Tom Read Wilson Finally Tells His Story: “It Was A Constant Barrage Of Verbal Abuse”

31:42I seemed always to be in hats. Because I played the Mad Hatter. And then I did a national tour of the cat in the hat, which I loved. Okay. The first show I did after the Royal Academy of Music was a new musical version of Sleeping Beauty. And I was essentially Maleficent, but I was called Fierina in the play. And I always did a word of the day with the company, which is why I ended up doing it. That's the beginning of word of the day. That was the beginning. I always did it, every time I was in a theater company. Okay. and my prince, who's a friend to this day, a very naughty boy called Matt Knowlton, he's one of the naughtiest people I've ever met, much naughtier than me, believe it or not.

32:33No, impossible. And much smuttier than me. And in those days, I was still really quite green, especially where smutty vocab was concerned, again, believe it or not, but it is true. And he thought that he would match my word of the day with the lexicon of smut. Oh, interesting. And on opening night, he taught me the word bukkake. You know, I've only, as an adult, I learned, I mean, like, when I say as an adult, like, within the last maybe eight years, I've heard about this word. It suddenly reached you. Yeah, it's new. Yes. For me. Yes, yes. Well, it was very new to me then. And actually, I've subsequently investigated it.

33:24And it's not... It sounds awful. You did. Did you enjoy that? I loved it. I've investigated the etymology. Okay. And it's very innocuous because it comes from the Japanese verb bukkakaru, meaning to splash. And they have a dish in Japan called bukkake that is a noodle dish where the noodles are liberally splashed by sauce. So it's very unfortunate for the word that it got marooned in porn here. So how does something like that happen? How is a... Bukkake. Well, it's timing, really. I think it's all timing. How is a word like that hijacked? Because I feel like... Yes, it's awful, isn't it? It is, because you're talking about a dish.

34:12It's probably a pleasant noodle dish. Yes, because actually it could have been marooned in meteorology. We could say, gosh, that's bukkake. Exactly. Look at that. Coming from the skies. But how are words, they're hijacked? I don't know. No, maybe it became a porn category in the East and then it jumped to the West. I don't know. Okay. So then how do all of these jobs, these odd jobs, if you will, but they're not odd because you're building your resume, you're building your chops. How do you go from there to The Voice? Oh. Oh, well, I suppose in a roundabout way, it was because of those jobs, because I was doing at the Theatre Royal Windsor, which I love, an adorable kind of cuckoo clock of a theatre.

35:03It's just enchanting. I was doing a play called Sweet Revenge. I was getting these sort of pleasant supporting roles. and I thought I need to do something bold because I'm nearly 30 and I need to, I really need to think of something. And so I secretly, I don't know what made me think of it, but I secretly auditioned for The Voice. And it is all very clandestine until you get on the show. You know, none of the auditions are filmed. It's all very secret. And they were so lovely to me. I mean, it was the best first exposure to telly I think one could possibly have because you were handled with kid gloves and so well looked after.

35:55And you were ascribed a vocal coach that befit your style. Interesting. And given a beautiful original arrangement. But you had to audition prior to that piece, right? So even that process was your idea, I need to do this because I need to move my career to another level. Well, when I did it, I think it was around the time that some of my theater heroes had done it, people like Carrie Ellis. And it really helped with her theater career. Okay. So that was my thought, and that's why it was that show, because that show seemed to me that it wasn't about getting a number one or anything like that, which I never could have done.

36:48You know, not that style of singing at all. So do you know, I went back. Yes. And I watched this clip, and I watched it with Jill and the voice. Oh, no. Did you? It's not very good. No, no, no, no, no. So first, let me just set the stage for The Voice because I didn't realize The Voice was, at this time, this is one of the biggest reality shows in the UK. Gosh, I didn't know that. I remember them saying to me on the day, they said, oh, you know, because you flopped. I mean, they didn't say that. But because you didn't get a turn, if you're lucky, we'll play a bit of your song, you know. And what they actually did was they played about seven minutes of, you know, my backstory and my interview and my song and my exchange with the judges.

37:59and it was a direct consequence of that that Celebs Go Dating came along because Frankie Nicol, who you probably remember, lovely Frankie, watched it and said, oh, we want somebody that's sort of jolly hockey sticks to serve as the welcoming committee. They didn't really know quite how it would work but she thought, oh, well, that would fit because he's, you know, quite sunny. Sunny, yes. So can we go back to the voice? Yes, yes, we love it. So you were on stage. Yes. And do you remember what song you were singing? Yes, it was the oldest song of the series. It was written in 1947, and it's called Accentuate the Positive.

38:52And I love that lyric is... Two of my favorite songs I love for the same reason, because they sort of describe my outlook. Cock-Eyed Optimist and Accentuate the Positive. It was a perfectly placed song. Yes. I love that song. And I thought it was a beautiful performance. And so I watched The Judges. Yes. And The Judges seemed to be... Have you re-watched a clip of this? No. You've never watched this? Well, I did. I watched it when it came out. The judges appear to be, I mean, they're bobbing their heads. They're snapping. Boy George was going back and forth. He was doing this. I'm thinking they're all going to turn around.

39:42Oh, did you? I thought they would all turn around. Yeah. The judges then, unfortunately or fortunately, because of how your career then goes on. Yes. They did not turn around. No. However, when they do turn around, do you remember what they said? I remember what Will.i.am said. I think he said, which has happened to me many times, in fact, I have to have a note on my bank that I put in place with the manager because I kept not getting past the fraud team saying, has the voice of an octogenarian lady. And I think he more or less said that. He sure did. and to, because sometimes I have to act as a translator and interpreter for you, you're saying the voice of an 80-year-old woman.

40:30Yes. For everybody at home. I mean, I've had Angela Lansbury on the radio. I've had Fenella Fielding. I've had Anna Blackman. Yes. Who actually, when I had them, I think were all non-agenarian ladies. So 80 is quite young for me. But this is what he literally, he turns around. Yeah, he says, and he says, are you, I think the first, one of the first things he said is, are you serious? Did he? He's like, are you for real? Is this serious? And I noticed that was the common question. But this. You poor thing, you have it every day. I get this question all of the time. All of the time. I remember when I, when you were on I'm a Celebrity.

41:15Yes. I went on to this morning, and I also did the after show for All My Celebrity, in support of you. Yes. The first question was, is he for real? Is this him? Is this his voice? Is he acting? Yes. How do you feel knowing that this is typically the number one question about you? Again, go back to that word eccentric. I delight in being Ek Kentron out of the center. Yes. And I don't mind if I'm a moon sort of orbiting the planet in a way. I don't mind that at all. The only slight downfall, if I'm really pinning my colors to the mast, and because it's you I will, is that it's not an aphrodisiac.

42:09That's the only thing. It's like, I think that in lots of ways it's a help because it sort of contributes to one's silhouette. But it's not romantically because it's very, I don't know, people don't want Angela Lansbury's voice coming out, you know, in a steamy setting. I mean, I mean, however far, but I will say this is that I truly, I'm not just saying this to say it, is that this is where I disagree with you. Yeah. Now, I know there's lived experience. Yes, yes, yes. But I believe that because we are all individuals, we are all extraordinary, that there will be and there is a group of people who will just devour that.

43:16Well, that is true. I do agree with you. It's like I think I haven't got Lake Ontario. I've got a little puddle. But the puddle are key. Yes. It's just that, you know, it's quite hard sometimes to locate the puddle. Yes, that's true. That's the only difficulty. That's true. You helped me, of course, once, darling, and you discovered how puddly the puddle is. Oh, my gosh. Can I talk about that? Yes, please do. Yes. I mean, I'm not embarrassed because I know, you know, I know from life. So I think it was, I went to Instagram once, right? Yes, you did. You were like, you were incredulous about my lack of good fortune in that department.

43:58So I thought I'll throw up. I said, I'm going to find a partner for Tom. Yeah. I was like, you know, I think we were having so much conversation. Oh, this is easy. Yes. This is nothing. Yes. Just, I'll go on Instagram. So I go on Instagram and I'm trying to remember what I posted because I know I didn't disclose who you were. I don't believe. Or did I? I can't. I remember. I think it was a bit nebulous. Yes. But I essentially was doing online matchmaking for you. You were? We had an incoming number. We had a group come in. Four. I don't mind, darling. This is an honest space. That number is indelibly seared on my mental retina.

44:48Four. We had four come in. However, you know, once again, it's the pool. I didn't have Lake Ontario. And there was one in particular that I think we had discussed that I thought was acceptable. Oh, right. I don't remember this. I thought he was a little old, though. Oh, right. I think he was a little old. Right. For you, right? Because you're very youthful, right? But what I realized in that process was that I was also ultra protective. So I was saying, no, won't work. Nope, it's not going to happen. Nope. Yes. I don't like. And that's when I realized that I would not be a help for you, which is also why when Jill and I had our matchmaking agency.

45:38Yes. We had a strict no friends, no family policy. Yes. Yes. Yes. We have to talk about celebs. Oh, we do, really. We have to talk about celebs because it was the voice that got you to celebs. Yes. And you said they were looking for you. Well. I think this was beautiful. Well, I don't think they knew really what they were looking for. Okay. But they knew that they were going to have agents that needed to sort of be strict occasionally. Yes. And needed to sort of know their stuff. So then as a juxtaposition, they wanted somebody that was never strict and didn't know anything. And that was me. And then I was very worried about it because I thought, you know, perhaps it would be sort of produced.

46:41Yes. And I went in to talk, and I just had to talk. I had to talk to the man that created it, who was just sitting off camera. And I just chatted to him for about an hour about all kinds of things. And then that was it. So then, Tom, what year was that that you started, Celebs Go Dating? 2016, I think. 2016. Yeah, I think so. Ten years. Ten years. And I know there's been over 300 episodes, I believe. Yes, I think yes. And then some. Yeah, then some. Because it's interesting. I remember celebrating 100 episodes with you. Yes, and that was shortly after you arrived. And you must have amassed nearly 300 yourself.

47:29You're right. I think I've done over 300. Yes. So then that year, so 2016, and Celebs Go Dating, the premise is in essence there's an agency. Yes. Celebrities are matched with quote-unquote civilians in the public. Yes, that's right. It's narrated by the fabulous Rob Beckett. Oh, my God. I met him at the first rap party, and I said, I've got to see you on stage. And then I followed him around going to his live shows because, I mean, I find him side-splittingly funny. Yes, yes. It's the intersection of, like, left field wit with observational comedy and the whole cocktail. It's interesting because I think the show is very, very good and he takes something that's very, very good and just makes it extraordinary.

48:29He's quite incredible. Yes. Do you have a celeb or multiple celebrities who've stood out to you? And why? Over the years? Oh, I loved, I absolutely adored Ulrika. Yes. Beautiful. I loved her because she so longed to surrender to a romance. and yet she in lots of ways we were sort of similar in that we'd sort of very happy with where we'd arrived yes and yet she had this beautiful way of sort of saying but I'm going to go on these adventures and that's really what she made the dates were kind of little adventures and be so open and really invite whatever comes my way very warmly. Yes. And I just loved that.

49:39I loved that. And I thought she was witty and erudite and lovely. Also very kind. Very kind. I remember she baked bread. She baked us bread. And she brought it in. Yeah, just so off camera. Off camera. Just incredible. Yeah, yeah. and oh and I loved I mean ones that come back of course you get to know them much better yes which is heaven especially for me because I have comparatively short scenes with them so then I kind of clock up more time if they come back so Sam of course yes I got to know him very well And And we Met outside several times You know he lived Locally And But you know I have to say I've never disliked Anyone I've always I've always been very drawn to the characters However divergent they Ah, that's been one of the loveliest parts, really.

50:58Yeah, I think that's super. Can I show you a photo? Oh, yes. All right, close your eyes. Close your eyes. Oh. All right. Oh. I want you to tell me what is happening in this photo and who are you with? Oh, this was just before your time, wasn't it? Yes, I think that's probably 2017. Oh, heavens. This was on the plane, either going to or coming back from Cap Verde. Okay. And it's Gemma Collins. Absolutely. You guys are knocked out. But this is like, this happened in phases because in the end, I think she was asleep on me. I think this was the beginning. So now I come into the picture of Celebs Go Dating in 2018.

51:59I'm going to hold on to that one. Oh, darling. Now we meet in 2018. Yes. And, you know, for me, it's 2018. I'm living in the United States. I'm given an opportunity to participate in a reality television show in a place that I'm unfamiliar with, a format I'm unfamiliar with, with a group of people I'm unfamiliar with. I've brought my family with me. Yes. But there still is a lot of stress and anxiety, if you will, around this. It was also a unique circumstance that I was being brought into. Yeah. And so to meet, you know, this person that I'll be working with and to immediately feel safe was very, very important for me, you know, for me participating.

52:59Yeah. And then that feeling of safety, you being the safety blanket for me just continued. You know, and it's one of these where I truly, I attribute my time with you. I attribute, I put Anna, you know, our colleague Anna in this is that. It was through the two of you that I fell in love with the UK. And in particular, our first year together. Yes. It was magical. It was. And I was introduced to British culture through your eyes. And I think that I'm so privileged to have had that opportunity. So many people say, oh, gosh, I wish, I want Tom in my life, right? And I say, well, you know what? I've got him in my life.

53:54And on top of that, like this would be bragging, not only is he in my life, but I was introduced to the UK through you. And that is so – like I can't even describe it to the point where so many people will say, really? You're making the UK your home? Really? You want a beer? And my response, absolutely. Do you know how incredible it is? You know, you think about whether it was just us and Liverpool. Yes. Yes. And our time in Liverpool. We're filming Liverpool, but just spending that time. I thought we had day dates. We did. We did. And, you know, and I feel so sorry for you, darling, because I.

54:37Very often when we're out, I pretend we're a couple. But the thing is, I'm getting the top layer of that cake is that. It's a nice fantasy. but but the bottom layer of that cake is that this is one of the great romances of my life and it's platonic but it's but i fell in love with you then and i think that's maybe why i thought initially to have a crush and i think i did have a crush for a while but um but I think maybe the reason that it had a little sequel was that all of these things were conflated in my mind because I was like I'm I love him you know I'm sort of in love with him but uh I no longer want to you know consummate it and and I I'm also in love with his family and um and so i knew that i was like oh this is just a love affair and i and actually everything shifted for me in the last 18 months to two years because i um i am sort of rubbing along so happily as as a single person and i'm so happy with my lot and i think because i always had a um a romantic soul and I think I do in terms of art and in terms of my sensibility yes I think that I always thought that the thing that was missing from my life was a gentleman and now I don't if it tumbled into my life I'd be happy as a clam but I don't seek it but you don't seek it No.

56:42I'd like to know that feeling at some stage. You know, I found my person. That would be nice. And to be in a kind of real romantic haze where it kind of put on your occhiali rosa and everything was slightly better for doing it with the person. Do you feel like, you don't have to answer this at all. Yeah. Have you ever had that feeling? No, I don't think so. Not really. Not really. I got near to it with one person. But...

57:33But no, I haven't had it yet. Okay. It's coming. It's coming. It's coming. It's coming. I mean, this is why I do think it's very naughty when, you know, when I'm out and about with you and I'll say, you know, I pretend you're my spouse and things. Well, I mean, connecting this even to celebs is that you have made me officially naughty. You know, I am, my level of naughtiness has now just, even the boys have noticed it. They're like, Dad, what happened to you? I'm purer than the driven sludge.

58:14Absolutely not. And everyone knows you knows that is the biggest lie in the world. To the point where, when we're filming, in particular, I've noticed it with celebs go dating, is that I feel as if we can just empty our souls to each other. Empty our souls. Empty our souls, you know. Empty our souls. You know what? It's time for you to leave already. What time is it? Hold on. It's time for you to leave. But, you know, it's so... Also, can I say this on this? is that this kind of banter is my biggest gripe with celebs go dating. Can I talk about my biggest gripe? Yeah, I do. My biggest gripe is that, so once I got to the show, Yes.

59:09Anna comes in the following year, Anna Williamson, who we love. Yes. Dr. Tara comes in. Yes. A few years later. Yes. We have a scene in the morning called Morning at the Agency. We do. Right? where you are in the agency doing something. Yes. We all walk in. The three of us walk in. Yes. And collectively, it's improv. It is really, isn't it? Yes. It's improv. And we improv a scene together. Yes. Those scenes are my favorite scenes of celebs go dating. Mine too. Do they ever make it in the edit? No. No. No. No. They never make it in the edit. We've done some incredible things. What has been your favorite?

59:58My second favorite scenes, I have to just bring up because they're your least favorite scenes. Oh, my gosh. Okay. What we call master interviews. And I'm ashamed of myself for loving them so much because they're very masturbatory. Because you sit in a room and you're down the barrel of, you know, they whip out the cannon. in a non-naughty way. Yes. And you go down the barrel and you say whatever pops into your head, and I just love it. As a sort of make the grey cells dance. Yes. And the synapses snap exercise. I love it. Yeah, you do. I don't know why, but you do. You loathe it, don't you? I despise it.

1:00:44You despise it.

1:00:49Hey there. We have conversations just like this one every week. So if you haven't already, hit follow and the bell icon, and I'll see you for the next one. Had you always wanted to go on I'm a Celebrity? Truthfully, and Ant and Deke used to tease me mercilessly about this, I hadn't really seen it. But I am an adventurer by nature. I've never been very good at sport. You're going to think I'm joking now, but my ball skills aren't very good. But I do love climbing a tree or swimming in an alpine lake or going on a hike or a ramble. that all of that outdoorsy stuff I love. And so when it came up, I thought, and this is a real life mantra for me, if there's no reason to say no except that you're frightened of things, you must do it.

1:01:58And I was frightened about things that I hadn't great knowledge of. Like I don't know if I'll be frightened of creepy crawlies and rodents and things like that. But I was more worried about tossing in my cot and things like that because I'm always scared about not sleeping. Oh, interesting. So you were more scared of not sleeping. Much more scared. Than anything else. Much, much, much more scared of that. But I actually had the most – it was short. It was very truncated. But the sleep quality was out of this world. It was? Oh, it was so deep. It was really a very hypnotic environment. And what is the environment like actually?

1:02:49Because, of course, we see it from the audience's perspective. Well, that camp part is very small and it's smaller than it looks. Okay. But the actual camp site, if you will, is sprawling. Is it? And I spent a huge amount of time, because we had 18 waking hours, really. And I spent a huge amount of time communing with nature. And there was a spot at the bottom of the creek where we would sort of collect wood for the fire. Okay. And it was tranquil there, but it was also very noisy, but in a delicious natural world way. So the creek would babble furiously. There was a bush turkey that had like a, I mean, extraordinary, like, kind of not what you'd think would come out of it, sort of basso profundo.

1:03:45And then laughing kookaburras in the canopy. Okay. And then I had a minor bird that imitated my whistle. Yes, yes. Just amazing. Which I will definitely testify. I have been on a trip with you. I forgot where we were. I think Dominican Republic. And I watched, I observed you. Those little terrapins. Yes, communicate with animals. And literally have them communicate back to you. Yes, I would sing Getting to Know You. And all the baby terrapins came out today. Yes, yes, on cue. So now, what did you love the most about that experience? I love that level of socialization because I live alone. And a lot of my life, and actually quite a lot of my work is solitary.

1:04:44and so that intense spell in my life of socialization was really lovely and then the communing with nature but the impact that had on me is the thing that I longed to kind of take with me forever back into life because because of living alone and because of having something slightly melancholic inside me i can be introspective quite introspective and you can't be there it's i believe it's a physical impossibility because we had one little mirror which i never looked in because it was just too grassly and um we uh there was no way to be aware of self you know of having a face and a body there was just you forgot it you became a kind of floating phantom that was ingesting everything ingesting ingesting ingesting and therefore one's lens went utterly out yes and i thought oh what What would it be like to live this way if you could just, just ingest and just delight in all that was in your orbit and lose track totally of the ego, I suppose?

1:06:21And I remember thinking to myself before we left, oh, if I could keep a symbol of this, I'd be happy. Wow. Just a thimble. Wow. I find that so interesting because, and I have heard this before, especially about I'm a Celebrity, is there is something that happens there where you evolve. Oh. Oh, it's extraordinary. And I think that's why a lot of people have an intensely vulnerable moment, which I did about halfway through. I just couldn't stop weeping. I just couldn't stop weeping for nearly a day actually. And it was because my body was going through a transition, I think, of losing the ego and living just looking outwards.

1:07:24But it fits almost poetically within this 18 months of transition, this transition period for you. Yes. Because I would imagine that you have been able to maintain more than a thimble of your outlook from the jungle as you've now come back. Yes. I mean, I wish, if I'm really truthful, I wish I had retained more. Okay. Because I think what happens when you come out is that all of those other things spike, actually. You know, the things that very much root you into the civilized world. We all actually made a pact that we would stay off our devices for another 48 hours. Oh, really? And we all adhere to that because we so loved what it had done to us, you know.

1:08:25So everyone agreed to this. All agreed. All agreed. And I think everybody did it. Look at that. Look at that. While in the jungle. Yes. Was there a person or two that you felt that you formed an especially strong relationship with? Oh, gosh. I felt so very close to age. I love him so. I love him so. And we, you know, his siblings are also his best chums. Yes. And he, there was so much that we had in common, actually.

1:09:06he loves playing with language and bending words and twisting them about and sort of seeing what shapes they make and he's deeply inspiring and the lyrics to his pieces are oh my goodness, I mean he's Keats he's remarkable Yes. And Shona, I felt that we sort of shared a soul in a way. I was so impressed by her. And she was discovering herself in that setting and discovering how much power lay in her talents. And that was just lovely to be close to that and watch that gradual epiphany. You gave her some phenomenal advice in there. Oh, did I? You did. You did. Oh, what did I say? Your relationship advice in particular.

1:10:19Oh, darling. Oh, yes. You were on it. You were on it. But in essence, you were helping her to understand the power that she already possesses and how special she is. Oh, I believe that because, you know, I think that she had to have a measure of time after the jungle and she really has, especially where that platinum larynx of hers is concerned, where she celebrated that and saw what happened to have the zenith of her artistic ambitions. be realized as a singer. And that was thrilling. I thought, there's no cloud in this clear blue sky for her. You know, this is a boon. Yeah. And you could see she believed, in my opinion, she believed more in herself because she saw that you believed in her.

1:11:21Oh, well, I hope so. I hope so. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I know so. I know so. anyone else that you felt really oh gosh did it for you oh yes I mean I know everyone did to a certain extent yes everyone did to a certain extent and I think that was what was so special about it was that we were so harmonious and we had a conversation as a group led I think by Jack who was just the loveliest soul the loveliest gentlest soul this is Jack Osborne Jack Osborne somebody built to be a father because he's like you He's just generous of spirit, just giving, and his antennae are always up. And very sophisticated, nuanced emotional understanding.

1:12:13And he said, and Ruby said it too at a different time. Okay. Isn't it special that we've made a microcosm that's entirely harmonious when, you know, we know, well, we don't know in that moment what's happening outside, but we know what was happening outside when we came in. Yes. And we have been given the tools in this microcosmic world to make what we'd like, what we'd like to see. and we all decided that what we'd like to see is harmony. Wow. And so it was a conscious thought uttered by more than one person and felt by all, keenly felt by all. And those two actually were, I was very close to them as well.

1:13:12And the other person I had. You're saying Jack and Ruby, Wax. Yes, yes. And the other person I have to mention is Martin because, oh, my God, Martin is fascinating. He can speak Polari, and Polari was a secret gay language, pre-decriminalization of homosexuality. and people could speak it so that they could mainly if Hilda Handcuffs, which was what they'd call the law, were around, to go under the radar and still say what they'd like to say. And he said to me one day, oh, bona lallys, Tom, which means great legs in Polari. I said, you don't speak Polari. And he said, yes, yes. In fact, I wrote a thriller and one of my characters only spoke Polari.

1:14:15And he said, I grew up listening to Round the Horn. And Kenneth Williams and Hugh Paddock used to speak Polari on that. And he said we'd listen every Sunday. And he said then, he said, I believe that political acts are often felt about 10 years after the fact. And he said, if you think about it, decriminalization happened in 67. And he said the New Romantics as a musical movement happened in 77. And he said we were all congregating at a club called Blitz where there was no gender, there was no orientation. And we called ourselves the New Romantics because we loved Byron and we loved Wild. Look at that.

1:15:05Wild. And we loved those androgynous poets who occupied myriad spaces and identities. Yes. And I thought, what a special man. And we had so many, so many conversations about his life and those revelations in his life as they happened and how they were always happening at the same time as the arts. And there was therefore a movement. Oh, I loved him. Oh, my goodness. I loved him. I can see that this I'm a Celebrity was truly about community for you. It was about community. And it's interesting because we're watching you on challenges and eating wild things and having to put snakes and all things all throughout your trousers.

1:16:06Yes, one got very friendly with my own snake. Yes. I think he sort of saw a fellow traveler out there. There's something familiar out there I'd like to know. And you say, wow, look how big you are. I'm so... No.

1:16:25You're sweet, darling. It's nothing to write home about. It's got the right amount of vascularity, I think. Right, that's the key is vascularity. That's the key. I like that. I think that's probably why we find it attractive. Because it's sort of reminiscent of a member. I don't know. Yeah, but it's interesting. It's interesting. But we're watching all of this. But for you, what's actually happening is community. Yes, absolutely. So the challenge where you were, I think this was your final challenge where you were eating a… Porcine vulva. Yes. Yes. Which is like a bacon-y radish. Actually, it's not bad.

1:17:06But the one that was hard, which was actually, because it was their Silver Jubilee, you know, when I went in. Okay. And therefore, there were a lot of virgin appearances of all sorts of things, I think, challenges and foods. And I got one of them and it was camel's brain. Camel, yes. And I said to Anton Deck, I think you must never do this again. Because that was like foie gras that had been left out in the sun for a year. Really? It was just, and it stuck to the roof of one's mouth. Did it? Oh, that was hard. Where are you? Porzine velvet was a walk in the park. Was it? Compared to camel's brain.

1:17:54Really? Was it, because you're hungry though, right? Somewhat. Yes, you're very hungry. So because you're very hungry, does it make the camel's brain, does it go down easier? I think perhaps it made other things that might not go down as easily. Okay. Like, you know, a huntsman spider or a porcine vulva. Yes. Which I had incidentally in solid and liquid form. Oh, interesting. And you had the spider... Go down easier. Did you have the spider whole? Was it alive or no? No, it wasn't alive, but I did have it whole, I think. Okay. It was quite texturally arousing. Really? It's quite, you know, it's quite crunchy.

1:18:37Crunchy, okay. You placed second. Yes. Okay. Yes. And what was interesting is, were you aware at all of what was happening outside of the jungle? Because there was a concerted campaign for you. I think Jack and Miranda, your brother and sister, were just phenomenal on that campaign. And they were so naughty because I said to them before I went in, I left Jack in charge, my brother, of my Instagram. And I said, don't do anything. You know, he's got a job. He's got a full-time job. Yes. And so does Miranda. Yes. And I said, don't do anything except, you know, if ITV asks you to share something, you know, if you get those requested tag things.

1:19:29Yes. Yes. To collaborate on a post. To collaborate, then do, but otherwise don't do anything. And then discovering, I mean, it had become a full-time job practically for them, in addition to their full-time jobs. I could not believe it. I couldn't believe it. And to answer your question, no, I had no idea. And also the funny thing is that when I, at least, was completely unaware of the cameras, I mean, genuinely completely unaware, until I went to bed each day. Okay. And then when I went to bed, I thought, oh, my God, I must have been watching a car rust. and then it's only after the fact when you leave and you see montages and things that Ant and Dec play you and then it brings back a flood of memories and you think, oh, yes, I do remember that happening.

1:20:34Whereas the trials and the challenges, I remember almost frame by frame as they happened because there was so much adrenaline coursing through your veins. Yes. and that, you know, it heightened your recollection. But the days, they were one sort of long, sort of undulating channel, and it was very hard to kind of pick the floating bits of debris out of them. You just couldn't recall. You could do it, and you had no awareness of the, I would say the falling in love with you that the that the nation was doing you you were utterly unaware oh oblivious you must have felt the love now I now I feel it and it is quite humbling and staggering when you're first out and about after that experience because I think people invest in that experience so much emotionally probably because everybody in it is so vulnerable and so naked and so exposed yes and so then when when you meet people um immediately afterwards they they are almost compelled to say i you know i lived through that with you because they because they really did you know i mean they really did because if you're in a cage with 15 snakes and their hearts in their mouth you know it's the the the journey of watching that show i suppose is almost almost as physically taxing in a much more condensed way yes uh as going through it which is why which is why you get such physical reactions when people are asked about it you know they go oh i could never do that or you know oh how did i do how how could you do that and how could you face that and so um i i think that's why i think that's why people get so very on board yeah i think it was a clearly it was a life-changing experience for you it was life-changing um and you met some incredible friends yes uh that you'll have for life.

1:22:58Yes. And on that note, I have a letter from one of them. Oh. If you can take a look at that and read that for us.

1:23:16Oh my goodness. Look at this, it's like parchment. Oh, to my liege and servant, I blush to my very cuticles, I must tell you, I am with challenges. Unbeknownst to me, in the inky black of post-crepuscular darkness, one of thy lordship's sperm hast invaded my corporeal womb twice, nay thrice. But it was definitely thine. Well, I did have contenders, that's for sure. I noticed this may come at a wrong time, but the cock has crowed. Worry not, for I shall crouch and deliver in the thistles on mine earth. I'll not bother ye, but with a simple lawsuit.

1:24:13But do not blemish thy perfect visage with woe. It will only be for a farthing and a small island. Barmy Climes, yours to the death, Queen Rubella, the lady in waiting with great expectation. That is perfect. That is perfect. Oh, she's so heavenly. Oh, I love her so. Yes. I love her so. I've breakfasted Shea Ruby, you know. Oh, really? Oh. I tell you, I'll give that back to you as well. Oh, yes, please. Darling, what a treasure trove you've offered me. So. Oh, my, what a special thing. So that is the wonderful ruby wax. The wonderful, wonderful ruby wax. Yes. It seems like these experiences that you're having now, these opportunities.

1:25:10Yes. You are evolving. As a human. Yes. These experiences are shaping you. Yes. And what you're doing is you're continuing to then give. Actually, I remember when I stopped doing theater and my work more or less became telly. and I thought oh that's sort of sad in a way that I can't sort of tell stories anymore you know but then we we do don't we you know we do instinctively and intuitively we tell stories all the time no matter what the medium is yes that's in essence what you have done for us today in this conversation. I say this with no joking whatsoever, but you already know this, is my sons, they...

1:26:16I feel as if Kingston is very happy-go-lucky. He can be around anyone. He's fine. Liam is highly resistant to many people, but the moment that he met you, obviously the moment that Kingston met you, is you change their world. You change their world. And there's so many things that I see they have become because of you. Their stance on queerness comes from seeing, you know, their Uncle Tom, you know? their ability their desire to step outside and see value in the arts that comes from you like that really doesn't come from me it originates the seed was planted from you to the point where that's a career path that they both are heavily considering that comes from you and I think they will do you remember in Battersea Park when, again, in the name of showing off to the boys, I climbed to the top of the tree.

1:27:32Yes. I've got to impress them. That's the awful thing, and I always do this with children. I've got to impress them. What can I do? But I would never do. It is, I mean, I have so many phenomenal memories with you. Like, truly. I think that is almost the underpinning of a great relationship, is that there's an endless number of phenomenal memories. Because, you know, it was through you also. that you taught me the different accents around. Really? Oh, yeah. Oh, yes. Well, I love them. I mean, the thing is, etymologically, accent, and it really means a regional song. Yes. And I love that because when I hear an accent, I tune in to the melody really first, even though there might be obvious differences in vowel sound or stress.

1:28:29It's the music that really draws you into it. And I think that's why I find them so attractive. You know what we should do? We should do something. I think, no, no, we have not done this. But all right, I have a game. Let me know if you want to do this. All right. You deliver a regional accent. And you guess it. And I guess it. Right. Okay. Let's see. Please, please. I've been talking so much about it. I know these accents. I'm going to put a bit of regional lexicon in there as well. Okay. Yeah. Go deep on the region. Okay. Know that you're a bret. Lang me your lum reek. Oh, my God. We're north.

1:29:13We're way north. Yes. Well done. Yeah. We are so north. Yeah. Are we so north we're in Scotland? Yes. Bravo, darling. Okay, North Scotland. Bravo! Thank you, thank you, thank you. And Lum is chimney. Ah, okay. So it's like wishing somebody a really happy home and heart. Lung me or Lum week. Okay, there you go. Okay, here we go. All right, give me another one. All right, I'm one and oh, one and oh. You know what, I'm feeling musical. Let's bash out a song on the old Joanna. You are Essex slash East London. Yes. And Joanna is Cockney rhyming slang for? Piano. Bravo. Oh, my God. Look at me. Look at me.

1:29:58Bravo. Thank you. Okay. I wish you and this podcast all the luck and success it deserves, my little akushla. Okay. I know we are in Ireland or Northern Ireland. Very good. So we're in that territory. All right, look at that. It's Irish. And a cusla is, you're my cusla. A cusla is from Irish Gaelic. Ah, okay. And a cusla means pulse. and it's short for oh pulse of my heart and so it's a kushla is just oh pulse and it's the notion that somebody is so vital to your very being that they're like your pulse yes isn't that beautiful it is beautiful I mean it supersedes beloved doesn't it it's just like it's heavenly it is This is why I love etymology.

1:31:11Yes. Right, because then I think what you end up doing is your vocabulary changes once you understand the origin. You see it through that prism. Yes. It's absolutely true. I've never heard you actually do mine before. Which I'm scared to hear. Well, there's one example, which is when I suddenly realized. Normally, I wouldn't dare do yours, but I have to do yours when I tell this story. Because I suddenly see myself through your eyes because it was so awful what I did to you. I think I know what it is. You know what's coming, don't you? Yes. So one day you and I were out and about in Brixton, I think, or perhaps somewhere in South London.

1:32:02And you had a lash on your cheek. And I pulled it off. And I said, and I held it out before your eyes. and you said, because you're so polite, you wouldn't say, why are you fingering my face and pulling off my hair? You went, oh, wow, tea. Oh, wow, look at that. Whoa, tea. And I was like, and then I said, well, blow. And you looked even more aghast. and you're like, wow, what? Like, oh.

1:32:54And at that juncture, I realized that people in Washington don't pull off people's eyelashes and tell them to make a wish. No, no. I don't think that's a US thing. No. No, I don't think so. No, I don't think so now. No, no. But that's a full British situation. situation. I think so. Interesting. Yeah, it's very lucky. But you did blow it off and make a wish, didn't you? Yeah, I think I did. I think I did. You know what? I think you got me, though. Really? Those are my preferred choices, or should I say, selection of words. Wow.

1:33:39When Kingston or Liam impersonate me, that's exactly what they do. Oh, the other one that you love, which I love that you love, is that's wild. That's wild.

1:33:54Yes, that's wild. Oh, that's wild, T. Oh, T, that is wild. I don't think I can do you very well. No, you did it perfectly. You know, you have, I don't have that ability. I think there's a separate muscle to impersonate. Can't you? No. You can't do me then? I wish I could. No. Do you know how much money I could make if I could do you? If I could impersonate you, do you know what I would be doing right now? I would be touring. That would be quite an OnlyFans if you could do me.

1:34:34Tom, Reed, Wilson, I adore you. I love you so. I, you are truly, you are one of the most kind, beautiful, majestic, wise, witty, fun. You're going to go into like, into like, so you can't darling, you can't. You have to say, you truly, truly one of the, you are, you are also one of the most influential people in my life. and I am so thankful to have met you. I am so blessed to have you in my life. It is a privilege to have you in the life of my family. I am going to be one of your biggest protectors throughout eternity. Even when I pass away, I'm still going to be out here protecting you. I think you were placed here on this earth to make us all reflect, to make us all better human beings.

1:35:48And it is a blessing to actually know an angel. So thank you. Just thank you. And I love you. And beyond this conversation, I'm truly, truly blessed to have you in my life. So thank you. Well, I feel the very same. And I knew, isn't that amazing? I knew the second we met. I mean, neither of us really believe in love at first sight, but in a funny old way, we did have it because I knew there's something. Yes. There's something here that if I'm given permission, I will... Pursue. ...gave to me forever. Ever. Yes. Ever. Yes. Isn't that something? Isn't that something? Look at that. I do love you.

1:36:39I love you too. But you're doing my eulogy. Remember that. Yes, I am. But it's whoever. It's awfully macabre, isn't it? It is. It's a perfect way to end. Whoever gets to the grave first will do the other's eulogy. My money is on me getting to the grave first. No, no, no. It's not happening. This is very, this is very, we shouldn't finish on this. No, that's the perfect way to finish. Clog popping. No, I'm dying first. Tom Reed Wilson, my buddy. I mean, there's so many things. One is, I think probably the most important, is how Tom holds space for everyone in his life. We saw it on I'm a Celebrity.

1:37:32You see it on Celebs Go Dating. You see it in every interaction, every television show that he does. He's a master at it. But it's something that he doesn't practice or rehearse or preach. He just does. And I think that's something we can all take from him and from his story. He mentioned, he said, you know, we both don't believe in love at first sight. And I agree. I always say I don't believe in love at first sight. But actually, the first moment that I saw Tom, we became intertwined indefinitely. It helped me redefine love at first sight in platonic relationships. You know, Tom is the person who taught me how to hug someone.

1:38:16Before I met Tom, I was what I call the standard hugger. I would hug briefly and then tap, tap, tap. He taught me, you know, you give it time. And my hugs with him are a minimum of 30 seconds. Minimum. When you hug someone for that long, you can actually feel a difference. You can feel cortisol levels droppings. You know, you could feel the connection with the person. He taught me how to hug. Yeah. This is an exclusive. I've not told anybody this. The story is the same thing I've been telling for years. It's just like the cameras are now in focus and people are actually hearing it differently.

1:39:02I just think about little Kerri. Upsets me now. Can you believe that we're doing this again? He just bloody loved me, pal. Here he comes. He's coming in. As a good interviewer, I have to ask you this. I don't want to be associated with it. When we're together, it's amazing, but we are very different people. Do you believe you two will get married?