Remembering Bob Chapman: The Mentor Who Changed My Life

17:15David Mead:So it really impacted me. And I realized in my journey that adults are no different. Gentleman, our plant said to me one time, you know, Mr. Chapman, I get 10 things right and I never hear a word. I get one thing wrong and I get my ass chewed out. And everybody, every time I say this, you see like this in the audience, because we have a world where we focus on the brokenness, not the goodness. Okay. So what we do through our recognition and celebration program, And again, it's not about five years service to get a plaque. It's about shining a light in the organization, looking for the goodness, holding them, saying thank you in a thoughtful way.

17:50David Mead:There's a skill in reckoning. It's not that a boy, pay raise. It is feelings, behaviors, and impact. And there's a skill. And we're teaching that skill in universities. We have people for 40 hours a week. And when they leave our care, they're inundated with the brokenness of the world. but I've got them for 40 hours a week while they feel valued, if they feel heard, if we recognize the goodness because when you recognize the goodness of Mary or Bill and you do it in a thoughtful way in a group, everybody feels good. So our key to our culture is continually looking for the goodness and holding it up and saying thank you.

18:27Bob Chapman:I've heard you say so often we catch people doing things wrong. You teach people to catch people doing things right. What are some of the specific ways that you do recognition in the company? I mean, in a place like this, it's a factory environment. It's manufacturing. How do you do recognition here?

18:45David Mead:It's very personal. We have basically called the Shine the Light Award and people can submit to us somebody who they feel embodies the spirit of our culture that they want to say thank you to. and it didn't occur to us at the time, but when you actually say to 12 ,000 people in the world, why don't you write and let us know somebody you think lives these values? All of a sudden you get these notes from people all over the world. I mean, from Serbia to China, whatever. And the beauty is that they have to stop and think about the goodness of somebody else. Not the number of years of service, not the top sales award, just their goodness.

19:23David Mead:The ramifications, when people see recognized for their goodness, you just feel good. Okay. Our goal is when you leave our care for 40 hours a week, you go home with the energy to deal with the brokenness of the world. Because you've seen 40 hours a week, you saw the goodness in the world. So it's a skill. Again, it's feelings, behaviors, and impact. We actually teach a class on how to do it. And quite often, if we can't. On how to give someone a compliment. Quite often, we do, yes, how to recognize the goodness in somebody. So quite often, we surprise the person and their family members come to witness it.

19:55David Mead:And it is profound, the impact. Because for a son or daughter or mother or father to see their child recognized for their goodness in front of an organization, you can't measure that. This cadence of constantly looking for the goodness in the world, which I wish our media did. Remember the expression in journalism, what bleeds reads. So what do we inundate our country with every day? The brokenness of the world. Because that's what they feel creates leaders, which creates income for their media. So where do we see the goodness in the world?

20:27Bob Chapman:Let me jump ahead a little bit, which is, you know, I'm sure there are some people who buy into what you're saying, but there are some people who are cynical that this is all fine and good and hippy-dippy when the economy is great. But when the economy dips, you've got to tighten the belt and focus on the numbers. And, you know, and we see it all the time, even well-intentioned companies. As soon as, you know, something dips the numbers, the first thing to suffer is the people. They cut the recognition programs. They cut the spending on the leadership programs. They lay people off. It's the first thing we do.

20:57Bob Chapman:So it sounds like these things are all nice to have if you're thriving. What do you have to say to those companies that that's the first thing they cut? People and programs. I mean, what does Barry Weymiller do?

21:10David Mead:Well, it starts with we have a constitution of our culture, the guiding principle of leadership. And the vision is we measure success by the way we touch the lives of people. So we kind of have a constitution that guides us like our country does. in terms of the responsibility of leadership. So if you embrace that and you end up with an economic situation, which we did in 08-09, which you've talked about for many years, it opened our mind to a totally different way. So it was shared sacrifice. So as you know, in 08-09, because our orders dropped by 30%, and I was taught, well, you know, what you got to do is you got to let people go.

21:46David Mead:Because, you know, that's just what you do. It's not personal. It's just what we do. I once, as you know, in the Air Force, asked some of the generals, how do you teach these young men and women to kill? They said, we don't. We teach them to take out targets that made bad decisions. They try to dehumanize the hurt they're going to infect and dropping bombs. We do that in business. We right-size the company. We organize the company. We give the shareholders what they want.

22:09Bob Chapman:Reduce headcount.

22:10David Mead:We dehumanize the impact. The psychological studies show that when people are let go, I walk up to you and say, sorry, I know you just bought a house, but I'm going to have to let you go because we've got to make the numbers work. It is a major failure of stewardship because I tell our people around the world, my primary responsibility as the leader of this company is to have a business model that you feel safe. That you can raise a family, you can have a home. And when people feel safe, you see a dramatic difference in their sense of the way they share, the way they help each other because they don't, they're not, there's cloud over their head.

22:46David Mead:not worry about layoffs are a broken part of our society. It means your business model failed. You let people down.

22:53Bob Chapman:I got to go deeper on that. You see, if you embrace layoffs, it means your business model failed. Most major public companies, and unfortunately, a lot of private companies, but most major public companies have fully embraced layoffs as a regular mechanism to balance the books. Have their business models failed?

23:14David Mead:Yes, well, their leadership failed. Remember, very profitable companies. Jack Welch taught us years ago, you can always probably let 5 % of your people go and you'll actually do better. Not just to reduce costs, but it's good to kind of take the low performance out. So I was taught from various relations, layoffs are a positive thing you do for a company because you improve profitability. And investment advisors will come to your company and say, you want to improve your image in the market? lay off some people and say, we're going to make more money in it. So part of it is the investing public rewards companies that do this.

23:48David Mead:Their share price goes up when they lay off people. To me, it should go down because they, I mean, I guarantee you when a board considers, a public company or private company considers a layoff where you're going to hurt people, okay? You're going to hurt people. They don't talk about the consequence of those people. It's just business. They'll find another job. How many weeks should we pay them for? I've never heard, ever in my 50-year career, ever heard a human way of talking about layoffs, downsides, and rises. But we're taught just one of the things you do, it's not fun, it's not pleasant.

24:17David Mead:So my responsibility to our people is to make sure you're safe in my care, where we can create economic and human value in harmony. And when people feel safe, they will share greater gifts with you. You will attract greater talent. There's no downside to caring. No downside. Some people think it's just about being nice. OK, it's much more profound, like parenting is being nice. Parenting is not being nice and being a good steward of the child in your care. Leadership is identical. And part of it is having a safe business model where they can raise a family. They can count on you and put their trust in you and have a career with you.

24:53David Mead:That is a foundational responsibility. And I've never heard that said before.

24:56Bob Chapman:I think a lot of leaders forget about the ripples, right? Which is they understand that, you know, even though they don't talk about it or think about it, the impact it has on people's lives when they get laid off. They also forget about the people who didn't lose their jobs, but they watch their friends get laid off. Now fear is injected into the system. Am I next? You know, and one of the craziest things I've seen is companies announce, we're going to lay off 20 ,000 people, we're going to do 1000 a week. And you're just like, how on earth do you think that risk taking and entrepreneurship and sticking your neck out for the greater good is going to happen.

25:29Bob Chapman:People are going to retreat. They're going to keep their heads down because the unbelievable fear that I'm next, not to mention the fact that it sucks to see your friends get laid off for no fault of their own. It wasn't a meritocracy. And you said boards aren't talking about the impact on the lives of the people they lay off. And they're also not talking about how it'll affect the culture for many, many months

25:51David Mead:beyond that if not yours you know simon some people say to me how do you justify this investment this cost of caring for your people your university your classes i look at them i say i don't need to justify caring how do you justify not caring because people really struggle going from using people to care about people because you know there's major bridge to cross for most people but i say nobody has to justify safety in other words safety glasses hard toe shoes safety no company. Why? Because we have workman's compensation insurance and we want to manage the cost of it. So it's a cost. Okay. So I would say to you, we don't have to justify safety.

26:30David Mead:Why do we have to justify caring? Because this caring is the safety of your soul that treating that young man or young woman or person in your care as you would want your son or daughter treated. I mean, a lot of people ask me, what do you do about the people who don't get it? I said, treat them like you would want your son or daughter treated. Well, they didn't get it. Oh, that would be different. I said, why is it different? That's somebody's son or daughter you're treating. So the way we see people affects the way we treat people. And if you see them as functions, it's a lot easier to downsize, light side.

27:00David Mead:But if you see them as somebody's precious child who simply wants to know the matter, it profoundly shapes the way you take the responsibility for your business model, how you're going to deal with the ups and downs of business. And all I can tell you is our culture is attracting unbelievable talent. opportunities to bring other companies together into our family and our customers love our culture, love our culture. It is inspiring a lot of people because it's a foundation is, I was never taught this. As you know, it occurred through a series of relations, but caring is contagious. When you treat people with respect and dignity, it releases in them the capacity to care for others.

27:38David Mead:And the pride you will get, the healing you will get and is profound. And so I would say to you, So I don't need to justify this because our company, we've had a 25-year growth in our share price, like 12 % compounded for 25 years.

27:53Bob Chapman:12 % compounded growth for 25 years.

27:56David Mead:For 25 years in our share price, okay?

27:57Bob Chapman:In your share price.

27:58David Mead:Because we have a very technical way of creating share price that emulates the market. And so I'd say to you, we have exceeded almost everybody you know for a long period of time. We take a long-term view.

28:08Bob Chapman:So anybody cynical who says no, but performance, performance, performance. Okay, fine. What you're demonstrating is that your leadership strategy outperforms the market.

28:19David Mead:So if you just look at the statistics that you've heard me say, that 88 % of all people feel they work for an organization that doesn't care about them. And if you hear the statistics, three out of four people are disengaged in what they're doing. When you look at the 12 ,000, 5 ,200 people work for you, and you know, these statistics say that they're doing what they need to do to keep their job. They're not giving you their gifts and you're sending them home damaged because you were not good stewards of their lives. It just changes the view I was taught and I experienced in the first half of my career.

28:51David Mead:And that's why I say business could be the most profound source of good in the world if we simply knew how to care for the people we have the privilege of leading. We have a society right now based on money, power, and position. It doesn't matter how you get it, as long as you get it legally, because then you can write a check to charity and they'll have a banquet to celebrate your goodness. They won't ask you how you got your money. They'll celebrate you. And I say to CEOs around the world, the greatest act of charity is not to check you right. The greatest act of charity is how you treat the people you have the privilege of leading.

29:25Bob Chapman:I have CEOs on here now and then. and honestly, in general, CEOs are the worst guests because it's hard to have candid conversations with them. They're very, very media trained. They come in with their talking points. You know, it doesn't matter what I ask. They know how to get their point across. They're going to tell me about their success. They're going to tell me about their product. They're going to tell me about the quality. I mean, I'm sitting here in one of your factories and not once have we talked about your product what this factory makes, the quality that you're outperforming the market.

30:01Bob Chapman:And this is completely opposite than almost every other CEO I talk to. Well, Simon, again, it was a couple of years ago that

30:09David Mead:Washington University organizational development professors interviewed me for an hour and a half. Normal interview. At the end of hour and a half, they said, we have never talked to a CEO that never talked about your product. And I sat back and I said, we've been talking about our product for the last hour and a half. It's our people. Okay. I'm not going to go to my grave proud of the machinery we built because we build great machinery. I'm going to go to my grave proud of the people that built that. It caught them completely off guard.

30:35Bob Chapman:I met you because you reached out to me and showed me this magical place. I got to know you and I decided to write about this amazing place that you had built in a book I wrote called Leaders Eat Last. You're sort of the central character in that book, I would argue. And you and I have become friends over the years and you've been a mentor to me. I've learned a lot about how to improve my own leadership ability from you. What have you learned even about yourself over these past 15 years? Like the Bob I met 15 years ago and the Bob now, tell me what's different, what's grown, what's new.

31:12David Mead:Well, again, because of my traditional education background, I was totally focused on organic growth and profitability and market share, all the things that you were focused on. That was the first half of my career. And I did well. I inherited a business that was challenged,$20 million business, went through my challenging periods, but I grew from it. And I was doing well when these revelations happened.

31:36Bob Chapman:It wasn't desperation or failure. No, no, no. We were doing very well at the time.

31:39David Mead:But when you have these revelations about seeing people not as functions, but as somebody's child who's placed in your care, knowing that the 40 hours you have them will profoundly impact their marriage and their relationship with the kids and their health, it changes everything. I get that.

31:54Bob Chapman:But what have you learned over the past 15 years since I met you? because you'd already had that revelation when I met you. That's why I met you. I mean, you wanted to show me what you had built. In the past 15 years, because I have an answer, I'll tell you something I've noticed that's different about you since I met you. But I'm curious what you think yourself. Well, Simon, when you came, we were on this journey.

32:16David Mead:Yeah. And it was just an incremental journey. And you came in and you saw something that we didn't see. I mean, we thought things were going well, but you amplified our awareness that we had been blessed. And so what I have learned, because since we first met, I've given hundreds of speeches around the world. The Harvard case study, the TEDx talk you did, the book. There's no question, as I sit here today, since we first met, that some higher power is using us to show the world the way he meant it to be, where people genuinely care for each other. Today, I feel this tremendous calling to take this responsibility of this message I've been blessed with and make sure it lives well beyond my time with voices like yours, your books, your talks around the world.

33:03David Mead:So I feel this tremendous sense of obligation. Why would somebody pick a manufacturing company in America that makes machinery to show the world what it should be, okay? Okay, why would he pick a carpenter to be the father of our Christ? So I would say to you, I feel a profound, and it grows because the reaction, I mean, I speak in healthcare. I speak in the military. I speak in Congress. I speak in the United States. Everywhere I speak, I see the hurt in the world. And so I'd say to you, what has been amplified is because you've opened the door to the world, how could we have a culture here in a traditional business that the world said, I've never seen anything like?

33:43David Mead:How is that possible? I'm just a simple accountant from North St. Louis running a manufacturing company because we were blessed with a message that could heal the world. And when I look today as we talk, the issues we face in the world, I see business as a source of destruction, creating economic value but not human value. And I feel a profound sense of responsibility with you in our partnership to change the way the world sees its responsibility to people they have the privilege of leading.

34:09Bob Chapman:I really like the way at the beginning of our conversation you distinguish between we have a prosperous economy but not a healthy economy. We have prosperous companies but not healthy companies. They're prosperous because they make money, but they're not healthy because the lives of the people who work in those companies are not healthy as a result of those broken corporate cultures. I like that distinction. And we want our companies to be healthy and prosperous, not healthy or prosperous or prosperous or healthy. I love that distinction. And I want to tell the story when I first went on the tour of all your factories and I saw this thing.

34:41Bob Chapman:And I remember saying to you, I can no longer be accused of being a crazy idealist because what I imagine exists in reality. I remember seeing the magic and then you introduced me to the culture team that had that was responsible for these classes and helping you implement what you imagined and after I'd seen this tour and you knew my opinion of what I'd seen I remember they were all sitting there with big smiles thinking I was just going to say you guys are amazing you guys are amazing they were waiting with a big smile on their face and I remember my first comments to your culture team were I think you may be the most selfish company I've ever met I said and I remember them all shocked and I said oh yeah I saw what you built and it is nothing short of remarkable and it is incredible what you have done for the lives of back then 3 ,000 people I said meanwhile there are millions of people struggling at work and you are keeping to yourselves something that the world would benefit from and I remember it was on that day you sort of said batter up and you started on the speaking circuit to share what you've done.

35:44Bob Chapman:You've written your book, Everybody Matters, to get the word out there. You've set up a consultancy to help companies learn what you're doing. You set up a not-for-profit to bring the listening courses to civil servants around the country so that they may benefit from the learning so you can help policing organizations, ambulances, nurses, firefighters. These are the people that you're helping with these courses. It's been an amazing thing for me to watch the small company that was very insular and doing something amazing that you you really are one of the leaders of the the movement to make business a force for good for the health of people not just for the prosperity of people it's been an amazing journey so as you know while we're

36:28David Mead:sharing this message with your encouragement and looking for people who believe what we believe and show it's possible and it still amazes me in the work we've done in the last 15 years You know, all my talks around the world to every part of the society, nobody debates what you and I are just saying. I know. They just have no idea because we have a society that is founded on success is money, power, and position. Yeah. Okay. And so what we're working desperately on because the long-term cure, we can, I can go out and work with major companies and help them learn to care, which we're doing through the Chapman Leadership Institute, major corporations.

37:05David Mead:And the feedback is phenomenal. We're fixing adults. And as you know, one day I said, why do we need to fix adults? And I looked and I said, oh, my God, our education system is around academic achievement. But we're not teaching as we are in our university human skills. So now we're incredibly dedicated to elevating the purpose of education, to create tomorrow's leaders in every part of our state, from health care to nonprofit to military to government, who have the skills and courage to care. And that means the board of directors. I mean, we just have a society that's built around successes, money, power, and position.

37:40David Mead:And until we change that, people want to have a successful life. And then they get there, and it's not fulfilling. They're not happy. So again, we're kind of self-destructing for economic gain, and we're hurting people in the process. And we're destroying the future for our kids.

37:56Bob Chapman:Do you want to know how I've seen you change since I've met you?

38:00David Mead:I've gotten older.

38:02Bob Chapman:Not in spirit. it you have the same amazing energy from when i first met you um you are softer and i don't mean your voice is softer it took years before i saw you choke up for the first time because of what you were saying and uh i see you choke up more often now it was always personal but it's become really personal and and you're more willing to wear your emotions on your sleeve more than you used to. You used to give me like, you know, sort of like good to see you, Simon, sort of like a tap on the shoulder, you know, and then it became like a tap on the back and then it became a bro hug. And now you hug me, you know, you hug me with love.

38:42Bob Chapman:And I've seen that. I felt that. It's going to make me cry. I wish leaders took leadership as personally as you do. You know, they see it as a rank or position. They see it as power and authority. but they don't take it as seriously as raising a child and you take taking care of your people as seriously as taking care of your children i mean it is not a punchline when you say that everybody who works for you is someone's son and someone's daughter i mean you deeply mean it you deeply feel it i have the pleasure of getting to talk to you when we're off camera. And what people don't understand is this preaching that you do when you're on a microphone.

39:31Bob Chapman:This is how you are all the time. I mean, like, can't we just have dinner?

39:36David Mead:My wife reminds me of that all the time. Can't we just have dinner?

39:38Bob Chapman:It's like, oh my God, my God, I heard it. But it's so ingrained in who you are and how personally you take this. It's such a source of inspiration. I got to tell you, I know people who turn it on and turn it off. And you can't turn it off. It's core to who you are.

39:54David Mead:I always say, Simon, you can retire from a job, but you cannot retire from a calling. I'm sure you can imagine what it feels like when I get in front of crowds all over the world and I see people come to tears, get standing ovations. Because can you imagine how it feels? Again, all the talks I've given in all parts of the country to have the most healing message that people ever heard. I mean, the reaction to our message universally, standing ovation, emotions, because it gives people hope. To think that some higher power selected this kid from North St. Louis with an accounting degree to show the world the way he meant it to be is profoundly meaningful.

40:36David Mead:I mean, I don't know how you don't get emotional when you think I'm carrying a message that could heal the world. I mean, how do you handle something like that without emotion? I mean, it's not an academic feeling. it is right down here and you can't say things about this message when you get the feedback the healing power of this is profound and when you look at the issues we face in this country in the world but i get this exposure to talk to people all over the world and i see the same reaction it's a universal truth in our world that people simply want to know they matter

41:10Bob Chapman:Big joke of it all. The big joke of it all is you are one of the highest performing companies in your category. You outperform the markets. Your people love working here. People want their children to work here. You have generations of people working here. I met Lance before. His dad worked here. He works here. His kids work here. His daughter-in-law works here. His wife works here. I mean, and it's there are there are other opportunities, there are other places to work in Phillips, they want to work here, they want their kids to work here, like, to have that level of devotion and love. I talked to people I walked around today, we talked to some of your folks, who it is a joy for them to go the extra mile for you.

41:57Bob Chapman:It doesn't feel like a burden or a task. They are grateful to give you more. And this is what is so astonishing to me, that though you don't do it for the business reasons, the connection is so damn obvious. Your people are just better people than in other companies. They themselves are not better, but they're given the opportunity to be their best selves at Barry Waymiller. And the company and they are the beneficiaries because a profitable company means you can expand and take better care of your people. You can expand the number of classes available. You can invest in training and you can invest in all the nice things because the business model works.

42:34Bob Chapman:And this is the thing that drives me nuts. It drives me nuts that people want us to give economic reasons why they should do this rather than human reasons.

42:46David Mead:I mean,

42:46Bob Chapman:I mean, it's like, give me an economic reason why I should be good to my child. If I'm good to my child, will my child increase their earning potential? You know, why not just raise a good kid and see what happens? Like inherently, we know that. I, and to think that it's different, here. And you're right. The level of dehumanization, you're 100 % right. And we see it in our nation, right? When we dehumanize the other, when we create names to distance ourselves from that person being a human being, we see it in politics, we see it around our nation. And when management dehumanizes the people who work for them, as you said, what's the headcount?

43:23Bob Chapman:I know in your company, you don't have headcounts, you have heart counts. It's very hard to reduce a heart count. I'm aware that language matters. Nobody here says, my boss. They say, my leader. You say all the time, nobody wakes up in the morning to be managed. We wake up to be led. There's no managers here. They're all leaders. I understand that the language matters. And you're using language that humanizes people, whereas the rest of business is using language that dehumanizes people. So even when they do do layoffs, they do it in such an inhuman way where you show up to work and your key card just doesn't work.

43:55Bob Chapman:Or you get an email that says, sorry, just business. You have no job anymore effective today right the more we've dehumanized the workforce the more we treat them as if they're not humans you know because remember simon i'm going back to what i said

44:10David Mead:what i was taught and what i experienced in the world yeah is the lens that was shaped by that education experiences people were functions for my success i needed that person that machine is that assembler, that accountant for my success. Okay. I was a nice guy. We had a nice company, but I saw people as functions for my success. And that day at the wedding, when I saw those two precious kids getting married, and I realized that all 12 ,000 people around the world are just like that young man and young lady. They simply want to know the matter. That day, my lens reversed and I saw people as somebody's precious child.

44:47David Mead:The way we see people affects the way we treat people. If we treat people as labor, as workforce, you know, as union members or as shop people, the language of business is broken. It dehumanizes, okay? And so, again, the good news is that we are clearly, with your help, your voice in the world, your book, your voice, your book, is the world is validating that this is the way to go. And we are on a journey to transform and create a more caring world where people feel they matter, regardless of your role in the company, that you feel you matter. And when you do that, you see this goodness come out of people.

45:26David Mead:Again, I want to make sure you cannot ask people to care. We can't go to the CEO of a major company and say, you need to care about your people. They'll say, sure, I do. But we're going to have a layoff next week. But, you know, I care about them. Okay. But I pay them well and I got good. We have to change the whole perspective of our society where we are stewards of the people we have the privilege of leading. The greatest act of charity is not the checks you write to the Cancer Society or all those other noble causes. The greatest act of charity is how you treat the people you have the privilege of leading.

45:56David Mead:That is the greatest. And if we had that, we wouldn't need all the charities to fix the brokenness of the world.

46:01Bob Chapman:You told me a story a bunch of years ago of a wealthy guy who had retired and he'd made boatloads of cash running a very, very large business. And he came to you for advice on how to be a philanthropist, on how to distribute that money. And you asked him, what are you proud of? And he said, well, I started this charity where we help inner city kids go to college. And you asked, well, how many kids have you helped? and he says so far 13 and he said i'm really really proud of the work we're doing and you said to him i find it confusing that you're proud of the charity that you're proud that you helped 13 inner city kids go to college yet you did it you accomplished that by destroying the lives of the hundred thousand people who worked for you that that it never occurred to him that he could be helping people throughout an entire career rather than saving money and then trying to help a lot fewer people at the end of his career.

47:06David Mead:Yeah, this is a gentleman in traditional terms, extremely successful, had contributed$120 million to his alma mater and had heard me speak and just flew out to talk to me. He was touched by my speech. Good Christian man, good values, good Midwestern values. And again, what led to that is I said, what are you proud of in your life? And he said, this minority student athletic scholarship program. I had no idea of his company. So I just said, again, how many people work for your company? He said, 100 ,000. I said, so you really care about five or six people? You can help with a scholarship and you don't care about the 100 ,000 people?

47:42David Mead:And he virtually leaned back in his chair and he said, I never thought about that. And again, the one other story that amplifies that is giving a speech in a church, a major church to a luncheon event. And I did it as a favor to somebody. And a gentleman came up to me running a major international organization and said, I thought my job was to be the market leader in our industry in the world, and we achieved that. I thought that was my job. But until I heard you speak, it never occurred to me to care for the 130 ,000 people in our organization. Then he added, you've given me a whole different purpose to my role.

48:21David Mead:So again, the biggest message, Simon, is the way we treat people affects the way they go home and live. If we're worried about kids today, what's wrong with kids today? Where do they come from? They come from our families, okay? What's wrong with their families? Parents come home from work exhausted, okay? TGIF, thank God it's Friday. Get out of that place. I imagine a day with the work we're doing together, we're going to go to TGIM. Thank goodness it's money. Get away from the kids, the spouse, and be back to a place where I really enjoy being a part of the team. So I would say to you, the vision that we've been working on for 13 years, we have made tremendous progress in bringing this message to the world and to make sure that it will not die with me, that it will live on well beyond our time with your work, your book, your talk.

49:08David Mead:In our new book, Everybody Matters, a new edition, we have a chance to shape the world that desperately is looking for hope right now.

49:16Bob Chapman:Well, I promised you I sent you an email years ago. I know. It's framed in my office. I know, I know. I promised you years ago in an email I sent you that I will carry your torch.

49:37Bob Chapman:For all the years I have left. And then I'll pass it on to the next person.

49:44David Mead:Thank you for your stewardship.

49:48i love you i really do

49:55Bob Chapman:i'm so grateful for that crazy one-hour lunch that became a three-hour lunch and this crazy adventure you've taken me on you know because uh we've said it a thousand times to each other we validate each other's work you know i validated your work by saying in my work that's the right way you know i know i validated your your theories and your ideas at scale and you validated my work because it's i'm just an idiot idealist who writes about these what could happen and you made it real this is a very large company make no mistake of it this is thousands and thousands of employees billions of dollars worth of revenue international global company i mean this is not some little mom and popcorn store that takes care of its people this is a large operation at scale and you prove that not only are the people happier and their families are happier and their communities are happier but it is a phenomenal recipe for prosperity healthy people make for prosperous companies and healthy healthy people make for prosperous nations bob thank you for being a light a beacon thank you for being who you are we should probably turn it off right now before we both just just a blubber fest

51:11David Mead:but you I see your soul when you talk because we've touched your soul not your mind, your soul this is the way the world was meant to be and when you see it you know that this is the way it was meant to be that we learn to care for each other

51:28Bob Chapman:Amen

51:28David Mead:Amen, thank you

51:33Bob Chapman:As always, thanks for listening. And if you liked this episode, please do remember to subscribe to A Bit of Optimism wherever you enjoy listening to podcasts. And remember, new episodes drop every Tuesday. A Bit of Optimism is a production of The Optimism Company, lovingly produced by our team, Lindsay Garbenius, Phoebe Bradford, and Devin Johnson. And if you want more cool stuff or just to find out what I'm up to, visit simonsynic.com. Until next time, take care of yourself, take care of each other.