Akon: The Truth About My Multiple Wives & The Real Cost of Fame

24:46So the mixtape was just as popular as the album and the singles. So with that, I was all over Africa. We was everywhere in Africa. And then when we dropped Mr. Lonely, then I was like, okay, this is different. Because now I'm getting called on pop stages. but what was crazy was the pop audience knew the urban records they knew the locked up records they knew the ghettos I was like, ooh, this is different then we would go to places in Europe like Germany Netherlands you go to places like Germany where nobody spoke English but they sing the song from top to bottom that's when things got really interesting I wouldn't say weird, but it's funny because I would think that after I got off stage I could have a regular English conversation with you and they couldn't understand nothing.

25:35I'm like, but how are you singing my songs from top to bottom and we can't speak English together? So that weirded me out for a minute. I was like, wow, this is different. That's when I realized, okay, God is special. Right, and you're blessed. Yeah. And you're blessed. A hundred percent. When you think about your career, what was the moment where you just looked at it and said, this is surreal, I can't believe I'm doing this? I would probably say when the first time it actually happened, where I actually had that moment. Like, because I kind of expected it in certain places. Like, home in Senegal, I expected it.

26:15But it was mania, almost like Michael Jackson status. That's when I almost caught it. But I was like, well, I'm in Senegal. They're supposed to support me this way. It's like, you know. And when you say almost Michael Jackson status, you're talking about? No, like, I couldn't go nowhere. Like literally, I couldn't walk down the street. I couldn't go to the local store. It would always be thousands of people waiting outside. Thousands. Like thousands. But when I went to Zimbabwe, it was like, wait a minute. Like from the airport. We couldn't leave the airport. Like we couldn't literally leave the airport.

26:53Like we couldn't leave the airport. Like the people would not leave until I showed my space. So they had a sunroof up there, and I popped my head out the sunroof. I felt like I was in three stadiums in one. It was so many people for as long as you can see people. And I literally had to ride all the way to the airport on the roof because that was the only way. I had to be there. I just tell people like— To tell people to move out? It was like a sea of people. It was unbelievable. I mean, how does it feel to have that response to music that you create? That was another thing that was surreal. Like, you're like, damn.

27:27like my music is affecting this many people like this that's when I realized okay I got a major purpose like it's those moments that make you realize that okay everyone in life has a purpose and your purpose is always going to be intangible with your gift whatever your gift is that God gave you that's what's going to be what's going to take you or walk you through the trail that you need to walk through to get to your purpose okay that's when I realized okay music is just a vehicle for me to do what I need to do. And I'm almost positive that Africa is where I need to be doing it. Interesting. So what did you believe you needed to do if it wasn't the music?

28:03The music was the... At the time, I didn't know. Okay. I just knew I needed to be in Africa doing something because the support here is overwhelming. There's got to be something I'm supposed to be doing. And I don't think it's just to get rich. It ain't about money no more, right? You know what I mean? Like, God pushed you through those stages where, okay, you want money? Okay, here's the money. All right, you want popularity? Here's popularity. Okay. Now it's like, okay, you got the popularity, you got the money, you got the respect. Okay, what are you supposed to do with that? You don't just brag about it.

28:31I know it's something more. You got to know it's something more. You can't think that the blessings is just here for you to walk around and just say, I got, I got, I got. To me, it just didn't make sense. And then that's when we got into the charitable stuff, when I started Confidence Foundation, we started rebuilding schools and remodeling, giving computers and stuff like that. But it felt like it was still something that needed to be bigger. And it seemed like the more I got into those things, more things were introduced. And that's when we got into the electricity because I started going through those rural areas, realizing there was not even no lights.

29:02And how I even got there, I was in Sierra Leone doing a concert. This is how crazy, you know, music walks you through your purpose, right? We got the huge stadium. Sierra Leone been waiting for this concert for I don't know how long. You know, we finally get there. The place is so packed that outside the stadium, there's another 14 ,000, 15 ,000 people that couldn't get in. And I was like, those people can't get in. Why? He said, well, they can't afford the tickets. I said, okay, so all the tickets are sold out? Okay, we still have place. Because they did, they sold out all the seats. Okay. But the field still had space.

29:41But the stage was in the center of the field. Me being who I am, I need everybody that couldn't afford the tickets, put them on the field. So now the field is flooded with people. The seats is flooded with people. Everybody's happy. We start rocking. Boom. Getting to the third song, which is Ghetto. Right as we say in Ghetto, lights go out.

30:08That's a sign. That's a sign. That was a sign. But what was crazy was the lights never came back on. Oh, man. No generator? No generator. It was the stadium electricity. Well, the country. It all went out to the point where everybody got rowdy. We ended up having to redo the show. But when I realized, okay, what happened? Like, what happened? He said, well, you know, the power went out. It happens like this all the time. Like, every night it happens at a certain time. We don't know when, but we know what's going to happen. Is that the, what is it, the power load, the sharing? Yeah, it's something like that.

30:41It was something. But them, they just didn't have enough. They just didn't have enough. So ultimately, I was like, okay, we've got to figure this out. Because I don't want to be going to other countries and be having the same problem. That's when I started getting interested in energy. I said, I've got to figure out how we can fix the energy problem in Africa. Starting in Sierra Leone. So that was it. Yeah, and that's what opened the door. Yeah, look at that. Look at that. Yeah, you could see where music has guided you. So what do you believe your purpose is today? To develop Africa, 100%. I know for sure that's what it is.

31:14Because anything that I've ever done that went towards the development of Africa, I never got no pushback. Everything went smooth sailing. I'll find the right partners, right investors. Everything is rolling. And then when I realize, okay, development is coming on an abundance, on a level that Africa will never need anybody again, then you start seeing, okay? Now I understand. man, this is definitely my role. Somebody got to play it. Yes. So you're willing to step up. 100%. To that resistance. Yeah. Because if I don't know, I don't think nobody else will. Yeah.

31:51Hello. My name is Holly, and I'm asking a certain someone, my friend, my dear friend who knows who they are, to pick up the phone so that we can connect. Welcome to ID Mobile. Please leave your message after the tone. I always feel refreshed once we've had a conversation. It's almost like we go back in time to how we used to be. We reminisce. We talk about the fun days. I can't really tell how you are through text and your laugh. I can't hear your laugh over messages. and then when we do get together every two or three months it's like a huge mammoth catch-up of everything and I feel like maybe some calls between those meetups would just help us even if it's 15-20 minutes just to like touch base with each other I would really like that

32:45this may shock you one of my best friends that I've had for the last eight years I believe I've only picked up his phone call about four or five times in the eight years wow why i hate to say this but it's efficiency for me so why is that bad help me understand that i think we're choosing convenience over connection if somebody rung me and said hey holly i'm just calling you to see how you are. I'd be like, oh, wow. Really? Yeah. It makes you feel wanted and appreciated. Yeah. And important to somebody. Yeah. And I do believe if I called my best friend, he would truly feel like I thought he was important to me.

33:36Yeah. We're in partnership with ID Mobile and Mental Health UK. We want you to ditch the text. My conversation here with Holly, I've realized that I am not making my friends feel important. And when you make it a call, your friends feel your importance.

34:02So I have to show you this. All right. Tell me what's happening in this photo and who are you with?

34:13Bro, this is my most proudest photo, bro. Is it? This photo? Yes. Now, Mike, I'm a full-blown celebrity at this point. You're big. What? But you're not that big in that photo. Man, listen, I'm a child compared to this man. Yeah. I was so happy, I couldn't, man, listen, because I grew up my whole life looking up to Mike. Mike, yeah. He's like everybody's idol. Nobody can tell me that Mike didn't have some kind of impact in your life. I don't care who you are. He was my favorite growing up. Oh, my goodness. It was like growing up in New York, it was Prince versus Michael. Right. I love Prince. I never liked Prince because I like Mike.

34:54Don't say it. No, not like that. But I'm just saying if I had to choose one, yo, Mike is my boy. Yeah. So it was always that rivalry. Like I would feel guilty listening to Prince, even though I love his music, especially the Purple Rain album. Like I love that album. but I could only play it once a month because the rest of the day has got to go to Mike. Yes, yes. I was a diehard Mike fan. As much as I loved Prince, I couldn't support him openly because I rock with Mike. Yes. So with Michael, I mean, Michael Jackson, the way that I hear the story is that he wanted to work with you. Yeah. You know, so that must be one of the top crowning moments.

35:32For sure. Yeah. Without a question. Because when I was locked up, I had this 10-year plan. I said, OK, this is what I want to be able to accomplish within now and the next 10 years from the moment I get out of the ground, hitting it running, starting over here. Mike was at the top of the list on the things that I would want to achieve. Normally at the top of your list, it's always the things that you may deem impossible, but you say, you know what, if I don't try, I won't ever go. But if I can reach half that, I'm successful. Right. So you said you had Michael Jackson almost on a vision board.

36:04On the vision board. Like, my goal is to work with Mike. Okay. Before all this is over, I need to work with Mike. Once I work with him, then I know I made it. It happened in five years. It didn't even take 10. So I was already, like, blown away at that point. It was unbelievable, yeah. Yeah, yeah. And so you work with him now. I have to ask, right, because I'm fresh off of C.M. Michael in the theater, right? and first is what was it like working with Mike? What was your biggest surprise working with him? First of all, it was a surreal, unbelievable moment, electrifying the work of Mike in the studio.

36:48My biggest surprise, though, working with him was how easy it was to work with him. Working with him made me understand why he's as big as he is because he had no ego, literally no ego. He would do any and everything or even try if I asked him to do it. He didn't care. He was like, listen, I called you in here because I believe in what you do and I need that to rub off of what I'm doing. I need to do something that I wouldn't think of doing. If I would have asked Mark to bark on the record, he would have did it just because I asked him to do it. And he would also want to see what it sounded like.

37:23He's not even like, nah, man, I ain't no dog. I ain't barking on that record. He wouldn't have did that. He would have been like, roof, roof. How did that sound? What do you think? Like he gives you 100 % trust. When he hires you to do something, he's like, it's your ship. You tell me. I'm doing, you know, whatever you need me to do, I'm doing it. That's how much trust he has in it. And not too many artists have that in either a producer or songwriter or someone that curates their sound. Or someone that's already known for a specific sound. You know what I'm saying? It was like, to see that, I was like, wow, I remember working with artists that went wood in the hood.

37:58Like, ain't had a, ain't sold no records. And you think you're working with someone like a Mike because of how they moving. And I'm like, but Mike was like, he was like, he had so much passion for the art. He never questioned it. Like, he already knew that the combination of us was gonna be, like, he didn't have to think about it. So he just trusted it. Yeah, he just trusted the process. And then after you two would create, would he then give opinion or he just trusted you? No, that's exactly. He would just trust. He would just trust. And me, because I trust the same way, I'd be like, Mike, well, just do whatever you feel.

38:33We're going to keep what's good. We're going to keep what's not. I mean, he's Michael Jackson. Yeah. Everything ain't always good, though. That's another thing that will surprise me. Some things weren't as good as I... I'm like, damn, it's Mike. But I realized, even with me, everything ain't always... This is records you ain't never going to hear, ever going to hear. Right, right. You know what I'm saying? The stuff that I really, really believe in, boom. Like, there was times where I thought Mike couldn't hit a bad note. You know? But I realized Mike was human like we all was. Right. But he was a perfectionist, though.

38:59He wasn't letting it go unless it was perfect. That's for sure. Okay. I mean, and I have to ask, not to be on the controversial side, but just the more and more people that I talk to in the industry. Right, right. I read once that you said he was the healthiest person that you knew. Yeah. From what I've known, he was super, super healthy. Super, super healthy. Ate good. He had a schedule for his food. He was just very organized. How do you truly, how do you believe he died? I just believe that. I mean, what I believe is what I believe. I just don't feel like, I just feel like there's a lot of holes.

39:38Like, it's not a solid canvas on the explanation of his death. I just honestly believe that there should be a lot more investigating need to be done, without a question. So do you fear that, right? And the reason why I bring this up is truly not to be conspiracy theorist, but because I now understand more about power and the threat that comes with it. So do you fear that as your power and influence grows, especially with projects in Africa, do you ever have the fear of a threat against your life? Not really. Like, that's the one thing I've never been afraid of is dying because I just feel like God's disciples are meant to come back.

40:30Like, death is a promise. The question is, once you die, how will you be remembered? What have you accomplished before then? Or was your purpose fulfilled before you died? Okay. Like, death was never an issue for me. Like, even that's why I was probably so successful in the street because I didn't, I always felt like God was protecting me at every moment. Like, so even with stuff like this, that's why I said I welcomed it. Like, because I know it's coming and I know that what I'm doing is something that was worth doing. That's why I'm getting the resistance. Yes. You know what I'm saying? Yes.

41:02But death can't be, if you're a man of faith, death can't ever be something that you fear. Because then you really have to question your own faith and question yourself. Okay. The moment you're afraid to die, now you have to ask yourself, like, why? Like, you're supposed to be welcoming that, to be honest. Like, if your faith is as true as if you say it is. Okay. You know what I mean? And has your faith always been that level of strength? When I was younger? No. Okay. I was scared because I didn't know what to face. I didn't know what I was going to face. Like, okay, what happens when you die?

41:36You ask all them questions. Like, if you go to hell, you go to heaven. Yeah, what does it look like? Is it over? Is it black? Is it dark? Are you reincarcionated into a tree, a cup? You don't know. It's all these questions. But then when you realize some things ain't meant to be explained and there's some things that our mind capacity will never be able to understand. You know what I mean? That's just a part of the faith. The same way we've never met God, but we know he exists. Okay. For whatever higher being it is that you worship. You worship. All right. Can we unpack that piece? Right. Because in looking at interviews and research around you, the one part that I have a question mark on, like a curious piece on, is how you grew up.

42:21Oh, man. And the circumstances. Because even to hear you talk about Senegal and you talked about how you lived with different religion and how there wasn't conflict. I think a lot of people think Africa, conflict, conflict. I'm with you. Right. But Senegal was one of the few places where there was no significant conflict, right? And I think that that does shape. No, it does. It shapes, yeah. So when you go back, you were born, though, in the States. In St. Louis, yeah. Okay, born in St. Louis. What do you remember about, so when you think earliest memory of childhood, what was that like for you?

43:02Well, it was my earliest memories. I kind of wanted to go back to Senegal. Okay. Because, okay, so when we were born, my dad was a forward thinker. Like, I think I got that from him, always trying to vision the future. Every time one of us was born, he would fly my mom to the States, she would have us, and he would send us back to Africa. So we all came to the States to be born for our U.S. citizenship, and he would send us back. And, you know, we went to school there until we were old enough to come to the States to finish school. So all of us came like around seven or eight between all of my brothers.

43:38And then when you went back. Our earlier years, we were in Senegal. That's why we all still speak Wolof. You know, we're all accustomed to our native tongue and everything else, culture and everything. Okay. And even on that, and so how many, because is it 19 of y 'all? Yeah, my dad. Yeah, my dad is, yeah. He's a king. Literally. Literally. Yeah. So you had 19 siblings. Or 18 siblings, including you? It's something like that. Okay. So you don't even know the number. I don't. It don't even matter no more. Really? I swear it don't. Okay. Because my dad, my pops is about 89 now. Okay. And I got a 9-year-old brother.

44:15So he had a child at 80. Yeah. Which that means the genes are that strong, and I don't have to worry about it. I know at 80, I'm going to still be pumping out babies. Okay. But are you, though? I don't know. We'll see. You know, if I reach 80, God willing. All right. So then born for the U.S. citizenship in the States. Right. But then you go back. So growing up in Senegal, how did that, how do you think that shaped? No, that shaped me, period. Like, I think those earlier years gave me, like, you know how they say you want to teach the child as much as you possibly can when they're at that sponge years.

44:53and that was the one thing that I my pop did nothing else right in his life he did that right because he made sure while we were young we learned multiple languages we learned our culture we knew where we came from and that mindset that came from the idea of treating everybody the same no matter what your faith was and just understanding life from a family perspective that came with me because all my friends I couldn't understand when I got to the U.S. how none of them had their fathers around like where's your dad though bro like you know or where's your big brother you know or where's your mom for that matter you had single fathers raising kids it was a lot of single parent way of life in America and I couldn't understand like how this was possible or how my friends would be spending weeks at a time in my house and his parents don't call a check on them and where they at.

45:45So I understood that there was a huge displacement in family values in America. And I came with that. So I invited everybody. Like, even now, like, my brother Babs would tell me, yo, bro, you're too nice. Like, you give everybody a chance. You know what I mean? Yes. But I don't know how to not give them. Like, I'm the kind of person that gives you 100 % trust from the moment we meet until you pull those layers off and don't trust you no more. Right. But I'm not going to meet you not trusting you. Okay. It's the other way around. I'm with you. So then you were in the States because your father was a musician, so he's traveling.

46:20And so where were you? Was it Newark that you spent most of the time? Yeah, when I got to New Jersey, I was Jersey City. Oh, Jersey City. It was Jersey City, but I used to work in Newark. Okay. So I was back and forth between Jersey City and Newark, which was like the two craziest sides. You from Queens, you already know I have to tell you. I'm not going to say it. You say it. You get in trouble. I'm not going to say it. You go ahead. Dirty Jersey, boy. But on the real, for all of us that know, it's a rough spot. Yeah, it's a rough, rough spot. But I think what helped me in Jersey was the fact that when I was in St.

46:57Louis, I lived in East St. Louis. Okay, yeah. So East St. Louis is equivalent to what—I think East St. Louis is probably the reason why Chicago is what it is today. Because at that time, in that area, it was so bad that the police went on strike for 30 days. Now, I don't know an area that could be that bad where the cops go and strike. It was just unbelievable. But when I got to Jersey, it wasn't as bad from how everyone seen it to be because I already came from a culture in Africa where I already experienced extreme poverty from a level of living out in the rural areas, you know, drinking well water and electricity was literally candles and kerosene lamps.

47:37We didn't have the luxury that I got in the States. So everything in the States to me was luxury. Interesting. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, that's interesting. It was different. While they're complaining about it, I'm like, man, this is what? This is it. We got lights on. Man, we got switches, clean water on the faucet. Y 'all tripping. Yeah. You know? So it was definitely different. And so in the States, were you, because at a certain point, it was just what? You and your brother. Yeah, just me and my brother Muhammad. Yeah, my older brother. So this is in Jersey? In Jersey City. So we had a three-story house in Jersey City on Kennedy Boulevard.

48:08Okay. And my dad had an opportunity to go to Atlanta, Clark Atlanta, on a cultural exchange program as a professor there. So he's like, listen, Mo, you only got one year left. Ali, which is me, you got two years left. You decide if y 'all want to stay, you know, because Mo was responsible. So if your brother's going to stay, then you guys can stay after the next year. You graduate, you can come meet me in Atlanta. This is in high school? This was in high school. Okay. So me and my older brother, Muhammad, stayed at the house while my mom and my pop went off to Atlanta with my other brothers. Wow.

48:38So you were how old? Like 16? I was in high school. 15, 16? No, I was older than that because when I came from Africa, I didn't speak no English. I didn't graduate high school until I was like 20, 20, 21. Really? Yeah. Okay. Yeah, that's older. So I was older. Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. So a lot of people were like, how are your parents going to leave you? I mean, I was actually 18. You were a man. I was grown. But I was still in high school, though. You know what I mean? Wow. I didn't realize that. So you were an older high school student. I was an older high school student. And it was because you didn't speak English?

49:08Because I had to learn how to speak English. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So that makes sense. They leave, but you're still 20. Yeah, practically. Chilling. You know, but you then grow up with your brother. Yeah. And you're in Newark. Yeah. It was a hustle. Because now, because we're a little, I wouldn't want to say older, but because Pops gave us that opportunity to be mature, have our own space, At least I didn't want to be calling my dad for no money or calling him to pay the rent. I'm like, yo, he left us here with the house. We should let him know that we got this. Wow. So that's when I get to hustling because I ain't want pop to even know that we was taking care of the bills.

49:48The last thing I wanted to do was call my dad for electricity or for a phone or a water bill, for nothing. I want him to say, okay, my boy's got this. You know what I mean? So it was my pride really killing and kicking in. But then that's when I got to hustling. And in Newark, at that time, it was like the car theft capital of the world. So stealing cars was like the thing. And I used to love cars. So that's what I got into. So I would drive to school in like the most high-end vehicles. And all the girls thought that, you know, I was rich. So I would tell them all I was a prince in Africa. I come to school in a different car every week.

50:24They're like, yo, you're a prince. Well, but I mean... Hey, it worked. You know what I'm saying? Hey, you got to get out how you live. I see it. I see it. So it was stealing cars. Yep. That was really... Because I always felt like drug dealing was, God, have been the dumbest hustle. Because it didn't make sense, especially for the risk that came with it. Right? Any morning you get stuck up, get shot and killed, you got to constantly watch your back. And you get caught with it. I mean, for a brick, you're doing 25 to life. Yep. Yep. And the profit on it is only$2 ,500. $5 ,000 if you're lucky. Right.

51:04You know what I mean? And you got to sell it on the bulk to get it. I mean, you sell one, you may get close to a five if ain't nobody supplying. But unless you're doing some major heavy weight at$2 ,500 apiece, you ain't seeing no money. For the risks that come with it, it doesn't make sense. So how much do you make selling cars? Cars? Man, for every car I got rid of, I'm making like$1 ,500,$20 ,000. Wow. And if I got the key to it and I get locked up, that's a joyriding charge. It's a misdemeanor. It goes right off your record. Wow. $15 ,000 to$20 ,000. Think about it. And you get the perks. Driving through in the ride, looking nice.

51:38Riding nice. Shorty's looking at you, so you get the perks of the beautiful women on top of that. Ain't no risk. And if I get jacked, man, you can have that. I'm going to go pick up another one. Another car. You know? Yeah. Okay. It was a different level of thinking at that time. How much did you make, you think, stealing cars? I mean, it was very successful for me. Because when I left New Jersey and went to Atlanta with my dad, it was a clean slate in Atlanta. They didn't even know. They were slow on that hustle. So by the time I set up shopping in Atlanta, I was making like$200 ,000, maybe$250 ,000 a week.

52:11It was at that time. By yourself? Yeah. To the point where I had to bring in some help. That was the biggest mistake I should have ever made because I should have just kept it by myself. But I was making in so much money that I had to figure out how I'm going to launder it, like move it around. And that's what I thought about it because studios, music studios was a cash business. So I was like, you know what? Let me build a few music studios. A few? A few because I had three recording studios in Atlanta. So that became how I justified how I made my money. So I would let everybody use it just to keep it busy for free.

52:45Didn't have to pay no money. And I think, too, people need to understand Atlanta. This is what year in Atlanta. I would say from the moment I got there, like around late 93 to 98, that was my window. That was your window. All right. So I think, paint the picture because, I mean, I remember Atlanta during that time. I visited Atlanta. Freak Niggas what got me there. Please, because many people will not know because Freak Niggas is done. It's over now. Yeah, Freak Niggas is over. But what was it? Freak Nick was probably the, it was the biggest high school, no, no, biggest college, the biggest college spring weekend festival.

53:26I mean, the flyest, the baddest chicks from everywhere in like America, excuse me, were flying, driving. And it was like a fest, like, but it was like a fest with no filters. Girls would be twerking on top of the cars, drinking. I mean, like, it was, I mean, you had, I can understand now why they stopped it. Because literally girls would be butt naked on the hood of the car at a stoplight just twerking. That's why they called it Freak Nick. Yes, and there was no social media. It was no social media. Right now, if you go back, if you go on YouTube, you may see a few documentaries that was built around Freak Nick.

54:08but it was all on camcorder shots that people that just happened to have camcorders. But man, when I tell you that experience, when I moved out, I went to visit my pop and never went back to Jersey after Freaknik. Yeah, I mean, Freaknik. I stayed. Atlanta was, so I mean, Freaknik was one thing. Yeah. But Atlanta also. Oh, and then at that time, it was like Atlanta was a huge population of just successful black people. Yes. It was the same when I visited. I'd never seen them. Unbelievable. I mean, you had guys that own their own high-rises, everybody riding in beautiful whips, beautiful houses out in Alpharetta.

54:42First Bentley I ever saw was in Atlanta. But you know who was driving it? Who that? Bishop Eddie Long. Oh, yeah. Bishop Eddie Long. I got to tell you this. No, no, no, I got to tell you. We went to Atlanta. It was for a Hawks game. And I saw a Bentley drive around, right, just the front of it. Right. And then it stopped. Then the driver got out. it wasn't raining but somebody pulled out an umbrella oh boy Bishop used to show out open the door oh my goodness Cain comes out it's Bishop Eddie Long and I said I was like okay I seen it all now nah Bishop Bishop Eddie Long for those that don't know New Birth Church yeah for those that don't know he was the he was the preacher at New Birth but I will say this shout out to Pastor Jamal Bryant I know him I know he's he's the pastor there now wow and He could probably tell you some stories, huh?

55:36Oh, man. But I will say this. Pastor Jamal Bryan was the first person ever to pay me to speak publicly. Wow. He brought me to his church in Maryland. I'll never forget it. Unbelievable. I had just written my book, brought me to the church, paid me, and then he ensured that the congregation bought my book. That's amazing. And it changed my life. Atlanta was so vibrant, man. And then the music. So was that Jermaine Dupri, So So Def? So So Def was founded in Atlanta. Okay. La Face was the biggest label that came out of Atlanta. That's right. La Face is actually what created the opportunity for all of what you see that's coming out of Atlanta today.

56:15All of them starting with Outkast, TLC, Usher Raymond, Pink. I mean, you name it, man. It was like they were, they were like Goody Mob. It was around that time where my studios was jam packed. Yes. And you had all those artists I would imagine in there. many artists that used to use my studios for absolute free. Wow. So we fast forward four or five years later, I get clipped, and now I'm in jail. OK, I'm not, this is never, this ain't the life I want to live. That was a turning point when I realized, OK, I know what I need to be doing, and it ain't this. Mm. All right, now, how long were you locked up for?

56:54About three years. OK. I got out 20, no, 2001. Then when I got out, the first thing I did was go and start recording all the songs that I wrote when I was in jail. And then I realized that Locked Up was the first record that I wanted to release, because I felt like that was the moment that I was in at that time. And then Steve Rifkin, who I was assigned to over at SRC, kind of was with me, but Universal wanted to release Bonanza. That became the record that they felt like was the record. But you had the deal already when you were locked up or no? No. You had no deal when you had the deal. I had no deal when I was locked up.

57:32Okay. So where does Fugees and Wyclef come in? That was all when I was doing cars. Oh, okay. Yeah. So while I was in Newark doing cars. Oh, that's right. Because Fugees, a Jersey. Yeah. We was right there on Clinton Ave. Like we had the Booger Basement. Well, they had the Booger Basement there and they welcomed all of us. You know, Jerry Wanda's uncle was the one that actually owned the house. Okay. And Jerry was a monk, immaculate producer to this day. We had him do a lot of records together. But, you know, we all used to work at the basement. And me at that time, music wasn't something that I took seriously.

58:07Because I was hustling. I was like, oh, I got it. But whenever I was fleeing from the cops or something, I go straight to the studio. They don't want to know where to find me. Or I finish my day just, you know, going. Clef would always look at me like, man, you up to something. What you up to, bro? He would see me coming to these different cars. And then one day you said, I don't know what you up to, man, but I'm just telling you, bro, whatever you're doing, it ain't going to amount to nothing, man. Figure out what you want. You're a talented writer. You're a dope producer. Just come rock with us.

58:36Spend time over here. With that energy that you got over there, put that energy over here. Wow. And of course, I hear it. Two, three days later, I go out and get my bread. It goes through one ear and out the other. So it was that, right? But I would always be at the basement. So they made me family. Every time there was a show, concert, yo, we got a performance over here. We're going to be at such and such park. We got a show in Brooklyn. And I would always come to the show. And every time I come to the show, Clef would always bring me on stage. Oh, wow. And let me freestyle. Okay. You know what I mean?

59:05Like, yeah, we got newest member of the refugee camp. He bring me on out freestyle. And at that time, they knew what it was. I didn't even realize. So you were official? Yeah, I was an official refugee camp member. Wow. Okay. I just ain't taking it as serious. You know? But that's what it took. Because when I got locked up, and I'm watching the television, and I see the Fugees blowing up, Thank you. Killing me softly, ready or not, going diamond, and I'm sitting like, what am I doing here? That was another major motivation for me, too. Was to see how well they climbed. To see them, yeah. While I'm in jail, they up there blowing up.

59:41And I'm like, man, I could have been over there with these guys. Okay. It changes everything. So now I see you're motivated to write. Right. And so tell me about the 10-year plan, though, because I think that's really interesting, how you created basically a vision statement for your life. Yeah, the vision board. Yeah, so when I was in there, you know, I would just write on strength, right? And then I was writing locked up. And as I'm writing locked up, you know, every once in a while I just kind of like sing it to myself to make sure I got what I want. And there was this older guy named Booney who was like my cellmate.

1:00:13And he would sit there and be like, Youngblood, man, what you doing here, man? All this talent, man. If you put all that energy that you had in them streets into your music, man, you'd be, you wouldn't be here. You know how big you can be You know how big you can be And I was like man you know what you write And then one day we just happened to be In the pod We was playing I think we were playing Spades And then Booney was like young blood sing that song man Sing that song for everybody you sung for me last night man Sing that song for me And I was saying I'm locked up they won't let me out So then they was like Oh that's your heart That's your heart.

1:00:52Right? So now, every time a guard would walk past, we would sing the song out together. I'm locked up. They won't let me out, bitch. They won't let me out. I'm locked up. Won't let me out, bitch. That's the original version. Right? So then it became an anthem where every pod would sing it every time a guard would walk past. Oh, wow. And Booney was like, see what I'm saying? Look at this, man. He only sang this last week. This is an anthem in here now. Bro, I'm telling you, boy, you better focus, man. You better focus. He was an older guy. He was like 67. He's like, see, I'm telling you, man, if you don't do nothing else, if you don't get nothing else from here, just remember I told you, if you focus on that music, boy, that's your freedom.

1:01:32And I thought about it. I said, you know what? You're right. So I went out. I incorporated my company. I said, yo, Boone, I took your advice. I started my company, man. What you think? He said, yeah, what you named it? I said, Convict Music. He said, why the fuck would you do that? Convict music, man, that's the dumbest name I ever heard in my life. Oh, my God. I mean. Right? I said, nah, but think about it, Booney. You know, that's what inspired me, man, to do this, man. And this music is starting from here. And I'm telling them what I'm going to do. And I'm showing them. So I'm going to say, hey, put together a business plan and let me see it.

1:02:07And I put together a whole business plan. Then I wrote out what I wanted to do in the next 10 years. Okay. And what was on? What were some of those moments on the 10-year plan? The first thing, I wanted to record these songs. That was the first thing. I got to get me another studio and record these songs. That's going to be the first thing I do. Once I get these songs, then I'm going to go out and get me a record deal. Once I get this record deal, I'm going to get that money from a record deal, and I'm going to purchase an illegitimate studio. Okay. Right? And then from there, I'm just going to create a catalog.

1:02:35I'm going to write for everybody that needs songs. I'm going to be a writer, a composer. And if the artist stuff works, that's cool. But I know this part, it's a no-brainer because I know I got this. And then the next thing I'm going to do, I'm going to take all these songs, I'm going to take it to the Fugees, and I'm going to see how many songs they want and take. I'm just going to write for them, and I'm going to stay on the road with them and all this. By that time, they were so big. And then there was some friction going on within the family. You know, cries. He's the businessman moving. Clef and Lauren wasn't getting along, seeing eye to eye.

1:03:06So it was a lot of little things. I was like, okay, that can't work because they got to fix that before I could be a part of what's going on. And then you had Spider and you had all these other members. They had their stuff going on, so now we're all kind of coming together, but we can't be the nucleus without the three main members, right? So then I was like, okay, I need to just focus and be, you know, going. That's when I ran into Lil Zane. Yes, yes. Lil Zane used to live in my complex, and he was riding his bike. Little kid. Oh, so he was only 13 years old. Oh, wow. So this is, like, before he was real Lil Zane.

1:03:39Yes, he was only 13 years old, and he rode past, and he came to me. He said, man, I heard you produce. I said, yeah, how you know? He said, yeah, man, I heard you produce. He said, I rap. I said, you rap? He said, yeah, I said, rap for me. He rap for me. I was like, man, this little man, you're hard. You know what I'm saying? Like super hard. So then he's like, yeah, man, I'm signed and I'm with Naughty by Nature. I said, oh, they from Jersey? I know them. Okay. So he told me about Vinny and what he was doing with them over there and Tretch and all of them and then come to find out they had a single deal with RCA.

1:04:14So Lil Zane then introduced me to a guy named Divine Stevens, who was doing all of the artist development for LaFace in Atlanta. So even to this day when people say, well, you know, who discovered you? I'd be like, it was Lil Zane, to be honest, because he was the one that put me in pocket to meet with Divine, who later brought me to Steve Rifkin. Wow, that's incredible. Yeah. Yeah, that's incredible. Isn't that crazy? But also, I mean, it was definitely Lil Zane made the play, but if you hadn't had the relationship with the Fugees. Oh, yeah. Eventually, I think it would have all came together.

1:04:47Yeah. But I think that route was the route that it was meant to be. Because what's the odds of a 13-year-old kid taking me to a connect that puts me on? Yeah. Like, the odds of that. Yeah. He's 13. Yeah. It's incredible. You know what I mean? It's incredible. And so when you look at your career, it's interesting. We talked a lot about the career, but more so about the highlight of it. Right. What do you believe was the darkest moment in your music career? I think the darkest moment is when I got locked up, to be honest. That was the darkest moment, period. But then while I was in there, I kind of saw the light at the end of the tunnel.

1:05:24It's almost like I had to sit down. Like I was out of control. Like I needed to be locked up. to be honest. Because at that time, I thought I was being punished, but later I realized God was preserving me for something. Because the other two guys that I was moving in with, they both doing life in prison right now to this day. Are they? And they got locked up while I was in jail. I see. So he preserved me. You know what I mean? Yeah, that's heavy. Yeah, it's that, yeah. Yeah, that's heavy. The older I've gotten, the more conscious I've become about keeping a high protein diet. And not in an obsessive way, but more just paying attention.

1:06:02Because when I'm getting enough protein, I feel it. Mentally, I'm sharper. My energy doesn't drop at 3 p.m. And after a workout, I'm just not wiped out for the next two days. Now, the hardest part has always been staying consistent. I travel constantly. Sometimes I'm on set. Sometimes I'm in a studio. Sometimes I'm at a desk. And the idea that I'm sitting down to a perfectly balanced, protein-rich meal three times a day, well, that'll just never be my life. So I lean on our sponsor, Huel. Now, their Black Edition powder is what I use when I'm at home. It's 40 grams of protein and 26 vitamins and minerals.

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1:07:47What pains you today? Nothing. There's nothing. The only thing, but I don't want to call it pain. Okay. The only thing that bothers me is that Africans can't come together and unite. That's the only thing that, when I think about it, makes me angry. Because we have the potential to be so much more if we came together. Yes. And I'm with that. But just on you, though, there must be moments where something feels heavy to you. That's the only thing that feels heavy. I swear to God. That's the only thing that feels heavy to you. That's the only thing. I mean, what about, I mean, you've got kids. Yeah, but my kids are fine.

1:08:32My kids are great. Relationships are good. It's all manageable. And those are things I can control. I mean, so, all right, so I'm a father. I have two boys. Right. And I always say that my, and maybe this is not the right thing to say, but this is what I say, is that my happiness is based on their happiness. So if they're in a situation where, like, I know one is sick, then I'm not in the greatest moods because he's sick. Right. You know, so my happiness is almost based on that. But as a parent, that's automatic. Right. That's father, mother. Like, that's automatic. I don't even think you can count that because that's just what it, that's your seed.

1:09:13They're connected to you. Like, you know what I'm saying? Fair. But when it's people that aren't connected to you genealogically, you know what I mean? Genealically, whatever. Genetically. Genetically. There we go. I couldn't find a word for nothing. Right? When they're genetically not connected to you, but there's a spiritual connection, it hits a little harder because it's in your soul. because I honestly believe somehow, someway, like even sometimes, like I may say the dumbest thing online because I know people are going to comment about it to create a conversation about something that's important.

1:09:50Okay. You understand what I'm saying? So do you intentionally do that? 100%. So would you put yourself as a, you say you're a rage baiter then? No, not quite. It's a method. Because one thing, like prime example, one of my earliest songs, right? the one album that I can say was true to me was my first album, Trouble. Okay. Right? After the Trouble album, I realized, okay, this is a business. The world ain't going to always want to hear about my problems. So I'm experiencing different things that they also can relate to. That's when Convicted came in. Right? Convicted was stories of success, but also stories not about me, but what other people felt and what other people saw.

1:10:32But there was also a lot of ignorance in that album that I knew would draw the people that I needed to hear me. Oh, interesting. Right? So I got I Wanna Fuck You, Smack That. The shit I normally wouldn't sing about, but I know it's gonna draw an audience that I need to talk to. Then I go into Freedom, which is a little bit different. You understand what I'm saying? But it also opened up a platform for me to talk to certain people that normally wouldn't listen. Interesting. So you're saying you strategically dangled the carrot. Oh, yeah. 100%. So you talked about, what would you say, what, ignorant stuff?

1:11:07Right. Because it's going to open up the comment. Okay. And guess what happens? It's the best thing because when it does open those comments, I'm reading them. And it's always somebody that asks a question where I'll be like, bingo. And that's who I respond to. And guess what that does? It opens up a whole conversation. And my followers know, like they know. Yes. Because they've seen the threads of real conversations about what us as a people, what us as humans, the challenges that we need to face to have these certain discussions. Yes. Right? And all the time it's about culture building, right, and tradition building.

1:11:46Because most African Americans don't have a culture that they are aware of from an educational perspective. They know what they were raised around, but their background is very hazy because they wasn't taught that because of the way the system was built in America to teach them black history. Yeah. And also, too, is your approach to this. Right. I mean, I can't act like, oh, I'm shocked. That's entertaining to me. Because every, I would say, every uberly successful entertainer that I've ever talked to has been fully aware of the business of entertainment. Right. And that the business of entertainment is to draw out emotion.

1:12:28100%. Fear, joy, happiness, sadness. And then try to deliver the message. 100%. Throughout it. 100%. So I can't act like I'm shocked because that makes sense. I mean, that's what it is. You got to know how to manipulate the algorithm because the attention span is only small. And the average person is going to respond to something negative before they respond to something positive. Yes, yes. All right. So then on that then, is there anything that you want to clarify? No. He's like, no, I need it. I need that. I need it. All right. So then can I ask you some questions that are lingering? and you don't have to answer.

1:13:13So first is, this is going to sound wild, what is your name? What is your real name? I'm serious. Yo, because I like you and you are my brother from another mother. I will give you a hint, but I can't give you the full. Okay, okay. All right? All right. And if I give you one word, if you feel my soul, you will understand. Okay. Entertainment.

1:13:50Why are you looking at me like that? Are you serious? But are you serious? Are you serious? What? I mean, you said one word. What did I say? You said entertainment. I'm an entertainer, yes. I'm an entertainer. But your name, though. What about it? My name is Akon. But full name. Full name. You want to hear it? Yes. I will give you the backstory, but I can't. Because I already gave you a hint. Okay. But it's...

1:14:22Look at your face.

1:14:28Yeah. Okay. In 10 years, I'm going to give you the full definition, story... Yes. where it came from, how it came from, which family member, how, and how it became what it is. Okay, but in 10 years. But I need people to search, research, understand. Okay, all right. I'm with you. I'm not mad at it. But you're the closest to ever get me this close to explaining the meaning of that name. You know, I appreciate it. I do. Because I have, I think that there are people who have questions, but then we have to understand what we were just talking about, and that is that you have been very successful at keeping our attention for a long period of time.

1:15:13Like, you've been in the game for a minute, and you are still selling out arenas. And so for you to do that, from what I understand about the music business, it's not just about the music, it's about the business. No, it's the business. I mean, it's the music business. People forget the word business even is even attached to music business, right? So this generation, they kind of did a leapfrog. They skipped the business and went straight to marketing. Right? Before, in my generation, they ran with the music and forgot the business. And in this generation, skipped the business and go straight to marketing.

1:15:53Okay. So the interesting part about it is that they're both in the same boat because you got these kids that go viral every week and wondering why their bank account is empty. Not realizing that viral moment just generated millions for somebody and you weren't a part of it. Right, right, yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. So the popularity will always win in human nature because everybody wants to be popular. But the problem is popularity comes with a cost. Because now when you're popular, everybody thinks you're rich. So when you're popular with no money, mental awareness kicks in depression kicks in this is what all these kids are going through right now we just had James Sexton he's one of the most famous divorce attorneys in the world he said the same thing he said that the worst thing you could be is popular and broke oh my goodness have you been there?

1:16:53yeah you would never know it though we all been through it The most famous, the most so-called rich you have to go through. There's no way around it. How so? It's just how the business goes, especially if you're an investor or you're a businessman. You're going to take losses. That's a part of the business. You're going to take losses. The question is how do you pad those losses to where you're not lost long enough to lose it. Okay. But you're going to hit those little potholes, like the same way the stock market goes up and down. Yeah. You got a pattern enough to where when the stock market drops, you got enough to hold you until that stock lifts back up.

1:17:31And it's no different being a celebrity, a businessman, or someone to claim to be a billionaire. Okay, that's fair. I mean, think about Trump. He's been a billionaire for how many years that you've known him? For all your life, right? Yes. But he was a billionaire in the negative. He owed billions. Right, right. That ain't a billionaire. Right, yeah, that's true. Now he's in the positive. Way up. Man, once you file bankruptcy, you're no longer a billionaire. But once you hold that title, those decisions that you make can keep you there from a strategy or image perspective. But liquid, man, you're working off and living off credit.

1:18:08Yes, yes, yes. Can we talk, if you're open to talk about this, can we talk about relationships? I'm always open to talk about relationships. All right, because this is my background, is that I was a matchmaker. and most of this conversation, this show, started with relationships. Interesting. And I see that your talks on relationships, when you talk about relationships, it gets a lot of attention. But let's not necessarily clarify, but just get your opinion on certain things. Right. So first is you, and I would imagine that you're, so you believe in polyamory. Yeah, polyamory, yeah. Yeah. And one thing I will say that I think there's a lot of people that's like, oh, polyamory.

1:18:50I think we have to understand, because I've researched the hell out of polyamory, is that I've seen that 82 % to 85 % of societies around the world at some point have allowed, practiced polyamory. Right. So I think we have to understand that the majority of the world, at some point, societies practiced it. Because polyamory is a natural behavior for men. This is a natural behavior. Now, because of the rules that are set around us, we control that behavior to, you could say, appease our partner because of the same rules that we're living by and that we're, you can say, agreeing upon. Does that make sense?

1:19:37It does. Because when you're single, it's not a problem. It's only when you are attached or you've promised someone that this is a relationship that we're supposed to hold in the rules that you decide to hold it in, if that makes sense. All right. But the only pushback I throw is that I think, I feel like men and women have evolved as both monogamous, you know. So monogamy, practicing monogamy, and non-ethical or no, no, let me say monogamy and polyamorous. You say creative. And creative, right? Because the way that I see it is that there's a lot of, you know, so pair bonding is natural. Pair bonding is you connect with one person, you feel the emotion, you feel jealous if they're with somebody else.

1:20:24It's all human. That's human genetics. But also we have evolved from, let's see how many people we can have, we can genetically pass our, or we can pass ourselves on. Now that's different. That is different. Because that's careless. Like, okay, you don't just go out and say, okay, let me just see how many chicks I can get. Or how many homies I can smash. Ball players, whatever, right? I think that behavior is completely careless. Now, who you attracted to naturally, that's a feeling that you can't escape, you can't deny because it is what it is. A feeling is a real feeling. You can't control who you're attracted to, right?

1:21:11But you can control who you decide to approach that attraction towards. Yes. You follow what I'm saying? Yes. That's why I said single people, oh, yeah, you guys are all day can move how you want to move, whether it's in secret or it's in open. If it's going to be open, just be completely honest. Yes. Okay. That's all I ever say. If you're going to do it, be honest about it. Yes. That's it. Yes. There's nothing more. The problem is the majority of the critics are hypocritical because they're saying that this ain't right, but yet they're doing it. Because there's not a person, I promise you, that ever critiqued or critiqued anything that I've ever said that if I went and did a background check on them right now or hired a private investigator that I wouldn't find nothing.

1:21:52That's just being real, right? So the thing is, I think as humans, sometimes we find ourselves judging others, not understanding the pathway they went through. because most of the time, oftentimes when I'm talking, I'm talking relating to culture. The culture that we came up in Africa, culture that certain people came up in the Middle East, and even in Asia, is just totally different from how it is in America and Europe. Yeah. But then also in American Europe right now, polyamory is increasing. Right. No, they're just more open with it. It's always been there. Yeah. Okay. It's always been there.

1:22:22They're just now just being open with it. Fair, fair. And also, I think it's important to me to underscore that to marry multiple wives or husbands is illegal in the U.S. and the U.K.? Right. It is. However, is it practiced? Yes. Yeah. I mean, if you go to Utah, it's illegal. It's legal in Utah. So I thought it was still illegal, but it's practiced. This is what I mean when I say it's hypocritical. It doesn't make sense. Like how in the state of Utah it's legal because you can go through the courthouse and literally marry as many as you want. Not even, at least in Islam, you're entitled to four.

1:23:02And four is a heavy load on a man. Like, you can barely deal with one, let alone four, right? So in Utah, you can marry as many as you like. But it's not a conversation as to what that is because there's no explanation for it. Okay, okay. You follow what I'm saying? All right. And if you do create an explanation, then it becomes racist And you don't want to go that route. Right. Because you want to keep it traditional from a cultural perspective. So it's just really a matter of understanding that there's different cultures in the world. If you don't understand it, learn it or find a way to understand it.

1:23:39Or if that's not your cup of tea, it's okay. That person can be able to exercise that culture without it affecting you. Right. Unless you're interested in yourself and just can't do it. And this is the culture that you grew up in. As a Muslim. As a Muslim. Right. Right. And then in Senegal in particular, I would imagine that. Oh, yeah. Our president right now, our president has two wives. Yes. Yes. All right. So now, currently, can you say how many wives do you have? I just believe that's your imagination. Is it more than the president of Senegal? It's entertainment.

1:24:18Okay. All right. So then how about this is that have you, you have recently the broken up with one of your wives. That's entertainment as well. That's entertainment. Okay. All right. So then on this is, and maybe this is entertainment too, is in polyamorous relationships. Right. I've seen that there's different setups. Yeah. Some of the setups are, I think, and I could mispronounce this, but it's sororal. So they are like sister wives. Like they know each other. Right. Get on almost as family. Others, they don't know each other. Right. In your setup, do your wives know each other or no? That's definitely entertaining.

1:24:59That's definitely entertaining. Okay. Okay. All right. How about this one then? How many children do you have? That's entertainment as well. That's entertainment.

1:25:14Okay, okay. No, but I got the most amazing kids. I got nine all together. Okay. Seven boys and two girls. Seven boys and two girls. Yeah. And the setup, that all depends on the person and the understanding. All right. Yeah. All right. So then with the setup, so we had Brie on. And she has a child with Nick Cannon. Right. And she was telling me about her setup. And what's interesting is she was saying how it is the most healthy relationship that she has had. But my question to her was, how does she deal with the communication? Because having one partner, that is hard enough. How do you deal with the communication with multiple partners?

1:26:07It's communication, literally. Like, it's literally the answer and the solution. You got to be mature enough to know that if this is the situation that I'm going to park in, I have to communicate. Okay. Okay. This I like, this I don't like. This I'm for, this I'm not for. And this is what I'm willing to, you know, deal with, and this is what I'm not willing to deal with. And once y 'all lay down those rules, just abide by them. It's literally that simple. All right. All right. Like, it's literally that simple. So then in that scenario, though, do your wives, can they have multiple partners? No.

1:26:45So only you can have multiple partners? Only a man, yeah. Okay. But in another setup, you're fine with the wife having other partners. I mean, if that's a setup, that works for them. Okay, cool. Exactly. That's why I said it depends on the person. Cool. Okay. Because I've seen Europeans where you have a girl that has two boyfriends. Right. I've seen it, like literally in Ibiza. I've seen it, like with my own eyes. Yeah, and I was looking at like Tibet up in the Himalayans. Right. They have polyandry, where the woman will have multiple husbands. Right. Yeah. 100%. All right, so what are the benefits then, do you think, to polyamory?

1:27:24I think that would also depend on the situation as well. Okay. But oftentimes when the family is united in that way, the benefit is more for the woman than it is for the man for sure. Really? Yeah, because the man actually has to take care of all of them. He has to treat them all equally. And their responsibility bears on him as well. So it's not just his responsibility, but all their responsibility is also his responsibility, right? The women, they have partners in this case of unity and understanding where, okay, they can alternate roles because it's four of them or five of them or three of them or two.

1:28:02They can alternate those roles, whether it's cooking, whether it's cleaning, whether it's taking care of the kids. One may want to take a vacation. Okay, cool, y 'all go after mommy, sister, whatever, and vice versa. So a woman's role is really to manage the household. So picture one woman managing the whole household versus multiple, and they're working together. Their job is cut in however many wives you may have. If it's four times, that's four times less work you have to do because you have other sisters that can work with you on those situations. So in this or in your structure, are all of the wives equal or do you have...

1:28:37That's any structure, no matter what structure it is. Oh, really? It has to be. That's the only way it can work. Okay. It can't work if they're not equally treated or treated equally. But do you have a... I mean, this is going to sound absurd, but like when I have to write, when I have to fill out a form, it's like, who's your emergency contact? Right. And it's my wife. I was going to be the first wife, no matter what. So the first wife, which is the first one that was... Period. You were married to? Period. Okay. That's always, because that one is the reason why you even got one, two, or three.

1:29:11She's the queen. Interesting. Period. You got to know that. So does the first wife have to approve the second or third? Nobody violates wife number one. The moment they violate, out the door. Okay. Hands down. If you don't understand that, it's entertainment. Okay. It's entertainment. You know I'm going to use this. Oh, that's our new line. I'm going to say, that's entertainment. Look, I'm going to tell my kids this too. Yeah, period. She comes first. Okay, but see, I didn't know this. Yeah, period. I didn't know this. Okay, so I get it. So the structure is more hierarchical. Like, it's she comes first, the others.

1:29:52Yeah, because there's levels in the end, you know? Like, she's the one that's actually sacrificing in the end. You know what I mean? because with new people, a part of your family, there's going to be new attitudes, new mindsets, new behaviors, and they got to deal with that. Only so that you can be able to do what you need to do as a man, but more than anything, it's a level of happiness that comes with that too. So they got to help preserve even that happiness so they can even stay happy. So, yeah, they're the queens for sure, wife number one. Last question on this is, do you see any downsides, though, especially for your wives in a dynamic like this?

1:30:38Yeah, in a dynamic like that, you've got to be able to put yourself in their shoes. Even though women have the tolerance, way more pain tolerance than men do, they also have emotional tolerance more than men do. But sometimes you could beg to differ with that because men, we're not good at emotions. That's why when we get emotional, we get violent, we get rowdy, we get dangerous, right? Well, women, they can suppress those emotions and still be calm. Us, we can't, right? So the one thing I would probably say in that question is that, you know, you got to be able to understand that when they're going through a level of emotional distress, you got to be able to ease that.

1:31:20So you got to be the one to play the role to try to deconvent anything that you feel can create a problem. Okay. Right? You got to pre-think that. Like you got to already know, okay, to be in this position, I'm already blessed to be in it. Then I'm even more blessed that these people are sacrificing for me to be in this position. So I should never put them in that situation. All right. Fair. Or never put them in a situation where they feel compromised, disrespected, or any kind of way feel unvalued. Okay. Okay. Does that make sense? It does. It does. And the only small pushback I'd throw on that is I think that men, we disproportionately have a hard time managing emotions, but we can.

1:32:01No, we can. We're capable. We're capable, yes. They're just better at that because they know how to multitask emotions. We don't. Our emotion is drawn to one person at a time. They can love the whole family at the same time. You understand what I'm saying when it comes to emotions? but when we're angry, we go to the person we're angry at. When they're angry, they go to everybody that their anger affects. No, no, no. This happens. You feel me? This happens. They be mad at you, they mad at the kids too because the kids came from you. And they look just like you. Just like you. But I think what's great, when I see conversations around masculinity today, is that we're talking about being able to showcase our emotions, being able to not be impulsive, because I think that gets a lot of, in particular, men in trouble.

1:32:54It does, all the time. Because we don't stop and think about it before we react. Yeah, exactly. You know what I mean? Women are planners. They don't just react. They talk, they think about it, they plan it out, then they execute. Then they respond. Us, the moment we feel it, we go right in, then be like, damn, why did I do that? Damn, I should have thought about that first. You know what I mean? Yeah, true, true. Also, in Utah, polygamy was briefly decriminalized but made illegal again in 2022. Right. But we know it still happens. No. And I think what happens— That's just for the books. Exactly.

1:33:25Is that you married— They got TV shows up. He's like, I know I'm right. Imagine if I came out with a TV show. What would happen? I mean, it would be well watched, though. Bro, I'd be handcuffed. I'm going to tell you that right now. Yeah. They would implement that law. No. That's why I never got married. Interesting. So you're not married, Mary. It's entertainment. See? I think you just answered it, though. But all right. Now, is there anything that you want to talk about that we haven't yet discussed that's important to you? Yes. My new album, Beautiful Day. Let's do it. Yeah, so I dropped that.

1:34:06Well, I don't know when this is going to be airing, but I dropped it. It's out. Okay. The new album Beautiful Day is out now, and this is like my fourth official album. You can definitely hear the growth from Trouble, to Convicted, to Freedom, to Beautiful Day. Like you'll be able to see how they align with each other. And influences and the culture, even on how I even bring back some of the African rhythms leading into it. It just feels... It makes music feel good again. because for a while music was very violent, like it was dark. Yes. You know, a lot of drill rappers was dying over these songs.

1:34:44It was like, I was like, man, I need something that can just remind people that spirituality actually exists because that's what we're missing right now. Yes. So I did it in a way to where it didn't sound preachy, corny, but when you listen to the album, it's going to make you reflect for sure. That's interesting too is that so your spirituality, you believe, has guided you throughout your entire career. 100%. Yeah, because that seems like that has been your through line. which I didn't realize before doing the research and having this conversation with you. Man, that's what's up. Yeah, yeah. So then when you were locked up, you had a 10-year plan.

1:35:21Yeah. You basically accomplished it all. Yeah. So now what's your new 10-year plan? Oh, yeah, it's legacy building now. It's definitely legacy building now. and at the top of my plan, I will tell you, but that's the reason why I've been, you could say, in the media a lot. You got to give it to us. That's why I feel like I'm a target right now because of that plan. Okay. I will tell you soon, but I'm going to get further down into it before I open up my mouth. Okay, but so you're building towards... Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. The next plan is going to submit my legacy like nothing you've seen before in your life.

1:36:08Okay, because you have been in the media a lot. Yeah. So this is specifically around... It has a lot to do with it. ...the top of the 10. Yeah. Is there anything on that 10-year plan that you can tell us?

1:36:22Not quite, because they kind of all connected. Okay. Yeah, this one is a silent plan. It's a silent plan. But it's going to be probably the most impactful thing that my generation has ever seen once it's complete. Yeah. And it deals with Africa for sure. It's entertainment.

1:36:48Well, I tell you what, though. This is how I can help you with entertainment. Right. Is, you know, we're one of the biggest podcasts now. That's the reason why it has to be entertainment on your podcast. Yes. Because you're too big of a podcast right now. That's the one time that your podcast may not work for me. It might fuck me up. You're too big. No, this can help you. This can be entertainment. This can be entertainment. You can drop a little hint. Right. A little Easter egg. You see, the thing about hints today, AI knows how to decipher those hints. Yeah, that's true. It's so smart. Yes. It's so, so smart.

1:37:31I know because I have an AI company, so I'm telling you. Trust me. But I promise you, though, when it's time to announce, I'm giving you my word today. You'll be the one I give the exclusive to. Duh. All right? My man. My man. I appreciate it. I appreciate it. Absolutely. I hope you continue to change the world. No, that's what's up. Because I think, you know, you are an artist that has touched everyone. And it's really interesting because everybody knows you. And what I've noticed about you is I've dropped your name to different people. And you know when you say Akon, you know what everybody does?

1:38:10They smile. Oh, that's what's up, man. That's powerful. That's amazing. Because not every artist does that. No, that's true. That's true. Every time I say Akon, people smile. So you got to keep making people smile. That's a blessing, yeah, for sure. Yeah, yeah. Last question then. Every guest gets this. You've had some incredible conversations in your life. Right. When you think about the most impactful conversation, who was it with and what did you learn?

1:38:43It would definitely be my grandpa, without a question. because those conversations to this day, I ride with them, like, to this day, right? Because it was something that he told me that was just, that made me think every time, like, I either get in front of a platform or I get on stage. He would always tell me, he got two quotes. One was a quote, and one was just something he said for me to think about. The quote was, he said, life is like a hotel room. We're just passing through. in that quote it basically tells me that from a perspective of where we stand in life this is not where it ends like this is just a test after life it continues somehow some way spiritually i know there's answers to whatever those questions are that our main our minds just probably can't process at the moment the same way we can't process the idea of how god looks like feel like, smell like, whatever.

1:39:44Those are things that we know exist, but we can't put a touch on it to prove it. Right? And the second thing he said, you're going to get to a point in your life when you're going to be able to speak to billions of people. And you have to decide, what do you say when you get there? Right? So I always use that as a platform for my entertainer friends. They have all these social media hits, all these followers, you know, constant people. It was so interesting because this is something I always wanted to give to a very, very good friend of mine who just says whatever he wants to say, whenever he wants to say it, on camera.

1:40:28And I know when I say that, you already know who that is. I know. It's Kanye. No, you said that. I didn't say that.

1:40:40that. Ye is in his truth. He's in whatever he feels at that moment. But if you have the chance to speak to a billion people, what do you say? Yeah. That's the responsibility that he told me that I will always have to carry no matter what. So strategically, always say something that's going to lead to something that's going to help humanity in some form, fashion, or some kind of way. Yes. You know what I mean? Yes. Is your grandfather still with us? No, he passed. He's passed. So then last, last question is that when he passed, how do you believe that changed you? Oh, no. It actually motivated me, believe it or not.

1:41:21Did it? It was the funniest. And I don't want to say funny, but it was the craziest thing because when he passed, most people with the relationship I had with him, you would have thought I would be depressed and crying. I actually felt joy. Did you? Yeah, because I already knew that wherever he was going, he's good. And I know that at the end of the day, I had an ally in the spirit world that's going to be looking out for me. So it was a joyful thing. And then I also knew that my time is coming, I'm going to be there too. I didn't look at it like I lost anybody. I looked at it like I gained an ally in the spirit world.

1:41:57because I know half the stuff that I'll be dealing with that I can't figure out how I'm going to go over it and get over it, I know for sure that my grandpa up there making moves. Like, I just feel that way. You know what I mean? Yeah. Because when you have that kind of spiritual advisor on earth talking to you like that, when they no longer exist, the advice is still there. It's an instinct because sometimes, and how I know it's an instinct is because when I want to make a decision and all of a sudden my grandpa pops up, I know at that moment I'm having that conversation on which direction to go.

1:42:27Right, right. Does that make sense? No, it does. And do you almost even, do you channel your grandfather when you're making decisions or when you're in certain environments? No, but what's interesting is I don't like physically channel him. It just, whenever I'm going through a difficult moment and have to make a crazy decision, out of nowhere, his thought, like the thought of him pops up. So it almost feels like, okay, he's guiding me in the direction I need to be going. Yeah. If that makes sense. No, no, it does. It's weird, right? No, no, I don't think it's weird. You know, I talk a lot about my best friend from Brooklyn who passed away.

1:43:07And I normally, like, I see him. Right. And when I'm making a decision, I hear him. Right, you just pop up. Yeah, he's like, yo, yo, that's it. You just know. Yeah, and then I know, then I lean into it. Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's deep. I appreciate your time I appreciate you man yeah keep keep doing your thing keep making people smile nah for sure you know most importantly and I can't wait to hear what's at the top of your 10 year plan nah you gonna see it you ain't gonna hear it this time you gonna see it you gonna see it what's it gonna look like I can't tell you it's entertainment alright done done but yeah thank you for coming through nah for sure hey this this segment of the show I think you need to call it it's entertainment.

1:43:56Yeah, I think so. I think so. I think, I'm going to start saying that's entertainment, but it makes sense. It does. Like, you need the entertainment. Nah, you need it, man. It's so important. Hell yeah. Nah, thank you, brother. Thank you, thank you. Akon, one word, charismatic. He's someone who I've heard his music throughout my entire life. And, you know, they say, you're like, don't meet the people that you've looked up to or that you've admired from a distance. But he surpassed my expectation. And also, I admire his relentless focus on Africa and unifying people. That's something that is just super admirable because he doesn't have to.

1:44:51He could just chill with his millions of dollars, you know. But he is really dedicating his life to the empowerment of others. One of the things that I loved about this conversation was the ability to have discourse. You know, there would be something that Akon said that I might not agree with. I would listen to what he had to say and then I would present my opinion. he would listen to what I would have to say and would agree or disagree with it and then we would go back and forth and then at a certain point, stop. That is what we need more of in society, is conversation. It's a great reminder that we can have different views on things and still get along.

1:45:37I'm still going to the concert. Look up, it's Kanye. He's like, dear God, if you are there right now, please, I need him to come outside so I can say something to him in Jesus' name. And then Kanye walked right outside, and I said, Take me on a trip I'd like to go someday. You'll be my American boy. One of his friends actually came up with the, don't like his baggy jeans, but I might like what's underneath him. And I was just like, okay, come with you, young sir. And that's it. It took us, like I said, 15, 20 minutes to hear it, and I left it and went home. Will there ever be an American boy 2.0?

1:46:14There was a lot. I was like, why are you even bothering? I have people who would actively say she's a waste of money and then be happy for me at the MOBOs. I feel like the industry is like a death by a thousand cuts. What was the moment where you felt like you were on the brink of losing it? Oh, goodness. I was performing everywhere I could. Any stage I could get to. It doesn't matter the crowd. I'm having a fun time. Behind the talent, they saw the passion. Were you the first person that John Legend signed? He literally started a label to sign me. He believed in me that much. I get off the train at Sandra Paye.

1:46:44It's like one in the morning. I'm on stage at two. I drink half a bottle of vodka. My body wasn't working. Everything started slowing down. I get to a show and my voice don't want to sing. Is there anything that we have not yet talked about that you want to talk about?