House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries on Shutdown Day 23

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1:02Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio, news. On this Thursday, the 23rd day of the U.S. government shutdown, which is now the second longest shutdown in American history, I went to Capitol Hill to sit down with Hakeem Jeffries, the Democratic leader in the House of Representatives. What are these days like for you? Is there a Groundhog Day rhythm to it? You know, and although there's always something extraordinary that happens as well. Yeah. That's unexpected because of the nature of how this administration conducts. Since the shutdown started, the White House announced a ceasefire in Gaza.

1:41The Treasury Department extended a$20 billion lifeline to Argentina. President Trump is overseeing the demolition of the East Wing of the White House. Now, the president is preparing for a trip to Asia, where he's expected to meet face-to-face with Chinese President Xi Jinping. When it comes to the shutdown, there are some potential pressure points on the horizon. On Friday, October 24th, many federal workers will miss their first paychecks. Then, on November 1st, open enrollment starts for health insurance, when many Americans are likely to notice their health care costs are going to go up, barring congressional action to restore federal subsidies.

2:18This is extraordinary stuff. We've never seen anything like this in the history of the country, which is why we believe it needs to be decisively addressed. Meanwhile, Jeffries continues to face pressure in his hometown of New York City to weigh in on the upcoming mayoral race there. Jeffries has yet to make an endorsement, but he said he'll do so before early voting starts. Polls open this weekend. So it's been all encompassing, you know, for the last several weeks. That said, I do have a sense of obligation to weigh in one way or the other in terms of the mayor's race in advance of early voting.

2:56I'm David Gura, and this is The Big Take from Bloomberg News. Today on the show, my sit down with House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries on the government shutdown, the role President Trump could play in ending it, New York City politics, and criticism of Democratic leadership ahead of the 2026 midterms.

3:18Thank you very much for having us. Really appreciate it. Thank you. It's day 23. And I'm curious sort of what has changed between day one, the start of this shutdown, and today in terms of the conversation and how you're feeling about where things are. Well, as Democrats, we continue to make clear to our Republican colleagues that we will sit down with them anytime, anyplace, in order to reopen the government, to negotiate a bipartisan agreement that actually makes life better for the American people in terms of spending and funding. But we also have to decisively address the Republican health care crisis.

3:53We've maintained that position from the very beginning, before Republicans shut the government down and during the entirety of the shutdown, because it is a real crisis that has been created at this moment particularly as it relates to the urgent need to extend the Affordable Care Act tax credits. As you and I are speaking, the House Speaker's doing a press conference just down the hall. What is the level of engagement? Do you pass one another? Are you speaking with one another? Are Democrats talking to Republicans right now? The conversations have been very limited unfortunately because Donald Trump has not given House Republican leaders or Senate Republican leaders permission to negotiate.

4:28Reinforcing the principle from our view that he made the decision to shut the government down. They want to continue to inflict pain on federal employees. They've done that from the very beginning of Donald Trump's presidency. In fact, more than 200 ,000 federal employees had been forced off the job prior to the government shutdown. I want to ask you about potential off-ramps, and Tammy Baldwin, the senator from Wisconsin, Democrat, said Trump is the off-ramp at this point. Do you agree with that assessment, and has there been any kind of outreach or dialogue between you and the White House? Leader Schumer made clear earlier this week that we have reached out to the White House again to indicate that prior to Trump's departure for Asia, he should sit down with Democrats to find a path forward to reopen the government, to enter into a bipartisan spending agreement, and to address the health care crisis that Marjorie Taylor Greene acknowledges must be addressed, and that traditional conservatives who are in the toughest seats in the country have now publicly acknowledged this week needs to be addressed.

5:31Can I ask you a question of congressional mechanics? And that is, can the Democratic leader pick up the phone, call the White House, and reasonably expect the president's going to take that phone call? Are you able to do that? And if so, what's keeping you from having that dialogue? Well, traditionally, that probably is the case. But in this White House, that's very much unclear. Donald Trump didn't have a meeting with House or Senate Democratic leadership until two days prior to the government shutting down. And we had to demand that meeting. He initially agreed to it, then he canceled it, and then he was forced by public sentiment to agree to it.

6:06But unfortunately, we had a discussion for about an hour or so, and then there was no follow-up from either Donald Trump or his administration because they are not serious about solving these challenges on behalf of the American people. We live in a high cost of living environment. The American people are struggling to afford to live, struggling paycheck to paycheck. And Donald Trump and Republicans promised that they were going to lower costs on day one, but costs aren't going down. Costs are going up. Inflation going up. Electricity prices through the roof. Housing costs expensive. grocery costs increasingly expensive.

6:45And now people facing the possibility, as we approach the open enrollment period for health insurance on November 1st, that millions of folks are going to see premium increases that could be as high as$1 ,000 or$2 ,000 more per month. And yet we see nothing but inaction from the President of the United States. Keeping that in mind, Jason Smith, chairman of House Ways and Means, was on our air yesterday, and he said maybe there could be a longer term CR, 14 months, take us through the midterms. Am I right in assuming that's unpalatable to you because it does nothing to address what you were just talking about, those health care subsidies?

7:21Yes, it's definitively unacceptable to us. We've made clear from the beginning we will not vote for a partisan Republican spending bill that continues to gut the health care of the American people in the face of an extraordinary crisis that Republicans have created. If you think about it, the largest cut to Medicaid in American history, almost a trillion dollar cut. This from a president and Republicans who promised in January that they would love and cherish Medicaid. As a result of the policies in the one big ugly bill, we're seeing hospitals and nursing homes and community-based health centers closed all across the country.

7:58Because of what Republicans have done, we also are facing a possible$536 billion cut to Medicare at the end of the year, if Congress doesn't act. They refuse to extend the Affordable Care Act tax credits, which is going to impact tens of millions of people. By the way, more than 90 percent of the people who receive tax credits connected to their health insurance make around$63 ,000 or less. These are working class folks. And then we know that Republicans are continuing to assault our public health infrastructure in the country related to vaccine availability. their appropriations bill right now that they want us to support in the House.

8:43They propose cutting$1.7 billion from the Centers for Disease Control and another$500 or so million from the National Institute of Health. It's not something that's acceptable to us in any way, shape, or form. This is a health care crisis that cannot be overstated, And so we've got to address it decisively now. I want to talk about your vision for how all of this unfolds. So my first question is, how do you see all of this playing out? How long do you think it's going to be? What's your best guess at this point? Well, listen, I think the longer this goes on, the more pressure that unfortunately continues to mount on Congress decisively to act, meaning our Republican colleagues who control the House and the Senate.

9:29and it shocks a lot of people that House Republicans have been on vacation now four consecutive weeks, have literally canceled votes for four consecutive weeks. That's an unsustainable position, we believe. They need to get back to work, come back from vacation, sit down, let's do the business of the American people. We also, of course, are going to approach the November 1st open enrollment period. And at that moment in time, it will be crystal clear to the American people that their premiums, co-pays, and deductibles are about to skyrocket in ways that will crush them financially. And they will be unable to go see a doctor when they need one, when their children need one, when their family needs one.

10:17And it's unsustainable for Republicans to continue to refuse to address that issue. It's not a made-up issue. It's a real-life issue that has adverse consequences on everyday Americans. I think back to the beginning of this and the days before, there were some critics who said, that date's too far off, and you're making this argument based on that November 1st deadline. People aren't dealing with that in real terms yet. Does this become an easier sell to the American public as we get closer to that date and, indeed, as we hit November 1st? Well, our view was that we needed to address this issue in October because of the fact that notices were going out to tens of millions of Americans who have to be able to plan.

10:59They need some certainty to understand, are they going to be able to afford health care? How am I going to manage this situation? What are my alternatives? And that's why we felt like it needed to be dealt with, with the fierce urgency of now, in connection to what was also happening with the need to either fund the government, prevent a shutdown that Republicans have now brought to the country, now reopen the government, and actually to reach an enlightened bipartisan spending agreement, where our only criteria had been, if we're going to reach an agreement that's bipartisan in nature, it has to actually improve the lives of the American people in three different areas.

11:40their health, public safety, and their economic well-being, particularly as it relates to lowering the high cost of living because America is too expensive right now.

12:01A nearer pressure point is Friday, October the 24th. Federal workers aren't going to receive their paychecks. How confident are you that you're not going to be blamed? Democrats aren't going to be blamed for that when that comes around. Well, from the very beginning of this president's term, Donald Trump and the Republicans have assaulted in the most egregious way possible hardworking federal civil servants and public employees. And it's outrageous. As I mentioned, more than 200 ,000 federal employees have already been forced off the job. That was prior to Donald Trump shutting down the government.

12:35We passed a law in 2017 that Donald Trump signed, which requires that furloughed workers, all federal employees, receive their back pay. It's Donald Trump that's now suggesting unlawfully that he can withhold that pay and they might not be compensated. Should workers be worried about that? I've talked to a few federal workers who, for the first time, for the first shutdown they've been through, they're worried that that's not going to happen. Is that a reasonable concern? Well, the law is crystal clear. It's reasonable concern from the standpoint that when Donald Trump says anything, and he's the president of the United States, and there's been a willingness to engage in unlawful and illegal behavior, sometimes rubber stamped by the conservative majority on the U.S.

13:17Supreme Court, that's problematic. But the law is very crystal clear in this particular instance. And we are going to make sure that every single federal employee receives the entirety of their pay. People will be watching this and listening to this, hearing what you're saying, and detecting that there is this deficit of trust between the two parties here. And I don't think that engenders a lot of optimism because this gets solved anytime soon. Is that misplaced? Do you feel like there can be some comedy here somewhere? Well, we're taking the Ronald Reagan approach to this particular situation from the standpoint of what needs to happen.

13:51Trust but verify. And so, yeah, promises can be made, but we need verification. that verification comes in the form of actual legislation, decisive legislative action to be able to address the Republican health care crisis. But, you know, we're here each and every day. Democrats have been showing up on Capitol Hill. We're committed to doing the work, to finding a bipartisan path forward, to reopening the government and to addressing the health care crisis that Republicans have viciously visited on the American people. I've got a couple questions just about the long-term consequences of this. So the president said, we're closing up programs that are Democrat programs that we're opposed to, and they're never going to come back in many cases.

14:34Is he right? Is the work that's being done by OMB and his administration irrevocable? Well, Republicans have been trying to shut down programs unlawfully from the very beginning of this presidency in ways that clearly violate the law because they're inconsistent with bipartisan bills that have been passed dictating how taxpayer dollars are spent in ways that are designed to benefit the American people. So what we're seeing right now is not inconsistent. These are just threats, you know, from Donald Trump trying to intimidate Democrats from backing away from the position that we've taken on behalf of the American people.

15:12This is a principal position for us, not political, it's not partisan. It's about the quality of life, the health, the safety, and the economic well-being of the American people, and will continue to hold this position. And we're going to have to, of course, continue to push back against overreach from Donald Trump and his administration. Unfortunately, Republicans who control the House and the Senate, they have complete control of government right now, in the Congress, they're not functioning like a separate and co-equal branch of government. They're a wholly owned subsidiary of the Trump cartel.

15:44And unfortunately, they continue to recklessly rubber stamp Donald Trump's extreme policies. We can pour one out for regular order. We haven't seen that in a long time. But I wonder if what's at risk here is the appropriations process. As you talk to your appropriations team, what do they say about how that's likely to change as a result? Yes, of what's led to the shutdown, but also what we've seen this administration do when it comes to budgeting over the last few months. Well, our appropriators on the Democratic side, Rosa DeLauro, and on the Senate side of the Democratic caucus, of course, Patty Murray, they are superb appropriators, and they're committed to a process of finding a bipartisan path forward.

16:25Are they worried? Well, I think Lisa Murkowski and Susan Collins have expressed concern about how this administration has conducted itself in violating congressional intent. The framers were very clear. Congress has the power of the purse. That's for good reason. We're the institutions that are closest to the American people, particularly on the House side. And so, yes, the American people should be worried. But we need a Congress to actually reassert itself in the best interest of the American people so that the administration is not allowed just to make these decisions unilaterally on their own without the people's representatives in the House or the Senate actually being able to have our will exerted through our representation of everyday Americans.

17:13It was opening night at the Garden last night. Knicks versus Cavs, Knicks won 119-111. Also the final mayoral debate in New York City. Did you watch it? Have you kept up with what happened on stage last night? I wasn't able to catch the debate live. I did catch the final few moments of the Knicks game, I do admit. but the debate had already ended at that point by time my day ended. I did think it was interesting yesterday and a strong step that was taken by Zoran, the Democratic nominee, when he indicated his intention to retain our current police commissioner, Jessica Tish. I think that probably will provide a lot of comfort to people throughout the city of New York.

17:53She's done a great job. She's well-respected. We're a diverse city, and it'll be interesting to see how that is received upon my return home. You've been asked about this a thousand times. Let me ask a thousand and one times. Are you prepared to endorse the Democratic nominee for mayor of New York City? Well, what I'll say is I'm prepared to weigh in in advance of early voting. It's two days away. Early voting starts on Saturday. Yeah. What's holding you up, and what are the issues that you're still concerned about? I know that you said the last time you were asked about this, you were going to have a conversation with Sergeant Mondani, another conversation.

18:23Yeah. What's left undiscussed? Well, I hope to speak to him today or tomorrow. And I, in fact, I plan on speaking to him today and tomorrow. And I think from my standpoint, look, I was prepared to try to bring this to a close one way or the other several weeks ago. And then the government shutdown hit. And honestly, David, it's been all encompassing because this is a traumatic moment for the country that this has been inflicted on the American people. And then laying on top of it, right, just shutting the government down, as Republicans have done, is very problematic. But trying to communicate with the American people why we as Democrats also believe that addressing the Republican health care crisis is necessary and explaining the entirety of the assault on their health care that has occurred this year, beginning with the one big ugly bill and the largest cut to Medicaid in American history, and the fact that their hospitals and nursing homes and community-based health centers are closing all across the country.

19:29Home care will be adversely affected. The possible cut to Medicare at the end of the year, the Republican refusal to extend the Affordable Care Act tax credits, and the threats that they're now making to even try to repeal the Affordable Care Act and the assault on public health infrastructure. This is extraordinary stuff. We've never seen anything like this in the history of the country, which is why we believe it needs to be decisively addressed, along with, of course, reopening the government, standing by our hardworking federal civil servants, and making sure that we can enact a bipartisan spending agreement.

20:04So it's been all-encompassing for the last several weeks. That said, I do have a sense of obligation to weigh in one way or the other in terms of the mayor's race in advance of early voting. So I did watch the debate, and the themes of criticism that came up from the other two candidates were he's inexperienced and his comments on the Middle East are problematic. Are those likewise the same issues that you want to talk to him more about? What's left unsaid between the two of you? Well, I've certainly already publicly communicated and privately communicated some of my concerns with respect to some of the views that he's expressed in terms of foreign policy.

20:39That said, I believe his relentless focus on affordability is the right focus. The question becomes, for any mayor, for any executive, how are you going to implement that objective? Because it's the right objective. But he's got to navigate a treacherous governmental terrain in terms of the city, state, and most significantly, the federal government. because it's clear that Donald Trump has it out for Democratic-led cities all across the country, and we've got to be prepared for the fact that Donald Trump is coming for New York. I guess my question is one of confusion. So I sat down with Governor Cuomo, and in that conversation he said, I'm a Democrat.

21:21My dad was a Democrat. He's really taking up that mantle. Of course, he lost the primary. He's running as an independent. Isn't there an element here of confusion that in this vacuum, and you could, I guess, do something to close that vacuum, He's able to take up that mantle to the detriment of the duly elected Democratic nominee. Well, it's interesting because he is running as an independent, so he's not the Democratic nominee. But, of course, he has a long history as a Democrat. I think some of the concerns that I've seen articulated, however, is, well, what is the actual path to victory, given the inability to convince a majority of Democrats in the primary that you were the right person to lead the city moving forward at this moment.

22:03Let me use this as a segue. So a lot of people point to his youth, point to, as you just noted, his emphasis on affordability. Part of your job is surveying the national terrain, political terrain, and looking for candidates. does his success in that primary make you think that youth is more important this time around? That that emphasis, that kind of monomaniacal emphasis on affordability is going to be critical here as you look to the midterms and beyond? Well, we've said from the very beginning of this year when we came back into session, in fact, in my first set of remarks on the House floor, that would have been on January 3rd, that we were relentlessly committed to lowering the high cost of living, that America is too expensive, housing costs too high, grocery costs too high, child care costs too high, health care costs too high, utility costs too high, and something needed to be decisively done about it.

22:55It certainly was our hope that Republicans would keep their core promise of lowering the high cost of living. They've refused to do it. In fact, what they've done is make life more expensive. But from the very beginning of the year, it's clear to us that the affordability issue is central to what we need to do on behalf of the American people. Listen, we believe in this country, greatest country in the history of the world, that everyone who works hard and plays by the rules should be able to provide a comfortable life for themselves and for their families, to live the good life. Good paying job, good housing, good health care, good education for their children and a good retirement.

23:31And the problem that so many Americans confront right now is that far too many people are doing the first two things. They're working hard and they're playing by the rules, but they can't get to that American dream, that comfortable life, living the good life for themselves and for their family. That's what's broken in the country right now. And so we've got to fix it. And yes, affordability is a big part of it, the central issue, the high cost of living. We've also got to find ways to put money back into the pockets of the American people, actually use the tax code to make their life better. Instead, what we've seen with Republicans, this one big ugly bill that's now law, is that they hurt everyday Americans in order to reward their billionaire donors with massive tax breaks.

24:12That's why I think that voters are going to reject this Republican extremism and Republican policies all across the country, and we'll begin to see that during the upcoming general election in Virginia, in New Jersey, and with respect to Prop 50 in California. What do you say to those candidates who are mounting primary campaigns against Democrats who are critical of Democratic leadership? Maybe looked at what happened in March, wished that you and the Senate minority leader had stood up then, want you to do more. What's your message to them just about the way that this party is operating in its current form?

24:45Well, to be very clear, House Democrats were strongly opposed to the partisan Republican spending bill in March, and we continue to have that position. And I'm thankful for the incredible leadership of Chuck Schumer and Senate Democrats who strongly opposed the one big ugly bill from the very beginning all the way through the end, the unanimous Democratic opposition. And we'll continue to stand on principle in defense of the American people at the same period of time. I understand that, you know, we've seen extraordinary extremism unleashed on the American people in assault on all of the things that matter.

25:23Republican assault on the economy, on health care, on nutritional assistance, on veterans, on farmers, on law-abiding immigrant families, on the rule of law, on due process, on the American way of life, and of course on democracy itself. It's the reason why more than 7 million people most recently came out in connection with the No Kings protests, came out peacefully, powerfully, and patriotically in order to express dissent with the fact that the country is moving in the wrong direction under Donald Trump and sycophantic Republicans in the House and the Senate who continue to behave like nothing more than a reckless rubber stamp.

26:01So we're in a more is more environment and we're just going to have to continue to do more, you know, more rallies, more protests, more speeches on the House floor, Senate floor, more town hall meetings in Democratic districts, more town hall meetings in Republican districts. We've held a hearing every week during this shutdown here, and we'll continue to do that to amplify the voices of the American people in terms of who's being hurt by Donald Trump's policies, who's being hurt by the shutdown that Republicans have visited upon the American people, and who's being hurt by the Republican health care crisis.