and what'd you say andrew okay okay closest number to under that you say over and i say under i'm over he's under all right let's do it i'm so confused i'm saying it has you started this and he's saying it has less than one gig you started okay so you wanted less than one gig yeah got it andrew gets the point Let's go.

1:38:31Wow. Disgusting. The answer is around 500 megabytes. Are you freaking kidding me? Dang. Whatever. All right. Question two. Okay. Horsha Design Studio makes some really beautiful stuff and also some really weird stuff. And so I've collected three of the weirdest things I could find and one thing that I made up. and I'm going to show them to you and then you must tell me which one is fake. This is great. Let's figure out how to do this. That means you created one of these? Did Tim or an AI create? Hey man, I don't tell you how to do your job. Number one, the Porsche kitchen. This ultra modern kitchen pulls from familiar Porsche materials like aluminum for its frame and new materials for its surfaces like frosted glass countertops and a raw wood paneling.

1:39:28That weirdly looks like it could be real. That looks the most sterile kitchen zero character ever. Oh. Oh. Number two is the Porsche impact driver. Porsche worked with a local Stuttgart tool manufacturer to develop an impact driver with comfort in mind. The vertical aluminum handle paired with a carbon fiber back yield an incredibly balanced impact driver. That's insane. Yeah, that's funny. Number three, the Porsche Hospital Bed. The Porsche Design Hospital Bed is a more modern addition to their design portfolio, emphasizing chrome fittings and clear lines. The height ratio between the headboard and footboard is a nod to the profile of their classic fastback design.

1:40:16And number... Wait, wait, wait. Wait, you know how they charge you like$8 ,000 a night to stay in the house? This is why. Because they have those Porsche pens. And number four. Oh my God. This is the Porsche smoking pipe. It might look like a normal pipe until you realize that the bowl has a heat sink. That's right. Those are radiator fins. No way. There's no liquid. But the fins do supposedly keep the bowl at a lower temperature, leading for a more pleasurable smoke. God, this is tough. What in the world? this is tough I feel like Google code competitions it can't be but it could be what was the second one B was the impact driver it was a kitchen impact driver hospital bed I don't know man the hospital bed is freaking so funny this is brutal what do you guys have I went with the kitchen you think the kitchen is fake Correct.

1:41:18All right. The kitchen is real. That is a real image. Andrew, you put the impact driver is real, too. That is a real photograph. Why do they have a drill bit in an impact driver? Excuse me. I think I wrote impact driver, but it's actually a hammering drill. That changes how I... That's why I picked it. A hammering drill, they're the same thing. I feel like you usually don't use a drill bit on an impact driver, no? Oh, I also put the kitchen. Kitchen. Do you not? I believe that's why you like a drill. Is it a hospital bed? what do you put on your impact drive maybe i'm sounding like an idiot here but no i'm worried i'm sounding like an idiot now i thought an impact driver was a traditional drill that has a hammer motor built yeah i know but i don't think you would normally drill holes with it because of the fact that it's not doing it you drill holes and really hard stuff maybe i'm wrong i mean i know you can put it in but if you are a contractor hold on here's a right and you know how to correct me i've used impact driver for many times for drilling holes most of the time for fence work, but recently many people say not to use an impact driver for driving holes.

1:42:19It says impact rated bits they're rated bits specifically for a purpose and it could break the bits. So I saw that and thought, oh that must be fake. You just threw a Porsche design logo on it. No, I wish I was that good at Photoshop. I probably could ask Tim. That seems like an easy one. Was it the hospital bed? Oh yeah, the hospital bed. It looks so AI created. Marquez is tied with David in the first place with nine points but don't be worried because andrew is hot on their tails like sure and i have nine points yeah andrew got the second one right i got the first one right the first one and he's also tied with it he's also tied with those other guys dang we're nine we're we're very deep into this season for a tie game this is cool this is cool you're all gonna get 40 something points in the next trivia extravaganza nothing none of it matters but that's pretty The last trivia was decided by one point.

1:43:16That's true. That's so true. Carried the one. Well, this has been a fun off-the-wall episode. Obviously, if you enjoyed it, feel free to hit that like button. But most importantly, hit subscribe so you can see more. Thanks for watching. Catch you in the next one. Peace. Waveform was produced by Adam Alina and Ellis River. We're partnered with Vox Media Podcast Network, and our intro to your music was created by Veen Still. Bingo! Let's go!

1:43:56That's a terrible combo. Maybe don't publish that. It's funny. And Doug, here we have the Lemo Emu in its natural habitat, helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual. fascinating it's accompanied by his natural ally doug uh limu is that guy with the binoculars watching us cut the camera they see us only pay for what you need at liberty mutual.com liberty liberty liberty liberty savings vary underwritten by liberty mutual insurance company affiliates excludes massachusetts your sausage mcmoffin with egg didn't change your receipt the sausage mcmoffin with egg extra value meal includes a hash brown and a small coffee for just $5.

1:44:42Only at McDonald's for a limited time. Prices and participation may vary.