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11:53David Imel:But file structure, no one knows. Listen, if you want your computer to go faster, find system 32 delete that and you're gonna fly

12:00Marques Brownlee:it is funny actually you know how the boomers will be like do you kids even know what a floppy disk is I feel like the newer version of that is do kids know what a file folder is have they ever seen a physical file folder

12:13David Imel:well no one's ever seen a physical file folder

12:15Marques Brownlee:like the manila

12:17David Imel:oh like a manila folder you are talking physical folder oh damn yeah probably not

12:23Marques Brownlee:I mean, yeah, at my first ever job, I had to like a filing cabinet, like a filing cabinet.

12:28Andrew Edwards:Kids probably have never seen files. I had a moment like that recently because I was thinking about how like in our parents generation, like inbox and outboxes were a thing. Like you would literally have two boxes on your desk. Remember, there was an inbox and an outbox. And it occurred to me that those sit on your desktop. And I was like, that's what the file structure. the folders sit on the desktop just like and that's when I realized that every desk I've ever owned my whole life had a computer on it yeah and on your desktop

13:00Marques Brownlee:it's like your desktop is your home you know and everything sits on top of your desktop

13:06Andrew Edwards:and then also like it makes sense how like the original conception of the desktop was things would only live there temporarily before you'd move it into your documents

13:14David Imel:folder yeah until they realize we're all hoarders and desktops are disgusting

13:17Andrew Edwards:all the older people watching this right now are like

13:20Marques Brownlee:god damn these people

13:21Andrew Edwards:and we're like in our 30s bro I know I know it's like not good but it's interesting the thing you brought up earlier proof that I'm actually Gen Z is I learned my first scripts and like how to use terminal and stuff from Minecraft perfect nice that's incredible

13:39Marques Brownlee:cool well uh speaking of computers old computers Apple did finally officially wait until right after we recorded the podcast last week to kill the Mac Pro. It was like the day after.

13:51David Imel:I've never been more sure that they waited until Thursday afternoon. Who else would care this much? No one. Yeah. Only Thursday afternoon. Yeah, afternoon. The afternoon part is how I know because then we couldn't even do a breaking. Yeah.

14:06Marques Brownlee:So they, you know, they kept it on the site for a while. It was always available, but it hasn't gotten updates since the M2 generation, M2 Ultra Mac Pro. I've had it on my desk. I talked about it in the desk tour that I did, which is like, This product is effectively end of life, but not officially dead yet. Last week, they officially removed it from the Apple store, removed it from their website, and now they've confirmed, I think from a statement somewhere, I don't remember.

14:33David Imel:9to5Mac. 9to5.

14:34Marques Brownlee:I think reached out. Yeah, they said they're not going to update it anymore. Yeah, it felt like they only made that product because people had been begging for it for so long, and it just was very useless. No, okay, Andrew's giving you this look like the Mac Pro. Do you remember us cheering? Like everyone looked at you in the audience.

14:50David Imel:I remember that.

14:51Marques Brownlee:I remember being at, it was probably Dub Dub and they said new Mac Pro and I felt everyone turn around. Yeah, yeah. You know, the Mac Pro, the idea of the Mac Pro is it's basically just a bigger enclosure with more cooling and PCI expansion. And all Apple missed on was really facilitating this ecosystem of PCI expansion accessories. There's a couple. I had an OWC SSD. I have that still on my Mac Pro. There's some networking cards. There's still some GPUs that are potentially useful for very specific applications like decoding video, but it really never materialized as like a really vibrant ecosystem because Thunderbolt's good.

15:31Marques Brownlee:And you can just plug in basically anything you need via Thunderbolt in a Mac Studio and get effectively the same thing. PCI is still faster, but Thunderbolt's really, really fast now. so the market for people who can't get it done with thunderbolt but can with the mac pro yeah was about three people i'm not even one of those people i could just be using thunderbolt uh but yeah the mac pro i'm sure nobody bought that thing for a couple years and yeah it finally was officially uh deceased it's funny because they made the version that had the feet and then they made the version that was supposed to go in like server centers the rack yeah rack version and it was like did anybody buy that for server centers?

16:11Marques Brownlee:I just don't think.

16:12Andrew Edwards:I know one person who had a rack mounted Mac Pro. Did they just buy it for personal use though? And they just

16:17Marques Brownlee:happened to buy the rack mounted version?

16:19Andrew Edwards:They did buy it for personal use. They bought it as a touring computer for lighting and video stuff for like pro arena shows. And it was just way more convenient to have it rack mounted because then you could put it directly in a flight case and get to a venue.

16:34David Imel:Do you know what's more convenient? A Mac

16:35Andrew Edwards:studio now yeah i was gonna say did they do you know if this person used pci cards yeah yeah they did because when you're doing like really complex video output stuff um you need like a like what's called like a deck link from black magic is like an example of like a really intense video io that

16:52Marques Brownlee:yeah yeah you guys know i don't even know what you're talking about it was just it was a it was a confusing product the second it switched to apple silicon because then now it was like all this unified memory no more expandable ram and gpu support was effectively nothing but they still have PCI slots so you could still do some very specialized stuff and it was like I mean don't you have like 18 terabytes of SSD storage I have a 64 terabyte PCIe SSD and I speed test it to this day like I have equivalent Thunderbolt 5 version of the same thing and it gets three times the speed from the PCI SSD but three times and also very fast speed is still like it was 9000 versus 3500 so it was like I should have been using a Mac studio all these years ago but i'm i was stubborn i didn't buy a new one i think when they make that hopefully soon make the m5 ultra seems like what they're gonna do i've heard yeah it's coming soon that i think is what i will finally upgrade to yeah yeah yeah and i'll just have a thunderbolt

17:48David Imel:drive just thunderbolt yeah you i mean you almost uh why can't i think of the word uh manifested this because like within the month before you just kept going like i don't think i need this anymore I think I could just use the studio with this and the new studio monitors and blah, blah, blah. And then Apple was like, finally, he said it. Get rid of it.

18:08Marques Brownlee:I did the studio display review. I said studio is the new pro because that couldn't have been any more clear. They literally came out with the new studio display XDR and discontinued the pro display in the same announcement. And it was like, oh, no more pro because studio is good enough. And here's a new thing. And then the Mac Pro sitting over there kind of shaking like, yeah, yeah, that's true. so we know Mac Studio is already more than enough for all of the pros who are using Macs for all these things there's a couple who are still using pro displays, there's a couple who are still using Mac Pros, they'll still use those things but it's like Studio is where it's at

18:46David Imel:Kudos to the 9 to 5 Mac people who made their banner image a Mac Pro upside down with it's little feet up and just looks like a piece of roadkill which is so funny I also have a quick question for all of you Sure. For funsies, I put Marques' maxed out M2 Ultra Mac Pro in the trade-in program for Apple. What do you think you would get back?

19:07Marques Brownlee:How much did you buy it for? It was over 10 racks. Are we doing closest without going over? Which is not bad considering the Intel ones. It started at 7 ,000. Yeah, the Intel ones were like 50 ,000. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was maxed out. It had 8 terabytes of storage and it had 192 gigs of unified memory. I think I spent 13 on it or something. I don't think Apple's going to give me very much. I think they would give me less than$5 ,000. Probably$3 ,000. Probably less. I guess. Because remember the$50 ,000 one I tried to trade in and it was like$1 ,000.

19:39David Imel:I thought those were$500 to all recycle it for you. I think it was$1 ,000.

19:45Marques Brownlee:Was that because Apple Silicon had come out and so the Intel ones were like useless? Just melted down for metal? Yeah, basically. Yes. For scraps.

19:53Andrew Edwards:I think they're going to give you$280. That would be insulting.

19:59Marques Brownlee:That's less than an iPhone. That's how much it takes to ship it.

20:02David Imel:I think they will recycle it for you. I'm going to say a G. I think Marquez is the closest. It is$2 ,665. That's not bad. I almost wonder if the trading program got the memo that these got discontinued yet. But I think that price will go down very fast now.

20:21Marques Brownlee:Which is an M2 Ultra Max Studio.

20:24David Imel:But that means in three years, right? 2023 is when you bought this so i'm like uh yeah something like that it's a fifth of the value

20:34Marques Brownlee:yeah you can get a fully loaded crazy m4 max max studio for that price it's still a crazy computer yes it's a really good computer how much does this how much does it cost on ebay the thing is just how good apple silicon keeps getting remember i benchmarked them m5 max macbook pro 16 inch and it's the fastest single threaded Mac CPU core ever. And it's like most of the stuff you do, that's the thing, like most of the stuff I do on a Mac most of the time is not editing. It's like all the regular stuff, it's writing, it's the, you know, whether it's thumbnails or like all the everyday web browsing stuff, emails that I do.

21:12Marques Brownlee:And then 5 % of the time, it's really, really heavy video editing. So all the sacrifices that I made in daily usability to go into video editing, it's like those probably should just be two different computers yeah um and so now yeah it's just the new stuff is good at both these vary a lot for your spec they've sold on ebay for as little as twenty five hundred dollars and as high as seventy eight hundred dollars i you know it's funny to complain about how little apple would give me for it but how much would i pay for that computer now you couldn't you wouldn't i would never buy it now why yeah because you could get a way better computer for the yeah i guess the ram is in the because i don't need the pci expansion in the next studio yeah yeah damn that's crazy see you see you later i'm sure there's someone

21:56David Imel:somewhere that has like a couple of these doing some very niche business stuff that would just

22:02Marques Brownlee:go buy this yeah yeah i was hoping i think secretly hoping for like a really sick video card that would like decode red code burner like an afterburner card yeah and that just never happened

22:13Andrew Edwards:also like as much as i'm you know i love these big 16 inch macbook pros they're not like thermally perfect you know what i mean like you do benefit from having the yeah the big the big what do you call it case yeah my studio or i was gonna say the mac pro like even though you're not gonna get a chip set that's like you know you probably still get better speeds on a thermally throttled 16 inch m5 max but i don't know there's something nice about knowing your cool i i would

22:43Marques Brownlee:say the best case scenario for abisilicon today was if they put the highest end chip in the mac pro and just let us cool the crap out of it and do whatever we want. But that's another story. RIP Mac Pro.

22:56David Imel:So if you're still here watching this with us, then you probably like tech, so you should subscribe if you're hanging around here on whatever podcast platform of choice. Anyway, this has been a crazy week for kind of like software development. There was like an Axios NPM hack earlier this week. Then Axiom, Axiom, thank you. We were just reading Axios. we were just reading axios that's uh there was an npm thing uh whatever we're not the place for that what we are the place for is to laugh at the fact that anthropic accidentally leaked their own claude code code to the internet and it is now freely floating around twitter but fair warning be careful if you go looking for this code because if you get caught with it on your computer or if you're sharing it or whatever there's like legal terms of service things where you could be sued by Anthropic which uh we just found pretty ironic it's hilarious you stole our stuff

23:56Andrew Edwards:and we stole all the other stuff yeah wait wait we steal not you guys yeah hey it's like no no it's not theft if all you do is train a model on it but also don't train your models on our code yeah yeah by the way love Claude pay for it happy with my 20 a month leaving my bank account but But still, joke's on you, buddy. This is dumb.

24:16David Imel:I will never feel bad for an AI company getting anything stolen from them. Sorry. They have all stolen everything. And they're just like, people do that. They had it coming. Yeah. All this stuff is ongoing. So by the time you're listening to this, there's probably been way more developments. But just be aware. Yeah.

24:32Andrew Edwards:But there's some interesting stuff aside from getting to laugh and do the little jester dance. There's some interesting stuff in the leak. for example um they were planning this like thing called buddy which was like a seemed like a tamagotchi style interface for claude and there were these goofy do you know what a distillation attack is yeah nope so a distillation attack you take like a pipsqueak ai and then you take a big chat ai and then you take the pipsqueak ai just prompts the chat ai over and over and over again like learns from it yeah and like pays attention to like how it's doing its reasoning and then it trains itself on the kind of reasoning that the chat AI is doing.

25:08Andrew Edwards:And it's a way you could make something weak, like a 13 million parameter QN learn from something like Claude Opus 4.6. And there were these goofy anti-distillation measures in there that would create fake API calls so that it would poison the training data for these distillation attacks. Nice. There's a lot. I'm anthropic. I'm sorry this happened, but also...

25:38Marques Brownlee:Well, moving on to the biggest news of the week, possibly the year, possibly the entire decade. Did you guys create your email accounts in like 2003? Yes. Yes. Long time ago. Gmail.

25:48David Imel:Well, that's the problem. It wasn't Gmail. All my cringe emails are on... AOL.com. AOL, Yahoo, Hotmail.

25:55Marques Brownlee:You're not still using them, right? No. Yeah, okay. Well, Google has just announced that they are allowing you to change your email address. Yes, this is a big deal because I have five email addresses. Oh, boy. Yes, big deal. So now you're able to change your account username once every 12 months on your Google account. Your previous address will still be saved as an alternate email address and can still be used to sign into your account if you want. And you can switch back to your alternate at any time. So if you have like memelord72 at gmail.com,

26:30David Imel:you can now become now you can be meme lord six seven that's right see i thought i thought this in along those lines where i have a professional email account because i had the foresight when i was a young high school student to just like use my name well i want to change it now yeah i know i'm a nerd i want to change it to meme lord six seven yeah that's true so does this work where

26:51Marques Brownlee:like you kind of have like a trail now of usernames and all of them still work like you've had your old username then you change it to the new username yeah but you still get emails if people email the old username yeah and then a year later you change it again you still get both old i don't know how that would work okay google will kill this program before what year goes by so it doesn't

27:14David Imel:matter i'm not sure how that would work but it just uses email alias so i would assume it would

27:18Marques Brownlee:work it's like mail forwarding pretty much start my land grab of all the best email addresses just keep going. But you could do that already by just creating new Google accounts. Yeah, but then I have to log into each one of them. Yeah, true. I'm so excited.

27:30David Imel:My two questions are, one, aren't most of the reasons we have bad email addresses is because the one we wanted was taken already? So, like, by the time I try and change it to just andrewmanganelli at gmail.com, that's probably been taken for 10 years. Have you tried? I haven't. I'll try.

27:46Marques Brownlee:I saw a lot of people online getting the ones that they thought were taken before but were no longer taken.

27:51David Imel:To be fair, they've probably at this point purged a lot of inactive accounts. I know Yahoo did that a while ago. They just purged a ton of accounts that weren't used for X amount of time. So maybe. My dream is to just get at Adam everywhere. Because yes, it is my actual name, but it is also such a common name that it is completely anonymous. Bro, that ain't even gonna happen in your dreams? Every time the new social media app comes up and I rush in early beta to get at Adam, there's already someone I guess internally at the company named Adam.

28:19Marques Brownlee:Adam is literally the first guy.

28:21David Imel:It's the first letter of the alphabet. Oh, yeah. Sorry, bro. Did you get it on T2? I did not get it on T2. It was like Adam348 or something. You couldn't get Adam, but Ellis got dad.

28:36Marques Brownlee:Dad is just God. So I guess he was first. He was before Adam.

28:39David Imel:My other question on this is, there's so many websites that use email as the username for login. So I'm assuming the old ones still work. work yeah okay this is going to break something along that for sure line somewhere almost definitely and it's going to cause major frustration i was thinking because i you know my original email

28:58Marques Brownlee:address that i ever made which is so cringe it is my login for everything because i was gonna just

29:04Andrew Edwards:bully you into saying it but maybe you shouldn't yeah no don't i will not say andrew your last name is two l's right yes okay you have like 30 seconds to get andrew magganelli at gmail.com wait it is available right now yeah I'm claiming it

29:21David Imel:is that real how can I do this okay I'll show you how to do it so go to your gmail wait not live on the pod

29:28Andrew Edwards:please I mean I do literally have it it actually says it's available but I'm not actually going to claim it but you should claim it before this episode before it yeah

29:39David Imel:I'll do it later

29:41Marques Brownlee:my full name was taken by a famous marine biologist wait you use it for logging into everything I don't remember what I was going to say. I totally lost my train of thought. Oh, okay. Speaking of losing the train of thought, nothing is going to make glasses? What?

29:57David Imel:This is a rumor. Famous nothing leaker Mark Gurman wrote an article about nothing potentially working on smart glasses for 2027. More like losing the train of plot, am I right?

30:08Marques Brownlee:Yeah, everybody is working on glasses, allegedly.

30:12David Imel:Hey, I'll go real quick into this. there's not a ton of information. They apparently will have built-in cameras, microphones, and speakers. No display. AI features would be offloaded to your smartphone in the cloud. Essentially, meta Ray-Bans. Yeah, but not meta, so there's that.

30:26Andrew Edwards:Yeah, like, I'm not gonna lie. They don't need glasses, okay? I mean, they don't need cameras because I prompt an AI once every two days minimum, okay? I'm a heavy AI user. Never once have I given it a prompt that required a photograph. Sure, sometimes I take screenshots, and include that in my prompt. You've never uploaded a photo? Never. I've uploaded screenshots. I've uploaded screenshots of my computer screen, but never once have I ever needed an AI that the input needed a photo. And I'm sorry, the only reason these stupid glasses have cameras is because they know they're going to sell all the data they illegally scraped.

31:02Andrew Edwards:While that is true, I think it might only be you

31:05Marques Brownlee:that has never uploaded a photo to one of these.

31:07David Imel:Also, guys, you can just take pictures and videos without AI needing to send it to AI. I want these because there's so many times.

31:15Andrew Edwards:Your glasses, you can do it with your phone.

31:17David Imel:Not if I'm holding Wayne with two hands.

31:19Marques Brownlee:Yeah, so there's a lot of. I will remind you that the number one use case of the Meta Ray-Bans for most people is first person hands free video. It's a thousand percent what most people buy those glasses for. Yeah, they probably don't use the AI most of the time. There is like always going to be the argument of I can do this with my phone because most stuff that these tiny computers can do. you have a computer in your pocket that can do all of that already but there's this race for like putting the thing on your face because kind of like ai a lot of them believe that this is the next frontier of computing or whatever and if the smartphone's gonna die and it's gonna be glasses next well i better get in now so they're all they're all trying it they're all getting in something on the ground floor to have a first-gen glasses product in the next year uh what will nothing's advantage be seems like they're gonna i mean they do design so they're gonna probably have some fun with design.

32:08Marques Brownlee:Do you think Google will announce the Gemini glasses at IO this year? Like officially? I think that would feel about right. Cause we've heard about this, like being worked on for a while and we've seen it. They had demos at IO last year. I think they're very useful. I think the, the feature that I got the most of a kick out of was like coming out of the subway or coming off of like getting out of a taxi and having maps navigation, like look through the camera and figure out where you're oriented and put an arrow where you're supposed to be going right away that's super useful and i feel like the google ones like google glass did this in 2012 well google glass would not oriented on the display in front of me it would show me like what street i should be looking for and then i'd look for the street sign not that that's that difficult but it's just the magic of i pop out and it's like go this way yeah pretty sweet yeah so like they're gonna all try to come up with their own killer features and their own reasons for why you should buy their version.

33:00Marques Brownlee:Am I shocked that nothing's making this? No. They also are the same ones that were like, we don't have to have a flagship phone every year just because everyone's doing it. But they got to make glasses though. Yeah. Carl Paye is also a big, big AI guy.

33:14David Imel:Yeah, but I genuinely believe that if they release these glasses without any internet connection and just the ability to record with glasses, they will sell just as many. I agree with that. I am essentially excited for these because one, I think nothing does make cool looking products. I think these might look pretty cool. I think these are going to be cheaper because it's nothing, which is like then I wouldn't feel bad paying that money because I would just be wearing them as sunglasses. I don't feel like wearing fake lenses and fake glasses like indoors for everything. So I would just buy these as sunglasses.

33:48David Imel:And honestly, the AI is probably going to suck because it's nothing. So I don't care. I just want to take some videos with Lane sometimes, like first person videos where I can use both my hands. And like this will probably be cheaper. And also, I'll still give Nothing a ton of credit for this. Both their new phones has a red recording light on it. So hopefully these glasses will have an actual real recording light so people can tell when you're recording on glasses. It would be so funny and it wouldn't also not surprise me.

34:17Marques Brownlee:We're like, I think appropriately assigning a lot of the attributes of Nothing's current phones to what we think these glasses will have. And like the headphones too. Did you like the headphone design? I'm trying to remember. So I, no, I like the earbud design. The earbud design. I like the headphone design. So like - It's fine. Most people with glasses on your face, I'm guessing here, but they kind of want them to sort of fade away and just like look like glasses and not draw too much attention. No, I want glyphs. I'm not. I was like, because there's other people who would like, you could get the transparent glasses, you can have the computer showing and the lights and all this other crazy stuff.

34:49Marques Brownlee:Those are the best Meta Ray-Bans. The clear ones were the best looking Meta Ray-Bans.

34:53David Imel:They were the most hyped. I think they were the coolest ones.

34:55Marques Brownlee:Look, what I was just about to say is all you people that bought those limited edition clear ones, I know you think they look cool. They really don't. Oh, they're sick. They look so darky. It depends on where you are. It's very specific to where you are. If you are walking around a place where lots of other people have meta Ray-Bans, then it's cool to have the one that looks a little different. Sure, on Meta's campus. On Meta's campus mostly is where I was like experiencing this. but if you're just kind of like out around in a normal place you're having the computer on your glasses look computer on your face look is not as uh appreciated sometimes it was like the same thing with google glass like google glass when i was testing them as a student in in car in hoboken new jersey i remember walking around like hoboken wearing google glass yeah feeling unbelievably self-conscious because like i i feel everyone looking at me i'm wearing a computer on my face but like you guys don't know like i got the directions up here like i got the notifications up here it's like the meme of the guy in the corner of the party they don't know i have a computer on my face yeah it was such an isolating like weirdly anti-social thing that's what i'm looking for but now this is going to be the thing where like if glasses blow up and everyone has glasses then the design actually becomes a part of like why you might pick one over the other

36:10David Imel:if i'm just always well no i'll look like a creep if it's just always recording but if you're recording no one's gonna want to come up and talk to me the design is very important that's why

36:18Marques Brownlee:google is partnering with like gentle monster you know like meta did rayman because it's gonna be the you know the it's gonna be the car phone collab of of the glasses world yeah and i mean you you're putting a computer on their face like you need it i think everyone has to partner with some existing like we make glasses people want to buy company because i just like google google learned from this from glass already. They had a compelling product that was not only 15 years too early, but nobody wants to wear an obvious computer on your face. Yeah. So if you just have it in glasses and it just looks like regular glasses, you're already at the peak of what people want.

36:55Marques Brownlee:Yeah. So we'll see some of that.

36:57David Imel:Dibs on review unit.

36:59Marques Brownlee:Maybe I shouldn't put it. Should I get it? They're clear, I don't know. Yeah, IO is what, June? It's June. No, I'm sorry. It's May 17th. i'm expecting android gemini and ai glasses it's mostly just ai yeah yeah but i mean they showed off the glasses early last year at io so i feel like they gotta be ready to launch them right um not necessarily i mean sometimes they just show stuff off i mean meta's like eating everybody's right now yeah they're like three years ahead of everybody else it was funny meta showed off the stuff they were working on, and then suddenly it was, you could buy it, which was crazy.

37:38Marques Brownlee:Yeah. So, we'll see. All right. Speaking of Google, quick thing, we did see some Pixel 11 leak renders start to pop out, and shocker, a lot of similarities to the Pixel 10. Like, a lot. No way. Matter of fact, I saw it on my timeline, and I thought, oh, another Pixel 10. That's what it looks like. Same color. I honestly just saw thinner bezels and more RAM. That's all I saw as expected new things.

38:07David Imel:What I saw, so it's from OnLeaks, the CAD drawings that are then rendered. It does seem like maybe thinner bezels. It also will be 0.1 millimeter thinner than the Pixel 10, but don't get too excited because the Pixel 9 was already 0.1 millimeter. This is the same dimension as the Pixel 9, just Pixel 10 had to maybe be a little thicker because of the magnets.

38:27Marques Brownlee:0.1 millimeters.

38:28David Imel:some of this stuff and this is really early and not confirmed but I'm still seeing people say this is going to be 128 gigabyte base storage and Google I promise you if it comes out 128 gig base storage same price I will do everything in my power to convince Marquez to give this bust of the year because it deserves it I tried real hard last time but 16E came out I will lose my shit

38:55Marques Brownlee:if this is the same Because I'm again assigning what would happen in the past to the future. I think if Tensor G6 is again underwhelming and not much of a big improvement from G5, and it's the same price and it's the same cameras and it's the same design, same dimensions, same features and same battery and same 128 gigs of storage, I think that takes the front for bust of the year so far. Like what worst deal has come out so far this year? Something worse will happen, I guarantee you. I'm pretty sure it's only April. It's like we got plenty of time. We have a lot of time. But that would be incredibly disappointing, I would say.

39:31Marques Brownlee:I will say, and this is just on the renders, so nobody really knows, but people are saying that it doesn't seem like there's a thermometer sensor on it anymore.

39:39David Imel:Oh, no.

39:41Marques Brownlee:So, you know, if you were cooking your meat with your Pixel, then RIP to you, because you can't do that anymore. Yeah. I'm surprised it's not already gone.

39:51David Imel:It's crazy. I don't want to go. I don't know if it's actually going to be 128 gig base, but if it is... We'll see. We'll give them a chance. We'll give them a chance. If Apple is really the budget, not budget, not budget, I did not say budget, price conscious big player in the US in 2026, we've lost the plot.

40:10Marques Brownlee:Hey, watch SE, 17, Neo, iPad, base. Even just base 17 was great. Base 17, yeah, true.

40:19David Imel:Andrew, Apple shell over here. That's crazy.

40:22Marques Brownlee:Well, you know what's the opposite of changing a lot every time? You know what's super consistent? The thing we do every single time. Trivia. It's consistent that we always get it wrong. Yes. We got to do an extravaganza soon, by the way. Soon. Soon.

40:37Andrew Edwards:We had our conversation about extravaganza yesterday. It's exciting. But we probably won't see an extravaganza until June. That's when I think it makes the most sense. So you'll have many more weeks to stock up on points.

40:52Marques Brownlee:That's what Straley Manifesto told me. And then it didn't happen until a year later. I'm going to start studying.

40:56Andrew Edwards:There will be another trivia extravaganza in 2026.

41:00David Imel:It will return in Avengers. Yeah.

41:02Andrew Edwards:But we are reaching the point where it's getting really hard to come up with extravaganza questions because we've done a few too many of them. No. But guys.

41:13Marques Brownlee:Yes.

41:14Andrew Edwards:We just talked about yet another pixel leak. seems like pixels leak more than my faucet i i was gonna say i don't know anything that's notorious for leaking other than pixels frank um sitting right in front of me but but but there was an iphone that didn't just leak leaked so badly that gizmodo was able to do a full tear down because they found it left at a bar. Yeah, we know this. Which iPhone was it? Simple.

41:52Marques Brownlee:I remember this. Simple questions deserve simple points. There are so many other stories that spiraled out of this story. This is like an all-time tech story. Steve Jobs called this man. Like, we're never gonna get another leak story like this one. I don't think so. I think that's the penultimate. Yeah. This is what everyone who does leaks now dreams of.

42:14Andrew Edwards:The engineer that leaked that phone, he vanished. It's sort of just like a...

42:22David Imel:Also, I don't even know if leakers dream of it, because didn't they sue the hell out of the guy who took it from the bar? A lot, yeah.

42:28Marques Brownlee:They definitely sued him because it was stolen property. The police got involved. There's a whole thing. The most of you who know the story already know which phone it was. If you don't, you're going to find out. I don't know what phone it was. You'll find out by the end of this episode, baby. Maybe it's at the end like usual. We'll be right back.

42:54Marques Brownlee:Support for the show comes from Framer. So you create a website so your business can thrive, but things don't always work out as planned. Suddenly, you start to struggle making small changes or simple updates to your site, leaving customers in the dark. So if updates to your.com feel harder than they should, Framer can be the shortcut you've been waiting for. Framer is an enterprise-grade, no-code website builder used by teams at companies like Perplexity and Miro to move faster. With real-time collaboration and a robust CMS with everything you need for great SEO, not to mention advanced analytics that include integrated A-B testing, your designers and marketers are empowered to build and maximizer.com from day one.

43:31Marques Brownlee:So whether you want to launch a new site, test a few landing pages, or migrate your full.com, Framer has programs for startups, scale-ups, and large enterprises to make going from idea to live site as easy and fast as possible. Learn how to get more out of your.com from a Framer specialist or get started building for free today at Framer.com slash wave for 30 % off a Framer Pro annual plan. That's Framer.com slash wave for 30 % off. Framer.com slash wave. Rules and restrictions may apply. Support for the show comes from Shopify. Every thriving, successful business has to start somewhere. A good place to start is the relatively simple question, what if, given the right tools, I really put my all into this?

44:11Marques Brownlee:One tool that can grow your sprouting business to new heights is Shopify. Millions of businesses around the world rely on Shopify for e-commerce from businesses just getting started or your favorite brand names. They offer a host of helpful tools you can take advantage of, from payment processing to analytics to website design. Their design studio includes hundreds of templates to help you create the exact website you've been envisioning for your business. And their email and marketing tools make it easy to get your name out there and stay connected with your customers. So if you're thinking, what if I need help?

44:39Marques Brownlee:Then no worries, because you're never left to fend for yourself. Shopify's award-winning customer support is available 24-7. So it's time to turn those what-ifs into with Shopify today. Sign up for your$1 per month trial at shopify.com slash waveform. Go to shopify.com slash waveform. That's shopify.com slash waveform. on. All right, welcome back. We've got to settle something here. Last week on the pod, I mentioned, and it may or may not have been the title, that Flighty was a top five app of all time. Unreliably useful, super good. If you use it, you know. And it turned out to be kind of a hot take.

45:16Marques Brownlee:There's a lot of people who like a lot of other apps. I decided it'd be fun if we all, actually Andrew decided this, if we all brought our top five apps to the table. It's kind of calling a bluff. I want to see if you're really going to put it in your top five apps when we make you list your top Yeah, I actually thought about it now for a while. I went through both my iPhone and my Android phone, and I really thought about this, and I've got my top five apps and my honorable mentions. If it's not in the top five, Flight is going to be really sad. Because they tweeted about it last week. Really good point.

45:46Marques Brownlee:I can start it off if you want.

45:48David Imel:Yeah, we all, I asked everyone to do this, so that's what we're going to do. I'm all one. We're all going to do our top five.

45:52Andrew Edwards:So there's one question I had about this, because you specified mobile apps, not desktop apps. Right. Does that include tablet apps? Sure. Yes? Because that alters my list.

46:05David Imel:My question on desktop apps is, is that not just software? It is.

46:10Marques Brownlee:I guess it's just like, but there's so many web apps and top five progressive web apps of all time. I also think there's not that many good apps. The spirit of it in my eyes was really good.

46:22David Imel:Okay, then I'm going to do only phone.

46:24Andrew Edwards:So no staff app, no Procreate. Yeah.

46:27David Imel:Okay. Yeah. Let's go just mobile phone.

46:29Marques Brownlee:Okay. Top five mobile phone apps. I have my top five. I'm going to give my honorable mentions first. That just barely missed my top five. Co-pilot finance app. There's a lot of apps like it. Not Microsoft Co-pilot. Damn it. There's a lot of apps like it, but it's just the best one. What is it? It helps you. You log into your accounts, your bank accounts. You can see all of your transactions and sort through things, budget through things, keep an eye on it. there's lots of apps like it but this is one of the best ones in my opinion it's the best subscription uh i think there's a subscription tier i don't want to come in let me see uh there is a subscription

47:06Andrew Edwards:tier i pay for it it's um is it worth it it's nine dollars it was worth it nine dollars mine broke recently and i've been going back and forth with their support for about three months trying to get it fixed and they just sort of were like yeah it doesn't work and i was just sort of like neither does my credit card it's not my credit card it's it stopped syncing with my venmo and so my venmo my venmo transactions don't show up in my co-pilot anymore which is like not like i can still keep track of my finances but it's really annoying that it worked for years stopped working and they're just sort of like no it's a back-end issue we just can't fix it that's one of those

47:42David Imel:things where like if the whole point of the app is to do everything and then it loses one of them it severely strapped.

47:49Andrew Edwards:I'm still a big fan of Copilot. It's just, it stopped working.

47:52Marques Brownlee:In finance, there is a lot of extra work in the back-end sync stuff. I happen to know people who work for these companies, and it is a lot of work. So yes, stuff does periodically break with it, but it is super useful to me. So it's in my honorable mentions. Athletic also makes my honorable mentions. It essentially takes all of the data my Apple Watch is collecting and formats them and displays them in different ways. Kind of like whoop like it shows me a lot of the same scores and like calculates like how much exertion i can do today when i should work out all these other things how much sleep is factoring in uh really useful for anyone who's an athlete and wants to keep track of a whole bunch of stuff that's two

48:29David Imel:dollars a month versus two hundred and thirty nine dollars yeah there's gonna be a theme a lot of

48:33Marques Brownlee:these are subscriptions i'm gonna yell about whoop after the 239 a month no sorry a year oh thank god

48:39David Imel:that's still wait i'll talk trust me i'm gonna yell about it at the end of this episode i have

48:44Marques Brownlee:whole whoops section yeah so athletic's good it's also iphone only like copilot um blip blip i discovered this year already it's in my honorable mentions we've been airdropping things to each other in the studio for so long and it's kind of a running joke of how maybe it's just the environment we're in like there's like 20 airdrop devices within range of any one of these so you open airdrop and suddenly things start popping up and you try to click one and it moves and you actually get the one you want and then it doesn't work or it declines even though they never saw the notification. Airdrop is just, it's supposed to be great, but it's kind of fidgety in the studio.

49:19Marques Brownlee:And Blip is just, it's money every single time. File transfer app, super useful. So Blip's honorable mention. Incredible. Geekbench. I use it enough and it's been good for long enough. I'm on Geekbench 6. I paid for Geekbench Pro. I regularly use Geekbench in videos. You guys are familiar with this already. Geekbench, honorable mention. YouTube.

49:39David Imel:YouTube?

49:41Marques Brownlee:My last honorable mention is YouTube. Oh, this is his last honorable mention. Wait, so you're going to do like 10 apps? These are just ones that are close, and I thought they have slight downsides, didn't make it, but YouTube is obviously great. My top five. In no particular order.

49:55David Imel:What? No, it literally has to be in an order. It's not in order. This has to be in order. I can't put these in order. Yes, you can.

50:02Marques Brownlee:Does that mean you have to start at five and go up to one? I can try, but I might regret my top five. All right, number five.

50:11Marques Brownlee:Don't edit that.

50:15Marques Brownlee:um okay number five relay for reddit dude it's an android app yeah uh it's the best android reddit app by a mile it's so good it's awesome it has a paid tier it's worth it if you use reddit if you sort through things it's just it's super useful it's a no question top five android app ever and it's in my top five ways ways is kind of not the prettiest app it's not but it is one of the most functional it's crowdsourced it has all of your potholes and all of your closed roads and all of your routing and everything every most of the reason people want carplay so they could put ways instead of google maps on their car screen ways is goaded wait i almost put google maps in

51:00David Imel:google maps has everything from ways now it's like all officially in it almost what doesn't

51:06Marques Brownlee:it have a lot of the smaller like granular like what it's alerting you about things like google will say things like i don't think it does potholes there's like object in road it does

51:16David Imel:object on road it does not 100 sure about potholes but i would assume it comes in i've never been in

51:21Marques Brownlee:google map to be fair i haven't used maps as much lately but fog bad weather flooding on the road

51:27David Imel:there's visibility closed roads do you know the one i don't notice which i'm fine with is the like vehicle stopped on side of road which on ways is every three miles it feels like and it does get

51:38Marques Brownlee:annoying and I wish I could be even more granular with like what it notifies me about but I still think Waze is goaded. Dude if the vehicle is stopped on your shoulder you probably gotta go to the hospital. Jesus Christ. Wait quick question about these because I was debating

51:50David Imel:using Google Maps in my top five as well but that's almost like a utility to me at this point. Does that count?

51:55Marques Brownlee:If the app is good enough I think you should count it. It's kind of like YouTube. Number three. Flighty. Flighty it's we talked about it last week. If you fly enough Flighty is unquestionable. It's like and it's almost a utility. Even if you don't fly enough, like I just like looking back at my passport and looking at the different places and trips and stuff. Yeah, the rewind, the whole thing. I need someone to convince me that it's worth it. Flighty? Yeah. Oh my God. Next time you fly, get on a trial. You could probably get like a trial version of it. I used the trial and I was like - Did it not blow your mind?

52:29Marques Brownlee:But I don't understand. I mean, it's a great - It's a great looking app. You're going to be on a flight that gets delayed and you know from Flighty, 45 minutes before everyone's sitting at the gate knows and you get to rebook your flight before everyone else does. And you're gonna go, wow, I'm glad I had flight. Are you speaking from experience? Yes, literally, that's happened to me. All right, two more. Number two, tick, tick, my task app. Saw that one coming. You know, there's a lot of task apps like this. There's a lot of planning apps. There's a lot of calendar apps. This is just the one I keep coming back to.

53:01Marques Brownlee:And I do constantly try to switch to other ones. Superlist almost made my honorable mentions. But Tick Tick is just that goat. It's just that goat. So I'm putting that in my top five. Number one, Carrot Weather. Number one? And I'm not like, I'm not locking in the order of my top five. But Carrot Weather is by such a margin my most often used weather app that it's not even really close. It has essentially stolen the layout from Dark Sky. which no one else has really cloned. I don't know if it's like not allowed to clone it or if they're just the only ones bold enough to do it, but they've one-to-one cloned the layout from Dark Sky, which is incredibly intuitive.

53:43Marques Brownlee:The data is super accurate. The radar is really good. A lot of these apps are really good and then the radar sucks. There's good radar, good multiple sources. It's just a default app on my phone. It's also unfortunately iPhone only, but that's my top five. It's a bunch of iPhone apps and one Android app, top five apps of all time. Tear my list apart. Anybody have any objections? All right. No YouTube, no YouTube studio.

54:04David Imel:YouTube is honorable mention. YouTube honorable mention. Oh, it was honorable mention.

54:07Marques Brownlee:YouTube Studio is pretty good. It's not, it kind of does feel like utility to me, but yeah, it's good. But it's not like amazing. I don't know. It's fine. It does what I want it to. I never really, I actually don't like editing descriptions and metadata in the Studio app because I've had to truncate my input before. So I'll have a long description and then I'll edit it from the app and I'll hit submit and then I'll view it on the desktop and it cuts off like after however many characters it was. So I've had issues with the app before. Yeah. There's also some things you can only do in the YouTube Studio app on your phone.

54:41Marques Brownlee:Like you can only add thumbnails to shorts in the YouTube Studio app, right? No, I can only do that in the YouTube app. The YouTube app. The YouTube Studio app, I can't change the thumbnail, but when I go into the YouTube app and go into my videos and then go to edit, that's where I can change the thumbnail of a short. Isn't that weird? You'd think they'd have - It's not right for Google.

54:56David Imel:No, I guess they do. I swear it sometimes feels like YouTube doesn't have that many actual creators on their platform because the amount of things that are just broken for...

55:05Marques Brownlee:Yeah, well, they have different teams for YouTube Studio and YouTube. Where's the chapters team? Probably different buildings. Yeah, probably different buildings. Chapters.

55:12David Imel:I know there's creators out there. We know one of them very well, but like...

55:15Marques Brownlee:Yeah, if they add chapters, I'd add this to my...

55:19David Imel:If you... Justice for chapters UI. Yeah.

55:23Marques Brownlee:Actually, just add a UI for chapters, please. Yeah. Like a real one. Yeah. Like why? Why wouldn't you do that? Yeah. I found out recently that it really, really helps to add chapters because then Google search can index the chapters so that when someone asks a question on Google search, it'll bring you to the exact spot because it knows what the chapter was about. Huge. It's helpful. And yet you still have to just put timestamps in the description and then it breaks 85 % of the time. Talk about breaks a lot. We do it every week. Every week on this podcast. Every week. And what is the number one tweak getting sent to us?

55:59Marques Brownlee:Chapters? Why are there no chapters?

56:01David Imel:Our comment section backs us up now at least. Usually now it's like, this is great. Chapters working as of time.

56:08Marques Brownlee:If you see somebody and they're complaining about us not having chapters, please tell them what's going on. Please inform them. Educate them. So there it is. That's my list. Okay. I have two honorable mentions. Number one of the honorable mentions, Google Opinion Rewards.

56:25David Imel:Oh. Okay. Damn, that's a good one. Deep cut. All time. This is a deep cut. That was really awesome.

56:32Marques Brownlee:If you don't know what Google Opinion Rewards is, it's been around since like 2010. It's freaking amazing. It came out very soon after Android came out. it will periodically based on your search data based on other things location data whatever send you a little survey and it's usually one to sometimes it can be up to like 12 questions weirdly enough it so it pays you money which is cool weirdly enough it pays you based on the amount of questions you answered so if you just lie to it it'll keep giving you more questions I don't do that but the only app that I have a subscription for on my phone that isn't part of like a family bundle or something is the Pokemon trading card game app.

57:15Marques Brownlee:And Google Paynear Awards pays for my subscription for that, which is pretty awesome. That's the only app you have a subscription for? That isn't part of like a family plan. So like I have a Google family plan. Like YouTube. That has YouTube premium in it. Spotify? I don't. I don't have Spotify. I have YouTube music, which is part of the family plan. and then i have the apple one family plan which also comes with apple music that kind of stuff but i don't we talked about in the car and at south by or something i only have like one subscription that isn't part of other stuff yeah i'm i'm terrified of subscriptions anyway honorable mention if you're not using goopener rewards you should be using it because it gives you at least one at like every couple of days sometimes it gives you like five yeah most people I forgot it was still around.

58:03Marques Brownlee:Other thing, if you have multiple phones, you can set it up on the same account with multiple phones and it'll serve you like multiple. It's crazy. I mean, I don't do that. They're essentially scamming. Bitcoin farming. No, I don't do that. But anyway, it's great. Okay. Honorable mention number two, Telegram. I know. Okay. The stickers and the emoji are all animated. It's so awesome. It's so amazing. Telegram is cross-platform. It's got a desktop app. Yeah, you can get your porn bots anywhere. It's amazing. Well, I pay... Oh, I... Oh.

58:40David Imel:We didn't even get one app further.

58:43Marques Brownlee:No, I realize I do have another subscription. It's Telegram Premium. Wow. Because it's like$20 a year, but it completely removes the porn apps, porn bots. It makes it usable, basically. Yeah, it makes it usable. Because there is a feature in Telegram Premium where you can charge people to message you if they're not in your contacts already. Wow. Yeah. So it's like, you can spam me, but you got to pay. Wow. You know, which is pretty cool. No one has ever paid. Okay. Now we're on to the actual apps. And this might be a top five, like in order of actual best. You made me pick a five. I didn't. Andrew did.

59:19Marques Brownlee:Yeah. Yeah. That's right. Okay. Number five, Libby.

59:24David Imel:I had that on mine too. You can use it. No, I took it off. It's fine.

59:28Marques Brownlee:Libby is great. is a library app it's so good in new york city it's amazing because we have three public libraries and you can get a library card for all three of them and libby will let you rent ebooks it'll let you rent audiobooks um it just has so many resources i think you might get like a free new york times subscription if you're part of the brooklyn public library or something it's pretty awesome so it's a great app and i can't believe it's free very cool number four Relay for Reddit also. I used Relay for so, so, so long and eventually they did go subscription because of the Redditpocalypse.

1:00:05Marques Brownlee:My honorable mention for Reddit would be obviously Christian Seligzap, Apollo. Rest in pieces. Number three. Nova Launcher. That is an app. I think I was looking at, because I was just trying to rack my brain this morning for like what are the most popular apps you know nova launcher is one of the most downloaded apps of all time with over five million downloads i could see that because of all time there's such a long period of like the last 15 years where everyone who didn't have a google phone but wanted a better launcher like all the touchwiz phones yeah that's the first thing i installed on all those yeah totally and a lot of people did the same thing.

1:00:46Marques Brownlee:Totally. So good. Number two, viewfinder preview. This is an app that I use to frame my film photos for when my cameras don't have viewfinders, like my 3D printed cameras. It's really, really good. You can do various different aspect ratios. You can test things. You can take sample pictures with it. It's super basic, but I use it literally every week and I've been using it every week for like six years so i think it's worth being in my top five number one for me pocket casts i think uh i think pocket cast is probably the greatest app ever made wow it's really really old multi-platform it's multi-platform it has a web app uh it has been passed around it used to be owned by npr for a while now it's owned by uh what are they called the people that do me were automatic but it is a really insanely good UI you don't pay for plus so the thing about it and no I don't I bought it for$7 in 2012 or whenever because they had a one time because subscriptions were not very popular back then so I bought it for$7 and then when they switched to subscription anyone who had bought it for$7 got the pro version for free for life so I'm grandfathered in So I actually don't know what the free version of Pocket Cast is like.

1:02:08Marques Brownlee:So I'm sorry if it sucks. But I just think it's just. It's pretty good. You just can't do like folders and stuff. It's an insanely good podcast app. Why would you need that?

1:02:18David Imel:That's the best. That's a good app, though, is when like the subscription thing is really for a power user. But the free version gives you like 90 % of what it is already. Totally. That's a good app.

1:02:28Marques Brownlee:So not as exciting as Marquez's weather apps, but. Agreed. Yeah. What do you got, Andrew?

1:02:35David Imel:All right, let's go. Number five. No honorable mentions here. If it is not in this list, it's a dog water app.

1:02:42Marques Brownlee:Wow.

1:02:43David Imel:Number five, Taco Bell. What? Okay. I don't actually use it that much. The app's that good? The app is actually pretty solid. You're not jaded by the restaurant. I usually, I'm totally jaded by the restaurant, but. Why are you jaded by the restaurant? Or I'm shilling for the restaurant? I don't know. Like, I like this app because of the restaurant. Of course. but taco bell has the most times that i want to add things onto like different items and i am way too embarrassed to say that in the drive-thru therefore this is the app that i use out of all of them i'm a plus potatoes plus jalapenos plus this minus that whatever i ain't saying all that in the drive-thru because there's no way it gets it right app dude it's it's the only fast food

1:03:26Andrew Edwards:app that works a hundred percent of the time there's no upsell pop out like all other fast food restaurants their apps are like so brutally just unusable and i mean i say unusable from like the i'm spoiled like it just things are kind of slow and choppy but still it's like or they send

1:03:44Marques Brownlee:you like 8 000 push notifications yeah they all do i'm sure taco bells does it sends you

1:03:50David Imel:notifications i disable notifications on every single app that i like yeah i did that too the

1:03:54Andrew Edwards:mcdonald's app dude like a fifth of the time it'll just only show you the breakfast menu and it's not breakfast time so you just can't order it and it's like this should be the easiest thing to figure out as an app what time is it not breakfast why does mcdonald's only do breakfast between certain times i'm sorry all day breakfast really struck a chord no no well taco bells has got to

1:04:16David Imel:be easy because there's only essentially seven ingredients on the entire menu and it's just it's just a different version of that we talk about the popeyes thing on the podcast no don't no we don't want people to know about this all right i have no idea what they're talking about but that's That's okay. Number four, I don't use, but I'm going to hype it up anyways. Interesting. Old school RuneScape app. This is a game that has been around for so long that is the most simple web browser game from like 2007. They relaunched it years ago. They're still updating this game. It has a huge user base.

1:04:50David Imel:And because it's so simple, it makes sense on an iPad or a phone. the other thing about it is it is the most grind intensive time consuming AFK able like game possible that being able to go on your computer and do different like boss battles or quests or stuff that are more intensive and then just would cut to 99 on your phone without paying attention is perfect now you don't have an extra job it basically is but this lets runescape people go outside because now you can still grind XP and touch grass. Yeah. Very important. Although, I was also looking, this has like 5 million plus downloads on the Play Store.

1:05:32David Imel:Oh. Great rating, except apparently, like within the last month, the login's completely broken on Android. So, Jagex, if you're listening, fix that for the homies out there. I still don't even play the game. I just watch a lot of content about it, but the app seems awesome. Number three, Blip. Blip has changed everything we've done here. the amount of times I've had to pull stuff off of phones to then send to Marques's Mac Pro to be like in a video or something. Blip has helped that so much.

1:06:03Marques Brownlee:Everyone's so hype on Blip, but nobody's ever blipped me anything. So why is this better than AirDrop again? Can you explain? Cross-platform. Cross-platform. Yeah, but there's a lot of different. Works every time.

1:06:13Andrew Edwards:You can blip someone somewhere across the country. Oh, really?

1:06:15David Imel:It's not Wi-Fi dependent. It's just you just send it.

1:06:19Andrew Edwards:It's free? It checks to see if you're on the same network as someone. and if you are, it just does local, you know. But if you're not, it goes P2P over the internet. So it's just dependent on your actual connections. It's not like oh, Dropbox is a really slow server. No, it's just 50 to 60 megabytes per second across the country.

1:06:41Marques Brownlee:Is there a file size limit?

1:06:42Andrew Edwards:Not that I've found.

1:06:43Marques Brownlee:That's crazy.

1:06:44Andrew Edwards:I blip myself the 10 gigabyte pod audio after every session. No file size limit.

1:06:52David Imel:That's crazy. Blip is awesome. I'm a blip evangelist. I'm full on blip. If there's blip merch, I'll buy blip.

1:07:03Marques Brownlee:No joke.

1:07:04David Imel:Rufus really put us on that one. Number two, Google Tasks. Y 'all changed me. Google Tasks may have legitimately changed my life. I will also argue that the simplicity of it has maybe helped me because I remember David Pierce, which we should bring back on again i know he mentioned that recently on like threads he wants to come back um it sounds like he just wants to talk about productivity apps but that episode did great so it did come join us david uh but like being i just have to type it in every time at this point a third of the time like i just do that the task before it even pops up because i typed it in which like in my brain had me remember it um it works great with that it works great with just uh android auto being able to like remind me do it in one hour when i get to work with all voice not hands off the wheel at all like yeah it's changed my life you saying that is going to end up at google io this year no one andrew manganelli next quote 128 gigabytes i will ruin you um and then my number one is the most niche one possible But as a disc golf player, Udisc is exactly what I was talking about before of the free version of this app gives you 90 % of the things to either find a disc golf course, record your score, do pretty much anything disc golf related.

1:08:28David Imel:It is a super cheap sport anyone can do. If you want to find a course near you, it's on there. My favorite thing about it is every year they release this giant post about how many people are playing and how many different countries. and it's essentially just so people can use that data to give to their local townships to build more disc golf courses. And if at any point you want to request the data, you can just reach out to them and do it to try and build more community building things. So people who run that app are great. The app itself is great. There's a$30 a year subscription if you want some like really premium things like getting it on my Garmin watch.

1:09:05David Imel:Other than that, it's free. Great app. Cool. Nice. Play disc golf. I'll go next. So first two honorable mentions. Okay. Specifically because I'm on Android now, so they're iOS only. One of them being Flighty, like Rick has mentioned. All right, I'll download it. All right, I'll download it. Flighty's great. There's a cross-platform one by Air that's also really good, but it doesn't have the new airport intelligence feature that Flighty just dropped. That's fire. Yeah. So Flighty's goaded. The other one is Gentler Streak, which was the fitness app that I was using on Apple. with my Apple Watch Ultra.

1:09:42David Imel:It was awesome. Miss it, but now I'm on Android. So it is what it is. But number five for me is KWGT, which is like a widget app on Android. It's been around for a minute. And that thing, I've customized so many home screens, it lets you do basically. What is it called? KWGT.

1:10:01Marques Brownlee:What does it stand for?

1:10:03David Imel:Great question. No idea. K widget. Custom widget maker. But with a K, custom. Yeah, with a K.

1:10:09Marques Brownlee:I've never heard of that.

1:10:10David Imel:Yeah, it's awesome. Well, whenever you get back on Android, David, Mr. iPhone only over there, download it. It's really cool. It's a little confusing. There's like a little learning curve, but there's such a good community behind it where you could just like import widgets that other people made. And it's awesome.

1:10:25Marques Brownlee:That's most of what I did. Like, there's some incredibly complex widgets where I'd import it and I'm like, what if I just tweak this other? Yeah. I break it. I'm like, you know what? I'm just going to leave it as is. It was fine.

1:10:34David Imel:Yeah. Number four is Duolingo. just because even though I still suck at speaking other languages, it's just, it changed everything. Like gamifying apps started, I think, because of Duolingo. The widget is awesome. What happened, Andrew? You look like you're about to say something. I thought you said Duel, like D-U-A-L, Lingo. Or no, D-E-U-L, Lingo. And I was like, do they have like a Battle Royale version of this? Sorry, I just can't speak English. See, it's funny speaking about language apps. No, but if you're gamifying languages, they should make a foreign language Battle Royale game called Duolingo.

1:11:07David Imel:Duol. Duolingo. Duolingo. It's time to duel. You just have to like curse at other people. I know that green owl is listening. Send it. Yeah, their whole team is killing it with the marketing. Number three is an app that I just found and it's already in like my top all time. It's called Stellarium. It's having like a moment on TikTok basically. But it is a, you know those old apps that uses like the accelerometer on the phone and stuff to like see the stars and stuff like that? It lets you zoom in and I immediately paid for the pro version because you get high version high res images of planets and stars and stuff so as you look around you can zoom in on planets and see actual like images it's it's super dope did you download this like two weeks ago when we were talking about it getting water oh no no i downloaded it like two weeks ago because i was seeing someone on it was going viral like on tiktok or something and someone was like zooming into a picture and i was like what the hell and then i checked the comments and they were like yeah this isn't a telescope this is an app and i immediately downloaded it there i just googled it and their web app is unbelievable oh i didn't even know they had a web app do i lift my computer up into the sky no he just but i found a starlink that would be crazy wild okay uh my number two app is an app called story graph which is basically goodreads from amazon but by an independent maker super awesome app they have a lot of good features that uh goodreads doesn't have because goodreads got purchased by amazon and amazon forgot it existed and just hasn't done anything with it for a decade so goodreads i think is the one that everyone uses just because of like the social graph effect and everything but highly recommend getting on story graph just my fiance has found so many great books because like their recommendation algorithm is just amazing uh and my number one app is obsidian because i'm a big note taker guy and obsidian is super complex and super like you can do a lot with it it is like a local first only note-taking app for desktop and android and ios and all this stuff but i'm surprised at how much i get on my phone for things that i thought would like not look right or like not format correctly or something like that um because i used to be an android i'm an android apple notes or samsung notes guy but obviously they're locked into an ecosystem i'm trying to like pick apps that go between everything uh and i use the i think it's called forever notes which is like an apple notes taking system that lets you link between notes to make apple notes way more powerful it's a whole thing but i've replicated that in obsidian so now basically everything that i need in my life is in obsidian so i use obsidian all the time and i'm always surprised at how much i'm actually able to do on it especially in dex mode you know now the moments you've all been waiting for top apps from a one mr ellis rovin all right so guys as you know for a long time

1:14:03Andrew Edwards:iphone 12 mini i couldn't install apps on it december 2025 i get a new phone so i've been using apps now for three months this is huge I have a few honorable mentions because I have very fond memories of apps I used in my childhood on the iPod Touch just because I feel like that was like a really golden era of like weird dinky apps like when we were backstage yeah so the beer app because I was going to bring up being backstage at South by Southwest I installed the beer app on the office iPad and chugged giant beers in front of all you guys and you laughed um another another honorable mention for me that i don't think is still in the app store and if it is it's like a shell of its former self do you guys remember urban spoon oh yeah yeah i loved urban spoon i went to once or no urban spoon was a restaurant slot machine where you entered in how much money you wanted to spend it would go what and then it would give you a restaurant near you and you'd be like that's what i eat i guess

1:15:14Marques Brownlee:nightmare that reminds me do you do you know the app too good to go yeah yeah too good to go is kind of like that too it just tells you the restaurants that are closing and they'll get rid of they'll just be getting rid of stuff and you can get like really big meals for seven dollars or you can get miso soup for seven dollars yeah you don't know what they're gonna give you it's

1:15:32Andrew Edwards:very random okay but ellis's top five are you ready i'm ready yep number five blip no i did not include blip on here even though it's just phenomenal um but number five discogs it's number five because please integrate the blog posts with the app i hate that when i click on a blog post it opens my browser wait what is it discogs is like goodreads slash letterbox but for music yeah so like you can keep track but it's a few other things like so you can like log your record collection and then also there's like an ebay style buying and selling platform built into it so like you can see someone's collection if they and then they can list something as like you know i'm okay getting rid of this and then you mention message them like i'll buy this or trade this and then you can do it all in the app it's very cool um and then there's also like an actual like publication side where they have anyone can upload a blog post and then they have like staff writers that write about music articles are very good they're very fun to read they're very interesting.

1:16:35David Imel:I just remember one time you came up to me. This is the only time I've ever heard of it. You're like, I'm so amped right now. It's like, why? You're like, I uploaded an album and it was the first one ever uploaded.

1:16:46Andrew Edwards:Yeah, that was a big day for me when when when I bought an album that was so rare, no one had had logged it on Discogs before. So I got to scan everything and like upload the track listing and spend like an hour of my day being the guy. All right. Number four this is another app that i don't know if it's still in the app store and if it is you absolutely should not buy it because it is the biggest biggest privacy boo-boo of all time it's called fog of world and it was this early ios app that would just destroy your phone's battery by leaving location on all the time this is so early in ios that location was not like on all the time and essentially it was like a big map and it would just like that would be blank or like whited out and then as you would go around

1:17:34David Imel:like an RTS

1:17:35Andrew Edwards:and then so you could see every single place you've ever been and if you travel a lot like I for some reason was doing as a teenager you could like zoom out to see the whole world because if you were like me and you said I don't care about your rules you would leave your phone off of like not on airplane mode on flights and you get these big stripes across the country and then there was like there was achievements for like all the states and countries you visited and like it would keep track of the total like square mileage that you've covered and like percent of the world that you've seen this is a goaded idea but the app cannot be top five you're just leaving your location goaded aspirationally in practice like nightmare utter utter nightmare how would this work on your iPhone 12 mini.

1:18:25Andrew Edwards:Don't get this app. Don't get this app unless you want the Chinese government to know every single thing about you. Okay, number three. Number three. Seesaw. Number three is Seesaw. Seesaw is like a it's for galleries in New York City. I don't know. You can see all the art that's on display in New York. That's it. What is it called? Seesaw. Like you see it and then after you see it, you saw it. Got it. like reddit i get it yeah yeah i read it on reddit i'm quite fond you check off things you've seen no it doesn't do that much it shows you galleries in a map and it shows you galleries in a list i like the logo and that's all it needs to do like i like apps that that do one thing and do it really well number two i have to reopen my list because i i can't remember oh number two the moment pro camera yeah which i am legally required to disclose they gave me for free i didn't pay for it it's true so if i don't know if i'd feel differently about it if i did pay for it but this was not something that i just happened to stumble upon this was moment saying ellis here's a code you have the app for free um i like the mo i didn't like the moment pro camera in fact when i first downloaded i said ew stinky to be clear this is our second this is moment pro camera two yeah this is much better but then but then they launched an update where you could save profiles which is like you like saves literally every single setting in the um the thing david i'm airdropping you a photo i took why you're not blipping it is this because i can't find you on

1:20:03David Imel:blip i can tell you is this one-time payment or yeah it's a one-time ten dollar one-time payment Listen, if you do the Google Rewards thing, what's it called again? Opinion. You could pay for this. Just load up 20 phones.

1:20:16Andrew Edwards:Let me tell you, the reason I like Moment Pro. Wait, wait. Before you describe the photograph. Is this a straight-out camera? Yeah, yeah. I love Moment Pro camera because I think the iPhone camera, the iPhone 17 Pro camera, forced to be between 640 and 800 ISO is one of the most pleasing things in the world. It flattens everything. There's very little dynamic range. There's a nice amount of grain. Almost gives it like a halftone effect. Yes. So, David, is the picture I sent you dope as hell? Yeah. And the number one app in the App Store, the one app I think every single person on planet Earth should download onto their phone yesterday.

1:20:54Andrew Edwards:Ready? Universal, universally applicable to all human beings. I hope it's Taco Bell.

1:21:00Marques Brownlee:It's going to be iMessage or something.

1:21:01Andrew Edwards:The Brooklyn Public Library app. BPL, baby. Dude, it just works. It just works. Nothing takes any time at all. If you live in Timbuktu, get a Brooklyn library card. Really?

1:21:14David Imel:Can you do that? Can you get a library card online or something? No, you got to go to that. Yeah, right. That's the lazy part of Libby is I haven't gone to the library to actually get the card.

1:21:26Andrew Edwards:At least with the Brooklyn Public Library, you need to go to the library. But other libraries. Anyway, this is all to say, dude, the other day I was like, oh, my God, I think I need to give my library book back. and I open the app and within 10 seconds I saw I have three more days. I hit the renew button in zero seconds after hitting the renew. I had 30 more days. Why are all apps not as good as the thing that costs zero money? The library. I just don't anyway. Brooklyn Public Library back end and front end app team. Boy, you're just crushing it. Why do they call it?

1:22:03Marques Brownlee:B-K-L-Y-N. it's like not it's not saving that many letters it's like WF why save more when save less

1:22:11Andrew Edwards:it's literally saving five

1:22:12Marques Brownlee:yeah it's not that many

1:22:14David Imel:that's a lot it's more than half for an app icon that's actually a lot of real estate

1:22:18Marques Brownlee:they should call it Bookland Public Library or just Bookland yeah just Bookland

1:22:24Andrew Edwards:yeah but how would you know it's a public what if it was a private library because it says book

1:22:28David Imel:oh

1:22:28Marques Brownlee:because you can download it you could call it Bookland Public Library

1:22:32Andrew Edwards:Bookland or just put the R in parentheses anyway that's ellis's as someone who is brand new to the world of apps nice um also let me know what lutz i should be getting for moment pro cam because i'm starting to play around with lutz nice i guess then without any further ado everyone's number one app trivia trivia

1:22:54David Imel:oh yes it took longer for that music to go in than brooklyn public library app did BKL-Y-N. Biggest news of the week for humanity is we are sending people to the moon today. No, we're not. We're sending them around the moon. They're going around the moon. They will be the furthest that humans have ever been away from Earth.

1:23:13Andrew Edwards:Isn't that crazy? I'm scared. Marquez, you can still say you went to Niagara Falls if you didn't jump in the water, okay? But that's different because people have actually been on the moon.

1:23:22David Imel:Did Katy Perry go to space? Oh, good question.

1:23:25Marques Brownlee:The definition of space.

1:23:26David Imel:Yeah, we're going to have to wait until Artemis 4 for people on the moon. Anyway, we're sending people around the moon. Sending people around the moon. They're going to slingshot around Earth, go back to the moon, slingshot around the moon, come back home. It's going to be awesome. You listening to this already know how the launch went. Today is April 1st at the time of recording. We are waiting for the launch. It launches today. It launches today. At 7 p.m.

1:23:46Andrew Edwards:Aren't we supposed to get a Tesla Roadster announcement today? How much astrophage do they use to get to the moon? Two billion pounds.

1:23:53David Imel:okay but the question is of Kit Kats sorry continue Artemis 2 mission that's what it is it's Artemis 2 mission but did you know that in Greek mythology Artemis has a twin brother named what I don't know Greek mythology

1:24:10Marques Brownlee:very well you should know this so this is a Greek mythology question

1:24:17Andrew Edwards:nah I'm wrong

1:24:19Marques Brownlee:it is but it isn't that's your hint which probably has ties to some other NASA related space program probably either way if you know it you already know it if you don't you'll find out the end just like the rest of us we'll be right back

1:24:43Marques Brownlee:support for the show comes from Hostinger you might find it easy to come up with an idea for a cool new product but building that into something real, something that other people can actually enjoy that starts with making the first move and with ai changing the landscape for entrepreneurs everywhere hostinger can help you make that first move in just a few minutes instead of a few weeks hostinger is an all-in-one platform that brings everything into one place your domain website email ai tools and ai agents so you can launch online without stitching together five different subscriptions start with a prompt then add your personal touch you can create websites online stores and custom apps without coding or design skills.

1:25:18Marques Brownlee:Then use AI agents to automate tedious tasks and help grow your business. Hostinger powers over 10 million websites and there's a reason it earned a CNET Editor's Choice Award. So turn your one day into a day one. Go to hostinger.com slash waveform to bring your ideas online for under$3 a month plus get an extra 20 % off with a promo code waveform. That's less than the price of a cup of coffee per month. So that's Hostinger.com slash Waveform, promo code Waveform for an extra 20 % off. Welcome back. Okay, we got a couple of little quick stories for you guys. There was some fairly big news. It could be big news to you or it could be just like a nothing burger news to you.

1:25:55Marques Brownlee:Define big. You know, the amount of Kit Kats that were stolen on the road this week. Okay, so the news is that Apple is opening up Swift as a programming language for Android, which is fairly big maybe i asked a friend of the show christian selig about this a famous developer for many different apps including apollo for reddit which is no longer available and he said i don't think you can use it for ui yet can you so kind of eh being able to write general algorithmic stuff in the same across ios and android is cool but until you can do the whole thing in swift i don't know if it's going to bring over many ios developers for instance especially if I just am able to blast through Kotlin with modern LLMs.

1:26:42Marques Brownlee:Yeah, this is a text, so it's kind of complicated. If just being able to blast through Kotlin with modern LLMs hasn't done it for people for whatever reason. So I guess what he's saying is like Kotlin is just so standard now and you can use modern LLMs to code things that like Swift is not that big of a deal.

1:27:02David Imel:So maybe it's not a big deal. I guess if you just like tell Claude, which just got leaked, but if you tell Claude to like, look at this Kotlin code and make a, make it Swift, maybe that's what he means. Like, does that, does it work? I guess. I refuse to mention anything about software engineering because I don't want to get yelled at.

1:27:19Marques Brownlee:That's fair. I, yeah. If you think this is a big deal, let us know.

1:27:25David Imel:Was it, I ain't reading all that. Congratulations or sorry that happened.

1:27:30Marques Brownlee:Yeah. it's funny because Swift used to sort of be the like oh we're just making our iOS apps in Swift and like we can't I'm sorry we only have an iOS app because we can't port it to Android whatever and so now you have less of a reason not to I suppose but I was like what's their angle?

1:27:44Andrew Edwards:I don't quite understand but also like I thought one of the big selling points of Swift is how easy it plugs into the Apple APIs which give you hardware access so like how does

1:27:54Marques Brownlee:and that's probably why it's not as big of a deal

1:27:56Andrew Edwards:yeah like can you port over something that is using like the face ID API or like. You'd probably have to configure that separately. You'd have to be like, Claude.

1:28:07Marques Brownlee:Yeah, yeah. I think, yeah, who knows? I mean, we were thinking, what was the meta one where you can code for both in it? React Native? React Native, yeah. Yeah, and a lot of people like don't like React Native. So I think Apple maybe saw an opportunity there. But like Christian said, if you can just, you know, Vibe code through Kotlin, then it's whatever. So just wanted to mention that.

1:28:26David Imel:I think this would have been cooler like two years ago. Yeah, two years ago. I feel like they just had this waiting and then now that everyone just does it with AI anyway, they're like, okay, sure, release it. Who cares? All right, Andrew? All right, I'm about to crash out. I'm ready. Not really. Okay, if you know about Whoop, we've talked about it on this podcast before.

1:28:46Marques Brownlee:There it is.

1:28:47David Imel:Nice. There it is. I like your big Whoop, who cares? Whoever added that. That was me. I said Big Whoop. What the f***? What?

1:28:56Andrew Edwards:That was straight up me. No, it wasn't. Yes, it was. No, it wasn't. Look at the document history. I just typed it in Slack three days ago. Yeah, well, I tweeted it five days. I tweeted that six years ago. Actually, yeah. Okay. Okay. That's it then.

1:29:12David Imel:Whoop just announced that they just got evaluated at$10.1 billion, which is three times more than the previous valuation.

1:29:20Marques Brownlee:That's a lot of money.

1:29:21David Imel:That is a big fake number. Big Whoop. listen, I've used a bunch of wearables. My stupid bed tracks my sleep. I pay attention to all sorts of different activity trackers. Um, I've been down this rabbit hole and the more I think about whoop, the more I can't just not think whoop is a marketing company and not really an activity tracker company. And I just, I don't know. Everyone's always like, Oh my whoop. It's so cool. It has the best statistics ever. And it's so much better than all the other ones, which just reminds me of all the people who have Mac and are like, oh, Mac is so much easier than Windows.

1:29:59David Imel:That's why I bought it, which just feels like something they marketed really well. And now you believe that. And there are probably some really niche people who like the whoops. I know some people like it because they like to wear a regular watch. But the fact that this stupid little tracker, one has a notification motor, but can't notify me when I get actual notifications. Sounds wild. It can't tell me the time. and this if you want whoop 5.0 is somewhere between 239 and 359 a year depending on what features you want and you aren't paying monthly you have to pay yearly so at a certain point this just feels like the planet fitness like uh scam yes scam pretty much like uh yeah it feels like they're just doing the planet fitness thing where it's like you pay up front for a year and you lock into a year contract and then they hope you basically just forget about it after you

1:30:54Marques Brownlee:submit that was the blip sound i have it on my i happen to know that that's the blip sound

1:30:58Andrew Edwards:the blip sound um david david blips a computer that's recording the way that's happened so many times on this one just finished it's a nice sound though i gotta say

1:31:11David Imel:yeah a big reason they're probably at this evaluation right now is because they just became a perk on chase sapphire which is like one of the most popular credit cards yeah in the country which means i'm sure thousands of thousands of people went oh i get a free whoop membership i'm gonna sign up and then put that in a drawer one month later and never think about it again you get one year you get a year because you have to sign up for a year so you get a year for free yeah i mean a ton of people on twitter were saying this i've seen this so many times i think activity trackers i don't know about you all but the second most popular question i get about different like consumer technology after phones is an activity tracker they're super popular now garments apple watches whoops i get asked about all the time and every single person that has ever asked me about it and bought one has given up with it within two months i mean it's a small that's anecdotal evidence but i don't know i hate these stupid things i might be the number one whoop

1:32:05Marques Brownlee:hater but i have a hot take yeah a lot of people are like oh i don't need much from my activity tracker i just need to track my steps your phone already does that sure yeah why do you need to

1:32:16David Imel:you don't need the other stuff here's my thing about whoop though is if you want to the thing i use on my garmin the most is in the gym i just have like the heart rate level uh you know like levels one through five and that's what i look the most at zone because the zones yeah thank you whoop you can't see any of the stuff unless your phone is out at the gym because you it's no screen everything you have to track on your screen you have to put the different workouts on your screen I want to put my phone down in the gym no but you can work out without looking at any screens like that's why I like I know but I like looking at my heart rate zones in the middle like that's how I time my workouts is do a lift or do a I used to do when I was climbing it's like do it heart rate up wait for heart rate to go down no I'm ready for the next time and I'm like properly rested in between yes but a lot of the thing that whoop does differently and or at least used to because now everyone has this but it used to be recovery that was their thing exactly you work out you have the watch on the other wrist whatever body battery and yeah and garmin's body battery you know what has it athletic for two dollars a month yeah athletic and it's like almost one-to-one replica of it so i don't know and first of all all of these things are toys none of these are really that important listen to our episode with dr mike about activity trackers it's i am fully in for it of turning health into a game and if that helps you be healthy be healthy that's great but there's so many better options than these stupid whoop bands they're not comfortable either they're really annoying to have this big plastic but there aren't there are some other ones i haven't gotten to try there's another one i forgot it's called it's like a hundred bucks no subscription it looks exactly like a whoop they've just dominated

1:33:56Marques Brownlee:that exact space of like, well, there's a bunch of different, there's like the people like the rings, the aura rings and all those. And then there's all the competitors to that, which is just like, I want a minimal thing. Then there's the small band with no screen, which they've dominated, but there's also Fitbits and there's other things that do that. And they have, you know, the most customers and maybe the most data and maybe the most accuracy, who knows? Then you have the thing with a screen from the Garmin watch, the Apple watch, and then people want to be able to look at their heart rate while they're working out.

1:34:22Marques Brownlee:That's a space dominated by one player. And so there's a bunch of different versions of these. The$10 billion, I don't really care about the$10 billion, but it is interesting that all I really use it for, and this is someone who actively trains and constantly looks at the data, is to gamify and try to make sure I hit certain metrics or hit certain numbers. The whole thing we talked about with Dr. Mike is it might tell you you didn't hit your number or you got a bad sleep score today, so you start to feel worse because you saw the number was worse, and then that's a whole cycle that you spiral into.

1:34:54Marques Brownlee:That's not ideal. but yeah I think Whoop is is like I don't know how else to it's like the default for I just want it's either that or Fitbit I just want a fitness tracker that can tell me at the end of the day if I did enough and if I should be feeling better the next day I think I agree with Andrew because

1:35:12Andrew Edwards:I do think there's a part of like the Whoop ethos I don't know if it was like this the beginning but it's definitely like this now just because like so many uh like big time ceos and celebrities who feel like they can't be seen with a smart watch either for like pr reasons or like they don't want to be seen as endorsing a specific company reasons like choose whoop as their um fitness tracker like like if you i feel like i especially at south by i feel like whenever i saw either a picture or like some sort of famous person they were all wearing whoops uh i think it is sort of a thought of as like the if you're at a certain status level yeah whoop is the only

1:35:53David Imel:option yeah their endorsements of athletes are gigantic yeah it it it marquez if do you know like

1:35:59Andrew Edwards:equinox yeah i was literally just gonna make i would associate whoop with like the equinox yeah where it's like is that because it's way more expensive than fitbit or i think it's six of one half a dozen of the other it's it's because it's it's the high price point option and then it's just because it's associated with this level of prestige where I can't be seen with a clearly branded product. And I know at this point, Whoop is a clearly branded product, but at the same time, it's sort of an unbranded product in the sense that there are pretty much no identifying details. So I do think if you're the kind of person who wants to be thought of as part of the CEO, high prestige crowd, Whoop is now the choice.

1:36:39Marques Brownlee:It's a status thing for sure. It's like I care about the absolute minutiae of metrics about my body and I'm going to push it to the extreme.

1:36:47David Imel:And I don't think it gives any extra information and any other thing. But their marketing has.

1:36:52Andrew Edwards:It's also totally an if you know, you know, product. You know what I mean? Like I totally think it's it's a marketing.

1:36:58David Imel:I think I just think the yearly it used to be worse. It used. Well, I guess you would get discounts, but like you sign up for two or three years at a time. It just feels predatory at this point. It is definitely doing the Planet Fitness model of like, hey, look, here's a time in your life right now. You want to be healthy, buy this thing and then realize a month into it, like, I don't care if you give up because I already got a year's worth of your money out of it.

1:37:20Andrew Edwards:You're freaking me out because I was going to sign up for Planet Fitness today and now you're making me feel like I maybe shouldn't.

1:37:25David Imel:The hardest thing about Planet Fitness is canceling it.

1:37:27Marques Brownlee:Yeah, I would say I wouldn't want to like shun people away from fitness tracking and like trying to. There's a lot of people who are looking to take a first step in fitness who don't really know where to start. and this is a thing. Well, it's one of the many things that you can try that can give you some information that you don't know before. Like you have your phone in your pocket that can tell you your steps. I have no idea what my heart rate is until I'm wearing a wearable. There's a ton of choices. This is one of them. And then it's just all positioning. Like, yeah, they're gonna have ads with celebrities.

1:37:55Marques Brownlee:I think Aura Ring kind of does some of the same stuff. You literally have a gold ring on, which is like this unbranded thing. So there's different positioning moves. I'm not as familiar with Whoop because I don't use one and I don't know which metrics they're showing. I assume they're at least decently accurate because they're not getting flamed for accuracy. But yeah, I have an Apple Watch and I follow maybe five or six of the metrics and I know they're not accurate. I've done the step counting things and I know they're not accurate. I've done the heart rate stuff. I know the Carol and Kellers aren't accurate but it's just something to have to focus on slash gamify and then get in that world.

1:38:31Marques Brownlee:And if you can get one that's not hundreds of dollars a year with a mandatory 12-month subscription, that's probably ideal. Speaking of which, breaking news, two hours ago, Fitbit is going to be launching a Whoop-like product that does not have a screen. Two hours ago. It is April Fool's Day. Well, sure. But Steph Curry put out a video where he is wearing a band without a screen on it. And he says, he describes it as a first-of-its-kind product before saying that he doesn't want to spoil what it is.

1:39:04David Imel:It's definitely not First of the Sky because we brought it up based on something else, which is fine. Selfishly, I'm just hyped for this because I like wearing real watches and that means that I can't wear an Apple Watch, a Garmin watch. This is not real? I mean, it tells time, so it's real.

1:39:20Marques Brownlee:You know what I like wearing, like, actual watches. You know what they need to make? They need to make Whoop, but it's just the band for an actual watch. there's

1:39:29David Imel:Alex saw something the other day that's essentially a puck that would go under your normal watch and have specifically for Casio's

1:39:37Marques Brownlee:yeah but I want like if the band of your watch was basically a whoop and it got the information from like below your wrist or whatever

1:39:45David Imel:I think I've seen something like that

1:39:46Marques Brownlee:and then you could wear it on

1:39:47David Imel:whatever watch you wanted is that the best place to get the information yeah but I also wouldn't want to like wear my actual watch in the gym you know like or to sleep because I like bigger watches usually I like the whoop and now this new Fitbit thing like the reason I've been liking these bands is because I can wear them on the other wrist and just forget about them and they have such crazy battery life I don't have to think about them I've gotten to the point where I mostly only like looking at heart rate zones and getting my notifications on it because I just don't like my phone ever vibrating or doing anything I'm so close to just giving up on a smart watch but then I have to change my phone more often

1:40:20Andrew Edwards:I do it for the exact same things like or heart rate and then like a timer like if I'm doing a like a plank i like that okay you know but i'm right there with you like the only time literally the only time i ever go back and check my recorded data is to find out how many days did i work out this week which i could literally do with a fridge and a marker or your brain a lot of it is i i

1:40:45Marques Brownlee:usually frame it as it's all comparative so like i know that the calorie counter in the apple watch is not accurate but if i want to know if my workout today was actually harder than the workout i did last week, I can see if it was a higher or lower number. That's like kind of as much as I can get out of it.

1:41:03David Imel:My issue is the Whoop people will be like, no, everything in this is gospel. It feels like. I've seen some people online talking about Whooping like, this is the most accurate. This is so much better than everything else with zero sources or real information based on that. Just like, I'm better than you. Therefore, this better. I don't know. There's probably people out there who love whoop there's again i don't want to vilify this as like uh if this is what helps you work out do it who cares what that price is but yeah i don't like whoop sorry 10 10 billion my butt stock market's fake what open ai just got i think whoop should give a 10 billion dollar investment

1:41:44Marques Brownlee:to open ai who then can give it to nvidia who then can give it to oracle who then gave it to whoop

1:41:50Andrew Edwards:I have an announcement. What? I am pledging$50 billion to open AI over the next 50 years. And it's buying intent, right? Yeah. No, this is the speculative intent. Intent. It's part of an investment package called the Pinky Promise. Oh, wait, no, that's actually serious. Yeah, you can't break that. Yeah. That's legally binding. Yeah. It's also, it is April 1st.

1:42:16Marques Brownlee:Oh, right, true.

1:42:17Andrew Edwards:That's why.

1:42:17David Imel:Not when this comes out. This is so bad.

1:42:19Marques Brownlee:Well, RAM prices are actually collapsing right now. And the reason is because everyone thought that OpenAI had purchased 40 % of the world's RAM supply for 2026. Turns out, no. Sam Altman just signed an intent to purchase, which is not actually a legally binding thing. And then OpenAI is like, actually, we don't need the RAM. And so now RAM prices are crashing. Thank God we can finally have our Steam Deck at a reasonable, Steam Box at a reasonable price. Maybe.

1:42:49David Imel:They'll keep the same price. Just make more money on it.

1:42:53Marques Brownlee:They have actually reduced the prices of RAM quite a bit. They've crashed a lot. Good to know. It's pretty awesome. Rare good news.

1:42:58Andrew Edwards:Rare good news. Very nice. But you know what hasn't crashed and remains at an all-time high? Trivia. I don't know how that works.

1:43:08Marques Brownlee:Not my trivia points.

1:43:10David Imel:My points have been crashing over the last three months. No, they've been steady. They've been steady. That's the problem. They haven't gone up at all, but that's fine.

1:43:18Andrew Edwards:Guys, which iPhone was left at a bar and subsequently leaked by Gizmodo? What do you think, Andrew?

1:43:27David Imel:I don't want to give you guys the answers.

1:43:33Marques Brownlee:What am I second-guessing myself?

1:43:36David Imel:You're sure?

1:43:37Marques Brownlee:You really should not second-guess yourself. I'm pretty sure it's...

1:43:40David Imel:This would be pretty embarrassing. It would be. Just going to throw it out there. I'm pretty sure I'm right. I don't think anyone would be able to take you seriously if you got this wrong. Oh, my God. Oh, that's what I like to see. Okay.

1:43:56Andrew Edwards:Everyone, we all wrote the same thing. So, would you like to read the answer at the same time? One, two, three. iPhone 4.

1:44:05David Imel:Wait, David wrote sour.

1:44:08Andrew Edwards:I wrote in cursor.

1:44:09David Imel:It's a four.

1:44:11Marques Brownlee:It was, in fact, the iPhone 4. But I had a moment where I was like, is it the 4S? Nah. But no, it was the new design. Because it was a huge design.

1:44:18Andrew Edwards:iPhone 4 was the one where they changed the outside and iPhone 4S was the one where the inside sort of became the modern iPhone. On the clock. I'm going to do this score update this time. Did you already give them that point? Sweet. Marques. Yes. Caboose in it with 20 points. Cooking. Andrew. Smack dab in the middle. Sammy Nestico tune. 21 points. David. King David. Biblical King David.

1:44:51Marques Brownlee:Didn't he get his head chopped off or something? I don't think so. Okay. Don't Google it. That was Ardenas. Just revel in the mystery of whether he might have gotten his head chopped off or not.

1:45:00David Imel:Pandora's head. No. Schrodinger's head. Schrodinger's head. Pandora's head.

1:45:08Andrew Edwards:24 points.

1:45:10David Imel:How am I smack dab in the middle? Because you're in between them. But not smack dab. You're technically the median.

1:45:16Marques Brownlee:You are technically the median.

1:45:17Andrew Edwards:You're a point and a half away. I'll give you a point and a half right now so you're smacked out in the middle. I'm just kidding. April Fool's. All right. Here's Adam for the space question. Artemis has a twin brother named what? Go. Fun fact, guys. The mission is called Artemis because they're going to do the gravity assist. They're not landing on the moon, so they're going to miss. Are they going to miss? That's why they called it that.

1:45:47David Imel:I don't even know enough of these names to just guess on this one. No, that's the rock guy. Dwayne the Dwayne Dwayne. I don't know it. Let's come and read. What do you got?

1:46:03Marques Brownlee:Discovery. I wrote discovery. That doesn't sound Greek to me. Yeah, it doesn't. That is not it.

1:46:11David Imel:I wrote Zeus. At least it's Greek. I'm probably wrong. Is it? I wrote Gemini. Wrong guys. Twins. Apollo. Damn. It was right there.

1:46:28Marques Brownlee:I should have had that. As much as I know slash like about Apollo.

1:46:31David Imel:I'm so glad I got to watch your reaction when you got that wrong. Because I knew it would piss you off. Nice.

1:46:37Marques Brownlee:Wow. Well, you know, another learning experience on the pod. Wait, Apollo twin.

1:46:43David Imel:Can we call. I got Apollo twin. Can we call it Artemis then?

1:46:48Marques Brownlee:Apollo's twin is Artemis.

1:46:49David Imel:Is your universal audio interface actually Artemis? It's called Apollo Twin.

1:46:54Marques Brownlee:Which is Artemis. Which is the Artemis. That's wild.

1:46:57David Imel:That's crazy.

1:46:58Marques Brownlee:I hate that. Well, now we know. I'm going to study up on Greek mythology for next week's trivia just in case. But hey, leave your comments on why. Who had the best top five apps list? I want to know in the comments section. Now that you've made it this far, you've heard all of our top five apps lists. who had the best list, comment below. And why was it me? It was probably Adam. Adam, yeah. Thanks for watching. Catch you guys next week in April. Peace. Bye.

1:47:25David Imel:Waveform is produced by Adam Aline and Ellis Riven, a partner of Vox Media Podcast Network, and our director of music was created by Vane Still.

1:47:38David Imel:Quick pickup. Yeah. Twin brother. There we go. That's it. how are you trivia this week twin brother how are you gonna cut that

1:47:50Marques Brownlee:do do do do wait it's all up here oh I think I know