How to Scale While Keeping Your Brand Intact (Kelly Wearstler)

15:58Kelly Wearstler:I was like, oh my God, I have to be here. And then I went back and like packed my shit up. and then I moved to LA.

16:06Emma Grede:That's unbelievable. That's unbelievable. So take me back to the moment where you decided to strike out on your own, because again, this business that you've created, like I always talk about you as having like this one of one career. You've got all of these verticals. They're all so kind of like inextricably like you, like they feel like it's like such a, you're the person that created these things. You've created this business in your own likeness, but I guess it didn't start that way. So I'd love for you to take me back to the beginning and tell me what it was like as you decided to go out on your own.

16:40Kelly Wearstler:Well, it came, it kind of happened unexpectedly because I, so I came to LA and I was like, okay, I got to find a place to live. And I had no money because I also had credit card debt because I was like working for free and it was just, you know, the whole thing moving out. And so I got a job working at a restaurant in West Hollywood. It was like a lot of people from the film business came to this restaurant. And I became friendly with this couple and we would talk design and go to museums. And I would tell them I was going to flea market and, and they were like, Hey, why don't like, do you want to help us with our house?

17:14Kelly Wearstler:We just got a house in Venice in the canals and we, you know, we'll give you like the living room and like you work on that. And, uh, like there was no budget. So I'm like, yes, like I'm going to do this. And I was doing everything. Like I was painting. I was going to the paint store in the morning, finding the painter, painting, going to the flea market with a flashlight in the morning. At like five in the morning, we find all the like good stuff and like, like having a cart, putting things in my car. Like I was doing everything because I wanted this project so bad to, to just be amazing.

17:48Emma Grede:Did you think about it as like a formative project or were you just doing your mates a favor? Like, was there a point in your mind where you're like, oh, this is going to be like a, some kind of showroom for me or like, you know, no, I wasn't.

17:59Kelly Wearstler:I was just doing what I felt in my heart. Like I wanted to make the clients happy. It was kind of like the perfect storm. So I did the one room and then I ended up doing the entire house and then, you know, they had friends over, uh, and, uh, I ended up getting other projects. And so I was like, like, shit, I have my, my own business. But I was still working out of my apartment. I was doing, I was still waiting tables like because you're nervous. It's like, what is the next job I'm going to get? Like I didn't know. And so then I started getting a couple of calls and then I was like, this is amazing.

18:34Kelly Wearstler:And I ended up hiring an assistant who actually worked at a vintage store that was like so great. And he was helping me in my apartment.

18:41Emma Grede:So this really was born out of a passion and you just like throwing yourself in and then word of mouth. Yes. That was it. That was There was no Instagram.

18:52Kelly Wearstler:There was no advertising.

18:53Emma Grede:So there's no way of publicizing your work. It was like, if you got invited to that couple's house and was like, oh, this is like a lovely living room or a lovely home, they would say, oh, Kelly did this. Was it a scary decision? Because again, I speak to so many young founders. And I think that people that are sitting here listening to this at home that are dreaming of like jumping into something that they really love. But it's not quite like the thing that they dream about. it's not quite matching their, you know, day job, if you like. Was there trepidation from you, like giving up waiting tables or like, where were you?

19:26Emma Grede:Yeah, oh my God, I would have nightmares.

19:27Kelly Wearstler:I'm like, oh my God, I still have dreams. I'm not joking that I had to go back to waiting tables. Like, is that crazy? I still have dreams like that. I'm sure you'd be really good at it. You're

19:37Emma Grede:a great host. There you go. You've always got that to fall back on. Yeah, I do. Exactly. You've always got that to fall back on. All right. So you start, and I want to fast forward a bit because I feel like I want to dig into the business that you run today. But how did you go from you and this assistant that came from the vintage shop to having like a 60 people studio now?

19:58Kelly Wearstler:So when I finished my apartment and it looked amazing, I'm like, I'm going to get a photographer and we're going to shoot it. And then I'm going to submit it to a magazine because that was like how the people operated there to like have their work in a magazine. And so I did and I got a call. I remember from El Decor. I was like, oh my God, I was so excited. And they published it and it was the up and coming new like designers. And then I also started working with this developer who's now my husband on, like he was buying all of these like historic apartment buildings in LA, like really cool ones.

20:38Kelly Wearstler:And I met him through a friend and he was like, hey, can you help me with like designing the lobbies and the corridors and like some of the common areas?

20:45Emma Grede:And did you immediately go like, yeah, I can design a corridor or a lobby area? Yeah, I always would say yes, obviously. No fear. There's nothing in you that feels fear, imposter syndrome, like anything that would stop you from just going for it.

21:00Kelly Wearstler:No, because I take risks. That's what I'm about. And that's how I grow. I continue to do things that are tough and I'm scared, but you just do them.

21:09Emma Grede:Where does that come from, Kelly? Where does the ability to just take a risk?

21:13Kelly Wearstler:Because I want to become better. I always want to be better. I always want to one-up myself, right? I always want to just get better. And I'm curious and I'm determined. I'm ambitious. I love what I do. Like absolutely live and breathe what I do.

21:30Emma Grede:It's just, it's amazing. I mean, it's amazing to me because you would have been such a young woman at that time. And I'm guessing that the competition, like here in LA, there would have been so many options and fabulous people that were doing like big celebrity projects. And you're just like, and it was scary.

21:46Kelly Wearstler:I asked a lot of questions. Like I can remember my first big project was at Brentwood. It was actually a new construction and they, you know, the contractor, there was like budgets, there was timelines that it was like very structured. And like, there was a lot of things I didn't know. And so I asked, I remember the contractor was like amazing. And I just, I wasn't afraid to ask questions and not, not let people know. I didn't exactly know the answer or how to operate. And I just watched a lot. I spent so much time at all of these, all of our sites. And I really watched like the plumbers and the electricians and, and, you know, everyone pouring the foundation and really understanding like construction and design because I didn't come.

22:32Kelly Wearstler:I wasn't working at a studio. I wasn't working in an architectural office before. So a lot of it, you know, you like learn. You had to learn on the job. Yeah. On the job.

22:40Emma Grede:Do you think that that still happens to you now? Because obviously you have a lot of different parts of your business. Do you still start a new thing or go into a new category and feel like you can ask a lot of questions or do you feel like you need to have all the answers at this point?

22:54Kelly Wearstler:No, I still ask questions. I mean, cause we still get presented with challenging projects and we work on like really large projects and some of them are historic renovations. And there's just a lot of questions. You're always presented with something new.

23:08Emma Grede:Yeah.

23:09Kelly Wearstler:When I was working on the residential projects and then I had this opportunity to work on a hotel. It was my first hotel project. And I got an office on La Brea, a very small office. I had like two people and the developer, who's now my husband, he now had investors to buy a hotel. So there was a hotel, the Avalon Hotel in Beverly Hills. And we had a platonic relationship at that point. He liked me. I had a boyfriend. Yeah, for sure. He would tell my friends. It was sweet.

23:38Emma Grede:You're like, oh, okay, that's sweet.

23:40Kelly Wearstler:I was like, I have to do this hotel. Like, I really want to do it. It's like this cool 1950s, like boomerang-shaped building. Like Marilyn Monroe lived there. It had all this history. And so he's like, I don't know. I have investors. And I was like, well, let's like just see what you can do. I really want to do it. So he went back and they said, well, if Kelly does the model room, every hotel you do, you have to do a model room and outfit it. Like we actually, you sleep there. You want to make sure everything is perfect before you like, you know, do 200 rooms or something.

24:11Emma Grede:Yeah.

24:12Kelly Wearstler:So I did the model room. I actually moved from my office on La Brea with my team of only like three people. We actually took a room at the Avalon and we like just lived and breathed it because it was a new beast. It's a completely different animal, like just where all the vendors, where things are made, fabricated, like it's just a very more complex business designing a hotel. And so I did the model room and that was the deal. You have to do the model room if we love it. And then you find an architect who's actually done a hotel before. And I did that, found amazing architect. They helped and it was a huge success.

24:47Kelly Wearstler:So this is like my big moment where I, you know, it was a very sexy project. And I got a lot of like global press and I got another hotel after that, Maison 140, this hotel in Beverly Hills and like things were getting like... That's like the beginning of the beginning. The beginning of the beginning.

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26:17Emma Grede:Is there like something, a lesson or something that you learned from those early days, just as your kind of reputation was being formed, that informs how you run your studio today, I wonder?

26:29Kelly Wearstler:I mean, I do. It's the same. Like I'm present. I'm there. There's like structure. I'm, you know, organized and I still like let curiosity leave me. And, you know, I'm so open to like many possibilities. And, you know, when, after we finished those hotels, I got a call from a big publisher in New York and she was like, I've seen your projects. I've been watching you and I want to do a book. And so I did, I did a book. I never thought in a million years. And it's so funny. like I look at it, it's called Modern Glamour and it looks like Instagram. Like it has photos of me shopping. It has like quotes on like pages.

27:10Kelly Wearstler:And it was like, it was a, it was a bestselling book. It was like really exciting.

27:14Emma Grede:That's crazy. So how are you thinking at that point, right? You've done a beautiful and very like revered hotel project. You've got your next big project that's coming down the pipe. You're asked to do a book. How are you thinking about structuring your business at that point, because I feel like you're kind of like, obviously in this moment where, you know, like the spotlight's on you, there's a lot of different ways that that can go. And obviously you've taken it so far as to like build this business. But like, I also think like when you have a business that's rooted in design, fashion, like they go in style and they go out of style.

27:47Emma Grede:And yet you've got this incredible thing that feels that it's like got a lot of longevity. So did you have a thought about, I'm building this type of business that's going to get me to hear? Like, I just, I'm curious about the thinking and how the whole thing kind of gets shaped up and comes together.

28:03Kelly Wearstler:Like I had no playbook, like honestly nothing. And I wasn't, like, I honestly never dreamed I'd be working on the stuff that I'm working on now. Really? No, never. And it's like, I just, like I always say, like, you're just like surfing the wave and you're just like getting on the opportunity that feels good. Like that's so important. Like things that feel authentic and things that really feel like meaningful to me and that there'll be an end result. I mean, granted, when I started, it was like I was taking any job. You know, I just make sure like that the projects we're taking, you know, our partners, but there really wasn't.

28:41Kelly Wearstler:I just was like slow and steady. And it's still that way. I mean, this is like, I've had, you know, an amazing, you know, career and it's just like, it's a hard work. It's like being there. I'm literally at my studio every day. You are? Yes. And I'm in, like, I don't have a separate office. It's an open air studio. And we have, like, these big work tables in the middle of the studio. And it's constant cross-pollination. I'm, like, talking to, you know, the furniture department. I'm talking to the marketing department, the sales, the finance, the architects. It's just constant, like, chess game.

29:17Kelly Wearstler:Like, really.

29:18Emma Grede:I'm curious about what type of leader you are. because it does feel like you're very like hands on. And I wonder what like decision making looks like for you. Like how have you figured out like what type of leader you want to be within your studio?

29:32Kelly Wearstler:It's still like a work in progress. Like I show and I set an example through passion, through hard work, dedication, also like working well with my team, like collaborating and being open to new ideas. and like all of that is, you know, just like a big part of what I do. And I'm always like, I'm constantly learning how to lead better. Like I don't like confrontation. Like I had a long time of like, this person is not performing. Like I have to talk to them. Like I had butterflies in my stomach. I hated it. Really you do? Like I just never liked it. Like I just don't like telling somebody they're not performing.

30:15Kelly Wearstler:So what do you do in that case? Like, I mean, sometimes you just like, you just let it go and it turns, like it's just, it turns sour. Like you can't, you have to, like this book, this Radical Candor, which has been like an amazing book. I've gotten better for sure, but I still have to continue like to work on that.

30:35Emma Grede:No, and first of all, I love that you say that because I think it's a very female trait actually, that in specifically in leadership, but it's one that I think so many people have, right? They don't want to be seen as someone that is like mean or bitchy or not saying like, you know, like, you know, just not being kind, not being empathetic. I mean, I don't have a problem with that. I always feel like I'm totally fine telling you what you don't want to hear, but it isn't something that comes naturally to a lot of people. But obviously to be as successful as you are, you've had to figure that out.

31:11Emma Grede:Like you've got no choice. otherwise you'd have an office full of people that aren't doing what you need them to do.

31:16Kelly Wearstler:Yeah. And now you're like, just over the years, like you learn like certain things to look for when hiring people and like the questions asked. And I hold myself to like such a high standard that I want like the team that I surround myself every day to be as hardworking, as passionate, as excited. Like we're working on fun stuff, like amazing projects. Dream projects. Like we should just be like, you know, like I feel so blessed that I have these like great projects I'm working on. And I put in the time, I put in the effort and the creativity. And, you know, you want to surround yourself with those people.

31:53Emma Grede:Totally. What are the qualities that you look for in team members or team leaders that come and work with you?

32:00Kelly Wearstler:Somebody that like really is passionate. Like that's the first thing I look for. and somebody obviously that has great taste level and they're good at their skillset. So if they're a furniture designer or they're an architect, you know, or like, you know, our salesperson, like have, they are like the top, you know, really like passionate about what they do. And I want somebody that wants to be there. Like, I don't, it's like, you know, people like, I want to work remote. I want to like, no, like we're here. I'm here every day. And I want everyone to work together. I want everyone to sit around a table because that is where amazing ideas happen.

32:39Kelly Wearstler:That is where like the shared passion and the unexpected unique qualities of a project appear. Can it work remotely in your business? So I always was about, if you want a job at the studio, you have to be there. It's very difficult to find great talent, top performers, talented people, people that want to work hard. There's many different skill sets there. And so I started looking at, we just hired somebody, an architect from Paris. He's going back and forth where ours also are bringing in some other outside team, but they actually are all very like senior. Senior.

33:24Emma Grede:Yeah, I think there's a difference actually. And I think there's such a benefit of early in your career having that proximity because A, you need visibility for, with your boss, right? It's like, you need to be in the room and you need to be seen so that you can be promoted, but there is just no, I don't know. There's just no replacing proximity, like, especially in the creative businesses where like, I need to be around you. I need to hear what's like informing your decisions. And I just need to like, watch how you move. Like I, there's just nothing, especially in the early part of your career, there's nothing that can replace that kind of proximity.

33:58Kelly Wearstler:No. And as like, as, you know, the kind of the creative leadership, like I want to have everyone there. So we're all learning from each other. Like I love continuing to learn from, you know, the junior designer in my studio to a director and, you know, everyone has something to offer. So, so now I'm like, we're bringing in people from like other parts of the world working remotely, but they still will come and they'll like stay a month with us, they'll go back. So it's like kind of back and forth.

34:29Emma Grede:Back and forth a little bit. I'm curious to talk to you about money and how your relationship with money might have changed like from when you started to now.

34:38Kelly Wearstler:You know, I always like invested in myself. I had no money. I had to work hard for everything I had. And I love that. It's given me so much opportunity. I love to spend. I'm not a saver. And I leverage like my credit cards to build like my business and get me where I am now. And I don't want to get in debt again. That was not fun. And I got a financial advisor that helped me just, I mean, I, who knows you could have 10 credit cards. My God. Totally.

35:13Emma Grede:And it sounds like you knew, did you get yourself into a tricky situation? Yeah. But it was so liberating when I was able to like pay that off. It's very usual because I think that like the options for capital are really, you know, reduced when you're a woman, especially when you're a woman in a creative business, it isn't so easy to go out and raise or to get people to understand what you would have done. So you probably just had to do what you could do to get the money to, you know, do a very expensive business. Yeah.

35:42Kelly Wearstler:Now I would say like, I, I reinvested, I reinvested in team, like hiring like the best team. And like over the years, like you can't hire like these like director level people. And so it, you know, it takes a long time to build a business when you have team that isn't maybe as like skilled as you'd want them to be. But now I like, I invest in my team. I invest in hierarchy, like having like the right hierarchy in every department is so important because I don't have to be in the weeds. I don't, there are, you know, we obviously have bottleneck. It happens at a studio, but having directors now really helps.

36:18Kelly Wearstler:I always tell everyone I'm always available. You can text me anytime, call me on the weekend. Like I'm available always come grab me. I'm at the studio all day so that, you know, you can interrupt me. I'm totally fine with that. And, um, and so really investing in the team and in technology, investing in that as well.

36:40Emma Grede:I've read a little bit about this. You'd spoken a lot about, I want to make sure we cover, I'm going to get back to money. Don't worry, because you know, I love that. But I did read a lot about what you're doing in AI because you're really like, I think I must've read about it on Substack or something like that, but you've really embraced AI in your studio.

36:57Kelly Wearstler:Yes. And, and, you know, we were early adopters. Like I was so interested in it. It was like, like during the NFT when all that was happening. Oh, really? That early? I went to chat like, yeah, like four years ago, like super early. And I remember learning and reading about AI and just starting to listen to every podcast, like educating myself. And I still do. I listen to podcasts on it all the time.

37:19Emma Grede:Is that what you mean when you say you invested in yourself? Like you invest in your own learning and understanding.

37:25Kelly Wearstler:And then we're investing in team to help us implement AI and strategies in the studio. So when I first used AI, it was probably like three and a half years ago in the studio. And I started it in a very like kind of like small department and really started working with a team who was really interested in it. And now we use it. It's like company-wide. Every department is creating the most incredible efficiencies. It enables us to be more creative because we have more time. And it is a new creative spirit on our team always.

37:58Emma Grede:Did you have any pushback from your staff who feel like, wait a minute, I came here to do a different type of job. This is replacing me. I won't be needed at this place anymore. What does that look like?

38:09Kelly Wearstler:No, I think people are open, especially in the creative realm. We use so many different tools and it is so, like, it's like so exciting. Like I would say I'm like a tech enthusiast and now there's like OpenClaw. Do you know OpenClaw? I know a little bit about it, not much. How are you guys using it? Well, we're just starting. We're actually investing in a team member that's going to help us. But OpenClaw is like this new platform or it's this new tool that basically will be an agent. It will operate for you. It will work all night. It's like having an assistant. There's some security ramifications right now.

38:48Kelly Wearstler:It's so new. It's only like two weeks new. So what would you use it for? Like to create a new project or how does it work? Like we're looking at it to... to like we, but the use cases that we're doing now is, okay, we're looking for art for a project and we want the, because this is a big, big time consuming effort is like curation. Absolutely. Curating, like we curate globally for our projects, but it takes a lot of time. Oh my goodness. You can use it for something like this. Yes, yes, yes. So we're, so with the use cases that I have right now are abstract art and, you know, we want like, you know, pastel colors and we want it about like 48 inches by 48 inches and then like fill a folder, scour the globe.

39:35Kelly Wearstler:But this is, this is also the price and these are maybe the galleries and then it will work like 24 hours a day.

39:41Emma Grede:That's insane. Cause you could pay somebody to do that for weeks or a month to find you the right pieces. That's how long it takes.

39:48Kelly Wearstler:So, so we have some other use cases that we're doing right now. And, um, so this is like such a game changer. Like I'm, and I'm so excited. I'm so fired up for this.

39:58Emma Grede:Is there any part of it that worries you or scares you for the future of your business? Because I understand, you know, certainly for us, we, you know, have really embraced AI, but I think by the same token, there's an awareness that so many more people in the business become redundant and yet we keep them in the business because there's nowhere else, like where else are people going to go? But is there any kind of worry for you that some of the kind of human and the tactile element of things that you do gets lost or?

40:28Kelly Wearstler:No, because everyone at the end of the day, everyone wants something that's comfortable and how's technology? Somebody, everyone wants something that is emotional and has the hand, the craft, how, how a chair is fabricated, how it's assembled. And it's like so much of it is in the execution. Like you can have a great idea on paper and come up with the most amazing design and, you know, with AI, but it's all in the execution. Like what is the assembly? What is the material? What is the hand? And that's never going to replace. Yeah. AI will, you know, pack boxes and things like that. But is it really going to create like this, like emotional response, this like experience that leaves like, you know, a lasting memory, like what a human can do?

41:15And do you think, no, no, no, can't replace you.

41:20Emma Grede:Although I haven't had the massage by the robot. My trainer had a massage by a robot the other day. And he said, no, I'm going back to it. I'm going back to Cecile, our lady. I was like, I could have told you that, bro. That's crazy. I just couldn't deal with the malfunction thing. I'll test anything in the business, but not on my body. No, thank you. Although I kind of liked the idea of that manicure thing. If you've seen the little robot manicure, it's already AI, but it's a robot manicure. I was like, well, that would save us a lot. I know, for sure. I thought that would be really handy. All right, let me take you just back to this money question because again, you're in such a creative business.

41:56Emma Grede:Is there ever a time when you think, I have to take this project because the money would just be too goddamn good not to?

42:04Kelly Wearstler:No, because I feel like financially secure and now I want to work on projects that I'm so passionate about and that I'm going to learn from. We have the opportunity to work on this like really small, tiny little hole in the wall restaurant by very passionate chef. And there's no budget, but it's like, I'm going to do it. Like working in Mexico City, working with a creative partner that's so passionate, like things like that I love. And then I'm going to learn from. I'm working in like, you know, an interesting culture. And so it's so exciting.

42:40Emma Grede:But there's no part of you that has to balance that and say, oh my God, like I really need this massive hotel thing to come forward. so I can do that little thing in Mexico City.

42:48Kelly Wearstler:Yeah, I mean, there is a balance. Like part of our licensing business helps to afford us to make smart decisions. Like we're, you know, our licensing business is like about 200 million a year. It's unbelievable. And in retail. And we do very well in our interiors and architecture. And we do creative direction and brand partnerships for, you know, many different brands, Airbnb, Chase, Lancome, like all these, which are also like really fun. So there's many different arms of the business that are exciting. And I love all the opportunities.

43:23Emma Grede:How much do you care about the money piece of it? Was there ever a part of you that's like, I want to build like a billion dollar something. Like, does that ever come into play in the way that you think?

43:33Kelly Wearstler:Yes, I still, like I'm actually working on fragrance. You are? Is that your billion dollar baby?

43:41Emma Grede:I want to smell like you. When I look at you, I'm like, I want to smell like that. Definitely.

43:47Kelly Wearstler:That's it. That's the one. Yeah, I'm so excited. So we're working on that now. That's a whole different name. And like, I've dreamed of doing this for so long, but you have to do things in sequence. Like sequence is such an important word. Like, you know, I could have done it, you know, 10 years ago, 20 years ago. I, you know, have now so much more knowledge on so many different aspects of launching like a new business. I did fashion. Oh my God, I did fashion at one point. It was a disaster. It was like so stressful in my life. It was a very like kind of wrong road to go down, but you learn. And I, I just feel like it's like the right time.

44:28Emma Grede:I so appreciate you saying that because I really believe in this idea of chapters and having like, you don't always get your opportunities at the time that they'll necessarily work, but sometimes you just got to shoot your shot and like do them anyway. But there is this kind of preconceived idea, especially for women in business, that if you mess something up, that it kind of messes everything up. Like you get your one chance. And if you don't get it all perfectly right, then, you know, it all kind of goes up in a poof of smoke. When the reality is, we know for so many men, they make huge mistakes and lose lots of money and have a lot of failure.

45:02Emma Grede:And they just kind of like dust themselves off and go to the next thing. So I appreciate you saying that you've made mistakes and there were things in your business that didn't work out. What did you learn from that situation with the failure of fashion?

45:16Kelly Wearstler:Just that, you know when it's time to wrap it up. And I so remember a friend of ours who had a fashion business and very successful sold it. I can remember being with my husband, Brad. We were Earth Cafe. I so remember. And he came in, he was like, you guys just have to stop. And I just knew. I was like, and I've been thinking about it. And so we just did it. And it was not fun because we had to let people go who I really loved and they worked hard. We all worked really hard. And so it was just tough, but it was humbling. It was like one thing that you have to be able to, going back to what my mom said, like you have to be able to rely on yourself in any circumstance.

45:57Kelly Wearstler:And now like I can be presented with anything that fits under my umbrella. I'm confident that anytime anyone can leave, like I can figure it out.

46:11Emma Grede:This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. International Women's Day is this month, and it's an opportunity to celebrate and recognize the women in our lives and everything that they carry. The visible responsibilities are one thing, but the emotional load is another. Between work, relationships, families and expectations, a lot gets managed quietly and often without much space to process it. Celebrating strength matters, but so does support. And therapy can be a place to set boundaries, sort through pressure and create more balance. Not because something is wrong, but because carrying a lot deserves care.

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47:27Emma Grede:That's B-E-T-T-E-R-H-E-L-P dot com slash aspire. spring is less about starting over and more about adjusting the dial refinement not reinvention should be the goal by march you've already lived a little in the year you know what you're reaching for you know what you're tired of and that's usually when i start thinking about what needs to shift not everything just enough to feel current if you're in that mindset macy's is pulling together a strong mix of brands shaping the season right now it's less about one trend are more about a range. Structured pieces, softer silhouettes, elevated staples, directional denim, all in one place.

48:09Emma Grede:Now, denim is obviously foundational and Good American continues to lead in fits that are strong and super wearable. Wide leg cuts, updated proportions and denim that actually holds its shape. Those are the kind of pieces that do the heavy lifting in your wardrobe. You change the jeans, you change the outfit. It's simple, but it works every time. Now, Now, beyond denim, what I'm noticing this season is balance, relaxed tailoring that doesn't feel oversized, dresses that feel fluid but still intentional, and layers that feel light enough to move with you instead of weighing you down. Spring is also where proportion becomes important, swapping out heavier winter layers for pieces that create shape again, a little lighter jacket instead of a coat, a soft knit instead of a big thick sweater, even subtle changes that lift how you carry yourself.

48:58Emma Grede:And what Macy's does well is centralize all of it. Instead of bouncing between multiple sites or hunting down brands individually, you can see how the season is evolving in one place. Establish names next to newer discoveries, classic staples next to pieces that feel slightly more directional. That's helpful because spring isn't about replacing your closet. It's about editing it with intention. Maybe it's one new denim silhouette. Maybe it's introducing a softer a color palette. Maybe it's finding pieces that move more easily between work and the weekend without feeling like two different wardrobes.

49:31Emma Grede:Fashion doesn't have to be dramatic to be effective. Sometimes the most powerful update is subtle and strategic. Find the standout brands that define this season's style, both familiar favorites and some hidden gems at Macy's. Shop now at macy's.com or in-store.

49:55Emma Grede:I wonder if you have any advice for like young creatives about how they can both protect their ideas, but also like take feedback in because it's such an important thing when you're coming up that you hear feedback and that you use it in a useful way, but it can sometimes be really hard to hear it. How have you dealt with that?

50:15Kelly Wearstler:I think you just have to be open and be a good listener and just run everything through your filter. And like during the time when I was starting out and it was like, this is trending. Like this is what you should be doing. And yeah, I can like do that and follow the herd, but how are you going to stand out? Like you're not like you have to follow like what is in your heart and what like you believe in as a young designer. I think it's important to obviously know what's going on. Like I know what's going on in pop culture. I know what's going on, what's trending. You just have to like kind of take that, but also you have to have your own voice.

50:54Kelly Wearstler:Like that's so important or you're just going to be part of the

50:58Emma Grede:crowd. Your mother, obviously, which I love because, you know, you've got these wonderful kids and I wanted to ask you about having children and what part of, I always think that they, my kids somehow did something to me as it relates to my ambition. And I wonder if you had any, like, you know, did your ambition sharpen? Did it soften? Like what happened to you as a businesswoman when you had kids?

51:25Kelly Wearstler:Well, growing up, like I wanted to just like be something, love what I do, be my own boss. Like that's what I wanted to do. And so I never felt like kids were in the equation. Like I really, I wanted to grow up like really want intro.

51:43Emma Grede:No,

51:43Kelly Wearstler:No, no. And I knew like that I wanted to just, I was just ambitious and I just didn't think that you could do both. And I, um, you know, met my husband and it was really important to him. And I was curious about it. Like, I'm, I'm just a curious person. And I was like, well, do I see myself with kids? Like maybe. And it was, I love my husband and it was like important to him. So I'm like, okay, let's, we'll have one. And I got pregnant unexpectedly because I probably would have been pushing it, continuing to push it. We were engaged and I had Oliver, my first son, and like everything changed. It was like the most magical, beautiful, like how you can love something so much.

52:34Kelly Wearstler:And I'm so vulnerable with them. And, and it's like the best thing. I have Oliver and Elliot, who are 21 and 22. And I have Crosby, who's three. Love the gap. The gap's amazing. What was going on there, babe?

52:47Emma Grede:Same husband. Love it, love that. Just a bit of a gap.

52:52Kelly Wearstler:You were busy, I'm imagining. It is the best thing in the world. And so having my family, you know, and my husband, I take them on my journey with me. I take them everywhere. I go to museums. Like, trust me, they were like, I don't want to go. And I'm like, no, like, like, and it brought me back to my mom. I was educating my eye, even though like, you know, you don't know what's going on. You're still educating your eye. No, you're taking it in.

53:18Emma Grede:You're taking it in.

53:19Kelly Wearstler:We travel together as a family. I include them in like everything I do, having my family involved. And it helps that my husband and I, we have separate businesses, but like we help each other. So there's like a great kind of family interest in like everything we do.

53:38Emma Grede:So there's two entrepreneurs in your house.

53:40Kelly Wearstler:Yes.

53:40Emma Grede:That's amazing. Yeah. So as your business is accelerating. And you work with your husband too. I listen to your podcast. Yeah.

53:47Kelly Wearstler:Very similar story actually. I know. And I was really like, he's great. Like you guys like great energy and it's fun,

53:54Emma Grede:but it's definitely challenging. It's fun and it's challenging. And we had a similar situation that having kids was very, very important to me and to him, I should say. And I was like, oh, okay. Like, you know, I've got to just kick the can down the road. And then I had a kid and I was like, oh my God, it's the best thing that's ever happened to me. But it's interesting. I wanted to ask you, as your career was accelerating, like what parts of motherhood were like the most challenging for you?

54:24Kelly Wearstler:Was probably during that time, I would say when my business is really growing, is I would work on the weekends a little and they would come to the studio. They would paint and do different things. But just the amount of work that it takes to be a founder and have your own business and really wanting to push. And obviously I missed certain things. But one thing I did is I was so focused on work and family and it was very focused. Like I'm at home. I didn't go out at night. I didn't go to parties. I was home with my kids. And that's one thing that I made the conscious decision. And like people are like, you never go out.

55:12Kelly Wearstler:Like you're never at these like things for work. And it's like, well, I have a family. And like, that's like the most important element of my life. Family comes first always.

55:22Emma Grede:But that was your trade-off. It was like it was work and the family. And then there ends up being very little for social and friends. and other stuff.

55:31Kelly Wearstler:Yes. Something you have to give. So you have to give. You can definitely do both. I think I'm an amazing mom. I have an incredible relationship with my kids and I'm there for them. Like, you know, you can have both. You just have to know how to manage your time.

55:45Emma Grede:Yeah. Do you think the motherhood has changed anything in the way that you lead or the way that you think about building your business?

55:52Kelly Wearstler:As a mother, I would say just, especially like with the junior team, like just more like compassionate and more communicative and, and very, you know, I try and be very warm. Like I feel like I'm a warm person and, you know, really want to include our junior team at my studio and just knowing like they're just starting out, you know, my, my older boys, they're just starting, you know, new businesses. You want to push them. Yeah. I push them. I hold them to a high standard. Like I hold myself, my husband and I both do. We hold, you know, our entire family to a high standard. And it's how I operate at my studio as well.

56:35Kelly Wearstler:Totally.

56:36Emma Grede:I mean, I'm guessing that your kids are growing up with a very different life than you did in Caroline. Yes.

56:43Kelly Wearstler:A little bit different. So different. Like so different. But they see, and that was something that we really had to, you know, just make sure like they had jobs. They, you know, you say no, like we were strict parents and they see how hard Brad and I work for what we have. And that obviously always like sets a good example. And I think including them really giving invisibility to what we're doing and they see that we're happy. They see that we're happy in our career. And like, that's what I want for them to do what they absolutely love. It's so important because you're, to succeed, you have to work 24 seven and have that grit and determination and passion.

57:30Emma Grede:I love that you say that because I read somewhere that you've kind of like reframed this idea of balance as integration rather than separation. And when I read that, I was like, does she mean with the family? I wonder if like, How does that show up in the way that you structure your days and you have your family and your business? What did you mean by that?

57:49Kelly Wearstler:Well, just in terms of I get up super early in the morning so I can work out. Like 4.30, 5.00. Because I like to have time. It's the only time I have to myself. And I have to answer the emails that I didn't get to during the day. And then I work out. And I always have woken up my kids every morning and spend time with them in the morning and drive them to school. and they would come to my office. I mean, they still, Crossey comes to my office, you know, in the middle of the day on his way home from preschool. And, you know, he sees, he sees what's like going on and happening. And then I'm at home.

58:26Kelly Wearstler:I go home and I, you know, in the car, I'm still on calls and like doing everything I have to do. And I get home and have dinner and I'm focused and hang out, you know, with my family, my husband and the kids. And then when, you know, they go to sleep and put them to bed and I go back to work for a little bit.

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1:01:37Emma Grede:I want to hear the rest of the routine. If you're up at 4.30 in the morning and you're waking this little kid up and you're back home for dinner, like what are the non-negotiables? Like give me an idea of the things that you have to do to keep yourself sane and productive and like just in the life that you want to live. Like you want to hear all the details? I want to know what you got. Like, yeah, give it to me.

1:02:00Kelly Wearstler:I mean, so I get up, I look at my aura ring. I get up very early, look at my aura ring. I go, I do my, my red light cap. And, uh, how good is the red light? Yeah. It's so good. I know. I was just told today I have a lot more new growth. Yeah. Every time I go to the hairdressers, I'm like, do I have new growth?

1:02:19Emma Grede:I think they just tell me now just to shut me up.

1:02:22Kelly Wearstler:Um, and then I, um, I go downstairs and I make my triple macchiato, uh, and I go through like emails like that. I want to make sure I get back to, you know, everyone. And then I go to the gym. Like that is a non-negotiable. I work out every single day, twice a day. Yesterday at three. Shut up. Yesterday at three.

1:02:44Emma Grede:No, you don't. You're psycho. You work out every single, seven days a week, twice a week, twice a day.

1:02:50Kelly Wearstler:So I'll do like, I have a weight, you know, trainer who we lift like really heavy weights.

1:02:55Emma Grede:hold hold hold hold hold you you work out every single day twice a day yes and sometimes three times yeah yesterday was unusual like on the weekend sometimes because i play paddle

1:03:09Kelly Wearstler:and my schedule like a meeting in the morning i work out super early what time and then i do my sauna like it's like 5 30 oh my gosh she's like the longevity queen you're showing me up

1:03:20Emma Grede:I thought this was me. All right, wait a minute. She's up. She's emailing. Triple Macchiato. The red light cap's on. She's getting in her workout kit. You're doing a workout. Sauna after or before. And the workout's at home.

1:03:33Kelly Wearstler:The workout's at home. Yeah, you don't have time to be going to a gym. Because I, for 20 years, went to Barry's boot camp. Oh, yeah. Like, every single day. But now it's, like, amazing being at home. And then I do my workout. And then I go directly to the sauna. Do my sauna. How long? Do my, I do 20 minutes. Okay. Yeah, 20 minutes. And then I do shower.

1:03:52Emma Grede:Is it a wood sauna or is it an infrared sauna? I need to know.

1:03:55Kelly Wearstler:No, it's just hot sauna. Okay.

1:03:57Emma Grede:Okay. Old school.

1:03:58Kelly Wearstler:And then I take a really cold shower, which is so amazing. You just feel... We have the cold plunge, but... It's a lot for a girl. I don't know. I hear it's not great for females. I know.

1:04:09Emma Grede:I'm a little on the fence. Like, I can do it, like, around my cycle, but, like, there's certain times when that shit... I'm just not getting in. Yeah, it's a lot. I'm just not getting in.

1:04:17Kelly Wearstler:It's a lot. But I do the cold shower. I feel great. Then I go get up Crosby and then I read books to him. We hang out, like have quick breakfast. And then he gets ready. Like we have amazing nanny who helps. I get ready for work, like super fast shower. Like you're putting that whole look together. I have my green juice, like my green juice, uh, and then go downstairs.

1:04:39Emma Grede:Wait a minute. You have to go back to me because you've always got a look on. It's not like you put jeans and a t-shirt on. You're just like throwing something together or you've got your outfits like ready in your head? No, no.

1:04:49Kelly Wearstler:And sometimes they work and sometimes they don't.

1:04:52Emma Grede:I mean, I like it. I always think like even if they don't work, they kind of work because you're you and it's like, oh, it's a weird like furry shoe. It just like kind of happens. Okay, fine. Outfits on,

1:05:02Kelly Wearstler:taking the kids to school. And then I go to school and then as soon as I drop Crossey off and then I like, I'm on a call. Like just like on the call, work, Zoom call. Like, I mean, I'm not watching, but I'm listening. Zoom call and then go to the studio. And then I'm like, goes directly to a meeting. And it's like one after the next, like go to meeting, meeting, being in a, you know, you know. Yeah.

1:05:25Emma Grede:You're like back to back to back all day.

1:05:26Kelly Wearstler:And then it's like 10 to one. And then I leave, I'm going now to my, my second workout. I do my second workout and like, it's a reset. What's the difference between the first workout and the second workout?

1:05:39Emma Grede:Are you strength training

1:05:41Kelly Wearstler:one and then cardio and then some are cardio, some are zone two, some are zone five and Pilates. With a trainer or without a trainer? No, with a trainer. Some days I do myself, I do cardio by myself, but I do heavy weight training. On a reformer or not Pilates? No, on a reformer. And then I'll go there and I started doing jump rope. Like I really want to get good at jump roping. So I started jump roping and like doing like tricks because it's really good for your body. And then I do like farmer's walks there and then we do regular Pilates. So I I do all that. And then she's, my Pilates instructor is super close to the studio.

1:06:14Kelly Wearstler:So then I go back to the studio and like eat super fast. Yeah, in a meeting. What are you eating? And then like usually it's salmon and a green salad.

1:06:22Emma Grede:Okay, she's disciplined this one. Yes. Okay, got it. So salmon and a green salad.

1:06:25Kelly Wearstler:And I eat, like I'm so laser focused on eating healthy and like knowing what I put in my body. I think it shows. I have a smoothie. I forgot about the smoothie. Oh, you have a smoothie. A protein smoothie? Yeah, protein smoothie on the way to taking Krasi to school. I have like the smoothie and the macchiato. Yeah, because you need this energy.

1:06:41Emma Grede:Otherwise you would just fall apart.

1:06:43Kelly Wearstler:Yes.

1:06:44Emma Grede:Wow. And I'm nuts.

1:06:45Kelly Wearstler:I have like snacks and things like I'll have to, and I drink a lot of water.

1:06:48Emma Grede:Is there like some, when you're doing the meetings, do you have rules in work, like some kind of meeting hygiene or a time? Like how does it work in the studio? Or are you just more like free and easy? No, just free and easy. Free and easy. Yeah. Okay. So free and easy. Free and easy. And then like home, dinner, you must like, what time do you go to bed?

1:07:07Kelly Wearstler:And then I go to bed, actually, I go to bed at like 9.30. I go to bed early. LA-ish. Yes. Okay. And especially like after just everything that I've done, like, and then like we read Crosby and I'm just like also like getting tired.

1:07:21Emma Grede:Okay. Now I've got your whole routine down. That was a very important part of this interview and I'm extremely happy about it. We're going to shift here gear a little bit. So I want to understand like what matters to you most. Like when you start to think about your legacy and almost like the body of work that you've created, what becomes most important to you to be able to like kind of look back on?

1:07:43Kelly Wearstler:For my legacy, I would say that I like created great and beautiful environments that people have had memories in and that made them feel good and made them feel happy. Because that's what I want to do is I want people to feel good and nurtured in their spaces and represent them. also like we you know design hotels and you know i have people coming out to me like oh my god like i was at your hotel and i got married i engaged i had a party and i just had like such an incredible weekend and it was such an amazing memory for me and that is so meaningful like i love hearing that and then we design a lot of product and designing product that people can pass down to you know their their kids and just continue to use and having these pieces in the world are like really, you know, just mean a lot.

1:08:38Emma Grede:Yeah. It makes a lot of sense. What are you most intentional about preserving in both kind of the brand and the business as you continue to evolve?

1:08:46Kelly Wearstler:to just continue to get better and to continue to learn and to produce really great designs and grow. I want to evolve. I really want to... I see myself doing this until I'm 100. Hopefully all this shit's going to pay off my routine. and uh you know I just listen if it ain't paying off for you it's not gonna pay off for any of us I hope it works out and you see I was just with Martha Stewart and it's like she's telling about her day and I'm just like shit like she is such an inspiration first of all beyond I couldn't I couldn't agree more but she packs it I know like she really does like she's such an inspiration and when you, you know, love what you do, like you want to just do it till the end.

1:09:50Kelly Wearstler:Totally. I really understand that. What projects are you like most excited about now? Designing the torch and cauldron for the LA 28 Olympics. First of all, we need you to do that. There's never been a female. What? Yes. There's never been a female. Oh, is there like a voting booth or something?

1:10:08Emma Grede:I don't know. We need that to happen. I'll tell them I'll tell my friends over at Team USA or I don't know like some sporty thing that I do but I so want to do it I know first of all we need you to do it there's never been a woman no no

1:10:23Kelly Wearstler:and it's like I'm like synonymous with you know design and Los Angeles and and yeah I'm so well suited for it no if not you

1:10:32Emma Grede:then who I need you to do that I think that that would be so major I would be so excited yeah that's that's a pretty kind of like you know big I know. That's so, yeah. I just have a few more questions left for you. These ones are rapid fire. Oh, Lord. Kelly, get ready. Don't worry. I'm crap at rapid fire. I'll just like go on for 15 minutes. So the team know when I say rapid fire, it means nothing. Okay. What is one interior decorating rule that applies to every room in the house? Do not buy all your furniture in one place. Oh, I love that one. Is that like the basic bitch of interior design? if you have all of your stuff.

1:11:10Emma Grede:Yes, because it's about curation.

1:11:11Kelly Wearstler:It's about also like you want things to surround yourself from travels and things that take time to curate everything that you're surrounding yourself with because then it's more soulful and it's meaningful.

1:11:24Emma Grede:Damn right. What is something that you used to aspire to that you no longer aspire to?

1:11:30Kelly Wearstler:It's tough, but it's perfectionism. Like I'm working very hard. My husband's like, just get it done and get it out there. Like you can't make it perfect and you can't, you have to set things free and you like tweak it and massage it, you know, as it's been set free.

1:11:48Emma Grede:Fair. What's the first thing you do in the morning and the last thing you do at night? I think I know.

1:11:54Kelly Wearstler:The first thing or a ring, I got to get my sleep score. And then does it affect your day? If you have a bad sleep score, like you feel it, like it's so right. Like you do feel it. Wow. But I just like forge through, I just do it. And then the last thing I do is I kiss my husband. Like we always like, even if we're pissed off at each other, it's like you still kiss.

1:12:15Emma Grede:Damn right. What is a book that's changed your life?

1:12:18Kelly Wearstler:The book that changed my life is a book by Rick Rubin, The Creative Act. And like I design from a place of creativity, emotion and things that feel so, just so natural. And I'm not connected. Like I can envision something visually in my brain and like it's not like I'm thinking philosophically about how I got to the solution of a design problem and so it really helped me to think a little deeper.

1:12:49Emma Grede:I love that. All right my last question for you Kelly. What are you aspiring to right now in your life?

1:12:57Kelly Wearstler:I'm aspiring to just continue to learn and to inspire people along the way and being just a great mom and just myself, I guess.

1:13:13Emma Grede:I love that. Just yourself. There she is. One of one. Kelly, thank you so much. I love this. It's amazing.

1:13:19Kelly Wearstler:Thank you.

1:13:24Emma Grede:If you're loving this podcast, be sure to click follow on your favorite listening platform. While you're there, give us a review and a five-star rating and share an episode you love with a friend. We'll be so grateful. A Spy with Emma Greed is presented by Odyssey. I'm your host, Emma Greed. Executive producer, Ashley McShann. Derek Brown and me. Our executive producers from Odyssey, Leah Reece-Dennis, Asha Saluja, Lauren Lagrasso. Producer, KK Sublime. Stephen Key is our senior producer. Sound design and engineering by Bill Shultz. Angela Peluso is our booker. Original music by Charles Black Video production by Evan Cox Kurt Courtney Andrew Steele And Carlos Delgado Social media by Olivia Homan Catherine Bale Special thanks to Brittany Smith Sydney Ford My teams at The Lead Company and WME Maura Curran Josephina Francis Hilary Schuff Eric Donnelly Kate Hutchinson Rose Tim Meekle Sean Cherry And Lauren Vieira If you have questions for me You can DM me at aspirewithemagreed Greed is spelled G-R-E-D-E.

1:14:30Emma Grede:That's Aspire, A-S-P-I-R-E with Emma Greed. Or you can submit a question to me on my website, emmagreed.me.

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