$1 Rental Properties and "Infinite" Returns with a 100% On-Market Strategy

6:50Brandon Turner:So that in itself is an accomplishment. And then you're making money in your first house hack. You did a double house hack. This was 2019, you said. So where did you go from there?

7:01Joe Meehan:Already by the end of 2020, it was December 2020, I bought my next house.

7:06Brandon Turner:Okay. So you had the bug. You were ready. You were ready. Yeah.

7:09Joe Meehan:I was saving money, making money. And then my salary went up a little bit of Bucknell as well. So I was able to, you know, gather another like 15 ,000 or so. And then the next purchase is really kind of what set me up here to really move forward in the real estate business. So it was a main house and a mother-in-law suite. They were selling them together and it had been on the market for a year, off the market and then back on. So I talked to my realtor. We walked through and I was like, is anybody else looking at this? Like what's going on here? Because it was like$400 ,000 for a 3 ,200 square foot house and a mother-in-law suite.

7:51Brandon Turner:And what city was this?

7:52Joe Meehan:This is Lewisburg as well.

7:53Brandon Turner:Okay.

7:54Joe Meehan:For Bucknell Universities. Yeah. And so I ended up getting it for a$360 ,000, but they were on two separate tax parcels.

8:01Brandon Turner:So that mother-in-law suite was detached since it was on two parcels. Correct.

8:04Joe Meehan:Detached lofted apartment with a carport, separate tax parcels. Yep. So I purchased one for$3.60 and then I purchased the other for a dollar. Nice. And so that's kind of like what really helped me moving forward because then I fixed the mother-in-law suite up, rented it and put a HELOC on it.

8:24Brandon Turner:Oh, so smart. That is an interesting strategy, man. That's super smart. So for those of you guys that are listening, he had a single family home. It was being sold altogether. But the tax records indicated that these were on two separate parcels. And so what you were able to do, because when you go get a loan for a property that's on two parcels, sometimes it's challenging when you get that conventional or FHA loan because they only want to do one loan per parcel. And so when you're trying to buy two parcels, it can be a problem. So what you did to get creative was you did one loan for all of the purchase price on the main house.

9:05Brandon Turner:And so you were able to get traditional financing on that property. And then you basically paid cash of a dollar for the second parcel. So technically, the mother-in-law suite you own free and clear. You're paying the mortgage on the single family home. Yeah. But you supplement that mortgage with the income you get from the mother-in-law suite. That's a super cool strategy to be able to take that down. Amazing. And so what were you renting that mother-in-law suite out for?

9:33Joe Meehan:So originally$1 ,100.

9:35Brandon Turner:Okay.

9:36Joe Meehan:And I was doing long term. And then the main house was a live and flip.

9:42Brandon Turner:Oh, okay. So you were working on fixing that one out.

9:44Joe Meehan:Yeah, so I lived in that, worked on it, construction zone. And then the mother-in-law suite, I then turned into a medium term rental and did the traveling nurses and stuff like that.

9:55Brandon Turner:The cool part about structuring this financing the way you did is you can sell the single family. I don't know if you have or not, but you can still keep the completely paid off rental. Is that what you did?

10:07Joe Meehan:Yeah. So as we progress here, that's game changer. I love it. I love it. So for the next house hack, I ended up moving into that one, obviously, but I rented out that main house for about a year. And then when I left college coaching, which is mid 2022, that's when I sold it. And that allowed me to leave coaching and do what I was going to do next, which were the multiple burrs.

10:35Brandon Turner:Okay. Again, fantastic strategy because now you have the option of selling that property and keeping the rental and the rental is paid off. So that's just pure cashflow. But let's talk about the numbers on the live in flip. So how much did you end up having to spend fixing that place out?

10:49Joe Meehan:Not a ton, probably about 25 ,000, 30 ,000, maybe even less than 2025 because like most of it was just painting and drywall stuff. And, you know, it was a 3 ,200 square foot house and a lot of wood paneling. It was an old, old house. So you got to use the certain type of paint and then paint over it like four or five times. And like I said, I was working a lot of hours. I would, you know, we'd have practice at like seven o 'clock, get done at 9, 30, 10. And then I would go home and paint for an hour and try to get it done. So, yeah, it was not as much money into it as it was just sweat equity.

11:26Joe Meehan:What did you end up being able to sell it for? 420.

11:29Brandon Turner:You bought it for 360, put about 25 in it. So you're all in it for 385. And then you sold it for 420?

11:35Joe Meehan:Yeah, with about two and a half years of rent pay down. So you made, you pocketed a little bit of cash and we were able to sell that property.

11:43Brandon Turner:But the bonus is basically you house hacked your way into getting a free rental property is the way I'm looking at that. You got paid to get a free rental property. That is an amazing thing to be able to do, to buy a property on two parcels, put the loan all on one parcel, fix it up, sell that one, put a little bit of cash in your pocket, keep the rental. Plus, keep all the rents you were making at the time you were living there. So, bam, free house. That's super cool. Yeah. we're going to learn more about Joe Mian and how he's investing in buying free houses right after the break. As a real estate investor, the last thing I want to do or have time for is to play accountant, banker, and debt collector.

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13:40David Greene:You get fast quotes, flexible coverage, and protection for property damage, liability, and even loss of rental income. Now is the perfect time to review your rates and coverage. Get a quote in minutes at biggerpockets.com slash landlord insurance. Steadily, landlord insurance designed for the modern investor. Most investors spend more time chasing deals than reviewing their insurance. But a quick coverage check can be fast, easy, and one of the smartest ways to protect and even improve your property's cash flow. As the months get colder, frozen pipes, icy walkways, and seasonal wear and tear can increase the likelihood of claims.

14:16David Greene:And traditional insurance companies aren't always built to handle these claims quickly or smoothly. That's why more real estate investors are turning to steadily. They focus exclusively on landlords, whether it's a single family rental, a burr builder's risk policy, or midterm holiday guests. You get fast quotes, flexible coverage, and protection for property damage, liability, and even loss of rental income. Now is the perfect time to review your rates and coverage. Get a quote in minutes at biggerpockets.com slash landlord insurance. Steadily, landlord insurance designed for the modern investor.

14:49David Greene:Did you know your house gets bored when you leave? I can't actually prove that, but it probably misses out on the action, the footsteps, the late night fridge raids. Yeah, when you're gone, your place is basically on unpaid leave. It's sitting there in the dark thinking, I could be contributing right now. Your side room wants a side hustle. Even your Wi-Fi is like, we could be networking. You're on vacation, spending money like it's a sport, while your staircase at home is fully capable of sending your income upwards. Here's the twist. you can go on a trip and actually earn money. Airbnb makes that possible with the co-host network.

15:28David Greene:If you're away for a while or have a secondary property, you can hire a vetted local co-host with real hosting experience to handle it all. A co-host can handle guest communications. It can manage reservations and keep things running smoothly so you don't have to check your phone between beach days. That means less stress and more time enjoying your trip. You can relax knowing guests are taken care of and your place is in good hands. You travel, your house works, everyone wins. If you're ready to host but could use some help, find a co-host at airbnb.com slash host. Running your real estate business doesn't have to feel like juggling five different tools and the tools are blades or flaming torches.

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16:39Brandon Turner:All right, we're back with investor Joe and he just got finished telling us about how he essentially used house hacking to get a free rental property. But now we're gonna dive into what came next. You've done a couple of house hacks now. You've managed to be super creative with how you did both of those deals. You've got the real estate bug. So what was the next move?

16:58Joe Meehan:Yeah, so that HELOC, I was able to purchase my next house hack. I call it a house hack, but I actually had to use 20 % down normal financing on that one. So I purchased a fourplex right down the road with the HELOC, moved into that. The good thing about this one was that it had an extra lot. So the fourplex was two separate addresses, and then the separate lot had its own address as well. And it was a full lot that you can build on. So what I did a couple months after I moved in was sell the lot next to it and paid back my HELOC. So basically got that one for very little as well.

17:39Brandon Turner:That's cool. So you used the HELOC that you had on your free rental property, essentially. And did you pay all cash for the fourplex, or did you just use that for your down payment?

17:48Joe Meehan:Just the down payment. Yeah.

17:49Brandon Turner:Okay. So you went and got a conventional loan, put 20 % down, you use the HELOC for your 20 % down. But because the quad flex had an additional lot, you were able to sell the additional lot to essentially pay back the money to your HELOC. And tell us about that. What were you able to sell that for?

18:07Joe Meehan:The additional lot was about 3540. So it didn't cover 100 % of the down payment, but a good portion of it. This is great.

18:17Brandon Turner:This is great. And I know people are listening, thinking like, man, this guy got lucky and just found all this property with all this additional value. But that's not necessarily the case, guys. This is actually something you can look for. So for those of you who are listening who are like, man, this seems cool. It's a great way to start of supplement your investing. You can actually do this. I do this when I'm buying off market, but you can also do it on market. You can have your realtor search for properties that are available that come with additional lots. So sometimes in the description, they might say that, hey, this property has an additional lot, or sometimes there's multiple parcel numbers that are tied to properties that are on the market.

18:56Brandon Turner:So just tell your agent what you're looking for. You want to buy a property that has additional lots. So that gives you options. I do this all the time. I've purchased several deals that come with additional lots and I've structured them in all kinds of cool ways. But I usually always structure it to where all of the money for the deal comes from the property with the house on it so that the additional parcel I end up getting to keep when I sell the property. And now I have free and clear land and it gives you the option to do things like just like what Joe did. You can either sell that land. So I bought a duplex that had an additional lot.

19:33Brandon Turner:I did the same thing. I had to put 20 percent down. And so I put the 20 % down and then I actually ended up calling a builder because I saw that right next to my lot was a brand new construction home. So I called the builder who built that house and said, I've got a lot right next to one you already built. What would you pay me for? They told me 15 grand. I said, great. I bought the property and I sold him the lot on closing day for 15 grand and that covered my down payment. right? And so I've also done it to where I didn't sell a lot and I'm building a house on one of the lots that I have, the free lots that I have right now.

20:08Brandon Turner:So I'm doing my first new construction project. And so you can keep the lots, you can build on them, you can sell the lots, or sometimes you can even increase your sale value on your property by offering the lot to whoever buys your flip. And you can say, Hey, I'll sell you, you know, you're buying the house for, you know, $250 or whatever. If you throw in another$20 ,000, I'll sell you the lot next door. And then all of a sudden you're getting more profit. So these are things that you can look for. Just make sure you tell your agent in your search that you're looking for properties with additional parcels, man.

20:38Brandon Turner:That's super cool, Joe. So you bought this quadplex. Tell us the numbers. What did you pay for the quadplex and did it need work? If so, how much?

20:45Joe Meehan:Yeah. So I purchased for$260 ,000. Like it was in good shape. It wasn't in great shape. It was just some painting here and there though. Nothing major. I guess the biggest part about it was they had tenants that were in there for a long time and were paying like$350 for rent, like crazy numbers. So that was like similar to the first duplex. I just knew like, okay, I'm not going to kick them out or raise the rent. But like when the time comes when they want to leave, like it's going to be a really good deal. So the rents right now are$900,$900,$700. And then I do one of them is a medium term. The one I used to live in, I changed it into a medium term and that one's$1 ,295.

21:28Joe Meehan:And then it has a garage in the back for$400.

21:32Brandon Turner:That's$4 ,100 a month coming in on this property. What's your mortgage on it?

21:36Joe Meehan:About$1 ,500.

21:39Brandon Turner:Hey, I don't know if you're doing the math, folks, but I call that a deal. Awesome, man. Awesome. So this was one that was just listed on the market as well?

21:48Joe Meehan:Yeah. And it had been sitting there for a little bit, just like the other ones. So I guess if you see the bright light at the end, others aren't, just have confidence in closing on the deal.

22:00Brandon Turner:I like this story, Joe, because it's more of a story where it's like one deal at a time. And each deal has its own unique characteristics. And you were able to capitalize on each deal. individually. People want to rinse and repeat formula. They want to be able to go find X, add Y, sell it for Z. But it doesn't always work like that. Sometimes each deal is a little different and the way you have to capitalize or monetize on those properties can be a little different. And I want people to hear a story like this because what people should really be focused on is, can you go out and get that first deal?

22:37Brandon Turner:Can you go out and get that next deal? And then look at the deal you have, look at the financial situation that you're in, and then monetize that deal in the way that makes the most sense for the property and for your financial situation. And then you can focus on what comes next. This is more of the story of an everyday investor. We don't all need to go out and build a portfolio of 50 to 100 doors, rinse and repeat, but you can do this one deal at a time. And it sounds like each deal got increasingly better in terms of how you were able to financially capitalize on it. And so this is super cool.

23:12Brandon Turner:So you were living in one of the units, you midterm rented. So that's three house hacks. Boom, boom, boom. Love it. And then after the three house hacks, you then pivoted. It sounds like that's when you focused on birds. So what did that look like to you?

23:26Joe Meehan:Yeah. So this is kind of coincided with my departure from college basketball. So it's kind of hitting that burnout of crazy hours, not sleeping in your bed a whole lot of days throughout the week. And it just started to get to me a little bit. And so...

23:41Brandon Turner:It's funny how things at work start to get to you a little bit once you start making a little bit of money in real estate. It didn't bother you working 90 hours a week making$10 ,000 a year when you didn't have a backup plan. But now that we got a little bit of real estate money, we're like, I don't know about all this work stuff.

23:58Joe Meehan:Yeah, I blame it on bigger pockets. Now you're thinking about financial freedom, this and that cash flow. And you're like, why am I working 90 hours a week?

24:09Brandon Turner:That tune changed. OK. Yeah, yeah.

24:11Joe Meehan:But yeah, it just reached a point where like, because you literally get no days off, maybe a couple out throughout the year. So it's pretty crazy. It was a great experience. But, you know, for me, just at that juncture, it was like, all right, it's time. And so that's when I was like, all right, I'll try to do real estate full time. Got my license and then found my first BRRRR in New Jersey.

24:33Brandon Turner:Why New Jersey? Why change markets?

24:35Joe Meehan:So I'm from the Philly area. And if you're from the Philly area, typically for vacation, you go to the Jersey Shore, the South Jersey Shore. Not the North Jersey, the South Jersey Shore. Big difference. I just knew the area, could see there weren't a lot of rentals. The properties were cheaper, but the rents were still pretty good. It's a good place for a burr.

24:55Brandon Turner:OK, so you leveraged your kind of insider knowledge about visiting the Jersey Shore and realizing that there wasn't a lot of opportunity for rentals. And with your newfound experience as a real estate investor, you said, I'm going to go capitalize on that. But it's great to have the idea. But what did the actual application look like? What did you find? What did you buy? What did it cost?

25:18Joe Meehan:Yes, I had a really good relationship with my realtor there. I ended up finding a bank owned for about$110 ,000, I think the purchase price was. Single family and it was in shambles. It was in really bad shape.

25:32Brandon Turner:So you found an REO, a bank owned property, but it was on the market? Did your agent bring it to you? Okay, got it. Yeah.

25:39Joe Meehan:And so I walked through it and was like, let's give it a go.

25:43Brandon Turner:What year was this?

25:44Joe Meehan:This is 2022 in September of 2022.

25:47Brandon Turner:Okay, about four years ago. Bank owned property. Got it for$100 ,000. Man, that's pretty impressive. How much did it cost to fix it?

25:54Joe Meehan:About another hundred.

25:56Brandon Turner:Oh, wow. Okay. I assume you weren't the one putting in the work on this one.

26:00Joe Meehan:So I was partially.

26:06Joe Meehan:So like I was still technically living in Lewisburg at that fourplex, but I had a friend who lived down there at the Jersey Shore. And so I would go back and forth like two, three weeks at a time and work on the house myself. And then I had a contractor who would do the more serious stuff, the electrical, the plumbing, the kitchen renovation. But three, four months of sweat equity on that house. Just again, like I had left my W-2.

26:36Brandon Turner:You had time. You had time.

26:38Joe Meehan:I had time. I'm like, I might as well try to save some money here. Like my contractor doesn't need to do the, you know, break down the floors and all that. I'll just do it for free.

26:47Brandon Turner:Well, not completely for free. How long of a drive is it?

26:51Joe Meehan:About four hours.

26:52Brandon Turner:Four hours each way?

26:53Joe Meehan:Yeah.

26:54Brandon Turner:So you were driving eight hours stints there and back to do a little bit of work. For the record, folks, this is definitely not free work. That's gas money. That's time. That's effort. Yes, saves on the bottom line for the P &L, but definitely will weigh on your emotional battery and your spiritual battery and your financial battery because that still does cost some money. But awesome. Still, you were able to pull it off. You spent about$100 ,000. And was this a short-term rental? Was it a mid-term rental? Was it a long-term rental? What's the scoop? Long-term.

27:25Joe Meehan:So that was one of the big things for this area too, is that it's a lot of short-term with it being a vacation area. And so the long-term rental was the part that was missing in the area in my evaluation.

27:39Brandon Turner:So how did it go? Did the numbers work? Yeah.

27:42Joe Meehan:So this one ended up appraising for$290 ,000. And so that's about a$203 ,000 loan.

27:47Brandon Turner:So you pulled all your money out.

27:49Joe Meehan:Yeah. I mean, that's like the whole goal of the BRRRR, right? The infinity ROI. Yeah. So yeah, the first one ended up, it was up, down, up, down, up, down, but ended up working out pretty well.

28:01Brandon Turner:Okay. So you're able to pull all your cash back out. Is the property covering itself in terms of what it rents for? Yeah.

28:08Joe Meehan:So this one, it has a pretty good rental on it. So it's$2 ,600.

28:12Brandon Turner:Oh, wow. That's awesome.

28:13Joe Meehan:Yeah. And believe it or not, it's at a 9.25 % interest rate. What?

28:19Brandon Turner:Why haven't you refinanced that thing again? I've been waiting.

28:22Joe Meehan:We can get to that, but I've been waiting.

28:24Brandon Turner:If you're making money at 9.25%, what do you see the seven and a half you're going to get when you refinance that? Yeah.

28:30Joe Meehan:Goodness, man. Yeah. So the margin is about$2 ,000.

28:34Brandon Turner:Yeah. Yeah. Good. So you're covering. You're covering. It's probably about a breakeven property when you consider maintenance. That's pretty cool. All right, Joe, I want to know if you were able to pull this off again. Great way to find a property in a market that needs some long-term rental. So we'll dive into that right after the break.

28:49David Greene:Most investors spend more time chasing deals than reviewing their insurance. But a quick coverage check can be fast, easy, and one of the smartest ways to protect and even improve your property's cash flow. As the months get colder, frozen pipes, icy walkways, and seasonal wear and tear can increase the likelihood of claims. And traditional insurance companies aren't always built to handle these claims quickly or smoothly. That's why more real estate investors are turning too steadily. They focus exclusively on landlords, whether it's a single family rental, a BRRRR builder's risk policy, or midterm holiday guests.

29:24David Greene:You get fast quotes, flexible coverage, and protection for property damage, liability, and even loss of rental income. Now is the perfect time to review your rates and coverage. Get a quote in minutes at biggerpockets.com slash landlord insurance. Steadily, landlord insurance designed for the modern investor. If you own a short-term rental, here's something worth knowing. Not all landlord policies are built for your type of property. And with holiday bookings, chilly weather, and higher guest turnover, having the right coverage is more important than ever. Steadily offers insurance designed specifically for short-term rentals, covering property damage, liability, lost rental income, and even unexpected issues like bedbugs.

30:03David Greene:Steadily works exclusively with real estate investors, so they understand the details that make short-term rentals unique and they build coverage to match it. A quick review of your rates and coverage every year can help you protect your property and your cashflow. Get a quote in minutes at biggerpockets.com slash landlord insurance. Steadily, rental property insurance for the modern investor. Did you know your house gets bored when you leave? I can't actually prove that, but it probably misses out on the action, the footsteps, the late night fridge raids. Yeah, when you're gone, your place is basically on unpaid leave.

30:37David Greene:It's sitting there in the dark thinking, I could be contributing right now. Your side room wants a side hustle. Even your Wi-Fi is like, we could be networking. You're on vacation, spending money like it's a sport, while your staircase at home is fully capable of sending your income upwards. Here's the twist. You can go on a trip and actually earn money. Airbnb makes that possible with the co-host network. If you're away for a while or have a secondary property, you can hire a vetted local co-host with real hosting experience to handle it all. A co-host can handle guest communications. It can manage reservations and keep things running smoothly so you don't have to check your phone between beach days.

31:19David Greene:That means less stress and more time enjoying your trip. You can relax knowing guests are taken care of and your place is in good hands. You travel, your house works, everyone wins. If you're ready to host but could use some help, find a co-host at airbnb.com slash host. What if your CRM actually did the hard work for you? I know, crazy. ReSimply lets you pull seller lists, skip trace them at no cost, and contact your leads by call or text without bouncing between apps. Then it's AI agents take over. Answering calls, following up automatically, even grading your conversations so you can focus on the deals that matter.

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32:58Brandon Turner:All right, we're back with investor Joe, who found another great niche of burring rental properties in a vacation rental market. So you did your first one, pulled all your cash out on the refinance. So you executed a full burr. Did you find more or was that the only one you were able to do?

33:16Joe Meehan:Yeah. So up until this date, I've done two more in New Jersey and then one in North Carolina because that's where I live now.

33:23Brandon Turner:And how did you find these properties? All just on market. All on market deals. Just evaluating on market.

33:30Joe Meehan:Yep.

33:30Brandon Turner:Okay. So you did two more in Jersey. Were the numbers similar? Similar price points? Similar? Are these heavy renovations? Yeah.

33:37Joe Meehan:Again, heavy renovations. The second one, purchased$190, put about$120 in, appraised for$425. So the loan value at$315.

33:48Brandon Turner:What's the interest rate on that one?

33:50Joe Meehan:Not good. $8.25. Okay.

33:52Brandon Turner:Okay. Okay. Another one ready for another refinance? Yeah. The time's coming, I hope. Did you pull your money out with that one as well, or did you leave some in?

34:00Joe Meehan:I took it out with that one again. All right.

34:02Brandon Turner:Two for two on the full burrs. All right. And the next one, tell me about it.

34:06Joe Meehan:So the next one sequentially was actually the one in North Carolina. I live on a Lake Norman area, one of the lesser expensive towns in Lake Norman, and found a good deal and just did another burr there that that worked out pretty well. And it's rented right now. I'm ready to go. So did that one and then did one more up in Jersey from afar. Another big renovation, purchased for$285, put about$90 in, appraised for$455. And that one still has, I left some in that one.

34:40Brandon Turner:You left some cash in that one. Okay. What year was that?

34:42Joe Meehan:That was last year, 2025.

34:44Brandon Turner:2025. Okay. I mean, even a partial bird in the year 2025, the year of real estate butt kickings, because a lot of people got their butt kicked in 2025. If you still executed a bird, pulled some of your money out, I'd say you're doing okay. Man, I love this story. I think it's just a good story of using the knowledge and expertise that you have, taking meaningful action, taking every deal on its merit, and then leveraging some creative strategies to help you continue to finance your real estate investments. One thing that I wanted to ask you about is now that you are a full-time real estate investor and you've left the coaching world behind, what is it that you're focused on now?

35:24Brandon Turner:What is real estate allowing you to be able to do?

35:26Joe Meehan:Yeah. And like we touched on earlier, it has allowed me to pursue what's really been my passion for a long time and that's human health and helping people in general. And so I started a company called Optima Vita, and it's a health consulting firm that both helps people one-on-one client services and does partnerships with companies and specifically real estate companies to help provide educational workshops online to their employees and agents, and then can help work with them one-on-one as well.

35:59Brandon Turner:This is the stuff that I love about real estate investing. Real estate does not have to be your passion, but it can absolutely provide income for you so that you can go focus on your passion and do the thing that you're called to do and not the thing that you have to do for money. And I think a lot of us have passion projects or things that we'd want to be able to focus on. And sometimes we just can't. A, because we have a job, we've got to go work 90 hours a week for, right? Or because starting a business is hard. And sometimes it takes a few years before you're profitable. And, you know, some people just can't afford to be taking a loss for a few years.

36:39Brandon Turner:But if you have real estate as a foundation where you know that's going to provide you the income you need to feed yourselves and feed your family, then you can start these passion project businesses and give them the appropriate time and effort that they need, whether they're profitable or not on the front side, that you get to pursue your passion and do the thing you care about. So it's super cool that you're able to leverage real estate to help you pursue something that you're passionate about. And the thing that you're passionate about is helping people be healthier, which is amazing. Amazing story.

37:10Brandon Turner:Thank you, Joe.

37:11Joe Meehan:Thank you.

37:11Brandon Turner:Before we get out of here, Joe, just kind of give us the story. Where are you now? How many units are you up to? Are you still buying or are you just kind of done with real estate? You're going to focus on paying them off and work on Optima Vita. Yeah.

37:24Joe Meehan:So right now I'm sitting at 11 units and I have probably about five properties with higher interest rates, but also equity. So the next step is kind of a refi across the portfolio, bring the interest rate down, cash flow up, and then take some money out and then evaluate. wait, where should I redeploy? Should I go back into my one to four units? Should I try a BRRRR? Should I try something else? AI is pretty important these days, apparently. But like real estate wise, that's where I'm at.

37:59Brandon Turner:I love it, man. Thank you so much, Joe, for coming on the BiggerPockets podcast and sharing this story. Hopefully, you guys listening, we're inspired by this. We're inspired by somebody who is in a position that maybe a lot of you are in, maybe not making the kind of money you want to be making, maybe spending a whole lot of time working in those hours, but still was able to purchase real estate and use real estate to truly obtain enough freedom so that you can focus on the thing that you're passionate about. And I think that that's really what everybody wants to do is they want to be able to live life on their own terms.

38:37Brandon Turner:And Joe's story really is a testament to that. So thank you so much, Joe. Thank you so much to everybody listening. Also, if you want to hear another story like Joe's, then check out episode 1078 with Connor Anderson. He's another young investor who started with a series of house hacks and totally transformed his financial future. That's BiggerPockets podcast episode 1078. We'll link it right here on YouTube too. Thank you everybody for watching. We'll see you on the next episode.

39:04David Greene:Thank you all for listening to the BiggerPockets real estate podcast. Make sure you You get all our new episodes by subscribing on YouTube, Apple, Spotify, or any other podcast platform. Our new episodes come out Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. I'm the host and executive producer of the show, Dave Meyer. The show is produced by Ian Kay. Copywriting is by Calico Content, and editing is by Exodus Media. If you'd like to learn more about real estate investing or to sign up for our free newsletter, please visit www.biggerpockets.com. The content of this podcast is for informational purposes only. All host and participant opinions are their own.

39:37David Greene:Investment in any asset, real estate included, involves risk. So use your best judgment and consult with qualified advisors before investing. You should only risk capital you can afford to lose. And remember, past performance is not indicative of future results. BiggerPockets LLC disclaims all liability for direct, indirect, consequential, or other damages arising from a reliance on information presented in this podcast. Attention, passive real estate investors, make sure you have the Passive Pocket Summit on your calendar. Better yet, plan on attending it in Denver, Colorado, from April 30th to May 2nd.

40:04David Greene:This conference is built exclusively for the LP or limited partner. It's a great place to network and talk current deals and current strategies for accredited investors investing in real estate deals right now. Go to PassivePockets.com forward slash summit for all the details and use a coupon code podcast to save you$50. Hope to see you in Denver.