Inside Google's Generative AI Reinvention — With Nick Fox and Liz Reid

25:16Yeah, Liz, it's interesting. Obviously Google had that incident where someone asked it how to make a pizza and it said put glue on it or eat rocks or any number of weird things. And from your position, you go from that moment where I think maybe a reaction would be, let's clamp this down. We've certainly seen that with Bing, although it was a more extreme example. But when it tried to steal a New York Times columnist away from his wife, they kind of said we shouldn't do that anymore. So how do you then go from like, oh, that's a problem to even still, because it's more risk, roll this out as broadly as you have?

25:53Yeah, so I think there's a couple of things that were important there. One, search has never been perfect. You know, people will go and say with AI, feature snippets have had challenges, knowledge graph is a problem, web ranking isn't perfect. And so we're always on a relentless pursuit to make the quality even better. What we saw with that incident was both those queries were quite rare. We saw them only like one in seven million, these types that people were facing. But we still really cared about the trust. And so we felt like we needed to take action on it. And so there's so much potential with the technology that we didn't think the right thing is clamped down.

26:31But the right thing isn't all either just let it be. So we put a lot of effort into understanding what were the types of failures that were getting surfaced. One of the things that was different with Genitive AI is we were seeing new types of queries than we had previously seen. You mentioned eat rocks. People previously did not come to Google search and say, how many rocks should I eat today or a day or any other form of how many rocks should I eat? Because they already knew. They already knew. They just needed a little affirmation about eating those couple of rocks. About those ones, right. High and ironed.

27:02So if you went and sampled our queries and you looked for general things and, you know, we did extensive evals, we weren't seeing queries like that, right? You can say that's a particular one, but more generally these sort of false premise questions, right, where like it's not really a question that people are seeking out, sort of cropped up in new ways. The other thing that cropped up in new ways was essentially how do you think about forum and UGC content, right? The glue on pizza is a really thoughtful forum discussion that includes one sarcastic comment about glue on pizza that we picked up on it.

27:41Okay, so it wasn't enough to understand the site. It wasn't enough to understand the page. We had to get smarter about each section on a page, even if a page was trustworthy in that. And so when you look at the value the tech can do, we don't view it as, oh, well, there's some problems, therefore don't try. We view it as a challenge to figure out how do you overcome? How do you handle the challenges that come up in the problems? And so people really put a lot of effort into figuring out how to do that. And then we saw with our evals that we had really made progress on those problems and continue to grow.

28:11And we'll always make mistakes. We'll always continue to improve it. But we have quite a rigorous eval and testing process and feedback loop on it that helps guide us to ensure that we're doing the right thing by users. Okay, so I want to talk about the future of the web and how publishers are going to be able to survive this moment. Because even if people are spending that 10 % more time in AI mode, maybe they're not going to websites anymore. So let's do that right after the break. Material security is transforming how companies protect their most critical cloud assets, like Google Workspace and Microsoft 365, with modern purpose-built security that actually works the way people do.

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30:28Join industry leaders like Cisco, Dell Technologies, Google Cloud, Oracle, Red Hat and 75 plus supporting companies to set the standard for secure, scalable AI infrastructure. Is your enterprise ready for the future of Vigentic AI? Visit agency.org to explore use cases now. That's A-G-N-T-C-Y dot O-R-G. And we're back here on Big Technology Podcast with Nick Fox, the SVP of Knowledge and Information at Google, and Liz Reed, VP of Search at Google. Of course, one of the issues that we see in this moment is that the way that the information gets into the bot is it's kind of like a reverse Robin Hood where it takes from these poor publishers and sort of gives to the already rich Google and allows it to surface this information to users without sending the traffic back.

31:27You might dispute the characterization, but I think it's important to bring up Matthew Prince, the CEO of Cloudflare, talked about how back in the day you would get two crawls per page and that would send one visit to Google crawls and eventually you would get one visit from those crawls. Now that number is something like 18 to one or even even higher. People don't like going to the footnotes because they're starting to trust these bots more. That's what he says. So how is there a future for Healthy Web if we keep moving this way? So we love the web. We deeply believe in the web. That's good. Same here.

32:03I think we share that. Google is a company that's grown up on the web, right? And I don't think it's an overstatement to say that there's no company that cares more about the web than Google does. And so we care about this deeply. We think about this deeply. And we have built both AI overviews and AI mode to be very web forward. It is a losing battle to fight users. There's a user change happening here. Users are looking for... It's clear that users are looking for a different kind of experience. If they're looking for a summary, we should not stand in the way of giving that user a summary. A product has to evolve, and you have to evolve listening to your users.

32:47So that's not a choice. What is a choice is how we do it. And so the approach that we've taken is to be very web forward. We have links throughout the experience. We try to very prominently feature content. We try to not recite content. When we do, you know, if we're referencing a specific publisher, a specific perspective, we try to say according to big technology or according to Bloomberg or whoever it might be, that will be linkified, right? and so to drive traffic. So that's our approach. That's our ethos. If you look holistically, traffic to the web from search has been stable over time. There's lots of reports of large decreases.

33:42At any given point in time, there are sites that do well. There are sites that struggle. But if you look holistically across, traffic broadly to the web from Google has been largely stable over time. So a lot of this is – there is clearly a change happening. We're trying to do it in a very web, forward-and-friendly way. And so that's our approach. I think just one thing to add. We definitely understand that publishers and some folks are seeing less traffic. But what's also going on here is other traffic shifts. We're here doing a podcast. We're doing a podcast because people actually like podcasts these days, right?

34:31So you're seeing a shift, especially among younger users, for where are they going to information. So they're going more to a podcast. They're going more to forums. They're going more to social posts and less away from some of the traditional media. And so some of what people are assuming is about what's happening with AI is actually more about the shifts to new forms of media that people are seeking out, whereas the overall traffic is relatively stable. Right. But there are publishers that have marked decreases when AI overviews started rolling out. I mean, just to give you one example, and I've given it on the show before, speaking with the publisher, World History Encyclopedia, who saw a 25 % decrease in traffic like tied directly to AI overviews coming out.

35:17I don't think it's productive for us to like have a back and forth over like whether that was actually AI overviews related or not. He believes it is. Google might believe that there's like, you know, these fluctuations. I guess the question is, what do you do about it? Because that information is valuable to the web. and to people forget the web just to people in general and without ways to support themselves uh we might not get that as much so could you envision a way where instead of someone from like world history encyclopedia which is the number two uh history site or number two yeah number two history site on on the web after the library of congress that they just like write that content for the LLMs and then it gets sort of ingested by, let's say, AI mode and then sorted to users if that's the new way that people want to spend their time?

36:11I think that's possible, but it's not the bet we're making. The bet we're making is that the value exchange that search has existed on for years is largely intact and it still makes sense. websites make their content available for indexing. And as a result of that, Google sends traffic to those sites. Again, it will vary site by site, right? There's some sites that will do incredibly well. There are some sites that may struggle. But that's been the history over time. When we did mobile, a site that didn't adopt mobile maybe would have struggled, et cetera. Or sorry, when the world evolved to mobile, you know, different sites do well through that.

36:58But by and large, our view is, and the approach we're taking, is that traffic still matters and that fundamentally, users want to visit the web, right? I was giving an example the other day of, I'm going to London, I was looking for a hotel, I was looking for a hotel near a park, convenient to the airport, convenient to a certain train state. I sort of had all these details that I was looking for. AI mode gave me a nice response. It gave me some good recommendations. Ultimately, though, it's a hotel. I wanted to see a review of that hotel, so I clicked through to a review site. Ultimately, I wanted to actually finally book that, so I clicked through to a booking site.

37:43I think it's too reductive to say it's AI or the web. And our view is that it's AI and the web. And those work together. And so that's our approach. I think it might have been a little too snarky in the way I set this segment up. Because if you think about it, Google's actually sending far more traffic per crawl than the others. I think Anthropic is up to something like 60 ,000 to one, according to the Cloudflare data. And I always felt that, and I might make some enemies saying this, but I always felt that this publisher insistence that Google pays them for highlighting their information in Google News, for instance, so that headline in two sentences, that to me felt overboard.

38:37This is a service where you're going to get highlighted, you allow the crawl, and you're going to get a ton of traffic. I'm a small independent publisher. I'd love to be in those Google News results. So I think that that was a little overboard. But this is a little different, I think. And maybe the traffic is consistent, but it just feels like, given this history example, you could spend your time reading about it on the website, or you could just read about the history event you want to in AI mode, or what I'm starting to do now, have a conversation with the AI voice. So is there ever some concern that the training data for the models will go away if the economics don't make sense for them?

39:20Or like, for instance, maybe these websites will go away if they're not. Because even though Google doesn't, Google's just indexing them and not like responsible for their existence, like a lot of companies really did count on that Google traffic to stay alive. It is for sure the risk if we got this wrong, right? And it's a large part of the reason we care so much about it. In some ways, a search engine ceases to exist if there's no web to search over. And so this is when I say that we love the web, this is a large part of the reason we love the web is it really is the ecosystem with which and on which Google search operates.

40:00And so we deeply care about it. But we don't see signs that, again, we see the traffic value. It's why we think it matters that the traffic is healthy and stable over time. If not, then we would start to get worried about that. Now, again, in pockets, right? Maybe it's tougher to be a certain type of encyclopedia, given what these tools do. So, again, there may be pockets where it's tougher, where it's different. But that's always been the story of the web, right? There have always been those that thrive and those that struggle. You have to lean into what the future is, right?

40:47We have to evolve to where users are, where users are going, what the technology can do. And again, our approach is to do it in a way that enables the web to thrive through that moment. So you're here in New York speaking with publishers. Are you both speaking with publishers? We both had a set of meetings with publishers. All right. So how are those going? Let's go to you, Liz. Are they understanding this moment? And what's being discussed? I imagine it was about generative AI. When we talked about search, and search includes generative AI. I mean, I think, you know, many publishers these days are sort of trying to understand how is the future going to evolve, right?

41:33I think the understanding, you know, as Nick mentioned, standing still is not going to work. It's not going to work for any of us, search included. But we all really do want to find a way to make this work for publishers, for media. and I think without that we don't have a search engine we don't have a product and so we have to go find a way to make it effective I think what we will see if we do it right is that really great in-depth rich content that people bring when people bring their perspective their opinion their experience their expertise that content will continue to thrive because people want to hear it they're not giving their fashion advice to an ai bot by and large okay the people i know who are giving their fashion advice are not the people who are spending any time on fashion before they're spending no time on fashion going forward right but the rest of the folks who care about it they still want to read that influencer they still want to read the style magazine those folks who are really deeply interested in tech they're going to still want to hear your podcast, right?

42:37Like you can talk to an AI bot about generative AI, or we can hear your thoughts, right? And so we really want to continue to make that content thrive and come to the surface. And we spend a lot of time thinking about not just how our AI overviews or AI mode really high quality, but what does it mean to really make it web forward? How do we surface those links? What are the best links to do? How do we allow people to understand the value in continuing to go deep and progress. What will they get when they get to those websites? We started initially with more of a tray of web links. And then we said, okay, that's great.

43:15We still believe in that, but we want to add links within particular sections because maybe you don't know which of the general sites, but you want to learn more about this one particular part. Then we started doing, as Nick was referring to, in some cases, according to big technology, according to somebody else, and linkifying that when we think it's really about their voice. Could be according to a Reddit user or could be according to big technology. You'll think about the sentence that follows differently and you'll want to hear about it and read about it differently. So we're constantly have folks experimenting on the teams with how do we really take the beauty of the web and surface it in a way that allows people to dig in deeper on it.

43:55How is search revenue continuing to grow the way that it is in this moment? I would imagine that as people use AI, as it's still nascent in terms of the way that it sends traffic to publishers, still nascent the way that you monetize. But every time I'm like looking at the numbers for the quarter or seeing them come in, I'm just like, huh? You know, it doesn't seem like it should be possible to grow. I think it's like double digits search revenue somewhere in that area in this moment. What's going on? So there's a few interesting things that are all kind of happening at the same time. The first is queries continue to grow.

44:35And we've shared that on a year-on-year basis, queries are growing. A lot of that is propelled by generative AI, right? And so generative AI has been, in a lot of ways, a fuel for growth. As users realize they can ask more questions, they can bring more questions to search. So that's a big part of it. The second part of it is AIO reviews fit into the existing search results page. The existing search results page has advertising on as well. And so as we drive more queries, those queries monetize and we have an existing advertising model for that, which also drives traffic to advertisers who are selling things or enable people to book hotels and things like that.

45:24So that's another major piece of it. The third piece is at the same time as all that's happening on the results page itself, we're applying generative AI to our advertising products too. And so in a lot of ways, the holy grail of advertising for the longest time has been an advertising come to us with, here's my site. Here's how much I'm willing to spend. Here's the ROI goal I have. Go do it. and we've been on that journey for a long period of time, generative AI takes us an additional step towards that. So we can be better at matching ads to queries. We can be better at generating creatives, those types of things on behalf of our advertisers.

46:10The fourth thing is as the queries get more specific and detailed, that leads to more valuable traffic to advertisers. So advertisers care about their conversion rate. They care about, obviously, their return on investment. The higher the conversion rate, the more valuable that click to the advertiser is. So the more that we're able to provide, enable users to specify their intent more specifically, the more we're able to deliver a more qualified lead to the advertiser. So all of those kind of work together in a pretty symbiotic way. And there have been people that have surmised that there's less impressions.

46:56So the CPC is up, cost per click. Is that wrong? We don't share overall ad impression numbers. It's not one of our financial disclosures. We do share that pay clicks have grown over time as well as CPC. So both of those are growing over time. Okay. How about shopping? I just think that shopping is going to be a real important new thing that happens through these bots. I've really gotten to the point where I won't buy anything unless I research it with a generative AI chatbot. What's the future of that going to look like? Liz, do you have any thoughts? Yeah, I mean, I think there's a few things.

47:41I think Genitive AI makes shopping exciting in a number of different ways. One, you know, you've got different types of shopping. You've got ones that are sort of more apparel or stylistic. You've got others that are, you're going to go buy an appliance, right? In the case of appliances, you want to do the research, but sometimes you want to understand about two or three different products. And those are not the two or three products that people have chosen to compare with. Somebody compares one product with another product. Someone compares this product. And so it's not really allowing you to do research on the subset of products you want to look at.

48:19But then with generative AI, you can't because you're no longer dependent on one web page talking about the three products you want to compare. You get to specify. You also often have criteria that you care about that are maybe not really what people are spending the time researching on, but that information is buried somewhere on the web. And so I think that ability with something like an appliance to really gather the information across the web, understand holistically what it is, and then dig in deeper on the web is pretty exciting to see. On the apparel side, there's lots of times where you both want some level of like, okay, the dress has to fit my size.

48:58So I have a couple of structured data fields. But then beyond that, what I want is not really a structured data menu. It's something that's to describe. I want it to feel more classic. I want it to feel summary. I would describe it to a friend or to a sales person differently than you might have previously done with keyword ease. But GenoNet AI lets you actually sort of start to describe what you actually want, right? And that kind of changes, I think, what we can do with shopping going forward and really allow both, in some cases, the more unique merchants, right? These merchants who are undiscovered that have great products, your local merchants, others that have ones, to be found because now people can actually express something in a way that narrows it down to where they shop.

49:48And so I think that's pretty exciting to see. I think we'll also see a lot of work around agents. We talked about some of the efforts at I.O. with the ability to decide that you want to track the price of something. And so when it goes on sale, do that. virtual try-on was a highlight at IO I am selling I never know what the clothes are going to look like on me do I have to buy it then do I have to return it returning it's like not fun for me it's actually not fun for the merchant right it's not usually good for their business if they have a lot of returns this idea that you can actually just see what it looks like and so have more confidence when you buy it that you'll keep it I think is really great so I think there's a lot of opportunity with shopping in Jaren and I don't know if there's anything you want to add Nick?

50:30I think you got it Yeah. No, I'm definitely watching that space pretty closely and probably another good emerging, well, not emerging business because Google Shopping is a big business already, but I think probably an area for a lot of growth. A lot of space for transformation. Yeah. What about visual? I mean, I think Google started with Google Glass, went away. Now everyone's building AR glasses. Is that going to be a format of search in the future? I think so. I think it's a relatively nascent space. But Lens is doing pretty well. Lens is doing on fire. Talk about that. Lens is doing phenomenally well.

51:10The combination of Lens and AI reviews is doubly on fire. Okay. So Lens is you point your photo at an item and you can ask it a question. Yeah. And there's really two things that are taking off. One is you can point your camera at something and say, what is this? or sort of here's my homework and you can give me some help with my homework, these types of things. So it's doing very, very well with younger users too. The other piece of it is circle to search, which is – so that's the camera version of it. But what if I want to search something that's on my screen? So I might have homework assignment on my screen or I might see a bag that I like in, say, an Instagram post or something like that.

51:51Ties back into shopping. Maybe I want to go buy that or I want to find out what it is or whatever it might be. And so that sort of combination of input is visual and then the AI summary, the AI response, and then again with links to do I want to buy it, do I want to go deeper, is proven to be a really, really powerful combination. Okay. I want to make a note about, actually, can we talk about Notebook LM? Sure. How's that doing? So Notebook LM, by the way, folks, I'm sure many of our listeners know it. If you don't know it, you can drop a bunch of links in it. It will make sense to FAQ timeline.

52:30It will create an audio podcast. By the way, Liz, to your point about people continuing to want to listen to this podcast. I hope so. I've had multiple people tell me that the voice, the male voice in these Notebook LM podcasts sounds like me. Oh, that's true. Even still, we're growing. So it's not killing big technology. They want your perspective. Not just the sound of your voice, right? Yeah, welcome to the deep dive. I think you're pretty close. So how does that product take? The product, so neither Liz nor I work on it, but the product is doing well.

53:09It's also doing quite well in the education use case. It's quite useful if you could upload your syllabus or a study guide or sort of point at your textbook, things like that, to actually go deeper in a topic. Obviously, the podcast version of it has really taken off. We've brought some of the podcast capabilities into search. Maybe you want to talk about how we've connected those back. Yeah. So there's a couple of things. Within Discover, we've been playing around with Daily Digest, seeing, okay, you get in the morning once, can you understand what some of the different stories are? We have a lab where we're experimenting with if you come to search and you issue a query for those who opt in, can you get a short little podcast about the topic that you ask about.

53:56So it's great if you're on the go and you want to do this and you want to understand it. I think you have both the conversational one like Search Live or Gemini Live, but sometimes there's a different feel between you just asking questions versus hearing people discuss it. So we're constantly playing around with the general technology of taking content and turning it into a podcast is something that Notebook LM really piloted, but it's making its way into other Google products is relevant because it's a fun way to learn about something going forward. Okay. As we come close to an end here, I wanted to just ask some bigger picture questions.

54:34I think there's two views of how this is going. There's one curve that people think about with generative AI that we've had great advances for a while, and now it's leveling off. And there's another curve that people think about where like, all right, this is cool, but we're at the beginning of an exponential and it's about to get crazy. Personally, where do you both land on that? I can go first. Go for it. Do you want to go first? No, go ahead. I believe it's closer to the latter. I think it's easy to underestimate where technology is kind of when you're in it. But actually, the way I see it sort of the most is there are, at least in the point of view of search, there are so many questions that we have on our heads that we're not asking.

55:29The amount of information that people are interested in, would be interested to consume, is so much more vast than what people do. We've said this before. One of the great things about our mission is that at any given point in time, we're barely scratching the surface of what that mission can be. And so, you know, I said this earlier, the opportunity that generative AI technology brings for a product like search is massively vast. And I think we're really, really early on in it. What do you think, Liz? I'd also agree it's very early. I think one thing in particular is that the models are getting much better at reasoning, and they're also getting much better at tool use.

56:17And LLMs are great at a set of things. They're not great at everything. We have great tools that exist in the world for other things. But if you can now teach an LLM to use tools, what does that now enable? And to use multiple tools across, right? So you take something like you have a trivia question about finance. LMs are great about reasoning through it, but you don't want them to make up the numbers. They're not going to know what the latest financial data are. But if they can go query a database we have of real-time finance data, real-time sports data, and then pull it together and ask the question, then you can ask much more interesting questions than you could previously have asked on search.

56:52But they're grounded in actual data. They're not just made-up numbers. And so I think particularly a bunch of the reasoning, the tool use, the agentic capabilities, they will really unlock a lot. and then just to double down on Nick's point whether or not somebody asks a question isn't just a question about whether or not they had a question, it's whether or not it was worth their time right, and so people do that question, right, you were curious about the flower, but if you had to figure out how to describe the flower in words no way, so you didn't ask the thing, okay, but then now you can take a picture of it, and now you ask the question, right it wasn't like suddenly people became curious about what the flower was or your plant is dying and now people take a picture and say why is it dying?

57:35How do I help it? They cared about whether their plant was dying. They just didn't know what to do about it, right? And so there's a lot of possibility to open up when you just lower the barrier to information access, lower the barrier to information understanding. The last thing I think that's kind of still very underexplored is transforming content, right? We talked about the podcasts from Notebook LM, but just this ability to take content in one form and transform it into another without so much work, I think is both exciting from a search perspective because people learn differently. People are in different environments where they can get it.

58:12But also from a creator perspective, you're creating content. Do you have to create the content in every single form or can you create the content in a podcast and easily turn it into a nice article and then easily turn it into short clips of video? And so I think there's a lot of possibility there around that sense of remixing content in a way that's interesting. Very interesting. So you've both been at Google for 22 years. Yes. Did you start? Were you in the same orientation with those? Did they have the spinning hats? We were on different coasts. I was in New York. Okay. I spent 10 years in New York.

58:45All right. I was in Mountain View. Okay. It's a long time at Google. Where does this era rank on the level of change? Most exciting. But I want to know about like, so obviously you've seen shift from desktop to mobile. You've probably seen like the cloud shift as well, shift from portals to search. Is this the number one shift, like the most intense shift, or is this like somewhere in the middle? I think it is the most, there's always like recency bias and things like this. To me, it feels like Google when I started. There's a strong feeling that the sky's the limit. There's a strong feeling of opportunity paired with the ability to – we are shipping in search at a pace – I can't even – like it's such a fast pace I can't even remember.

59:37And that's fun because the technology is fundamentally enabling us to do things that we might have only dreamed about doing before. And so, you know, again, we don't see these things as scary. And so it's not – I didn't ask which is the number one fearful moment. It's just a really exciting and fun time. Okay. I think in search in particular, like there have been many technology shifts, but this is a technology shift at the heart of what search is, right? About understanding information and ability to organize. When you go back to our mission, organizing information, making it useful, making it universally accessible.

1:00:19So it's a technology shift that's right at the root of that. And so that makes it exciting. And I think we have a lot of folks in search that have been in search for quite a long time. And they have been trying their ideas for many years. Sometimes people think, oh, when we ship it, it's the first time we thought of it. No. Actually, oftentimes we thought of the idea 15 years ago, 10 years ago, 5 years ago. You tried. It didn't work. You tried. It didn't work. Or you tried and it was more incremental. You could make a little bit of progress. Suddenly we're at a time where you try those ideas and you're like, wow, I can probably do them this time, right?

1:00:53Oh, I cannot just do small tweaks and make a little bit of progress. I can make big jumps. And that's really exciting to people because, you know, you work hard. You're building a product for multiple billions of people, which is just a daunting thing and it's hard. Now you're like, wow, I can bring this to life for billions of people. And that makes it really exciting. I have two more questions. Can we just lightning round through them both? Let's do it. I asked Sergey when we were at IO what the web looks like in 10 years, and he's like, I'm not even going to begin to attempt. What does the web look like in five years?

1:01:28It's a long time right now. You've got people guessing AGI in two, right? I think if we do our job right, the web feels like it is filled with really rich and interesting content where people – where creators feel like it's one of the most thriving times where they can bring their perspective, where anyone can come and share their content and be discovered and connect with people. I think it is probably even more multimodal, multi-format. Like I would certainly expect video to continue to grow. I would certainly expect audio and not just, you know, text with some images to grow. So I think you'll see more and more of different types of content that people do.

1:02:16But I think if we all collectively, but certainly Google search, which has a key role, do our job right, then you see content really thriving. The thing I'd add is I think the web will be much bigger. I think there will be... I think the other thing that we haven't talked much about, I think this moment will also lower the barrier for creation of content. And we see that happening a lot. We see that with things like VO3. But I think the barrier for creation of content, multimodal but attacks as well, will come down quite a bit. I think that will enable an explosion of the creation of content as well.

1:02:56Okay, here's my last one. we've talked about this moment of reinvention for Google. We've talked about some of the speed bumps that you've put in for yourself or these moments where you don't want to go too far because you might lose user trust. And you've both said that we're at the beginning of an exponential. So do you ever worry that even though you're in reinvention mode and changing a lot, that you're not changing fast enough to get ahead of this?

1:03:29My view is, I mean, I think you always worry about that, right? Like, I think you always worry, are you prioritizing the right things? Are you doing the right things? Are you doing it fast enough? So for sure, speed matters. It's one of the things that we've sort of collectively been emphasizing with the teams. Again, we take this responsibility very, very seriously that we have. And so I think we need to build quickly. I think we need to experiment quickly. and then we need to make sure that we're shipping to the billions of users who use Google when things are ready. And so that's the approach we need to take.

1:04:22Does that enable us to go fast enough? I think that's a good question, but we're not willing to sacrifice the trust of our users and we take the responsibility of those users seriously. So, you know, we do it as quickly as is reasonable. Liz, take us on. I think I'm probably both personality-wise a worrywart, and part of my job is to always obsess with that question, right? Are you doing enough? How can you go faster without breaking? Not at the expense of trust, but can you go faster? Can you do a better job? Can you raise the bar? And so I spend a lot of time with my team just always asking the question, how can we be more effective?

1:05:01And I think being obsessed with, like the alternative of not worrying is being complacent. And so I don't want to be complacent. I'd rather worry and focus on it. Liz and Nick, it was great speaking with you. I've appreciated our conversations through the years, and I hope to continue them. Thank you. We hope to be back. Oh, you will, as long as you want to. Okay. Thank you, everybody, for listening, and we'll see you next time on Big Technology Podcast.

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