'If You Can Keep It': The Direct Impact Of Local Elections

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0:30From school board officials and city council members to decisions over roads and disaster relief budgets, local elections make a direct impact on your day-to-day life. But state and local elections, well, they get a lot less attention, less media coverage, and lower voter turnout. In November's municipal elections in Dallas, Texas, here's one example, 14 council seats were up for the vote. Turnout, just 8 percent. And mayoral elections typically get voter turnout of about 20 percent or less. So what can voters do to stay more informed at the local level? And how can media and other institutions step up to support more engaged community members?

1:09I'm Jen White. And I'm Todd Swillick. You're listening to the 1A Podcast. Today, for our weekly installment of If You Can Keep It, where we look at the health of our democracy, we're going local. Right after this short break.

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2:12your podcasts. Let's jump in with our panel. Nathaniel Rakich is the managing editor at VoteBeat. That's a nonprofit, nonpartisan newsroom covering local election administration and voting. Nathaniel, welcome. Thanks so much for having me. Also with us is Josh Dar, professor of political communication at Syracuse University, where he researches local news, campaigns, and elections. He's also director of the Local Next Lab, which connects newsrooms, funders, and researchers to pioneer journalism innovations. Josh, thanks for joining us. Glad to be here. And with us from Madison, Wisconsin, is Sean Johnson, the Capitol Bureau Chief at Wisconsin Public Radio.

2:52Sean, it's great to have you. Thanks for having me. Nathaniel, let's just start with what we know about how actively engaged people are in local elections compared to national elections. Yeah, I mean, as you mentioned, voter turnout is significantly lower in these oddly timed elections. So basically anything that isn't November of an even year, even primary elections, which we're kind of in the middle of right now, those tend to see lower turnout. And there just isn't as much of an apparatus. Everything basically is really geared toward national campaigns and elections these days. That is the media ecosystem because kind of of the dominance of cable news and social media.

3:33and but also you know those campaigns are better funded um and so these local campaigns as you point out are just kind of you know more in the dark and people are less and less aware and often they're just not they don't even know that they're happening let alone knowing who's running and people are frustrated by this we're already hearing from a lot of you we got this from jim in georgia who says people have come up to me at the local publics and say they don't want to vote in local elections or they just vote straight ticket in partisan races because they have no clue who any of the candidates are.

4:06In large part, it's a tragic byproduct of the collapse of local newspapers. We're going to talk more about that collapse of local media and the effect on all of this. But Josh, what challenges do you think voters face when it comes to staying informed down ballot and on the issues in the candidates in their local community? as you note a lot of that depends on the local information environment but it also is related to the elections themselves you know these are all related to each other so when you know when people are reading more local news when there is more local news about politics to read you have more competitive elections and when you have more competitive elections you have more information about them available to everyone more people are interested the candidates are more active So in a situation that we have now where newspapers are closing, that leads to fewer candidates running.

4:56Newspapers are losing staff. That reduces political competition. And when there's less local news available, there's less turnout just generally. So we know this is happening. And it's got to be related to the decline of local media because how else are people going to know who's running, as you pointed out? And when there's less attention and engagement in local elections, Josh, it's not just about people voting. What does it mean for the accountability of local politicians? So local politicians are going to respond to the media environment they're in. So we know from the rollout of Fox News across the country that more conservative candidates ran.

5:35The people who are already in office voted more conservatively because their media environment changed. So when the local media drops out of an environment or reduces relative to where it was, we know that representatives are not paying attention to their local interests as much. They're not working as hard. They're doing more party line voting. They're bringing less money back to their districts. So in some ways, they're giving people less of a reason to vote for them or to vote against – to cross party lines to vote for them. This is all related and local media is at the center of it, and that center is increasingly getting hollowed out.

6:11We got this email from Daryl in Ohio who says, before the advent of social media, local communities in the suburbs usually had a weekly newspaper focused on local news, government, politics, and local goings-on. Those are mostly gone, and with it the watchdog function they served. As people are no longer aware of their local government and issues, you have less participation in voting, folks willing to serve, and more petty corruption. Sean, you're joining us from Wisconsin. Tell us what you're hearing from people there about the main challenges they're facing when they want to learn about local issues and local candidates on the ballot.

6:45You know, I think it's, as everybody else has stated, that the news ecosystem we're in right now is a lot different than it was even five years ago, certainly 10 or 20 years ago. And so if you're looking for strictly local news, you have to turn to different sources. I mean, in our case, we are Wisconsin Public Radio, but our local news is the state of Wisconsin. So we're presenting a news story from Madison for a potential audience in Milwaukee or Green Bay, Wisconsin, and vice versa. It's less hyper-local. We focus on our community, but it's a larger community. Well, let's go to a voicemail we got from one of you.

7:22Here's Jay in Oklahoma. I try to stay informed, but really as someone who just started getting interested in politics and these races, it's hard to know where to start. I go with my local Indivisible chapter and an organization called Thanks for Voting the OK. That's the only way I found to stay informed. Well, Nathaniel, it's a really important question. What are the main sources that people use to learn about down-ballot races and measures now, especially in an environment that we've all established is now, in many cases, bereft of local independent news? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think to a certain extent people are – you're kind of at the mercy of what resources exist locally to you, right?

8:14So if you do have a good local newspaper or radio station or something like that, you can turn to them. That's certainly what I would recommend as a member of the media. If you don't have that, though, I mean, the listener there mentioned something. If you have a local community organization, civic organization, or advocacy organization that you know kind of shares your values, looking to see at whether they have endorsed a candidate in the race, whether they have done kind of endorsement interviews or anything like that, or a Q &A with them. or just have issued a voter guide, that can be very helpful.

8:47Sometimes the local government themselves will issue a voter guide, especially on questions like ballot measures, kind of laying out the full text of the measure and explaining that for folks. But, you know, it really are kind of like at the mercy of how, you know, how robust the local infrastructure is for getting that information out there. I would say in kind of a, not a worst case scenario, but in, you know, kind of the most drastic case, especially for some of these local races, contact the campaign themselves. You know, they are going to give you, like, obviously their spin on why you should vote for them.

9:21But often if it's a city council race, the candidate themselves will be happy to talk to you. That is what they are out there doing, knocking on doors. They want to talk to voters and make their case. And you can ask them whatever questions are on your mind. I love that we're hearing from people in different parts of the country right now sharing where they're finding resources for local elections. Kathleen in Florida emails, Voter Action Pinellas has developed a voting guide for voters who support our values of justice, inclusion, and a democracy that works for all of us. Thank you for voting and please vote early.

9:51And Amber emails, here in Worchester, Massachusetts, I've actually found that the Nextdoor app has been a great resource to learn about local issues, candidates, and even to engage with current and prospective elected officials. Josh, we heard from an earlier caller or listener about relying on social media to get information about local elections. And when you hear that, that people are turning to social media, is that encouraging? Does it raise any alarm bells for you? I'm always a little confused about that because obviously Facebook itself is not publishing news. Twitter itself is not publishing news.

10:29You're at the mercy of whoever's talking. I think that places with stronger local information ecosystems, like Nathaniel pointed out, probably have better social media ecosystems as well. But the thing about social media is it rewards what gets most engagement. And the things that are going to get the most engagement have the broadest geographic audience. Really geographically tailored news is going to be at something of a disadvantage there. And so this is just going to accelerate the nationalization of politics where people think that every single local issue, every local office must be a reflection of something national and that every national debate has to be relevant to their local environment.

11:12And so the reliance on social media kind of turbocharges the media economics that makes people talk about national politics more except in places that have strong local media input. ecosystems because, you know, the rich will get richer there. Well, Sean, at the same time, it's an ongoing conversation in public media. How do organizations like ours better utilize social media to reach people who may not be radio, traditional as we think of it, radio listeners? How are you tackling that at Wisconsin Public Radio? I think it's just an ongoing journey to kind of meet people where they are. And so at Wisconsin Public Radio, we do all the stuff that we've always done.

11:54We have radio newscast stories. We have digital stories. We have podcasts. And we now have a voter guide, too, where we reach out directly to the candidates and we come up with questions for them based on reaching out to our audience and finding out what they'd like to hear. And so then you have, if you go to our site, just WPR voter guide is where you'd find it. If you Google that, then you have answers from the candidates for governor and U.S. House of Representatives for this primary in their words on where they stand on these issues that our listeners have identified as important. So that's one way that we're adapting.

12:33and, you know, through the benefits of being able to see what people are reading on our website, we can tell the closer you get to an election, the more our audience values that. Let's go back to our voicemail box. Hi, this is Charles in Jacksonville, Florida. I get my local news from my NPR station, WJCT First Coast Connect, at 9 a.m. every morning, which gives us a lot of local happenings. And I read my local paper, the Florida Times Union, every day. Well, Charles, thanks for that. Of course, we're down for the shout out for your local public radio station. Every time, does every community have a local newscast like Charles does at First Coast?

13:18Probably not in every community. And we got this from Dave who says candidates should be required to publish position statements on a standardized list of questions. I review local news outlets who've asked such questions, Ballotpedia, other sources, but they're not required. And sometimes information is still lacking and the candidate does not have a website to explain their position. Josh Darr, what do you think about it? Would a public requirement, every locality is going to be different, could a public requirement for more information, more position statements from candidates help to fill this information void that we're struggling with here a little bit?

13:59I think it's possible because I think it would be in the candidate's best interest. I mean, I think it has to be framed that way. They'd have to sort of adopt it willingly. The people who've already gotten into office would have to vote for it. But I think that in these local races, you know, maybe these representatives don't want to be caught up in the national tides. Maybe they don't want to be subject, their electoral fortunes to be subject to who's the president of the United States if they're a county official somewhere in Florida, right? And so how can it be framed that way, not as a gotcha thing, not as a potential danger to their ability to represent their constituents, but as a service to their constituents?

14:41It's hard to pressure that without local media there to do that. But I think it's possible that they could see it in their best interest if constituents call for it. Well, Sean, as a practical matter, how difficult is it to get candidates to respond to these questionnaires and to put together the kind of comprehensive voter guide you're doing at Wisconsin Public Radio? It can be surprisingly difficult, even for a candidate for statewide office. And, you know, for example, right now we have a competitive primary for governor. And, you know, you would think that candidates would want every opportunity to get their message out there.

15:15And we are not sitting there grilling them with follow-up questions. We're saying, here's our question. What's your answer in your words? And I'll tell you, one of the candidates who's since dropped out just never filled that out. She had other stuff going on with her campaign, but it's not a priority for everybody. They want to present their message the way that they want to do it and not have to go through any kind of filter, even if it's just as simple as us asking the question first. When you get down to the more local offices, as we'll do as we head toward November, then you're talking about kind of an issue of campaign resources, too.

15:54If you're a candidate who's running for the state legislature, you are actually out there knocking on doors. You're raising money. It is a pretty hectic time in your life. And so you have to carve out time also to do this questionnaire. And I would say most of them do it, but there are some people who just say, no, thanks. There are also some people who say, we don't really want to deal with the media. Thank you very much. Goodbye. Or just don't respond for that reason. Well, Josh, is some of this a reflection of the media environment we're currently in? And I mean that we're in this very fractured environment where people kind of self-select their information silos and stay there.

16:30And maybe candidates can be a little more selective about who they talk to and who they don't, considering who they think their voters are. Yeah, I think they can. I think that's an important point, and I think that they think they can reach constituents directly. It's obviously going to be different everywhere, but if they can publish quickly and publish consistently, they can reach voters without having to go through the media, so that's probably attractive. Lou in North Carolina emails. Please let voters know of the nonpartisan Vote411.org for information about local candidates, polling places, registration.

17:08Voters can find their local ballots there and information about candidates and ballot proposals. And Mary Emell's League of Women Voters maintains a website with information on local, state, and national elections. It's called Vote 411. Still to come, yes, they can be corny or hyperbolic. But how effective is political advertising in local elections? That's right after this.

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18:39Well, Nathaniel, depending on where someone lives, they're probably going to get inundated with political ads. We talk about just the decimation of local independent news coverage. But the commercials, online especially, TV, of course, are still there. How much of an effect does local campaigning or political advertising have on voters when they're not getting enough information elsewhere? That's a great question. And I think that we have to separate out the question of whether political ads inform versus whether they persuade, right? And I think, again, on the information side of things, I'm not sure how well they do compared to, obviously, kind of a robust local media outlet.

19:24But I do think that in local elections, political advertising can be particularly effective because a lot of the studies of political advertising that have been done are on the presidential level, a place where you're already saturated with information. And an extra ad that you see on the evening news isn't necessarily going to make a difference. But when you don't know anything about the candidates, when you see that first couple of ads, you're learning a lot. And just kind of learning who the candidates' names are and maybe a couple of key things about their platform can make a difference. And so we do see effects of local political advertising in city council races.

20:04That has been shown to be fairly effective in primaries when you have voters who are just meeting the candidates for the first time. and maybe there's a wide field of Democrats and you don't have those partisan cues to tell you how you want to vote, but they're all Democrats and you're a Democrat, so you just need to pick someone. Those are the instances in which political advertising can be effective. Sean, how are you seeing this play out in Wisconsin, local ads and campaigns affecting voters' choices? I think right now for the election that we're approaching, our August primary, you had a summer mostly where we did not have a lot of ads.

20:40And I think that contributed to an electorate that was not terribly engaged in our race for governor. If you looked at polling, even recently, about 50 percent of Democratic voters, which is where the big primary is for governor, 50 percent of voters at one point in July had not made up their mind yet. you don't see that in a November election when you have an advertising blitz or in our case we've had some big state Supreme Court elections where there have been more than 100 million dollars spent and when ads get spent like that people get opinions about the candidates real quick and you just have a different election altogether so without the advertising blitz which we're getting some now in the closing weeks of our primary.

21:25We always do. But when that doesn't exist, that's when you have voters kind of wondering, how do I feel about this race? How do I feel about these candidates? Well, people really care about this. I mean, the board is letting up so many of you reaching out. Mary says, I rely on the Missouri Independent, which covers statewide and many local issues in candidates. The St. Louis American is an award-winning black newspaper, which also carries very insightful information about local issues and candidates. St. Louis Public Radio is also very effective in presenting forums and interviews. Josh, what are some of the most effective ways that campaigns are reaching voters today?

22:06I mean, yes, advertising, sure, that's problematic. I don't mind ads telling me what detergent to buy. But if there's no other information for candidates, I'm less enthused. Mary has a lot of local resources she relies on. What else are campaigns doing in this environment? As there's more money available for campaigns through some of these campaign finance law reforms, I think they're finding different ways to spend their most valuable resource, which is the candidate's time. I think candidates get rewarded for traveling around their districts as much as possible and making events happen. Those are good ways to draw people in.

22:45Direct mail, I think, is obviously still a big one. Not every race can afford TV advertising, but there's still ways to print materials and get the word out with an active candidate. In some ways, there's no substitute for that, somebody traveling around going to make their own events. Some people will hear about that through word of mouth if there's an exciting event. If there's no local news to carry it, they might still hear about it. So, you know, being an active candidate still matters. Well, let's listen to another voicemail we got from one of you. This is Dawn. I'm calling from Indiana.

23:21I actually just heard your call for comments while I sit writing postcards for Get Out the Vote for my local party here in Hamilton County. And one of the things that we are up against all the time is the national message is just taking up all of the air in the room. So I would encourage people to go and look for the website for their local county party. Start on a county level and then work your way up to the state and then the national. You are absolutely correct that local politics are really where things hit home. Make yourself as informed as possible before the next election. We also heard from Peter in Pennsylvania who says local coverage has declined with the death of newspapers, but other media has not stepped up to fill the void.

24:13Our local NPR affiliate has a huge award-winning newsroom and boasts about how well they cover the area, but they only cover the city and spend most of their airtime previewing national news. And I want to connect those comments to this we got from Graham in Massachusetts, who says, I find it hard to care about local politics when I'm renting and have to move every couple of years because rent keeps increasing. Why would I care about Waltham elections when I don't even know if I'm going to still be here in a year or less. So I want to first start with that engagement question. When voters become more disengaged on local issues, which we're seeing more and more, and politics are becoming more nationalized, Nathaniel, to your mind, what's the risk for our democracy?

25:02Yeah, it's a great question. I mean, I think that the nationalization of politics and polarization of politics is such a big part of this story because as the world has kind of gotten smaller with the advent of social media and things like that, everybody is just getting very preoccupied with what's happening on the national scene. And you have situations where local city council candidates are getting asked their position on Israel-Palestine, which is obviously not something that is within their control. And so I do think that the attention on your, on kind of like how your team is doing on the national level and how, you know, people will increasingly vote for the same party up and down the ticket now, you know, that, that has gotten everybody into almost like a sports mindset about politics.