DEEP DIVE: Asking for Big Help (And the Best Ways to Give It)

20:24It is the reciprocity that makes it easy and the lack thereof that can make it more difficult.

20:30Angela Santomero:Yeah. And there's kind of more dignity in that for the person who is receiving the big help. You know, something else has occurred to me that is a factor in this is the need for the big help acute or chronic. Right. If your friend's house burns down, that's pretty sexy. I'm going to be really helpful. Right. Yeah. But my friend's kid, you know, has a, I don't know, an advancing disease that's taking away her mobility. And that's how it's going to be for the rest of that kid's life. I hope I wouldn't be such a lousy friend as to not be that helpful. But it's different when it's going to be true next week, next year, forever.

21:03Angela Santomero:But not talking about you, but like you would be a lousier friend to that person. Everybody would be because at a certain point, like the like, are you kidding me? I'd love to grab a bucket and rush over and put your house fire out. you're going to have a very different level of mental and emotional engagement with that than like, oh, this is you four of you having this chronic disease. It's a natural thing and it's something to sort of solve for in the equation. And this is another big place to watch your story, right? This person always needs, it's so exhausting dealing with this person who's always got a problem.

21:42Angela Santomero:Well, let's say you have a friend who's financially having problems and you're trying to help them out. You have every right to sit down and be like, the most amount of money I could contribute to this person's well-being is$20 a week, let's say. That's absolutely within your rights. But take a step back, think about that, and have that conversation rather than letting it become the story of like, oh my God, I wish I'd never met this person. They've just become this huge financial drain in my life and it's a nightmare. Yeah. And if the answer is like, I'm kind of done with this and I'm out of money, I'm willing to give a zero.

22:16Angela Santomero:That's fine, too. But I just think it's getting the clarity around how much you can and want to help versus getting stuck in the place of like, I'm going to help and be miserable about it is no good. This seems to me, though, like if we're talking about big help, we are talking about something that is a little more maybe situational than like this is my friend who always talks about herself and never asks about my day. You know, it's more situational, I guess, if you're asking for really big help. It does kind of mean help you don't usually need or haven't had to ask for before. I guess so. That makes sense to me.

22:49If you're on the receiving end of that, like having been on the receiving end of big asks like that, what really interests me about how hard it is to ask for help when you really, really, really need it is that when you've been asked for help by a friend who really, really needs it, you're so glad to be able to help. I had a friend last summer who lost both parents within the same month, both parents. And COVID made things much more complicated. And she called me with like a day's notice. Could a couple of her kids come and stay with me for a couple of days? And I should have thought of that. I should have waited for that big ask to come in.

23:22But I was so relieved to have this concrete, specific way to be of real help to her. She had to leave the country during COVID, which meant, you know, quarantining and all that kind of thing and leaving her kids for a long time. And she needed help. To be on the receiving end of that, that was a gift to me because I was sitting around, you know, wishing you could help, feeling sad for her, crying. It must be so hard to be her. I wish there was something I could do to help. And then there was something I could do to help. And it wasn't that big a deal, P.S. It was a gift to me to be in the receiving end of that.

23:52And I think that's generally the case. Like when our friends are really in the soup, you're glad to be able to help.

23:58Angela Santomero:I don't think it's generally the case. I think it is always the case. A couple of rules that I have learned at this phase of my life in dealing with a lot of this stuff. Number one, always try to go to the funeral. Never think to yourself, I don't know this person. I'm talking about not in COVID times. Now we can't do anything. But don't ever think like, will it be weird? I don't think this person knows me well enough. Like I know at my mom's funeral looking out and seeing like, wow, that person came. It was touching every single time. I literally never had the thought of like, why would that person show up?

24:28Angela Santomero:I don't know them that well. Like, right, right. Maybe if your parent is extremely famous, you might think that I can't think of an example where people would be like, I wish that person hadn't come because I haven't seen them in several years. It means so much to people to just show up. The other thing is always offer specific help. The more specific help you can offer, you take the burden off of the person to have to come up with a big ask. I try to say to people instead of let me know if I can help. I'll say like, I am a night owl. So at 2 a.m. if you need a pharmacy run, I'm your person. Try to think of like really not meals.

25:04Angela Santomero:Nobody needs any more meals. Like try to think of real. I live right next to the pharmacy. I happen to have an extra car sitting in my driveway if you need a ride anywhere I'm a great driver Whatever it is like offer people and then write that down for them send an email and say I'm your 2 a.m person whenever you need it. I'm your driver whenever you need it I'm great at fixing boilers or anything that breaks in the house put me on that list, you know The more you take the burden of them asking for the big help off I have another one for funerals that was specifically helpful in one case, which was um I had a relative's mom died very unexpectedly.

25:43I got the kids their outfits for the funeral, you know, because on top of everything else, she had like a two year old, a five year old, an eight year old who all needed like little tiny suits and shoes and stuff. And, you know, I went to Macy's and got it all right and got options and returned it all after, you know, it was very helpful in a specific way. And it wasn't lasagna.

26:01Angela Santomero:That's awesome. And I hadn't thought of this before, but this goes under your decide once, you know, lazy genius, this thing that we talk about whenever someone dies, I'm going to call and be like, can I take your kids right after the service so that you can participate more fully in the reception? Can I get your kids close? Can I be the person who does anything that happens after midnight for you? Decide once and make that offer every time. Make it clear and make it in writing because anything you ever need, call me. It doesn't have the same effect. So you're talking about how to sort of be an askable friend, which I really like.

26:37Angela Santomero:These are specific things. Be the most askable friend. That's right. And it's okay to set limitations within that too, but the clarity helps. Hey, we're having our own financial issues. I wish I could give you a million dollars and solve all your problems. I can't give you any money, but anything you need on Saturday or Sunday, call me. I'll walk your dog. You look at their life and you say, where are the pressure points and the pain points that are going to come up in this situation? And which one of those am I willing to take? And then you offer it. And hopefully they have my person who's organizing a list for all of those things.

27:11There's a possibility that you can do this sort of ahead of time, too. Like it makes me think of, you know, when my kids are going to, I don't know, soccer camp or, you know, the chorus trip, the emergency contact, the person that you put down as if I can't be reached. Right. Yes. And my kid needs to be taken to the town hospital. Who should you call? You know, you always kind of pause and think about it. If it's your sister, it's easy. And then otherwise it gets more complicated. And I got a phone call last summer, somebody asking me, could I be her contact for her kid who had a sort of a specific medical condition that due to my own personal history, I know something about.

27:47So I would know what to tell the nurse at the camp, like do this, don't do this. That's actually not helpful, but make sure you have this. And she's like, can I put you down? Even though you're not my sister or my sister-in-law, can you be the emergency contact for my kid? And I was really glad that she asked me. Right. And of course, like nothing came of it. The kid had a fine summer. but sort of thinking of those people ahead of time and formalizing those asks is a little weird. It's kind of like having a living will or something, but it seems to me that like I've never done that. I've never said to you, Hey, if you ever need me to get in the car at one in the morning, I'll do it.

28:17So, you know, I'm put me down. I'm on your short list. And it feels like asking somebody to go steady with you or something, but why don't we, why don't we know ahead of time that you got me and I got you? Why do we wait until this and then wonder?

28:29Angela Santomero:That's right. And I think this is somewhere where people who deal with chronic disease, people with special needs kids, like I have that network of like, listen, not everyone maybe is ready to take your kid with very specific needs for 12 hours. But like, I know your kid, I got him. Like if you need help, send your kid to me. Like this gets much more complicated with people who have big asks, you know, like, hey, watch my kid is an ass and it's worth doing and stuff. But like, I just think it's so great to have that point of view. And it's something I'm working on with myself of like, how can I really help the people who I know in specific ways that's not just like, I'll drop off a casserole.

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31:46Angela Santomero:And now the mom's performance for an audience awards from the What Fresh Health podcast. Our first nominee is Chrissy Engstrom from Dayton, Ohio, for her performance in I Can't Believe You're Acting Like This. My goodness, honey. I can't believe you are throwing a tantrum like this in Target. Oh, my goodness. Hitting. I have literally never seen you like this before. I am shocked by this completely out-of-character behavior. Next up is Tanisha Holland in Sorry We're Late. So, so sorry we're late. Some wouldn't find their shoes. Like I keep saying, put on your shoes. But I guess she must have heard, I'd love it if you'd find Mommy's lipstick and rub it all over the bathroom towels.

32:34Having kids is fun, huh? It's always an adventure.

32:38Angela Santomero:We recognize Sally Porter in You Will Not Speak to Me That Way. You hold on just one minute, young lady. You know I will not be spoken to that way at the grocery store. Oh, eye rolling? Absolutely not tolerated in my world, Missy. How dare you? A commanding performance by Sheila Martin in I Regret That My Son Just Said You're Ugly to You When You Said Hello. Jakey, you know we don't talk about people's appearances in public. Remember? We talked about this that time? You told the nice lady at the pharmacy she looked like a witch? And when you told the old man at church he's going to heaven soon?

33:20Yes, I want you to use your words. But just not those words. Let's go.

33:26Angela Santomero:And finally, Kate Piermont for her truly searing performance in look how quiet I am trying to keep you on this airplane. Okay, that's right. Get it out of your system, honey. Would you like a cracker? No, you'd rather kick the nice lady next to you in the face. That's a poor choice. It's a poor choice. Okay, only four more hours to go. Okay, let's try to stop shrieking, sweetheart. Ooh, let's ring the call button and see if they'll bring mommy in our seatmate a cocktail. Ladies, you are all winners to us. This has been the 2019 Moms Performance for an Audience Awards from the What Fresh Health Podcast.

34:13So I want to talk about, you know, does the big help have to be so big before you ask for help?

34:19Angela Santomero:We kind of front loaded this with like, OK, people are dying. People have horribly sick children. Right. Because I think that sometimes, again, access points, like sometimes those moments are actually easier to ask rather than like, I'm done. I got a two and a four year old. I can't take it for another second. Right. So Nora Bouchard, I talked about her before. She wrote this book called May Day, Asking for Help in Times of Need. She suggests that you actually like make it a practice, practice with smaller, lower stake asks. I mean, I am just like you, the Irish Catholic stock. No, I got it right now.

34:51I can carry the three bags and the three kids. I got it right. Like when I used to travel through airports with my three little ones, people would ask if they could help me. And I'd say, no, I don't know why. Like so that they could admire me as I walked away. Because you're insane. Yeah. I love to not need help.

35:06Angela Santomero:Because for the rest of time, they'd be like, one day I met a woman in an airport who could do it all. I shall sing the song of her glory forever. Yeah. Like maybe the one exception would be, yes, you can put that suitcase in the compartment for me because I'm like carrying a baby in a sling and have a two year old by the hand. But I love to not need help. I'm pretty attached to that independent, capable side of myself. You can bring home the bacon, fry it up in a pan, Amy. And never, never let you forget your Margaret. To quote, maybe, never let him forget he's a man. Back in my day. I mean, talk about an Odilex alert.

35:40Angela Santomero:That is best left in the past. That was a commercial that ran when we were children. It was Anjali fragrance, I believe. Yes. I'll put it in the show notes. So yeah. So Nora Bouchard says, actually practice with lower stake asks. And I like this. Jennifer said this on her Facebook group. She said, I can ask for help even if I can technically handle it, but I just want or need a break. I don't need to drive myself to the edge of the cliff before I ask. Yeah, I solve this by being like a wildly disorganized person who often forgets to pick my children up from school. So I have to have a small network of moms who I can turn to and be like, oops, forgot to pick one of them up.

36:13Angela Santomero:Could you grab them for me? This really like never really occurred to me like, wow, you don't have to wait until you really need help? You can just wait until you want help and then ask just somebody? Like that seems crazy to me. But what if it wasn't? Yeah, it's not. Despite all my Irish Catholicness, we recently in the post-COVID, post-vaccine world had our first family gathering. And not that it's a post-COVID world, but it was a vaccinated group of people and it was outside. Listen, I'm going to keep justifying myself, but it was fun. And it turned out to be at my house. And I wanted to host it, but it was three days because normally we would go to a restaurant one night and we would do that.

37:00Angela Santomero:So we're not going to restaurants. So it was going to turn out to be like three full meals for a large group of people at my house with like a lot of COVID protocol stuff. It was a big ask. And as we talked about it, I would have never done this 10 years ago. I was like, here's the thing. If I host, I'm not cooking anything. And so everyone else cooks something and bring it. And we'll get taken one night and then y 'all figure out the meals. And like, here's an email list. You guys figure it out. My sister figured out the meals. It was super relaxing. It worked out great. And I didn't have a moment.

37:33Angela Santomero:I let go of the thing where like, I'm going to do it all and get to be righteous and grumbly about how hard I work for everybody and no one appreciates me. Did have to let go of that satisfying moment. but it was super helpful because I said, this is a different circumstance and I'm going to need a lot more help than I usually get. And you know what? It worked out great. It was a good lesson. It's another good COVID lesson. Like being a superhero is so uninteresting. It's such a bore. Yeah. And there are seasons of this, right? Like there are times like you have 18 people coming for dinner, like you're going to need more help.

38:07There's times when you're, I don't know when these are seasonal. These are, these big asks are sort of they come and go. They're acute. their moments and for you to not be your usual independent capable self is what the doctor ordered for that moment in your life.

38:22Angela Santomero:Yep. And I do think that the flip side of the like, oh, it's so easy, see, is the chronic stuff where you feel like you're always asking for help and it's trying to like set up systems where you can be helpful and that that person can ask for stuff without overwhelming any individual person. because that does happen. And it's not because you're not a good friend. And it's not because the person is an over asker. It's because situations can get very overwhelming. Yeah. And if you're the person who's like, why is nobody seeing that I'm overwhelmed right now? Like one, maybe they're not. Two, maybe they didn't listen to this episode.

39:01I don't know. They don't have ideas, but you do have to be unafraid to ask for the thing and kind of have it ready. Like, oh God, I'm thinking of somebody in my life right now. Like, why have I not called this person over the last year and a half and offered actionable, specific help. I should have, you know, I could have, I would have, I didn't. I think this person is getting a lot of help, but that person in that situation, it's sometimes you look at it from the outside, like I wish I could help in some way. And then you, you know, the sleep of the righteous, because you had that if only thought.

39:31But if that person called me and said, I really need you to start bringing my daughter home from Girl Scouts every week until the end of the year. You would do it. I would be psyched, right?

39:40Angela Santomero:Yeah. And there's a truth somewhere in the middle because having been on both ends of this, I was once in an extremely bad accident and just like driving to the hospital. I mean, just staring at the window and being like, why are those people walking down the street? Why are those people sitting in a cafe? Like, don't they realize that this thing has happened? Things happen only to you. The ripples of that don't affect everybody. trauma is isolating. And so if you sit at home kind of stroking the orb of no one really cares about me because look at what they're not doing for me, you will find all the justification you ever need to like golem stroke that precious for the rest of your life.

40:25Angela Santomero:Because that is true that like, and I've seen people lose children, lose spouses, be involved in unbelievable tragedies. And you know what happens? Other people move on with their lives. That is the absolute nature of the world. And when it has happened to me, I have found it extremely isolating and painful. Like, but how could you guys just be having that event when you know this bad thing happened to me? Because that is the way of humanity and it stinks. And so don't sit at home like rubbing that preciousness of I'm all alone and no one cares. Ask for the help you need. At the same time, we can as friends realize that that is true, that like my life is extremely busy.

41:10Angela Santomero:I often say like I'm in a lifeboat with five people and it's taken on water. It's not a lot of time in my day where I'm looking around being like, how is that guy over there getting eaten by a shark doing? It's like not my problem. I got problems of my own and I do have problems of my own and they're real problems. And they may not be as big as other people's problems, but they take a lot of my mental energy. So I think we have to watch both stories. The story of no one cares about me and my problems, and I'm going to just sit at home and bask in how everyone else is doing great and laughing and not thinking about me.

41:42Angela Santomero:Wrong story. And I'm too busy. I have to keep my lifeboat from taking on water. I can't possibly be bothered with other people's problems. People can be bad noticers of how much you need help, right? Particularly if you're sort of an extremely capable person who likes to seem like they have their act together. But that doesn't mean because they're bad noticers that they aren't willing to take your daughter home from Girl Scouts every week for the rest of the year, right? Like even that person who's not really getting how much you need right now is probably very happy to be on the other end of a specific ask to be a good friend to help.

42:20It isn't like, can you, you're not asking your friend who has three kids of her own, can you move in with me and take care of my kids? You know, and sometimes these little things that would really lighten our load seem like these big asks. And I think they're not if you really sort of write them down and know what they are, right?

42:36Angela Santomero:I think what we've come to so clearly, and I hadn't thought about it in exactly this way. I like this lots of helpinghands.com thing. I like the like meal train. And I really like the meal trains that involve more like, I will shovel the snow. I will be your point person. Meals, I don't know anybody who's had a tragedy who didn't throw away 40 pounds of food. It's never happened because everybody is like, I'll be helpful by dropping off this lasagna. And it's like, okay, stop with the lasagnas and get on a Excel spreadsheet that says, I will pick up nighttime medications. I will drive kids on a minute's notice.

43:14Angela Santomero:I can do that Wednesday and Thursday any week, you know? Right. I will wrap all the Christmas presents this year, whatever needs to be done. Great. And I love the like, I'll pick up, try to think of the things maybe other people aren't. I'll walk the dog, but also I'll get the kids clothes for the funeral. And I think if we can get out of the storytelling of like, nobody really cares, look, and then we can get out of the storytelling of like, oh my God, that person is just like a drag on my life. And like, if I touch that quicksand, it's going to pull me under. We will all be better at asking for and giving really useful help to each other, which is fundamentally what we all want.

43:53Angela Santomero:There is nobody sitting around and like drumming their hands like Mr. Burns and being like, I love not helping my friend who's in crisis. Nobody's doing that. It's not happening. It makes us feel you're actually giving your friends a gift when they can be concretely helpful to you. But the onus is on you a little bit to be like the next time somebody says, if there's something I can do to help, let me know to say actually yes. Yeah. And stop telling yourself the story of I don't know that person well enough to ask for help and stop telling yourself the story of I don't know that person well enough to insert myself in their crisis.

44:24I mean, and you might. I definitely have sort of asked about stuff and kind of gotten the like come no closer thing. And that's OK. Now, wait a minute, because that's a really good point.

44:33Angela Santomero:Offering help once is very different than inserting yourself in other people's tragedy. There are definitely, I've definitely been involved in, especially, what's the word? Like, what's the word I'm looking for? It's not exciting tragedies, but like high profile tragedies or specifically, you know, dramatic tragedies that people do kind of come out of the woodwork wanting to be part of it in a specific way. Don't be that person. You go in, you offer help. You're not inserting yourself in terms of like, I am the person. You don't make it about yourself fundamentally. That's the difference. Yeah.

45:11Angela Santomero:Offer help. And if it's rejected, maybe offer help once more six months later. Right, right, right. Because that's the point. That's when somebody is like, gee, I really could use help now that everybody's gone home. Man, everybody knows it, but it's hard to do. Well, I think we've completely solved this completely complicated. But I'm getting it. I understand it now. No one ever will suffer during a tragedy again, Amy, thanks to us and our podcast, which is good to know. I know how to be a helper and I know how to ask for help more than I did 40 minutes ago. So thank you. It's a complicated dance and it's hard for so many reasons, but this is a good place for my husband's great advice, which is what if you just assumed good intent on that person's part.

45:56Angela Santomero:He was involved in an incident that was extremely tragic. And it was the kind of thing where people said a lot of the wrong things about it. And I was quite amazed by his ability to be like, I think I know what they're trying to say. Even though they said really a terrible, insensitive, kind of ugly thing. He and his family both kept saying, and I was so wowed by them, whatever people are going to say, because they don't know what to say, I'm just going to try to hear, I love you and I want to be here for you. And I was like, what miraculous people these people are to be able to try to do that in light of like, people doing it so wrong, you know, and really it was kind of a game changer for me.

46:46Angela Santomero:Like, yeah, what if we could just operate in this, like in from our place of maximum generosity? And what if we can assume when we're ready to ask for big help that other people are ready to say, I love you and I want to be here for you. Assume that that's the response instead of I'm kind of busy this week. If they're nasty and toxic, you're going to figure that out real quick. They're not going to slip by you. That's good information. All right. Now I think We've really solved it. We've extra solved. If we went on for 10 more minutes, Amy, we would. Now we've totally solved it. Super final solve it.

47:15Guys, will you follow us on Instagram if you don't already? We're at WhatFreshHellCast. I put all the episodes up on there and share funny memes you guys share with us. And we're having fun there. Come join us there.

47:26Angela Santomero:No pressure. But my kids are goofing on us that we do not have enough Instagram followers. And I can't really have that in my house, guys. I can't have it. Save me from my kids goofing on us that we don't have enough followers on Instagram. Please. That's some big help. That is some big help. Go help some people. Go ask for some help. And friends, we will talk to you next time. Bye-bye.

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