Dami Hope Exclusive On Break Up with Indiyah “Her Story Didn’t Add Up”

25:30But because it's a TV show, that you have to have it structured in a way that drives entertainment. I feel like for me, subconsciously, you kind of notice these things that they put in place. Because, like, say, for instance, I want to go talk to someone. Like, I want to go speak to her. I'll be on my way to speak to her. And suddenly I'm getting, oh, no, dammit, come over here. And I was like, wait, what? it's because then it's like then they put someone else with this person that I wanted to speak to or you know I mean I'm having a conversation I feel like it's going really well with someone but then obviously this person has now been sent over here to like talk to this person I'm just like okay guys you know whenever like I feel like that was the frustrating part about it because it's like I want to be able to speak to people I thought when I'm coming here I'm gonna have like free will to actually just speak to the people that I want to speak to and build on it and I get like yeah give everyone a chance but going back and looking back at the the show because I did watch it for I did watch it to be honest and I remember looking back and I remember some of the like first conversations like India and I had they wouldn't they weren't even there oh really you know I mean so it's like these are moments where like I feel like these were building blocks for us as well that would have been like the quiet but you would have noticed that oh these guys actually get along and I'm seeing that you're putting the clip with her and Davide who inherently just not even attracted to her anyway.

26:50And it's like, what's the point of, you know, this? Do you get what I mean? It's almost like it becomes a little game at a certain point. But so on this, I think what's so hard, and this is a challenge that I think every reality dating show has, is to your point is a lot of people are themselves, but a puffed up version, an exaggerated version of themselves. And then some people are just outright faking, fraudulent with who they're representing to be. so how do you form a relationship with romantically or even platonically with people when you're all you're each other's representatives and not each other you know what i mean like so even in that first conversation with india how do you know like you're you're getting to know her versus uh representation of her that's the thing i feel like you don't because like when you come out the villa like that feel like that's when like the person that you did speak to those parts of them are still there but it's not really the full representative of that person okay you know i mean and i feel like you figure it out you actually find out about it when you come out because like in you is like soft-spoken quiet you know general but then on the outside she's feisty she's loud she can speak up she does this and it's like obviously on the show i get it as a black woman as well you might have to keep yourself at a certain you know wavelength to a piece to you know so which i i fully understand and i get it that's why but most of the time as well like she just didn't actually care too much she was just living in a bubble like a peaceful bubble as she would always say yeah so you know you notice they're doing things or they'd be whispering or they'd be like saying this and that and it's like they're finding out intel or they're this and it's like like now you're you're being performative we can tell but i'll call now because you know it's a long time ago right but and i get it everyone came in for you know different reasons so and i guess like if you're if you're there to build your own like whatever it is you're going to do the things that you feel like you need to do to to get that yeah for sure for sure um can we talk about casa more because i think that's when your star power if you will yeah india star power and your relationship went to another level yeah so do you remember that and did and did you and also as you're going into that because you don't know what the what the audience is thinking so what were you thinking the audience was thinking i feel like going into before going into that and like looking back at it now because obviously i was in the villa india and i weren't that intense yet and we'd only like kissed like you know a couple of times I don't even think we shared a bed yet or I'm not even I can't even remember I don't think we had shared a bed or anything yet and it was a thing where it's like I feel like on the outside I feel like parasocially people are looking at something else and it's more intense for them than it is for us and we'd have this conversation I remember me Jax Paige and India we'd have this conversation about like we feel like Casa Moore's coming up coming up because we've reached this because we all know like awesome four weeks, Cast and More has to be coming up.

29:59So we're all having conversations. And we're talking about like, oh, yeah, we're all going to be open-minded. Like we're all still going to explore and, you know, talk to people or whatever. But obviously the audience don't see these conversations. Right. So for us, we already like have spoken and we know like what we're going to like, you know, be open-minded to do or whatever. So when Cast and More happens and I feel like outside world looking in, it's like I'm the only one that's now stepped out of this relationship that's not even a relationship. because we've probably only kissed three times.

30:29Do you know what I mean? But outside we're looking in, they're thinking, oh, nah, this guy is, he's a villain. He's just like going crazy and he's just trying to get with all the girls. But it's like, I'm just doing things that like are familiar to me when I'm actually dating someone and like I'm trying to get to know someone. And in that short space of time, it was like, you know what, this is a connection that I feel like I could build on. And I feel like Indy was just like me. So I feel like she's gonna obviously talk to people as well. There could be black boys there. I was thinking in my head there could be a boy from South London that you know what I mean that she relates to so in my head I'm like thinking like I don't know what's going on and it's such a short space of time to like you know say okay this is like I'm locked I'm locked off because I didn't come on this show to pretend to be someone I'm not or to like sacrifice my whole experience because of what like the audience might you know think or want when you're not even in the show do you know what I mean So when this whole situation happened, and I don't know, I got like an inkling, you know, got an inkling that sis was coming back with something anyway.

31:33So I was like, you know what? Let's burn the whole place down. Let's have some fun. And I remember I was in my, I was in, I went to have a meeting with, I think, probably one of the producers or whatever. And then I was just like, oh, I remember I went back down because I had to like do my speech, like speech of like who I want to pick back. And I was like thinking, bro, we got to go crazy over here. We're going to, at the end of it, you got to say summer's not over. you gotta lie we gotta tell this really was your line it is really my line bro I was like no we gotta pop we gotta pop it off cause if the world is obviously like cause I got like I got told like obviously when I was like in casa I remember I think obviously um it was uh there was the two girls the Chyna and Summer and I think um obviously I was getting to know the both of them more so and I remember obviously I think I kissed uh Summer but then I wanted to kiss Chyna as well cause I just wanted to I'm a urinary I'm a lipser I just wanted to I just wanted to see like Like, if the sparks would fly.

32:25And I remember, I think I was about to do China, and then they came over to me like, oh, Dami, chill out, man. You're doing too much. And I said, oh, okay, fair enough, cool, cool, cool. Since you obviously all feel that way, you know, you just gotta go hard to go home, boy. Because a lot of people will pull back. No. If someone just said, you're doing too much, I think most people will pull back. No, I just felt like, I was thinking in my head, bro, everybody's probably against me right now, so you know what I mean? let's just make good TV, like just let's make good TV. And like in my line, the line might sound cringey now, like, you know, people watching it, but in that space, being in that, it's like, you know what, let's go guys, you know what I mean?

33:05And then obviously I think Sis came in and she obviously had someone by her arm. I remember she was just talking about like, oh, I see he's true colors now. And mind you, I don't know what she's done, but I just know she's come back with someone. I'm restraining myself and be like, are you colorblind? Because you're here too with someone else. Because we had this thing where it's like we're both heartbreakers. And we had that thing. And it was like it was almost like an alley-oop to a dunks type of situation. And it was like, wow, well done, girl. Yes. So you had respect. You had more respect for her after that.

33:34Yeah. Like I never stopped liking her when she left. And even when she came back, it's a situation where it's like obviously it's awkward to see. But I wasn't upset. I wasn't hurt about it. Even though people, you know, said, oh, I was so angry or whatever. I wasn't upset. Because at the end of the day, I'm a fair person, and I'm a person that's like, you know, maybe they actually get on. And at the end of the day, it doesn't mean our story is over. It just means, like, we've got to expand and build on to if we're supposed to, you know, be together. Right. That's a great window to emotionally how you were feeling.

34:05Because at night, I'm sure there's lots of ideas coming in your mind. Because you said the producers were saying you were doing too much. You see India with someone else. Right? You now want to be with her. you're you're coupled off with someone else yeah so so walk us through what you were feeling at night i was feeling anxious i was like i was feeling like did i just lose something that i actually really wanted i was feeling like how do i even like approach the situation you know i mean i'm just thinking about what steps do i take to like kind of show her and reintroduce that like you know this is actually what i want and it's you and then i remember there'll be sometimes like i'll try to go talk to her and producers do what the producers do again be like no, not today, give it.

34:48I'm like, why? What was something that you did that was a loophole or like a sneaky way to try to get to her? You'd be doing like, you know, when the like, you're not supposed to like talk after like, you know, when you're going to bed and obviously we didn't share bed and stuff. But I remember, I remember like, I'll speak to her sometimes through the day or like we'd like be passing and like try and do little touches and just try to be like, oh, do you know what I mean? Just remember I'm still here, do you know, I'm still here kind of thing. And we have like little conversations that would like kind of just like amplify like, oh, you know what I'm feeling and whatever she's feeling.

35:21And then I think there was a point where it's like, this one was like so viral where I think I went to go sleep outside with Andrew and then she must've followed me. And there was like a whole romantic thing of us just, you know, running into each other. And that's when I knew, yeah, no, it's game over. Gotcha. You knew it. You knew it was something real. Yeah, it's mine now. Yes, yes. Can anyone tell me why roaming fees are always so expensive? I feel like every time I get back from traveling overseas, I'm hit with a jaw-dropping phone bill. It's actually why I'm excited to try our new partner, Saley, an eSIM app that gives you a safe and secure data connection anytime you travel and, most importantly, without any expensive roaming charges.

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38:00And it's like, OK, you know, where do I even start from? Because where do how do I even explain myself? Because what you have is these edits that you've seen. But that's not even me for real. Right. You know. Right. So you feel as if you were painted as a villain. Yeah. after like the whole like situation, I was painted as a villain that, you know, did something and I'm angry that, you know, she did it back, you know what I mean? Some, you know, like, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. But like, it wasn't something that upset me in the beginning because obviously that was the like, like the lore of Love Island, this happens.

38:36Like I've watched it from previous seasons. I make up my own mind about people, but I don't hold them to that because at the end of the day, I know it's a TV show. Right. You know what I mean? But then parasocially, people are so invested and they spin on stories themselves and they make stuff up and it still happens to this day. Yes, yes. You know, even to get into parasocial relationships is because I love how you're using the term because I feel like that's exactly what makes these shows so popular is that it's not just a passive viewing. It's that the people who watch, a lot of the people who watch these shows form relationships.

39:15And typically what I see is that they see themselves in one or two of the contributors. so if they feel as if you have done a contributor wrong and they have aligned themselves or formed a bond with that contributor they feel like you've now done them wrong yeah and you definitely become the villain yeah no you're right you know you're right you said it all yeah in the villa do you believe you fell in love with india there i feel i feel like a first like i said i did i think i did But then I feel like when I got outside is when I really, really fell in love with her, you know, because like like dad loved her, mom loved her.

39:59And it's like we're from two different cultures, but, you know, we made it work. And it's like a lot of things like, you know, you just like gravitate towards each other and you think the same way or we're building this thing together. And it's just like it was fun, you know. Yeah. And I think also the fact that you met on a show that, you know, historically not a lot of couples come out of. Yeah. But you then had to experience a lot of the same things. Yeah. But even if we can talk about you all coming third, because that in itself was his story. Like that was major. So going into that final, when you knew that you all were a final couple, how did that feel?

40:43Because what I'm picking up from you is you really didn't care much about what was happening outside of the show because you had found someone who you were genuinely interested in. Yeah, I feel like coming into the finals and knowing I was there from the beginning and I was the first guy there to reach in that, it was like, even though we were third, it's like, it just further amplified the fact that I'm a born winner. Cause like even through all the transgressions and all the early dumplings and everything else, it's like, I still fought my way to get to where we were here. And us coming third was historical.

41:18I remember the whole opera, like no black couple has ever gotten that far. and it was like, like, we always do they were going to win. They had my vote too, to be honest, bro. They were making some good TV for me while I was in there, bro. I was like, oh my God. There ain't no way we're beating them. Like, they were funny. So it was like, so it didn't even bother me that like, oh yeah, it was forced or whatever. It was just like the fact that we were actually there with all our friends and like, we've all done this journey together and it was just like a moment of like, wow. Because you came out with like, outside from like a girlfriend, came out with like real life, like long friends.

41:56Yes. You know, so it was like, it was an experience. It was like, you know me, I love friendship. So it's a thing for me. It's like, I've done a new experience now and now I even have more friends. I have new friends. So it's like... Just a win. Just a win, bro. It was good. Just a win. But it was close between second and third. Very close. Yeah, close enough. Close enough. If only Ireland could vote. If only Ireland could vote, man. I didn't realize Ireland can vote. Ireland can't vote. And they all watch it as well. so it's like a whole big thing where it's like just let the Irish vote too you know what I mean because like I think the app doesn't work because it's on the UKM the UKM Apple software whatever so it doesn't work in Ireland so they can't even like vote yeah that's the thing definitely that's what I'm saying you're gonna win if Ireland can vote bro they were behind me man oh my I didn't realize that that's wild okay okay we need to change that bro yeah you need to do something about that alright done let's use our platforms and change that bro let's change that right now Right now.

42:52Right now. But still, third is not bad. It's not bad, no. When you get out of the villa, when do you first... When do you in India, when do you feel like you two become an official couple? I feel like probably when we moved into our house, because we used to stay at my grandma's and then sometimes we stay in our mom's. And then when we first got our first apartment, that's when it felt like, oh. Because I've never really lived with a girlfriend and actually were paying rent together for a spot. You know what I mean? And we're building on this spot and decorating and buying TVs, you know what I mean, moving in.

43:37So I feel like that's when it's really grounded that, oh yeah, we're really official. Yes, yes. I would imagine that there was a lot of pressure immediately to then sustain that. because so many couples break up so quickly. Did you feel any of that? You know what? There was a lot of pressure in the sense of like, I would be making TikToks and, you know, you're trying to build your platform. You're trying to like, I'm just having fun with it because this is my first time coming into this like trajectory of, you know, fame and everyone knows who you are. And it's like, I'd want to collab with people or friends, but, you know, parasocially, they'd be looking like, why is he with everybody else but India?

44:15Do you know what I mean? Mind you, we speak all the time. We're together all the time. And she's doing meetings. She's, you know, she's about to start building this career of hers. And she's doing all these things. But I'm outgoing. I'm meeting up with, you know, friends that we have in there. I'm making, you know, content and TikToks. But everybody has something to say. And it's like, continue this whole villain narrative. Oh, he doesn't even care about her. Or he's embarrassing her. Or she's a stronger woman than, you know, than me. And it's like, when do I get to actually live, guys? Because it's like, relationship-wise, we're good.

44:45But then I feel like all these, seeing all these things, I feel like there was a point maybe started getting to her and, you know, start affecting all what she's thinking. And in her head, she's actually starting to think, oh, is there something that she's missing here as well? You know, all these little collabs that you're doing, these, like Paige is one of our friends that I would do. And she was starting, OK, maybe there's something she's missing. Or I'd go to Ireland and there would be like an Irish, you know, influencer as well. We're all at the same network. And, you know, it's just like people seem, you know, worlds collide.

45:14But it didn't break us. it's just things obviously we'd speak about and then you know there'll be boundaries put in place or you'd be like you know you take take a step back from doing this or you know stop doing stuff for you know just girls just so the noise would just stop i see you know i mean i see it can i even ask too is when when you came out right because you said something really interesting to me at the beginning of going into love island is that you were just doing it as a joke yeah So it wasn't a brand build for you. Do you think India, was she doing it as a brand build? And I'm not trying to disparage her in that, but I guess where I'm going is that because a lot of – I've talked to a lot of influencers.

45:55And those who use television platforms, what they'll do is that they'll set up their everything, their socials. They'll get agents. They'll set it up so that when they come out of the television project, they can immediately start using that, leveraging that. And I'm wondering, was that her desire? Because then if so, because I feel like when she got out, she really catapulted. Her popularity shot up quickly. I feel like hers was kind of like she came in. I don't know the reason. I can't speak for her. But I do feel like when she came out, though, it was a fresh start for her, too. There was nothing put in place.

46:34and everything, like, she was hot cake. Everybody wanted, you know, the girl that said made the best heartbreaker win, you know? So it was like hot cake, she's pretty, and, like, people just wanted her in it. It's like she was, like, the star of It Girl. So I feel like everything just, like, happened for her, like, you know, just, like, naturally, you know? Okay, so her career is taken off. Do you feel that her career is moving faster than yours? Not necessarily, actually. I feel like in that space, I actually wasn't even thinking about what was happening because I was having meetings with management and, you know, talking about different things.

47:11And I was getting deals. I was seeing like money that I didn't see, you know, I could never see one incident at first. I'm like, I'm doing good. So I wasn't really like focused on. Obviously, I'm seeing like the big like, you know, PLT or whatever looking for her. And that's a big, for my, yes. And like, but on my side, it's like, Boohoo are looking for me too. and they're trying to pay but I'm saying no because obviously I have I didn't want to do fast fashion I wanted to because I don't wear that stuff anyway and it's like if I am going to brand build and stuff that's not the way I can go and it's easier it's not as easy for guys to navigate outside of that when they do it so like girls can do PLT and do whatever and still manage to do this but if I did that it's like I become boxed in now I'm just another one of you know the guys and they were paying big like they were paying more money that I probably like I've seen that once for like what a year contract and i'll keep saying no and then they'll keep like asking me no come on are you sure we'll up it we'll up it but i'll still stand in my ground that nah this is it's not for me can you share how much were they all i think they were offering like a first it was like maybe near like 200k and it was just like for one year yeah for one year and it was like then they come back and they say oh we can even get you to do your own ex like collab and just it would just be you and we'll add we'll even add more and i'll still just say no it's just just It's not for me and I don't want to be boxed in and I don't want to have a hard time trying to like, I do this because of the money and then suddenly now when I'm trying to navigate these brands that I actually do want to work with don't want to work with me.

48:40I feel like all the things I did at that early on really worked out for me because I would get bigger jobs later down the line. Do you know what I mean? And they would all add up to even way more than that. So do you know what I'm saying? So it's like, yeah, you offered me 200K, but by the end of the year finish, I made way more than that. And I feel like the first year I probably made like, maybe like five, 550, 600. So it's like - Wait, hold on, damn it. Yeah, so it's like - Oh, oh! It's fiscal. That's a lot of money though. And you know what bro? And the thing - Hold on, wait, wait, wait, wait.

49:13Cheers on that, man. Cheers on that. Man, congratulations for that. Thank you. Yeah. I like that. I really do. Because I'm assuming that was a lot more than you were being paid as a microbiologist. Oh yeah, bro. Bro, my dad was so happy now. Bro, it was shopping time, you know? It was shopping time. Nah, it was shopping time. I remember the first time I got my paycheck, I think my best friend wanted to buy a car. I sent him at least half of the money for the car that he wanted. Bro, just send him money left and right. Who wants, who wants? Because these are the people that I've come up with, and now I'm here in this space.

49:54Is this your best friend? Yeah, best friend Wally. Wally, you were at the house when you decided. I was like, it was like one of my girls' birthdays. I was like, let's go Dior, man. What do you want? Because it's like, now you guys, when I was like, when we were like, you guys, you guys grew with me. So it's like, I have like anything you ever need from me. Wow. I got you. So, and then obviously my family as well, just had to take care of them first. Yeah. So it's always just being that way. Yeah. And then blowing a lot of cash on presents and birthday gifts and stuff like this. Which, which, which I love.

50:22Can we get into you and India? as much as you want to go. I would love to know, what did you first, or what did you love about her? I feel like, I loved her like feistiness. Like she was her own character and she was able to speak. Like she just spoke up for whatever it is that she wanted to speak up for. And she wasn't shy. about not if she didn't want to do something kind of thing. Do you know what I mean? And I like that, like, she just stood on her own ground. Yes. Yes, yes. Now, with India as well, I've noticed, and if I could just pick up on this, is that in our conversation so far, you've been very calm and cool.

51:18Yeah. But every time we touch on India is where I see nervous. It's not even nervous. It's just like, it's a situation, obviously, you know, we're not together anymore. And it's like, yeah, it's just we're not together anymore. It's like just, it's an uncomfortable situation because obviously I've never been in this like type of situation before. And now I have been. And it's just the whole like, if you want to get into, just to get into, it's like, you know, we were in a good place. Like we were good. We're still together. and, you know, there's a lot of boundaries in place that mostly were set by her.

51:56And obviously... Which were what? What were some of these boundaries? Just like, in terms of like me, female friendships, you know, like anything around girls or just like, you know, coming back homely and just making sure you call in or, you know, just all these like things that like just set by her, like things we would say we do together first. And if you're going to do with someone else, you'd say it or you'd ask or whatever. But they'd all be by her. but then majority of them would be broken by her, you know? And then I feel like in this situation as well that has happened, it was kind of shocking, obviously.

52:28So you were together for four years? Almost four years. Almost four years, yeah. Okay, so over the four years, or over the three years and change that you and India were together, you had moved in together. All right, so you're living together. Were you already talking? You were committed to each other? Yeah, committed to each other for so long. We did so many anniversaries, so many holidays. each other's we did everything together you know were you talking about marriage yeah we talked about marriage it's a thing like in our household like we all we both know our cultural differences and the cultural like humor that we can kind of share beside each other obviously she's jamaican i'm nigerian and you know what they say about nigerians 419 they all cheat like we made these type of jokes and i remember one time i went on the radio show and i made the joke about like oh like we can skip the ring you know i mean because we can have babies because obviously like you know blah blah which I get like it's a sensitive joke outside of like you know our household and things that we're comfortable with right you know I apologize for that but it's just like it's just like dark humor and you know a lot of the things that I do end up saying online to get me in trouble is from a place of like just humor and jokes and you know but but I see though that what his what could have happened yeah is that you take all of those it then underscores that villain narrative.

53:45Yeah, and it all just keeps on bringing this whole villain narrative, and I feel like that's what has been pitted against me for this situation that's happened, because there's a difference between the reality of how people are and then the image, right? And I feel like the reality of me is I'm carefree, I share everything, I want to be open with the world. If you're a fan of me or you like me, I want to give you me. Do you know what I mean? and there's no reason for me to like hide. But then I guess on the other side, on her side, because she would go out and she'd have as much fun as I'm having, but she just won't post it.

54:20And maybe the ones that she's posting is like she's just watching TV in the living room. So it's always like she's always at home, but I'm always outside. Right. So you feel as if people were already accusing you. Not feel, you saw it. They've been accusing me. Cheating. Cheating, I'm gay. They attack my masculinity just from how I dress, from like me being expressive with like, you know, my fashion. I can get my nails done. I can put on makeup. It's just like all these little things they were used to like, you know, paint this picture of me as a person that isn't even me. But at the end of the day, it's like I don't care about being expressive.

54:59I want to be this way. I want to live my true. I want to be myself. Do you know what I mean? And I feel like all these things have been, you know, used now against me, especially in this situation. and it's a thing where it's like, it's unfair, but at the same time, it's like, this is the aim of the game that I got into. Do you know what I mean? So I get it, but it's unfair. No, it's entirely unfair. And I want to unpack all of those because I think it's important for us to get your opinion on each of those. But something that you also mentioned that we have to talk about is you talked about there's a cultural difference between you and India, right?

55:40So you are Nigerian heritage, India, Jamaican heritage. How did that cultural difference show up for good or bad in your relationship? I feel like more or less, I feel like we come from different types of households where Maya is so traditional. It's full of like, you know, you have to greet. It's very respectful. And I guess like in her household, like lovely people. but then I would sense the difference in like, I don't know how to say it, like without, because I'm not trying to sound rude or anything like that, but there is a definite difference. And how she speaks to her mom is not how I speak to my mom.

56:21Do you know what I mean? I'd have to put auntie in front of her mom's name. Do you know what I mean? Stuff like this, like different things. But she'd obviously do it as well because I would teach her the difference in the culture. Whereas I feel like mine's very traditional, but then hers is a bit more free. Right. Do you know what I mean? So I tell you, I mean, so being from, you know, being Jamaican, what I've noticed as a big difference. So it was interesting. Most of my best friends growing up were either Jamaican or Nigerian. Right. And at the end of the day, all Jamaicans are basically from Nigeria.

56:51Yeah. I tried to say that one time, bro. I tried to say that one time. They were like, no, I'm not. No, I'm not. If you trace it back. If you trace it back. Yeah, that's what I was trying to say. Ghana or Nigeria, man. I've been trying to say that. It's pretty much. We are all family. All family. And that's something that I think we also need to remember is that we are all family. And what society tries to do is divide not only us, but divide everybody. That's how you disempower people. But one thing I noticed is distinctly is that I feel like most Nigerian households that I know of are very patrifocal, right?

57:27Most of the family revolves around the male patriarch, so the father figure, making the primary decisions, et cetera. In every Jamaican household that I've been close to, including mine, it's matrifocal and revolves around the mother. The mother, yes. My grandma was it. I actually get that. I actually agree with you. She was it. And so when I've seen Nigerian and Jamaican marriages, I've seen that that sometimes is a friction point. Right. Did that show up at all? Is that what you're getting to as well or not necessarily? I don't feel like it showed up, but I do feel like there's in some cases where it felt like, you know, I mean, maybe I felt like an outsider, you know.

58:22With her family. Yeah, with our family, it's like, yeah, I fit in, I accept, but then I feel like there is a certain level of, you know, things they probably think of me because of, you know, the parasocials are put online as well. And it just became like, maybe I'm not, you know, the same as you guys or something. And I felt like that sometimes. And I feel like it kind of starts showing up like towards the end. You know what I mean? I feel like it starts showing up there because I just didn't feel comfortable anymore. So you think it was more so what was being said about you? You said about me and just how it felt like I was now being treated.

58:54It's just a bit different. And I guess maybe it's, again, it's the jokes. It's the stuff that the internet are putting against me. I think I remember I wore an outfit to the mobiles or something, and I did my hair back, and I had earrings. And then the internet wanted to diss me about whatever fashion it is that I did. I thought I ate. I still think I ate. It doesn't even affect me. But things like that, if the internet's saying something bad, then I feel like they'd start believing what the internet's saying. Her and her family? Not her. I feel like she'd understand me, but maybe her family's just like, oh, maybe, because, you know, maybe I'm zesty, or maybe I'm actually, you know what I mean?

59:32All these little things, and it's like I could gauge this, and I could see it, and it's like, you know? Right. So you feel like, and not to put words in, but I don't know if you felt this way. You feel like maybe her family didn't feel as if you were masculine. Yeah. A thing so simple as that. Yeah, I think, yeah, maybe eventually, I think it probably came to a point where it was like that. So then, Dan, help me understand what happened, because just so everyone, if you're comfortable with me saying what happened. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, the whole world knows. Yeah, yeah, this is true. This is true.

1:00:09So for the five people who don't know, I want to give just a little bit of the detail. Is that so in July 2025, you and India had celebrated your three-year anniversary. Yeah, yeah. Okay. So you're three years into your anniversary. Then December 3rd, 2025, India was spotted kissing inside UK star Marlon Garcia. And this was at the series three wrap party for Inside, which is a Netflix reality competition show by the Sidemen. So. This happens on December 3rd. When did you find out? I probably found out probably on December 5th. And it was just because of the chain of events of things just didn't make sense.

1:01:05And I'm too clued in not to figure stuff out, especially because I've been with you for so long. And I think eventually she obviously came forward and said this had been what happened. and for me I had to process it and I'm like you know I'm processing it privately like no one knows this is happening so it was a thing for me like it was just like a situation of like stories just wasn't adding up and just to keep it short it just wasn't adding up and then eventually she came forward to tell me and then we just had to like obviously I said I can't be in this relationship but at the same time I know you know we have this public relationship I think it became a to a point where it's like there's times where it was like she'd be on snap or something and she like say something about her her she'd like mints like her mental health right now is you know in a bad place and i would be trying to process this but in my way i needed to get out of the space that we lived in because we still have to live together oh that's right you're still living together yeah we still live so all right so damn all right i'm all right this is complicated yeah It's very complicated.

1:02:11But you said already before you were clued in that things didn't feel right in December. No, things didn't feel right in the sense of that night that she went out and when she came back. It was like you have this thing of like, oh, if you go out, you just text and you say, oh, what are you doing? But you're gone now for the whole night, not said anything. And it's like, that doesn't make sense because you would. I was with you in the morning. You know what I mean? we literally came back with you in the morning. So it's like, we've helped you put your outfit on. We've helped done all this stuff.

1:02:43So then you've gone out and then come back. Your story don't make sense when I'm asking, like, where are you being? Ah, so you were at home. Yeah. And then what time did she come back? Probably like, I don't even know because I had to work that day. So I had to even leave the house. So I'm not actually sure what time she came back. Sometime in the morning? No, probably like afternoonish or something. Afternoon? Yeah. Yeah, I think she probably woke up at like 1 p.m. or something. And that was like when I got the text and she just like crashed out and she was blah, blah, blah. So she was gone. You wake up.

1:03:19You leave to go to work. She's still not back home. So at this point, you feel, all right, something's up. It's not even like a straightaway thing, oh, something has happened. It's more of like, yeah, things happen. I mean, you can go out, get drunk, and you know what I mean? You just crash out. Do you know what I mean? I understand that. Like, I understand how to have fun. So it's okay. I get that. All right. So can I play devil's advocate? Yeah, play devil's advocate. Because I think you might be giving yourself a little bit too much grace on this one. All right. So, I mean, I've been married for 20-something years, right?

1:03:49But if I'm three to four years into a committed relationship where I live with someone, we have established boundaries. Yes, yes. and my partner goes out and she doesn't come home and the next morning, I mean, I'm not even waiting to the next morning. I didn't wait till the next morning. Don't get me confused. I was even up like saying everything good because I'm checking for your well-being and seeing how you are. Do you know what I mean? So I've texted. It's not like I've just gone to sleep and forgot like, oh, my whole girlfriend exists. I'm still looking out for her well-being, just trying to check where she's at, if she's good.

1:04:23Do you know what I mean? But getting no response, getting none of this. So it's like, then the first response is that 1 p.m. the next day. I'm like, you know, whatever. But just to like, you know, to move on from that is just like when everything happened, it's like I remember it was her birthday, her birthday as well. And when she put up the whole mental health thing on Snap, I remember people on Snap because I'm trying to process this. People are hitting me up saying, how are you out when your girlfriend is at home, you know, process? And I'm like, bro, you don't even know what I'm going through here.

1:04:54I'm just I'm keeping everything cool there's no sense of hate for me for her like at the end of the day like you're someone I've been with for so long that like I'm still able to be in this capacity with you but I do need to like have some level of self-respect to like for myself as well to be like you know what this isn't what I want anymore I can't I can't like be here or do this because at the end of the day it's just like I'm like I'm an honest person right and I always want just people always be honest you know i mean and i feel like when trust has been broken like that and in such a silly kind of way you know i mean like you know you feel you feel all these type of like emotions but at the same time it's like you know you gotta you just gotta exhale for a second because it's like how you know you're asking yourself how could you how can you do all these things blah blah blah and what are the emotions like the emotions i felt i felt angry i felt like why would you do that like why would you disrespect me and us like that do you know i mean like for what?

1:05:53For like a short time that you had on a show? Like, do you know what I mean? Because the show wasn't about love. It wasn't even any of that. So it's like, and you know what I mean? It's like, it's okay for you to go out and make friends, be friends with the opposite sex and stuff like that. But it's like, there's boundaries in place. This isn't even a boundary cross. This is just like straight, you don't do this if you're in a relationship. Do you know what I mean? Right. And it's like, I know now there's like people as well that's like around on the table when this is happening. So it's like, there's people that know you and I are together and you've done this as well.

1:06:22Do you know what I mean? So it's like I'm processing a lot of stuff, but it's like I'm trying to keep us away from the embarrassment of it online and everything as well. That's right, because that's a whole nother. It's a whole nother thing that you've got to deal with. And for the most part, I continue to play my part. On her birthday, I still have to show up because the internet doesn't know. But you two had broken up already. Yeah, and people might say, oh, it's just the case and all that. But at the end of the day, I don't actually know but the full story is because like there's there's certain elements that are part of the story that's like it confuses me as like how can this happen do you know i mean i don't want to i don't want to go into because it's like it's like i don't want to actually like spread too much like info about it or whatever but i feel like when i posted my new year's uh dump i feel like that was a thing for me where it was like i'm starting this year fresh now i need to need to choose myself and And just to clarify for the five people who don't know, is that you did your New Year's dump, basically, of here's a reflection of my year.

1:07:23And you posted a full carousel. And in it, you don't include any photos, any imagery of India. And so people see that. And then it goes to another level. It goes into another level. And they make up their new stories and whatever it is. And that's how I feel like then everything happened. And I remember, you know, at this point, things are like moving fast now. And then now this sudden story, apparently now, where if I know there's someone that was there and there's like a recording of it. I have to listen to everybody's phone ping at the same time. There's like all of my friends, all on their phones.

1:08:00And we're all getting this video. It comes up TikTok the same time. And I have to look at everyone and myself. Watch this video. And I look at all my friends. Watch the same video. And everyone's in shock. because there's one thing of like, okay, yeah, you've heard it, but then seeing it is a bit like, and it doesn't, then it feels even way more than, you know, how it was expressed to me. And it's like, then I'm dealing with all this stuff and, you know. And just for the, just to, if I can. Yeah, go for it. So this is January 10th. The video surfaces online where you see India kissing someone else.

1:08:33Okay. I guess from that point, it was just like, yeah, no, this is so, it's embarrassing and then it's it's just it's just disrespectful because like we've been like i don't know i just feel like it just wasn't worth whatever we had to do that but at the same time it's like i just had to remove myself from that situation and like but at the same time it was still wasn't enough for the internet because the internet still want to believe i had to have done something first it's it's still on me and then you know it's ai and it's not real and it's like what did dami do or dami's been cheating for a time so she's just getting her lick back or dami what Dami did in Casa Moore, this is why he's doing that.

1:09:10Or Dami's joke the other day, why wouldn't she do that? Or how Dami dresses, oh, that's why she's done it. And people are like, oh my God, I'm so, like, she should cheat on him again. Do you know what I mean? All these things I'm seeing online, it's like, you can hate me, you can say all these things, but like, I stand for women protecting women, but it comes to a point where it's like, what have I actually done to you guys? I ain't done anything. And now it's like, I've been dealing with it privately. I've not spoken about it. I never wanted to speak about it. It's calm. But now publicly I have to deal with it and the whole embarrassment of it publicly and people, you know, making mockery of it and, you know, joking about the both of us.

1:09:43And we're having to go through this whole turmoil of like what was such a beautiful relationship and, you know, to now this is how it ends. It's a bit like it's a bit it's a bit it's a bit sad. Why didn't you say anything? Because at the same time, I generally still have like a care for her. And it's like like I've loved it. I've been with her for so long. there's a level of care that I'll always have. And at the end of the day, it's like, I'm not trying to bash on her or try to, I don't want anything to happen to, like, who she is or whatever it is. Like, I want her to still be good. Do you know what I mean?

1:10:16So for me, it's like, I don't really need to say that. I don't have to explain myself to the internet, but it's like, but for me, when I'm seeing people just always trying to twist things and you're now further trying to make me this villain or I must have done something, it's just like, you know what? It's kind of grinding on the teeth. Like, it's like if you don't know something and if I don't speak, if you don't speak about it, they have time to then form their own ideas as to why everything has happened. And it's just it's just a lot of just a lot of noise. All right. So for everyone making the noise.

1:10:47Yeah. They will be listening to you right now. It's fine. What do you want to tell them? You know what? Good question. Shut the fuck up in the most polite way. you know I mean let people live like at the end of the day situations happen like I don't want any like trouble for my ex and everything as well like there's none of that it's like we're both people like yeah it's happened but we moved on we're processing it we you know we're civil at this point now so it's like I just want to be able to like like if you don't know something don't make up something so right fair that's fair enough now you just said that you you You in India are civil now.

1:11:28Yeah. So do you talk? I don't say we talk all the time. Like, obviously, she'll say happy birthday, you know, all this stuff. It's like we're giving ourselves that window of, like, you know, space to, like, just heal and process this and deal with it and just go, you know, our ways. Okay. So. Okay. And what it sounds like is, and you actually said it, is that you wish her the best. Yeah. And you want the best for her. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Now, a lot of, I think, what's happening now is probably because Inside UK is on air right now. Do you watch it? There's no one like you, and there never will be.

1:12:08From the producer of Bohemian Rhapsody, there are many legends, but there is only one. Michael, rated PG-13, in theaters April 24. No, no, I didn't watch it. It's just whatever comes up on TikToks. Because the whole time, bro, you can't even scroll out all these little edits and people tagging me and stuff. So those are the only things I would see, but don't really have any reason to watch this one. You know what I mean? Yeah, I feel like there's no reason to really watch it. So it's cool. Yeah, I appreciate you just sharing that because it was interesting. I was talking to a friend of mine who said, oh my God, I can't believe Demi is coming in.

1:12:46He's never said anything about the relationship. I can't wait to hear his opinion. And I think from his perspective, he said that, you know, the community really lifted the two of you up. Yeah. And I think that you both gave a lot of inspiration and hope to a lot of people. And so when you two broke up, talk about parasocial relationships, is that a lot of people felt that pain. and just hearing your perspective will be helpful for many? I hope so. Yeah, yeah. No, I think it will. I think it will. So now here's a question that will test how healed you are. Okay, don't hit me. I feel like I know what you're going to say.

1:13:34You know what I'm going to say. You know what I'm going to say. Don't go ahead. All right, let me say it. Have you thought about dating again? Yeah. Yeah. I'm not opposed to dating. I mean, I have to get back on a horse and saddle away. And saddle away? You know? I don't spend too much in, like, dwelling in pain and stuff like this. I just have to put my best foot forward and keep going, man. Yes. Life's not done yet, so, you know. You got to go forward. Yeah, whoever's out there for me be out there for me. Okay. So now talking about who's out there for you, can I show you something? Oh, you got someone for me?

1:14:12Can I show you something? Wait, what? Can I show you this? All right. I want you to tell me. Okay, you ready? Yeah. Okay, you ready for this? All right. I want you to tell me who is this. Oh. What you do, bro? No, that's just my bestie, bro. She's like my... That's your bestie? That's my bestie, Uchman, like my older sister. All right. Yeah. Because... I put on a date, yeah. I was just joshing. See what you do? You do this. Because people have been putting us together and banding us together for so long and saying that we've been having a secret relationship and an affair book. But really and truly, that's just be my bestie.

1:14:46Like, you know what I mean? Like, I have a whole lot of friends in the industry and it's like, anytime I'm with women that are very beautiful, pretty, they wanna pin it that, oh no, they're definitely doing something. They have to be doing something. But nah, she's just like my older sister. Like, she's actually my bestie. Like, I think we went to the Brits and they were like, they made a whole thing with me, Dami with this, you know, influencer girl. Mind you, that's big Uche, that's a Tory bro. She ain't no small somebody. Right. So it's like, yeah, that's just, you tried it, though. You tried it.

1:15:17So you funny like that, huh? You know what I do like is I had a proper stalk of your IG in particular. And what I can see is that you have a lot of relationships with men and women platonic. And I think that you're showcasing that, you know, you could be a man, have a relationship with a woman, and it be friends. It's all. Yeah, just friends. Yeah, yeah. That in itself, I think, is a myth that we can't be friends with girls. Yeah, I feel like people actually just think that. And I feel like even in, like, forever gay and a relationship, I'm not a person that wouldn't want my person to not have male friends and, you know, female friends.

1:15:57You know what I mean? I love when you can be friends with the opposite sex and then not have to be sexual or weird. Do you get what I'm saying? And I feel like I have a lot of that and I've been having a lot of that. But obviously, parasocially, they would love to assume that, you know, when you're in a relationship, you can't have those things. Do you know what I mean? And if I'm out by myself with, you know, my friend, it's like, that's weird. Why are you on a date with your friend by yourself when you have a girlfriend at home? But it's like, bro, it's OK to just chill with your friends by themselves alone.

1:16:28Do you know what I mean? And sometimes I have to think in my head when I was in a relationship, it's like if I go out with my friend and I'll snap it, though, I'll put it on. So it's like I'm not hiding anything. Do you know what I mean? because there could be someone behind me or someone over there sneakily recording me and trying to make a whole situation. Oh, that means, do you know what I mean? But I live my life so loud that I want you to actually know who I am, how I am, and just understand that like, you know what I mean? Free will. Free will. Free will. Hey there, we have conversations just like this one every week.

1:17:01So if you haven't already, hit follow and the bell icon and I'll see you for the next one. If you think about that time, that period of the late 1990s, early 2000s in Ireland, what do you believe was the lowest moment for you? I don't know how this period started, but like, you know, men, boys, they always take the piss. And there was one day in class, I think one of the guys that like, it was like I was getting ganged up on, like, you know, everybody was like dropping jokes on me. and they were making like small, like passable racist remarks that like even the teacher was still writing on the board.

1:17:37And this all, you can hear all this stuff that's going on, but you're not turning around, you're not doing anything. And everyone's making all these like black jokes. You know what I mean? All these like, your dad's disappeared, even though my dad's still in my life. All these like, compare me to chocolate bars and all these, you know, all these just like quick, quick snickering insults. And every time I make a joke, because you know, I'm the only black person here now and it's a class full of maybe 14, 15 white boys. So it's silence. And we're in a SPHE class, which is all about social and all this stuff.

1:18:09And it's like, this is the type of class where you should actually be saying these things aren't actually allowed, but nothing's actually happening. And I must have said like, I think then I must have hit this guy with a joke that like everybody just turned around and they were like, what? How could you say that? This, that, and the other. I was like, I have not said anything like as bad as whatever you guys have said, right? But I was apologetic for my joke. So I come out now and I think this is where everything changed. This is the moment where everything changed now. Interesting. Because it was like, it was a way where it's like, I come out now, everybody's angry with me and my joke, even though everybody's been laughing.

1:18:49Even the teacher now finally turned around. Do you know what I mean? Oh, to say that what you said was unacceptable. Yeah, damn it, get out. And I said, what? So I'm outside now taking a little breather. I maybe settle into myself that like, oh, maybe what I actually said was too far. Cool. I'm here now, like everybody's like angry and they come out, they're saying they want to fight me. I didn't want to fight anyone. I said, like, it doesn't actually have to go to this. And I remember, I remember we're inside this like a secondary PE room. And like, no one's there. It's all like closed up, boxed off.

1:19:23It's like shower room or whatever. and I remember I was like everyone just formed around and I was like oh like you know still trying to plead my way out of this because it's like I actually don't want to fight you know what I mean but I said I don't want to hit you either though because if it's a thing where it's like okay I deserve these hits because of what I said fair I'll take it and then guy kept hitting me kept punching me but I was still standing and he was getting more upset because I wasn't punching back and he was saying I need to fight back but I just kept letting it hit me and I feel like it wasn't enough though because I've taken the hits now and everyone's gone home but then the next day because I didn't fight back it now needs to turn into a whole fiasco of like we need to go again wow and I'm like brother like we've already like squashed this like you know I mean this should be enough now for us to like you know carry on like whatever way it is that we're going to carry on just carry on but at this point now I've already said no but if you're going to do it again I'm gonna punch you back because I've taken my hits and at this point I'm ready like I'm readying myself now because it's like I can't let people think that I'm someone that you're gonna keep like doing this to I've given you the first one so the next one obviously I've beaten him up it's very quick very fast but then now they're angry with it because now I've beaten him up so then it becomes a whole it becomes a whole thing of like different people from different points of the school people that are even expelled they're not even in the school like everybody now wants a piece of me to that I mean everybody now wants a piece of this black guy that doesn't seem to fall down when you hit him and I remember some guy went on Facebook at the time and obviously on Facebook everybody can see what everyone's saying and he was like oh this chocolate bar is going to get it tomorrow or this kick out whatever blah blah blah and I'm seeing over like what 200 likes and these are all from it's from the school and at this point you're not I'm not telling my parents about this like there's no one I can really like go to my siblings are young it's just me.

1:21:21And you do go to the teachers. The thing is no one can snitch you're not it's it's it's it's like you can't you just can't tell you can't like snitch at this you know I mean it just became a whole like uproar like all the other schools now are hearing about this even my old school all my other friends like that that I don't I'm not with anymore they're all hearing about this the girl school it's like I didn't come to this school to fight do you know I mean but it's like it gets to a point and I remember the last fight that I ever actually ever had had to have was with this kid that was expelled and I remember my the vice president the vice principal at the school he brought me into his office because I feel like the older years they met me outside and they've obviously been hearing about you know all these fights and they felt sorry for me he was like dammy like I'm hearing all this stuff that's happening and honestly this is this is what he He said, honestly, if you're going to fight, just don't do it in your uniform.

1:22:17And I said, but the only thing is, I knew he hated the guy that was expelled. You basically got the approval of the only kind of body of authority to say you could do it. Yes, and it's like when obviously they told him, they probably thought he was going to say, okay, speak to me and maybe try and find a way from me to leave school quietly, where I don't actually have to be outside, blah, blah, blah. I must have been walking out and it was the school bell rang, and we're all walking down and it's like it was a whole swarm of people like even parents like school buses were not going to move like everybody like stood still just to come and see what was happening it was like over i'd say like 400 like 500 people just coming to you this is to watch you fight to watch yeah because the thing is i was making so much news about everybody that i was beating up and obviously now everybody now wanted to see this person that everyone keeps talking about right and it's it's become this whole spectacle of like oh why doesn't he like why does it why is no one able to beat him up why is he just this down the other and obviously the guy the guy that was expelled he's really popular like he's a bad boy like he's really popular whatever this down the other and i'm popular too at this point so it's like now everybody's here to come and see this and they've obviously seen the racist stuff that he's put online to come and like you know do all these things and i remember um walking you know past the school buses like through the lanes and before i know it i'm in i'm in the middle of this big circle that i like i didn't even like i was just walking and then suddenly i'm wrapped around everybody and someone's taking my bag now i've given my bag i think i've seen my bag just being flicked flicked somewhere you know i mean just put somewhere wherever it is and before i know it not even a time for conversation it's like bro just step toward bro just step towards me and he's like oh so you ready yeah you ready call i don't know if you call me chocolate bar again or whatever he's like but you know you ready yeah and again i plead like look bro we don't actually have to do this do you know what i mean because that's the one thing i always say to people we actually don't have to fight there has to be something else before we actually have to get physical that maybe we can just leave it as but if you hit me we gotta we gotta i've made a vow to myself from now if you hit me then we actually gotta go and I remember he's come up now and he's punching me he's punching me he's punching me and I like the punches are severe like in every other fight that I felt I could feel these ones like so intensely so pain so painfully I was thinking in my head today's gonna be the day that maybe you know I actually fall and I'm trying to find like all the pieces of clues of like, what am I supposed to do?

1:24:59As I'm like trying to like weave and trying to punch back and try to whatever, but I'm still getting hit. And it's like, it's like nothing I'm doing in this instance is actually working, you know? And I remember, I remember like just had a flashback earlier in the day of my MMA friend talking about, bro, you have such long reach, just like step back. And then, you know, and I just remember him saying it to me and somehow I don't know, I don't know if God into my body or something happened. It was a way where it's like, I step back, weave, and then fell down, lights out. And in that moment, it was like, it was a sense of like, this was the last battle that I'd ever have to do.

1:25:36Like nobody would touch me now. Do you know what I mean? And from then it's like, I created this like safe, harmonic like space in this town for my siblings and everybody else, because now nobody would be racist to them. Nobody would touch them. And it's a thing where it's like I'm almost like a hero now. A hero. But this is an amazing story. Sorry. I've been going off on a tangent. I'm so sorry. No, no, no. That's not a tangent because that was the seminal event in your childhood that not only reshaped how people viewed you, but how you viewed yourself. and then also how people related to your siblings.

1:26:21Yeah. Right? So you could see how that moment changed you. My question, though, is how do you believe it changed you? So who were you before kind of like those series of fights? And then who did you become? I was someone that was scared of being alone, wanted to, like, you know, fit in. and try to appease people just to do that. But then through the series of fights, I stopped being scared of being alone. It's like me being myself was enough. And if nobody else vouched for me, if nobody else fought for me, I'd fight for myself. And that's just it. But again, it's okay. But is it okay? Because I see you saying, this is what people keep saying, and it's okay.

1:27:14but after you hear something enough, it has to impact you. It has to affect you.

1:27:24I feel like I've been hearing it for so long, it doesn't really affect me anymore though. I feel like there would have been a certain point where it's like, you start looking inwards and start questioning yourself. You're like, oh, is what I'm doing not cool enough? Do I have to be cooler? Do I have to appear a bit more masculine now? Do I have to do certain things? But I feel like what really changed me and to make me not like care anymore, I don't even want to go into sensitivity of it, is when my dad died. That's when I feel like everything anyone could say about me, everything anyone could do to me, it just didn't matter anymore.

1:27:59You know, it's like the pinnacle of my life and all the stuff that, you know, I've done and my guidance counselor is now gone. So it's like the words of everybody else and stuff, it just doesn't really, it doesn't hurt anymore, you know? So it's like... Can we talk about your father? We can talk about him. We can talk about him. You know, it gives me chills when you said that because I could see how he was everything to you. Everything. thing and he recently passed away it's a 2024 yeah and can you recall the last conversation you had with him yeah I feel like um it's kind of strange because you know like you know dads and you know sons like it was the last conversation I had him was like the longest FaceTime we've ever had and I think I had I was modeling for something and it was like taking my friend with me you know you call your friend on FaceTime, you're driving your car, and you're like, you're just talking about your day, and he's expressing himself as well, and he's giving out about my sisters and stuff like this, and I'm just speaking to him, and he's like, he doesn't even want to get off the phone.

1:29:13Like, we're actually like, we're joshing it, and it's like, I feel like in a period where I grew up with my dad, it's like, it wasn't always so smooth. You know, my dad kind of like, there was a thing about like, when I was younger, you know, when I'd be disciplined or whatever, or he'd be angry, he'd always do this thing before, and I used to not like him. I used to not like him. I would always do this thing where it'd be like, he'd hit me or whatever because I've done something or maybe he's just angry or something that's not working out for him. And then he would come back home and then he would be like, hey, son.

1:29:42You know what I mean? Not speaking about the situation that has happened. And I remember, I feel like for a long time in my life, it's like I learned to forgive people even when they don't say sorry. And I feel like I kind of hold on to that. I feel like I'm just a forgiving person. I just, I don't care enough to like have hate or have, you know, make people like, oh, villain in my head and I have to like push them. Do you know what I mean? I feel like there's more to life than, you know what I mean? Like my, I think my heart is very bright. You know what I mean? There's no way you can go in there and it's dark.

1:30:14You know what I mean? So I feel like, I feel like I carried on into probably, you know, certain aspects of, you know, my relationship and whatever it is. But yeah, the last conversation with my dad just, it was that. and I remember the next like I was at the mobos and I always think I was presenting for a while and I was presenting at the mobos at that time 2024 and literally the next day I presume like I think my dad he must have had a stroke and he's in the hospital like he checked himself to the hospital and suddenly now we're with him in the hospital and this thing that just seems like oh it's it's not serious just keeps getting more and more serious and it hurts me the most because the night when like he passed like it was my little sister's it was my little sister's birthday because her birthday was on the 24th of february and it felt like we had our birthday we did in the hospital had like you know a cake or whatever and literally before like my parents went back home they were thinking oh we're going to see him they're going to see him tomorrow but i stayed back i think with my sister and something else i can't remember which other sibling was with me but I remember like I stayed back and then when it's when it's stuck the clock struck like maybe 11 45 yeah all those rooms start beeping and everything start beeping but I remember I went to him before that and I was just speaking to him and obviously he's not able to like respond to me now he's just like he's just like he's in a he's in a bad place that I've never I've never seen my dad like this before and it's it's kind of like horrifying because like this person that I was like literally speaking to the other day and we were like joshing up and I didn't know that was gonna be the last conversation that we'd be able to have where he'd speak to me.

1:31:55And we had that, but then it's like, here I'm trying to speak to him, trying to pray, I'm trying to pray life back into him. I'm trying to like plead with God and just say, please, you know what I mean?

1:32:14Man, I'll tell you what.

1:32:18You know when you just plead? Yeah. I've never had my heart broken before. I've never had my heart broken before, but when life went out of him, my heart shattered and everything just...

1:32:42You know, I, uh, you know, that's my greatest fear. That's my greatest fear, and you've gone through it. And that's why I have so much respect for everybody who's been able to walk that path. and especially you as the older brother because you have I would imagine did you feel like you had now you you have a sense of responsibility I'm the man of the house now it's like just like that just like that it's like whatever passage he had just went into me now it's like I have to do all these things and it's like but I didn't want you to finish doing all these things I still wanted to have someone to look up to.

1:33:34I still want to have someone I can take care of and give back to, you know what I mean? Like, I didn't feel like I was complete with all that. Like, I still had more to give you, do you know what I mean? And it's like, now you're gone. And I just remember my mom, everybody, they came rushing back and it was like, I was still the last person to have the last moment with him as well. And this has happened. And everything is just like, from then I feel like the sense of responsibility to share, like, the way I used to be, where I used to shop so much, I used to buy gifts, everything just started, it clicked in my mind that I have to lock in now.

1:34:10This is like, I gotta make sure my mom, my siblings are good. Like all of them, they're in uni, they're working, everyone has that, but it's like, dad's gone now. And it was so rapid that there was no real time, because at least some people get time. Like you get told, oh, you got six months, you got one year so you can plan stuff there was no planning it's just abrupt and it's just gone you know i mean and this is it and then it's like i had to take the reins and um literally i feel like for the first like for so long i didn't want to go red carpets i didn't want to like i didn't want to do anything it's like yeah that's why i feel like what i said it doesn't affect me anymore it's like i see i see it's like yeah okay what now do you know i mean that the hardest thing that could have happened to me in life has happened.

1:34:59Like you think you have so much time with your parents and then suddenly one of them go. Because I've met friends and I've had people like, you know, they lose someone that's important to them. It's like, damn, I would never want that to be me. And then it's you and you have no control over it. Like it's a whole bubble of like, I'm still grieving. Like I don't even know when I'll stop grieving. Like, you know, like I'm talking about my dad today. I don't want to cry about that. you feel like the pain that I feel like I've already processed is still there. Like, I feel like, oh, maybe I'm done.

1:35:28But suddenly now I'm here with you and I'm crying about it. It's like, it's a hard one. But at the end of the day, it's like everything I try to do now is just to like, I try to just keep doing things to make him proud or, you know, keep doing things to like, you know, amplify his life through me and all the things that he's done for us to be here. I'm just going to have to keep doing it. So like, it reaches the heavens. Like, yo, your son's doing pretty good now. You know what I mean? Yeah, look at that. Look at that. Well, you know what? From everything that I know, and I did a whole lot of research before you got here, is I believe he was, continues to be incredibly proud of you.

1:36:06You know, incredibly proud of the man that you've become and how you show up for others. I think that's so important. And I love this through line of loyalty and confidence. You have this very quiet confidence about you that I think that you want to continue, you know, to exhibit. Can I give you another surprise? Go on, hit me. You ready for this? I'm scared now after this last one, so I don't even know if I want to see this one again. All right. Are you willing to close your eyes on this one? All right. Close my eyes. Just don't kiss me, though. All right. All right. Thank you for the trust. All right.

1:36:46Now, open it up. Bro, I hope this is like a$100 ,000 check. It's better. It's better? It's better than a hundred-day check. It's better than a hundred-day check. Y 'all hearing this? It's better than a hundred-day check. I want you, if you are willing, to read that letter out loud, please. Okay. To my brother, from the day I met you, I knew you were different. You had the strength about you, but what stayed with me was your heart, the way you care for people, the way you show up even when you've got your own battles. When your dad passed, I watched everything change. The whole family was shattered.

1:37:23There was pain everywhere and much heartbreak. And in the middle of that, you didn't fall apart. You carried everyone. I'll never forget watching you stand there and read the theology. I don't know how you did it. You spoke with strength, with love, like you were holding the whole family together with your words. And in that moment, I remember thinking, he's not just grieving, he's stepping up. You became the one everyone leaned on. but what really stayed with me is what people didn't see. You never let yourself break in front of everyone else. You held it in. You stayed strong for them and I know you were going somewhere quiet to deal with that pain on your own.

1:37:58That's the part that gets me. Because that's not just strength, that's sacrifice. You didn't just lose your dad. You gave up your space to grieve properly so your family wouldn't fall apart and somehow you still kept your promises. You still became the man he raised you to be. I've always respected you, but after that, I look at you differently. You're not just strong. You're the reason people around you don't break. I love you, bro, and I'm proud of you in a way I'll probably never be able to fully explain. You're a brother. You're a friend. Real. You know who wrote that? This is my brother? My little brother?

1:38:38Who? My best who? What? My best friend? This is interesting. You know what I love is that there's so many people in your life who could have written that letter. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. My best friend, Wally. There you go. Who's that right there? That's Wally, man. That's my life partner, bro. But we just ain't gay. You know what I'm saying? That's my life partner right there, for real. You know how I know it is, is that you've mentioned him many times in our conversation already. Yeah. He's been with you at these inflection points in your life. And what's interesting to me, and I think this is a showcase of great friends, is that every time there was an inflection point, your relationship became even stronger.

1:39:22Not real. Very real. Yeah, yeah. I'll tell you what, I will hold on to that, but I'll give that to you. Damn, Brunner, you got me crying again on the throne. What are you doing? You know, what I love is that I love to have a conversation where we touch on every emotion. We've laughed. You almost had me in tears in here. And I think that's a reflection of healthy masculinity. True. And I'd love to get your perception on how has that term masculinity changed for you over the years? I feel like the term masculinity for me is the freedom in owning masculinity. Even if it might be flamboyant sometimes or it might be a little sassy, it's like men have attitude too.

1:40:20And it's like being able to like express that in a way that you're confident with and comfortable, you know. and I feel like over the years it's touched me in ways in how I dress, how I speak, you know, I'm part of the girls, you know, all these little things that like, you know, people might deem as zesty, sassy, all these stuff. It's like, I'm still a very masculine man. I get shit done. I pay the bills. I do the stuff that I need to do. But at the same time, my personality is going to shine true and even if my masculinity might seem shaky to you it's not because it's still masculine like every every fiber every part of me however way you may deem it is still very masculine you know i mean it doesn't take away from you know it doesn't take away from my masculinity yeah you know so a lot of people ask me how do i define masculinity because it's i think for a lot of people it's hard especially nowadays and to me what masculinity is is it is um it is strength that's not rigid yeah you know responsibility that's still emotionally aware and emotionally connected to me that's you to you that's that's that's you and i think when people say yeah this God damn me hope he's not a masculine guy.

1:41:44I think that they are throwing back to a very toxic version of what masculinity used to be thought of. You are the way forward. And I think that that's why I was so excited to talk to you because I wanted to see it for real. I feel like you got a little bit of me and you too, man. I feel like we kind of wanted the same. Oh, man. I'm a little upset because you outdressed me today. Nah, you looking fly, too, bro. You got a little Rick Dog Mars, bro. You see? I mean, but I see the whole situation, which means that we have to talk about fashion a little bit. Yeah, yeah. Just a little bit. Touch it.

1:42:22When did fashion become important to you? I feel like when I taught university, and, you know, it wasn't just like fashion is just clothes. It was more so like how I would change my hair color, how I would like try and relax and how I try and you know get jerry curls. Oh you had a jerry curl? Yeah I was running that stuff back at uni. Did you really? With the activator? Bro, activator, it was bouncing. It was bouncing bro. But I remember bro, like back when I was at uni I feel like there was just like there's a level of expression that was free. You know I'd get eyebrow pairs in, I'd like do things that just like felt expressive.

1:43:01And I feel like then it just tapped into like from that into clothes. Like I look at myself in the mirror and you put like sport core and, you know, smart, smart together and seeing how they like sit together. And you look at it like it's kind of it's kind of it. And then it became a whole like thing of like experimenting. And I feel like with science as well, there's a science to fashion, too. So it's like you got to experiment with different things and you got to like try things. And at first, they might be the worst experiments. but to you you feel confident and you feel like good and I feel like over the years like when I look back on some of the stuff I was wearing I'm just like bro that that that ain't really it but now it's like you know I just I just kept going out and I kept wearing my own clothes and I started looking at everyone else and no one else was dressing like me and then it started making me feel like you know I'm special I'm unique because it's like you don't want like fashion is subjective right but it's like when you wear something so it's like you're bringing your own identity into your clothes.

1:43:56So like when people see you, the first thing is like, oh, like he looks, you could look, you could have no money in your account and you dress good. You look like the richest person in the room. So it's like, there is like an identity to like who you're trying to become and who you want to be that when you're wearing your clothes that like I was always trying to like be a part, you know what I mean? Be a part of is making me stepping into this character and this person that I actually am. Yes. Do you know what I mean? Can we touch on something? You just said something that I tell my boys all the time because they're like, because I have a, I mean, Dammit, you will appreciate this.

1:44:27I have a room, a full bedroom that I've converted into my wardrobe. Damn, I'll big your house. Whoa. Okay, sir. Okay, so now, come on now, come on now, come on. Okay. You know, I've been on TV for a while, you know, but a full room, right? And then I've taken over the landing as well, right? Okay. And I go into my situation. I've got everything color coordinated, everything right set up, everything nicely. and my boys are like, Dad, like, what are you doing? And I say, I never want to go anywhere where someone looks like I look. Real. Right? And you just, so you just said the same thing. Why do we feel this way?

1:45:08Because, bro, we're special. You want to feel like, it's like everyone can dress the way they dress, but I just don't want everyone to go somewhere and someone has the same identity as me, bro. It's like we're standing in our own power by the way we dress. You know what I mean? Yes, yes, yes. So you feel, because this is how I feel too, it's an expression. Yes. It's me boldly saying, this is who I am. Yes. And I don't know if you feel this way too, but I feel as if I'm also saying, take me for what you see. And if you don't like it. that's literally it but people always like it though that's the thing they always like it though they always do though there's always more to like it than not it's true it's so true for me it's like when I'm wearing clothes I don't go out thinking oh someone's going to notice me and stuff and all these things but the people that do come up they be like oh my god bro you dress so sick you dress like this And it's like being happening from even before, you know, I went on the show.

1:46:11So it's like, and then now it's just amplified. Right. I mean, so this is you. This is truly, authentically you. So is this how you started to get into fashion? Because you have your own fashion line. Yeah, I have my own fashion line. Okay. Let's speak on it. Yeah, Snow Bunny. And I feel like, for me, even the name, since we just touched on it, since we're here and we're speaking about everything, I feel like, for me, I like the name because I thought it was sexy. Okay. Yeah. and I know the name obviously has one meaning of that, but that's the derogative term that people just made up. I think there's a couple of meanings though.

1:46:43Yeah, there's a lot of meaning. And there's the actual meaning of like a novice skier. That's the actual real meaning in the dictionary, it means a novice skier. And I remember when I was making it, I had this idea to put a rabbit in a balacalava, and I was like, this is my first drawing or whatever. And I know there's controversy to it, like I get it, But I'm not someone that wants to be boxed in by things other people made up. Because at one point, someone has made it into this derogative term, right? But that's not what it means. And there's so many other meanings for it. So why can't I have it mean something that it means to me and not allow myself to be boxed up because of what everybody else thinks?

1:47:22Okay. You know? Okay. And I feel like when I was making it, it was another form of expression of just doing whatever I want. and like the clothes that I'm making it's like you have to introduce like obviously because we're living in the UK and you have to do like an introduction thing to it so I start with like you know track suits we call them snow suits you know I mean so we play on all that stuff and then I feel like this year is when I actually go into the real advancement of like what I've actually been trying to create because you know you you create like from time so it's like there's always building blocks to like show people what you're doing and stuff and I feel like it was it was a It was a no-brainer for me not to have my own fashion brand.

1:47:58It was a no-brainer. It was always gonna happen. Do you believe that is, I mean, you know, I know you're a multi-hyphenate, so there's a lot that you do. But do you think that fashion is going to become more and more a part of your day-to-day? Yeah, I feel so, yeah. Okay. Alongside everything else that I do wanna do still, yeah. Okay. I like being busy, I guess. Yes, yes. There's a beauty and there's a fun to it. Just like, I like hustling. I like making my way. I like making things, you know, I like reaching milestones that I've set for myself. And like this year, it's like I keep saying free will because I actually want to do all the things that I want to do.

1:48:35And I don't want to hesitate on it. If I want to make music tomorrow, I'm going to do it. If I want to write a book, I'm going to do it. I've written a book already. So it's like all these things that I want to do, I'm just going to do all the things that I was passionate about that we were talking about from earlier. It's now time to like hone in on that as well and use my free will to experience all these things. where there's traveling, where there's all these things, trying all these new things. It's like I want to allow myself to do those things, you know? Yes. So I can look back one day and I'm like, you really did use your free will, bro.

1:49:05Yes, your free will. I like it. You've used your free will. Yeah. All right. So now, Dem, is there anything that we have not yet talked about that you want to talk about? I feel like one thing I haven't touched on is probably, you know, my accents. I feel like that, like I feel like people get misconstrued and they feel like, you know, I'm putting on an American accent. Okay. And obviously I'm Irish. You know, when I see other fellow Irish people, my accent just code switches into that, you know? But I feel like for me, when I speak clearly, like when I see like black people, Nigerian people, like go into the whole Niger accent and, you know, they talk like this and they move.

1:49:44It's a whole lot of code switch. And in my, when we were growing up, like obviously my mom, she was hard of hearing. So like sometimes it would be like a situation where like Like, because obviously she's Yoruba fluent. Obviously she speaks English. But at the same time, it's like when you're speaking so fast and you have an Irish accent, it's like she's trying to catch, she's trying to read your lips and catch them. Like, so I would have to, like, slow down my words and then it would sound like I'm American. But I'm not. I'm just trying to pronounce my words clearly. You know what I mean? Like, I can do the American accent and do all those things because, you know, I'll be doing that.

1:50:18You know what I'm saying? but it's just like when I speak clearly and people misconstrue that oh nah he's putting on an axe where's his Irish axe and I feel like people that don't know I'm from Ireland or whatever they just firstly assume that oh he's trying to be American but then there's tick Irish words you can be like you're right there fella you wanna go down to the Pope do you you know what I mean but like I'm not gonna come around I'm not coming like bro it's like I'm gonna come to the UK now and I'm like you're right there fella yo let's go to the Pope you know what I mean but like you see when you're growing up with the guys and you're joshing and we all, they speak like that.

1:50:50It's natural, isn't it? Well, after a while, it's just like, when I break it down, I just, this, I actually think this isn't my actual voice, even though people want to tell me it isn't my voice. I do feel like it is. Right, so you almost don't know what your voice is. I know I have many accents under my belt, but, you know, whoop-de-doo. Oh my gosh. You know what's so wild to me about that is, I feel like when people hear that term, code switch, it seems like it's this negative thing, right? But from everything, I mean, one is if you are black, a matter of fact, I saw a study that showed that black professionals code switch 70 to 80 percent of the time.

1:51:26Yeah. Right. But we're doing it as an adaptive strategy. Strategy, yeah. You know what I mean? And so we're white professionals code switch at a much lower percentage. Yeah. But now that I've been in the UK for about eight years, I now can see how many people code switch into posh sounding. Posh, yes, yes. Especially in the professional environment. Especially in the first, yes. Yes. I see it. I can see right through you guys. You know what I mean? Yeah. I was like, I see what you're doing. I see what you're doing. And they sound all sweet and nice. And then I tried to do the posh because I've not been here for so long.

1:52:03It doesn't sound the same, you know? and then but I understand I feel like there's an art form to code switching because sometimes it's actually helpful to be adaptive because if I go to Nigeria now and I'm in the market and then I'm trying to do my accent it sounds like I'm from abroad but I'm trying to haggle you know what I mean they're going to be trying to so I have to be like hey hey I'll find out this one how much is this one auntie now please give me for you know what I mean you gotta get in with the program to get what you want it is it's adaptive it's adaptive yeah Yeah. Fair. Fair. Fair enough.

1:52:37Fair enough. I'm glad we talked about that. Anything else? I actually don't know. I actually don't know. I feel like I touched on a lot of things, to be honest. And your questions were amazing. Thank you for allowing me to actually be here. I guess open up, you know. You're welcome. Well, Damien Hope, can I say, you were incredible, my man. Thank you. You too, bro. I'm so happy to have met you. I'm excited about what you're going to do. in the future. And what I love most is that you have remained consistently someone of high character throughout the entirety of your life. And you are someone who not only your father is incredibly proud of, but I can see that you are your grandmother's greatest dream.

1:53:26Not real. She told me I'm the favorite. I'm the favorite. But see, I know. I know. So continue on, continue on, and thank you so much for joining me. Thank you for having me. So we say follow back? You got it. Oh, definitely, definitely, definitely. I mean, Dammy is a force. Loyalty, hands down, I would say is a top trait that he embodies and that he holds to a high level of value. And so you can see why when someone breaks that loyalty with him, why he's ready to walk away. Because you think they've been in a relationship for almost four years. Many couples with therapy could work through that challenge.

1:54:15But he had no willingness to do it because of, I think, how much emphasis he places on loyalty. And that's his prerogative. It's hard to relinquish the memory of Dammy crying over his father and how heartbreaking that moment was. And for me, that was the hardest part of this conversation because I've trained myself to try to hold space, but I was fighting against it. I was literally, I was going over to him. And that was a challenge that I had as an interviewer. It's funny, he said, I see a little of me in you. And I thought, I see a little of me in you, yeah. On TOWIE, I was branded as the ice queen.

1:55:05I remember my hands were shaking. The anxiety was overtaking my whole body at that point. I'd go to sleep thinking a whole room full of cameras were watching me. I ruined the news. Go away! Go away! My mom, she's a complete stranger. It's almost like I just haven't got one and that's it. I can't imagine doing that to my child, Madison. Everything's perfect. Then I meet a guy who absolutely took the stuffing out of me. And that's when I started to go partying. What's your best dating advice? Don't. Oh, just don't date. No, I'm joking. I'm joking. I want to go to TOWIE. It completely changed my life overnight, like that.

1:55:41But I did start to question my career choices, like my worth in this industry. So what do you do next? The press, they were terrible. They like to build you up, not too high, just to where they think you should be. And then they like to tear you down or watch you fall down. But I feel like I've sorted me and Maddie out. Like, we're good. So remember how I said, what does the industry think of you? And you said... Ice cream. Whoa, can I show you something? I have lots of surprises for you, Chloe. Oh, God, I don't think you're going to cry.

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