Aspire Insights: How to Speak So People Will Listen (with Communication Expert Jefferson Fisher)

24:13They're rooted in time-tested traditional perspectives that honor ancient wisdom, animal-based products, and clean living education to guide you in creating non-toxic rhythms and transformative results in your daily life. They are wildly passionate about providing research-backed, results-driven products without compromising your health. Backed by thousands of five-star reviews and unbelievable before and after photos. Their products are proven to create positive change in your skin and sense of wellness from skin, body, baby, hair, and home. And you can't forget their cult following natural deodorant and tallow skincare products.

24:53Primally Pure products are handcrafted with real raw ingredients to optimize your results and your overall health. Use code ASPIRE to get 15 % off your Primally Pure purchase. That's www.primallypure.com and use code ASPIRE at checkout for 15 % off your order. I'm so ready for fall, mostly because it's officially layering season and Macy's VIP fall fashion preview sale is the perfect way to update your wardrobe. Right now, you can take an extra 30 % off top brands plus 15 % off beauty. So it's just the perfect time to grab pieces you've been dreaming about. I'm going to snag a few pieces from Good American, of course.

25:40I just know I'll be wearing them nonstop. There's something for everyone in this sale. Women can shop over 100 brands of clothing, handbags, and accessories. And ladies, don't worry about your little ones. Kids' prices are just as low. Finally, to my beauty lovers, you'll get 15 % off favorites like YSL and Amani. The Macy's full VIP fashion preview runs September 25th through October 5th. Shop in store or online at macy's.com and get ready to step into full style.

26:14I want to talk to you about like workplace disagreements because I think difficult conversations with family, with friends is one thing. When you're in a professional environment and you have to have a disagreement. And let's say like you really think you're right, right? You've got an issue, a colleague or your boss, but you can't go and have the conversation as you would maybe ordinarily with a friend. What is the proper way to handle those types of disagreements? There's some things that come to mind. One is this idea of frames. And anybody listening right now can apply a frame to every conversation, whether it's the workplace, the boardroom, the living room, whatever one.

26:52And this is how you do it. Number one, you want to tell the person what you want to talk about. Number two, you want to tell them how you want to feel or walk away from that conversation. That's adding the goal into it. Number three, you get their buy-in into the frame. So let's say I need to address some comments you made yesterday, Emma. It would sound like this. Number one, I talked to you. I said, Emma, I need to talk to you about some comments that you made at yesterday's meeting. I want to walk away from that conversation with the understanding of knowing that's not going to happen again.

27:22Sound good? and like you, now you have it. Now you know exactly where you're going in that conversation. It could be about anything though. Hey, I'd like to talk with you about our meeting tomorrow and make sure that we're aligned on expectations for the budget network. Perfect, they're going to say, great. Instead of the, hey, you got five minutes? Which is never five minutes. And also it depends. Are you trying to tell me a story? Are you trying to give me something that I need right now? Because right now I'm focused on this email that I'm working on. So there's a lot of different ways of using that frame.

27:55Two, I want you to think of when you need to disagree with someone, especially in front of other people, but in any conversation, instead of the, I disagree, I don't agree. That's going to make them very defensive because they're going to go, no, that's mine. You need to have my idea. Most people love ideas. They just love theirs the best. A hundred percent. And so when you're able to say, instead of I disagree, tweak that to say, I see things differently. Talk in a matter of perspectives, not in points. So you might be making a great point. What you need to do is just talk about perspective. I see it differently.

28:29I have another take. I have a different perspective. Whenever you can say that, they're not going to get defensive. So it's going to allow them to do that. Third is you can prime the conversation with something like, I'm telling you this because. Now you can use this in a romantic setting. I'm telling you this because I love you. I'm telling you this because you're my friend. versus that. Instead of the, hey, I love you, but you hear the difference? Yeah, I totally hear the difference. Same thing in the workplace. I'm telling you this because I know you value transparency. I'm telling you this because I know we're all headed to the same goal and we all support each other.

29:04I'm telling you this because I want to leave this meeting with alignment. Perfect. There you go. Just like that. And I'll give you another thing that I really like for the workplace. Anybody who's ever can relate to this of throwing out an idea around a boardroom and somebody immediately tries to cut it down, it's because they think their idea is the best. They want, they're very protective of their ideas. And so they like to poke holes in yours because it's not theirs. Of course. So, but when you say I have 20 % of an idea, use percentages. So I have 20 % of an idea. I need your help with the other 80%.

29:34And now - That's a good one. Now you create this collaboration environment. Now everybody's, now they feel it like a challenge to build to the 80%. Yeah, because there's like a sense of ownership in the rest of the idea. Now they feel like they're building it. All right. So what happens then? Because I'm just going to keep picking on this. What if you have to prove your case? Like what happens when nobody's with you in the room and you feel very, very strong to the point of like, you know, emotionally strong in an idea? What do you do? Like, how do you create? It's not so much an argument, but when like the room is against you, like how do you bring people around when it's like, I know I'm right about this thing?

30:13So I would, here's what my thought is. Number one, I would say out loud, I know you're against me on this. Because what happens is when we make a statement, people love to correct us. Right. They love to correct us. So what they're actually thinking is when you say… No, no, no, I'm not against you. That's what they're going to do, right? Exactly. You got it. If you're saying it, they correct you. So there's a difference between this idea. I don't want you to take this the wrong way. That guarantees they're going to take it the wrong way. But if I say, you're probably going to take this the wrong way, they're going to go, no, no.

30:43So you lead with the, I know you're all against me on this. Automatically, everybody's going to go, no, we're not, in their head. And then two, you're going to lead with the goal of whatever you're asking for, of why, not their point, but where you're headed in this conversation. Like the communal goal, which is always going to be higher than the issue you're presenting. Right. So whether it's, and it needs to be more specific than alignment. It needs to be, I know we're looking at trying to build X quarter. I know we have the, we want to expand here. So you have to hit them with the common goal because now they're in.

31:16Now they're like, you're getting that first agreement with them. Yes, we all are. And three is you're giving the mission of what I feel strongly about. So when you can even prime it with, I am telling you this because I believe that I am very right on this subject or I've, in my experience, this is where we're going to go. I need to voice this. It can be as simple as that. I'm telling you this because I have to say this out loud or I do, I will not forgive myself if I leave this meeting without this unsaid. Then they're going to allow you to say it rather than take it as an attack. Yeah. That makes so much sense to me.

31:49I feel like so, you know, you can, you know, all the best plans that you might have in the world, still sometimes things can just go the wrong way, right? They can just go a little bit and they do, right? They just go a little bit left. Do you feel like you need to always bring like somebody else in to have the conversation? Do you think the disagreements are more easily settled between two people? Or there's like a real need for HR to come into some of these workplace disagreements. Depends on the topic. Yeah. There are some things where it is smarter and wiser for you to have a witness. Right.

32:21To the conversation. There's that. We're putting on your legal hat now. There you go. You need to have a witness to that conversation for somebody who's objective and can hold court on that. If you said something at the meeting, I have two choices. Maybe you said something I didn't like. I have two choices. I can spread things about you that's ugly and just breed toxicity, or I can address it with you directly. And that oftentimes gets more respect from the other person of, you could have done this with that. You could have reported it here. I'm talking to you now. And it's that concept we talked about of you need to tell them who you are.

32:56And that doesn't mean telling them your name. That means telling them who your character is, your values. And it has all to do with that direct one-on-one conversation. Yeah, I love that. I also think you go back to what you said earlier about the end result. Like, what do you want the end result? Nobody wants a problem in the workplace. You want to be able to get on with your colleagues. So it's like, what are you actually, what are you trying to optimize for here? It's not like to win the battle. It's like just to have the ease of like a good work life. And so you have to think about that from an end result.

33:25What happens if you are really, like, if something happens in the workplace that does verge on unprofessionalism, you know, if somebody insults you, if somebody is, you know, really rude or, you know, degrading to you in some way, is there like, what are the, what should you say like in that moment? Because I feel like sometimes we get in our own heads and we'll go home and be like, God, I wish I'd have like been able to say that. How do you deal with that in the moment in a way that isn't, you know, like lashing back out, right? It's not unprofessional, but by the same token, And it's like, you've crossed a line here.

33:59You want to make sure you add about five to seven seconds of silence. We're going back to the silence. This is really hard for me. All this breathing and silence. I'm such a lasher out. I don't know what to do. All this breathing. Okay, we're breathing again. Seven seconds this time. I was good. I could get on the four, but the seven is a lot for me. Yeah. Seven. Well, it depends what they say. It depends what they say. You know, something not nice. Exactly. So let's say you said something ugly to me. I would never. You would never. But let's say you did. That was truly insulting or condescending.

34:32There's a difference between me catching it and throwing it back at you harder. Because that's what you want to do. I want to say something harder. Well, then now I'm the one that has to apologize. Now I'm the one that's had the worst offense. But if I just give it five seconds of nothing, what I picture is you just let their words fall to the ground. They don't even reach you. And then now you kind of get to look at it on the ground and look at them like, is that what you wanted to say? kind of give them that's what the silence that's what the silence does and so when they realize that they didn't get that that hit of dopamine they didn't get that reaction they didn't get that response oh they it just makes them feel uncomfortable they're realizing it's not fun that's why oftentimes they'll um already apologize for it although take it back and they'll say no i'm sorry i didn't mean that because they heard it again in the silence and so long silences are like mirrors that allows them to hear their words back.

35:26I do that a lot of times in litigation with people who I know are lying under oath. If you add that silence, it just eats them. It eats them up. And they'll often get to the truth before you even have to say anything because they know you're not buying it. So one would be the silence. Silence is great. I've been really tripping myself up my whole life with this chit chat having to fill the gaps. I'm so annoyed. Silence is a whole lot more powerful because it's those it's a tool the way you're talking about it is it's literally as you know it's a mirror it's a tool it is and those the absence of words it's not the absence of communication i mean it is you're still saying so many things and what you're saying is when you look at them and the words and they're falling on the floor and we're both looking at the word i mean it's a whole thing i could i can totally visualize this whole thing and you would feel embarrassment right and i guess it's the same like if you lash out at your partner if you're that moment of silence you will feel horrendous yes because now you've you've put that word out on a plank like you've exposed it you've exposed your ugly and people don't like their ugly being exposed and so when you have that silence and then you can ask them to say it again which is the best have you done this oh yeah have you yeah do you like would you say can you say that again would you repeat yourself yeah so you ask you can yeah either one of those you can say i need you to say that again.

36:43But not like saying that. Yeah, exactly. I need you to say that again. I didn't catch that. I need you to say that again. Can you repeat that? Anything like that, it's they don't want to do it because it's not just a spotlight on their bad behavior. It's getting the double down on it. And that's a whole lot harder for people. They often will not do it. Number three, what I want you to do is ask a question of intent. This is for the people that do double down. This is for the people who really want to go that far. And you can use this in every day, even at the workplace. You say, did you mean? That's what I want you to begin with.

37:20Did you mean? Did you mean for that to embarrass me? Did you mean for that to hurt my feelings? Did you mean for that to be rude? Did you mean to belittle me? When you ask that, it's doing two things. One, particularly in text message, you say, did you mean? Like, did you mean for that to be short? Have you ever with, a significant other. And you're like, oh, I guess you're mad because you sent OK. Or K or whatever it is. And say, did you mean for that to be short? And they go, no, no, no, I'm just, I'm busy with the kids. I'm dropping off something else, giving them the grace. Number two, it's making them have to hear their words and the intent.

37:55And they have a hard time living with the intent when it's actually to hurt you. Wow. So you're going to go, the insult, it's like the insult happens. Yes. You're going to go seven seconds silent. Yeah, five to seven seconds. And then you're going to repeat it back to him. You're going to get them to double down on him. Yeah. It's almost like I'm wishing for someone to be rude to me now. Yeah. Wow. That's some powerful stuff. I'm better than reacting to it. I know. And this is, you know, I just feel like so much of this is ingrained. I've watched so many interviews with you where you are like so even keeled.

38:30You have such a beautiful way of communicating. And I feel like I'm going to blame my upbringing. but you know I just like you know I I kind of feel like I was forged in fire right I was raised to like fight fighting words like you know head on and I think that my immediate uh you know my immediate kind of reaction is to like you know do this like what the kids would call like crashing out right I'm like literally not ready to to go head first into you know this like horrible reaction can you can you train yourself can you train yourself to be more thoughtful and you know like you have so many tips, but like, how does that become ingrained in who you are and how you choose to communicate?

39:10We often think only of the moment in time and when we're talking together. We rarely think of the moment after, after you said the hurtful thing, after you said something you can't take back, when you can't unring the bell. And when you start thinking of the issue behind the issue of, yeah, okay, we can talk about this, but we have to think of a life together. We have to think about the kids that we want to raise. We have to think about the company that we want to build together. Whenever you're thinking about the issue that's behind it, it allows you to slow down. You want to be the one who leads the company and show more control.

39:48You want to do that and slow your pace. You want to do that and stop with the reactions. You want to do that and control your emotions. It's not that difficult unless you just choose to say, you know what, this is a moment that I can take and I can either choose to say something or I can choose to breathe. One of those is going to lead to better outcomes. Yeah. I feel like you're completely right about that. I mean, because I think the reason that I have so much been able to, in my older years, calm down and be more thoughtful about the way I communicate is because I didn't like the way I felt after the reaction.

40:21Right. And so it's like, you see yourself in that moment and you stop wanting that feeling of like, God, I wish I could have done better. I could have handled that situation. I didn't like myself in that moment. And that kind of distance, you know, being able to see and be like, I don't want to feel like that will really change the way you speak. It feels good in the moment. Yeah. For 20 seconds. It feels good in the moment, but then. The bad feeling lasts a lot longer. That's the problem. Yeah, you don't want to be the one left holding the consequence of your own words.

40:55I used to think I needed a full drawer of makeup and at least 20 minutes to look presentable in the morning. But then I tried Merit and now I'm done in five minutes. Merit is a minimalist beauty brand that's made to simplify your routine. It's for people who want to feel put together without spending a ton of time or energy. Their products are clean, vegan, and so easy to use. You genuinely can't mess them up, even half asleep. Lately, I've been reaching for Flush Balm every morning. It gives me the most natural-looking flush and it blends like a dream. The Minimalist is another go-to. It's part foundation, part concealer, and it evens out my skin in seconds without feeling heavy.

41:34And great skin serum? My skin just looks better and more hydrated every time I use it. Merit has made my mornings feel less rushed and more effortless, which I didn't really think was possible. oil. It's time to simplify your morning. Head to meritbeauty.com and get their signature makeup bag free with your first order. Lately, my social feeds are full of wellness hacks that are kind of questionable. Like, should I really be taking olive oil shots every morning or is red light therapy the cure for everything? I'll stick to an actual professional thank you. And with ZopDoc, it's easy. Zolt Dog is a free app and website where you can search and compare high quality in-network doctors and click to instantly book an appointment.

42:18Filter by insurance, location, speciality and ratings from verified patients and then you can see their actual appointment openings. Choose a time slot that works for you and click to instantly book a visit. Appointments usually happen within 24 to 72 hours and same day visits are often available. We use it here at Aspire and you should too. It makes taking care of your health so much simpler and so much less stressful. Stop putting off those doctor's appointments and go to zocdoc.com slash Aspire to find and instantly book a top rated doctor today. That's z-o-c-d-o-c dot com slash Aspire. zocdoc.com slash Aspire.

43:02Look, we get it. You can hardly go anywhere or do anything these days without hearing AI this or AI that. And if you're like most people, when it comes to AI, you're impressed but have a few concerns. But what if AI was used not as a tool to replace people, but as a way to help understand people better? AI from SurveyMonkey is designed to do just that. From crafting the perfect survey, which is harder than you might think, to analysis that digs deep, finds patterns and surfaces trends quickly, SurveyMonkey's powerful suite of AI capabilities makes it faster and easier than ever before to get insight from real people, helping you make confident decisions for your business.

43:43Try it today at surveymonkey.com slash Emma.

43:53What are some tips on how to communicate over email and on text? Well, in text and email, it's transactional. And that means I'm reading the nuance into it for you. And again, we love to read the negative. We never read the positive. We never get something and we go, isn't this just the kindest email? You see that they said, okay, with no emoji. How kind of them? Like we never think of that. It's like, what kind of okay was that? Because in our head, it was like, okay. Totally. You make the voice. Exactly. Yeah, you make the, you pull up to a friend, you see what they said and you're like, ah, yeah, that's so bad.

44:27It's just in our natural part of our default there. If you want to do better in emails and texts, you need to say less, Emma. Say less. Instead of this mindset of, I need to be a waterfall of information, be a well. So if they want more, they know where to get it. Make them ask a question. And if you're always just giving a flood, I mean, who reads an email that's 10 sentences long? Nobody. Not me. Not me. As soon as you do a paragraph, I'm off. Exactly. Yeah, you can almost just see, You don't even have to see the words. Totally. I just see the chunks and I'm like, oh no, call me. You see the chunk of tax and you're like, nope, absolutely not.

45:08And you have been successful for a really long time, a very successful trial attorney. How, I mean, you must have learned so much in all of that time to get to this point where you're such an expert in communication. What is it from that profession that makes you so good at this? Everybody's watching more than you think. I know there are people who say nobody cares. people still watch you they they're they're focusing on their own thing but they watch so in a trial it's not just the question i'm asking the witness it's the jurors the 12 jurors who are watching me watching how i react information not just the good stuff but the bad stuff if another attorney's asking a question you ask something that's hurtful for my case and i act like it's all terrible you know what they think i was gonna it's bad yeah they think it's gonna of hurt my case.

45:59But if I act like it's nothing, then it's smooth. It's fine. It's not just the question you ask. It's how you're asking it. So you have to make them remember it. That's why it helps to be very short and concise. I have to take a lot of information and boil it down into something very useful. Let's put this in a workplace context. You feel like you have to give a whole lot of background. So you're meeting with somebody and they go, okay. So I was thinking, and you can just totally let me know if I'm wrong about this, but for context, and they just, and everybody's like, oh my gosh, what do you need?

46:31And they're looking and they're thinking about what they're going to eat for lunch. Instead, just you need to lead with the end. What's the takeaway? I wonder how as somebody who suffers with anxiety, how this kind of experience and expertise around communication has kind of helped or hindered that. How do you feel like the anxiety kind of fits together with your communication style? Because it must have some type of impact it highlights all the more of why you need to say the feelings out loud when you keep them all in bad things happen yeah just you it's like a shaken up coke bottle you're gonna explode one way or another and when things were starting to go when my account was starting to get a lot of attention that actually became very lonely because nobody in my world could relate to what was happening totally i didn't know anybody and i was i'm from a small town in Texas.

47:25I just didn't know anybody. And there's not like a blog. There were no, there were no like viral sensations around. No, but not in a hundred miles. Knock on their door and say, how's this going to work out? I wasn't in LA where it's like, oh, you have a million followers. Like it was not that kind of thing. And so I've, I've made some amazing friends, you being one of them. Yes. And the idea of how do you communicate that made it all more important of, well, I need to just say how I'm feeling to the people who love me. And it's easy to, when they said, are you having a, first time I had a panic attack.

48:00I didn't know. I thought I was, I thought I was dying. I thought it was a heart attack. Oh yeah. Yeah. I went to the ER. I thought, I thought I was having a, because I was so convinced. I was so convinced. I don't have anxiety. There's nothing. I know how to breathe. I'll just breathe through this. Exactly. I was like, I've never been stressed out in my life. I'm not, I've never been anxious. And it turns out your body knows the difference. Your body knows the difference. Doesn't it, James? It really, really does. And so that helped me communicate that more. And so what I teach, part of that is being able to say, I can tell.

48:31I can tell I'm getting defensive. I can tell that's getting me upset. I can tell I'm becoming overwhelmed. I can tell I'm not ready for this conversation. There's a difference between acting on my defensiveness and saying like, that's not what I said. You can't say that. That's me acting on it versus I can tell I'm getting defensive. That's me putting on a table and saying, You can see that right there. We can look at it together. That's how I'm feeling. Now we can address it rather than me reacting on it. I mean, these are very, very big subjects and really amazing things. You're a father of two.

49:04I have four kids. What are you teaching your kids about communication? Because I imagine some of that is like just stuff that you can really impart on kids, which is just amazing to like give them the freedom to be able to say how they're feeling. Yeah. Something about kids is I came across this quote once and it's always stuck with me that once you have kids, you now exist as their memory. That's all you will be to them. And so it just became very crucial to me. What am I going to share with them? How do I always want to make them feel? And with my kids in particular, there are little things that I do for when they're acting out or I know my daughters told me she brushed her teeth and I know she hasn't.

49:46You know, and by the way, that silence definitely works. Yes, it does. No doubt. Yeah, I'll say, it's okay. If you haven't brushed your teeth, it's okay. And she'll go, oh, I forgot. I need to go brush them. So anyway, it's this thing with kids that I see so much of myself. Yeah. My son even looks like me. Yeah. And behaves like me. And so I can look at his little face and take it in my hands. And so many times I'm saying the exact same thing I had to say to myself. and it's a very very special moment you you become obsessed with your kids like you love their face they're your favorite thing to see yes everything about their smell you're obsessed about all of it their little everything about them there's nothing better and why think i would say i've done the best with my kids is having them being a safe space for all their feelings yes instead of telling him that toughen up or to get over it.

50:46I make sure he tells me what he feels. And he's extremely empathetic in that way. He can feel something and go, I'm feeling sad. I said, Jet, what's going on? He'll say, I can tell I'm really upset right now. That right there is huge for any kid to be able to say their feelings. I just want him to feel that forever. I never want to take any of that away. Yeah. I totally get that. One of my favorite things ever when we had the twins, at the time she was seven, she came to me and she said, Mom, I'm feeling really jelly. And I was like, you're what? And she said, I'm just really jelly of the twins.

51:23And I was like, how amazing that you felt like you could just come and say that to me. I was like, oh, let me get rid of these babies and we'll go and do something together. But I was so proud that she felt like she could just have these feelings that honestly were quite out of line. I was like, goodness me, they're three days. oh, pull it together, woman. But, you know, it's like she had a big feeling and she wanted to share that. And to me, it just was, you're in such a different headspace sometimes that having a kid that can very easily communicate with you is so important. And I think, too, of, even though everything is perfect now, I think of when they're going to be like 15, 14.

52:00Yeah. And they're going to do things. And I want to be the safe space. Yes, you do. Because you never want to, it would be crushed if they have done something they've run into trouble and they're like I can't tell dad like that would crush me if they said I can't tell mom like it would just crush you and it's like what are the things I can do now to make sure that I'm a safe space and they I ingrain that in them that I don't care what they do you can always come to tell me so it's always the thank you for telling me with this thank you for coming to me with this instead of the you did what like that strong reaction of them going okay I can't do this anymore that's very, very keen on how are you going to react in the face of bad news.

52:43Yeah. And that's what you do. You're like, thank you for telling me. Thank you for sharing. Yes. You say that. Whatever it is. Say that. Even if you're absolutely shocked by the information that they're telling you. Yeah. Yours are little, so they're probably not getting there yet. But at some point, they're going to come and tell you something where you are a little bit taken aback. But you've kind of got to receive that information in the same way as you would anything else. Exactly. If you want a 15-year-old that comes to you with stuff. Yeah. My kid, my son when he was four came walking and he had his hands over his shirt.

53:11He looked really, really sad. I was going, what's going on, bud? He said, I did something bad. I said, what have we got? And he showed me and he had a big hole in the shirt. I said, what happened? He said, I just want to see if the scissors would cut it. And I said, well, what did we learn? He goes, yep. I said, okay. I said, yes, they did. All right. okay, well, we probably shouldn't do that again. He goes, yeah, now I probably shouldn't do that. And I said, thank you for telling me. Thank you for coming to me. Like that's the, instead of the, they just spilled a little bit of milk out of the cup.

53:47Okay. Okay. No. And I feel like that's just going to pay dividends as your kid gets older. If you're their safe space, I mean, that's it. That's all we can hope for as parents. And in life. Yeah. In life. Yeah. Totally. Hands down. I feel like you've just given so many amazing, amazing tips. But if there are just three big takeaways in terms of somebody just saying, do you know what? I really want to become a better communicator. I really want to have better relationships. I want to be better at work. I want people to understand me more. What are the most important things we can do? Number one, don't see an argument as something to win.

54:23See it as something to unravel. When you start to pull your way and I start to pull mine, it just makes the knot tighter, makes it harder to undo, makes it longer for us to unravel it. And sometimes it'll take a week. Sometimes it takes years, Emma, before you actually address the knot. And when you start seeing something to unravel, like when you're very quick to apologize, really easy to loosen. Two, you go into conversations, have something to learn, not something to prove. When you can get into that conversation, they have to understand my point. They have to see how I'm right. Instead of the question, asking yourself, having something to learn of, I wonder where that's coming from.

55:03Huh. Okay. I can see that. I wonder where this is. I wonder why they reacted that way. When you're starting to get curious about what's happening. But actually acting on that curiosity in a way of asking them questions with true intent. You're going to have better relationships. And three, you control everything about your life simply by what you decide to say next. Yeah. What are your reactions? You can't be a kind person if you don't use kind words. Simple as that. It's really simple. So if you want to be seen as somebody who's kind and caring and effective, then you're going to start using words that better serve you and lose the words that don't.

55:41I think that's three really golden tips right there. We're going to write those down. Yeah, exactly. Everyone needs to write those down. So one of the things that I like to do when I have an expert like you that comes in, I get on the group chats. Okay. I have a lot of group chats. And I literally asked my girlfriends, I'm like, what would you like to know from a communication expert? So I have a couple of, if you don't mind. Okay, yeah, let's do it. And you can, you know, they're easy, quick and easy. Okay, got it, got it. As a strong-willed and really assertive person, how do you communicate with vulnerability and compassion?

56:14Vulnerability and compassion? Begin your sentence with, I'm struggling. There's nothing wrong with that because people relate to struggle. They don't relate to perfection. So if I say, look, I'm struggling. I'm struggling with my nerves in this. I'm struggling to get to the point here. You're asking for people's help and people want to be helpful. Now you can't say, I'm struggling to understand you right now. Like that, that's not going to work. But if it's true vulnerability, it's going to be, it's going to be a lot better. And people, when you can say, I can tell I'm feeling nervous about this.

56:44People would say, they lower their energy and they go, okay, it's okay. You can tell me like they will meet you there. But if you act like everything's perfect and you don't need anything from them, then they won't give you anything. You said people relate to vulnerability, not perfection. Yeah. Shit. That's a really big, we could just do our whole episode about that. Oh, this is a good one. My husband need not worry. What's your advice for breaking up with someone? I feel like it's so interesting now because I don't know that the term ghost even existed, I don't know, 10 years ago. And now people can just disappear off the face of the earth.

57:18If you had the right words, and I'm talking this could be a significant other or it could Just be a friend. But how do you just break it off with someone? It's very attractive when somebody's direct with you. When somebody can actually communicate what they need instead of bouncing around it, it's an attractive quality. If you need to break up with someone, don't begin with the high and then end on the low. Oh, so we're doing that inverse thing. You got it. Instead of that, hey, so it's just, you know, you're just so great and it's been so wonderful. They're just, they know just by that. And it's not you, it's me.

57:50Exactly. Exactly. Instead, it's the quick flip. I'm telling you this because I want to be friends with you for a very long time. I'm not seeing it the same way you are. Instead of the but, you have the and. And. Yeah. So even if it was, this has been wonderful, and I need to make sure that we're doing what's right for us. There's never a good reason to ghost is what I want to say. Yeah, exactly. There's not. It's a true insult. And it really speaks to a lack of character in my way. What are your tips to get somebody to listen? Like when you're doing everything right and you know, how do you actually get somebody to hear what you're saying?

58:29Well, let's say if they're talking, okay. I use their name, use their name. Like Jefferson. It's like, yeah, we're just animals. It's just, they hear your name. It's like how I say my kids' full names, It's Lake Holiday London. You know, listen to me. Same thing. Yeah. So if let's say you're in a meeting and somebody keeps kind of dominating the conversation and you say, Emma, I mean, they'll talk or if you say it again, people love their name. It gets them to kind of stop and listen and pay attention because there's nothing better than the sound of their name. So I have a few rapid fire questions that we ask everyone who comes on.

59:06First question is, what do you do when you wake up in the morning? oh um i'm usually being woken up by my daughter my daughter is yeah she's using my alarm clock the four-year-old yeah yes uh she's five now oh it goes so quick yeah and she's uh five and she is a big snuggler on the bed so she that's her my alarm clock so usually usually it's the smell of her hair oh heaven yeah heaven heaven and what do you do before you go to bed at night We do song and prayer. Kids, I will typically do a puzzle or I read a book. That's like my - That's your wind down. That's my, and I have tea. You do? I do.

59:47I love a cup of tea. Any particular tea? Yeah, it's like a cayman meal type of - Heaven. It's really, really nice. Very good. Very good non-electronic habits you've got there. Yeah. A puzzle, a book, and a cup of tea. I really try to. And I just try not to get on my phone as much as I - I mean, it's a total no-brainer. And what are you currently aspiring for in your business life? Oh, that's a good question. Find where I can do the most good. Oh, that's lovely. How can I help the most people? How can I change legacies of families of how they're going to communicate and build relationships in the world?

1:00:20Like I truly, truly believe a better world begins with a better conversation. I really do. I couldn't agree with you more. And the good news is you're actually doing it. So you can be really proud of yourself. Yeah. What are you aspiring for in your personal life? To be more fully present. I try to make every baseball game, every practice, every jujitsu, every, I mean, even the little huddles that I have with my wife before. We're going, you know, we're just in the chaos. You're in it. Yes. Little kids. Yeah. Yeah. Where we're going to go. And she's a practicing attorney and I have my practice and this, whatever this is.

1:00:57And so it's making sure that I iron it out. There's nothing wrong with just continuing to iron things out. Yeah. Constantly. Always evolving. Always, yeah. Always. What is a book that changed your life? Oh, a book that changed my life. There's a book that still gets me, and it's a children's book. It's The Giving Tree. Oh. I can't read it without boohooing. I really can't. I can really see you at bedtime. Oh, my gosh. It's a great one. It's a very, very good one. I remember my parents reading it to me and I didn't understand it. And then I remember seeing it on the shelf, whatever, at different people's houses.

1:01:35And then when I had my own kids, it was just such a mind opener of, no, this is my purpose. You just continually give. You want a branch? Take it. You want the tree? Take it. Like just give and give and give. Oh, that's such a good one. I'm so glad you're reading it to your kids. Yeah. What is something that you valued when you were starting out that you don't anymore? Something I've valued that I don't anymore. I valued knowing a lot of people. Having a whole lot of friends. That was something that I valued a whole lot. How many people can I know and like? And then now, I just want my circle so small.

1:02:17It's probably biblical too. You cannot please everybody and everybody will try and want something from you. And you just want the four people that they could care less who you are. Totally. And that they're pleased for you. Oh, exactly right. Because when you got that two or that four, they're like the ones that are like, yes, they're so happy for you. Yeah. And that's hard. That's really hard to find. It's really hard to find. All right. So on the flip side, what's something that you value now that you didn't back then? My quiet time. I don't think I took enough time for myself. I just, I ran, I ran, I ran.

1:02:50I mean, you get that. How many miles? I mean, you just run out and over the place. I know. What did we even do with our time before we had kids? That's so true. I had so much quiet time. So true. We thought we had, we thought we didn't have time then. I'm stealing your answer. Yeah. You didn't think we had time then. It was, yeah, the time that I really spent for myself of just having a quiet cup of coffee is really a treasure to have that. And I didn't really value as much writing things down. Yeah. When I write things down, it's almost therapeutic in a way. I'm not texting it. I'm writing it.

1:03:24There is something about it coming from your body onto the page. I'm a furious journaler, and it's actually so wonderful to go back and look at those things. I sometimes write down, like when my kids say something really silly and random that tickles me, I write that down, and it's the best keepsake that you could have because you're like, wow, did they say that? Because they grow up so quickly and you need those records. It's like the best. And I did, I think here until most recently with the book and everything, I would try to write a letter to somebody that I haven't thought of in a while and just send a letter that I was thinking about them.

1:04:04And that made me feel a thousand times better than if, I mean, a text is great. There's nothing like a text or a call from somebody who just said, I'm just thinking about you. It just feels good. But for me, it was something about writing it and putting it in an envelope and putting a stamp on it and sending it. It just feels like, all right, I have something important in the world. Totally. And how good does that person feel when they get the letter? Someone needs to write me a letter. Yeah, I'll get your address. Write me a letter. I'll get your address. I'm waiting. This was so heavenly. I love, love speaking to you.

1:04:38Thank you so much for coming. Thank you for having me. Such a pleasure. If you're loving this podcast, be sure to click follow on your favorite listening platform. While you're there, give us a review and a five-star rating and share an episode you loved with a friend. We'll be so grateful. A Spy with Emma Greed is presented by Odyssey. I'm your host, Emma Greed. Our executive producers are Corrine Gilead-Fisher, Derek Brown, and me. Our executive producers from Odyssey are Maddie Sprung-Kaiser, Leah Reece-Dennis, Asha Saluja, and Jenna Weiss-Berman. Justine Dom is our senior producer. Our producer is kristin torres sound design and engineering by bill shultz angela peluso is our booker original music by charles black video production by evan cox kurt courtney andrew steel carlos delgado and arnie agassi social media by olivia homan special thanks go to britney smith sydney ford my teams at jonesworks and wne maura curran josephina francis hillary schuff eric donnelly Kate Hutchinson-Rose, Tim Meikle, Sean Cherry, and Lauren Vieira.

1:05:46If you have questions for me, you can DM me at Aspire with Emma Greed. Greed is spelled G-R-E-D-E. That's Aspire, A-S-P-I-R-E, with Emma Greed. Or you can submit a question to me on my website, emmagreed.me. In football, value isn't just about making flashy plays. It's about consistency, durability, showing up. Week after week, season after season. That's Toyota, the brand built for the long game. Award-winning quality, legendary reliability, and a lineup of vehicles that hold their value against the toughest competition. Every play, every drive. It's no wonder Toyota was named the best resale value brand for 2025, according to Kelly Blue Book's KBB.com, for the fifth year in a row.

1:06:37and why Toyota's proud to be the official automotive partner of the NFL. Because like every great team, Toyotas are built to go the distance. For great deals and reliable vehicles you can count on, visit buyatoyota.com. That's buyatoyota.com. Vehicle's projected resale value is specific to the 2025 model year. For more information, visit kellybluebookskbb.com. Toyota, let's go places.