In short
How to give help that actually works for mom friends in crisis, and how to ask for the help you need without drowning in “I can’t / I can’t” or over-helping (e.g., 20 lasagnas).
Key claims
Be honest about what you can/can’t do; use a “coach/quarterback” (not the parent in crisis) to assign practical tasks; give specific offers (times, errands, handyman help) and provide “outs” when you’re asked; support should continue beyond the first week (check in months later); small gestures can be enough (“be somebody tall”); avoid awkwardness by “comfort in, dump out” and respecting concentric-circle boundaries.
Guests
Margaret Aples and Amy Wilson (hosts of What Fresh Hell? Laughing in the Face of Motherhood).
Notable examples
a friend texting “on my way to the drugstore” for ibuprofen + popsicles; meal cards and frozen meal stock-ups; taking kids for hospital/field trip photos; “team quarterback” spreadsheets/meal trains; Dairy Queen blizzards for a new mom; a 5-pound cookie as a “takes the edge off” gesture; frozen meals for future weeks; lice shampoo + favorite coffee drink.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOThe Importance of Helping Friends
1:00 to 2:45
Discussing the challenges of giving and asking for help among moms.
“Hello, everyone, and welcome to What Fresh Hell?”
Finding Effective Ways to Help
2:45 to 5:28
Exploring practical suggestions for providing help during crises.
“One of the pitfalls is I always say yes, and yet I resent everyone because I'm the person who's always helping.”
Managing Help During a Crisis
5:28 to 8:08
How to manage help effectively when someone is in crisis.
“If my sister's in crisis, I would try to be like, I'm coach.”
The Challenges of Asking for Help
8:08 to 14:18
Understanding the difficulty of asking for help during tough times.
“You have to be realistic about there is a bit of a statue of limitations, a statute of limitations.”
The Challenges of Asking for Help
14:58 to 16:34
Understanding the difficulty of asking for help during tough times.
“Osea's marine screen is rooted in nature and backed by science.”
Listener Support Discussion
16:54 to 17:18
We discuss ways moms can support each other through tough times.
Practical Help: Meal Support
17:18 to 19:15
Different ideas on how to provide meal support for parents in need.
“Yeah and clever and in unusual ways you might not have thought of.”
Specific Asks for Help
19:15 to 21:00
The importance of making specific requests when offering help.
“these toys are not going to unpack themselves in the playroom.”
Check-Ins After a Crisis
21:00 to 22:51
The value of checking in on loved ones in the months after a crisis.
“Anna had a particular thing about when somebody's moving that you take their little children out of the house for the move.”
Thoughtful Gestures in Tough Times
22:51 to 26:50
Small gestures of support that can make a big difference.
“It's like if everyone would donate a little bit of blood all the time would be fine.”
Show all 19 chapters
Sharing the Parenting Load
26:50 to 28:00
Discussing how sharing responsibilities can alleviate stress.
“I'll tell you one time the cookie did not do the trick for me was when in our apartment building, our hose from our washer broke in the middle of the night and there was water everywhere.”
The Importance of Community Support
28:00 to 30:13
Learn how community support can help parents in difficult situations.
“or next to her in the chair or whatever.”
The Importance of Community Support
30:33 to 31:47
Learn how community support can help parents in difficult situations.
“Amy, my part-time job lately has been refereeing the fights between my kids who fight like cats about our cats whose turn it is to scoop the litter box.”
Embracing Imperfection in Motherhood
31:52 to 34:09
Explore the acceptance of being an imperfect parent and supporting each other.
“Sure, some moms do it all and we're all for that.”
The Challenge of Asking for Help
34:09 to 37:08
Discuss the difficulty of asking for help and how to overcome it.
“And I do think this is something that we can offer other people.”
Navigating Grief and Support
37:08 to 41:41
Learn how to navigate grief and provide support without being intrusive.
“And I have a friend who said to me, and it struck me so much that her dad had died.”
Comfort in and Dumping Out
41:41 to 42:02
Understand the principle of comforting those in need while managing your own stress.
“And so like, you know, somebody sending you a nice letter about the time that your mom did something nice.”
The Importance of Humble Help
42:02 to 43:48
Learn how small acts of support can be impactful and necessary in crises.
“I knew the people involved in the middle.”
Advice for Aspiring Helpers
43:48 to 45:00
Discover practical tips on how to effectively help others without seeking recognition.
“The humbleness to know your role in any given situation is something you have to check in with yourself about.”
Transcript
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0:39Amy Wilson:I found a five-pound cookie. What fresh hell. Laughing in the face of motherhood. I'm dealing with my sick kid. Can I help you with your sick kid at the same time? With Margaret Aples and Amy Wilson. Best Sister is definitely taken. A podcast that solves today's parenting dilemmas so you don't have to. Guess we could use some popsicles.
1:08Amy Wilson:Hello, everyone, and welcome to What Fresh Hell? Laughing in the Face of Motherhood. This is Margaret. And this is Amy. And today we're going to talk about how to really show up when our mom friends need help. What actually helps when people need help? Yeah, because we want to help. Everybody wants to help. I think there's very few people who are like, Amy, I hope she rots. Nobody doesn't want to help, but helping is hard. And asking for help is hard and giving help is hard. And we just were talking before we started, like besides dropping off a lasagna, which is definitely nice and you definitely need that, but you don't need 20 of them.
1:40And in these moments, it can be really hard to know like how to help without helping too much. Does that make sense to you?
1:47Amy Wilson:And being helpful in a way that's actually helpful. I have a lot of thoughts on this, Amy. Where do you want to start us off? Well, I want to say that part of the problem right now, I think, is that it feels like everybody's in crisis. Like, I can't ask for help and I can't give help because we're all drowning. And I think that that's maybe a little bit left over from the pandemic and not exactly true. And then it kind of is true. Like, everybody I know has at least one sick kid right now. One of my kids has walking pneumonia. For sure. Fever, this, that, and the practicalities of, like, I would like to go over and help my sister whose kid is on like week three of fever, but I can't because I don't want to get it because then I have another family member who's in the hospital and I can't get sick right now.
2:27And it further complicates just showing up for each other.
2:30Amy Wilson:I'm glad you started there. This is something I want to say about this. I think that there is a very important core helping thing around this. Honesty is the best policy and being as transparent as possible about what you are and are not able to do. One of the pitfalls is I always say yes, and yet I resent everyone because I'm the person who's always helping. And then that leads to other people saying, I don't want to ask because I don't want to put them out. Try to say in these conversations, and I've had people say this to me, I'm going to ask you something. It's okay to say no, here's my backup plan if you can't do it.
3:13Amy Wilson:You know, like giving people an out when I ask for help. I just had a situation where one of the kids was doing a thing at school, a presentation. I was working and my husband was out of town. I called my niece, who I knew was around, but not around conveniently for her. And I said, this would be great if you could come, take my other kids, show up, take the pictures, be the representative of the family. But if that's not possible, I do have a friend that I can ask. And so it would be a friend instead of a family member, but that would also be fine. And trying to set up the ask as something that you can get out of.
3:54If you are the person in crisis, asking for help can be something you literally don't have time to do. And it can also be exhausting when you're getting 40 and 50 incomings. Please let me know if there's anything I can do, which is on the one hand, a total cop out. But also, I've definitely been that person and been like, I don't know what I can do right now. I don't know. But I want to know. Please let me know. The person who's in crisis does not have time to be with the clipboard. Like, can you take the dog to be groomed? There might be something you could really do to help. That would actually be helpful.
4:23And you want to help. And the person who's in crisis can't be in charge of assigning tasks. But that is sort of where we end up. And then we all drop off a lasagna and like, you know, bite our nails and hope that we're doing what we're supposed to be doing.
4:36Amy Wilson:I have suggestions. Okay. Having gone through this with a couple of different crisis situations, I think it's a great idea if you can do it to have when you're in crisis, your closest, most helpful person be team quarterback, you know, or team coach, really the coach who says, OK, there's eight positions that need to be played. Amy, you're going to play lasagna dropper offer. Susie, you're going to do anything that has to do with picking up prescriptions. Julie, you're on food and trying to make sure that there's food going out. And now there are meal trains and lots of other things that you can do to like help actually organize the kind of support that people need.
5:23Amy Wilson:And I think on a meal train now you can sign up for different kinds of tasks. Having people play zones and getting a little bit organized on that. If my sister's in crisis, I would try to be like, I'm coach. I'm head coach. here's the things that need to be done. I'm going to make and keep the spreadsheet about what needs to be done. Whenever anyone says, how can I help you give them just my phone number and they can text me and say, how can I help? And I can say, all right, we need three days a week of pickups. One of the kids has Girl Scouts on Fridays. Do you know the person who runs Girl Scout troop?
5:58Amy Wilson:Can they find somebody to get the rides? And so to have a person who is not the person in crisis being the quarterback, I think can be really, really helpful. This reminds me of a movie set. I have a good friend who's a movie producer. He wears many hats, but basically his job is to get between the director who's trying to direct the scene and the person who has a question for him. This producer has worked with this director forever. This producer knows everything from what the director wants for lunch to like, should the background look like this? And his job is to run interference. Don't bother the director.
6:34And 10 years ago, one of my friends had a true crisis, like reporters calling the house crisis. And one of her dear friends, again, just sort of decided, I'm going to hang out in the kitchen and I'm going to answer the phone. Like that's my job. And nobody's getting to her unless they go through me and I'll take your number. Just being that person and seeing that need and anticipating it can be so crucial. And I feel like it's almost, it's of course a nightmare, but it's also easier when there's a huge crisis and literally everything has to be done. Like the parent has to go stay at the hospital with one kid.
7:08There are three other kids to be taken care of. It all of a sudden becomes clear. It's when these things get a little bit of, they might not be a crisis, but they're a crisis for your friend when she has COVID and so does her toddler. And how do you help like in little ways?
7:21Amy Wilson:They're harder. That's right. The big ticket crisis brings out, the marquee crisis brings everybody out, right? It brings out the crowds. I have friends who've said I have friends who have lost their spouses and I have friends whose spouses have left or gotten a divorce. The friends whose spouse has died unexpectedly get a ton more help. You know, like somebody dying is like, oh, I know how to do this. Somebody like your husband had an affair. It's like, oh, I don't think I want to get involved. It seems like I'm in their business if I bring a lasagna. And so I think it's important to give voice to the help you need.
8:00Amy Wilson:And this is another part, and it's a little controversial. At a certain point, you as the person in crisis, you have to get on the team at some point. You have to be realistic about there is a bit of a statue of limitations, a statute of limitations. I listen to podcasts and it always drives me crazy when people say statue of limitations. And I just said it. I'm always like, it's statute of limitations. I think sometimes what happens is a person goes through a crisis, they become nonfunctional, people rally around to help. At a certain point, you have to like be on your own team, but you have to map out a path back.
8:38Amy Wilson:Because otherwise, I think people get a little bit wary of like, I cannot get into that quicksand because I'm going to drown too. I think giving voice to as much as possible can be really helpful in that. Like, hey, it's been six weeks. I know you're still drowning, but what I'm seeing out here as the coach is like, okay, the meals are starting to dry out. Like, what's our plan for starting to walk out of the darkness? The level of support that is pouring in comes in at a fire hose and slows to a trickle at that at some point. Especially at a time where it feels like everybody's got their something and people don't have anything to give.
9:15Amy Wilson:And there's very few times when we as moms of any age kids who are in marriages who are trying to meet our mortgage payments who are working one or two jobs. People do not have limitless resources to give to other people. And I think the thing that often goes wrong in this situation is that the stories start to become, all right, everyone's given up on me. They were willing to help for a little while, but now they've all given up on me. I think being able to voice stuff as much as possible as it's happening is helpful. And it can be hard to have those conversations because everyone wants it to be like, Amy's my best friend.
9:55Amy Wilson:She's like a sister to me. I'd do anything for her. The reality is you would not do anything for her. You're not going to take food off of your own table and give it to Amy. You have to be a little bit more realistic about what kind of help you can offer other people. Otherwise, to the helpers, it feels like throwing stuff in a bottomless pit. And to you, it feels like, oh, well, people are busy protecting themselves rather than helping me. One of the other things that occurs to me that is tough in these situations. And again, I think we should talk not just about the person who lost their house in a fire, but like your friend whose both kids are sick at once and so is she, right?
10:30Those are both people that need help and different rules apply. But for like the big crisis, I'm thinking of something that happened recently where a friend really did require a GoFundMe page to be set up. Who is going to do that, right? Is it her immediate family member that's supposed to do that? Is it the next door neighbor? Like who gets to tell that story? When does it get put up on social media? Who clears it? You know, like all that kind of stuff. You do not want to overstep. When do you share that? I'm not allowed to press send until somebody else press send. And who gets to do that in support of a family who does not have time for this stuff right now?
11:04Amy Wilson:They're just trying to get through the next hour. They don't want to answer 40 questions about a GoFundMe while they're trying to like actually survive the day. Right. And yet it shouldn't be nobody sets it up. It can be like, where am I in these rings? I would like to think that maybe the way to get to make this less hard and less uncomfortable is to get better at doing it like in little ways more often for smaller crisis. I'm definitely like, I got this. Nobody needs help. Nothing to see here. Everything's fine. I am that kind of person. and that maybe we need to be better at like giving help and getting help in tiny ways.
11:38I saw this on Twitter and I loved it. In this moment where like everybody's kid has been sick for three weeks kind of thing. A mom that I know, her name is Megan. She posted this because it was so kind. It like brought her to tears. Her friend texted her, I'm on my way to the drugstore. I have to get ibuprofen for my kid. Do you need any? And she was like, yes, I do. And her friend was like, no problem. Anything else? Yeah, I guess we could use some popsicles. And this is a small, tiny, I'm dealing with my sick kid. Can I help you with your sick kid at the same time? Yes, I can. And then tomorrow, you know, her spouse will go to the drugstore and get something for them.
12:09Like, that's how we're going to get through this stuff by in all moments being like, can I lighten your load a little bit today instead of waiting for the GoFundMe to go up?
12:18Amy Wilson:Yeah, I think that's really true. and I recently had the same kind of thing. I have a friend who works and will get caught up at work and will text me and say, hey, can you run my kids home? Because I'm not going to make pickup today. And it's almost never a problem. And occasionally, if I can't do it, my husband's around, whatever, it works out fine. And then I had this situation where I was going to be away for the performance. My niece said she would come, but the kid who's in the performance needs to get dropped off 45 minutes before and then the other kids need to eat. Well, how's it all going to work?
12:48Amy Wilson:So not purposely, but I thought, oh, my friend who I often drive the kids, let me see. And she wrote me back and she said, I am so thrilled to be able to help with this and like pay back all the times you've driven my kid home. And offering people the opportunity to help can be a gift as well. And that's something that we shouldn't forget. So much more to say about this topic when we come back. Summer is finally here and I have a kid who will be working outside for the next eight weeks. But thanks to Drip Drop, their hydration needs are covered. Drip Drop is doctor-developed, proven fast hydration that helps your body and mind work better.
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15:05Amy Wilson:Amy, let me double-click, as we like to say, on the lightweight aspect. That means it doesn't give you the whole white, ghostly, am I partly a mime look, makeup layers over it easily. It feels nice, and that means I actually wear it. Osea's new marine screen is sunscreen for the sun you live in. And right now, we have a special discount just for you. Get 10 % off your first order site-wide with code FRESH at OseaMalibu.com. Really love Osea. The code is FRESH at O-S-E-A Malibu.com. So I just did the closet swap, right? I got out all my summer clothes and I immediately thought, huh, a lot of this I didn't really like last summer either.
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16:54Amy Wilson:We started with a post from our listener Gretchen who said moms parents supporting other moms how have we been supported by others like this podcast thank you very much what can we do to support others because this parenting thing is tough and that was sort of the germ of our idea for this episode and we posted this question how are we supporting and how have we seen this done in good ways and we got some great answers. Yeah and clever and in unusual ways you might not have thought of. Around the meals thing, I thought this was pretty genius. Jen said after a mom had surgery, people were asked to bring kid-friendly meals only.
17:32She says this was brilliant because the husband just ate whatever. The mom just had surgery. She wasn't eating. And the kids were getting their chicken nuggets and broccoli on the table every night. They don't need chicken a la grec being delivered from the Greek restaurant. They won't eat it. Makes so much sense.
17:46Amy Wilson:Yeah. I mean, we've definitely had this problem in terms of like, you get the 19 lasagnas. Some of them have the wrong ingredients and the kid thinks it's strange and they won't eat it. And spinach in it. Yeah. God forbid, don't put spinach in the lasagna, please. My kids will not eat it. There's something green in here. The meal drop off. It can be hard because sometimes it's like, er. Megan suggested food gift cards. And one thing I would say, especially now with food delivery, it gives me a little bit of an excuse to get food delivery if I have a food gift card. It lets me say like, all right, I can pay a little bit more to get it delivered because I have this food gift card.
18:23Amy Wilson:I deserve this. We have another listener who suggested that a neighbor's friend's father passed away. She was at Costco. She got a bunch of frozen meals and dropped them on the doorstep in a cooler to have around when you're going to need them. Like you were saying, like six weeks from now, I don't really want to have to think about what's for dinner either. And all the lasagna's will have been thrown out by then. And she gave her like a frozen meals stock up for that time, which I thought was pretty thoughtful. Yeah, I think it's great. And I think that meals tend to be the easiest access point.
18:51Amy Wilson:And so watch going overboard on meals where you end up. Don't all stock their freezer. It was, I love that so many people thought of us, but man, when my mom died for a year, I couldn't look at lasagna or ziti, you know, I mean, and so many people brought meals and it was lovely. But I mean, on day six, after my mom died, everyone was like, we have to eat more lasagna. We have 20 more to go people. It became like, like you say about the kids, these toys are not going to unpack themselves in the playroom. I mean, the grim determination with which we were shoveling lasagna into our mouth. Nobody's flying home until this lasagna is gone.
19:28Amy Wilson:Oh, my God. Exactly. We were like, thank you for coming to the wake. As a parting gift, we would like to offer you nine pieces of lasagna. Becca said she had a friend say, I'm free from like 12 to 3 on Tuesday. Bring your kids over. I'm going to feed them and they can play with my kids at the house and I'll drive them home later. So you're feeding the other person's kids and taking care of them for them. Double whammy. I am a big, big fan of the specific ask. Rather than what can I do to help, I would say, Amy, I'm free Tuesday and Thursday nights and I live near a pharmacy and a grocery store.
20:03Amy Wilson:So on Tuesday and Thursday nights when you need anything, please put me at the top of your call list. or a different example. My husband is extremely handy. He can go in and look at basically any problem and fix it. Like from your screen door isn't latching correctly to... The ice maker isn't working. Your computer isn't biting up the ice maker. Handyman tasks, call me. Any handyman tasks that need to be done. Like I try very hard to think of a specific ask. It can be really hard. We just had a family member who was quite sick, who were far away from. And we sent meal cards. And it can be hard when you're farther away, when you can't offer that specific kind of help.
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20:45Amy Wilson:You know, I did try to call the quarterback, her sister, and say, what could they use tonight? Can we send something for the kids to play with, like a new toy for the kids to play with? And just even still trying to make specific asks. What do you think they need? What would be helpful? Anna had a particular thing about when somebody's moving that you take their little children out of the house for the move. So the kids aren't underfoot. Nobody's in danger. They have a nice day. And then she added, make sure to let your friends use your broom and vacuum after the movers have driven away and they've got to like deliver their house sort of clean.
21:18Amy Wilson:That's so smart. That's another good example of like moving or if you're sick, hey, can I, why don't I take the kids home from school and just keep them for the night so you can sleep ball day. Specific asks, and those are smaller things, which I like a lot. I can think of two different times, just knowing that your kid is being taken care of out of your sight by somebody that you trust, which is really just like a fellow parent who gets it. Two times I had a kid in the hospital and I got, I remember both times, got pictures of one of my other kids living their happy usual life. One was on a field trip and one was in a concert that I couldn't go to from other moms.
21:55Here's your kid, you know, picking pumpkins and smiling with Tobias. He's fine. They're doing fine out here. Yeah, he's absolutely fine. And that is so small. And do you see that? I remember those gestures 10 years later, like, don't worry about your other ones. They're fine. That is a truly concrete way to help.
22:12Amy Wilson:I have another suggestion. And this is again, I'm Amy's going to be day to day and I'm going to be big tragedies today. Okay. But when something happens, I try to set an alarm on my phone for the day, not the day of the tragedy, but like for one month out, two months out, three months out to check in on that day and be like, hey, how are you doing now? What can you use? Because what I find having been through this with a bunch of people is that it's the week after is the 10 ,000 lasagnas and the 4 million offers. It's like blood donations after a tragedy. Like they say they get completely overwhelmed.
22:49Amy Wilson:They end up throwing out some of the blood. It's like if everyone would donate a little bit of blood all the time would be fine. But what happens is like after a big tragedy, like everyone donates blood and trying to mark a year out to say like once a month, check in and say like, hey, what could you use? Hey, how about I take the kids out on Saturday? You know, whatever it is, find an offer going way into the future versus the week after. I love that. I am going to swing back the other way, though. And I'm going to give you some really good ideas of things to do right then, like in the immediate moment that aren't donating blood or bringing a lasagna.
23:23Love it. Guys, this is a really good one. Candice, she just had a baby. Her twin sister brought over four Dairy Queen blizzards when she came for the first time to see the baby. They were for the mama. She put them in the freezer. Well, she gave one to her sister who was holding the baby and put the other three in the freezer. She cleaned up in the kitchen while she was there. But how about that? What a thoughtful new mother gift.
23:43Amy Wilson:Candice's sister gets sister of the year. I mean, we had husband of the year awards for the bird call husband and the angry pumpkin squash husband. Yes. But we need to hold like an award ceremony in my backyard at some point, Amy, and we'll get trophies. It's pretty early in 2023. But Candace's sister, like I can't really see anybody beating this. No, I mean, four lizards. Pick another category, guys, because best sisters. Yeah, no, best sister is definitely taken. You know how like the trophies get bigger, Like there's like a little cup and then at the end it's got like four stanchions and like eight layers, like a wedding cake on a trophy.
24:21Kenna was on the phone with her best friend when the school called on the other line and she found out that her kids had lice. Her best friend was at her house within the hour with a bag full of lice shampoo and Kenna's favorite coffee shop drink in the largest size available.
24:35Amy Wilson:I mean, that's a good friend of the year is also gone now. I mean, this is the problem. All of our awards are taken for the whole year. Did she take the lice out of Kenna's kid's hair for Kenna? No. No, she didn't. But she brought her the pumpkin spice frappuccino. Nobody has a friend that good. It's a dangerous game, Amy, because I don't want a lot of people ringing my doorbell when I'm having a problem. But showing up versus, hey, if I can ever help, let me know. There's a chasm between those two things. But I get it. You don't want to be intrusive either. But you can also always just show up, leave a note that says, here's the day I'm available.
25:16Amy Wilson:Here's a little bit of food and go. Go. Well, look at this. I mean, these two have in common, like one was like, she brought me something from Dairy Queen and one is something she brought me something from the coffee shop. It isn't like she brought me the perfect solution to all my problems, right? And enough money to pay my bills for the next six months. She just showed up with this coffee drink I like. Well, I'm about to be super corny, but it is really, I mean, Amy, it's the thought that counts. But I remember at some point, my sister-in-law was in this crisis situation and we were trying to think of ways to help.
25:48Amy Wilson:And I was being very like, OK, we should set up this and that and all these practical solutions. My other sister was like, I found a five pound cookie. Like it's a cookie that weighs five pounds. It's like the size of like a pizza. That's what I found. And it's a five pound cookie. And she had written us to be like, I'm thinking of sending her this. And I was composing the text to be like, that is just not practical. she really needs when we really think about it what she actually needs is for us to research this 82 things that will help her in her situation by the time I composed the text I literally think we were recording when the text came in so I didn't get it and then by the time we got off she was like okay cookie scent and I was like oh yeah that's it meanwhile my sister-in-law was so delighted with this cookie there was no as we like to say because I stole it from our friend Mark This can't be fixed.
26:42Amy Wilson:Like there are so many situations that can't be fixed. And sometimes a five pound cookie just takes the edge off and that's enough. I'll tell you one time the cookie did not do the trick for me was when in our apartment building, our hose from our washer broke in the middle of the night and there was water everywhere. And we flooded the apartment below. And I mean, it was 20 years ago, guys. Sent a five pound cookie. I sent them like a big cookie like and we hadn't even met them yet. Sorry, I forgot the very important detail. We had lived in this building for like two weeks and I wasn't using the washer.
27:13It just like broke in the middle of the night and just destroyed their home. But you'd never said hello, destroyed their home. And here's a cookie. Somehow that didn't that didn't that didn't patch the wounds. Not fully that fully. But I was the problem. I was the monster.
27:26Amy Wilson:So I guess, you know, a cookie doesn't really. They were like, take your cookie and shove it. Yeah. I mean, listen, there's no guarantees in this life, people. We can't promise you that a cookie is going to solve all of your problems. But it's the present. It's like, I'm thinking of you. It's a small gesture. Here's another one. Anna, her daughter was six when her little brother arrived via C-section and Anna was in bed, you know, and with the newborn in her C-section. And a neighbor dropped off a little basket of presents for her daughter, who was six, like word search, little Legos things. And it was stuff that her daughter could do while like hanging out with her mom in bed or next to her in the chair or whatever.
28:04It was like she could stay still and play with these things. And that's a huge gift for this mom. That's a great angle to bring something for the other kids, the siblings of the kid that the parent is dealing with.
28:15Amy Wilson:Yeah, I love that. This category, I think, is something that I wouldn't have thought of, but I love it. Kristen says, the first time my three-year-old daughter had a tick, I freaked out and bought her to my neighbor mom, who calmly removed it. On my way to her house, I had that feeling Amy talks about, okay, where are the adults? It can't be me. Yes. Yeah, it is that thing of I think sometimes what we're looking for in so many of these situations, and I would not have put this fine point on it until I read this. Sometimes we're just looking to like call uncle and have someone else step in and be like, oh, I can adult for you for the next four days or the next like 15 minutes.
28:56Like, yes, exactly. You know, there's a mouse under my stove and I can't handle it because my spouse just got deployed. Right. Like that's also showing up for somebody. And I don't know. You have to be pretty close to somebody to know that she needs you to get the mouse. Like, who are you going to call? Who are you going to call when your spouse has got deployed and there's a mouse under the stove and you don't want to be the adult? I sometimes think like, I hope I have enough of those people. I hope I've done the work of creating that village. I have a thought about that. We'll be right back.
29:21Amy Wilson:Oh, Amy, between swimming and sweating, summer is basically bad hair season at my house. But we found a solution. It's Nutrafol. Nutrafol is the number one dermatologist recommended hair growth supplement brand. And it's the number one hair growth supplement brand personally used by dermatologists. Nutrafol's hair growth supplements are peer reviewed, NSF certified for sport and clinically tested. And what I love is it's not a one-size-fits-all approach. Nutrafol offers multiple formulas for men and women tailored to different life stages like postpartum or menopause and lifestyle factors such as a plant-based diet.
30:04Amy Wilson:So you get the support that's right for you. Let your hair be one less thing to worry about. See visibly thicker, stronger, faster growing hair in three to six months with Nutrafol. For a limited time, Nutrafol is offering our listeners$10 off your first month's subscription and free shipping when you visit Nutrafol.com and enter promo code laughing. That's Nutrafol.com spelled N-U-T-R-A-F-O-L dot com promo code laughing. Amy, my part-time job lately has been refereeing the fights between my kids who fight like cats about our cats whose turn it is to scoop the litter box. But we have found a miracle solution.
30:48Amy Wilson:It's the Whisker Litter Robot. There's nothing to fight about because it does the scooping for you. The Whisker Litter Robot automatically cycles after every use and it notifies you when the unit needs attention so you're not handling waste or scooping daily. Plus, the Whisker app gives you real-time notifications that help track your cat's behavior and routines. And let me tell you, you know I'm a super sniffer and the Litter Robot smells way better than a conventional litter box. I'm not going to lie, it has changed my daily quality of life for the better. And the cats like it too. Litter robot bundles make it easy to get fully set up while saving you money.
31:28Find the litter robot that's right for you, whether you have one cat or five.
31:32Amy Wilson:The future is feline. Learn more about Whisker litter robot models and starter kits today and take an additional$50 off bundles with code FRESH. That's an additional$50 off bundles with code FRESH. Visit whisker.com slash fresh to shop now. Sure, some moms do it all and we're all for that. But we are also here for those moms who maybe aren't acing their mom game every single day. And now some shout outs for all you just OK moms out there from the What Fresh Hell podcast. Hey, just getting by, mom. You only forgot to pick up your kids from school one day this month. That's almost certainly better than some other mom out there somewhere.
32:18Amy Wilson:Listen, disorganized mom. The thing to remember is that you took your kid to the birthday party. The fact that you had no gift and were also there on the wrong day are problems, but you did try. So we say, go you. Heads up, lazy mom. We don't think you're bailing on cooking dinner. We think you are doing your part to keep the pizza delivery economy of this great nation humming. Thanks, friend. Yo, slacker mom. Sure, one of those fancy PTA moms ran a fundraiser that raised like 10 grand to fund a whole new tech department at her elementary school. But look at you. You've practically funded a new wing of the town library by racking up giant fines every month for that copy of the third Harry Potter book your kid can't seem to find.
33:04We salute you. Helicopter moms are the worst, right? That's not you, distracted mom. You spent your kid's entire soccer tournament scrolling through Instagram and Facebook and missed two goals and an assist by your kiddo. Way to help him develop an independent mindset. Oh, yeah, PJ mom.
33:25Amy Wilson:Those pajamas totally look like pants to us. Someone glared at your robe at school drop off. Not us, baby. We think you're totally pulling off those slippers as hip fuzzy clogs.
33:46Amy Wilson:my sister kate talks about she has a um they call it the socialist cleaning service but it's a group of friends who go and clean each other's houses first of all it's a great idea and it's like everybody kind of helps each other out but the big job of the cleaners who come into your house is to clean your area of shame. Like this is the thing you can't face. And everybody's different, right? Yeah. And like this, the way that the litter box has like spread all over and it's so awful and I'm a bad person because this is in my house that your friends come in and they're like, yeah, super gross, but I have a mask and gloves on and like, I don't really care.
34:22Amy Wilson:And it took me 20 minutes to do. And I do think this is something that we can offer other people. Maybe not a mouse. I don't think I love anybody enough to go get a mouse out of their house, But being able to let people into your problems is a big obstacle to, I mean, I think you and I both really pride ourselves on being capable. And what gets in our way is being able to say like, I can't, you know. And I think that even in working together, the times both of us in the many years we've been doing this have had times that we kind of have a shorthand to be like, I'm going to have a bad week at work this week.
35:00Amy Wilson:And I just need you to know that I'm not 100 % this week. That we, because we've worked together for long enough and been through stuff together, having just the ability to say, I don't need to justify with how big and bad my problem is. just know that this is not my week and I'm going to be on the struggle bus this week. And then I'll pick up some of your work or you'll pick up some of my work, whatever it is. I think about Heather Chauvin, who we had on the podcast, who's a busy mom doing everything and getting it all done. She was diagnosed then with stage four cancer. She said it took being diagnosed with stage four cancer for me to free myself from all of these burdens.
35:40Amy Wilson:And that the lesson she wants people to take from that is it's okay on a Tuesday to say, I'm drowning today. I don't know why it's a Tuesday, because if I came to you and I said, Amy, I have stage four cancer, you would say, hey, let me drop everything. I will record the podcast. So I will find get like I will do everything. Yeah. But one of the things that I value in our partnership is that I can say, Amy, this week, I'm just maxed out. It's just I'm right. You don't have to earn it. You can just ask for it. I don't have to earn it. That's exactly well said. What a gift to our friends and for our friends to give us to say, you don't have to earn my help by being in your worst situation.
36:24Amy Wilson:It can just be a Tuesday. And I trust that you can say to me, hey, I'm drowning this week. And I can say, do you need meals? You want me to take the kids? Do you want me to stop by the pharmacy? I have a lot of friends like this who, whenever I say, oh, my husband's out of town. Hey, is there anything you need help with? Like, that's just their reaction. But it starts with me saying, hey, here's the problem. And when I'm so busy tap dancing and putting on my brave face to say, I'm always great. You know me. It's me. I'm always doing great. Like, no worries over here that I rob people of the gift of being able to help me.
37:04Amy Wilson:And they do want to help. Right. It's very easy to see from the outside. You want to help the person who's in that situation. And I think on the flip side of that, another thing I would say about help, and this does go back to big tragedy stuff, often, I think when other people experience something that we don't understand, or we feel nervous about for any reason, whether it's the loss of a parent, the loss of a child, a divorce, their husband got caught cheating, it's awkward, It's whatever that we can sometimes feel that inserting ourselves in that situation is intrusive. And I have a friend who said to me, and it struck me so much that her dad had died.
37:45Amy Wilson:And my dad says this about losing my mom, that people don't talk about that person anymore because they're worried about bringing it up and making it awkward. My cousin said to me when her dad passed away that somebody said, well, I didn't want to remind you of it. And she's like, I'm not I didn't forget. I'll never forget. And Rob Delaney, who just wrote a book about the loss of his son. I saw him on Gayle King's show and he was saying she came back to the dressing room. And as she went to say hello to him, she started crying. Thinking about that he had lost his child. Is that why she was crying?
38:15Amy Wilson:the loss of his child and that she was like, oh, I was sort of embarrassed. And he's like, it's the best thing that's happened to me in a month. The fact that like it was so alive for you. I understand both sides of it. It can feel really awkward. I was in a situation where someone I knew had something pretty scandalous happen in her life that was like very bad and embarrassing. There was a part of me that was like, I think maybe it's best to never say anything about this. But I was in a situation where I had to interact in a way that was awkward, that was saying basically like, because of this situation, you can't participate in X and Y event.
38:53Amy Wilson:I mean, it was bad. I did not know this person super well. And it sounds very self praising to me. But like, I kind of got up the courage to write an email that said, I know what is going on. I mean, we both know what's going on. It's like in the news. It's that kind of situation. Like you said, it's reporters calling the house. It's bad. I know this must be really hard. And I know we don't know each other well. But if you ever need anything, reach out. And I understand the instinct of like, because on the flip side, there are people who do kind of like love to insert themselves in everybody else's drama.
39:28Amy Wilson:But I think it never hurts to make a call. I had somebody after my mom died who I didn't know super, super well. And they wrote me this quite long, lovely email about a time in their life where they were having trouble making a decision and that my mom had sat down with them and maybe taking them to lunch and helped make this decision they felt had had this really positive outcome in their life. And it wasn't someone I knew well, but like, in what world would I reply to that email and being like, stop inserting yourself in my tragedy? Like, it was a beautiful gift that this person gave me. And I have tried to take the lessons of that to always say like, hey, this seems like a difficult situation.
40:10Amy Wilson:I'm not going to show up at your door and start knocking and be like, let's be friends and I'll be part of what's going on here. But at the same time, I do try to say all the time to people I know who've lost people and whatever. Like, you know, I was thinking about your kid the other day. I was thinking about your husband the other day. I had this really great memory of them. Read the room. If it's not going well, I get it. But I just think people, you have to fight that instinct to be like, I don't want to be the person to bring up so-and-so's tragedy because we're having a good time. Like they're always thinking about that person.
40:44You've seen, I'm sure, I'll find the link and put it in the show notes, the idea that for in response to grief or crisis that you should comfort in and dump out. Have you heard this? That there are concentric circles. Remind me because I have. You know, like say a kid who had an accident, had to be airlifted to a special hospital. The parents are in the inner circle with that kid. And maybe like the grandparents are in the next circle. You can call your friend and say like, oh, my God, I can't. This seems really hairy. This seems such and go. I don't know what's going to do. You may not do that to the grandmother of the child or the mother of the child.
41:17You're doing comfort in and take your stress or worry or bad feeling or overwhelm elsewhere.
41:24Amy Wilson:where my friend's child has an accident and is in the hospital. I go to that person with right. How can I help? How can I be here? Blah, blah, blah. And then I call you who doesn't know anybody. And I say, I'm really overwhelmed by this friend. It's so awful. Right. Comfort in dump out. That's smart advice. And so like, you know, somebody sending you a nice letter about the time that your mom did something nice. Like that's comfort, right? They're not dumping on you. It's just comfort. You can take it or not or respond or not. But it just seems like that can't be bad. It occurs to me sitting here, like I'm thinking about this situation I was talking about before where the person I knew that was answering the phones because the reporters were calling the house.
42:02I knew the people involved in the middle. It was not appropriate for me to be like, how can I be? It just was one of those situations like I want to help. That's not helpful right now. But I was in communication with the person who decided like she was the gatekeeper. And I said, how are you doing? And she said, can you bring me some clothes? Because I ran here and I don't really have enough clothes. And I'm clearly going to be staying here for a while. And I brought her some clothes. And I'm thinking like back, like that still helps. That's still comfort in, right? Maybe it didn't make the innermost circle, but it made like the second or third ring of help.
42:37And that's still like counts.
42:39Amy Wilson:And not for nothing. I know you weren't thinking about this, but like you didn't get credit for it. You know what I mean? There's a story about a guy who goes to India to work with Mother Teresa. And he is like, I'm here to like put salve on orphans and like walk through the streets and hand food to the people and wash the feed. And that is what I'm here to do. And he walks in and, you know, somebody there is like, oh, thank God, and gives him a box of light bulbs. And he's like, all the light bulbs in our back office need to be changed. and at some point he's talking to Mother Teresa and he says, I'm very frustrated.
43:16Amy Wilson:Like I came to be of help and I'm changing light bulbs in the back office. And she says to him, you don't know how long we've prayed for someone tall. We needed a light bulb changer, my dude. And that I think can be really hard in giving help is to be like, this person is in a big headline crisis. And like You want to be sitting next to the mom and holding her hand and being her number one person and be the hero. But what you need to do is bring a phone charger to her aunt who doesn't have one. And you're not going to get any glory for that job. No one's ever going to know you did it. But they prayed for somebody tall.
43:53Amy Wilson:The humbleness to know your role in any given situation is something you have to check in with yourself about. Yeah. And also just to accept that that's enough. It's enough to show up with a Dairy Queen blizzard for your friend who's falling apart. Like that's enough. It's enough to bring a charger for your friend's aunt. That's what I got out of today. Just keep helping. Find something little. Just be somebody tall. I love it. Be somebody tall and know when you're the tall person and that's what's needed. And it's not your story. It's not your hero's journey. It's your time to be like the invisible helper in the background sometimes.
44:28Amy Wilson:And let's changing light bulbs. Yeah. You know me, Amy. I like center stage. I like the white hot spotlight with the long solo. And so I struggle with that, I know, to not be like, look at me right here helping and being the star. Look at me helping, getting my help all over everybody. Look at me helping with all my help. You solved it. You solved it for me. So thank you. You helped me. We solved it. Be out there helping people. I know all of our listeners are great helpers. You're like, yes, yes, enough with the people with their tragedies. How can I help the Web4Shell podcast grow? Here's how.
45:04Amy Wilson:It's so easy. Go to your app, review us, and follow us. Make sure you're following, and then throw us some five-star reviews. Four-star if you think there's some problems. Three-stars if you're really on the fence. Any review helps more listeners find the podcast. It's true. And that's how you can help us today, friends. It's true. That'd be awesome. Thank you so much, and thanks for listening. We'll talk to you next time. Thanks, everybody.
45:39Amy Wilson:Thank you to Osea for sponsoring the show. Osea's new marine screen is sunscreen for the sun you live in. And right now we have a special discount just for you. Get 10 % off your first order site-wide with code fresh at oseamalibu.com. That's code fresh at O-S-E-A-M-A-L-I-B-U dot com. Thank you.
From the publisher
This Deep Dive series revisits some of our past episodes on discerning what we need as moms, and then asking for it confidently.
Do you hate feeling unable to help people in crisis, or do you worry about getting too involved and stepping on toes? There are ways to give help to people in need that are productive and considerate, and our listeners wrote in with some excellent examples.
Amy and Margaret discuss:
How to avoid the "let me know if you need anything" trap
The "comfort in, dump out" model of caretaking
The perils of too many lasagnas
The best help you can give may be something that feels inconsequential to you but is actually a huge help to the people in need. Whatever your role ends up being during a crisis, accept it graciously, and don't expect a hero's fanfare for your efforts.
Links!
Anne Helen Petersen: A Shortcut for Caring for Others (and Being Cared for Yourself)
Susan Silk and Barry Goldman for the LA Times: "How not to say the wrong thing"
What Fresh Hell is co-hosted by Amy Wilson and Margaret Ables.
We love the sponsors that make this show possible! You can always find all the special deals and codes for all our current sponsors on our website:
https://www.whatfreshhellpodcast.com/p/promo-codes/
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