Georgia Kousoulou Reveals Reality Of Life On TOWIE “There Were Showmances All Around Me”

32:23Yeah. So how do you know that it was real? You know, your feelings for him and both, but more importantly, his feelings for you. Yeah. Well, I didn't. I kind of I think I had the expectation that it wasn't going to last I think we was in our B-fire everyone was getting on and I thought this could just be a holiday romance so I didn't need to worry about it because I just thought I don't even want a boyfriend anyway I was thinking I don't want that I don't want married I didn't want that so for me I was just having fun I thought well someone to film with you know he seems quite fun I've never experienced a guy like this he was really loud, very confident, very cocky.

33:00I kind of went with it, which was actually great. I didn't think he's going to be my husband. Okay. You just thought it's a summer romance. Summer romance. It is what it is. Good for TV. Good for TV. It gives me more filming, more people to film with, you know, because back then it was about how many scenes you were filming, you know, to stay on the show. So it was another thing. And I thought, well, if we just film this holiday romance, it is what it is. No, it weren't. I think I met his mum the next day and had pie mash. Wow, look at that. But now you just said something that also I'd love to explore a little bit.

33:31As you said, it was about how many scenes you were filming. It's how, you know, much you'd be on the show. I would imagine the desire among the entire cast is you want to be on the show as much as possible. Of course. And then there were a lot of big personalities. A lot. Right. I mean, that was some people could argue that was the heyday of TOWIE, right? Yeah. So that means that are you saying that you think that everyone on that cast was consciously thinking, I need to be in as many scenes as possible. Oh, everyone. Everyone was thinking. Everyone. Everyone knew you didn't film, you weren't on the show.

34:05You know, imagine all them cast members, like you had to have a storyline. If you're not having a storyline, you're getting dropped from the show. And it was very cutthroat back then. Every series, you never knew if he was coming back. Wow. So it was like, okay, we need to film. And there was showmances, as they called them, everywhere around me. I remember people, because I was single, and I remember the producers saying like, is there anyone you fancy? And I'd be like, no. on the show on the show yeah and I before Tommy come on I don't think I could have faked that I couldn't have faked a fake showmance and I know there was people definitely doing it but I couldn't do that because to be honest I wasn't really bothered about a relationship so which is better and I'm not a good actress actually I can't act and I can't lie I'm really bad at them two things so for me I couldn't have done that and it's actually Tommy I didn't really think too much of it I thought well we'll just go with it for someone to film with you know And he was also good friends of Arge.

34:59And Lydia and Arge were together at this time. And I was good friends of Lydia. So it just kind of works. I just went with it. I see it. So now, how intense was it? How many days were you filming? Even how many days a year was filming? So Ibiza, I think we was there 12 days, I think. And you never knew how many days you were going to film or when. And it was great, though, because it was a big holiday with your friends. It was the best time of my life. but trips were intense because you're together so there's no getting away so in Essex you could film a bad scene or you know something you know and a row and you could go home to a normal life and switch off but no you couldn't on the away trips but that's where the most drama happened the best viewing was then because it was the best scene you're in a hotel things are going on and people are telling things and even if you don't want to film certain things the producers are knowing about it because you're there yes they're there The next room is a producer, you know?

35:59Yeah. When you think about your entire time on TOWIE, what was the hardest moment for you? The hardest moment would be me and Tommy Rowan and actually being upset and then trying to hide it because you're not supposed to hide it. But I was the master of hiding it and I did it with us and that's how we survived it, 100%. Really? I never forget sitting in scenes, wanting to kick him under the table, not liking him but pretending that we were fine because I knew that I was good at that. I thought what I'm going to do here is I'm going to sit here and I'm going to talk about someone else's relationship and I'm going to pretend that we're fine because I know that the cast will try and break us.

36:51I knew it. And that's exactly what they did because we then become, when you're together in a couple, you're more powerful and you're in a way dangerous to the other cast members because the two of you. And how so? How are you more dangerous? So you're filming more and it's like this, it was this weird like hierarchy, like if you're in a couple, you're safer, you know, and there's this like, you're going to get more scenes. and it was very cutthroat back then. Like the cast were like hungry, you know, for the scenes. So they would want to break you up. Cast members would want to break you up. So literally they would try to.

37:30They would try to. And how so? They would try to pick us. They'd be like, what's going on? Oh, have you not had a row? I've had times where they would say to producers, we heard George and Tommy Rowan. and I'd be in a scene not knowing and they'd go how are you and Tommy and I'd be like fine why they'd be like oh no you wasn't because you were brown and I'd be like what yeah yeah we even had a cheating allegation did you yeah it got brought up in a scene that I dealt with it off camera because we weren't filming at the time six months before and one of the cast members told the show about it and then they brought it to camera and I didn't know they would try it Because they were like, we want to split them up.

38:15So I was like, right, okay, fine. I'll play this game. And I was like, listen, we would deal with us after. We're not breaking. And we never did. Wow, look at that. We'd have a few, like, rows on the show if we couldn't help it. You know, there's certain things you can't. About him working and things like that. But the deep stuff, no. We're a team and we're the team and we stay in the team. And it's us against the rest. And it was. And no one ever broke us down. Wow. Not once. And did you think that or feel like they knew that you two had this agreement? They were fuming. They used to go to the producers and say, why is Georgia and Tommy always talking about other people's problems and not their own?

39:00But I was so good at discussing other people's stuff that I got away with it. And the producers couldn't really have a guard with me because I was giving them what they needed and I was making the scenes happen because I was the one getting the information out or helping. And I used to get a lot of ag on socials and people would say, you're so busy. And I'd be like, no, I know I am. But I'd rather be busy. Slag me off if you want. But I'm protecting my relationship. And I genuinely believe that's how we survive TOWIE. We're the only ever couple to survive it. Really? The only ever couple. There's not been one other couple.

39:35So I've done a good job. It worked. I beat the TOWIE. I beat it Oh my gosh And I would imagine One of the reasons why No couples have survived it Is because The others Yeah Were trying to To break them up They weren't a team Yeah And I would also imagine That it's not just the cast No But it's also production Of course It's also the public Of course But they They learnt very quick of us That they weren't getting it They tried Everyone tried There was talks of girls Coming on the show That DM Tommy And all that You know, like the PA days. I mean, they were hard days for us. And they tried everything, but we stayed together as a team and no one beat us.

40:17What I've seen with the press is that the press has been relentless on many television personalities. Yeah. In particular women. Yeah. And in particular women in their relationships. Yeah. So during your time on TOWIE, did you feel that pressure as well? I felt protective of it. Um, only like when it comes to like PAs and stuff, there was pressure because I think, oh, if he would, if he, if he messes up here, cause you know, back then we've like, I didn't know him as well as obviously I do now. And I used to think, oh, if he cheats on me and things happen, it's going to be in the press, you know, and that would worry me a little bit.

41:00Yeah. Cause those, those were popular. Cause even, even when I got here in 2018, I feel like those, those were of those public appearances, right? Yeah. Where they were popular. And it seems like that's where a lot of reality TV personalities were making their money. The boys. The boys. More. The boys would get books more than the girls. I never really did the PAs. I would do more like shop openings, salons. He would get booked a lot. Now, imagine I'm in a new relationship with this guy. He's new to telly. I'm new to telly. And he's got girls. They used to literally like throw themselves at him.

41:33Yes. And the PAs were predominantly what? Clubs. Clubs. that were being booked. Late nights. And how much were they making for PAs then? I reckon back then like$1 ,000,$2 ,000 for an appearance. Okay. Maybe more. I can't really remember, but that's good money. Very good money. Oh, yeah. Unbelievable. Two, three thousand pounds and they're just showing up at the club. Yeah, getting drunk with their friends. Getting drunk. Girls everywhere. VIP, girls everywhere. So he's doing that frequently. Yeah. How frequently? He was doing it most weekends, I would say. but then he realized very quickly it's not going to work with in a relationship you can't do both and I think that is why we survived because he didn't he stopped doing them I think look at that he was like this isn't for me I think he valued my relationship more you know luckily for me yeah look at that yeah you know I think that's why I asked was he a bad boy or a bad bad boy no yeah Because what I often see is, this is with men, regardless of the lifestyle they're living, when they meet a partner where life, everything with that partner is better, they're willing to stop whatever it was they were doing.

42:50And it sounds like this is exactly what Tommy did. Yeah. The press were right. They were nice. And I think the press can't write if it's not there. you know I think they can try and find a story but if he's not on a table with loads of girls and even if he was if he's not doing anything what can they write yes so and also then the trust come in and it's when it's I used to turn up a lot how so well he he started he opened a club with these guys and I used to go over Friday did you yeah of course I did I used to show my face and I used to make it very known that that was my boyfriend okay I used to circle the club and I'd be like, that's my boyfriend.

43:28I mean, now I'd be like, do your thing. I'm staying home with a cup of tea, but I couldn't care. But back then, I'm like, this is my territory. What the girls did to me on TOWIE, I was doing to the other girls. You're doing it. Yeah, yeah. Now, see, I didn't realize that there was that much pressure on you and Tommy from the other members. Yeah. And one thing I was doing in the research is I saw, and tell me if this is accurate, is that do you speak to any of the TOWIE cast? You do? I do. All right. So it wasn't like this mass fallout. No, they wrote that. Okay. Because I think someone said to me, are you inviting everyone to the wedding?

44:06I was like, hardly anyone from the show. Purely because I'm not going to start inviting the whole cast. My wedding, I had a lot of people. And also, there's only a certain few now that I'm really close to. I talk to everyone. and I bumped into the cast when I was doing promo for my show not that long ago. And I'm like, guys, what's going on? I'm a big Tari fan. I love Tari. I still watch it. So when I see them, I'm like, oh, let's tell me. Tell me the goss. And I get back into that natural role. But I'm not going to invite them to my wedding because your wedding's your wedding, you know. But no, there was no fallout.

44:43I don't know where they got that from. And also, too, is I think there's probably, there's not a strong understanding as to what the relationship actually is yeah so i would imagine it feels like they were cast mates yes right it wasn't best friends no and some of them are some of them were but they've left now okay my best friends left um so yeah the girls on there now i'm like i talk to all of them i say hello if i saw them i'm so excited to see them but yeah no they're not my best friends now you know sure so So who were the best friends? So Lydia was my bridesmaid. Chloe Lewis. Amber, she come on with me for a bit.

45:24Danielle Armstrong. I've got good, good friends from that show now, and we're still really, really close, which is actually really nice. Yeah, it's really good. Yeah. It's really good. And then the boys, Arj is one of my good friends. Dan Edgar is one of my good friends still, and he's still on the show. He was at my wedding. So, yeah, there's still good. I've got a lot of good connections from that show that will never go. Because when you're on that show, you do have a bond that no one can... I can't describe the bond. It's like a weird family connection. They're not your family, but they are.

45:56You've experienced this life together that no one really knows about. You can't explain it to people, but you just get each other. Yeah. It's like a fraternity and a sorority combined. Yeah. You know, what do you think it was about TOWIE and still is that mesmerizes so many people? You know, like when you walked in, I was telling you a story about how I was in the U.S. Yeah. On another project. Right. And someone literally walks in, an American, saying, do you know about TOWIE? I watch TOWIE. Right. So it's one of these where it was it's a phenomenon. Yeah. And it actually launched many other reality television shows.

46:38I think Maiden Chelsea happened as a result of TOWIE. What do you think it was and still is about TOWIE that has made it so, you know, such an important part of UK culture? I think because no one had seen it before. Everyone was like, wait, they're not actors. You know, like he was like, and it's so funny because people still say to me this day, did you have a script? I'm like, a script? Absolutely not. We can't even repeat a line. Like, we're not good at scripts. Absolutely not. But people just mesurized. They were like, what? So you really just walked down the road and that happens? I'm like, yeah, that drama's real.

47:10I'm like, yeah. People still are like, what? And I'm like, no, I know. It is actually wild. But Essex is like that. You know everyone. Someone's dated the cousin's cousin. Everyone's like, it's like that. So what a great idea to make a show about it. Yeah, yeah. And it's just, it is so great to this day. I think that you were perfect in that environment and you really thrived. Like you came into yourself. I loved it. You know? Yeah. But even to go back and look at how, so when you met Tommy, you came back home. Yeah. And then that's when you first saw that your parents had literally split up. Your mother moved out of the house.

47:53Yeah. Right? But you had Tommy. Yeah, Tommy. So I would imagine that gave you, Tommy really became the safe space for you. Yeah, and a lot of pressure for him, actually, because I kind of then moved into his house. I like never left because I was like, hang on, this is nice. I'm just going to stay here for a bit. So did you believe that you two would get married? Because that's right at the moment where you start to become disillusioned around love. So what did you think your relationship with Tommy would be? I kind of didn't know. I kind of didn't really want to be married, but I kind of didn't want to not be with him.

48:29So I just was like, oh, I like this and it's working. And he always said, like, we're going to get married. And I think the show really wanted it to happen on the show. But I was like, this isn't a show, man. We're not doing that. We're not doing it for a deal, magazine deal or, you know, just for the show. We was very certain on that. I think people realized that quite quick. I wanted to see if it was the real deal, you know. Yes. is that almost what led to you and Tommy leaving TOWIE? So we left TOWIE because I was pregnant. Okay. Yeah. And it just, it felt right to leave. I kind of was, I never said I was leaving, leaving.

49:05I just said I'm leaving for a bit. And I was heavily pregnant and I had to leave to have the baby. And I was like, I'm definitely not going to film. I filmed right up until I was pregnant. And then we got offered a two-part special for Brodie. so it was like oh yeah might as well all right might as well do it and then i yeah and so then you were officially gone then i never went back from tally i went back for i think i've done a couple of like cameos but yeah my life then moved on all right now brody yeah before you have brody yeah from what i understand is that you were on contraception yeah for a long period of time Yeah.

49:50Okay. How many, it was years and years and years? Years, yes. I was like 16 or something. And so did you get pregnant while on contraception or no? No. So it was the weirdest thing. I was in lockdown and it started making me feel really sick, weirdly, this tablet. And I'd been on this tablet for years. Actually, people were saying you should come off them. And in my head, I thought, okay, we'd been together a while then. And I thought, everyone said to me, if them pills take a year and a half to come out of your system, everyone said it to me. So I thought, oh, God, that's a lot, isn't it? And it started making me feel sick.

50:26I have no idea why. So I come off. Well, I got pregnant straight away. Look at that. Biggest shock ever, actually. Okay. I was like, oh, my God. Oh, no. What's happened? Wow. So you were scared? Yeah. Because I did. I know it's so silly because that's what happens when you do that. But I was like, oh, oh, what? I was like so like I didn't expect it and it was in lockdown was like what is this and I was like maybe it's lying the test isn't real but it was real and it was terrifying but unbelievable and actually best thing that ever happened because now I think I don't think I'd have ever planned to have a baby because I thought of it was terrifying to me um so actually it was the biggest blessing ever that it just happened.

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54:04So get to Lowe's, get it done, and earn your Sunday. Lowe's, official partner of the NFL. So then having Brody, you become a mom. Yeah. How does that change your life? Completely changed my whole life. I was like, what is this life, to be honest? I was like, whoa, this is a lot. I was like, this is hard. and it just like threw me in. I don't think I've realised that when you're pregnant, you're like, oh, I'm pregnant. I love being pregnant. You get so much attention if everyone's really nice to you. And I was filming for TOWIE when I was pregnant and, you know, I got to go in later and, you know, it was just grey and, you know, everyone was like, oh, you look lovely and I loved it.

54:42I had so much confidence as well being pregnant. I wore really tight dresses and I was like, love the bump. I couldn't believe it. I shocked myself. And then you think you're going to be pregnant forever. I didn't think I realised that I actually had got to have a baby. And then Brodie turned breech and I was like, oh, no, I've got to have a C-section. And then that was petrifying. But I just, I don't think I even knew what to expect. I'm going to be honest. You leave the hospital. Yeah. Come home. Yeah. Right. Wild. What makes it wild? A whole house full of people. First grandchild on both sides.

55:19It was like, Jesus has been born. Yes. And I was really happy because I love people, but I was like, well, this is a lot. But I was kind of wanting the people there because I was like, help me, what am I doing? And I was a bit like, what now? Don't leave me. I was like, mum, do not leave me. Where are you going? She's like, I'm just going to be... No, no, no, no. I think she stayed there for two weeks. Do not leave me. I was like, do not leave me. I'm petrified. Do not leave me. She's like, you're fine. I'm like, no, no, no, don't leave me. It was the weirdest thing. I definitely struggled, definitely mentally.

55:48Now looking back, I weren't right, really. I weren't right. I really, really struggled because I didn't know what to expect. And I never forget feeling really, really lonely in a house full of people. And I remember I used to take myself off to the bathroom and cry a lot. And I didn't realise that Tommy realised I kept crying. And I would do the night feeds and I would cry and be like, this is scary, this is a really scary place. and I didn't realise I was in this place. But it was a dark place, to be honest, because I was a bit like... I was like, what is this life? What have I done really? Okay.

56:29So when you reflect back, do you feel like you were going through postpartum? 100%. Okay. Yeah. So, you know, I was looking at postpartum, and here's what I didn't realize about it, was how prevalent it is.

56:46So technically postnatal depression, right, is a type of depression that many parents experience after having a baby. main symptoms include low mood, exhaustion, difficulty bonding with the baby, extreme anxiety or irritability. But here's what I didn't realize was how common. So it affects more than 10 % of women within a year of giving birth. And it could also affect fathers, which I didn't realize no so when you think about your um those behaviors for you or the symptoms should i say what were your symptoms i couldn't bond i didn't know how to bond and the hardest bit about parenthood for me was everybody said to me which they shouldn't have said to me which i don't blame them but i do when you have this baby you're going to get this overwhelming feeling of of love and you're going to bond instantly it's this instant mother's instinct and this connection so when it didn't happen to me I thought oh my god I knew it there's something wrong with me there is something wrong with me I should have stuck with dogs I was so in my head I was like I know I love this thing this human but also kind of like an alien because I don't actually know you I remember thinking I don't know you but I love you I know I love you and that was certain I knew I loved him but I thought how do I how come I haven't got this bond and I was thinking maybe it's delayed it's delayed and then everyone said you're going to know what to do and I kept thinking everyone said there's this mother instinct that kicks in and you know what to do but I didn't know what to do and I thought oh my god is that wrong with me again what's wrong with me and I was just I was so in my own head that I kept thinking why have I not got this mother's instinct that everyone told me I was going to get yes and when you reflect back Georgia what was the hardest day of that period for you Day three and ten.

58:40You remember it? I remember it day three and ten, yeah. I don't know why, day three and ten. And it only got better when Tommy said it out loud in front of my mum, his mum and the midwife. Okay, so he had to say it. He said it. He said, she's not right, by the way. So day three, for example. What was going on for you day three? I was just everything. I was like, I didn't even recognise myself in the mirror. I was like, what is this person? I didn't look like me. I had this person on me. I was like, this alien person. I was like, how am I going to keep this person alive? I kept worrying, how am I going to keep him alive?

59:16And I was like, I know I've got a feed in my bottle, but I was like, how do I know? I was like, everything I was picking up, how do I know? How am I going to do this? I was always thinking, is he okay? Is he okay? Is he okay? And then I thought, oh my God, is this going to last forever? This tiredness, like, all like I couldn't see past the night feeds and the days and they all blurred into one. and I had so much love around me and everyone was so excited about this beautiful baby and this healthy baby. And I thought, why am I not as excited as everyone else? And you didn't tell anyone? No, not one person.

59:51I was ashamed because I thought they're judging me and I thought this makes me a bad person because I thought, how am I not happy? How can I not be happy about a newborn baby? That's terrible. It wasn't obviously terrible, but I couldn't get out of my own head. I thought, this is terrible. And everyone was like, it's the best thing in the world. And I was like, no, I know it is. and he's unbelievable and I love him, but why am I not as happy as all of you's? Like, this is weird. If you could go back and be with you on day three or day ten, what would you have done or told yourself? I'd have hugged myself and said, this is so normal.

1:00:26This is so normal. This is so normal. This is you and you're fine and this is just your emotions. You've got hormones raging through your body. This is totally normal. and you've had, you've been cut open multiple layers, you had a C-section, you are fine. You're doing amazing. Like, you are fine. It's going to get better. It's going to get easier to give yourself a break. I'd have gave myself a cup of tea and gone, you're fine. Okay. Yeah. Is that what happened after Tommy saw what was going on with you and then told people out loud? Oh my God, instant change. He, I'll never forget, it was in the kitchen.

1:01:01I was on the sofa, had the baby in my arms, had the midwife. The midwife, her name was Pat. She was unbelievable. And I had her a lot. And I'd hurt my mum and Bev all the time. They were there. And Tommy said to everybody, they were like, how are you? And I'm like, yeah, yeah, good, thanks. Yeah, yeah. That's just the way I do it. I'm good at it, right? And he said, no, she's not. She is not right. And all of a sudden, everyone looked at me and I burst into tears. and everyone was so shocked because I think they just thought I was, like, tired and stuff, you know, and I burst in tears and I was like, it all come out.

1:01:37I was like, I'm struggling. I don't know what I'm doing. And from that day, my whole experience changed. What do you think would have happened if he had not said that? I don't know, you know. Scary to think about it because it only would have got worse, you know, because them night feeds go on three months, which was actually really quick for some babies bro but three months is a long time to feel lonely you know and your thoughts go into a place you lose yourself I was just so I didn't know what I was doing like just walking to the shop was a lot like everything was a lot I'm so thankful to him to this day that he did that and at the time I was fuming by the way I looked at him and I remember thinking how dare you how dare you say I was fuming but then when I cried I was like now I'm like thank God Thank God.

1:02:24Yeah, you were able to release. It's one of these where this is, one is, thank you for sharing that, is I would imagine you think that the more of these conversations that we have, we normalize this. And we realize that because one is we have a significant number of women that are impacted by this, a significant number of men impacted by this. and having that conversation just to be aware that, you know what, this is normal. It's so normal. Yeah, this is normal. And do you know what? Looking back now, there weren't a lot of people in the public eye saying that. There weren't anyone that I could, that admitted they struggled.

1:03:05And I really, really found that hard because I'd look on social media and it'd be like these girls would be having babies and I'd be like, why have they got their life together? They're really like, and it would make me feel really bad about myself. And it weren't their fault. but like there was no one opening up and I was like so I used to think it was just me no one was talking about body image and how it affected them how they lost themselves or how they didn't look like themselves how how they didn't bond with their baby no one was saying that because and I get it because everyone felt ashamed I wouldn't even I weren't even saying it really so I couldn't expect other people to so I think it's so important because how many other women and are sitting there thinking that, you know?

1:03:45Yes. You know, and it's like if I would have had that person to go, oh, yeah, I'm not alone, you know? And I know that I definitely will help people talking about it because it was a lonely time. Yes. But it's so normal. And it's so normal. And look what's happened as a result is that you have now, or as a result of Tommy, you know, outing you, is that you were able to emotionally get it out of you. But then you said things got better. Oh, my God, unbelievable. So did you feel like literally it was once you didn't feel the pressure of the shame, that's when it started to go away? I was like instantly like, wow, this is normal.

1:04:21Okay, cool. If I want to cry today, I'm going to cry. If I don't want to get out of my pyjamas, I'm not going to. It was all normal. And I was filming my show as well. So I was trying to juggle, wait, hang on a minute. Because I was so, our show is very, very raw. Like it is so fly on the wall. It is so fly on the wall. And I remember filming the whole series of my pyjamas. basically and I was like I'm not changing because so this this is not Tyler this is the uh this was solo show baby steps yeah multiple series of baby steps by the way six series yeah congrats on that that's not bad that's not bad yeah um so you're filming the show yeah while this is happening yeah you're probably hiding it from production yeah hiding it obviously from the audience yeah do you ever showcase it yeah I showcased everything okay because what happened was Tommy's out in me was we just started properly filming so everything was I was literally filmed the whole series looking back in my dramas look at that basically like no one everyone does it now but back then like no one did that like no one was on camera like that like I mean I even got my belly out I think I was in a path of the days sleep deprived and just went with it which was actually great now but he was so raw That footage of that series was so raw.

1:05:43I, like, look. If you look at my eyes, I'm like, I don't know what I'm doing. I couldn't even tell you the day of the week it was. You know, like I was in it. Yes. I'm glad, actually. Why? Because I'm glad I didn't hide it because it's the first time in my life that I never hid how I felt, actually. Look at that. So you stopped deflecting. Yeah. That's why the show was good, I think. Because you were your true, authentic self. Because I couldn't hide it because I didn't know how to. That was the first time I didn't know how to because I was like, whoa, I'm weltering now. I'm like in the deep end and I don't like swimming.

1:06:13Like I'm like in the sea around me. And as I was the sea, it was baby. I couldn't deflect. There was no hiding it. Do you know? Yes. Yes. And then as, you know, Brody grew. Yeah. And your relationship with Tommy grew. Yeah. How did your relationship change at all with Tommy? Oh, it changed. It was hard. I become more confident being a mum he become confident being a dad it was great actually but then we realised quite quickly something was wrong something was going on and we realised we went away Brody was only three months old and we rowed the whole trip bad really bad and I couldn't understand why we weren't getting on and then I realised quite quickly that, hang on a minute, we're really, really good at life.

1:07:10We've always been good at life together but now when you become a parent, you need to be on the same page and you need to think the same when it comes to a child and we've always not really thought the same and we never really knew that because why would you think the same? We're both doing our lives and we live together, we live dinner together, you know, but parenting a human, keeping them alive together and you've kind of got to think, you know, agree the same things we clashed and I didn't understand why and I was like I can't do this I don't this is wrong I don't like it you can't do the relationship can't do the relationship and we come back from Mallorca and we was going to split up generally and it was bad it was really bad because I was like whoa I've got a three month old baby I don't want to be on my own I want this this family unit more than ever I love him but we are not aligning and And I just didn't know why because I was like, why are we not lying?

1:08:05And I'll never forget Brodie would cry and it would trigger Tommy's brain. Like when I'm in brains because I know that now, but it would trigger him and he couldn't deal with crying. And I'd be like, grow up. I remember being annoyed. I'd be like, grow up. So then if Brodie would cry, what would he do? He'd be like, I can't deal with it. I'd walk out and I'd be like, great. You think he's abandoning you? Abandoning me. We're supposed to be a team. We've always been a team. and our whole relationship we've been a team and now you're not being a team with me why and I was annoyed because I was like hang on I need you more than ever you've been the best teammate the whole time what what you're saying you can't deal with crying get over it like that was my attitude I was like which I feel bad about now but at the time I'm being honest I was like I don't get it grow up it's not about you it's about the child um and then when we come back I realized, no, there's more to this.

1:09:00How did you realize? I don't know. I was like, this isn't right. There's something, this isn't about the crying. This isn't about not being my team. There's more to you. What is going on? And I was like, I actually, I was driving. I called him and I said, before we split up, I think you need to get, I think you're going to get diagnosed with ADHD. I think you've got ADHD. He was like, what? I was like, no, no, I think I'm going to get you to see someone and I think you've got it. So you were both at the verge of splitting up. Yeah, he was moving out. He was like, I'm going to move out. And I was like, what?

1:09:37But I actually kind of was going to let him because I was like, I can't deal with the pressure around with you and trying to be a mum because this is hard anyway, really hard. And I just couldn't, I couldn't do it. And I think now knowing more of your story with Tommy, I can't imagine how hard it was in that moment because here you two had come off of a reality TV show with people actively trying to break you up. And you were able to stay together. So that's immense pressure. But then you fast forward and that friction that you had, that was just between the two of you. That alone was causing you to split up.

1:10:17Yeah, and I couldn't understand because we've always been a solid team. Right. Throughout everything. Okay. So I'd put in Google like partner triggered by crying or, and it kept coming up like different things like autism, ADHD, and it kept flagging. Then I started reading it. I'd be like, hmm. So he reacted positively. I couldn't believe the positive reaction. I'll never forget it. And I'd done it driving because I was scared. I was like, I'm just going to do it now. Well, I'm on the phone. It feels safer on the phone, you know, like. I was like, because it's not a nice thing, you know. So I just called him and I was like, I'll never forget it.

1:10:51And I literally remember where I was driving. That's how crazy I literally remember it. And he was like, no, you're right. I'm going to do it. And I was like, wow, okay, that's brave. And he did it. And he had it. Yeah. Look at that. I know. So when you get the results back, are you two together? Yes. What's your and his reaction? I was, I weren't shocked, but I was, I was actually so relieved because I was like, it's not us. It's not you. It's not me. It's this. We can, we can do this. We've worked on loads of things together. We've got through loads of stuff before. We've grew up on telly together.

1:11:28We're fine. Let's work it out. And it was, it was a relief and he was relieved. He was relieved. He was so relieved for himself and take away us for himself. He was like, wow. because I never forget he said to me once, he said, don't you have music playing in your head? And I was like, what? And he's like, is your head not always busy and music and talking? I was like, no. He's like, well, what are you thinking? I was like, no, nothing. He's like, what? I'm like, he's like, Georgia, my brain is da-da-da-da. And I was like, that's exhausting. And I think for once in his life, he was like, wow, my whole life has been answered because he's gone through his whole life like this.

1:12:06Studies suggest less than 20 % of adults with ADHD are aware that they have it. So the vast majority are unaware. Tommy was unaware. A study found that 24 out of 25 spouses of virtually all adults, all adult spouses with ADHD felt their partner's symptoms interfered with their functioning in one or more areas, specifically household chores or organization. Oh. So did you, now when you look back, do you see how the ADHD, his ADHD was showing up in his behavior outside of just the baby crying? Oh, yeah. But I used to think, oh, you're lazy. Oh, your mom's done it for you the whole life. Mommy's boy.

1:12:53You know, and to be honest, I didn't need to deal with the traits because, yes, we lived together, but he'd go to work, I'd go to work, we'd film. It never really affected me. until we had to be on the same page. So that's insightful. Yeah. You know, because it was, there's a higher degree of requirement that you get it right because you have a child. Yeah. You know, so there's a lot more pressure. It matters more. It does. It does. So once you get the diagnosis, you both get it. Yeah. How does it, what do you then change? Or how does that diagnosis change how you two then operate? Because I would imagine you come together stronger.

1:13:31We come together stronger because we was like, okay, let's look into this, like what do we do? And I was actually filming then for our show, which was actually great because what happened was the show become therapy for us because I'll never forget it, our exec producer come round and said, right, we've been offered another series from the success of the other one. Have you been, what's been going on? And I looked at her and I was like, no. She's like, well, I'm like, no, no, we're really bad. actually she's like what they ITV didn't know about it no one knew about it because we weren't filming and actually then they went back to ITV and they said you know Georgia and Tommy actually aren't this happy they've had this baby but they've they've been really bad and they were like okay are they still going through it they were like yeah they were like okay let's film it so we filmed it at the time I was like I don't know if it's a good idea because I didn't know what was going to happen it could have gone either way actually it's the best thing that happened because we had to talk about it we had to talk about everything and it was the best therapy we've ever ever had yes just talking about it right i'm with you georgia it's one of these where i and i think this podcast has helped me to fully understand the weight of this is the harder the conversations are the higher quality of life we have 100 and i can't recommend talking enough and listen i've done it my whole life I've swerved me I've deflected everything and I had to learn very very quick when I become a mum that no no you can't do that you can't do that and I have responsibility as Brody's mum to not do that I have to talk because I need to be the best version for him and myself and I really wanted to make our family unit work you know and talking was the best thing and also me and him them awkward chats together we wouldn't have done you know like we probably would have done them but like swerved them a bit you know because they're awkward and they're uncomfortable very uncomfortable um and we we had no choice it's hard living with someone with ADHD it is hard it's really hard for them but it's also hard for you because our brains don't work the same so everything is learning we're still learning now you know I would say something and or like he would like snap or do something and i'd be like what and vice special or i'd be really slow at him he'd get annoyed with me and our brains don't are not the same um so we are learning to go through life like that now but now we're you want to learn don't you you know yes and we want to make it work and you know and it's and it's worth it and listen the adhd brain is is great unbelievable and people with adhd they think outside the box and they're very successful.

1:16:19But if you don't know about it, you're like, what is this? There you go. Awareness is everything. Awareness is everything, 100%. Just a heads up before we get into this next section. It includes a detailed account of miscarriage. Please take care while watching. So then once the relationship between you and Tommy started to grow stronger, stronger, from what I understand is you two decided, let's give another baby a go. Yeah. Yeah. we got a really really good place work was going great with him I was like thriving in motherhood I was like I think we could have another baby you know and it was kind of like again when should we do it and was like oh no let's just go with it and then it again happened really really quick which blessed went to a scan first scan great lovely yeah having a baby second scan great I'm going to be honest I blocked a lot of this out I've like really so I need to open my brain up a bit.

1:17:18But I had a bleed one night. I'll never forget. I was having a roast dinner. I was cooking one. I was on my feet all day cooking a roast dinner. I love cooking a roast, by the way. I'm really good at potatoes. That's my thing. And I went upstairs and I thought, that's weird. I went to bed, woke up the night and say, because it was a weekend and there's nothing we could have done. It was Sunday. It was like, right, we'll ring. First thing, we'll get an appointment. Called them. there was a private clinic in Loughton that we called called them, they were like yeah come in today we was like okay so I go to scan and she's like no the bleeding everything looks fine, the bleeding's not the problem I'm like what?

1:17:57she's like there's a heartbeat, I'm like oh thank god straight away I'm like relieved she's like go silent I'm like why should I go in silent if there's a heartbeat I'm just looking at this heartbeat I'm like why should I go in silent she's like the sack around the baby is small I'm like so what does that mean I've got a small baby she's like I'm not sure I'm like what do you mean you're not sure she's like I don't know yet I don't want to tell you anything wrong information yet until until you're a bit big like a few more weeks go home I'll see you in a week what does that mean what is that I drove myself mental I didn't sleep I didn't eat.

1:18:40I didn't sleep. I was sick. I was like, that was the worst bit because I didn't understand what was happening. I was like, am I pregnant? Am I not? Yes, I'm pregnant. Is the baby going to survive? One minute I'm happy, then I'm not. Then I'm going to a scan. Then I'm Googling. Then I'm asking friends. And it was the up and down that I drove myself insane. I tortured myself. Everyone around me was like, didn't know what to do. Didn't know what to say. I started getting a bump so quick. I couldn't celebrate this pregnancy. people around me, I was trying to hide it from the public. The public kept writing on my Instagram, she's put on weight.

1:19:13I was getting slated that I was getting big. I was like in, I didn't want to work, I didn't want to go on social, but I had to because it's my job. People coming at me and I just genuinely didn't know what to think because I didn't know what to do. I didn't know. I was carrying this baby and I was like, I just, and I got really big quite quick with this baby. So I didn't go back to her because quite frankly, I was, I blamed her. I was like, no, I don't like you. Bless her. That's terrible to say, but I was fuming. I was fuming with the world. And then we found this doctor, this professional in London.

1:19:50I go to him. I lay there, the dreaded silence. And then he's like, there's a heartbeat. I'm like, oh, there's a heartbeat. There's a heartbeat. It's fine. Then he goes, can you go empty your bladder? I'm like, yeah, go to the bladder. Go empty my bladder. I come back in the room. I looked at Tommy's face. I was like, what? He's like, George, sit down. I'm like, no, no, no, no, what? No, what? What? And he's like, the doctor was like, I'm going to be honest with you. I don't know if this baby's going to survive. And I'm like, no, no, no, no, no. What do you mean? He's like, I think you should go home and we'll talk again in a week.

1:20:29I'm like, I can't, I can't, this is, this is, this torture. He's like, I just, I don't want to say too much now. and, you know, I tell you the wrong information. But I could see her by Tommy's face. I was thinking, I know you all know something, but I'm going to go, okay, I'm going to go home and come back. Why not? You think they had a conversation when you went? I think they had a conversation. Yeah. So I leave, I go home, I come back again, lay on the bed, same conversation. I've tortured myself for a week. There's a heartbeat. I'm like, there's a heartbeat. Go through exactly the same thing.

1:20:59I go to the toilet. I come back. Same thing. Everyone's silent. No one's talking to me. And I'm looking, Tommy, the doctor and the other guy. I'm trying to look at them in the eye to read it. Tommy shook his head to me and I'm like, no, what do you mean? And the doctor's like, this baby's not going to make it. And I remember screaming, going, what are you talking about? The baby's, I've just seen the heartbeat. To me, I'm seeing this baby that's grown. It looks like a baby. It's a baby. So I'm going to this doctor, what are you talking about? and to be honest I don't actually know what he said because I was like it kind of went a bit blurred, a bit blacked out a bit and I was just screaming saying what are you talking about and he's like we need to, this baby's not going to survive you've got two options, I'm like no no and I remember like thinking how do you know, how do you know and he said Georgia I would not say this to you if I didn't if I weren't 100 % sure, he's like you can carry on this pregnancy but you're either going to go you can go full term deliver a baby it could be stillborn which is you've got really high chance of stillborn he's like the other option is you you need termination we need to remove the baby and he's like the way you are the what you've gone through the last 12 weeks because i was going back to all these scandid weeks like you've tortured yourself for weeks on end i personally want to remove this baby from you you you need to get this baby out of you like your mental health is is bad you've got a child at home who also needs looking after and I was like what?

1:22:31I just I think went black around me to be honest. I just didn't even know what to think. No. No. How do you, what's the conversation between you and Tommy? There was no conversation. I just screamed the whole way home. Screamed the whole way home and they said they're going to call you to get a date in to remove this child. And I was like it goes against everything that I've ever believed in because they're basically telling me I've got to take, kill the bag, terminate the baby because the baby's alive. Right. So they're telling me I've got to do, I've got to say yes to that. You know, I'm like, no.

1:23:07But at the same time, I can't go through having a stillborn. Either way, I didn't want to make either decision, you know. And the doctor rang me himself and he said, Georgia, I'm making a decision for you. This is best for you, your other child, your family. we are removing, we have to remove this baby you could be pregnant for another six months, you don't know and who knew, he said there is no I was going please just tell me, I was like how do you know is there even like a year of this baby because I would have took the year I would have I think if they said to me that baby could have lived for even a year I would have took it but now I know, still born I couldn't have done that to Brodie, I couldn't have done that to anyone around I couldn't have done that to myself I couldn't have done that So I said, okay, and they got me in the next day.

1:23:58They were that concerned. That decision, one is I've never heard of a parent having to make that particular decision before. That's a heartbreaking decision. I did some research and when I look at the, well, one is in terms of what it is, So triploidy is a rare genetic condition that causes the developing fetus to have 69 chromosomes. So that's instead of the regular 46. And it happens randomly. Yep. Right? And it's not caused by parents' genes at all. And sometimes it happens when two sperm have hit the same egg. That's it. Yeah. So this is something that's a rare occurrence. So rare. occurrence it affects one to three percent of pregnancies worldwide uh and what's interesting too is 66 percent of triploidy cases affect male fetuses really yes wow yeah so that evening the doctor has really made the decision for you yeah uh and it's for you literally it's for your health i think he was concerned but yes i think he was very concerned about me i mean i was in a different zone to be honest i was like because i was thinking and i know this is bad but like i was praying that there was no heartbeat because then i didn't have to make that decision because although that would have been traumatic seeing no heartbeat it would have been done for me because there was no survival rate but i still had to say i still had to sign the paperwork to say yes which goes against everything that i believe in because the baby's a blessing yes So imagine the torture I put myself around.

1:25:48I was like, I'm technically taking this baby out of me. Yeah, I can't imagine. It was just awful, to be honest. The whole thing was awful. You know, I know that your advice on this is don't be afraid to tell people you're pregnant before the 12-week scan because, you know, you needed the support when you'd lost your baby. Yeah. So when you reflect back, you had not told people. I told my family and my closest friends. Your closest friends. Hadn't told the public. Okay. Hadn't announced it. Thank God I had told people, my friends and family, because if I hadn't, imagine doing that alone. How did you and Tommy heal from that miscarriage?

1:26:35I think I healed by crying a lot. He didn't cry as much as me. I think he did it more. He threw himself into work. But I'm going to be honest, what come after that was really bad. My obsession with wanting a baby. And it wasn't happening. And that was probably just as bad, the torture again of trying it not happening. Because it happened quick. It happened first time, both times. That pressure for our relationship was really, really bad. Because he was like, you are torturing yourself. And I was like, I need... I didn't want to replace the baby. You never can replace a soul. But I was like, I just needed that back.

1:27:20I didn't even want to lose my bump. I was that into it. It was bad. Oh, wow. Yeah, I didn't want to lose the bump. I was eating like I was still pregnant. So you're a public figure. So you also have to deal with disclosing this to the public. And I did really quick. Okay. I announced what had happened really, really quick because I just needed to do it. I was like, I just need to say it and then stop hiding because people writing on my pictures, the whole pregnancy, like, I think she's pregnant. I think she's pregnant. And it's so wild that people think that they can do that. It's actually beyond me because I would never in a million years ask a woman if they're pregnant.

1:28:03Even before this happened to me, I wouldn't do it, but we need to stop doing that. Yeah, not speculate. Yeah, we had Perry Edwards on and she said the same thing. it's like the speculation is just horrible. There was, and it's, you know, like the algorithm. My whole thing was pregnant, pregnant, pregnant, pregnant. Everywhere I was, people were telling me they were pregnant and like my friends were pregnant and it was a lot. And I had loads of people say to me, well, you know, you've got one child. You've got one, you should be grateful. And I'm thinking, hang on a minute. I know how good having one baby is.

1:28:35That does not give, like, that doesn't mean that I can't want another baby. just because you have one baby doesn't mean you you don't deserve another like how dare you like and i was just like i just took on the world to be honest i was around with it i would have out of anyone at that point i was so in it i i didn't want to work i didn't want to i didn't do anything i was like so all i wanted was baby but but as you and tommy continued to try you were unsuccessful yeah at getting pregnant yeah so at what point do you think all right we need help he said it's me i think we was trying and trying and you know trying for a baby is not fun at all it got to a point where it's very like one plus one is two yes yeah you know just just a second on that for someone who's been there yeah right for an extended period of time yeah is we often hear couples talk about trying for a baby yeah but those that are not say oh yeah that's fun but it's not always fun.

1:29:41No. It's a job and you're getting it done. Exactly. It's a transaction. Transaction. It's a transaction and when you get really, really serious about it is that you're looking at the time, you're looking at, there's a lot that goes into it. But for you, what made it challenging? I had every single ovulation stick going. I drove myself mad and I would be like I'm ovulating and he didn't understand it because why would he understand it because I was obsessed he weren't obsessed and also I was annoyed at my body because I was like why are you letting me down why are you doing this to me I was just I was like it was this circle of like and it was just it was never going to be there was no good outcome come out of this I'm going to be honest I was like unhappy depressed I was eating.

1:30:35I was like, I was like there. I mean, I never stopped being a great mum to Brody because he's my first priority. But apart from him, I was like, didn't care about anything else. I was like, don't want to go out, weren't seeing anyone. I was like, I'd put on so much weight and I got into the biggest rut. I was like eating because I wanted the baby bump, which is actually mentally disturbing, actually. I drove Tommy so mad because I'd be like, you can't go out and do things because I'm ovulating. that day you can't go around that work trip I'm already letting and it like took over our life would you say that was the lowest point of your relationship with Tommy that was bad he says like it ruined us he's like you was obsessed and I know I was I couldn't help it and I actually didn't like myself I really didn't like myself at the time but I couldn't help it I really couldn't then nothing could have snapped me out of that nothing but so he suggested that you what help did he suggest so i was writing so i was writing a book at the time weirdly which actually again was therapy i don't know why this keeps happening to me what is things happen when i need it which is good and i was never forget i was in london doing the audio for the book and i come on period and i was really hopeful this month like you are every month because i was a bit late and i text him just come on my period he texts back no he rang me he said i'm booking i'm booking out of here and he was like i booked it we're going i was like what he's like we're going tomorrow and well thank god for that look at that look at that so first cycle yeah successful thank god for you yes right so lucky which is a blessing such a blessing which is a blessing yeah And then we have Gigi.

1:32:21Yeah. Yes. Now, Gigi is, you've referred to Gigi as your rainbow baby. Yeah. Mylene Klass was the first person that I'd ever heard talk about a rainbow baby. I'd never heard the concept. It is a beautiful concept. So lovely. So how do you, how would you describe a rainbow baby? She's just this, this like, this perfect, this ray of sunshine. and she is just everything that I was supposed to have. Yes, yes. She's just magical in different ways. And then also have you looked into how your second child, how a lot of that even genetic makeup now has gone through you onto Gigi? Yes. And Marlene Kass actually, she, I think it was with you actually, said about the baby DNA lives in you yes forever and that actually gives me a bit of reassurance well I tell you what on the you say you're 10 months in right when you think about the reaction but also this term that I've talked to a lot of my guests about a lot of the moms around the quote-unquote bounce back what's your position on that because uh well I don't even want to put words in your mouth what's your position on moms on the snap back the bounce back that whole adage of get your body back to where it was as soon as possible so i hate the i hate that phrase snap back bounce back and it was a massive trigger for me when i had brodie i was in such a deep dark place that i was going on instagram and i was seeing these moms that just had their like six packs out and they just had their life together and I was in such a such a dark place that I it was more internal that I was like why are you so happy why do you look like your life's all good when I'm like in my pajamas my belly was like swollen I was injecting myself every day because I was on if you have a c-section you have to have blood thinners I was a bruise and I was like how is that genetically possible to have a six pack I think it should be you train when you want to train you do it for when you want to do it and to be honest it's the best thing I've done for my mental health this time around and it's that hour out of the day that I I solely rely on um if I didn't have a wedding would I have gone gym quicker like would I have gone gym no definitely not because I don't think it should be about that to this day I think you should have a baby and it should be about surviving their months just making sure that you're up and showered is is enough and having that baby alive is enough.

1:35:06It shouldn't be about having the pressure to be back in your genes, to be honest. It shouldn't be about that. But if you want to do that, you do that for yourself. Make sure it's for yourself, not for anyone else. And I'm so strong on that now because I'd done it this time for myself, not because someone told me I had to bounce back because that's a ridiculous saying. I did it because I had a wedding that I wanted to go to that was my own and a hen do that I wanted to feel good at. and I thought, you know what? This is more about what I look like. I'm so determined to get my life back because I'd lost myself.

1:35:39So that, this time, is being more about getting myself back rather than just my body. And the body's just come with it. Getting yourself back mentally. And I'm such a different person now. I'm so content. Yeah, yeah. You know, when you think about getting back to a place where you feel good about you, right? So many of us disproportionately place body image in that category yeah so what is your relationship been with body image over the years i i feel like i grew up on telly so my whole 20s i have always had to be in a bikini filming which actually was a lot of pressure i didn't realize it so when i i had gg and i had the wedding naturally the pressure was easy because i was like wait hang on it's like it went back to like the tower days and I was like, I know how to do this.

1:36:35Yes. I'm actually good under pressure because I've always done it. And I achieved it. And people was like, you just had a baby. There's no way you're going to be able to, to get back to yourself, you know, with this wedding. And I was like, it would, I didn't actually know what I was going to achieve looking wise. I just knew I wanted to feel good. I just wanted to feel so confident at my hendu and my wedding. And actually, when I realized speaking to people after, I'm like, I've always done that. Right. You've already. Yes. Since you're since the beginning of TOWIE. But even when you think about that and, you know, one is thanks for being honest about that, because the guys do that as well.

1:37:13You know, I see it all the time on, you know, friends of mine that are on TV or shows that I've done where they know there's that one beach scene that they need to do or that one pool scene that they need to do. And they're literally working out up to the minute before the scene. Oh, but doing synopsis in the morning. They're on the side doing push-ups. Yeah. They're on the side right before. So this is what people on television do. Yeah. Now, what about body enhancements, surgeries, et cetera? Because that's a major part, I think, of the career of a lot of people on television. Yeah. Right? So did you feel pressure early on?

1:37:56Yeah. You did? Yeah. Okay. I had my boobs done before I even went on TOWIE. I had my boobs done when I was, the other year I was going on TOWIE, I was like 19 or 20. Did you have them done in particular thinking of TOWIE? No. No, no, you just? Just knew I wanted them done. And that was probably from everyone in ASIC was doing that. So I was like, oh, I'm doing it. and I always had big boobs my Greek nan's got big boobs it's like my Irish lot of good good I just the shape I just never liked the shape I was never confident about the shape I was quiet they were slightly different and you know when you're young you're like they have to be the same you know this is how I used to think of course you do um and I knew I was getting my boobs done and I got them done really really young okay and what's your positioning on that now because surgery uh and enhancements are at an all-time high across the board so what's your your positioning now so now i'm actually redoing my boobs um so since then so they're up they're now 14 years old um and i found a lump in my boob in the summer literally three days later i saw this doctor he felt he was like i know what you mean scanned me straight away he was like okay the lump is nothing to worry about I was like oh my god thank god there's I'm gonna scan the other one as you scan the other one he's like that can you see that I was like what's that he's like that implant's ruptured I'm like what he's like they're not supposed to be like that I was like oh okay he's like you need to get them out he was like they're not going into lymph nodes he was like which is obviously good but that's not saying that they won't implants can leak I was like okay he's like you need to get them out when you get home I'm like okay fast forward I've been recommended a surgeon in London went to see him really lovely guy he was like how are you not in pain I said what is that are you not in agony I'm like yeah I said I've had a bit of pain I said but I've had I'm going to be honest I was like I've been busy I've had a baby I've had an IVF I've got married I've had that a lot's happened in my last two years of life I was like I've just ignored them he's like you can't do that he's like you need to get them out so I'm now getting them out I think the problem nowadays with implants is they disguise things you need if you're going to have implants I feel like listen surgery is up to everyone I think if it's going to make you feel good about yourself why not do it if it's safe and you've got great like you're going to a great doctor that you really recommend why should anyone tell you You shouldn't do it.

1:40:38It's your life, right? But please, anyone out there that's getting boobs or doing boobs, just feel them more. Touch them because, unfortunately, implants, you know, it could be the implant, it could be a lump. Just get them checked. And unfortunately, if you have got an implant, you need to get that scan. Because unless you're getting a scan, you can't tell. I would have never known that they're ruptured. I'd have never known they're broken. So thank God I did do that. Yes, and you think about how important this message is because of how life-threatening, right? Right. This is so bad. So when you think about how dangerous even the position that you're in.

1:41:14Yeah. Because you said that the doctor doesn't know. No. What's what's what's what's happening. Many doctors don't want to do this procedure. How dangerous is it? Yeah. Well, you know, if it gets into blood, that's bad. I'm praying that, you know, they might never, but they could. So I can't take that risk. Yes. And I don't ideally want to get surgery now. No, I've got a baby. be it's going to be awful i can't lift her for two weeks that is not great at all i can't even lift out the cot but if i don't do it now when am i going to do it well good that you're you're going in for surgery i know yes i know another thing to do i'm like i just want a break i've been so busy no you know i think life has said to you no break so what is next i just want to do so much i'm so content in my in my home life i've got two healthy unbelievable children and oh my god it's hard it's so hard by the way gg was up all night it is very hard but i wouldn't change it you know baby loss and things like you never get over i don't think but you learn to live with it and you and you like appreciate things more and now i'm like i am so ready to just to be present so present i just want to be present i want to i know i can do more and i feel like i give I've just focused my life on having babies and for my family for the last couple of years and now I'm ready to do things myself as well and I don't even think feel bad saying that because I I'm I definitely am a better mum when I have a bit of time for myself like taking that time to train for me now is unbelievable I go back even if it's just a pilates class and I leave there and I'm like full of energy back with Gigi and I pick up and I've just got a spring in my step and I'm like that is not selfish that is healthy and I think it's you know mums don't get enough credit like we can't do it all the time it's hard work and we do do it or we try and we just need a minute just just give us a bit of minute and if that's like even having a hot shower or going to the toilet about a child going mom you know them them little things are important just having a girl like last night me and some of the school mums went for an Indian on the high street and it was like unbelievable i just needed that girl chat i just needed that minute yes to just have my time just be me just be georgia and it's so healthy and i've really really learned that i need to have them they're not even selfish they're then i need them yes i need them and i've learned that i feel comfortable saying that now but i deserve them you do you do yeah one thing that i find very intriguing about you is that so you're part of a hit not just one but two hit television shows yeah which a lot of people i think don't give enough credit to the talent on those shows like what makes those shows pop production is important all that but the talent yeah and for someone to want to tune in to see you night after night or week after week there's something there's some x factor right yeah but then you went you duplicated it with your book because you have a best-selling book i know i can't believe i'm all for congratulations congratulations but to achieve that that's also there's significant interest you have a very strong social media following very high engagement people are interested yeah tuning in to you yeah and it wasn't until this conversation that i really got it yeah i think it's because you are truly so authentic you're very forthcoming and you're unapologetic in your truth.

1:44:49So then last question for you, everyone gets this. When you think back to all the incredible conversations you've had throughout your life, which one stands out to you as the most memorable? So who was it with and what did you learn? That's a really good question actually. I think, you know, maybe with my parents, maybe with my parents telling me because they're always they was always actually my biggest believers and you always think it's my parents are going to say that but they always said you're so good at people and you're so, just be yourself and actually like why didn't I listen? I should have just listened I don't know why I just gave myself so much you know, I just had so much self-doubt but I shouldn't have done that I should have just listened to them when they said that to me.

1:45:44I mean, I've learned it now. It's took a long time. Yeah, yeah. Your mom is always right. I'll tell you what. I feel like 99.9 % of the time, you know, they're right. We just don't want to listen. No, they're just, yeah. Yeah. You know, my mother-in-law, Dr. Jean Cobbs, I love her. During when we had our second child, people were asking, Well, how long are you going to keep them in diapers? Or here's nappies, right? How long are you going to keep them in nappies? And it started to get to me, and she saw that it got to me, and she said, look, how many 10-, 15-year-old, 18-year-olds do you see walking around here with diapers?

1:46:26I said, none. She said, there you go. I know. She said, you know, you're on your own timescale. Your own journey. Your own journey, absolutely. And do you know what's really funny, Zach, because when you have a baby, everyone says to you, are you going to breastfeed? Are you breastfeed? Do you want breastfeed? With Brody I had it a lot and I was like, no. And I always said no just because I didn't want to. And I can openly say that out loud now and I don't feel bad about it because at the end of the day it's my body, my baby, my journey and it's up to me. However I think suitable for my family, I'm going to do it.

1:47:03And what's best for me and my little family and the bottle is best for me. And my best friend's breastfed. That's best for them. And back then, the pressure, I would never say that aloud, but now I fully will. Because I think, it's your baby, your body. You know best. And I remember thinking, I said to someone, hang on a minute. When we're in our 30s and there's 20 of us in the room, how are you going to tell me who's been breastfed and who's been butthfed? And who cares? We're all alive. As long as you're keeping that baby alive, it doesn't matter. You just trust yourself. and I now, I'm so strong about it because I'm like, no, it's my decision.

1:47:40It's my baby and it's my body and it's my rules. Yeah. That's how you said, I'm so strong about that now. Yeah. That to me is the story of your life. Yeah, it is, isn't it? Is that you were someone as a little girl who liked to talk. Yeah. But you could argue you truly didn't have a voice. No. Even through TOWIE early on, you liked to talk, but you deflected, right? Yes. But through these life experiences, especially as of late, the last few years, you could see that you found your voice. Yeah. And now not only do you talk, but you talk with your voice. Oh, my voice. Yes. And I think that's beautiful.

1:48:15It is actually, isn't it? Yeah. There's a lot of self-belief now. Yes. Just a bit more confident. Self-belief. There's courage. Yeah. Right. You have it all. Yeah. Yeah. It's been a journey. It has been. It has been. This has been lovely. Georgia, thank you so much. Thank you. I've learned so much about you. I feel like I've learned about myself. I feel like I've really learned about myself. Do you know, because when you map it out, you're like, oh, actually, I've done a good job, you know. Yes. Yeah. And you have. Oh, boy. Georgia. Sweet Georgia. You know, I have to say this about Georgia. Georgia truly has the X factor.

1:48:56and that's the reason why she was able to help make Towie what it was. She's able to express herself in a way that truly makes you want to express yourself. You know, she talked about being the agony aunt and she was one of the first guests that we've had where I almost wanted to open up, to share with her, get her opinion. What do you think about this, Georgia? She's someone who you just want to have in your corner. And she appears to be an incredible shoulder to lean on. Her level of emotive description was very powerful. And you could see that journey of it really began with postnatal depression after having Brody.

1:49:53But I will say from having gone through a miscarriage with Jill that I cannot fathom the decision that Georgia had to make. That will change anyone. And it's not only changed her, but you can argue, and she said it, is that she's now become better as a result. Georgia said it. if Tommy had not said something, she doesn't know what would have happened because it was one of the darkest places she's ever been. You know, I think that this podcast is demonstrating that hard conversations change lives. And that's what Tommy did. And thank goodness, right, that he did that.

1:50:48you