TommyInnit: How Getting Banned From Minecraft Changed My Life! I Was 16 Years Old With £1 Million

41:31And I was walking through, I just remember being like, do you know that feeling when someone's staring at you? It was like that. And then it just hasn't stopped since. This is when things started getting a little more complicated for me. Okay, okay, because it seems like you didn't like that. No. You didn't like that feeling. I didn't at all, no. because I just want to like go to the park and you know go online finish my stream and then turn it off and go downstairs I didn't like that no okay okay so so you didn't like that feeling right yeah but you're still continuing right and and and and your profile is growing my streams yeah my dreams are still coming true and I was getting really overwhelmed as well so I just start like going around hers and like turning off my phone for a couple days okay or like a day and just not checking it because i was like this is getting a bit too much now and honestly i was i was much more positive about i had a girlfriend i was like this is amazing this is your first girlfriend yeah and i did not care about youtube at this point i was like oh that's cool i have a girl this is i can't believe i have a girlfriend this is the best thing ever so i was like whatever i was just hanging out i did not care and then i'd like i remember i checked my youtube studio i was I was like, I wonder how that mod video I did.

42:47And then it got like, usually I get like 2 million views and it had like 5 in two days. And I was like, that's a lot more. And on the streams, we came to the big sort of end of our lore. It was called Lore, like the story. And it was like the first sort of big arc. I went live. I remember our stream, it was this big stream. I looked terrible. I was like, ah, I have 600 ,000 viewers right now. Like 600 ,000 actual people watching live. watching and i'm like that's weird i'm not good that's a lot and i was like that and i remember at one point in the stream i was like by the way if anyone has like your free twitch prime sub like go ahead and use it and the whole chat was subs and i was like just watching myself like make the most money i've met i was just staring at it like that it's probably fine i won't think about that it's incredible and also can we talk about the money too because yeah sure Because you're talking about you're beginning to monetize.

43:43Oh, yeah. So I made like a bit at school. Can you disclose how much or the range? Yeah, it was like initially like a couple grand, which is like mental when you're like 15. I was like, that's wicked. Yes. And then I was like 16 and I made more than that. And then I was like, look at this mum. She's like, what the fuck? And probably about since that point forward, I went, this is weird. I'm not going to think about money anymore. And I just stopped thinking about it because it stressed me out. Really? Yeah. I didn't like it. So you're not thinking if I get this many views, I make this much money.

44:22Well, I wanted views. But not the money. Attention is awesome. I love attention. I didn't want money because it's stressful. I just didn't like it because I was like, well, I've already got everything I need. I've got my parents. I've got my dogs. I've got my mates. I've got the new phone. I didn't like it so I just it just stressed me out because I was like I shouldn't have this this is weird like people work I shouldn't have this so I just ignored it but really I didn't so at this point I was like 16 I'd like made like a million quid and I was like that's a bit weird isn't it okay help me understand this you're 16 yeah you've made a million pounds at 16 many 16 year olds would say okay i love this i you know i'm gonna go buy a lamborghini i'm gonna go do this but it seems to like even now it may i hate i don't like i think the most important thing for me was that i don't lose my identity and so yeah so from a lifestyle perspective it sounds like at 16 making all that money you didn't change your lifestyle not at all it remained the same so then talk to me about this i guess massive leapfrog moment where you know well yes i hit the millions i start getting recognized a lot now i started doing videos with the sidemen who have very different demographic to me and i collaborate with anyone and everyone because it's a sideman i was excited to meet him yes but then i get like people who weren't my viewers but knew me this is when i started being like more widely i guess famous which is a percentage word pretentious word to use but like are people hollering at me and go yes tommy in it people who i wouldn't speak two in school who wouldn't be my friends were coming up to me so i get a little one i kind of get really anxious now in public i was like i really hate this i remember being at college and having to go home early early because i was just like spinning out so my address was public i didn't know this now but my mum told me only like a couple months ago like some lads like showed up to the house and were like where's tommy in it we're gonna beat him up like outside our house i slept through it but like like we were getting mail of like pedos and that like really Yeah, because our address is public.

46:26Some people who love me, we're getting everything. My parents protected me from all of this. The only thing I saw was when I'd stream, so we had the police around and my mum was crying and they were like, okay, if you want when we stream, we'll be on watch. And I was like, what do you mean you'll be on watch? And it just became this thing. And I was like, guys, I just wanted to use you around. I didn't mean to cause all this fuss. I'm sorry. I just felt really bad. I was like, I'm sorry. I didn't mean to do none of this. I just wanted to play Minecraft. And help me understand, because when your doc's like that, right, I would imagine there's ill intent.

47:00Yeah, they're trying to, like, get detention. And ultimately, all that happened, if you're in America, it's much scarier because they can send a SWAT team and people with guns can bust out. And I've heard some horror stories from my friends that I'm so lucky. I feel for them so much. I'm so lucky it didn't happen to me. What happened to me was basically people just used Deliveroo to send unpaid food to my house. and I got some free milkshakes one time from a delivery driver that felt bad. That's all that happened. But in the time, you're thinking, what's going to happen next? And that was very scary.

47:32And I remember, like, staying up till 4 a.m., staring out the window, thinking I'm going to see someone in my garden. And also, it seems as if you were unaware of exactly what was happening. So your parents were bearing the brunt of the stress around that. Yeah. So now that you've talked to them in hindsight, did they tell you about how they were even feeling yeah they were spun out they were scared and they were freaked and they were also freaked out about the money stuff and all of it and like how do you parent a kid that's now well at this point i was more famous than my mum was and she was like how do we do this um and they did an amazing job because i didn't i still had a relatively normal childhood even after that stuff happened my mum would be like you can't just deliver a reward whenever you want you'll spoil it you know you can spend your money but don't right like they would never stop me from anything but they go don't be a knobhead and i go that was enough for me to go i don't be a knobhead yeah and then i um you know and it was really transparent with them and i just go and go around my girlfriend's house loads because i just this is spinning me out a bit and then um from then to july i went i got to 10 million subscribers and it would be every month i'd be in the car with my mum and we'd be taking the dogs out to the field and i'd go oh mum I'm on 7 million now I've gone up a million she'd go alright I'd go yeah how was it?

48:51it just became normal it was like weird I make another new channel that I start doing vlogs on then that does it's like the fastest channel ever to hit a million it was in like a day or something and then I was like doing that and I was having a great time because we're out of Covid and I was like let's just do some mad shit so we went skydiving and had a water park to ourself oh my gosh and at this point as well I'm finding it really hard to navigate. So every week I'm having a call with, you know, Dream or a different YouTuber. Tons of calls with MrBeast. Tons of calls with like every YouTuber under the sun.

49:24Because I'm disorientated. I need some guidance. And I don't know if I did this consciously or not. But one of the best things I've ever done is I went, right, the thing I lack that's going to fuck me is perspective. So I'm going to call every YouTuber. So walk us through some of the advice, especially for MrBeast. because I mean what he's achieved is just you know has been next level yeah but well but what was the advice that you were getting at that time from some of those folks it was it was nuts and I'm not going to throw anyone under the bus because they're all youtubers and they're all you know and each of their own and it's much more American mindset than I have but it was all stuff like about success about how to succeed and telling me to ditch my girlfriend so I could be more successful it's not stuff I and I'm not going to throw anyone in the doghouse but like because I don't blame them at all I was asking them for advice they were trying to help me these are people who were so but you know the whole life of YouTube way more obsessed than I am but it wasn't if I'm ever in the position where there's younger YouTubers coming in who I can help I will absolutely do it and I'll give all my time I can to give them the advice and knowledge and stuff I've got over the years because it was just very you know success grind now relax later you know it was actually only when I had my friend like Wilbur be like don't no do that um you know I see us right yeah so I'm lucky I had lots of guidance I should have just spoke to my parents more really in hindsight because they caught and i do now all the time but like yeah and it was just saying stuff like hire one of your mates for two grand to do all your chores for you so you can just focus on the grind it was all this stuff that honestly kind of gave me this superior sense of self that really would come to start ungrounding me and i think that laid its seeds for what was Let me ask you something.

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52:10Come solo, bring a partner, bring your crew everyone's welcome. But seats are limited and they will go. Tickets are on sale right now at livenation.co.uk. I can't wait to see you there. So then if we're back to that 10 million zone, that is, but that's only, what is that, only three years ago? Yeah, 2021. It feels like a lifetime ago, man. It's only three to four years ago. Yeah, and then I start like, yeah, I stretch myself too thin and COVID starts ending and my views start going down. And I go from like getting 20 million views a video to 10. But let me tell you, that was the worst feeling in the world.

52:53And that was when I, myself, because I realise now, all of my self-esteem and all of my confidence was sort of leaning on this thing that was, I'm the most popular person ever who's ever been this age. and you sort of take that out from me and it went it properly went so getting 10 million views a video instead of 20 it stopped going, it had been going up for a year since 10 ,000 subs it had been going up, it started going down and even just the idea that it was going down, I think I was really really spun out for years and it was sort of around the time I went on Logan Paul's podcast I remember I started thinking, well I'm shit and that didn't leave kind of still hasn't some could say but like starting to but like that that really privately started being a battle i was going through okay and this is when in almost the identical way of in hypixel where i wasn't getting enough views i started losing myself quite a lot like quite a lot um yeah yeah we're going to go there if if you're willing i'm willing you start to dip you start to feel crap in yourself but do you try to overcompensate yeah because so much of youtube is like based on superstition because you never really know why this is happening um so i start like if i pose a tiktok and it gets like 8 million views instead of 10 million i like delete it our shame one time i was live and i dipped under 200 000 live viewers i went to 190 000 i ended stream out of embarrassment because i thought that's so bad it's i delete tweets that get like 250 000 likes because i don't get 300 000 that's interesting at this point a lot of my friends join this organization called misfits and so they go over to uh america i start feeling really quite isolated because they're in la having the most amazing time and i'm in nottingham and we've built this new little office like a couple grand i'm in there I actually don't realise it at the time because I needed my set up out my bedroom but I'm starting to feel quite isolated in July me and my first girlfriend break up and I have a fun summer of discovering drinking and you know being single but like ultimately it spins me out you know because I'm way less happy than I was when I was with her and I've stretched myself a bit too thin with these vlogs and I'm starting to be less in it and all my dreams have come true then my last dream is 10 million and I've made friends with everyone I could ever dream of being friends with.

55:31And then it's like, well, what now? Because I'm still on this treadmill, so I'm running really quick, but I'm not really running for nothing anymore. This is when things get a bit difficult. So I go, right, you know, in January of 2022, I find a little place in Brighton and within like a week at 17, I move to Brighton by myself. So I have a load of other YouTuber friends here. I go move to live with them to sort of get that sense of belonging this was a bad idea, because all these things that you know now I'm a bit older, like the importance of family and the importance of love and friendship and nature and dogs, they're so simple and home cooked meals I didn't know, so I move out and I spend a couple months, like, I can't hang out with anyone past 10pm, because I'm not 18 so I can't go to bars, so I just sit in this like, lonely apartment in a skyscraper I'm, like, alone, like, every night listening to music.

56:27Like, miserable. But I'm really happy I'm in this city. But it's, like, weird. And I'm around the city and I start getting recognised all, like, 30 times when I'm outside. Like, it's a lot. And I'm just, like, I don't even know what to do. But I'm still, like, big. But the numbers are going down. And I'm just spinning out. Like, really badly spinning out. And so I call, like, every YouTuber under the sun for advice. So, and you can name any YouTuber. I genuinely mean any, and I will have had a two-hour call with them asking them what I should do with my life. KSI, MrBeast, Logan Paul, Mark Grober, Ryan Trahan, Dan, MumboJumba, like, everyone going, what did you do?

57:10Because I'm a ninja, like, I'm a bit lost. And they, funnily enough, I actually got the best life advice from Logan Paul, which is, like, one of the most ironic things in my life. But, like, he was really wise. What did you say? He was just like, career is a really long thing. Prioritize your happiness. Don't attach your worth to numbers. And I was like, that's amazing. But yeah, that's easier said than done. Exactly. In theory, it definitely works. So I started doing all this. And I do my first merch drop, which is very, that then sets me up even more for life than I thought I could be settled for.

57:45So I'm very happy about that. And then I did that on my 18th birthday. I turn 18. I start meeting some more friends in Brighton. start being a bit more like normal. I go to VidCon in America. I go to Los Angeles for the first time with my dad. We're having an amazing time. I go to VidCon and we do this live panel. And I go on stage and there's like 3 ,000 people in front of me screaming at me. And I'm like, oh, you're all real people. And you're my people. You're the people I would hang out with in school and you're here. And that was one of the most mind-blowing things ever. And I fly back from America after just met in 3 ,000 people.

58:25I remember the whole 12-hour flight back from LA. I'm sat like that. My audience, it properly changes my life and my outlook. And that night, I had a call from Dream. Poor Dream had to break the news to me that Techno had died. He got diagnosed with cancer in the end of 2021. And that was like, yeah. Yeah. What did he mean to you? Techno. I loved him. He was a hero of mine, and he was a friend, and I looked up to him. It was hilarious. And every time me and Freddie would go on walks, they'd go, I can't believe a friend's a Technoblade. And he was, you know, like...

59:15he was the only other one properly from Hypixel, that same server that, you know, me and him had had this great camaraderie and we'd done streams together and he was amazing and his whole thing was he'd never die that was like his catchphrase so he was and he was in destruction he had this character that he sort of didn't really drop too much off cause he was a very private very private person like he never died and then he did and that was like you know we're talking about colourful in my videos like that point on the world lost some of its color like i was just it it put me in in the real world yes and that god did i like not being in that world for the longest time so he was he the first person that was that you would say that you were close to who had passed away yeah i might like a granddad but not and not someone who isn't at that age that you're respecting to pass away exactly you know uh a few years ago my best friend passed away and uh thank you it's it's one of those where people will say well did you process that it's like i'm continuing to process yeah it doesn't stop it doesn't it it just continues yeah and then uh i have to break the news to a couple of other of his friends and my friends who are all devastated and then the morning of um my show the audience find out and I I mean what a day that was one of the most that was the most day of my life the most like so I go into the show and I'm there I'm at the Brighton Dome and we're rehearsing and there's every YouTuber you know Dan's there Dan's in the show Jacksepticeye all the YouTubers are there and I just have to and my parents and I have to take a minute to go to the dressing room and I just lose it just cry my eyes out and my parents come I just remember thinking to myself right I can get through today I can get through anything so I sort of it leaves my brain and I focus on the work at hand and I do the show and I go out and do the show and it's the most like I love it being on the stage and then at the very end my dad says let's just put a slideshow up for techno and I can remember like looking over and seeing on the big thing rest in peace techno blade and I wasn't sure if that was I've always been so self-conscious about not accidentally using him for the wrong thing or you know and i see that and i look out and i see 2 000 people standing ovation all of them like crying and i just burst into tears on stage and you can see the video but it's the most like i can visualize it in my head it's the most moving thing in my whole life and it was just like i couldn't believe it yeah yeah yeah uh just uh one last question on Technoblade is when you think back, what was the last conversation that you had with him?

1:02:03It would have been that text when he said, thanks for being my friend. Wow, that was the last thing he ever sent to in our chat. I think that's so incredible that his last message to you was thank you for being my friend. Yeah, that was when I was like, something's up. Because he sent a message that was a bit vulnerable. And I was like, he's not, that's not him. That was, yeah. I was having to think about all that. And then I feel like a prick because, like, all my dreams have come true and I'm sat here on my arse annoyed at the world and pessimistic. And it's just crap.

1:02:42Then, which is the kind of thing that happens where I don't want to go too into this because I haven't even processed it myself very much, but, like, someone who I've been deeply close with, like, like a load of stuff comes out about him and he's like one of my best pals but it's been a bit i don't really know how public i want to i don't really want to be very public about this but quite suddenly his reputation changes on the internet and privately a lot of light bulbs go off in my head where i'm like oh shit and that like really spins me out and it spins out of the audience at the same time a load of other youtubers in the scene it kind of starts it's almost like specifically minecraft youtube like me too movement of like everyone loads of people my colleagues are like and they were a dickhead and they were a dickhead and they were a dickhead also dream my relationship sort of fractures with him a load of online stuff at the end of 2023 comes out about him i feel very torn of what to do i'm this community that we have that was tight-knit right of the dream has to be that was beautiful and lovely and you know every day i'd log on to twitter and it'd feel like i'm going into the school cafeteria and everyone's going but hey Tom, begins to really fracture.

1:03:50Okay. And I stopped going on Twitter because it's spinning me out, which is a shame because, you know, especially before it was X and Elon bought it, it was this beautiful place. So I'm really spun out. And then I go on tour. I go on tour. So in the tour, Jack's like playing my dad, Freddie's famous childhood dog. And like a couple of weeks into the tour, my mum FaceTimes and it's like, me and your dad are splitting up. And I'm like, what? Because they've never argued. You know, it's been the most tight household full of love. And again, I don't really want to go into this too much, but, you know, it's sort of on my dad's end is where the fault is at in the relationship.

1:04:31And they split up really suddenly. And it's like, what? So every night I'm, like, doing this show where I'm pretending Jack's my dad. And at the end of every show, there's a big montage of my family to show how I got to this point. so I'm stood on stage in front of a thousand people watching my family on stage I'm not going to come home to and it just like tears my heart in two and it's the the worst so I do that tour and I luckily I have Freddie and Jack there to comfort me throughout the whole thing but I'm spent man I'm like I'm properly and when you tap into your emotions in in that moment especially when you look back and you see that photo when you're on stage yeah what are those emotions just i don't even think i knew at the time how much pain i was i was in so much pain i was like and i quit drinking that year because i was like i'm gonna end up drinking too much and getting miserable so i was just like i'm gonna stop doing anything because there's that one time i had a few pints and my head started getting really dark thinking about techno i was like right let's just not do that and then I go right I mean this video I've had a bad year 2024 was my bad year but I'm gonna be all right and it turns first of January I'm like I still feel bad and it really really hurts that like I'm still feeling bad I'm like it's done with now and I'm like spun out and still myself worth low and at this point like you know I've stopped enjoying YouTube but there's still that like still so intertwined in my instinct i start getting really badly jealous of like new youtubers that are coming up who were like i've never talked about this and no one would ever compare me to him but like i show speed he seems like such a lovely lad but seeing someone who's still in that phase of youtube and is really happy and really energized and doing that and like sort of hanging out with all the people i used to hang out with it and all the things i found too difficult to handle like they're getting recognized and then that you know sort of watching him embrace spins me out i'm just like oh i'm i'm crap i'm crap compared to him and i start like comparing myself to him and to other youtubers and i just get really spun do i have depression because i've had a bad day for like three months now from what you've just said there's so many places i'd like to be able to unpack with you.

1:06:52Let's do it, mate. Now, when you say it spun you out, because you used that term. I love that phrase. Yeah. What does that mean in action for you to be spun out? I guess it's losing sight of yourself and your needs and what's truly important to you. And it's, I think, sort of,

1:07:16I guess it's getting caught up so much in the surface layer of stuff. Like for me, I can get really jealous of a YouTuber and that's what I think about. But really what I'm meaning is, you know, I'm really grieving. And I'm like placing all this grief for my family and my mates and my dead pal. I'm sort of shifting all the blame onto something else. And I think spinning out is, for me, I feel very whole when I sort of wipe off all that dirt. And I go, look, here's what's happened. I'm sad about these things. I want to have a conversation like this. Like this is honest. But when I'm by myself and I'm tired, I'm not really going to think about all these hard things.

1:07:46I might get really disproportionately annoyed or pissed off at something because sort of displacement, I think, really. So that for me is what being spun out is. And what I like about this conversation is for us all to understand that we all spin out. You know, we all hit these moments. Yeah. But if we're consistently feeling this way. Yeah. Then to your point is, okay, it's something more. Yeah. and you said so were you diagnosed with moderate to mild depression yeah okay yeah so so being diagnosed with that did you feel like that that was a weight off my chest it was okay and why so because i was like oh it's not even my fault well it's like you know before i beat myself up and i was like oh actually it's medical now and it felt a lot more a lot better and i started antidepressants which has been great which well they've been good but it basically just means when i have a bad day i only reach like an eight out of ten not like a 10 out of 10 you know okay yeah okay and then what else has helped you with your depression uh because i know that there's medication there's therapy you talked about yeah you're in therapy uh there's exercise you know people do a lot of exercise yeah okay that's really helped uh reading books as and finding the right books for me um honestly number one is like connecting with people i'm like love and And having these chats with my friends and family has really, really helped me.

1:09:16I've really, my relationship with my audience has deeply changed. Like reading the Bruce Springsteen books, you know, and him from a time where there's no internet, there's no numbers, it's a connection between you and people. Has really, and doing these tours and understanding the people and making slowly more and more videos that are more vulnerable and about mental health. And like when you're lonely, you feel like you're the only one that feels like that. And then you put it out there. It was really scary. And I sometimes think, you know, compromisingly vulnerable to put myself in that. But I got to this relationship with the internet where I didn't check anything.

1:09:51I didn't go online at all. And, yeah, that's sort of expressing that to my audience. Because I think what a lot of YouTubers do, which is what, because YouTube is for young people, like, you have an audience of, you know, five to 21-year-olds. and then you kind of lose your audience and get the next wave of five to 21 year olds so i've really made an effort to those people who were watching me five years ago connect with them and prioritize them and you know that's became such a special relationship to me and when i hold i think about it so much yes um and even though obviously because they all have jobs now and that why there's so much less of them but that's what's they're the most important to me And obviously anyone's welcome to get into me, but I learned that from Springsteen, who has a relationship with his audience that spans 30, 40 years.

1:10:45I want that. Yeah. I want these people to, this became just deeply, deeply important to me. And also the issues, man. Like, that they all, all my friends have felt something with depression and anxiety. And all my audience have felt lonely. And I've had people tell me shit like I was about to kill myself and then you went live. and at first you hear that when you're younger and you go wow that's really moving i'm that's great my streams are good but then now i've been at the point where i've been depressed and i'm like what and i just feel this overwhelming sense of like responsibility to not fuck around yeah it's how you know when you think about if you're willing to go there is sure in that state of depression how difficult did it get when you think of the most challenging time for you it just got i never wanted to like top myself or self-harm but like i just

1:11:41i still fall into it i just felt like i'm nothing and i was just like i'm and i'd find a youtuber or problem to compare myself to i just go no one like loves i'm shit i'm honestly crap i found that So hard to... I really believed it. And then I'd go and do a stand-up performance and I'd go, wow, this is amazing. There's people out here forming. I'd go, oh, I'm crap again. I just had nothing to... Because, you know, when I was with Molly, we'd have a chat and then she'd sort of stop me from spiralling out. But I wouldn't have that one by myself. I'd just, like... feel like I'm not enough. I just really didn't feel enough, ever.

1:12:24I felt like I'm underachieving and like I'm doing shit wrong and that like I don't know what I want and I don't know who I should be because I'm like 21 like I don't I don't think you're meant to know but when you have the pressure on and also you know I'm like sensitive that like I really care about you's I did for years and then when you have loads of people online telling you you fell off like that was stinging me to bits I'm really really as the years have gone by like it can really bother me so I have to like not look at it I really connect with people on like a deep way yes very quick so so you got those and do you still get any of those comments yeah online yeah i'm just like oh but i'm more attuned to myself now but i think what it is ultimately it is and this is what i've had to think for a long time it is you know it like hurt it stung when youtubers you know i stopped being the biggest youtuber and you kind of realize a lot of those relationships you form when you're a kid are more business oriented than you thought they were and people don't give you as much time when you're not as popular that stung a bit and i realized that like beginning of 2024 and 2023 and that was something i was dealing with it stung but i moved on and i didn't have that community so much anymore and that stung but when you lose you know your best mates and your parents and your girlfriend and your home those like scars and weren't such a big deal become a huge deal because it's all you've got left to cling on to.

1:13:52And I think ultimately I know if I really wanted to and put my ass into it, I could get back to getting millions of views on videos. It's in my control how to be popular. My parents are never going to get back together. And I'm never going to feel like how I did when I was 16. Simple and light. And it's not even that I want views and subs. It's when I feel how I used to feel. Yes. You know? And even if now I did, they wouldn't it doesn't do anything so it's that illusion of you know it's and it's i compare it to a casino you know and you go into a casino and you just see all these people like hoping that if they hit the jackpot it'll fix some empty space inside them and for me i think like i almost feel like i've googled a lot about like attention addiction and if that's a thing because i feel like I probably have that of like with YouTube and those numbers that like I need it and like you get that high and then it starts fading and then you just keep doing it to try and get that high back and it's only after it's been a few years I'm like oh that was getting a bit addict-y like do you know what I mean yes I wonder what's your opinion now because I know that you've been very vocal on this now and I thank you for for being vocal on this topic of for young people now who are using social media in particular how to now not fall victim to what it sounds like you fell victim to yeah but i feel like like i was falling victim to it before was it like i was posting photos on instagram and noticing the cool kids have 30 likes and i had 18 and then getting excited when i had 20 and annoyed when i have 12 i feel like like everyone is like famous in their own way no one's making stuff for them you're making it for the response and that's not how the world used to be and i don't yeah so what do we do like what what advice would you give to a 17 year old right now i would say the things that make you happy like do them and it can be anything you You know, that could be drawing or making a video game soundtrack or interior design or any creative outlet that works for you.

1:16:08And try new ones. And don't do it with any pressure for what's going to come. Just do it because you love it. Yes. And, like, if you can start to build up goals and the goals being based on, you know, having a mission, I think, at least really works for me. And I guess my goal now is to sort of try and alter my, you know, because for a long time, my mission was simply. get YouTube rank. Right. And then it was get 10 million subs. Then it was I don't know. And now it's, right, I can see there's all these people out there that are feeling lonely and lost and depressed, and me too. I want to, like, who are lacking, like, joy.

1:16:46I want to, like, give them understanding and, like, I guess share joy through laughter. And after, for me, having those experiences being at comedy nights, where there's, like, 10 people, or Bruce performances, and understanding, oh, my God, this is life changing that is that actually changed my life that helped me that was an experience I couldn't have yes like cool that I want to do that that's the most important thing so whenever I'm like thinking about views I have to remind myself no that's not that doesn't really help my mission right now like and that's really difficult yes yes because I'm so like programmed yeah I could see it it's interesting I can see the tension in you right now yeah of your kind of battling the old you.

1:17:26I really, and that was, and there was a long time where I felt so inferior to the old me. So I was like, he got 10 million views and I don't, and I just, it's been a real weird battle. Yeah. You know? So when you think today, are you proud of yourself? Yeah, really proud. Do you want me to go, so you look at me in the way? No, I'm just, just letting it sit in. Do you feel? But I won't, I'm proud of myself right now and after an hour of a talk and I've just remembered about all the things i've done but when i'm by myself in a car or first thing in the morning i'm probably not no because i you just get so like myopic you just forget i just like forget about anything i've done or any achievements i've done or any friends i have and all i'm thinking about is right now and i'm like i'm not doing nothing and yeah do you feel safe yeah safer than i felt in years yeah okay okay do you feel like those around you are proud of you Yeah, yeah, very My mates are great and my family Okay, on that note, I have a little surprise for you Oh yeah?

1:18:31Can I play something for you? Yeah, sure Alright Take a listen to this

1:18:43Hey babes, it's your mother here I just wanted to say I love you so much And I'm so proud of you of course I'm proud of all the stuff you've achieved but I'm even more proud and wildly impressed at what a kind sensitive thoughtful and emotionally literate man you've grown up to be all the brilliant accolades you've achieved aren't just due to luck and talent it's the focus and the hard work and the authenticity that's super duper impressive and I think that calm self-acceptance is one of the reasons that you're so accepting of other people and you're so interested in learning about other people and their lives.

1:19:20It's a lovely mix of empathy and curiosity. I feel these hard times have brought us even closer and even more open in how we communicate and secure that we can disagree too. I'm so proud that you're becoming a positive role model for young men and how the way you are, your thoughtfulness, your vulnerability, your kindness is leading by example you cut through a lot of the noise and all that bullshit and you speak to your generation i love you babes you big daft twat

1:19:54oh thanks mum oh that wow i'm really not good at getting compliments i started like squirming i was like oh i feel like my mum when she would be at the school gates and would go love you at the top of the lungs that was like that was like that but to the world i actually was like the sweetest and most excruciating thing at the same time. That was... You did. I was like, actually, like, oh, please. I swear down, British people are not made to get compliments. Oh, my gosh. I love that, what she said. She's a great mum. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. You can see what I mean about growing up in a household and just, like, that is amazing that she speaks to me like that.

1:20:27I take that for granted less and less as I'm getting older. Yeah, exactly. I think this is what happens as we get older, is we understand what love really is. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. yeah oh god i i think you know it's interesting i i got chills uh at certain parts of that because in what she just said she echoed the story that you just gave us yeah you know the highs and the my mom's sick man oh hold on my mom she's so good yeah yeah so um one place within the kind of this category of mental health that we didn't yet talk about but you've definitely mentioned throughout this is anxiety.

1:21:09What I've noticed with me trying to deal with anxiety is, you know, in essence, it's like your amygdala in your brain, right? Essentially being in the state of fear all the time. And when you're in fear all the time, it throws everything off. Like you can't focus, you can't emotionally connect. And it's one of those where I'm consciously trying to talk myself out of it but i see how it's almost destroyed many good things in my life yeah me too so yeah so how is it impacted how has anxiety impacted you it's just this little i mean it's impacted me in a lot of ways but the one that's been the most prominent is it's just this little shit voice in my head that's just been a prick all the time i describe it as like a stranger in my head who i don't even know it's like it steers me away from my needs and my wants and what I actually want to do and goes yeah but here's what you should do here's what you should do do this trust me do this please do this now do this like and then if I don't it's like well you're a prick you're shit why are you not doing that you're an old bed and like I've really really as I say felt in the past few years with like jealousy and then having to go and sometimes I've given into that I've made videos I know are not as good as I could have made because I thought these would get more views and if I get more views then I'll feel happy and if I feel happy then I'll feel happy and I won't be able to worry but as long as I get and it's like no obviously you won't feel happy it's a lot about I've been reading it in this ADHD book it says you know you should like if you're feeling pain that's alright you need to focus on what makes you feel good whereas I think what anxiety does is makes you focus on what will stop the pain and so for me a lot of things that stop the pain is getting hit of dopamine from getting a load of views or or it's so stupid.

1:23:01I hate how I'm grounded. I actually feel like a knobhead saying it, but I hate that that is such a prominent thing in my life. I just think it's ridiculous, because I know it's not true. And when I meet all these people, I do this gig called Tomedy to 90 people. It's the most special time of my month when I'm on there. I met like 100 people every show for a meet and greet, and I connect with people so quick. I love it and I love hearing people's stories and I like I genuinely like the people who are my audience I have so much love for them and not in like a because I know them way but like when I meet them and I chat with them they're my people and it's this amazing thing where like I can't believe because I don't feel real until it is real I don't feel real until someone's coming up to me being like I got diagnosed with depression saying we could do this helped I just don't like even the fact that I feel like I'm just chatting to you now and like maybe one or two people will hear this the idea that like 100 ,000 people will hear my, is that mental?

1:24:02I don't, it just spins me out. You know what's interesting? I forget people hearing this. Yeah, we've been talking. I forget, man. Is that when people tell their story, typically, what they try to do is they try to create this heart, this arc that ends on this high. Like, I'm the greatest as a result of this. Yeah, not me, mate. You actually, you actually took us up to the pinnacle of the mountain. and then you brought us down and you said, this is me. But I hope in a couple of years when my stand-up is better, because I'm nowhere near as good as I want to be, but when I have a tight hour that's properly me as Tom Simons, do you know what I mean?

1:24:44And it's like coming from my art, I think that will be my high because I'll be connecting with people again. It'll be true and I'll be as good. But I'm very happy for the next couple of years to be a lot more niche and just let people grow with me. I mean, you don't always have to be at a high. But I think you actually are in the high zone now because you resonate the most now. That's good. Your story, everything that you mentioned, feeling crap days, having the anxiety, you know, all of those. I feel all of those. Really? You know, I can resonate with that. I can't resonate with having 10 million subs.

1:25:20Me neither. you know but i can resonate with comparing myself to someone even in this day yeah you know happens all the time you know on the podcast charts i'm thinking oh my gosh we should be higher we should it's this constant comparing and when we compare we despair at some point you have to go who am i doing this for because i'm not doing this for me anymore i'm doing this because i'm scared exactly do you know what's mad and this is what spins me out is you see it's exact same thing i felt at school is that same thing of like the cool kids are and now i feel like i'm the cool kids are over there and i'm not one of the cool kids anymore and all i need to remember is yeah but i never wanted to be in the first place i just want to be around freddy and my mates and having a good laugh it's funny recently i've ended up um one of my mates they have two little siblings who like um i was teaching them to play minecraft i just nearly i was like this is the most amazing thing and i was just oh i forgot what it's like to be a kid you almost learn more from them than they do from you but i think i've put way way too much weight on my career instead of my life the past few years yeah it's been nice these past six months to really after after the tour to go right let's sort my life out like i have been i'm going gym i've been making my house nice i bought myself a nice painting from a room and i've been my mum's been coming down from nottingham and she's helping me do my house my two roommates are moving out now so i'm gonna have this house for myself but also i'm gonna be able to make it completely mine i bought a nice piano and finally with this money I'm starting to like go right I'm going to buy a piano because that's all I want is a piano I'm going to buy a really nice painting that reminds me of home and I'm just like slowly and I always ring my mum before I spend any money because I get really stressed spending money I hate it I hate spending money but like I probably need to figure out that relationship with that but yeah there's definitely a tenuous relationship yeah because I know I don't need I know I really don't like need to be I also would really like to give the charity more but I just am like no I don't want to spend money and I really feel bad about that.

1:27:18I'd really like to figure that out and also start raising some more money for charity and stuff because I've done a lot of work with Sarcoma now since Technopass. I raised a couple hundred grand for them and that was amazing but I'd like to do a lot. I feel like I'm not doing enough. Yeah. You know what, Tom? We're going to need a part two. Yeah, you reckon? Yeah, we're going to need a part two in particular because you are swimming across to that next boat. And in a couple years, this will be well sick. Yeah. So when you are in that boat, We're going to need to have another conversation. And you know what I most appreciate about this time with you is that you are telling, you are describing how I believe most of us feel.

1:28:02That's good. There is like, I always say like there's the Instagram photo and then there's the, there's actually what happened to get to that Instagram photo. what oftentimes we hear on television a lot of pods is the instagram photo oh yeah not me mate what you just explained to us is is actually what is happening yeah and and there's a there's a final question i have but one more before the final yeah it's funny sorry no no please but like i literally chat like this if anyone like i got i was in la before my la show and these two viewers came up to me and they were like oh we love your podcast and your videos and i was chatting with them i just chatted them for like an hour and a half i just told them all this as well because they just were asking and i asked about them and they told me all about them but i love connecting with people and i do it this is what my mate said to me the day is i'm so good at doing it so deeply so quick but i think it's because i'm all right being vulnerable of our own people i have no like because i think comedy teaches you to embrace your vulnerabilities yes i've gotten a lot better at that so i'm happy just like being open yes i sort of love it it's very empowering when you decide i'm going to be open about everything you're like and i think all my mates having all these secrets and it all coming out my response to that was i'm gonna have any secrets it's really scary but also but it feels like i'm actually empowering it is it is so how would you today yeah how would you describe yourself today in terms of how you feel within yourself who who who is tom today oh well i don't know i like hanging out who i'm i'm me i'm i like having fun i like relaxing and being in nature and i like really really like performance i really deeply care about art i love my family i love my friends i love like my audience i love chatting i love chatting the most that's the thing i love chatting literally i've always always been my number one favorite thing is chatting yes i've done this since i was little yeah notice you notice you didn't say anything about youtube yeah and that would have been everything that you would have said just five years ago yeah that's interesting that's interesting i think it's good progress yes i'm getting there you're getting there all right so the last question everyone gets this all right and that is if you think through all of the incredible conversations you've had throughout life so far yeah right what was the most memorable conversation who was it with and what did you learn

1:30:29probably like sat next to freddy by that river in wales that was the best one i think or after i did my palladium show like me and my ex-partner molly we just sat and chatted uh and and what in that conversation say with molly after the palladium gig yeah what was your lesson what did you take away from that just like and same with freddy really and same with like you know i've been like seeing someone else and i've had lots of chats with them now and you just go oh yeah this is what's important like this you know people human love it's love at the end of the day love is number one yes which sounds a bit hippie but you know i mean like you're not gonna the reason youtube is in one is because i loved it stand up someone because i loved it and that's the thing that will pull you out of anything is if you love a person and you can and love and connection really and also nature like the three best things man so if you love some it you know and that and with freddy and also just i've had a million chats with my mom and dad me and my dad always have these long drives and have amazing long chats me and my mom always stay up late whenever i go to nottingham and chat for like hours like just over years i've just had so many phenomenal chats with Even people who I'm not fond of now, like, I've had such great connections with and such long chats, and I don't take them for granted.

1:31:51And really, I'd say it's that, really, and it's that, you know, that's the most important thing in the world, is connecting with people. Yes. Because that's what, you know, and this is why I remind myself, like, none of it's coming with you, you know, when you die. And when Tento passed, I remember him getting 100 million views on that video and wanted to go texting him, Tento, you've got 100 million views on your video. And he's not going to see that. He's dead. As romantic of an idea as I is, I do think it's just like you have to stay to your heart because there's no point otherwise. And your heart's going to change and grow and you are.

1:32:23But all the times in my life that have been the best are when I've, you know, cleared away all the bullshit and just tried to be myself. You know what I thank you the most for? Yeah. Is I thank you for being a voice that says it's okay not to be okay. Yeah, of course. Why in it? Why fib? Yeah. What's the point in fibbing? I mean, but that is predominantly what I think is what you see today. And when I monitor a lot of the content from my boys, I mean, most of it is horrendous. It's terrible. It's atrocious, right? But it is not allowing them, I think, to understand that it is okay not to be okay.

1:33:06Yeah. And I thank you for being a voice that stands on that. I don't think you have to take. you just you know andrew tate and all these lads like you just get all these people just with these skewed horrible views of what it means to be a bloke or what it means to even be a person and all these ideas and it's like the world's turned into a casino because the first time in australia i went to this casino and that was when i was like oh this is youtube this is how i can voice it and it's the idea that if you win a jackpot it's going to solve some emptiness in you and it's not and that thing i felt at school of not fitting in and not feeling cool it's been seven years i still feel it it hasn't solved anything i've just been like putting it off and the way to solve it is you know those moments that you actually care about and that you love and you know and you're never going to be on your deathbed like you know what though i'm glad i was cool like no you want to be glad that you had love and and had a happy time absolutely and you remember those times and those moments with your family and your friends in particular the people that you love most yeah yeah so that is it that is it we'll have a part two when you're in the new boat.

1:34:08I think the new boat's going to be like a yacht for you. Well, you never know. That'll be good. Yeah. I think you'd be good with a rowboat actually. Yeah. Yeah. But, but, but I could see you, I could see you in something else. But man, I mean, thank you so much for having me. This has been such a wonderful platform to get across how I've been feeling and you've directed me, you know, you made me feel so comfortable and warm and I never would be able to say this on my podcast or on my videos. And you've got this out of I mean, I'll probably sit in the car in the back and go, did I fucking really talk about being jealous of my show screen?

1:34:39Am I stupid? Why would I say that? You know, this was the most consistently you I think I've ever seen you. Wow, thank you. And this is now me knowing you and me researching you. Yeah. This is you. I think we have seen Tom Simons. Oh, yeah, man. We've seen you fully. You've seen me. yes yeah and you know what and we like what we see i like what i see oh that's good imagine you like yeah and you're a twat and you're a nomad and you are a dick yeah no well thank you

1:35:20as he said not tommy in it it was tom today i know that among my sons and their friends that kind of gossip of who's done what on the Dream SMP is of high importance to them. That was a question that they wanted me to ask. I thought Tom was quite respectful about some of the controversies facing some of the other YouTubers, but it's clear that he has distanced himself from those and doesn't have any friendships, it appears, among that group anymore. I love Tom's vulnerability. What I see time and time again from reading about comedians is how comedy is born from a place of pain, place of trauma.

1:36:12And this is, I think, what's happening with Tom. I think Tom will be an incredible comedian. Not just because I think he's a funny guy, right, just naturally funny, but because he's committed to being vulnerable about life. And that's what we want from our comedians. You know, I think we want to see a reflection of life through their experience. And that's what Tom is providing. Where do you think Tommy Innet will be in 21 years time? in 21 years. Oh my gosh. He'll only be 40, he'll be 42 years old. I don't know where Tommy and it will be in 21 years, but my hope is that he's happy.