Why Most People Are Having Bad Sex (and how to fix it)

4:30Susan Bratton:Okay. All the things. And let's even park there, right? Yeah. So what is sex?

4:36Paul C. Brunson:Yeah. In my opinion, what sex is, is intimate connection and pleasure. And I'd go so far as to say orgasmic pleasure because there's a very big distinction physiologically between how much health benefits you get from intimacy, oxytocin creation, skin-on-skin contact, co-regulation, and hot orgasmic bliss states of ecstasy, right? That's even better. That's really good. They're so good. And you can get there with kissing, breast pleasuring, genital pleasuring, oral pleasuring, intercourse. I mean, there are over 20 kinds of orgasms the human body can have, and they are all learned skills.

5:23Susan Bratton:So you're saying that you can have an orgasm just through kissing?

5:27Paul C. Brunson:Oh, God, yeah. Oh, very much so. Really? Just through breast pleasuring. I can have a coregasm. I can have a footgasm. I can have a female ejaculatory orgasm. I can have a think-off. I can literally be erotically hypnotized, and I can have orgasms on command under hypnosis. Yes. So what I've done over the last two decades that I've been writing the recipes for hot sex is that I've been systematically achieving having these types of orgasms. And as I figure out how to do it, what the pathways are to it, I write the directions down so that people can have them with, You know, not with me, but have them too.

6:12Paul C. Brunson:Have them like I have them. So many women think that they're just not the kind of person who can have an orgasm from intercourse. So they no longer want to have intercourse. So, you know, then the couple stops having regular pleasure because they think of sex being so narrowly defined as intercourse. Right. And she thinks there's something wrong with her rather than the fact that all we ever see in our culture is pictures, movies, stories that are oriented toward the way a penis and a testosterone-dominant human person likes sensation. and what I like to do is I like to teach what the vulva owners need as well.

7:01Paul C. Brunson:And it's nobody's fault that we don't know it. We are coming out of a lot of religious repression, a lot of shame, lack of sex education, pleasure-based female-focused sex education. There's very little sexual literacy, as we talked earlier. There's a lot of censorship of what I can even – I can't even use the words vagina, vulva, penis, clitoris without putting asterisks. I joke that the story of my life is going to be called SEGS, S-E-G-G-S, you know, like the movie about Susan Bratton. The title is SEGS. Trying to teach pleasure in the age of mass censorship, you know.

7:46Susan Bratton:Which is incredible. I mean, even thinking about that, why do you think that all of these words are censored? Like, why would clitoris or vagina be censored?

7:57Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

8:02Paul C. Brunson:Well, it's a political discussion that I probably don't want to get into on a show about pleasure.

8:08Susan Bratton:Wow. Okay. Yeah. All right. Fair enough. Fair enough. That says it all right there. This says it all. So, a yoni. Yoni is the vulva.

8:18Paul C. Brunson:It's internal, external. It's the vagina, it's the urethral sponges, the clitoral sponges, the perineal sponge, the outer labia, the inner labia, the mons venus, the clitoral shaft, the clitoral tip, the perineal area, the foreshad. These are all different locations and different types of tissue in the yoni. Yoni is the kind of a word that I like. Like, you know, some people call it their kitty or different things like that, their flower, and all of them are very pretty. I tend to like to teach the word yoni because it comes from tantric lovemaking, which is a very heart-connected kind of lovemaking.

8:56Paul C. Brunson:We look in each other's eyes. We breathe together. We're connected in our hearts. We're connected in our body. It's really a more spiritual, less friction, and more connection, which is what I like. That's the kind of lovemaking. techniques that I like to teach are removing it from role play or, you know, feeling like there's a performance and moving it into, I don't know where you start and I end in our ecstatic pleasure together.

9:26Susan Bratton:I see.

9:27Paul C. Brunson:And so I think that that's a really nice word that's comprehensive because vagina, to me, that's very male oriented because it's just the part you put your penis in. When actually all my action, like 60 % of my action starts on the outside. On the outside.

9:44Susan Bratton:This is such a good point. So I remember teaching my sons the difference between a vulva and a vagina.

9:52Paul C. Brunson:Good. Thanks, Dad.

9:53Susan Bratton:Thank you.

9:54Paul C. Brunson:Dad award. Yay! I got it. I got it.

9:57Susan Bratton:I got it. And it was because I saw, and I think the research shows that 70... You going to break my heart on this one? I'm going to break your heart right now. You may cry right now.

10:10Paul C. Brunson:Are there tissues? Okay, I'm ready.

10:13Susan Bratton:Okay, get ready. 73 % of women in the UK said they do not know what a vulva is.

10:21Paul C. Brunson:Right, right, right.

10:22Susan Bratton:Right. So you think about that. That means it's 99 % of men. Right? And so I remember seeing something along those lines. So I started teaching them the difference. Good. So now, talking about pleasure.

10:34Paul C. Brunson:Yeah, yeah.

10:35Susan Bratton:What is an orgasm?

10:36Paul C. Brunson:It's a couple of different things. Primarily, it's a contraction. And because lovemaking is so co-regulating, oxytocin is one of the nicest things that you generate. Like, the body is flooded with oxytocin with lovemaking. And one of the things that's kind of neat about oxytocin is that it works on, and I just learned this, like, yesterday, that it's a contractile hormone.

11:02Susan Bratton:Okay.

11:02Paul C. Brunson:And that made a lot of sense to me because contraction is a big part of orgasm. You know, when you have the, you know, when you're like, when you calm, you, you know, there's a contraction there. And so oxytocin helps with orgasmic response as well as locking the blood flow into the erectile tissue, especially of the penis. All right. Nerd, nerd alert.

11:31Susan Bratton:I mean, this is good. I know. I like it. So the contraction happens as a result of the oxytocin.

11:36Paul C. Brunson:Yeah, that's a big, big help is oxytocin.

11:39Susan Bratton:All right. So that makes it the... What about excreting any fluids? Is that part of the orgasm as well?

11:46Paul C. Brunson:Yeah. So there's a lot of things that happen during an orgasm. There's a neurotransmitter cascade. There's a hormone cascade. There's a contraction and a release that's very nervous system rebooting. There's all kinds of things. Like literally, when you have an orgasm, you release NK cells, natural killer cells. Natural killer cells are the little cells that gang up like Pac-Man in your bloodstream and eat precancerous cells and senescent cells, the zombie cells that the longevity people speak about. I mean, this is why I talk a lot about how if you extend your sex span, you extend your health span and your happiness span because you're getting the oxytocin, you're getting the dopamine, you're getting the serotonin, you're getting all these things.

12:35Paul C. Brunson:So an orgasm is both the...there's a lot of pathways from your genitals or all parts of your body, like there's Rafini nerve endings and Carpinian corpuscles and mechanoreceptors, and there's all these little cellular signals that are sending pleasure signals to your brain. Your brain is your biggest sex organ because it's processing sensation and telling you, oh, that feels good, right? Like that's what it's doing.

13:06Susan Bratton:Yes.

13:07Paul C. Brunson:So all this stuff's happening concurrently in your body. So having oxytocin and having intimacy and holding hands and things like that, they're all great. As a matter of fact, one of my favorite things about oxytocin is that it makes you less annoyed with people.

13:22Susan Bratton:Oh, my goodness.

13:23Paul C. Brunson:Could we all use a little bit more of that right now? Like, let's go. Give me a double shot of oxytocin, right?

13:29Susan Bratton:So you're saying we all need more orgasms in our life. Yes, because it creates empathy as well as joy and co-regulation.

13:37Paul C. Brunson:You like people better, not just your spouse or your partner or your lover or whatever, but you actually like people better. You think nature's more beautiful and painting and art and music are more beautiful. Food tastes better.

13:53Susan Bratton:Connected to oxytocin, obviously, orgasms. Yeah. Would you suggest that there is an optimal number of orgasms we should be having? So, for example, one a day. Is that enough? Is that too much? That's a low bar. That's a low bar. Are you serious?

14:07Paul C. Brunson:I mean, you can come for hours. I mean, you can just roll through orgasms.

14:15Susan Bratton:Men as well.

14:16Paul C. Brunson:Yes. All 20 kind of orgasms are available to the male and female body. Okay. We have this thing. It's called homologous parts.

14:22Susan Bratton:You've listed at least 50 words. I have no idea how to spell.

14:26Paul C. Brunson:I like the science of sex. I can see it. And I think it really does help people get connected to it a little more and open to it. Like when they realize, oh, this is really important to my life. You know, like if I really want to have a good, long, healthy, happy life. So for me, I'm 64 right now and I'm having the absolute best sex of my life. I have orgasms so easily in so many ways. And I've been 20 years ago, I got into doing what I do because I wasn't having any orgasms at all. and I'd had sex with my husband for 11 years and I was avoiding him for sex because I didn't have orgasms. I didn't think I could.

15:08Paul C. Brunson:He didn't think I could. But he's do want to have sex anyway, right? That's just how it is in so many places because we don't know that we could just learn how to do it.

15:17Susan Bratton:And that in itself I think is a myth that we should unpack is if I have not had an orgasm...

15:24Paul C. Brunson:Yet.

15:25Susan Bratton:Yet.

15:25Paul C. Brunson:That's the word.

15:26Susan Bratton:It means I cannot have an orgasm in the future.

15:30Paul C. Brunson:No, you can always have an orgasm in the future. You just have it. Yeah. You just need to learn how.

15:34Susan Bratton:Okay. And even if I haven't had it for 10 years, in your example, you haven't had it. Okay.

15:39Paul C. Brunson:Yeah, of course. It's just learning the pathways and training your body to feel sensation and being able to stay in sensation.

15:46Susan Bratton:Okay. Now, you mentioned it was, what, 10 or 11 years with your husband that you had never had an orgasm.

15:54Paul C. Brunson:From intercourse.

15:55Susan Bratton:From intercourse.

15:56Paul C. Brunson:And I couldn't, I could have one with a vibrator, which was great. So I knew I could get there. But, and this was back in the old days when the vibrators weren't so good. I brought you some really great stuff to show you. Oh, did you? Yeah, yeah, yeah. You've improved. Oh man, I mean like literally one of the things that I brought to show you today, I'm having a whole new level of orgasmic intercourse. And I thought I was already like an Olympic gold, I'm an Olympic gold medals orgasmer. and I'm like whatever is beyond category now. Like a crazy.

16:28Susan Bratton:All right, we are going to get to that. We're going to get to that vibrator. Just me more. But in that, what I want to get to also is that so 11 year period, no orgasm through penetration. A survey of over 2 ,000 people found that 68 % of women admitted to faking orgasms. 27 % of men said that they fake orgasm. women I know have I think what is it roughly 80 % or more of women have had sex with their partner without the desire to have sex although that's slightly different

17:06Paul C. Brunson:that number could be low there's a lot of what we like to call doody booty going on daddy I used to call it mercy sex and then somebody was like oh I call that doody booty I'm like stealing it

17:20Susan Bratton:okay so you say virtually All women are handing out some doody booty at some time.

17:25Paul C. Brunson:Most women are.

17:26Susan Bratton:Most women are. Most women are. So this was you.

17:28Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

17:29Susan Bratton:You were handing. And so what then inspires you to then continue to have sex if you're not having the orgasm? Is it simply for the pleasure of your husband?

17:43Paul C. Brunson:Because you think you should. Because he's a miserable bastard. If you don't. Because he's Dr. Grumpy Land. because, you know, it's easier just to submit to it. Like, there's just a lot of that out there. Or women who are like, well, it makes me close to him or whatever, you know, like they've kind of justified it. They just think they can't, but they're supposed to, right? And it's my job. Like, I have a commitment to him. All right. So when you were in that space, what did you do to pivot out of that?

18:13Susan Bratton:And then how did you finally get the orgasm through penetration?

18:18Paul C. Brunson:Yeah. Yeah. It was really a couple of things. The first was that Tim and I, and now I've been married to this man for 34 years. I've been with him longer than I haven't. We crested over about four years ago. So he's my life partner. And we've been through thick and thin. We've lost money together. We've been almost dead together. We've done everything. So like there ain't nothing I don't get through with that man, which is great. But what really helped us was a friend of mine, Tabor. He worked for Brad Blanton, who wrote the book Radical Honesty. And he was like, you guys just really need to start telling the truth.

18:53Paul C. Brunson:Like, it would be super helpful in your marriage. You're struggling. And we started telling the truth. And we had to unlearn all of the ways that our society and culture teaches us to lie. Walking on eggshells, withholding, you know, letting things go even though they bother you, stuffing things, white lies, you know, omission of detail. Oh, gosh. I mean, you know how Santa unfurls his list?

19:17Susan Bratton:And it just rolls.

19:18Paul C. Brunson:And it just rolls to like around the universe. Like that's how many things we have in our culture around not telling our truth. Right. And that's oppression. I am an anti-oppression person in every aspect of my life. I like to uncover where oppression exists, remove the shame, and then allow people to live into their potential. And one of the biggest places to do that is your sexuality. And the other one is in just speaking your truth. And the hardest part isn't really me telling you my truth. The hardest part is like catching yourself how much you begin to realize how much you've covered up your true desires.

20:01Paul C. Brunson:And you think it's going to sound mean to tell your truth. When in reality, and my husband is super solid. You know, I have a strong personality and he just loves who I am. And he's like, is that all you got, baby? Give me some more.

20:18Susan Bratton:Okay.

20:18Paul C. Brunson:So he's hungry for everything I have in every aspect. So I was lucky that way.

20:23Susan Bratton:Do you recall that conversation?

20:25Paul C. Brunson:Yeah. We decided to become radically honest. We practiced radical honesty. And there were times when I would tell him, you know, when you enter me, my turn-on just goes down. Like it literally just, it's like my turn-on got clubbed by your penis. I just don't know why that is, but it's just like a down. And so he was like, oh, okay, well, let's make it an up. What do we need to do? And the second thing we did was we went to therapists, and that was helpful for some aspects of our relating. Okay. But what was really helpful for dealing with his frustration at me, and it was really helpful for me in some of the trauma that had happened to me.

21:12Paul C. Brunson:But what really helped was going to sex workshops. Okay. And we went to them, and they were so scary. I mean, on the way there, I'd have to get out of the car, and I'd have to, like, jump around and, like, you know, like, just, you know, it was, like, so edgy for me. I'd never even looked at my own vulva at that point. Like, I'd never been like, what's the little look like? I'd never done that. So I was really like, pretty much everybody is super shy about sex, didn't have the words for it, you know, and so this was very edgy. We went to the sex workshops and we learned what to do. And one of the things we learned was an expanded orgasm practice, which is basically a yoni massage with a very light clitoral stroking.

21:54Paul C. Brunson:And what that helped me do was begin to stay in sensation. When you go to a therapist, a sex therapist, one of the very common modalities that they'll work on is helping you stay in the feeling of pleasure because we tend to just we leave the scene.

22:15Susan Bratton:We check out.

22:16Paul C. Brunson:You know, we just go numb. And so learning how to stay in sensation was a very, very important part of this for me because I would dissociate because it was bringing me down because it wasn't pleasurable. It felt weird to me. And so we went to the sex workshops and boom, ignition. Like I started coming. We started having a blast. Then I was like, now I want to try this. Oh, I want to de-armor my G-spot. I want to try female ejaculation. I want to learn this. I want to learn that. And we just went on this journey and we realized, my gosh, Most people aren't going to spend the money to get naked at a sex workshop and learn what to do.

22:52Susan Bratton:That's inspirational because you and your husband, you had to be brave. You had to be brave. And I think that there's a reluctance to be brave, to face the hard stuff. I feel like the harder stuff that we face, the higher quality of life we get.

23:09Paul C. Brunson:One of the things that I think is super helpful for people is to have a sex life bucket list.

23:18Susan Bratton:Interesting. Okay.

23:19Paul C. Brunson:To have a little list somewhere. I mean, wherever you want to keep that list, right? In your spank bank or on the refrigerator on a post-it note. It doesn't really matter. But what are you guys learning? or even as a solo pleasurer, if you're not partnered, but you're solo pleasuring to increment your pleasure and orgasmic capacity. Okay. Right? You're expanding your orgasmic potential. You're learning orgasmic activation. So as you're doing that, what are the kinds of things you want to learn? What experiences do you want to have? And I like to call those erotic playdates. They're different than, like, if I said you should have sex, people would be like, okay, well, we already do that really well.

24:01Paul C. Brunson:Okay, well, what about an expanded orgasm practice? What about learning yoni and lingam massage? Lingam is the word for the penis like yoni is the word for the vulvovaginal system. Lingam. It's a nice word. It sounds good, too. Lingam, yeah. It sounds like it wants a lick to me, doesn't it?

24:17Susan Bratton:It does.

24:17Paul C. Brunson:Lapping lingams. I mean, it just all sounds so good. Yes. Yeah.

24:23Susan Bratton:What's on your sex bucket list now, Susan?

24:25Paul C. Brunson:Oh, God. There's constantly new things. But I'll tell you, one of the things that I've been doing recently is I've been having remote sex dates with my partner. So we travel a fair amount, like he's in Nashville right now presenting some patent ideas. Well, I'm here in L.A. talking to you. Yes. And so we have really hot remote pleasuring dates together. And I brought some tech to show you. So how do you do this? Can you? You want me to show you right now? Absolutely. Let's get right into it. So this is a stroker. A stroker? This is a stroker. And it is... I can't get the lid off. This is a stroker.

25:06Paul C. Brunson:And I did release the vacuum. And it's a vulva, right? It's a vulva. And a penis goes inside here with some lubricant.

25:16Susan Bratton:Oh, so he would have the stroker? Yes.

25:20Paul C. Brunson:He has the stroker. and I have these two products. This is the Pro Wand and this is called the Pearl 3. And the entire thing, let me turn it on for you. The entire thing, this whole thing vibrates and creates sensation. Now I charged this earlier, so I know I wasn't to hold. There we go. I'm like, come on, girl, you charged this earlier.

25:48Susan Bratton:And then also, Susan, just for audio listeners, what are you holding?

25:52Paul C. Brunson:So I'm holding what's called a vibrating vaginal massage product. Okay. So this has three little bumps on it for the G-spot, but the entire thing vibrates. Let me see. Oh, wow.

26:08Susan Bratton:Look at, feel that.

26:09Paul C. Brunson:So that feels really good inside the vagina because the vagina wants to kind of like chew on things a little. It wants something to grip. It wants something to play with. You can push the button, it'll go up a few more, and it'll do patterns, things like that. Oh my goodness!

26:26Susan Bratton:This is pretty intense.

26:28Paul C. Brunson:It is a very nice sensation. You want to start low and work your way up.

26:32Susan Bratton:Oh my goodness!

26:33Paul C. Brunson:This is like super speed! I know. F1 racer. Okay. And what's nice about it is that it will synchronize through the app to the stroker. And the stroker has another chamber you can put on it called the keyon, and it'll automatically stroke your penis hands-free. It even comes with a pillow with a little strap on it. And so my husband can lie there and have his penis be pleasured in here and he's using the app to control it.

27:04Susan Bratton:I see.

27:04Paul C. Brunson:I'm on video and he's on video on the app and I'm feeling what he's feeling in his penis inside my vagina. Let me turn it on for you. Hang on. Here, you can turn the buttons up this way. Okay, let me see. One on the end, the furthest one from your thumb. And that's really good for using all on the outside of the vulva because underneath the outer labia...

27:31Susan Bratton:Oh my goodness, the speed of this.

27:34Paul C. Brunson:That's a nice motor. And so what's so interesting is that I've had literally a new kind of orgasm from the experience of our remote lovemaking. We have great communication. We don't mind if it takes a minute to get things set up. We're having fun together. But I had a new kind of an orgasmic sensation from feeling what feels good to his penis in my vagina. So the clitoris, most people know that it's like an 80-20 kind of a thing where 20 % of the clitoris is external.

28:11Susan Bratton:Yes.

28:12Paul C. Brunson:The little nub and the little shaft that you see, it's the same as the penis. This is the homologous tissue. Yes. We have the same parts, but they're in slightly different configuration. But they started out the same and then they just grew differently in utero based on hormones, chromosome, et cetera.

28:31Susan Bratton:Yes, yes.

28:31Paul C. Brunson:And the outer labia have the legs of the clitoris under them. The top of the inside of the vagina has not just G-spot. It's not a spot. It's a long tube of erectile tissue. It's the same one that runs down your penis on the bottom. You know how you've got that one tube on the bottom of your penis and then you've got the two along the top?

28:54Susan Bratton:This is what makes up the G-spot. Yeah, I did not realize.

28:58Paul C. Brunson:That spongy tube. And the clitoral arms kind of travel beside it. So there's tons of nerve endings. And then there's a third spongy tissue on the bottom of the vagina between the floor of the vagina and the top of the anal cavity.

29:14Susan Bratton:You know what? And I think if I can ask this is some people are going to hear that and say, that's bizarre.

29:21Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

29:21Susan Bratton:Right. Now, I think I'm at a point where I have been interested enough in sex toys to look at this and say, no, this is the future.

29:31Paul C. Brunson:It is.

29:32Susan Bratton:But what is your response to those that say, no, this actually is not good. We're now in a place that is unnatural and we shouldn't be using this type of tech.

29:44Paul C. Brunson:This would be a good place for me to show you what the vagina wants. Can I do that?

29:49Susan Bratton:Okay, absolutely. Absolutely.

29:50Paul C. Brunson:So, and then I want to come back to your question about why it's beneficial, not scary. Okay. So, and these devices, all these devices connect to, so what I've been talking about is haptics and teledildonics. I'm going to give you the vocabulary. Oh, my God. Okay. Haptics is the feeling. Oh, I could feel it in my vagina. That's the haptics. It's the sensation, the pulsation, the vibration, the oscillation, all those things. Okay. The teledildonics is the remoteness, the remote aspect. And that could also be called synchronized remote sexuality. So those are many words for this. Remember before we started and I was talking about how some people are visual learners?

30:34Paul C. Brunson:Some people are auditory. Some people are more kinesthetic. And some people are more visual learners. Well, kinesthetic learners, like I can tell you my Taoist thrusting technique, thrust in time. I can tell you it's a 10 count. It's shallow strokes and deep strokes and how to do it and all that stuff. But if you put your penis in here and you feel what I'm actually telling you to do, then you're like, oh, I got it. So that's the place we're going is that you can currently hook to adult video, but you are going to soon also be able to learn how to make better love, how to have orgasmic intercourse, orgasmic oral pleasuring, yoni massage, all of these things, toggling, peeking, touching for rapture.

31:24Paul C. Brunson:I have so many techniques.

31:26Susan Bratton:And how long can you now hold an orgasm?

31:29Paul C. Brunson:I mean, I can come for, you know, I can come for an hour straight from light, delicate clitorals. Are you serious? Yeah, I mean, you just learn how to sensation. You just ride the sensation. You can just come and come and come. For an hour? Easy. I just, I got to have a drink of water. I got to take a rest. That's all.

31:50Susan Bratton:You are an Olympian.

31:51Paul C. Brunson:I am, but everybody is. But everyone is. And thank you for having me. because people, if they know these things, they'll be like, well, all right, I'm like, I'm doing it. You know?

32:01Susan Bratton:Does it reach a point, though, where it's too long?

32:04Paul C. Brunson:No. No. And I don't usually come for an hour. We have to move positions and things like that. But I will have an extended lovemaking experience that will include, often, it'll include yoni and lingon massage. It'll include breast pleasuring because kissing and breast pleasuring, your body, there's a pyramid, a three-axis pyramid of arousal that includes your lips and tongue, your mouth and throat, your breasts and nipples for men as well. Men just don't think they can have it, but they can. We have the same bodies. Many men are very orgasmic from nipplegasms. And anybody can learn how. And then the genital system.

32:45Paul C. Brunson:And when you start to kiss, that starts the letdown, the release, And then stimulating the breasts and nipples, that really helps get the blood flowing into the genitals because we need blood flow to fill up the tissue. Yes. To have more surface area to send the signals to our biggest sex organ, our brain.

33:09Susan Bratton:Our brain. Wow. Look at that. Look at that.

33:11Paul C. Brunson:So on this note, because you're talking about ejaculation, premature ejaculation is a topic that a lot of men don't want to talk about.

33:20Susan Bratton:Yes. But it is an issue.

33:22Paul C. Brunson:It's the number one issue of men.

33:23Susan Bratton:Is it?

33:23Paul C. Brunson:Yes. And I would actually put it in the category of performance anxiety, like generalized anxiety. And there are a number of things that you can do, techniques that help you become more present. Because often what happens to men, you guys are the best. You want to please us so much. You'd do anything to give us pleasure. You'd give up your pleasure for our pleasure, you know? Men have been painted as being so selfish and, you know, it's all for them or what have you. And it's not. They just don't know what to do. And that's why I love what I do because I love to tell men how to give their partners incredible pleasure.

34:02Paul C. Brunson:And a part of it is that they get the performance anxiety because they're thinking about something that happened last time that didn't go well or they're catastrophizing what could happen. And they're not present and in their body. And so a lot of premature ejaculation is solo pleasuring too fast, too hard, and then they kind of get into that routine. Some of it is just they're very, very sensitive. And they have to learn how to manage being overly sensitive. And, you know, just like they can barely even penetrate a woman before they come too fast.

34:40Susan Bratton:Interesting.

34:41Paul C. Brunson:And – but a lot of it is in the big sex organ. It's in the brain, right?

34:47Susan Bratton:It's in the brain. Now, I remember I was talking to Karen Gurney.

34:50Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

34:51Susan Bratton:Out of the UK, sex therapist out of the UK. Great. And we were talking about penis size. Yes. And how that touches upon a lot of anxiety for men. So myth, is this a myth, that penis size matters? Is that myth or fact? Well, the average penis is, you know, five and something, whatever.

35:14Paul C. Brunson:I don't even know. But, you know, like six inches or what have you. And women generally want six inches in a regular partner, seven inches for a hot date.

35:22Susan Bratton:And we're talking about erect.

35:23Paul C. Brunson:Erect. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, the penis is like a little nothing, you know, until all the erectile tissue fills with blood. It's amazing, right? Yes. What it does is just incredible.

35:32Susan Bratton:It is.

35:33Paul C. Brunson:Men have wonderful hemodynamics. I love that word.

35:37Susan Bratton:Hemodynamics. You have words.

35:39Paul C. Brunson:I got words.

35:41Susan Bratton:Oh, my gosh.

35:43Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

35:43Susan Bratton:So this would suggest to me, though, that penis size then does matter.

35:48Paul C. Brunson:Well, I mean, I think for some women it doesn't. And, you know, remember, we have these vaginal caverns that are very interesting, too. I've got to get my balloon out and show you what the vagina wants because the vagina itself is a mucous membrane.

36:03Susan Bratton:Okay.

36:03Paul C. Brunson:And it has this little tiny sphincter muscle at the opening that's called, here's another nerdy word, I'll even say it like a nerd, the entroital sphincter.

36:14Susan Bratton:Entroital sphincter. Entroital sphincter. Entroital sphincter.

36:17Paul C. Brunson:Yeah, it's a little round muscle and it's full of mechanoreceptors that love to feel stretch. So it loves when something takes that little muscle and opens it like a penis. I see. And then it has this kind of really just like a long tubey shaft to it. Okay. And this is where the G-spot is up here and this is where the perineal sponge is down here. So the whole entrance and the early part of the cavern is full of erectile tissue. It's got like a golden bracelet of erectile tissue around the opening and the early entrance to the vagina.

36:58Susan Bratton:Yes.

36:59Paul C. Brunson:But then the vagina itself tense up as you become aroused, which is why foreplay, which I like to consider just to be sex too. Yes. You know, like let's not rush to intercourse. Let's like take our time. Right.

37:11Susan Bratton:And that's controversial even to call it foreplay, you know, for some people. So, but when you become aroused.

37:19Paul C. Brunson:It goes like this and it tense up. Your cervix pulls up. The uterus pulls up. All this extra room gets in there.

37:27Susan Bratton:Okay.

37:27Paul C. Brunson:And the vagina. Okay. So like, can I have your hand? Sure. I'm going to let that go for a second. So when I, if I were to rub you, if I rubbed you and I just rubbed your skin, it feels nice. Like, it's nice. But if I rub the meat of your body, if I like rub in there and get under the skin, it feels better. It feels better. That's good. Right?

37:52Susan Bratton:So you're saying that within the vagina, getting in, this is the key.

37:58Paul C. Brunson:And what the vagina wants is not just the er, er, er, er, er, er. What it wants is you to go spelunking in there. And it wants you not to do... And can I have that, the pearl three, the purple one? Yes. What it wants you to do, and one of the reasons I really like this is that I have activated my vaginal cavern to a whole new level by stroking beyond the vaginal proposal lining into my guts.

38:25Susan Bratton:You know what, Susan, this is a master class right here. That I wish, well, now guys are going to know is the key is not just a basic stroke, fellas. No. The key is that you want to hit all the...

38:39Paul C. Brunson:Yeah, you want to hit that whole cavern. You want to activate the meat around the cavern.

38:44Susan Bratton:So you want to stroke all in here. You want to boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. Yep, hitting it all.

38:50Paul C. Brunson:Yes.

38:50Susan Bratton:Okay.

38:51Paul C. Brunson:Exactly. You want to get everywhere. You want to get that top part. You want to get the cervix. You want to get the deep spots. You want to get the bottom. You want to get the sides. The pedendal nerves. You know when your toes curl from orgasms? Yes, yes. the nerves running down to your feet. And so when you're getting turned on and your toes are curling from orgasms, it's actually those pedendal nerves that are getting activated. So there's tons of nerves in here. Your vagal nerve comes down here. Your pedendal nerve comes in here. And so you're getting nerves and tissue activated. And when you do that, what happens is as you're getting in there and you're activating this all yourself and then your partner's getting in there and activating it all, it all becomes massively more responsive.

39:38Paul C. Brunson:The tissue starts to engorge. It gets pillowy. It gets flush with blood and not just the erectile tissue, but all that tissue. And when it does that, everything plumps up and has more surface area that feels better. and then your contractions. Then it starts, you also start to get really good musculature. You get good pelvic musculature. The more you orgasm, the better your pelvic musculature. And then the squeezing, that contraction becomes more intense. And so here you are now, you're staying in sensation. You're riding the waves. You're coming and coming and coming and coming. It feels good outside, it feels good inside.

40:25Paul C. Brunson:Everything's just like... I mean, if I think about my Volvo vaginal system in my 20s and 30s when I was like young and fresh and everything was active, and it cannot hold a candle to how lush and orgasmic my entire genital system is now. It is nuts how good everything feels.

40:50Susan Bratton:I believe it.

40:51Paul C. Brunson:Just from using tools of pleasure and using techniques. All right.

40:59Susan Bratton:We need to talk about how much noise there is in the new year. Reset, reinvent, rebuild. And what I've found usually goes hand in hand with that is pressure. But this year, how about flipping that pressure into permission to finally try the thing you've been thinking about for months? And not to do it perfectly, but just to start. When I launched my matchmaking business, I was overwhelmed and nervous, but I quickly learned that you don't need all the answers, just the starting point. And that's why I recommend our sponsor Shopify to anyone wanting to build a business where you sell products or services online.

41:35Susan Bratton:Shopify makes the journey easy to start and to keep growing. You get templates to build your store, built-in tools for marketing, and even AI that helps with writing copy and editing photos. You don't need to be a designer or a coder either. Millions of entrepreneurs have already made that first move. So in 2026, stop waiting and start selling with Shopify. Sign up for your one pound per month trial and start selling today at shopify.co.uk slash need to talk. That's shopify.co.uk slash need to talk. My day kicks off with a refreshing Celsius energy drink, then straight to the gym. Pre-K pickup, back home to meal prep.

42:17Susan Bratton:Time for my fire station shift. One more Celsius, gotta keep the lights on. When the three alarm hits, I'm ready. Celsius. Live. Fit. Go. Grab a cold, refreshing Celsius at your local retailer or locate now at Celsius.com. Eczema is unpredictable. But you can flare less with Epglis, a once-monthly treatment for moderate to severe eczema. After an initial four-month or longer dosing phase, about four in ten people taking EBCLIS achieved itch relief and clear or almost clear skin at 16 weeks. And most of those people maintained skin that's still more clear at one year with monthly dosing. EBCLIS, LibriKizumab, LBKZ, a 250 milligram per two milliliter injection, is a prescription medicine used to treat adults and children 12 years of age and older who weigh at least 88 pounds or 40 kilograms with moderate to severe eczema.

43:03Susan Bratton:Also called atopic dermatitis that is not well controlled with prescription therapies used on the skin or topicals or who cannot use topical therapies. EBCLIS can be used with or without topical corticosteroids. Don't use if you're allergic to EBCLIS. Allergic reactions can occur that can be severe. Eye problems can occur. Tell your doctor if you have new or worsening eye problems. You should not receive a live vaccine when treated with EBCLIS.

43:22Paul C. Brunson:Before starting EBCLIS, tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection.

43:26Susan Bratton:Ask your doctor about EBCLIS and visit ebglis.lily.com or call 1-800-LILY-RX or 1-800-545-5979.

43:33Paul C. Brunson:We all have that dream trip we've been wishing we could go on.

43:36Susan Bratton:But too often, life, or usually price, gets in the way. That's why Priceline is here to help you turn your dream trip into reality. With up to 60 % off hotels and up to 50 % off flights, you can book everything you need for your next adventure. Don't just dream about that next trip. Book it with Priceline. Download the Priceline app or visit Priceline.com and book your next trip today. Go to your happy price. Priceline. What other, do you have some more tools over here to help?

44:07Paul C. Brunson:Here's a really good one I should show you right now. This one makes a lot of sense. There's two here that I want to show you, two more. So this one is really, really fun because this is a proximity sensor for your penis. Oh my goodness. So it's not doing anything. It has a magnet in there. All right. But this is a little tiny clitoral vibrator. this little point right here, you wear it. So you know what the mons venus is, right? Or the mons pubis. It's the top. It's the top where the pubic hair is on the top and then it comes down into the outer labia and inner labia and where the pubic hair is basically.

44:47Paul C. Brunson:So the top is called the mons venus. And that really needs a lot of stimulation if you want to maximize your orgasmic capacity, especially in the area of female ejaculation, because that's where a lot of The blood flow and the fluid runs down into the pelvic bowl to activate everything.

45:03Susan Bratton:Okay.

45:03Paul C. Brunson:So this hooks on the mons.

45:06Susan Bratton:Can I say this too? This is so important that if you are, I would say, if you're listening to this conversation right now, it's important to turn on your video.

45:14Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

45:14Susan Bratton:Because you want to see this.

45:16Paul C. Brunson:Yes. So this sticks on the mons and then the little kind of pointy beak comes down onto your clitoral shaft and your clitoral glands, the tip of your clitoris.

45:28Susan Bratton:Okay, I see.

45:28Paul C. Brunson:And as you become more orgasmic and you stimulate your clitoral shaft and glands, it gets bigger and bigger and you get your little lady boner. You want to get a little lady boner. A lady boner. I got a giant lady boner now. Mine just keeps getting bigger and bigger because I do all the sexual biohacking and all kinds of things.

45:46Susan Bratton:Yes.

45:47Paul C. Brunson:And honestly, you feel more pleasure when you have more tissue.

45:50Susan Bratton:I've never even heard it referred to as a lady boner. Yeah. But it's literally a...

45:55Paul C. Brunson:It's a little penis. It's a little penis. Yes. Yeah, it's a little penis. Yeah, we call that big clit energy. I got a lot of BCs.

46:04Susan Bratton:Oh, my gosh. So are we doing this at the same time, though? So you have this. Yes. And this is wrapped around the penis at the same time.

46:10Paul C. Brunson:What's going on? Now, this is also a panty vibrator. So I could wear this, and then we could go out on a date, and you could control the app, and you could give me orgasms during dinner if you want to. And then we could come home, and I could continue to wear it, and we could make love. And there are two ways you can do it. This little thing is really cool because it's this little silicone pad. You can feel it. It's this little silicone pad. Feel that.

46:33Susan Bratton:Oh, yeah. That's sticky.

46:34Paul C. Brunson:It'll stick right on your skin and peel right off your skin, and it goes into these little holes, and you stick it on. Or, and this is what I like to do, you can use this fancy little silicone harness.

46:45Susan Bratton:Oh, I see. Pull it around.

46:47Paul C. Brunson:It just goes right around your hips, and it fits everybody. I've never had anybody say it was too big or too small. It fits like that, and it goes right around your hips. Now, I've got this on. You've got that ring on your penis. And as you're going in toward me, deeper into my vagina, it's revving up the vibrator. And as you come out, it slows down. And remember earlier when I said peeking and toggling and you went toggling? What's toggling?

47:15Susan Bratton:Yes. Your nervous system has a parasympathetic and a sympathetic state. Yes.

47:22Paul C. Brunson:Right?

47:22Susan Bratton:Yes.

47:23Paul C. Brunson:Sympathetic and parasympathetic. Parasympathetic is the rest and digest. Sympathetic is the activated. And when you toggle the pleasure, you go from the two states and that increases the intensity of the pleasure. So as you come into her, she's going, ah, you know, whoa. And then you go out and she's like, oh, and then, oh. And what happens is when you pull away and the sensation dips, her body leans in for more. Yes. And so then she goes up even more. And it's really fun because this is an erotic play date, right? We get this. You put it on. I put it on. We make love. And we're trying something new.

48:05Paul C. Brunson:Yes. And so what's that create? New relationship energy.

48:09Susan Bratton:Yes.

48:10Paul C. Brunson:You know, you're beginning as beginners together. You're feeling like a teenager. You're giggling. and what I always say about trying anything new is do it three times. The first couple times you're really just getting into the groove. By the third time you're starting to get some mastery and you're like, oh yeah, now I know why Suze told me to do that. Oh my God, it was so good. Yes, yes.

48:29Susan Bratton:Does this fit also? I've heard you talk about, you know, there's libido, there's desire, and there's arousal.

48:36Paul C. Brunson:You have such a good memory.

48:37Susan Bratton:Oh, thank you.

48:37Paul C. Brunson:Thank you for doing your homework.

48:38Susan Bratton:I mean, you're out here trying to give us a master, no, a PhD in sex. Who doesn't want that? You know what I mean? Yes. And so there's the three. I would imagine the novelty fits within the arousal as well, like the context. And you want to have that novelty because it just increases everything.

49:01Paul C. Brunson:You need more novelty. Desire is a combination, an equal combination of trust and safety. Like I can be vulnerable with you. Yeah. Right. I feel comfortable with you. You're not going to hurt me. And novelty and variety. Yes. And a lot of couples have plenty of trust and safety and not enough novelty because they're just doing the old in and out. Right. Absolutely. And so these erotic play dates, the sex life bucket list, the like, what do we want to learn? When you have that and you're trying new things together, you are not only increasing your skills, but you're having way more fun.

49:38Susan Bratton:What percentage of people do you think are actually having high-quality sex? Because I would imagine it's a small percentage.

49:45Paul C. Brunson:I would say generally, if I looked at, you know, like over the last 20 years, all of the people who have entered into my world and the people who find me and who want to become better lovers, here's what's the common thread. One is that they know there's more than they know and they have a growth mindset.

50:09Susan Bratton:Okay.

50:09Paul C. Brunson:That's the number one indicator of someone who has the potential to become a better lover. The second thing is that they understand that the more they learn, the better they get. And they are working on getting better in every aspect of their life. So everybody from a bodybuilder to an entrepreneur, those are people that have growth mindsets. Some are physical growth and some are emotional growth and mental growth and business growth and things, but growth mindset. And there are so many people for whom they've been raised in an environment where there's so much shame around sex, so much repression, so many expectations for what they should be doing, that they don't feel like they can break out of that and pursue this, like it would be wrong.

50:57And so it turns out that out of every 100 people, roughly 15 % of people have what it

51:07Paul C. Brunson:takes to be willing to learn how to become a better lover.

51:11Susan Bratton:Only 15 % have what it takes to be... they just have the potential.

51:17Paul C. Brunson:So you're saying the vast majority of people are having low satisfaction sex. Low satisfaction sex. It could be so much more than it is. And a lot of people think that what they have is what it is. And so they don't know there's more. Again, go back to lack of sexual literacy, censorship, everything being very porn dominated. I run a business mastermind for sexperts around the world. People like myself, the people who are coming up behind me, because I've been doing this for a long time. And I'm one of the very few people that has been successful at it over time and figured out how to get beyond all of the censorship and things like that.

51:56Paul C. Brunson:And so I want to lift my people up. And so I teach them all the things that I do and I help them and they collaborate and we all work together and things like that. And there are so many sexpert out there and we're all censored. We're all constantly shadow banned. We're constantly getting our accounts shut down. And so it's just really hard to find us. So even if you're, that's why, again, thank you for having me. Thank you for being so inquisitive and open-minded and having an appetite for learning because it is, podcasts and vidcasts are the only uncensored medium currently available to people like myself and the hundreds of sexperts that I cherish and help grow.

52:40Susan Bratton:But, you know, when you look at the data, right, and you look at children, for example, who over 80 % say they don't have an understanding of sex, even though they've gone through sex education.

52:50Paul C. Brunson:Well, what's sex education, though? It's fear. Like, you know, don't get pregnant. Don't get STI. You know, honestly, I'm a chief advocacy board director of an at-home STI testing company. And they have a really hard time even advertising, right? for STI testing.

53:11Susan Bratton:Yes.

53:12Paul C. Brunson:So it's a political issue.

53:14Susan Bratton:Yeah, there you go. Again, political.

53:16Paul C. Brunson:We've got to change the world now.

53:18Susan Bratton:I think we should use the Play-Doh visualization because I think that'll be great.

53:22Paul C. Brunson:We need our Play-Doh.

53:23Susan Bratton:Yes. Can we, I never thought I'd say this on this podcast, but can we bring in some penises?

53:28Paul C. Brunson:Yes.

53:28Susan Bratton:Bring out the penises. There should be music.

53:32Paul C. Brunson:Da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da. Thank you. Which color do you want?

53:37Susan Bratton:I'll take any color.

53:38Paul C. Brunson:You take. Take which one you want.

53:39Susan Bratton:Here, here, here, here.

53:40Paul C. Brunson:Okay. There you go. I'm giving you the purple one.

53:43Susan Bratton:Oh, I got the purple penis.

53:44Paul C. Brunson:Oh, look, they put a little head on it.

53:46Susan Bratton:Yeah, there is. I like it. This is official. Can we, can we, excuse me, can we give a shout out to the We Need to Talk team?

53:53Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

53:54Susan Bratton:For creating great penis.

53:55Paul C. Brunson:Let's toast them with our penises toasting to the team.

53:58Susan Bratton:Hey, they know what they're doing over here. Every day is a school day.

54:02Paul C. Brunson:Yeah, yeah, that's the best part of your job.

54:05Susan Bratton:I mean, this is great. Yeah. I love this. Me too. I love this.

54:07Paul C. Brunson:So what's interesting about this is that when you think about a penis, the large majority of a penis is erectile tissue, sponges.

54:17Susan Bratton:Okay.

54:18Paul C. Brunson:There are three big tubes in your penis. There's two corpus cavernosum, and they're these kind of pointy things. If you've ever felt the tip of your penis, it almost has these little, almost like a snake tongue. Yes. Under the glands there. Yes. That's where they come to a point, right there in the glands of your penis. And then the third one is that one that's kind of like a line along the bottom. Yes. That's your urethral tube. That's where the semen and the urine come out of the tip.

54:44Susan Bratton:Okay.

54:44Paul C. Brunson:So there's three big tubes. And what's interesting is that they're not just from your body out. They actually go in and down towards your testicles. So you have a buried shaft of your penis as well. Have you ever felt like underneath your testicles and you feel like it's hard down there too when you get really turned on? Yes. Well, that's all erectile tissue all the way down in there.

55:06Susan Bratton:Interesting.

55:07Paul C. Brunson:And so you can think that this penis is basically three tubes, a little bit of tissue, something called the tunic albuginia, which is like that membrane on a stake, like that thin white membrane that holds all the spongy stuff in and then the skin and then some nerves, some capillaries, et cetera. And that's what's in a penis. So, like, most of it is a sponge. Because you know how it's, like, this big, and then it gets to be this big. How does it get that way? The sponge is filled with blood. You see boobs. You get excited. You get an erection. It's very basic. Exactly. But for a woman, we have the same amount of erectile tissue, but it's in a teardrop.

55:52Paul C. Brunson:So that's what ours looks like. It's exactly the same amount as yours.

55:56Susan Bratton:The same amount of erectile tissue.

55:59Paul C. Brunson:In the female genital system. Those three things I said. The urethral sponge, okay, aka G-spot, not a spot. It just gets bigger and it kind of pokes out of the vagina. The clitoral head, shaft, arms, legs, and body. Like that little starfish thing that you see on the internet. That we can put on the internet. And then this spongy thing that kind of looks like your prostate, but it's this big sponge on the bottom floor of the vagina between this vagina and the rectum. That's the third spongy tissue. And so this is your vagina. This is the introidal sphincter. Here we are back to the sphincter again.

56:35Paul C. Brunson:Hello. So there's the sphincter and it's wrapped in all this tissue. So the clitoris is just this little tiny piece right here that sticks out the clitoral shaft and the clitoral tip. That's our little lady boner right there. And then all the rest of it is what I call buried treasure. And it takes you, with your fast-acting hemodynamics, here we are back again. Hello, hemodynamics. Yes. You're like boink a minute or two and you've got a nice erection.

57:04Susan Bratton:Yeah.

57:05Paul C. Brunson:Right?

57:05Susan Bratton:Yes.

57:06Paul C. Brunson:Lady boners take 20 minutes. 20 minutes? To come to full effect. For women who don't frequently get to full effect, it can take 30 minutes. 30 minutes. And so you can imagine that most couples who are like, well, sex is intercourse and I've got an erection, so I will stick it in you. And the woman is like, why aren't I having orgasms? Why is this not as great as I thought it would be? It's because this is just there's nothing there yet. It hasn't. The female genital erectile tissue is like an English muffin. This is the best analogy that I've come up with for it. So you know how when you're making an English muffin and you take it out of the refrigerator and you cut it in half or you open it up and you stick it in the toaster and you press it down and it pops up and it's still like beige.

57:50Susan Bratton:Yes.

57:51Paul C. Brunson:Yuck.

57:51Susan Bratton:Yes.

57:52Paul C. Brunson:That doesn't want to taste good.

57:52Susan Bratton:No.

57:53Paul C. Brunson:So you stick it down again and then it finally pops and it's nice and toasty. It's got the little burned things. Yum, yum, yum, yum, yum. Yes. But then you got your butter. Your butter's hard. It's been in the fridge. You cut it off, clink, and you stick it in and you smash the two sides together. And then you wait. because when that butter melts in all them nooks and crannies, you know you love it.

58:11Susan Bratton:Yep, yep, yep.

58:13Paul C. Brunson:That's what you got to do with a yoni. It's an English muffin.

58:16Susan Bratton:It's an English muffin.

58:17Paul C. Brunson:You got to let it all get that blood. Let it simmer. All the nooks and crannies. Let it simmer. So she gets her full erectile function. So that's what 20 minutes worth of what you want to call foreplay or you want to call sex. It's all sex to me. I don't like this distinction that intercourse is what sex is. It's all sex. Hot sex. When you know how to do it, great. You know, it's just like when people say to me, oh, I don't like 69. Like, I can't even concentrate. Oh, I don't know. I'm like, well, do it more than a couple times. Like, it's the most incredible experience to be that connected with each other, to be in each other, to be connected like that.

58:56Paul C. Brunson:To not know where your body begins and my body ends and we're having this incredible pleasure. Like, practice.

59:03Susan Bratton:Yes.

59:04Paul C. Brunson:Don't give up.

59:05Susan Bratton:Can I ask you a question about the English muffin?

59:07Paul C. Brunson:Yeah. Do it.

59:09Susan Bratton:About the warm-up.

59:10Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

59:11Susan Bratton:Are there techniques to expedite the warm-up? Yes. There are. Okay. Kiss. Okay.

59:19Paul C. Brunson:Breast. And then put it all over the outer area, the vulva, the gons, the outer labia, the clitoral shaft, the clitoral tip, between the inner labia. When you open up the inner labia, that's called the vestibule. Welcome. It's got a welcome mat. It's the vestibule. It's the doorway. And so open that up. Go in there. Take that little sphincter and give it a little pressure with that thing. Maybe pop it in there if she's ready. Right? All that's going to feel so good to her.

59:53Susan Bratton:Okay.

59:53Paul C. Brunson:You don't have to do yoni massages just with your hands. You can do them with toys too.

59:58Susan Bratton:You can do them with toys. So this is the best segue for oral sex.

1:00:02Paul C. Brunson:Oh, yeah. Let's go.

1:00:04Susan Bratton:Okay. So I would imagine that also is an expediter, if you will.

1:00:09Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

1:00:09Susan Bratton:But oral sex in itself, what's your stance on how to make that? I'm over here going, I do like oral sex. How do we take the pleasure level up?

1:00:25Paul C. Brunson:Oh, yeah. A couple of things. One, I would say giving oral to a male-bodied partner. A lot of people call them blowjobs. I like to call them blowvacations. So it's not just that you're doing something for him. You have to switch. You have to do a reframe and switch to you're taking your pleasure. When you begin to stop performing and doing this thing that you think he wants or trying to give him the same sensations he'd get from intercourse or self-pleasuring or what have you. When you actually just take your pleasure with his penis, when you're rubbing it on your lips and you're sticking it up in here, that's how you get your spit to start running.

1:01:17Susan Bratton:Get your spit

1:01:18Paul C. Brunson:going. Stick it in the sides and in between your cheeks like a little chipmunk with a walnut, right? Run your tongue around it. Lick up and down it, right? Take it in and out. And as you do that, begin to relax. Because when you relax, then everything's opening. Relaxation is the letting down. Your spit will start running. Your breasts will feel heavier. You'll start to notice your yoni getting aroused. You'll start to feel that, you know, that erectile tissue starting to blossom. And so giving pleasure to a penis. Use your hands with your mouth. Take breaks. Like, one of the things people feel like is once we get started, we got to go all the way and we got to go right to this and, you know, it's got to finish with intercourse and, you know.

1:02:03Susan Bratton:Right.

1:02:05Paul C. Brunson:There's no train timetable here, right? It's like every journey should just be what your body wants in the moment and what it craves. And so maybe you're going to do that for five or 10 minutes and then you're going to take a rest and your partner's going to do 69, you know, and give each other, mutual pleasure. And when you're doing that, and oral pleasuring evolve the same way. It's like, you know, knead the outer tissue, rub the mons. One of the things I teach guys is something they really need, which is called the bullseye touch technique.

1:02:40Susan Bratton:Bullseye touch technique.

1:02:41Paul C. Brunson:And that's because testosterone makes you very goal-oriented. So you're like, Oh, yeah, I got to give her an orgasm right away, right? And so I'm supposed to touch the clitoris right away. And many women, they'll feel frustrated that you're not doing that because they've been conditioned that way too. But when you begin from the outside, like if it's a bullseye, don't go for the creamy center at first. Start from the outside and work your way in. Stroke her legs. Stroke her belly. Give her a belly massage. Give her a core orgasm. Rubber mons. Core orgasm. Core orgasm. Which is it? Yeah, your erectus abdominis has a lot of erectile tissue in it as well.

1:03:20Paul C. Brunson:And when you kind of squeeze it up and down and you get the belly really loose, we hold ourselves so tightly. You know, oh, if our belly's fat or we're worried about it or what have you. But you can actually stimulate that whole area and get orgasmic contractions from that. Wow, wow. So outer labia, mons, inner labia, clitoral shaft, the top. The clitoral shaft goes from the tip, the little glands, up and into the pubic bone between where the mons is. It goes up and in there. You'll be able over time as you begin to stimulate your partner, you'll be able to feel her get that lady boner. And the shaft is just as delightful to get stroked and licked as the tip is.

1:04:05Paul C. Brunson:The inner labia, you can have an orgasm from just putting your tongue down that little frilly edge of that beautiful little labia and running right back up the other side and over the clit hood and coming around and maybe doing a couple of circles on the clitoris and then going down into the vestibule and touching the opening to the, you know, the intros, the opening to the vagina.

1:04:30Susan Bratton:Yes.

1:04:31Paul C. Brunson:Right? It's a roadmap. It's a roadmap. But you're not like boom. It's not what you want to do because then the clip's like, ah, ah. It's like I didn't even get my English muffin toasted yet.

1:04:46Susan Bratton:The butter is hard.

1:04:47Paul C. Brunson:The butter is not melted.

1:04:50Susan Bratton:Gosh. All right. I get it. I like, you know, it's interesting. Everything connects to this.

1:04:56Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

1:04:57Susan Bratton:Biggest sex organ. Yes. Because even you're talking about the reframe. It's all here. Yeah. It's all here.

1:05:03Paul C. Brunson:There's one interesting thing about the mind, too. A lot of people think about, you know, we've talked a lot about sex techniques and we've talked a lot about, I guess, genital anatomy.

1:05:15Susan Bratton:Yes.

1:05:16Paul C. Brunson:And bodily anatomy and the neurophysiology of orgasm and the benefits of it. But bedroom communication is actually the foundation on which it all rests. Okay. Like I can teach you all the techniques in the world. You can have a heart tongue. You can do thrust in time. You can, you know, do all these things. But if I can't tell you exactly what I want, like if you say, if I say to you, well, what I'd really like to do today is I'd like to start with a make out while I stroke you and you pleasure my breasts. And then I'd like to move into a yoni massage and then we'll see where we go from there.

1:05:52Paul C. Brunson:But that sounds really good. Or, you know, when our daughter kicked my toe the other day, it's all bruised. Could you just rub my toe for me with some pain cream first and I've got a kink in my neck. Can we get rid of that stuff first or my low back sore? And can we just start with that? Or can you just start by holding me and letting me tell you about my day? Can we just like check in together? Because I need to get out of my head and into my body and my heart connection with you. If your partner's like, you don't need to tell me what to do. I'm in my masculine. I can figure out how to do all of this.

1:06:23Paul C. Brunson:It's like, I don't need you to give me direct. That's the, oh my God, dude, like, no. You want to know exactly what mommy wants at all times. And all you do is go, okay, baby, I got it. Let's get going. Get over here and let me hug you. Right? Like, it's not. The more you get your woman to tell you her desires because they change. She runs with the moon, even after menopause. We are moon cyclers. You're much more steady state. and you want different things too. And when she starts to be able to tell you what she needs

1:06:57Susan Bratton:in any given moment, that hurts.

1:07:01Paul C. Brunson:That feels too much friction. We need to take a break, you know, whatever it might be. Oh, you got a hair on the bottom of your penis. Get up and go trim that thing off if I'm going to go down on you, whatever it is. Right. If she could just say anything and you're like, got it, baby. Okay, baby. Thank you. Yeah, let's go. Like then you're the man she can say anything to, which means she can ask you for anything she desires, which Which means now you've got this great flow.

1:07:25Susan Bratton:Yes.

1:07:25Paul C. Brunson:But communication is so interesting because then you can learn moaning. Then you can learn dirty talk. Then you can learn sharing frames. Then you can learn how to adore and worship her. And she can learn how to tell you what a great job you're doing and how much she respects you. Like then the communication flows too.

1:07:46Susan Bratton:You just mentioned sharing frames.

1:07:47Paul C. Brunson:Yes, sharing frames. What is that? A frame is like a snapshot of a moment, but it's a body-based experience. So you could say something like, tell me your favorite part of our lovemaking last night. And I'd be like, okay, well, you know when you were doing the toggling when we were making love, we were having intercourse? And I could tell you were doing like the shallow and the deep strokes. And I was just completely lost in that. I mean, I could barely catch my breath between the sensations of those strokes. And what I loved about it was you weren't doing it so deep it was too much, but you were like, you took me right to the edge.

1:08:25Paul C. Brunson:And then when you would do those shallow strokes, I wanted so much more. And then you'd give it to me and I could rest because you weren't overly giving it to me and you weren't underly giving it to me. And I came so well and I loved how you had just so much control. And yet I felt like you were right there with me, surrendered to it too. Like, it didn't feel like you were counting or paying any attention. It was just like, delicious. I loved it so much. It's the best you've ever done so far. Thank you. That's a frame.

1:08:57Susan Bratton:That's a frame.

1:08:58Paul C. Brunson:That's a frame.

1:08:59Susan Bratton:I see it. And you need to be able to feel, I say, courageous plus safe enough to be able to communicate that. And it's body-based. Yes, yes. What I felt.

1:09:10Paul C. Brunson:What I experienced physically.

1:09:12Susan Bratton:Yes, yes, yes. How does this connect, if it does, to seduction?

1:09:18Paul C. Brunson:Yeah. People, as you know well, and you talk about this in your books, it's the core wounds. I'm not lovable. I'm not enough. Right? That impacts your sex life. And so desire is how you feel about yourself. I'm fat. I'm ugly. You know, like all this negative talk. And how are you doing in your relationship? if you're mad at your partner outside the bedroom, if they're not meeting your overall general relationship values, if they're not showing up as the person you need in a relationship, it's going to hurt in the bedroom. So that's your desire. Do I feel desirable? Do I desire you? And then arousal is the stairway to heaven.

1:10:04Susan Bratton:Okay.

1:10:04Paul C. Brunson:So what arousal is, and your ladder looks so much different than my ladder. Dude, you are so lucky to have a penis. Yes, because your ladder is like, and you're up the ladder. It's a short ladder. It's the easiest ladder you ever climb. Like, it's not. Men do. They need heart connection. They need love. They need turn on. They need safety. They need reassurance. They need, you know, foreplay or whatever you want to call it. They need all those things. Yes. But women need way more most of the time. The lighter the touch, the better the come.

1:10:38Susan Bratton:The lighter the touch, the better the come.

1:10:41Paul C. Brunson:Yes, because you build the ability to feel the sensation. It doesn't take so much to get you off. You're not rubbing madly. You know, that's the friction, not the connection, right? You're not starting fires down there, right? Like if you just do these slow techniques, your body starts to go, I can feel that. Oh, that feels nice, right? Instead of grinding it out so fast. So the seduction is a combination of helping – like you basically have to get up under me and lift my butt up onto my arousal ladder. You've got to help me get going because as an estrogen-dominant female-bodied human, estrogen is a molecule of safety.

1:11:24Paul C. Brunson:And women, as you know, we do not walk in the world safely. We have our mind. We've got 360-degree vision. Yes. We have intuition. We know when there's a creeper stalking us, hopefully. You know, we can tell when we're in danger. And so we've got danger signals always up. We're always worried. So our male-bodied partner's job is to help us pull that all in and get into our heart and into our body and out of our head. And it takes us – it's like an old, rusty machine from the 1800s, that arousal, right? I get it. It's like it needs some oil. It needs some grease. It needs a turn. You got to put some muscle in it.

1:12:07Paul C. Brunson:Get us off the step.

1:12:09Susan Bratton:You know, Susie, is this responsive design? Yeah, that's right. Okay, this is what this is.

1:12:13Paul C. Brunson:Yeah, this is your, you would be more spontaneous generally. Yes. We would be more responsive. You will respond to your help to get into our body. So the holding, the massage, the yoni massage, the lingam, the kissing, the breast play. But also before that, the romance, the attention, the appreciation, all those things.

1:12:37Susan Bratton:Yes. That's why, you know, it's, I think we have to think that, you know, you don't want to have sex with someone that you don't feel safe with. Right. You don't want to have sex with someone who is unkind to you. You don't want to have sex with someone who you can't even have, you can't share anything with. It's like, these are the basics. But unfortunately, we have so much friction in our day-to-day relationships, so much unresolved conflict. You could see why sex is not happening or why sexual satisfaction is so low or why orgasms are not happening. And so you're right. Those are the foundational pieces that really need to be addressed first.

1:13:17Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

1:13:18Susan Bratton:This has been a master class. There's a lot of topography.

1:13:23Paul C. Brunson:The sexual landscape is vast.

1:13:25Susan Bratton:Yes.

1:13:25Paul C. Brunson:And so you can learn the techniques in any order you want, but the communication skills are definitely an ascension model and arousal is definitely an ascension model. So it's good to know what you're going for. Like that's how you learn. Mastery is, okay, if I'm going to learn to cook amazing meals, if I'm going to become a good cook, I've got to learn some of the fundamentals, right? I've got to learn how to make a gravy. I've got to learn how to fold things and all this stuff.

1:13:53Susan Bratton:And, you know, a key piece to mastery that a lot of people forget. Tell me. Is not only do you need to put the time in, but you need to be open to the feedback.

1:14:01Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

1:14:02Susan Bratton:So you can become better.

1:14:03Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

1:14:04Susan Bratton:Yes. And I think this is where you come into play perfectly is because you are literally teaching us. And through these mechanisms or even through your writing, right, that in itself is feedback. Yeah. If we're open to listen. For couples who feel like they have maybe the script when it comes to sex, because I feel like there's like this standard menu, especially with heterosexual couples. It is typically the woman pleasures the man, gives him oral sex, which then turns into sex in a missionary position, which turns to him orgasming quickly and her not. And that's it. All done four minutes later.

1:14:51Paul C. Brunson:Yeah.

1:14:51Susan Bratton:Right. So for couples that have been doing that.

1:14:55Paul C. Brunson:I wouldn't say most guys are getting blowjobs.

1:14:57Susan Bratton:Okay. Oh, most are not.

1:14:58Paul C. Brunson:I'm glad you think they are. God love you. Oh, my God. I don't think they are. Okay, but most are not. I think it's grab a boob and stick it in. I think it's like honk honk, boom. Oh, that's most... I think that's what most people think. Sex is intercourse because sex was for procreation only. And so the only thing that's sex is what's going to make a baby even if you're not making a baby.

1:15:15Susan Bratton:Okay, so then that's it.

1:15:16Paul C. Brunson:So then couples that are in that script, what...

1:15:22Susan Bratton:I hate to say quick tips, but what are some things that could be done to help break that cycle quickly?

1:15:29Paul C. Brunson:Yeah, yoni massage and lingon massage.

1:15:30Susan Bratton:There you go.

1:15:31Paul C. Brunson:I mean, I really think just having her learn how to completely receive is a practice in and of itself. If she's only ever had that kind of like quick penetrative sex where it's like the doody booty kind of thing.

1:15:44Susan Bratton:All right. One more. This is for me, though. I have to ask is aphrodisiacs.

1:15:48Paul C. Brunson:Yes. I love them. Oh, my God.

1:15:50Susan Bratton:I love them. So there is such a thing.

1:15:53Paul C. Brunson:Yes.

1:15:53Susan Bratton:As an aphrodisiac.

1:15:54Paul C. Brunson:You know, human beings have been running around on this earth eating things to make themselves horny since we crawled out of the slime. Are you kidding me?

1:16:03Susan Bratton:Okay, what are they? What are some of that actual work?

1:16:06Paul C. Brunson:They're everywhere. You know, everything from, they're all over the world.

1:16:09Susan Bratton:What about, I often hear, chocolate, oysters, wine. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Are those?

1:16:14Paul C. Brunson:Well, chocolate is cacao.

1:16:16Susan Bratton:Yes.

1:16:16Paul C. Brunson:And that actually is grown across the equator around the world. So cacao, it has polyphenols that are great for blood flow. So you get better erectile function. You get your yoni boner better, right? So cacao is fantastic. Chocolate's fantastic for you. What was the other one you said? That's zinc. Okay. Yeah, the zinc is helpful. And semen is also an aphrodisiac. So semen has over 20 things in it that are good for your partner. So one of the benefits of receiving seminal fluid as your lover is that I get serotonin. I get testosterone, which makes me hornier. So you know how the more sex you have, the more you want?

1:17:02Paul C. Brunson:Yes. I think a big part of that is the testosterone. It gives you luteinizing hormone, which helps regulate your menstrual cycles as a woman. It has zinc in it. It has spermidine and putrescine. You know how semen has a little funky smell? That's called putrescine. Spermidine and putrescine are polyamines that are actually supportive of nine of the 12 hallmarks of aging. Here we are back to mitochondrial function again. Look at that. It makes you live longer. Okay. Okay.

1:17:39Susan Bratton:So sperm makes you live longer. Semen, should I say, semen.

1:17:44Paul C. Brunson:Yes, the sperm's in the semen, but it's a semen volume from your prostate. Yes. And the more you ejaculate, the longer you live as well. So there are a lot of studies that show that this is why we know that for every 10 years you stay sexually active, that you extend your sex span, you add two years of health span onto your life, roughly. Those are mostly men's studies, of course, because all the studies are men. But I mean, literally, when I said there are 10 ,000 nerve endings in the clitoris, that's brand new data. We used to say eight because it was a porcine study, pig clit. So finally, and thanks to our trans folks, because we're doing nerve sparing, you know, genital restoration.

1:18:24Paul C. Brunson:And so we now know more about the nerves.

1:18:27Susan Bratton:Look at that.

1:18:28Paul C. Brunson:I know. But yeah, the prostate itself, that's a gland and a muscle. It's a contractive muscle. There's oxytocin again. Yes. Contracts and ejects. What you're doing is you're bringing blood flow. Blood flow, yeah. Which brings healing factors, growth factors, oxygenation, right? So all this blood flow. Like what you could call this episode, blood flow makes good sex.

1:18:59Susan Bratton:Pretty much this conversation has been much more informative than I was expecting.

1:19:09Paul C. Brunson:Oh, good.

1:19:09Susan Bratton:This was academic, but to the point where everyone can take something that was said and not just like make their sex life better, but make their life better. which I think is so much more important, which is important, is to know that we are all empowered to do that. I think you're a reflection of someone who has said, you know what, I am going to take charge of my life, and I'm going to live it to the fullest.

1:19:39Paul C. Brunson:And the way I want.

1:19:40Susan Bratton:And the way you want.

1:19:41Paul C. Brunson:100 % the way I want. One of the most important things to me is to be surrounded by people where I don't have to filter myself. Like I'm on my best behavior with you, of course, right?

1:19:51Susan Bratton:I can see. I can see you because you walk to the line and then you come back. I do.

1:19:54Paul C. Brunson:Yes, I do. I don't trigger anybody, you know, but I really try not to. And I'm in my compassionate heart if I if I have triggered anyone. I feel I'm sorry. But but I really love to be around people who play full out and say everything they're thinking and are there 100 percent authentic self. That's when life is so juicy. So when we let go of the shackles of our repressive culture, when we move into our desires fully and we become exactly who we want to become, it is just so lovely, so delightful, so wonderful. And you'll find your people. Your people will be like, Mitch, I love you.

1:20:34Susan Bratton:Yes. Yes. And you're like, you definitely are my people. Yeah.

1:20:39Paul C. Brunson:Yeah, you find your people.

1:20:40Susan Bratton:Yes, you do. And it is beautiful. You know, when you find your people, you have your village, you know, and you feel safe. Yeah. Because you could truly then just double down on your authenticity. So then, final question.

1:20:53Paul C. Brunson:Okay. What did you say for last?

1:20:55Susan Bratton:Everyone gets this question, and it is my favorite. You think about all the incredible conversations you've had throughout your life. Which one was the most memorable? So who was it with, and what did you learn?

1:21:11Paul C. Brunson:Oh, God. This is weird, but one of the things that I think would have been Perry Belcher, he's a copywriter. He's a good old boy from Mississippi or someplace, Louisiana or someplace. And he taught me the concept of traffic and conversion. Okay. And traffic and conversion is what I have run. You know, I'm an entrepreneur. I've run up my business for 20 years. And it is not an easy, it's a stupid business to be in. And I should have known better that it'd be in such a difficult business because sex is constantly censored. I'm cockblocked everywhere I go. And so I just keep this rule of thumb. He taught me this about my business.

1:21:55Paul C. Brunson:He said, you've got to watch how you're getting your traffic and grow that. And you've got to watch your conversions so that you know you're making revenue. And it was such a simple formula for me. And the reason that I like to have abundance and I like to generate wealth is because I think about when I visualize myself, I am a little husky with a big sled. And I am pulling a sled and there are thousands of people on it and I am pulling them forward. I love to take care of people. I love to help out. And so the more that I can do well, the more good I can do. And so that funny little conversation with Perry where he made business so simple for me because I'm not a numbers person.

1:22:41Paul C. Brunson:And so it really helped me to have that simple way of thinking about my business so that in my mastermind last week, I went through what my strategy is for 2026 and why it's what it is. What are the forces that are changing in the landscape in the market? And how am I modifying my business to grow my traffic and improve my conversions?

1:23:02Susan Bratton:Yes.

1:23:02Paul C. Brunson:The more sexperts I help grow their businesses, the more sexual literacy and pleasure and longevity I create. So Traffic and Conversion from Perry Belcher.

1:23:13Susan Bratton:There you go. You know, I would not have thought anything different coming from you. Oh. That you would pick something that people would say is obscure. But I think that is a great representation of you. Thank you. And I think it shows how alive you are. I think that's really what I'm walking away with. I have, and this is going to, because they will watch this, so they're going to say, what are you saying? I have family members who are not 64, but I feel like they've already written off their life. Yeah, I know. I think they've hit an age and they've said, well, you know what? This is not for me anymore.

1:23:56Susan Bratton:Satisfaction is not for me. Sexual satisfaction is definitely not for me. They've just written off these pieces of their life. But I think that you are a representation. Why?

1:24:07Paul C. Brunson:Right. That's the 85 versus the 15. Yes. It's mindset. It is. You've got to be a Wolverine. You have to be. You've got to take a lick and keep on ticking.

1:24:16Susan Bratton:Yes. Yeah. And this is, you are a Timex. I know. In a beautiful garden of Babylon. Right from the 70s. Garden of Babylon. Timex.

1:24:25Paul C. Brunson:You will forever think about my Yoni as the hanging garden of Babylon now.

1:24:29Susan Bratton:Is it bad that I have a visualization of your yoni? No, not at all. No.

1:24:33Paul C. Brunson:You're welcome to. It's fine. It's a pretty thing.

1:24:35Susan Bratton:It's lush. Yes. I keep looking over here. It's more lush than this area right here, right?

1:24:40Paul C. Brunson:Oh, yes.

1:24:40Susan Bratton:Yeah, it's there. Susan, thank you so much. I've enjoyed this conversation.

1:24:45Paul C. Brunson:I have too.

1:24:45Susan Bratton:I've learned so much. Oh, that's good. And this conversation will improve my life, so thank you.

1:24:50Paul C. Brunson:Good. Thank you. I mean, Susan, I love that conversation. I think it is ultimately how comfortable she is with who she is.

1:25:05Susan Bratton:I love that. You know, she busted many myths that persist in society today. Namely, this whole notion of as you get older, sex, basically, the satisfaction drops and then sex stops. And it's so interesting to talk to a woman who is 64 years old who is saying that she's having orgasms that last over an hour. I didn't know that was possible. There are a lot of people who grapple with just the idea of, say, a dildo. But now she's talking about remote AI, Wi-Fi enabled, simultaneous sex tools. But the demonstrations, these are demonstrations that our children should see. What the kids are learning is STIs are bad and don't have sex.

1:26:01Susan Bratton:Like, we need to know about pleasure. We need to understand what is sex. We need to understand what is communication and how important it is. What I loved about that, this conversation that we just had, is we talked about topics that are present in the lives of most people, but we're not talking about it. Anyone who is interested in sex needs to watch this.