How to Stop Overspending w/Mary Ann Stenquist

0:05Welcome to the Wealthy After 40 podcast, the show for Gen X women and couples who are ready to ditch financial stress and feel confident about retirement. I'm your host, Dailene Higgins, a money coach and retirement strategist to help you gain clarity and confidence with your money by creating a spending plan that aligns with your financial goals and dreams so you can spend intentionally, save consistently, and feel at peace about your future. Join me every week to understand your money, simplify your decisions, and take intentional steps toward the life you want.

0:50Today's episode is a guest interview. I am so excited. I know it has been a while, but I didn't want to just bring guests on anymore just to bring guests on. So they will be impactful when I bring them on. They will compliment me in areas that I am not the expert in, right? And I don't claim to be. So Marianne Stenquist is going to be joining us. She is a spending coach and she works with clients who struggle with emotional overspending. Now you might be wondering, is this me? Is this not me? Listen to this episode. We discuss it. If you're still not sure, please reach out to one of us and we will direct you as to what the challenge could possibly be and help you find a resolution.

1:36You will find both of our links down in the show notes. We both have a workshop, so please sign up for one of those as well, but I welcome you to the episode. Welcome to the episode, Marianne. I'm so excited to dive into the topic of spending. So let's start with who you are and who you help.

1:58Mary Ann Stenquist:So my name is Marianne and I am a spending coach. I am actually a speech pathologist by trade, but a spending coach by calling. I, through many different roads. I found myself struggling with overspending and I was unable to work as a speech-language pathologist due to the new road and journey my life took. And so I found myself overspending, found myself really struggling with that, and I had to do my own research. And in that research, I found that there's an emotional reason for why we buy. And so as a spending coach, I really try to help people align their purchases with their intentions and not their impulses.

2:45Yeah, I love that. I help people budget their money with their values so that they can get more enjoyment out. So we're tackling it just from two different angles and I really love that. So I, before we jumped on, I know I said, I help people understand like overspending may just be a control issue. They're not budgeting or planning correctly. So really tactical. That's my nature. I'm very tactical, very practical. But yet there's been times I'm like, they're still overspending, even doing what I consider to be the simple pieces. So let's dive into overspending from your side and your view. And I love that you acknowledge that there's a tactical and practical

3:34Mary Ann Stenquist:view, but there's a missing component. And that's exactly what I found was missing when I was trying to just make a budget. Everything looked good on paper and it was like, oh, wow, I'm meeting all my goals and I'm putting$600 towards savings. This is amazing. And then that didn't happen. At the end of the month, I'm like, where did the money go? It looked so perfect on paper. So it was really frustrating. I was trying to understand why. So I thought it was the budget and I kept trying to fix, I kept trying to change the budget, a different budgeting approach, a different app, and it didn't fix my overspending.

4:11Mary Ann Stenquist:And that's where I've really discovered that overspending is not always a budgeting problem. It's a spending problem. You can, the numbers can look perfect and you still overspend, but why? And I like to think of it as money management is a balance between saving and spending. And if you don't spend, within the limits that your budget outlines, you won't be able to save. So no matter how much you refine your budget, if you can't stick to that limit within the month, your budget's not going to work. And that's a lot of what happens is we're not looking at our budget all the time. We're not thinking about it or looking at it at the store when we have that cute blouse, that kitchen appliance, it's not top of mind.

5:00Mary Ann Stenquist:And so my approach is really helping you in those moments, making those aligned decisions that will make your budget work. Yeah, I love that. I, yeah, being very practical, logical planner, you can lay it out, but having those strategies that help you in the moment is key. It's definitely key. And so yes, I build in values, but tell us how you help clients in that burning moment of, I just have to have this purse or I just have to have whatever it is. And how do you help them and guide them? Yeah. So first of all, I do establish what their values are. And I love that you do that as well, because that is really the motivation.

5:48Mary Ann Stenquist:our brains in the study that I've done about the brain are very bad at assessing value if you just have one thing. And so if you compare that thing to something else, then you can accurately value that thing. So if you're contemplating buying that kitchen appliance, you compare it to your goal of getting out of debt or doing a kitchen renovation and you're going to have an easier choice. So establishing that value is number one. Number two is how do I break that instinct to just, I see it, I want it, I buy it. That just seems to happen. The spending doesn't just happen, but it feels that way. So in the moment when, when I have clients and they're struggling, what I have them do is pause.

6:35Mary Ann Stenquist:And there's really power in the pause. I don't have them put the item in their car. I don't have them put it in their, put it in their Amazon car. I just have them like pause from that item, get up and walk away from your computer, walk around the store and just think about the item because when you see it, when you hold it, it's almost like you own it. And the only thing keeping you from buying it is just swiping a card. And that seems a very small price to pay. But when you remove yourself, even just for a walk around the store, you can just think about like, okay, what do I want about this item?

7:14Mary Ann Stenquist:And the interesting thing that I have found is that you're not actually wanting the item. You're wanting what the item can give you. And that pause allows you to think like, why do I want that item? What is that item going to do for me. And then you can think, do I already have that in place? Do I have something at home? Do I have five of those items that are sitting unused? And this is just a new feature. It allows you to think more critically about the purchase. Yeah. I love that. Now I know I've worked with clients and they'll be like, well, I had to get this thing, which is like, okay. And that was a big choice, but then they have to get to everything that goes with it.

8:00Yes. And so talk to that, like, how does somebody work through? Well, I've got this, so it has to come with this and this.

8:08Mary Ann Stenquist:That is a very easy trap to fall into. And the trick is, I've coined the phrase, try before you buy, not in the sense of marketing, where they allow you to try before you buy it. But you need to prove to yourself that you are going to use the item before you even have the item in your possession. So the best example is like working out gym clothes. We think I'm going to work out. So you go out and buy all the gym clothes instead of buying before you actually try working out in your life. Prove to yourself that a I can keep my commitment to work out and be you prove how many times you're actually going to fill And then you say, okay, if I am consistently working out three times a week, then what do I need to fill that habit, that ritual that I've already created?

9:04Mary Ann Stenquist:And so you need to ask yourself, if I buy this item, will I be able to implement it to date? And if not, it's often not because you need the appliances. It's because you need the system. You need it actually in your life. And that rule applies to everything. And it actually, it's what kept me on track to not buy the fancy digital calendar I wanted three years ago. I was so, it was Black Friday and it was the fancy calendar. And I was like, this is going to solve all my problems. And I had it in my car. It was expensive though. And I just was like, I just, I don't feel good about spending that, but it's just going to, it's going to make it so much easier.

9:48And I thought, will I be able to get this calendar and implement it tomorrow?

9:56Mary Ann Stenquist:No, because I didn't have any routines. It's like a chore chart and calendar and everything. All of my calendars were disorganized. My girls didn't have chores that they were doing regularly. I was just kind of like running by the seat of my pants. My life wasn't organized. And so realizing that, it's like no fancy calendar is going to fix that for me. I've got to make those changes first. And then guess what? Three years later, I could have bought it sooner, but I just, I didn't need it. And then it was like, you know what? My life could really support having something like this. And I bought it and it's great.

10:33Mary Ann Stenquist:And I love it. It's not sitting unused. Yeah. Yeah. We really can use that to our advantage and not get sucked into like, I need it now because it's always going to be there. The internet has everything. Well, and I love what you said. And it's what I find in working with clients in anything, right? We think we have this problem. And so we go after for spending, it's like buying something for money, it's approaching something that's the wrong problem. And so really getting clear on like yourself, it was organization, I needed to do a little more work on the true problem before I was going to find success.

11:14And, you know, I think that's so important to recognize that as well. So let's shift just a little bit and say you did buy that or say a client and they're like, well, I just bought it. And they're going through now that shame and that guilt, which is very easy to do. We're all human. We all feel bad when choices don't line up with what we know we should have done. But practice makes perfect. I do believe that. So how do we solve these feelings or work through these feelings to help us find success?

11:50Mary Ann Stenquist:That is a very natural process to go through. Even with things that we like, we think, oh, I shouldn't have bought that. I should have waited. I could have used what I already had. And so instead of inviting those thoughts and feelings of guilt and shame, I want you to acknowledge that there was a justified reason for why you bought it. there was a reason even if it does seem a little blown out of proportion you need to get to that core reason of what was I trying to buy with this even if it's makeup why was I buying this trending blush when I have 10 in my closet you wanted the look that it gave you and the marketers promised that thing and so it's an easy yes I'm not getting that with my current thing so this is going to fix it and then you realize, well, maybe it wasn't the makeup.

12:43Mary Ann Stenquist:Maybe it was the tool. Maybe it was the brush I needed. And that's why I'm just buying all these brushes. So really just analyzing your last, you don't have to go through your credit card statements. You don't just think about the last five things you've bought and ask like, what was I trying to buy with those things? And that will really bring the logic back into it and just say like, okay, I bought it for this reason, but then go beyond that. And it's like, did I need to buy that item to get that need met? It's like technically with the makeup, no, because you have those 10 blushes sitting already and you're not even waking up 10 minutes earlier to use the blush.

13:25Mary Ann Stenquist:So it's like, technically you didn't need it. You wanted it. It wasn't a need, but then moving forward, you're not going to go out and buy the 12th blush, the 13th blush, you catch yourself before you find yourself buying the same things over and over. And again, that applies to everything. It can be whatever your favorite things are to buy, is just really identifying what you were trying to buy. And then as far as like addressing the guilt and shame, that's really big. And I'm really big on reframing guilt and shame. So shame tends to keep us stuck. We hide. We just keep it hidden because we're so ashamed.

14:09Mary Ann Stenquist:And the emotion of guilt actually is the brain's way of communicating that what we just did that we're ashamed about doesn't align with our values. And when I learned that, when I was studying emotions, I was like, wow, that is powerful. Because if that emotion of guilt is coming, that means that what we just did doesn't align. Well, what are our values? What is it conflicting with? And almost nine times out of 10, what we're buying does conflict with our values. And that's why we really need to align those purchases with our intentions, our values, and not just that impulse to buy. Yeah. Yeah, that's huge.

14:54That is really huge. Understanding that guilt and recognizing it's that friction moment. And hey, yeah, you feel bad, but what can you do different? Again, solving the problem, not going after something, even like the budget or going after something else. And honestly, I think this is falling into what I call systems, right? A budget is just a plan. Then we have actions and we have systems that control it. And even something, you know, I call my awareness that I help clients with a soft skill. That's what you're doing is all soft skills. It's something that's not tangible. We can't, not everybody talks about it.

15:36And so it's like, what do we do? What do we do? So, all right, overspenders, emotional overspenders. Do they make good money?

15:47Mary Ann Stenquist:Do they come in all shapes and sizes? They come in all shapes and sizes. And I think that it's important to differentiate this idea that there's savers and spenders. And I have found that we're all spenders, but there's just different levels of spenders. And for the saving spenders, the people that tend to not spend money who are traditionally called savers, there's a reason why they're not spending. And so it's really important to distinguish, like differentiate those things, but also to focus on. I'm not talking about everything you're buying because we have to buy things. We have to spend money.

16:30Mary Ann Stenquist:This is the overspending part where you're spending over your capacity or, you know, when I was overspending. we never went into debt. We never went into any credit card debt. So you don't have to go into debt to justify having difficulties with spending. It's really not a money issue. If it's causing you guilt and shame and it's cluttering up your house, it's too expensive. So whether you're going into debt or not, it doesn't matter. It's what you're feeling. And so really understanding that is important, especially because the media rewards and glamorizes spending. And I found that I was justifying my spending when I was watching other people blow 10 times what I was spending.

17:19Mary Ann Stenquist:And I was like, well, I'm not that bad. But I wasn't happy. And so it doesn't matter if I wasn't that bad on a numbers basis. I didn't feel good. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So you brought up savers and spenders. I'm a saver, lend to saving, but I do tell people I spend. I have my moments where I spend not out of control, but in the moments I'm like, wow, that was a lot of money. And I do it like two or three times a year. It's a very seasonal for me. And so I think that's the other thing to recognize that. Well, and the other thing I thought of as you were talking about that saving and spending is definitely a balance.

18:00And so as a retirement coach, I'm trying to help people live for now and save for later because you can be on both sides of the coin of, well, I'm never going to live long enough to retire. Okay. But what if you do, you never planned for your older self, you know? And so it's this balance. Money has a balance and money, it's hard because money is involved in everything. And whether you are being guided by seeing what other people have and that's driving your spending. Talk about some of those things. Like why do people overspend emotionally? The getting, I know it's like dopamine, but I'm sure there's other things as well.

18:43Mary Ann Stenquist:Yes. And that's what I found is in my research, I was trying, I literally typed into Google how to stop spending before it happens. because I would just spend and the money has already been spent. And it's like, how do I stop it before it happens? And nothing came up. And so in my research, it would get to the good part of like, we spend to feel dopamine and then it would just stop. And I'm like, it's so much more than the dopamine. I know it is because especially for me, shopping felt like a need. And I'm like, this isn't a need, but it feels that way. And in my research, I actually came across Maslow's hierarchy of needs.

19:29Mary Ann Stenquist:The funny and ironic thing about it was I came across it on a sales marketing business webpage. So they're teaching marketers how to use our emotional needs against does. And I was like, this is it. This is the reason. And it really goes to unmet needs. Everything we buy is either a cope for something we're not getting emotionally. It's a deflection. It's whatever it is, but it comes to an unmet need. So speaking of the kitchen appliance or the calendar. The unmet need was control. I wasn't organized and I was needing help. I was needing support and we can spend a lot of money in pursuit of this help and support, but I didn't even need the calendar first.

20:31Mary Ann Stenquist:I needed to establish a routine at home. I needed to ask for more support from my kids, from my husband, and he was more than willing to do it. But I didn't recognize that that was the issue. I thought that it was, I didn't have the calendar. So recognizing the need behind it and not feeling shame. And that's what I love so much about, I call them my spending types. They're not labels. They are ways to help you identify what need is not being met and what need is like your primary emotional need that you tend to buy to try to fill. And it takes away the shame. And it also gives you tools because not having an emotional need being met is fixable.

21:18Mary Ann Stenquist:And it doesn't feel that way when you're just buying, buying, buying, and don't know why. Yeah, that makes sense. Okay. So you had to go on a journey on your own because Google didn't come up with anything. I love that. You've gone on the journey yourself. You've figured it out. How do you help clients? And how does somebody take that first step? If they're like, oh, is this me? And recognizing, or if they know it's them, they're like, yeah, I can really identify. What are some ways that you can help them? Sure. I have found that really starting where we both start with the values, getting them motivated and helping them realize, and just asking yourself, even right now, just sit and ask, does my spending align with my values?

22:09Mary Ann Stenquist:And even, even simpler than that, if someone were to look at my spending, not knowing anything about me, would I give an accurate picture of who I am and what I value? And when I asked myself that, I was appalled. If someone looked at my spending, they would see a bunch of clothes and apparel. They'd think that I was just self-absorbed, that I only cared about my appearance, that I could care less about my family. That was so far from the truth, but that's what my spending reflected. Once I realized that, and once I realized that my values are my family, personal development, and this business idea that I started to have.

22:53Mary Ann Stenquist:And once I had that, it was like the desire, it literally, the desire to change happened overnight. And then spending followed. So it really is getting on board with values. And then once we get that comparison point of what you're saving for and spending less for, then we're really keeping track of those unintentional purchases, those impulse purchases. And not just like I spent this much. We're not even tracking the money. We're just tracking those. I put this in my car. I grabbed a$5 candy bar or a$5 treat at the grocery store. But not just that, it's why. Because I deserved it. Because I'm tired.

23:39Mary Ann Stenquist:Because I need a pick-me-up. And then you walk by the section in Target and it was like, oh, it was such a good deal. I couldn't pass it up. And I bought this home decor. item. So you're capturing in the moment what your brain is telling you as like a justification for that's why I need it is because I deserve it. And that's what really starts helping clients to recognize that voice and recognize that there is a pause and they do have a choice to put that in their item. So first we're looking at it after it's purchased, then we're trying to do it during, and then we're trying to do it before. I like that.

24:16I always tell clients because they'll be like, it's only this much, or I only can save this much. And I'm like, that is a taboo word with money, right? And so like the idea of what was on sale, well, how many on sale items are you buying? And so it's like understanding that trail that you're creating and being able to go there.

24:38Mary Ann Stenquist:So yeah, I was just going to say, in addition to that, like, I only have this much, or I don't have any money left over to save. My approach really is empowering because you realize that the money leaks that you start, that you have just all the time. And then when you add the money amount to it, $5 here,$10 here, that adds up. And you think, oh, that's empowering. I can use that money towards what I value. and that's so much more empowering than like I can't buy this I can't buy this you can choose to buy that but it is taking away from what you value more and if you want to cut in other areas that's fine but we're we think that we're really good at mental math and like I won't spend as much in groceries this year or this month and then we buy the thing and then we overspend in groceries anyways.

25:36Mary Ann Stenquist:And that's where you come in or how do you fix it? But I'm not even aware of those impulse spending because it's just all wrapped up in one receipt and one total. And it really doesn't reflect your grocery spending when so much of grocery stores are not grocery items. Exactly. And as you were talking earlier about the candy bar, I was thinking, oh, as children, right? As kids, those end caps, those things, right? As you're waiting to check it, which now you can do self-check. But I remember going with my mom and be like, well, can I get this? Can I get this? Can I get this? You know, it's that strategy by the grocery stores, by the stores, by the marketers.

26:16And we have to learn to put our bumpers on. And what is it that we really want? I heard a money coach. She said, I don't spend money on eating out because I choose to do other things. And it's that choice and that's that value. And it's that funneling of your money to the most important things. And so that recognition that you had for your family and for somebody to see that, which I don't know that I guess I'm going to get a little off here. Like, I don't know that it's important for other people to see that. However, to actually paint the picture for yourself. So then if somebody does see that, it's like verifying and doing that.

26:57So, all right. So how can somebody connect with you, start exploring, working with you, better understanding if they have a overspending problem, lacking practical and planning or overspending because I just don't, I have a different need. I recognize needs differently. Sure.