If Apple Made a Camera, It’d be the Sigma BF

0:00Rinse takes your laundry and hand delivers it to your door. expertly cleaned and folded. So you could take the time once spent folding and sorting and waiting to finally pursue a whole new version of you. Like tea time you. Mmm. Or this tea time you. Or even this tea time you. So did you hear about Dave? Or even tea time, tea time, tea time you. Mmm. So update on Dave. It's up to you. We'll take the laundry. Rinse. It's time to be great. Not all journalism is the same. Take The Guardian. Our coverage has something unique, fierce independence. Nobody owns us or tells us what we can and can't say, so we're free to report the whole picture.

0:43We connect what's happening in Washington to the rest of the globe, expose corruption wherever we find it, and give fresh perspective on everything, from wellness and soccer to culture, the climate, and more. Read, watch, and listen to The Guardian for free at theguardian.com. I'll start with the crown because I think this one's just fun Rivian's tan update I think it's sick as the crown? out of left field Marques I don't think there's anything negative that anyone could possibly say about it and therefore it is my crown if a new color is the coolest thing that happened in February we had a rough February it's not just a new color it's a new trim package did you see the seats?

1:26they look like Tesla also a new color it looks sick did you see that? new dual tone color so i want you to see the picture of the seats they look great they look like tesla bar how sick are those seats what is up people of the internet welcome back to another episode of the waveform podcast we're your hosts i'm marquez i'm andrew and i'm david and can i turn my headphones up a little bit absolutely just a tiny yeah perfect thank you alice Today's episode, we have OnePlus did a thing that they didn't mean to do. Sigma did a thing that they meant to do, and it was really interesting. Also, we speculate on iPhone 16e pricing and have a little bit more thoughts.

2:12The review is out by the time you watch this. And we're trying to figure out what's good with Alexa AI, because that's also brand new. Alexa Plus. Come join us. Also, it's the end of the month, like literally the last day of the month as this goes up, so we have a new crown and clown of the month that we'll have to figure out and agree on at some point. But first, actually, first, we have a quick correction on Google Tasks. I have a couple of corrections. A couple? Okay. And an answer to people having issues with pocket casts. This whole first segment is just like corrections and wrong things.

2:41Yeah, it's our corrections and other people's corrections. Okay, perfect. That's perfect because I actually have one from last week, too. Okay. David, do you remember last week when I said the new Google Tasks browser was out and you said, I've been using this forever? Yeah. So I found out what the difference is. Previously, you could have a page dedicated to just your Google Tasks, but it was inside of the calendar URL. So if you go to calendar... So just the URL. So pretty much you can switch between calendar and tasks, which I did not know about. I didn't know that either. Now, when you go to tasks.google.com, it is its own...

3:18No, you weren't using this. This is new. All right. It looks the same. It does look the same. Look, it is the same. The only difference is that the top left says tasks now and is dedicated to tasks. Why? And you can't go do. Why did they make a separate website? I'm glad they did because I had no idea this was here. Somebody at Google probably got an email being like, quick, name five things you did this month. And they were like, I made a website for a thing that already existed. Yeah. The basis of what we talked about last week was that Google has not forgotten Google Tasks. And that still remains true.

3:50Hashtag blessed. Hashtag blessed. Honestly. That's huge. Yeah. Okay. And then I also have one other correction. last week I said our Vox podcast at South by Southwest was 11 a.m. CST. It is at 10 a.m. CST. So if you're at South by Southwest, come watch, listen live. It's the first time we're ever doing this. Come live with us. Also, for people who heard this and thought to look up South by Southwest tickets just to come, they're very expensive. Yeah. It's more if you're already at South by Southwest than, hey, here's a thing happening at 10 a.m. Yeah. We would love to do this again later, but this is our trial run because Vox is setting it all up with their stage.

4:28Think of it like this. If we can pull this off and this goes really well, then we can maybe do some other version of this with more people in the future. So with this smaller group, we'll test some things out. We'll try some stuff. We've been reading your comments. There's some good ideas in there. Keep going. But yeah, then we'll experiment with more later. The next one's in Tahiti. Yeah, wow. Heard it here first. Yeah, that's a leak. It's at Fyre Festival 2. That's the next step. Okay. I also have noticed a lot of people saying that they were having issues with Waveform on Pocket Casts. I love Pocket Casts.

5:03You do? Yeah, I've been using Pocket Casts. I haven't had any issues. Marquez and I found out the issues along with some help from our subreddit. Essentially what's happening, people were saying within the last couple weeks, Pocket Casts, when they try and download the newest episode, they're getting failed to download. So what we figured out is that inside of Pocket Cast, there's the correct waveform RSS feed and then there are two more feeds that are actually this company called Listenbox downloading our YouTube video into audio and posting it on Pocket Casts. That's not us. That is not us. They can just do that?

5:38Apparently. That is one of the questions I have in a minute. So I've read that some people enjoyed that because it would also download the video so they could listen in Pocket and if they wanted to reference really quickly the video, they could pop it up. But we're not the people doing that. And if you go to ListenBox right now, it says they're pausing operations until they can reliably bypass YouTube blocks. Spoiler, you're not supposed to be doing that. Yeah. Until we can break terms of service reliably. Yeah. So the way to tell the difference is if you go to PocketCast, the correct feed, which is audio only, is waveform colon the MKBHD podcast.

6:16Waveform Clips is obviously not this, but there is a feed for Waveform Clips, and just Waveform is not the correct one, so that will not be working. Oh, my gosh. So the only correct one is the one that has the Vox logo at the top. Correct. To be clear, there's only one correct feed. Yes. Pocket Cast. Right now, we only have video on YouTube, audio through RSS feed, wherever you can get it. We've thought of some other ways of doing it, but we just haven't found the correct balance for that. we do we keep an eye on it but I have two questions here if anyone from ListenBox is out there do we still get view or download credit for that I'm assuming no and no they're just stealing to be very clear they're just a service that operates to let people create a podcast feed out of thin air by downloading a bunch of videos that show up on a YouTube channel if it's not your YouTube channel you don't get to make that podcast feed either stealing and putting it up and claiming to be us That's what I assume.

7:12So we will try and find a way to fix that. Thank you to everyone that called this out on social media. It's funny because it's breaking and not working, which is also, that's part of the reason why this kind of sucks for us because we have a bunch of people like, how come your guy's thing isn't working? It's like, well, all the stuff we did is working correctly. We did not do that. And now this stuff's broken. So Pocket Cast people, oh, I guess I think there's a way to deal with it through ListenBox, but not cool ListenBox. you probably should get permission from the people you're downloading from.

7:43Also, it's illegal. It's not illegal, but it's against terms of service. It's like shades of, what was her name? Gray? No, Mira. When they asked her, like, Amir Marati. Yeah, are you downloading from YouTube? I can't say we're not doing that. We're using publicly available data. Yeah, totally. Okay, my car is publicly available. That doesn't mean you can take it. Did you see the meta Slack message about the people feeling bad that they were torrenting all the books inside of, like, on Meta Campus? No. It was like, I feel pretty bad that we're doing this, like, on Meta Wi-Fi. And then, like, laughy face.

8:28I mean, they should be doing it on Meta Wi-Fi. Because if they were doing it at home, then they would be liable for it. Which Meta probably would prefer. Zuck is the one that should take responsibility. everybody all right evergreen let's go to a correction not from us oh yeah so this is funny this kind of developed over the past couple of days slash week or two but you may have seen the headline the oneplus watch 3 which is out now um had a tiny typo on the back it is basically meaningless the watch is totally fine but the typo on the back says made in china except instead of made it's m-e-d-a made in china it's just like the text is whatever somebody messed it up it's the text is wrong and so like people including me took a picture of it got a little laugh out of it it's funny because it almost doesn't matter at all but it is weird that it would make it to the final product because then it makes you think well what else gets past these people and makes it to the final product that they didn't mean to not sure but uh the correction that they're issuing is they are allowing for returns and letting people obviously you can keep it if you don't care i would want to but yeah maybe it's a limited edition thing it's keep it yeah these prints are always worth more yeah i mean these aren't gonna be worth more probably but you don't know yeah they said that you could send it in for a full refund or you could just keep it as a limited edition product apparently they are ceasing selling them again until sometime in april yeah they took it seriously two month delay now that stinks yeah that's like damn how did this make it all the way through yeah this is kind of yeah uh wild that it made it and they probably made a lot of them by now probably a lot of inventories sitting around with that text on it what are they gonna do with it they can't sell it they should sell it for like uh a hundred dollars off or something like that.

10:22It'd still be, they'd still make more money than just throwing them all in the landfill. It's better than a waste, yeah. Does this feel like an overcorrection? Like, does anyone care? I feel like it's an overcorrection. I mean, better to overcorrect than not do anything. That said, are they legally allowed to say things that don't say their origin? Does it have to say made in China? Why does everything say where it's made? That's a question. That's definitely a legal thing and that's a good point. Really? But sometimes it just says China, right? So is the meta in not even matter? Could you make the argument that it's obvious enough that that still means made in China?

10:57Like from a legal perspective? Or even the meta, yeah. Sounds like we need the Eagle team. They did not pay me to say that. That would be an interesting deep dive. To quote Rick Ross, I don't have the answers. I usually got all the answers, but I don't have the answers. Is that the walnut of the almond? It's my favorite clip. Yes. Yep. I also heard that this watch is quite good. Yeah. I've heard good things. It has like seven day battery life. That's the main. I've heard the biggest upgrade from the watch two is the watch two had the rotating digital crown that didn't scroll. Now it's scrolling.

11:37They added scrolling. And also everyone apparently, I forgot about it, but the watch one was like. Horrible. Terrible. It was really bad. So yeah, people seem pretty impressed by this already. Yeah. The watch one was the one that just came with like all the built in fitness features, but that's basically all it could do. Yeah. And it was just bad. So it's good that they've made it quite a bit better. I will continue to use mine with the typo on it. Real quick, there are multiple laws requiring made in. So maybe that's why they ceased operations. Interesting. Turned out it mattered. Yeah, so thank you to French-speaking anonymous.

12:14Oh, yeah. Listener who wrote me an email. Do you want to write the email? I do not want to read the email because I was right. But he's French. No, no, no, no, no. I misspoke. And I can explain. I led our dear listeners down the wrong path because last week I implied that the French word tonneau translates into English as ton, which is not true. The French word for ton is, get this, ton. Yeah. What I was trying to say is that the English word tonneau is borrowed from the French word tonneau. And the French word, the modern French word tonneau is derived from an ancient or medieval French word, also called Old French word, that I have written in all my notes here to make sure I don't get it wrong this time.

13:10Oh, the Old French word is also tonne, like T-O-N-N-E, which is the same as the Old English tunne or the medieval Latin tuna. so all of these words are related because they all mean the cask the barrel thing right like they all used to mean barrel because you used to measure how many barrels could fit on a ship which is where we get the the idea of the ton but uh marquez unfortunately um we have to take your point away and andrews right wait wait no just marquez's just didn't they both get it shut up oh you also got it right i think so okay so there's that guy how do i ban this guy from way for him.

13:47I'm terribly sorry. This one is on me, but you guys have to suffer the punishment nonetheless. In the words of our listener, I will maintain my healthy five-point lead. I just want to say that I spent so much time researching medieval Latin only to misspeak in game time and blow it all. We've all been there. My apologies, country of France. You miss every shot you don't take, Ellis. Thank you. Alright, want to talk about some Sigma stuff? I want to talk about the Sigma the grind set the Sigma boyfriend yeah I have a I want to talk about the Sigma camera yeah let's do it sick okay Sigma announces BF camera this thing looks sick and I'm choosing my words wisely it looks sick it also looks like it feels great so if you get to look at the images can you describe it But yeah, you'll see that it looks, it is essentially a unibody aluminum, like mirrorless camera sized body, but with a full frame 35 millimeter sensor inside Sigma's lens mount on it.

14:53What's L mount? L mount, sorry. Which they have an alliance with. But also the buttons are all metal and the jog wheel is metal and textured and the front of the body of the camera is half knurled and half clean matte. It's so sick. there's a black one and a white one i just i want this to be a good camera so that i can use such a beautiful camera it looks incredible sigma is beautiful very well known for making really freaking weird cameras and lenses to be honest i've i've long appreciated sigma's uh sometimes ability sometimes persistence at making weird cameras they are the only ones that make a wide zoom like the 18 to 35 and the 24 to 35 that i use so shout out to them they also randomly i think approached me with like yeah we also have like a nine millimeter f1.8 so just crazy lenses yeah that um yeah i appreciate they're the only ones i make them you post on social that this is like the most apple camera that could possibly be totally okay i think more like johnny ive though you know for sure yeah johnny ive days apple would have made a camera like this if you told them to make a camera it for sure would have had no memory card slot only internal memory now look i i like internal memory the Hasselblad has internal memory but to also not have a card slot is an extra step that they didn't have to take yeah so this has like 230 gigs of built-in memory i mean with the this like unibody metal like aluminum putting a sd card slot in there would one take away from the design and two probably cost so much they have a they have a swappable battery like the battery oh so it could go in the so but it doesn't like close it's not like a door it just like pops out of it's like the so it becomes unibody it becomes flush with the body like the Hasselblad uh yes yeah just like the XT can't believe I'm gonna say this but I actually approve of this of not having a memory card so would you rather have had like external storage like larger storage option versions of the camera i think this is enough 230 gigs 230 gigs is like thousands of raw photos this camera shoots 6k yeah if you're doing video two and a half hours then you have a problem but i don't know if this is necessary like this people aren't using this to vlog you know it is also hevc video yeah it's like yeah yeah compressed and highly two and a half hours of video it says yeah you don't think that's enough your your longest a-rolls are like an hour yeah but that's a roll like if i'm running around then i already have 100 gigs of stuff and i haven't dumped it yet and i go out to another thing i want to shoot now i'm thinking like oh i haven't dumped the other stuff but i i don't want to shoot too much now because then i might not have enough for later like i actually have to think about it i have something that i need to disclose i have a one terabyte sd card that i've been using for about five years and i have never wiped this card so my point exactly look that's a terabyte that's four times as much as which is why i'm saying i don't like the hasselblad has a terabyte of built-in memory that's awesome flash storage is really cheap yeah they should have done 500 exactly agreed i will never say no to more but i think 256 is more than enough here that is my argument it's 230 230 okay more than enough because the os is on it that's why i feel like i don't know man for people that are content creators like you're going out and you're shooting multiple events i could see your your argument marquez yeah but this is for people who buy lycas and just go shooting on the weekends yeah i was talking to ls and har on the way in this is kind of like the affordable version of a leica because it the whole thing is about the experience the build quality the fact that it's a single piece of aluminum has no tilt screen you know the leica is the same way it's just a single lcd the thing that really kind of kills this for me is that there's no viewfinder and it's just the screen yeah the fact that it doesn't tilt it's an lcd i don't know how bright it gets so like out in the middle of the day might suck might suck it might it's 24 megapixels which i do approve of wait before we get too far Yeah.

19:16Can I just talk about the SD card thing? Oh, yeah. I feel like we've gotten so far. Sorry. I was talking to Vin about it, and I think we came down to the biggest issue with it is if something happens with your storage, now it's sending it in to get fixed versus if something happens with your SD card, you have a new SD card. It's so Apple. I think that's what makes me the most upset about it. Do you remember the flip cam? The thing that I never stopped talking about? The flip. Do you remember how you got the videos off that thing? Plugged it in. Yeah, it had the switchblade USB port. Yeah, that was epic.

19:48Sorry, dude. Go back. And no one ever complained about that? Yes, they did. Are you kidding? No, no, no. I can't hear you. I also think this thing has a sub-bezel on the screen. Yeah, it does. It's got a giant, it's a screen encased in the body, which is not flush, and then there's a sub-bezel. They try to hide it in the renders. I like the one corner. You can tell the other ones are dark enough. Yeah, I'm surprised they even show that. Yeah. You know, it's like okay here's the here's the thing about it so pretty it's called the sigma bf you might think that stands for boyfriend um no sigma bf stands for beautiful foolishness doesn't really yes it does so i love that that is they are basically admitting that this is a ridiculous camera but beautiful but it's beautiful damn sigma so it has like a lot of things about it that are like impractical but damn Sigma yeah is that really what it means it is really what it means yeah I believe it instantly it has two hour battery life it has a nice metal shutter button yeah I came in here the other day when it was announced saying that I was like super obsessed with this and wanted to buy it and then I thought about it and I think a lot of people are gonna go through the same process where you start to realize the important things that you need in a camera that this does not have yeah like i think a flip out screen is like yeah why does this not have that i need that that's not even a nice to have at this point that's like i need it's hard to shoot with and especially when you don't have a viewfinder it's just so even the leicas at least have an ovf yeah an optical view it feels like if apple made a camera like this they would make similar sets of concessions of things that seem like you have to have but then they would try to engineer their way out the other side of like it's the brightest screen ever in a camera or something like that we have a a18 chip so that you have zero latency between sensor feed and viewfinder camera like they would try to engineer their way out of it but they would totally be like yeah also there's no viewfinder yeah and you'd be like this camera it needs a viewfinder yeah so that's why i thought it looked like an apple camera also the ux looks kind of bad um sebastian DeWitt who makes Halide had mentioned that this is the reason he got into UX design in the first place and app design is because companies make like an absolutely beautiful piece of hardware and then the software is terrible just like cars so yeah we also didn't mention it has a status monitor right above the jog wheel which is basically a little micro LCD screen that shows you like aperture and stuff like that it looks cool I love that there's like a very small amount of buttons the lenses they now also make in silver um to make it work you know with the camera yeah i think it's going to be for people who like want something really pretty that is better than their phone it's two thousand dollars which is not unheard of yeah i looked at the bnh pre-order listing and saw two thousand dollars and i was like i think i expected higher yeah actually i thought i mean i've never shot with a sigma mirrorless camera so i feel like i was thinking about sony a7 type of range when i saw full frame yeah and two grand is not insane the other thing about this is that people were hoping that it would have a foveon sensor and what a foveon sensor is is a sensor that has uh all three color filters on each pixel so instead of having to do demosaicing where you like do this process to actually show the color every single pixel gets all the color so um it looks a lot better it's like sharper and it's like three yeah it would be much sharper they're much harder to make uh and they used to make them they stopped making them after a while but yeah but unfortunately it does not have a phobia on sensor so if that was a trivia question sorry it was not okay but i do want to say i and i every time i look at the bf i can't stop thinking about it like it the feature set is not that far off from my eos m like obviously this is a dramatically better camera but at the same time the eos time is 18 megapixel so i'm only missing six of them uh i don't have a full frame sensor i have an apsc sensor yeah but other than that same viewfinder status uh around the same size it's around the same amount of USM has expandable storage.

24:17Bingo. And get this, with Magic Lantern, I can shoot raw video on the USM. That's true. Checkmate Sigma. The Android of cameras. This is great. Who's the Sigma now? They are. On that note, we should take a quick break. But I do think we should also do trivia. The pause is back. The pause is back. Segway, yeah. All right. First question. In 2014, invites were given out through a promotion known as Smash the Past, in which 100 users would be selected to win an opportunity to purchase for$1 what smartphone. Marquez, that was almost awesome. Almost. I'll just write it now. Audio listeners, he tried to flip his marker into his hand.

25:05Don't say. I know. I can't say. That's the point. Wait, we're only naming the company? Company, phone, all of it. There was a in 2014. In 2014. that's a good the promotion was smash the past oh yeah i know this smash nice no nice no no no no well hey think about that we'll think about it too answers will be at the end like usual we'll be right back

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27:48All right, welcome back. I'm holding the iPhone 16e here in my hands. I've been using it for a little over a week now. Now that you're watching this, the review is out. I can't wait to watch other people's reviews because I assume they will also have some of the same thoughts as me. But in general, to summarize, iPhone 16e kind of replaces the iPhone SE, but not really. It's its own new segment. It's just not a budget phone anymore. The SE iPhones were in the$400 range. This is a$599 iPhone to start. This phone that I'm holding here that I'm testing has a storage upgrade. This phone costs$900.

28:32So I'm testing a$900 iPhone 16e. And I'm supposed to evaluate it in the landscape of other phones you could get for that money and the landscape of other iPhones you might be considering if you're upgrading from an older phone. and my conclusion my review if you've watched it you already know is i can't think of anyone who should start with this phone i think if you have 600 to spend and you have an old iphone right now there's a listing on walmart.com for a refurbished iphone 16 or iphone 15 pro everything about that phone is better than this phone and it's cheaper and it's the same price six hundred dollars wow brighter screen higher resolution higher refresh rate triple cameras similar battery life there's a whole bunch of things about that phone that are great apple intelligence apple intelligence exactly oh wait sorry that's a downgrade but here's the highlights of the 16e that i think are at least a little bit interesting one it is the a18 in the body of an iphone 14 basically so it brings at least the cheapest new iphone up to a modern size and shape and look.

29:34Two, the battery life is great. It has a physically larger battery than the iPhone 14 otherwise would have because three, they've introduced a new part called the C1 which combines 4G, 5G, satellite, and GPS, I think, all into one chip. Except for millimeter wave. No millimeter wave. So you don't get that. By the way, the 15 Pro does. But you get all of that in a new, smaller, more efficient chip that allows for even better battery life in this phone. And we expect to see, at least I expect to see that in future iPhones and other devices as well that have 4G, 5G satellite GPS. But that's debuting in this lower volume iPhone.

30:14And that's kind of it. It's an iPhone. It has an action button. It has a single camera on the back. Oh, this has a lot of parallels to the Pixel 8a because it came out when the Pixel A, Pixel 8 was already really, Pixel 9, God, I want to remember. There's so many Pixels. But it came out when the higher end base Pixel was already discounted and was basically the same price. And this smaller camera sensor, it's not that much worse, but it is a different look, kind of similar to the Pixel A. Yeah. And it's just, yeah, if you want a cheap, you know, new iPhone, this is that phone, but also it's not cheap.

30:56It's lighter. It is lighter. It is lighter than the Pro. If you value that, get this phone. There you go. You found the person. They also took out Wi-Fi 7 for some reason. Wi-Fi 6E and Wi-Fi 7 are not included. Which, whoever buys this won't care. No ultra wideband, no millimeter wave 5G. A lot of little things. No MagSafe is probably the biggest thing. I forgot about that part. Yeah. That's the worst part. So that's, there's like a bunch of little things that stack up on top of each other. Some of them, I honestly don't think are going to matter to this buyer yeah like wi-fi 7 they don't have a wi-fi 7 router so it's fine yeah um even the yeah the single less gpu core like that's not going to matter but yeah it's all the things that you could have cut out at 450 dollars and no one would have cared about yeah it's not all the things you can cut out 50 yeah so my exercise for you guys is what price is this phone a good deal because i think right now the phone itself is actually totally fine it's just a bad deal at what price does it actually make sense to buy this phone if you had to buy it outright a lot of people just get a carrier deal or whatever just walk in and go what phone am i gonna get for free with an upgrade and it doesn't even matter but if you were spending the dollars this is 599 what price does it make sense to buy this so the old se was 429 and before that was 399 yeah so it's already a massive jump yeah there's so many people sorry to cut off but like there's so many people who kept saying stop comparing it to the se this isn't the se yes it is it's the cheaper iphone that comes out at a totally different time than all the other why would it not be compared to this i don't know a lot of the s bro i don't know explain that okay they renamed it yes but effectively the iphone se was old we want to give you the cheapest new iphone available so what we're going to do is parts bin this thing we're going to give you an old iphone body with the new chip in it so that you can have a future-proof cheap phone for a while that's exactly exactly what this is this is the iphone 14 body this is the a18 this is the same formula i think it's the reincarnated se where we might potentially get them more often because now we're linking it to a number but i still think this is totally reasonable to compare to the se especially because of release date timing okay yeah uh the magsafe thing is a big thing for me yeah so pricing wise okay tariffs we talked about now they're going to be major tariffs whether or not that influenced apple changing the pricing of this last minute and how much it might have changed the pricing if this thing had come out at 549 how would you feel still be kind of tough for me i think they could do 499 feels right yeah yeah match it with the pixel a series right that's at$499 now it's a more competitive price segment yeah they had been cheaper than the a series in the past right how much was the pixel a series when the se was se 3 was they're all playing around for i mean the first the pixel 429 the pixel 4a was 349 at one point yeah so just saying yeah i don't know the thing about the united states well one of the things about the United States is that the price of things, the price of phones, like, does not matter in the United States.

34:13Because the difference between buying the SE at a carrier and doing a 24-month contract and buying the regular 16 at a carrier and doing a four-month contract is like$8 a month. Which is why you see that the most popular iPhone is the Pro Max. Yep. Because it's just a few extra dollars per month on your carrier deal and you're going to get a trade-in and it's just the way phones are here. Yeah. Yeah. So I would love to know how popular the old SE was for that reason. Maybe those buyers bought the phone outright because it was an amount of money that they felt okay just spending the money outright.

34:47But I don't think most people are going to feel okay spending$600 outright. So I feel like this is not going to sell very well. Yeah. I would say in the markets that people do buy phones outright and hardware is very competitive. for$600 you could get a phone with triple cameras 120 hertz display 5 ,000 million power battery fast charging wireless like there's going to be a ton of better specs oh yeah so the argument for the iPhone SE has always been well this is the cheap iPhone yeah you want an iPhone and so this is a cheap one so the cheap iPhone is just way more expensive now there just is no and in those markets everybody uses WhatsApp and people are not locked into the Apple ecosystem either so you can buy a nothing phone 2a or whatever 2a plus whatever it was called yeah for so for cheaper than this yeah so i think in hardware competitive markets this price this phone no reason to buy it no i just don't think there's a reason to buy it in any market yeah yeah i think that's where that's where it kind of landed with the review the opening for the review if you haven't seen it uh is a sketch where uh a world's most honest carrier employee has to talk to someone who wants the iphone 16a really bad awkward and tries to get it recommended awkward yeah i'm gonna end this with a compliment okay i love the back of this it's matte matte black ultra clean super clean first of all maybe i love it because i helped brandon with the robot shot of it it was way easier to clean than all those smudgy phones whenever we do it but matt single care this is just clean yeah it's like this is the de facto default iphone right here and they did a good with it yeah i called it super clean and boring ellis for some reason ellis does not like that thing what's wrong with this phone the back of this phone looks so i say earlier it looks like you it looks like an eye an iphone without eyebrows like it looks like an ipod it's complete no it's it's completely if if you ask like a four-year-old to like ham-fistedly draw an iphone that's what they draw it's not it's not it i also have another another thing the notch by now just looks really outdated i don't know i don't think it's that bad i think that the old iphone se because it had a home button it looked it was different enough that it didn't necessarily feel like super outdated and it was a different input mechanism but this is this is the same input mechanism but with a worse notch okay i feel almost the exact opposite wow i feel like now that i've used this phone and it's the same size as my 15 16 pro and everything like i don't notice the notch it feels the same as a dynamic island if it had the cool software bubbly features that'd be nice but it doesn't whatever but when i look back now at the three-year-old se with that huge forehead and a huge bezel at the bottom and the home button i'm like oh that's way worse i guess that's fair so it feels like we brought the iphone the cheapest iPhone into like the age of modern iPhones.

37:40I just really don't want to teach my mom how to use Face ID. Well, you'd have to with no matter what you do, you know, SC with a notch or with a dynamic island. Yeah, but with the home button she just uses her fingerprint. Yeah, the home button was easy for the most people. Yeah. Well, there's no more home button on anything anymore, so. Pour one out. Yeah, rip home button. Okay, I want to end this with a question. There are several reasons why this phone may have been more expensive, right? r &d on the c1 chip tariffs overall strategy whatever do we think that the iphone 17 lineup at the end of this year is also going to get a price hike in some way yes because i am starting to feel like we should brace for that definitely the other thing about that is that if there's a price hike and there's also the slim which was rumored to be and that's actually in there expensive and that's got to fit in there and then if this if there's an e for the 17 as well there's going to be too many iphones next year so i don't think they're going to drop the e in september i think they'll keep this same release date so that means in september they're going to adjust the iphone lineup you know every year they drop some out and add some new ones in so in september it's going to be 16 e at 599 17 which i guess might start at 899 which seems insane they i there's also rumors they're gonna bring promotion to the base iphones but probably 899 999 1099 1199 or 1199 1299 1299 for a base 17 pro max is it's a lot but i feel like they could do that this year and then fitting the slim iphone somewhere in there maybe it's in between the E and the base or above all of them?

39:32Maybe. I still think if there is slim iPhone, it takes the place of 17 Max. Oh, you don't think they're adding to it? You think they're replacing the Max? I think there'll still be two base non-pros. Oh, the plus. The plus. Sorry, sorry. So you think 17 and 17 Air instead of 17 and 17 Plus. I think that's right. I think that'd be my guess in there. because i just think five iphones is too much yeah it's um and then i do think 17e if it comes out would come out later although i do think it should come out at the same time possibly but yeah confusing wait so but this price increase on everything do you think we're gonna have a similar purse because this increase from the se3 was 2022 it came out at 429 i looked up pixel 6a was$450 then.

40:23So it was cheaper than 6A. Now it is$100 more expensive than the Pixel A series. Well, we'll wait to see what happens the next couple months when the Pixel 5A comes out. What if that's more expensive too? Pixel 9A, right? Thank you. They did increase the price on the Pixel 9 as well. Remember. Pixel 7 and 8 were super... This feels like the opposite of was it Pixel 6? where like the 6 versus 6 Pro, the 6 was such a good deal. It was a$300 Delta. Yeah, this feels like the cheap one is such a bad deal. It's dumb not to do the extra$100 to the next one. Yeah, 100%. Damn, max safe. Do you think there are...

41:04Because ET News reported that it seems like Apple is about to finalize their part suppliers for their hypothetical passport fold. Do you think they're making room for the 18? No, not that one too. Who? ET News? Entertainment television? Entertainment Tonight? It's a Korean electronics industry. So you're saying you think their foldable might come out next year? The word on the street is that, yeah, 2026 is... Bro, if the 16E costs$600, what is the fold going to cost? $2 ,000. It's going to be more expensive than every fold we have now. And all the folds we have are$1 ,800. Yeah. Unless it's a flip.

41:45It could be$19.99. I think it's supposed to be a flip. it's going to be a flip right wait passport well flip is first but this rumor he's talking about is from the passport one that's rumored to come out after that got it can confirm mark german co-signed this this report okay so final final guess uh currently iphone 16 lineup is 799 899 999 1199 do we think iphone 17 goes up by a hundred bucks a hundred dollars so that makes So the base iPhone 17,$899. Yeah. Then$999. Then$1099 and$1299. Or they just say hell with it. And remember when the iPhone X was$999? It was like one of the first$1 ,000 phones.