803. Work with Your Cycle: Boost Energy, Mood and Fertility

27:23But the fact is, these things change. And just to give you an example of this, our basal metabolic rate increases by about 11 % during the second two weeks of the cycle compared to the first. And so when I give you one size fits all nutritional guidance, where I say you need to have X number of calories a day, what's going to happen to you during the last two weeks in the cycle? You're going to be hungry, right? And you're going to be tired and you're going to be pissed off and you're going to have food cravings because your body actually has different needs during that time that you're never told about.

27:59And so ignoring these needs and these changes that we experience has created for a lot of women, this experience of what we think of as PMS and it's completely unnecessary. Wow. Yeah. I think like just that fact that PMS is unnecessary is going to blow a lot of people's minds because I think we've just taken it on as like normal and what we have to go through. So you're saying nutritionally, lifestyle, how we work out, how we, our mood is all affected by the progesterone, I guess. Right. And even the way that like we relate to our partners. So just to give you, yeah. I mean, so here's some really interesting research.

28:40And so we all know about the fact that when estrogen is high in the cycle, so near ovulation, women tend to experience an increase some sexual desire, right? So women tend to feel more lustful. They feel sexier. They want to have more sex at that time relative to the second half of the cycle. But there's also research showing that what we're looking for from sex changes across the cycle. And so many species of females, and especially female mammals like us, they don't even have sex during non-fertile points in the cycle, right? They only have sex when conception is possible. We are very rare in the fact that we have sex across the cycle.

29:21So even when we're not fertile, so during the luteal phase, so the last, you know, those second two weeks in the cycle, most species, the females don't have sex at all because it's kind of irrelevant, right? I mean, from a conception perspective. But human females, of course. And then there's a couple of other species like the, oh gosh, now it's going to prairie bulls. I'm like, what is that species? That was my guess. Yeah. Yeah. Like prairie bulls are another one like us. There's some other primates that also have sex across the cycle, but it's very uncommon. It makes sense though, because if we're just listening to our natural, like our natural desires on like a physical level.

30:09Right. I'm probably not wanting to have. Yeah. I know that I'm not wanting to have sex as much. Right. Yeah. Totally. Totally. And when you do want to have sex during the second two weeks, there's been some really interesting research that's been done looking at women's motivations during that time. And it's not about like sex for the, you know, like sort of sex for the purpose of sex. It's about sex for connection and action. And what they find is that for women who are feeling insecure in their relationship and are really feeling a motivation and a need to connect with their partner, that during the second half of the cycle, that they tend to have the most sex because they have that need for connection.

30:49Because the second half of the cycle is essentially all about the body coordinating activities to help promote the probability of a successful pregnancy. And so we see all of these psychological and physiological shifts that help to promote the type of an environment, both a physical environment in a woman's body, but then also her social environment and her relationship with her partner that's geared toward pregnancy. And this is true whether or not women want to have kids or not, right? If you've ovulated and you're having a luteal phase, right, which is that second half of the cycle that's dominated by the sex hormone progesterone, your body is getting everything into place and getting you to behave in a way that's helping to get your environment into place in a context that will be favorable for pregnancy and child rearing.

31:41And so it totally changes our need for connection with our partner. So what we tend to see is that even though women's sexual desire decreases during this time, that their need for connection with their partner, emotional connection and emotional support from their partner increases during this time. And this is something, again, you know, sort of like the different calorie requirements that we talked about, women aren't told about. You know, like, I don't know about you, but I was never told about this. And a lot of us assume that, you know, sexual desire, for example, is one size fits all, right?

32:14And that it should be the same every day. It should be consistent. And that it should be consistent and that there's something wrong with us if we're not experiencing. Or that it should mimic a male or like something like that. Yeah, yeah. That we should just be like instantly turn on-able just like men are. And that sex should always be about sex instead of sometimes sex being about sex and sometimes sex being about connection. Yeah. And these are just a few of the types of changes that we tend to see in how women relate to their partners and like what, you know, what the meaning of sex is, like what their needs are physically in terms of their calorie needs and, you know, everything in between.

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35:31Again, that's fatty15.com slash almost 30. The code is almost 30 and you'll get 15 % off their 90-day starter kit. Yeah, I'm mind blown. Like, so if people listening feel like they're two different people during the month, sometimes like I notice and I feel like I've become more attuned to this over the last couple of years. I'm like, why is something that my husband does every day annoying me this week? You know what I mean? Like, it's just like, there are certain things that feel almost like magnified during certain parts of my cycle. And I've noticed that now, But before I would have lost the plot and totally spiraled.

36:14But now I'm understanding that I'm different. But I think what I need to bridge the gap on and maybe people listening can relate is how do we have this conversation with our partners? Right. I think this is a really important conversation to have with our partners. Because again, like, you know, and to sort of step away from sex a little bit, but to get at some of the emotional things like what you were just talking about. you know, one thing that we know about the way that our brains work is that like the types of things that irritate us and the types of things that set off alarm bells. So make us feel, you know, anxious within our relationship, all of that changes depending on what's going on with ourselves physically and psychologically.

36:56And when we're in a time of vulnerability, which we are when we're in the luteal phase of the cycle, because again, the sex hormone progesterone is something that's released as your body is preparing for the possibility of pregnancy. Right. Right. And this is a time when women are incredibly vulnerable. Yeah. Right. Not only is the number one, you know, this is the time in a woman's life and she's most likely to be murdered. Right. But this is also a time, you know, where it's like our needs are at an all time high. Our calorie needs are higher. You know, historically women relied on men for access to food because we spent, of course, most of our history as humans and living as hunter-gatherers.

37:35And so we are very dependent on our partners. At least historically, we've been very dependent on our partners during the time of pregnancy. And because of that vulnerability, and of course, when women are pregnant, they're less able to forage for food on their own, right? Again, thinking about this in terms of an ancestral evolutionary type of a context. So pregnant, you know, the luteal phase and pregnancy is a time that historically has been very vulnerable for women, right? And they've been very dependent on their partner. And whenever you are in a state of vulnerability, it changes the threshold that your brain creates for sending alarm bells that there's a problem, right?

38:15This is why chihuahuas bark more than like a Great Dane, right? Because they're vulnerable, right? They're small, they could be attacked. So everything freaks them out and they freak out, right? Our brain is the same way. And we get really anxious about things when we're more vulnerable. And when we're not vulnerable, we don't get anxious. And this is also why men will walk alone at night much more frequently than women will, right? Because we're more vulnerable. And so we are more afraid of, you know, a bad outcome. And you sort of put this with the luteal phase and our relationships, you know, your partner could during the follicular phase.

38:52So during the early phase of the cycle, when estrogen is the dominant hormone, tell you, I'm going to be late tonight. I'm going to stay and work a little bit extra. And you're like, okay, no big deal. I'll see you when you get home. During the luteal phase, where your brain is going to sort of fire the alarm bells, you need less evidence of a problem for you to freak out. And so a lot of times what will happen is the exact same stimulus. So your partner's saying, I am going to stay late for work. You're thinking to yourself, oh no, like, what does that mean? Like, what if I'm abandoned? Right.

39:25And again, it's because our need is greater. We're more vulnerable during this time. And so our brain actually changes the threshold for when it sends off the alarm bells. And knowing this is so helpful and being able to communicate this to your partner is so helpful. And I'll just give you an example from my own life. I had an incident with my husband where we were trying to plan out our summer schedule, right? And he had all of these things planned that he wanted to do. Like, you know, he had this golf trip with his friends and he was going to do this and this. And anyway, he said some, and the way that he laid it out, it was kind of like, oh, well, you know, and you and I can go and do something on our own, right?

40:08If there's time available or something like that, right? At least that's how it came across to me. So I was very upset, right? Like, wait a minute. Like, and it could, because this made me feel very, it made me feel unsafe, right? It made me feel like, oh, maybe he doesn't value time with me the way that, you know, he should. And so the alarm bells were very much going off. And, um, and this was during the luteal phase of my cycle. And, you know, I totally freaked out, slammed the door when I left, you know, I, I was not willing. He called me, I hung up on him. and later on, after I'd cooled off, I thought about it.

40:46I'm like, I am in the luteal phase of my cycle. Like this, I feel anxious. Yeah. This made, I lashed out because I was feeling vulnerable. Right. And do I have need to feel this afraid? Like, and I went through the sort of, no, I don't like, no, he's, he's always shown that he values me and, you know, this and that, and the other thing. But also, you know, sometimes I'm not able to talk myself off the cliff just by sort of understanding like, okay, my brain is firing alarm bells and it's more likely to do this because I'm more vulnerable during this time. Sometimes I also need additional assurances.

41:24And so I talked to him and told him like, my brain is firing alarm bells and this is because, you know, I'm at this vulnerable point in my cycle and I just need added assurances that I'm safe and that you value our relationship? And, you know, and, and that's exactly what he did, you know, and, and being able to talk to him about this is so helpful to me. And I think that most men, you know, with this and also the sexual desire piece, I mean, I think men are so, you know, if they're in a relationship with a woman, they just don't understand what it means to be cyclical. They just don't understand what it means to have a brain that's cycling because our hormones are cycling.

42:08Right. And being able to talk to them about the fact that we are going to cycle through periods of higher and lower sexual desire. Right. And at some point, sexual desire is going to be all about like, you know, just like hot, lustful sex. And sometimes it's going to be about a need for connection. And so the quickie just is not going to cut it. Yeah. Right. And also understanding that sometimes, you know, smaller things will set off my alarm bells. Sure. And then understanding that other times I'll be more resilient to that. Men are like so happy to have this information. They need the info. They do.

42:43And I mean, having these, yeah, I mean, seriously, and having these conversations with our partners, I think is so critical. And as long as you're not in a relationship with a total jerk, you know, who's going to throw that in your face. And, you know, every time that you have something go on that, you know, makes you feel sensitive that they're not, you know. Throwing that back at you. Exactly. Then I really think there's huge value in doing that. And it's really transformed my relationship. And it really has deepened my relationship because there's so much more of an understanding of what's going on with me that allows us to be able to navigate some of these typical road bumps that people experience in relationships.

43:24I think it's, yeah, it's so important. I think the lead up to the conversation always feels harder than the actual conversation, you know? And I think to your point, they are receptive because it helps them. It helps them be better. So it's truly a win-win. Is there a way in which you help your husband to track your cycle? Or is it just kind of like he has an awareness that at certain times things might be a little bit different? Yeah. Well, it's funny because he is so tuned into it now that he always, he always knows more than I do. He's like, he's like, wait, where are you? Like, you're like day 18 right now, aren't you?

44:03And I'm like, I don't know. Like, I think I'm like day 14. And he's like, no, I'm pretty sure it's 18. I'll pull up my tracker. And I'm like, yeah, you're right. It's 18. Like he just knows. He just like has it running in the back of his head always. And I've got to tell you that even, you know, it was with my first book, I did, you know, I just had like a little couple of, you know, short snippets about how the cycle works and how that, you know, can influence the way that women feel and experience with the world. I got so much feedback from men saying, oh my gosh, I had no idea. Like this changes everything.

44:37And so I think that, you know, really I'm talking with our partners and not assuming that they understand because they just don't understand what it means to be cyclical. It just totally. Because they're on a 24-hour cycle. Yeah, they're on a 24-hour cycle. Yeah. And so it just is a totally different experience for them. And then to understand that, I think that it deepens the relationship. And then it also, you know, it allows for better communication, allows for better sex. It allows for everybody to get what they want. Completely. Completely. I wanted to, with the luteal phase, so we talked about, you know, in our relationships, but are there other ways that we can support ourselves during that phase nutritionally, workout wise, what can you be aware of?

45:20Yeah, absolutely. And so one of the things that I already talked about is just the fact that we do need more food. And this is something that women always have a hard time with because when you tell people that you need to eat more, you're always like, yeah, okay, whatever. I need to eat more. And you're like, so should I work out more? You know, just kind of like that weird math. Yeah, because we have this, you know, we've been force fed since we were really little, this one size fits all, you know, like here's what you need every day. Right. And women, um, because we have these cycles and at different periods in our cycle, we're hungrier than we are at other periods in our cycle.

45:57So we know that women eat less and move more when estrogen is the dominant hormone. So near ovulation, we're just not as hungry. We tend to move around a lot. And during the luteal phase, we tend to eat more and we tend to move around less. And we've been told, no, you are supposed to get the same amount of exercise every day and or at least every week if you've got a workout plan and you're supposed to have the same number of calories every day. And so we've been trained from a very young age not to listen to our bodies, right? Because we are like, I'm hungry. I've been eating the number of calories I was told I'm supposed to eat and I'm hungry.

46:39Or in the follicular phase, when estrogen is the dominant hormone, we're like, I'm not hungry. And I'm told that I need to eat this and I'm not hungry. And so it's like, we've been trained to think that our body is the enemy and not to listen to it. And so we just need to totally get rid of that type of thinking and learn to trust our hunger, especially during the luteal phase, because this is a time in the cycle when our resting metabolic rate increases, as I said, at like up to about 11%. So for a person who eats about 2000 calories a day, this is like an extra 165, extra 175 calories a day.

47:19I mean, this is like significant. And so you need to eat more. You also need to recover longer. Your body is not able to recover the way that it is in the follicular phase during the luteal phase. And the reason for this is that your body, and this doesn't sound like it should be that hard to do, but the building of the endometrial layer that the body is building to prepare for the possibility of pregnancy during that time ends up being incredibly energetically costly. I feel like I feel it every month. Yeah, I know, right? You know what I mean? No, totally. Totally. And so, you know, your heart rate goes up, and so that's going on.

48:00You have less heart rate variability. So if you are somebody who uses a tracker, you'll see that your HRV actually gets lower during the luteal phase compared to the follicular. You're just not as resilient. And so it really requires extra care in terms of rest and recovery. And it feels weird to women, again, because we're force fed this like one size fits all nutritional and rest related guidance, but we need to eat more and move less. And that doesn't be, I mean, that just feels so counterintuitive to everything that we're always told about what we need to be doing with ourselves that it can be difficult to listen to.

48:39But I promise you that it makes so much of a difference in how you feel. Because I've found, and even just watching my own tracker, I can treat my body like an amusement park during the follicular phase. I can go out and stay out late with my friends, only get five hours of sleep, have two glasses of wine at dinner. And I wake up and I'm like rested, recovered. My HRV was good. Everything was just fine. If I do that in the phase, it's terrible. My recovery is awful. My HRV is low. I just can't do that. And I found that if I make small shifts where I just make sure that I go to bed even 30 minutes earlier, right?

49:26To make sure that I'm getting that extra recovery, right? Minimizing or completely abstaining from alcohol, changing my workout in ways that prioritizes strength building and high intensity cardio during the follicular phase when estrogen is dominant, and then focusing more on sort of meditative forms of exercise. I love going for walks. So walks and yoga and things that are restorative. What I found is by making these shifts is that not only did my relationship with myself get better during the luteal phase of the cycle, not having all these food cravings, not feeling exhausted and cranky all of the time because my resources are all depleted, but I actually got stronger, which was crazy for me because I have spent, you know, the last, I don't know, I think it was probably about 10 years ago that I really got into strength building and just making sure that I'm lifting weights and being able to, yeah, maintain muscle mass.

50:25and I had kind of plateaued at the amount that I was able to lift for a really long time. And I finally decided to put the science that I'd been learning to the, you know, put the rubber to the road and shift the way that I was exercising to prioritize strength building in the early parts of the cycle and prioritize more, you know, like restorative forms of exercise, like those beautiful walks outside. And I got stronger. I go over the research on all of this in the book, But sure enough, estrogen actually primes different types of pathways in the body that help to promote muscle building. And yeah, and it's because it's anabolic, like a steroid, right?

51:06It's an anabolic steroid. Progesterone is actually catabolic and it actually likes to break muscle down and break different types of proteins down. And it does this because it likes to take all those amino acids for building that endometrial layer. Wow. And so they've done studies where they'll have women following the exact same strength building routine where they're either doing most of the strength building in the early half of the cycle when estrogen is dominant, or in a different group of women, they had them doing the same amount of exercise, but instead they were doing the majority of the strength building in the luteal phase and then doing other stuff in the follicular phase.

51:44And what they found was that despite the fact that these two groups of women were doing identical amounts of exercise, that the group who did the strength building in the follicular phase, so when estrogen is dominant, the first two weeks of the cycle, that they put on significantly more muscle mass than women doing the exact same workouts in the second half of the cycle. And so it's like, why are we exhausting ourselves by doing the same workout every single day? I mean, it just doesn't make any sense. And, you know, it's like we've all been led to believe that we're the same as men, you know, and a lot of this has just been laziness, honestly, on the part of science where they haven't taken the time to actually really look and spend time understanding the way that our hormones and our cyclical changes in our hormones influence the way that our bodies respond to things.

52:40And instead, they've just tried to study women as if they were small men, only including them in research during these narrow windows of the cycle when estrogen is the dominant hormone. And so women are never told about the fact that all of these things change in that last two weeks. And when we follow this guidance that we're given that doesn't work for our bodies, it can make a lot of us feel really awful. Absolutely.

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56:19Would you say just on that nutritional piece that would you recommend more protein in the luteal phase? or like, is there anything we should stay away from? Is there anything in particular? Yeah, so really great question. And the research on this is very small. So this is a very small body of research. Which is crazy. Yeah, I know. Well, yeah, and it's of course like typical, right? I know. Everything with women's health, like when you look at the amount of science that's been done, it's like, are you kidding me? Like, this is the best we can do. And what I think also is crazy, this is, I won't go too far on this, But it's like, you know, I feel like now more than ever, and maybe it's always been, but maybe it's just being talked about more, where people are struggling with fertility as well.

57:08Right. And I'm like, I know we can't be doing studies on pregnant women, but why aren't we understanding what women are needing not only to conceive, but also to create these healthier menstrual cycles, cycles in general, not have these intense PMS symptoms? because I can imagine it's affecting potentially fertility, which we can get into, but it's just, it's mind blowing to me because I'm like, it's, it's a part of, it's a part of like our human nature to conceive, you know, so it's just so wild. So I want to reach, I want to put a pin in the fertility thing because I have a lot to say about that.

57:51I'm sure. But with, you know, with respect to what we should be eating again, Again, anything that we can do to eat foods that are nourishing for our body, you know, so whole, you know, whole foods, minimally processed is going to be especially important during the second half of the cycle. Because again, our body just isn't able to recover from being treated like an amusement park, like it is in the first half of the cycle. And so, you know, really trying to make sure that you're eating nourishing foods. And in terms of like, whether there's specific types of macronutrients that might be important during this time.

58:27There has been a little tiny shred of research that suggests that maybe more protein is the way to go. And the reason for this is, again, our body is using so many amino acids to build that endometrial layer, which again, it's so funny because it doesn't sound, it's like something growing fingernails. You know what I mean? It's like, it doesn't seem like it should be that hard to do, but it is. And it requires a lot of resources. And they've done these really cool studies where they've looked at availability of amino acids in women's bloodstream and urine, just like kind of looking at like what's freely available.

59:01And what you see is like right after the peak in the luteal phase, when the body is in peak endometrial lining development, like we become absolutely depleted, like just absolutely depleted of amino acids. And our body is just like taking everything that it can because amino acids are of course the building blocks of tissue. And they're taking all of those things, breaking down muscle, you know, doing whatever it needs to do to get these amino acids and then using it for the endometrial layer. And so there's been a tiny bit of research that suggests that women tend to feel better when they're eating more protein.

59:38And of course, protein is, you know, a great source of amino acids. And so what I've done, even though there's not a ton of science, because one of the things about this book is that it is all science-based, right? It's not just like woo-woo, like, hey, let's try to take naps in the luteal phase and go for a run in the follicular phase, but it's all backed in science. And this is one of those things where there's not so much evidence where I would say, absolutely, I know this is true, but it's low cost, right? It's like the risk is very low if like you're eating more protein in this time. And so I've done that in my own life and it definitely, it makes me feel fuller longer, you know, and it makes me feel better.

1:00:22And so I tend to prioritize making sure that I'm getting more protein and especially because I tend to eat a pretty plant forward diet, but I do eat animal products. So I do eat meat, but I, and I tend to eat more of it during the last two weeks of the cycle. Definitely. And it it makes me feel better when I do so. And so sort of, yeah. So shifting, you know, kind of shifting what I'm eating has been really helpful to me and also helping to minimize, you know, feeling like uncontrollably hungry where I feel like I need to stop what I'm doing every, you know, couple of hours to eat something. It's useful to like be able to fill up on something that's going to give me, um, give me a lot of satiety.

1:01:00Absolutely. Yeah. That's super helpful. Um, you mentioned earlier a link between anxiety and progesterone. Can we talk about that? Yeah, absolutely. So, so what's so crazy about progesterone, and this was another reason that I say that, um, the luteal phase is sort of a neurobiological mystery, um, is because progesterone, believe it or not, is a hormone that has these really potent anti-anxiety effects on the brain, which is really surprising to most women because they're thinking about PMS and thinking about anxiety. And there's sort of a difference between anxiety and then where we, because we did talk about lowering that threshold when we're willing to fire the alarm bells.

1:01:46And that's more of a targeted fear. So our fear response becomes more sensitive, but general anxiety right when progesterone is highest actually tends to be relatively low. It's when progesterone starts to fall because all of a sudden, you know, cause the luteal phase, if you think about the last two weeks of the cycle, right. They're kind of divided into it's, it's also divided into two halves. So the early luteal phase, whoops, for people who are listening, I'm like drawing, going up a curve, your progesterone levels are rising. Okay. Right. And during this time, women actually tend to feel pretty sleepy and very calm because it is this very calming neurostic.

1:02:27It causes this really calming neurobiological effect because it releases this metabolite called allopregnanolone that stimulates GABA receptors, which are the calming receptors in our brain. So when progesterone is being released, it's breaking down and it's causing this calming effect in the brain. But then what happens is once it peaks, if we're not pregnant, then it starts to fall. And when it starts to fall, you have all these naked receptors in your brain that we're used to getting all of that progesterone. And all of a sudden they're naked and afraid. Wow. Right? So that is why for many women who experience really bad PMS.

1:03:11So beyond the sort of, oh, I feel kind of moody and, oh, you know, I'm feeling more tired. But for the women who feel like they need help, right, like they're having some real issues, it tends to happen more frequently in the second half of the luteal phase. So either the week before the start of the period or about two to three days before the start of the period. And this is something that tends to happen to women who aren't very resilient to hormonal changes. So each one of us differs a little bit in our ability to sort of navigate all of the psychological changes that happen as our hormones change.

1:03:56Why do we differ? We differ in a lot of ways because of a lack of neuroplasticity. Right. And so neuroplasticity is something that we can increase. So this is essentially how plastic is your, like how quickly is your brain able to upregulate? So like, and downregulate progesterone receptors. So another less nerdy way of saying that is, I love the nerdiness. How quickly is your body able to sort of be, you know, sort of adjust, the volume based on how much progesterone is being released. And so, as I said, when progesterone levels are falling, you get a lot of these naked progesterone receptors that are like, oh no, I'm anxious because I'm used to getting this calming neurosteroid and it's gone now.

1:04:46What happens is women who are really able to navigate those hormonal transitions without any issues, those receptors actually recede. So they actually retract. And so they're no longer there and naked and afraid. And they recede because just like they're biologically... Yes. Our brain is so cool and so plastic. We create and then pull back in receptors. Yeah. So we used to always think that the brain was just sort of this blob in the head and that you kind of had this thing and it's like not really changing, but it's very plastic. It's always changing, especially women's brains, because we have to be able to adjust to changing hormone levels.

1:05:26So how can we create that plasticity? Yes. How do we create a hormonal, like resilience to hormonal changes? How do we create cellular plasticity? It's really all of the pillars to good health. And it's so, you know, it's so boring to give you the answer to this because it's everything that we can do to decrease inflammation. Right. So when we keep inflammation though. We know that that's related to having more resilience to hormonal changes, just basic physical health, because what's good for one part of your body is good for other parts of your body. So it's the sort of pillars, the bedrocks of good health are getting a good night of sleep, having healthy circadian rhythms, which is going to help you get a good night of sleep.

1:06:11It's eating a nutrient dense diet, getting physical activity, managing stress, and having meaningful relationships with other people. So, you know, doing these sorts of activities, which again, I mean, this is that wisdom that our grandparents and our parents have been telling us over and over and over again. All of this also helps to promote resilience to hormonal changes. Wow. Yeah. And it really is, you know, and this actually gets to the fertility issue as well. Let's get into it. Cause I'm just like, I've been thinking about the whole time. I'm like, what is the connection here? If people are wanting to get pregnant and they're experiencing these PMS symptoms?

1:06:49Is there a connection? Right. Well, so, okay. So there's not a connection, but, but there is sort of, there, there is a connection between the luteal phase and, and, and fertility and pregnancy. And so this is something I want to, I want to talk about because it is almost never talked about. And I think that it's an absolute tragedy because there's so many women who struggle with infertility, sort of, you know, like unknown infertility. And the answers are really simple in a lot of cases. And this is, so to start with, ovulation is obviously required in order to get pregnant, right? So we understand that your body releases an egg.

1:07:34And after the egg is released, that empty egg follicle is actually what is the endocrine structure that releases progesterone, right? So we do not release progesterone if we fail to ovulate, right? So if you have an an ovulatory cycle, you don't release progesterone. You don't actually have a real luteal phase because it's never being released. And so we actually get more sort of symptoms of PMS during cycles that are fertile compared to infertile, which is totally counterintuitive. And most people wouldn't believe it, but the research supports that this is in fact the case. Now here's the part that most women aren't told about, which is the thing that I think is tragic.

1:08:20So let me back this up with a story and tell you that when I first started doing research on cycles, right? So women's menstrual cycles and how women's psychology changes across the cycle, we would bring women into the research laboratory, right? And we would only bring in women who are healthy, who reported having regular cycles, right? So who knew basically every month that their cycles would be roughly the same number of days, right? Whether it's 20, 28 days or 30 days, we just brought in women who had regular cycles and who were healthy. So everybody was, you know, have a healthy body weight.

1:08:57Everybody was not on medication. I mean, this is like a pristine sample of women. And usually the women in our sample, because we collect on a college campus, get a lot of college students, they tend to be between the ages of about 18 and 24 to 25. So these are young, fertile, healthy women. And when we first started doing this research and we were measuring their cycles, and we would do it using a luteinizing hormone test, which is that LH test that women, you pee on a stick, and then it tells you whether or not you're about to ovulate. And what we were finding with our research was that about 30 % of the time women weren't ovulating.

1:09:34This is a population of women with regular menstrual cycles who don't have any endocrinological issues. None of them are on birth control. And their periods are coming like normally, but they're not ovulating. And I'm like, 30 %? This is nuts. And so I thought we were doing something wrong because of course, you know, like as a, as a researcher, you're like, there must be something that I, you know, I need to participate. And so I talked to other researchers in the field and it turns out everybody gets the same number. They get about 30 % of cycles are an ovulatory. And these are healthy women who don't even know that they're not ovulating because their periods are coming at regular intervals.

1:10:18Okay. So first, first thing that we need to know is that failure to ovulate is incredibly common, right? Okay. And that a lot of times, um, women have no idea that they're having these anovulatory cycles. Um, and, and I'll say that they're very common. It's not generally common, like for huge long periods of time, right? Like if you're anovulatory for, you know, a full year and never have an ovulatory cycle, that would be unusual. Okay. But for any given cycle, there's about a 30 % chance that you might not be ovulating. What causes failure to ovulate? The number one thing that causes failure to ovulate in women, well, number one and two, stress, lack of social connection.

1:11:03Wow. Yeah. Those two things. And so we tend to think of fertility as being this issue that needs to be solved with Petri dishes and syringes and in a doctor's office and with medications. And it really might be solved by joining a book club, right? Or finding some new friends, making sure that you're prioritizing a community. Because the thing that I don't think that most women understand, because we've kind of medicalized our bodies in this like really bizarre way. Yes. Like our body will not ovulate if it doesn't feel safe to have a baby. I mean, say it again. Yes. Our body will not ovulate if it doesn't feel safe to have a baby.

1:11:47And part of that is stress. Like stress is one way that our brain, you know, is getting information about how safe the environment is. And if we are under chronic stress, our brain is going to think this is not a good time to have a baby. And so it just won't ovulate. And especially when I think about the fact that we're, a lot of us do this research on college women, who's more stressed out than a college woman, right? Except for a woman who is a career woman or a woman with young kids. I mean, it's so common for women to experience this like chronic stress. And they, again, you know, we're taught as women to suck it up.

1:12:25It's like, don't trust your body. Don't trust your stress response. You're overreacting. You can do it all, right? You can have it all. You can, you know, work a really stressful job and have a family and have this, that's chronic stress. And that's going to suppress fertility. And another potent suppressor of fertility is again, not having a community and women who have higher scores and loneliness tend to have higher rates of failure to ovulate. And just to give another example of this from research during the COVID-19 pandemic, when women, when, when not just women, but when everybody was socially isolating, they did a research study where they looked at the ovulation rates in women during the period of social sequestration that happened during COVID, the rates of anovulation almost doubled.

1:13:14Wow. Just from lacking community. That's crazy. I mean, it really is crazy. And I don't think, again, you know, it's like we've medicalized our bodies in such a way that it's hard to think of us as being this really organic structure, you know, that it's like we need, it's like air, you know, we need social connections. We need to be able to learn to dial down our stress response. And we also need to make sure that we are getting enough food because that's, that's another thing that'll shut down ovulation is if, um, if your energy intake is not sufficient to, um, and it's not because there's this idea out there that if you're a professional athlete or you exercise a lot, that you're going to have no, you know, you're going to have suppressed ovulation and you can't get pregnant.

1:13:57And that's not true if you eat enough. And so they've, they've done studies now where they found that it's not that like over exercise or intense exercises suppresses fertility. It's just generally these women are in a state of negative energy balance. And it's like, that's stressful on the body. And that's stress on the body. And same with, you know, they did the studies with vaccines and how that influenced fertility. And it doesn't influence fertility in the long-term, but in the short-term, like if you get a vaccine, you might suppress ovulation that cycle because your body's having an immune response.

1:14:29And same with if you come up, if you come down with a cold or you have the flu, your body also is likely to suppress ovulation. Inflammation is stress on the body that also decreases the probability of ovulation. And so again, you know, I think that and I provide tools in the book that women can use to try to help support ovulation, because I think that it's some ovulation is so good for female bodies and brains. I mean, it's like how we make our hormones and our sex hormones are so good for us. I mean, in so many ways, like in terms of feeling our best, but also just in terms of supporting our bodies.

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1:18:19My mind is like blown because it's, it's evolutionarily, if that's a word, like when I think about, you know, having community and, and deep connection, like it's the village, you know, it's, it's where the, the baby is coming into to be, you know, it's just, it, it all makes sense. But I think in this modern age, like you said, we've like over medicalized everything and not to say that medical intervention hasn't helped and it's amazing and all the things. And I think we've like lost touch with these quote unquote, almost like basics to our health. Yeah. Yes, exactly. 100%. And it's like, I'm so grateful for all of these technologies that we have because especially for women, it's like, it's a terrible bind that we get put in as women where it's like, you're just starting to hit your stride with your career.

1:19:13And all of a sudden your fertility is falling off a cliff. And it's like, what, you know, it feels really unfair because it is unfair. You know, it sucks that our fertility starts to decline in, you know, as early as our late twenties. Yeah. It's crazy. It is crazy. And it's totally unfair. And so I'm so grateful for all of the research that's being put toward trying to help women extend their fertility, whatever that looks like. But as you said, it does then sort of make us forget that, especially for women who are still cycling and, you know, in their peak reproductive years, that it's really as simple as supporting the basic pillars of health.

1:19:53And, and it is the village, you know, it's throughout most of our history. And when we, when you look at contemporary hunter gatherer groups, it's like whether or not a child survives or not is heavily, heavily dependent on whether or not they have parents and family and tribe members around that are helping to care for and provision for a child. Because during those times, women, I mean, are pretty helpless. Like soon after you are giving birth and then you're having to, you know, feed your baby and you've got a crying baby and it's hard to get food. I mean, it's so dependent on having those relationships And so our brain is so smart and it communicates with our ovaries because ovulation starts in the brain.

1:20:37And it's, yeah, it starts in the hypothalamus in the brain. So the brain tells the pituitary to tell the ovaries whether or not to start stimulating egg follicles or not. And if our brain tells our ovaries to start stimulating egg follicles and they start developing and our body all of a sudden feels really unsafe, it will cut it off. Yep. It'll stop. and then those egg follicles will just wither and die and then you don't ovulate. And so it's like having, you know, trying to set up your world in a way that is conducive to, you know, like a healthy, you know, you almost have to imagine like what it would have been like in tribal days, you know, to like an environment that would be really supportive of pregnancy and really supportive of childcare.

1:21:23Setting up that environment for so many women is the difference between struggling with their fertility and then ovulating regularly. I can't stress that enough. And even like, you know, if you are tracking your ovulation and kind of closely monitoring, you know, when you have sex, all the things and kind of understand what's happening during that hopeful like conception period, like thinking about, you know, maybe you're not, you know, flying around traveling during those two weeks. Maybe, you know, it's like those types of things that I don't know if we're necessarily intuitively thinking about.

1:22:05Right. No, I'm not. No, no, me either. Right. And like they did a study, for example, there's this one study where they had women getting socially, like they had them experimentally socially excluded. Right. So they like went into a situation where they felt like other people were leaving them out of a game. and then in a different condition, women were felt like they were included and they were included in the game. And what they found was that, um, for the women who felt excluded that their body during this really critical period where your body's starting to mature egg follicles was, were releasing hormones to stop ovulation in its tracks.

1:22:40It was starting to release that now. Would, would it, you know, be, they didn't look and see like, did these women actually not ovulate? probably not from one instance of that, but that their body was starting to go down that path. If you're constantly in situations where you're not feeling supported and you're not taking these types of things really seriously, it can have an impact on fertility. And like you said, I mean, sometimes it's like just taking simple steps because even if you don't have control over your travel schedule all the time, and if you're trying to have a baby and you do have a lot of stress and you are having to travel and do some of these other things, even doing things like mindfulness meditations, for example, have been found to be incredibly helpful in terms of minimizing stress.

1:23:26You can also do meditations like loving kindness meditations that help you feel more socially supported. And so even if you're not like a super extrovert who wants to be going to parties and feeling all of the community love, there's ways that we can actually you know, put ourself into the appropriate mindset because mind, you know, it's like our mind creates reality and that's what our brain is talking to our ovaries about. And so doing some of these things to try to really support fertility, support ovulation, support healthy hormone release, support our cellular plasticity and our ability to navigate these hormonal changes can be such a game changer for women.

1:24:03Yeah. This is a real, this is so fascinating. I think a lot people are going to, yeah, be note-taking. So for those listening that have recently or are thinking about coming off of birth control, I know we've had our episode about that. And I'm curious related to PMS, how they can support themselves with this like new, new hormonal self because it's like, yeah, it's totally different. Yeah. It can be totally jarring. I mean, like, so I remember when I went off the pill that, cause I went from being such a steady Eddie, you know, like, like when you're on the pill, it's like, it's just like every day is the same hormonally.

1:24:47And so you're pretty even keeled. And I remember when I went off of it, well, the first thing I noticed was, you know, I felt more alive and energetic and all of these like really great things, you know, I felt sexy and fun and, you know, all of these great things. But then I also like definitely, you know, the pendulum swung the other way where I was like, oh my gosh, like, cause I always thought that, you know, PMS, I'm like, what is that? Like, I don't even know what that is. Like these people are over, you know, they're exaggerating. And then when I went off it, I'm like, nope, they're not exaggerating.

1:25:21This is a real, this is a very real phenomenon. And I mean, really, again, anything that you can do to increase your resilience to the hormonal changes is going to be a game changer. And, you know, honestly, like when you look at the research, what it finds is that women who have really bad PMS, if they're not able to get that, you know, like if they're not able to take steps to increase their resilience to hormonal changes, they're also the women who tend to have a bad postpartum period. And they're also the women who tend to have a terrible paramenopause, menopausal transition. And so our ability to navigate these hormonal changes and increase our resilience to those kinds of changes can be really powerful in terms of leading us to have a more powerful or like a more comfortable luteal phase and to get rid of PMS, but also to have a better postpartum and then also to have a better menopausal transition.

1:26:19Wow. And so, you know, I, I spend, um, and I talk about it in every chapter when I talk about all of the different ways that progesterone changes the body and, you know, what are some of the steps that we can take to sort of alleviate some of these things to make it feel like more like we're just sort of coasting up and down a smooth hill rather than, you know, climbing and falling off a cliff every month. I also have a couple of chapters that are dedicated specifically to how do we navigate and how do we increase our resilience to these hormonal changes. So that way we can have a better luteal phase, but then we can also have a better postpartum and have a better perimenopause.

1:26:59yeah and I think these conversations are happening more and more around paramenopause menopause like yeah I just think it's happening more but to have this be kind of your foundation like you know as women having a period and kind of shaping our resiliency around this and knowing that it serves us through every hormonal shift moving forward because there will be Yeah, because we live in cycles, right? We live in a monthly cycle where we cycle between estrogen and progesterone. We have pregnancy cycles where we cycle between pregnancy and postpartum. We have a fertility cycle where we cycle from being in high fertility to a season of infertility.

1:27:46So we're cyclical. And the more that we can learn to navigate our cyclicity and to promote our resilience to these hormonal changes, the easier it all feels. And it really does. I mean, it really can make a big difference. What do we need to know just as a reminder for people about the brain and birth control and just understanding, you know, when we come off of it, I guess, what is our brain coming from as far as being on birth control for a while? Yeah, it can be a little gnarly, you know, like it really can be. So, um, you know, when you're on the pill, you know, rather than waxing and waning between these two hormones, you know, where you have this period of high estrogen and then that falls, and then you're in this period of hypergesterone and that falls, um, for women who are on the pill, you get the same hormonal message every day, right?

1:28:36So there is no cycle, right? You're just getting, you know, every day is the same hormonally. And it is sort of like being a man, right? Where you're just getting the same thing every day. And when you discontinue that, and then all of a sudden are cycling between two hormones, it can feel a little crazy. And like I said, I remember having the experience where I was like, oh my gosh, this is the best I've ever felt, right near ovulation. I'm like, oh my gosh, this is amazing. And then going into the luteal phase and thinking, what is this? What happened? And essentially what's happening is our body is having to learn how to adjust to, you know, from being this, you know, every day is the same hormonally self to somebody who's cycling.

1:29:21And that again, requires you to have a lot of cellular plasticity and neuroplasticity. And that takes a little bit of time to build. And so for women who are transitioning off of the pill, especially if they've been on it for a long time, it can take a little bit of time for their brain to catch on to what's happening, right? But it does happen. And, you know, for many women, it can happen as soon as like about a month and a half or two months after they discontinue because many women will start ovulating again within about six weeks of discontinuing the pill. And as soon as they start ovulating again, you start to feel a little bit more normal, right?

1:30:00And then your body has to kind of learn the ropes and learn how to navigate, you know, again, adjusting like how many receptors are present to get the hormones and then retracting and being able to navigate that smoothly. And that can take women sometimes, you know, from as little as like a couple months to all the way up to, you know, a year. I've heard from women who've had difficulty even after a full year has gone by where they still aren't quite feeling like themselves. And, you know, for those women, I definitely make the recommendation that, you know, a lot of the things that I talk about in my new book about promoting your resilience to hormonal changes and ways to support ovulation are going to help get you there quicker.

1:30:42Yeah. Because again, it's all about getting your body back to being regularly ovulating, which is the sort of normal state for a woman who's not pregnant, who's of reproductive age. And then also being able then to navigate those by having a lot of cellular plasticity. So all of the, you know, all of the little brain cells are able to quickly adapt to what's happening. And that way you don't feel as sort of, you know, like, like you're learning to drive stick shift, you know, like where you're shifting between first and second gear and you're like, but where you can become really adept at it where it's like, yeah, like if you really pay attention, you can tell that you're shifting and that there's a little bit of a different energetic shift, but it doesn't need to feel terrible.

1:31:29Yeah. And I think these conversations help, you know, it's like when, when we kind of bring what is happening biologically to light, then people feel less alone. They feel less crazy. And that's kind of like my last question around, you know, I think there has been in society and culture kind of this narrative around hormones where it's like, she's crazy. The hormones are crazy. Or even like I remember in postpartum, I'm like, oh, my hormones are crazy, you know, and not really honoring the truly natural cyclical nature of what's happening. So I guess, you know, what would you say to women who are, you know, in job environments who are just kind of like very much listening to that narrative around their hormones, like how can they like reclaim the beauty of the power of their cycle, their hormones?

1:32:33Because I do, you know, the mind is very powerful. We like believe something, you know, we can have a totally different experience. Yeah. Well, so to them, here's what I say. And this is, there's nothing wrong with being hormonal. Everybody is hormonal. Men are hormonal, right? They just have one primary sex hormone. And when their primary sex hormone changes, men change. So when men's testosterone levels are increasing, for example, they are more likely to behave aggressively if provoked. Their sexual desire is greater, right? And we don't think that's crazy, right? And so when our hormones change, it also influences who we are.

1:33:14And the idea that there's something wrong with having hormones that cycle is nothing more than a byproduct of the fact that we've all been force fed this belief that the only way to be is male, right? And that the male way of being is somehow superior to the female way of being, right? Nobody's even asked to consider like, where are these assumptions coming from? You know, like what's wrong with having a cycle? Like, you know, there's no reason that we couldn't turn the tables on that narrative that exists and say, men can't make good decisions because they only have this one hormone. And so they can't think of things from two different angles.

1:33:55They can only think of things from one different angle. And so women have a superior way of being because we're able to look at things from different perspectives, depending on what hormone is dominant. It's just that that's not sort of where culture landed, right? Culture landed with male as the assumption of what is normal. And from that, we've all sort of bought into this belief that there's something wrong with being female, but that's just not true. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's so much power in it. And I think even just, you know, I almost treat it as like part of my job as like a thriving human being to pay attention to that stuff now.

1:34:38I think maybe it's after pregnancy and just kind of tuning into my body more. I'm like, it is like the unlock for us as women. Yeah. We can be better partners, friends, better at our jobs, love our life more. You know, it's just, it is a true unlock. And so to spend time and care and attention here in this part of our health is like more than worth it. I know it can feel like, oh, this is too much. I don't have time for this. You know, I don't think we prioritize this stuff as much as we should, but it can improve everything else. It really can. And I mean, honestly, it doesn't need to be that complicated.

1:35:20I know. Because I think that sometimes, because you'll have these like purists who are like, well, if you're not tracking your cervical mucus and you're not, you know, this, and it's like, not everybody wants to do that. And it doesn't need to, you know, it doesn't need to be that complicated. And you don't need to ask your boss to schedule meetings around your period. You know, it's like not, it doesn't require that level of care. Even simply like getting something that tracks your body temperature, like the, like a ring or something to that effect can at least give you some insight into what's happening.

1:35:53I always recommend starting to just track things because I like to, but if you don't want to do that, you just want to keep it simple, stupid. temperature is low. You're probably in the follicular phase of your cycle. Temperature is high. Your body temperature increases when progesterone is released. And so that means that you're in the luteal phase of your cycle and then just making these really small adjustments. And, you know, I make recommendations about small things that you can do that don't need to turn your life upside down. Cause most people don't want to have their life turned upside down by the fact that they cycle, but it really doesn't require that much effort.

1:36:24And it doesn't require, You're, you know, meditating on a, you know, this, a mountainside, every luteal phase. It's just making these small little adjustments. And as you said, and I love how you phrase it, it's the great unlock. It is. It just unlocks. Yeah. Everything. Everything. And I, and to your story earlier, it can unlock so much in your relationship if you're in relationship. Oh, a hundred percent. You know, so I, yeah, I just encourage people to have that conversation. Maybe even send this episode to someone. Yeah. I love that idea. You know, I'm going to give it to my husband. We're going to talk about it tonight, actually.

1:36:58But this has been incredible. The book is The Period Brain. I'm so thankful for your work, your writing. It's just made such a big impact on our audience. So I'm just really, I'm really grateful. So where can people find you? So you can find me on my website is sarahehill.com. And that's Sarah with an H. and I'm on all social platforms with Sarah E. Hill PhD. I'm the most active on Instagram. Amazing. Amazing. Thank you so much. This has been wonderful. Thank you so much. I'm so glad that you had me. So great. Amazing. We'll see you later.

1:37:39Thank you so much, Sarah. You can follow Sarah on Instagram at Sarah Hill PhD. And the new book is out now. It's called The Period Brain, The New Science of Why We PMS and How to Fix It. All right, guys. Morning Microdose is the Clips channel for all the greatest hits of Almost 30. It's a free podcast with no ads at all. They're between five and 10 minutes. It's like the best of the best. I just got a DM this morning from someone that was like, this really hit. It was so powerful. So Morning Microdose is a great channel for that. Subscribe, rate and review Almost 30. It means the world to us. We've had 800 episodes.

1:38:10We've been doing this thing for a while. So it's so nice to just show us a little bit of love there and just appreciation. You can find us on YouTube. We got that video on YouTube, baby. And then Almost 30 Podcast on TikTok and Instagram. I'm on Instagram at itskrista. And I'm at lindsay simsik. We love y 'all. Love y 'all. See ya.