ChatGPT-5 Chooses the Right Model For You - DTNSB 5077

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0:36The Cologuard test is non-invasive, requires no special prep or time off, and you start screening right from your home. It's just three simple steps. Set up, sample, and ship. If you're 45 or older and at average risk, ask your doctor about the Cologuard test. Available by prescription only. Learn more or request a prescription at Cologuard.com slash podcast. Hi, I'm Angie Hicks, co-founder of Angie. And one thing I've learned is that you buy a house, but you make it a home. Because with every fix, update, and renovation, it becomes a little more your own. So you need all your jobs done well. For nearly 30 years, Angie has helped millions of homeowners hire skilled pros for the projects that matter.

1:17From plumbing to electrical, roof repair to deck upgrades. So leave it to the pros who will get your jobs done well. Angie, the one you trust to find the ones you trust. Find a pro for your project at Angie.com.

1:56The show breaks it all down in a way that's clear, engaging, and actually enjoyable to listen to. Hosts Neil Freiman and Toby Howell make the show feel like you're catching up with two friends while giving you the context you need to feel smarter and more confident throughout your day. New episodes drop every weekday wherever you get your podcasts. Tune into Morning Brew Daily wherever you get your podcasts. This is the Daily Tech News for Thursday, August 7th, 2025. We tell you what you need to know, follow up in the context of those stories, and help each other. today dr nikki tells us by putting wires in mouse eyes is helpful for the mice and and us and open ai announces a long-awaited release of chat gpt5 yeah late breaking news there i'm jason howell i went to it now let's start with what you need to know with the big story yeah so after a whole lot of leaks and waiting i think there was even a like a leaked blog post on on GitHub earlier this morning.

2:54So I was like, okay, it's going to happen. OpenAI has finally officially announced its new flagship model, ChatGPT5. So they're not messing around with any O's or anything like that attached to four or whatever they've done in the past. This is like a very major next step. Users of every subscription level will gain access to this. And it's actually quite interesting how they're doing this. GPT-5 arrives as a single unified model inside of ChatGPT. There's a behind-the-scenes kind of mechanism that's at work that automatically switches to enhanced reasoning and other modes based on the complexity of a given task.

3:38So you can say goodbye to the model picker approach. If you use ChatGPT, it can be a little confusing, like picking the right model. Now, apparently, you don't need to do that once this actually rolls out. So even free users, along with this, are going to gain access to some of ChatGPT's advanced reasoning capabilities, that for the first time, because of the kind of more advanced way that this operates behind the scenes. So that's pretty cool. CEO Sam Altman announced the new model during a live streamed event. Actually, to be completely frank, it's still going on right now. So this, like I said, is late breaking news.

4:14He calls it, quote, the best model in the world. Of course he does. For coding, writing, and tasks, Altman said the new tech, quote, really feels like talking to an expert on any topic like a PhD-level expert. Way to talk it up. Open AI also stresses improvements in safety with a 45 % drop in hallucinations compared to GPT-4.0. All users can begin to use GPT-5. Starting today, paid users will gain access to higher use limits, more advanced versions. Yes, that does include the$200 per month version that basically just takes all the reins off of it and says, go nuts, go crazy. What do you think, Wynn?

4:59And are you a user slash fan slash curiosity digger of GPT? And what do you think of five? I'm definitely a curiosity digger. I do like the idea very much that from a user perspective, I do like the idea that they're trying to make this a little more accessible by taking the switching out of it. Because that's always been, I think, one of the most unapproachable parts of it is that there are so many different models. And so I think it makes a lot of sense for them from a user empathy perspective to try to just like align it. And I like the idea that the AI is picking itself in a sense, like picking which member of the team is bestest for the task.

5:37I am always very skeptical about someone telling me in 2025 that it feels like talking to an expert on the topic, like a PhD level expert. So I will say it definitely probably feels that way. And I think that's something that all of these models are very good at is making you feel ways about things. um i think actually i think nick turley is it nick turley the head of chat gpt said what was it hold on nick turley head of gp chat gpt said the vibes of this model are really good um and we rate the vibes as good i so i i think to probably be as positive as i can that that is something that that they're very very good at and that they have it in in and there's a lot of validity to this is, yeah, to make the vibes good.

6:29That's part of a good user experience. That's part of helping people use the tool, you know, like in a certain way. And that helps people's, I guess, success with a tool, depending on how you mark success by, yeah, making the vibes good. Like, like, what does that mean though? What does it mean? Make the vibes good? Like I have a general sense of, of vibes. And then of course there's vibe coding, which is another kind of aspect of things. Is he talking just more like a feeling? Like a, oh, this feels good to use this. I feel like I'm talking to a machine that actually has my back or knows where I'm coming from.

7:06Is that what he means by that? I assume so because I'm trying to be positive because I really don't. I'm extremely skeptical that it may feel like talking to an expert. is it actually like talking to an expert no way like this is what bothers me a little this is the kind of thing that bothers me and of course we know that sam altman is going to like hype up you know chat gpt that's not a surprise i don't even necessarily blame him for it or anything but um i it's it's i also thought of maybe being cynical like the best model in the world for coding and writing tasks like that might be true but overall i still at least for my job and again maybe I'm biased because it's my job and I don't want to lose it to AI.

7:46I don't think we're there that I don't think we're at PhD level expert. It may feel like it, it might have the vibes of a PhD, but it certainly doesn't have like an actual degree in coding. And this is from personal experience this week. So, I mean, I'm very happy for user experience improvements and, and for people to try these things for like simple things. But I really think they're overselling it when it comes to this PhD level expert at stuff. I mean, anytime they say something like that, yeah, the hairs on my neck stand up a little bit. I mean, these are the people who are in control of these things.

8:19As I was kind of putting this together, it was like, it's better at, you know, all of these tasks. It's better at reasoning. It's better at coding, writing, blah, blah, blah. I'm just like, this is, and I think I've even said this on AI Inside at times, like, it's the greatest hits of new model is released, right? Like, they all say that. And it's true. It's kind of like when a new Pixel phone comes out and Google says it's the best Pixel we've ever made. Well, damn well better be because it's your latest one. So, you know, like they're not going to release one that's worse than the previous one.

8:52So I just take that as a given. And it just kind of feels like, you know, the fluffy things that CEOs who want you to buy their products say. when you start throwing around PhD level expert, like I sort of get where you're coming from, but I think it ties into the over promise kind of behavior, let's say that we see a lot in AI, which is that they're all talking about how these things, how super intelligence is right around the corner. And our model is the best representation and reason, you know, to show you that it is. And yet, you know, I can't get an agentic browser to like, close a tab when I say do that, you know, it closes the wrong one or whatever.

9:36Like they get things incredibly wrong. So can they synthesize information and organize it in a way that maybe a PhD level expert might be able to do? Can they explain a complicated theory or, or concepts in a way that I now understand where I didn't before? Sure. They can do all these things, but to basically kind of liken it to a PhD, I think is far overselling it based on what we as humans know when we meet someone who is PhD level and what their expertise actually is. I think they're just two different things. It's like comparing apples to oranges. Yeah. I think the subtle thing here is like perception.

10:15And I think right now, because these LLMs are so good at seeming to be conscious that's seeming to understand like really understand you saying the right thing saying the right thing and that's kind of built into how they're made like yes part of their they're made to make you feel yes and and like i mean on to be honest like yeah there's actually something substantive in nick turley saying the vibes are really good because honestly like this it's like an old person using vibes but like no honestly this is what they're good at is the vibes And I mean that in like the most sincere way, but the vibes are not good and are not good enough.

10:54You know, like it's one thing to make you feel like you got a good answer that made you feel that you're talking to something, something. But it's all about perception. And I feel like there's so many things that that right now it's really cool. It's really like solidifying to me that a lot of this is about that perception. and I don't think they're going to stop trying to sell us this perception of this like you know like super intelligence but and it's weird because I think the more they say it the more it keeps getting picked up like I think I read a fortune I guess your mind might vary on on like you know insert x publication but I read like this fortune article really quick that said oh you know well generally um you know AI is really good at coding and I was just like no it's not but But I do understand, though, why that's the perception that, you know, obviously Fortune, not an engineering magazine.

11:42But I understand why that has come around because they just keep pushing the vibes. And I guess now in 2025, there's a lot of vibe-based culture. And that the perception is like, hey, that there's something substantive there. But it's driving me crazy. But yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And also define really good. Like really good could mean a million different things. is it really good at creating a block of code? Well, yeah, it is. It is really good at creating a block of code. Is it really good at creating a great, you know, no errors whatsoever, you know, succinct and, you know, all of these complicated aspects of coding that developers are in fact really good at because they've been trained.

12:23And, you know, I think they're getting better at that, but I don't think they're at the same level. But they sure really want you to believe that they They really want you to buy licenses for it. Like I, I literally this week, and this is not chat GPT, but I was using Claude to do something that is extremely simple, but boring. Like I had basically some texts and I wanted to say, Hey, write an object that is this text. It's like the simplest thing ever. It's like literally something that I just kind of compared like, okay, color equals red. I'm typing in color equals red over here. All right. The next thing says like animal, like type equals dog.

12:57I put it's like, it literally just like, it's very wrote. It's like the most basic thing that I have to do every day. And I asked Cloud to do it. And it took me

13:03Huyen Tue Dao: 20 minutes to do it when it should have taken me five. And I was like, you know, this should be the kind of thing that it's good at. And there were, it's weird because there were certain things that it was smart at. I was like, well, there's compile errors in this. And it knew enough to like, oh, let me run this and see what the errors are and try to fix them. And it's so weird because it's, it's like, it's so good at certain things. Like, again, I speak to it in natural language. It gets what I'm saying. It tries to take steps to fix it, but something is missing. And, and yeah, impressive. It's impressive, but it might be just vibes still.

13:33Sorry. I mean, 50 % vibes, which I guess, I don't know if I can live off of 50 % vibes. No, I don't think anyone can live off of 50 % vibe. All this to say, by the way, like the event is still going on. I've been checking my chat GPT or sorry, my open AI chat GPT account, you know, cause I am a paid to what, not$200 per month user, but a$20 per month user. It has not appeared on my account yet. None of this is to say that I'm not interested slash intrigued slash a little excited to play around with it because I do use ChatGPT for a lot of different things. So I'm very, very curious, but I'm also like, you know, like we've been talking about a little skeptical when they start throwing around PhD.

14:16So there's that. All right. Well, we don't need vibes because DTNS has wonderful listeners because we are made possible by you. The listeners, thanks to Tony Glass, Philip Less, Howard Yermich and we want to welcome a new patron Nilesh. Thank you so much for being here. Yeah, welcome.

14:55work can gather team feedback from Slack and use it to suggest updates to a project brief in Google Docs. You stay in control reviewing the draft and deciding what moves forward. Put ChatGPT to work on your most ambitious ideas and projects. Get started at chatgpt.com by selecting work mode. Available on Plus and Pro plans. This message is brought to you by Coligard. If you recorded songs off the radio for a mixtape, it might be time to screen for colon cancer. The Cologuard test is non-invasive, requires no special prep or time off, and you start screening right from your home. It's just three simple steps, set up, sample, and ship.

15:37If you're 45 or older and at average risk, ask your doctor about the Cologuard test, available by prescription only. Learn more or request a prescription at colaguard.com slash podcast. Hey guys, it's Drew Afualo from the comment section. Listen, It's time to stop settling for hair products that just don't work. With all the prestige brands at Sephora, upgrading your routine is easy. If your hair needs repair, they've got the K18 Leave-In Molecular Repair Hair Mask. If you're trying to level up your wash day, the Kerastase Elixir All-Time Hair Oil leaves your hair looking ridiculously shiny without feeling heavy.

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16:51Angie, the one you trust to find the ones you trust. Find a pro for your project at Angie.com. Summer's supposed to be the easy season. So why are so many people quietly Googling a therapist between summer Fridays? Because more daylight doesn't fix the hard stuff. Sometimes it just turns the volume up. Grow does therapy differently. Grow connects you with thousands of high-quality licensed therapists across the U.S., offering both virtual and in-person sessions, nights and weekends. There are no subscriptions, no long-term commitments. You just pay per session. Grow helps you find therapy on your time.

17:27The therapist you want takes your insurance on Grow. Grow accepts over 125 insurance plans. Sessions average$21 with insurance, and some pay as little as$0, depending on their plan. Visit growtherapy.com slash ACAST today to get started. That's growtherapy.com slash ACAST. growtherapy.com slash ACAST. Availability and coverage vary by state and insurance plan. All right, there's more we need to know today. Let's get to the briefs. All right, well, Google has launched its AI coding agent, Jules, after a beta that began early this year at Google I.O. So it's powered by Gemini 2.5 Pro and acts as an asynchronous tool that integrates very closely, or sorry, integrates closely with GitHub.

18:16It can also spin up Google Cloud virtual machines and fix or update code bases autonomously. The asynchronous nature means it can operate in the background, unlike other coding tools that require developers to be present for each step or prompt. And the full release includes structured subscription tiers that includes a free intro plan with a daily task limit and two paid plans with much higher limits. didn't hear anything about phd in that one um what do you think do you trust a jules bot to do the thing while you walk away and grab a coffee because it's often the the background kind of doing the thing you don't have to be there and babysit it i mean that's fine because like honestly having sat through it like there's not a lot to do when it's doing its thing so that's fair um i do think that the thing that that i do worry well okay sorry so i think what's important though is that when it's done, it kind of checks in with you.

19:13I don't know if I... So it kind of depends on what it is. If it's something like immediate, like I have a new problem, I'm trying to solve it right now, and then it takes time to do the thing in the background. Sure, that's fine. I wonder if this has a lot to do with kind of more things that we do already automate now. Like that could be like kind of running tests, like long suites of testing, other things like that. Like I, I kind of need to know more about how it works, but I don't necessarily mind that it's asynchronous. Like a lot of stuff we do is, and it allows it. And I guess like the, the positive thing here is that it would allow a developer to multitask.

19:51So maybe we have Jules doing something that, you know, we could do, but it's pretty like rote and like boring. And then we can kind of go off, have meetings, plan architecture, and then Jules comes back. I think that's like, that's not a bad idea, honestly. But we'll have to wait and see. But yes, I'm glad to see no mentions of any kind of degrees at PhD or otherwise. Not yet. Not yet. No, it's implied. It's implied in the vibe. More details have been shared since Apple's announcement yesterday of a$100 billion investment in U.S. manufacturing. So I thought I'd kind of touch in on this. I know Tom and gang talked a little bit about this when it was fresh.

20:27Apple announced it will manufacture all iPhone and Apple Watch cover glass at Corning's Harrodsburg, Kentucky facility. Apple says that 100 % of Apple devices cover glass will, as a result, be made in the U.S. for the first time. So there's that. Samsung also is going to be working with Apple to produce advanced digital image sensors in Apple's upcoming iPhones at its semiconductor plant in Texas as well. So this announcement mentioned the launch of, quote, an innovative new technology for making chips, which has never been used before anywhere in the world, end quote. So, yeah, just a little bit more detail around what it means when Apple says it's going to be having such major investment in U.S.

21:15manufacturing. This is kind of the starting point. This is what it looks like. And, I mean, producing all the blasts for Apple's iPhone and Apple Watches, that's not insignificant. That's a pretty big deal. As someone who's not, you know, political analysis is not my job. I can't help but feel like this is tied to tariffs. No, absolutely it is. The T word. And on that note, rather, the president of the U.S. announced Wednesday that he might impose a 100 percent tariff on semiconductor imports with exemptions for some companies like Apple and TSMC. The president often announces numbers that later change because you might know 100 percent is quite a big percent.

21:58And the number of exemptions to the rule may limit its impact, although one company looks like it might find it hard to get an exemption. Yeah, today was one of those days when I opened up TechMeme. I was like, man, there's a lot of politics. So how are we going to do this? Well, the president of the U.S. also wrote on True Social Thursday, the CEO of Intel is highly conflicted and must resign immediately. There is no other solution to this problem. That's a full quote there. Well, Intel's CEO is Lip Bhutan. He has served on Intel's board since 2022. He took over as CEO on March 12th this year.

22:37Tan also serves on the boards of Hewlett Packard Enterprise, Schneider Electric, and SoftBank. He was born in Malaysia. He went to school in Singapore and attended graduate school in the U.S. in the 1970s. And now he is a U.S. citizen. He lives in Piedmont, California, here in the Bay Area where I live. He's Presbyterian, has served on the board of Evangelical Christian Colleges. All right. So that's a little bit of background. He founded Walden International Investments, which has invested in many Chinese semiconductor companies. Now, Tan received a letter in 2023 raising concerns about those investments from the Select Committee on the Chinese Communist Party.

23:18Earlier this week, U.S. Senator Tom Cotton sent a letter to Intel's board asking questions about those investments and Tan's 12-year term as CEO of chip design company Cadence Designs. They actually sold products to China's National University of Defense Technology. Well, Cadence pleaded guilty in July to violating U.S. export controls. Intel has been cutting costs, recently delayed several projects, including the building of factories in the U.S. And other companies like TSMC, Samsung, and most recently Apple have announced those expansions of investment, one of which we were, or two of which actually that we were just talking about here in the U.S.

24:04So that's a little bit of background there. Big thank you to Tom Merritt for helping me synthesize this and get some coordination and collection around how these stories intertwine and play because it's a little challenging to kind of follow along. But at least that gives you a little bit more background on what that actually means. All right. Well, Japan recently passed the Smartphone Act, which requires Apple to lift its longstanding ban on third-party browser engines by December 2025. So it is this year. This will prevent Apple from requiring competitors in the browser space to use Apple's WebKit engine, something that many of the browsers in question will not do since they can't control or modify it.

24:47The law not only bans outright blocks, it also demands equal access to OS APIs for third-party browsers. Users in Japan will soon see a choice screen when setting up new devices as this law goes into effect by December 2025. Similar rules are coming into force in the EU and the UK in 2026. That'll be interesting. You know, once again, anytime I see stories like this, I'm like, okay, what does this mean for the wider swath of the world? We've got these very specific regions that have these requirements and that the whole landscape is getting more and more complicated for companies like Apple to kind of create different localized versions of what they're doing in different places.

25:31Of course, Apple would love for everything, for its iPhones to operate the same way in all different places. Now it's starting to get kind of splintered and broken up in these ways. Meanwhile, I think this is really great for users, right? Like users, you know, we come from the land of down Android and where a lot of this stuff has kind of been there more or less since the beginning. So I think we take it for granted. But, you know, on iOS, you are really limited to that WebKit engine. Some people might argue that that's a good thing for safety and for security. Others, you know, I think from a choice perspective, like give me the choice.

26:10Allow me to make the choice. So I see this is a good thing. Yeah, it's always a tenuous thing, right? Because obviously, there's a good degree of trust that you can have in WebKit Engine for a lot of the basics, like you said, security and privacy, because we do know that Apple focuses on it. But to some point, and I know sometimes I'm critical of this, but at some point, yes, that does prevent innovation, that does prevent competitors in the space, and it does prevent people from trying different ways. and of course then you always have to kind of re-evaluate like a new player in the space like are they malware or are they realware?

26:43I don't know what the opposite of malware is but it does I do think over a long period of time this kind of control does limit options and thereby might actually and does in fact kind of stifle innovation or at least a different way of doing things which is not always a bad thing and often a good thing so I'm also excited as a developer so yay Yay. The Framework Desktop, we all know Framework, right? It's a company that is really dedicated and devoted to repairability. And the desktop version or kind of variant of their efforts, apparently the reviews embargo lifted this morning because there were a bunch of reviews that suddenly hit.

27:22Their new modular approach to desktop PC builds is being generally praised for its compact size. There's a powerful AMD Ryzen AI Max processor inside that's nice. How easy it is to assemble. It actually has a customizable magnetic front panel. You've got swappable decorative tiles. You can kind of make it your own from the outside anyways. Expansion cards for individualized port arrays, that sort of stuff. But general consensus seems to say that the machine sits in a very confusing position given Framework's repairability ethos, something that's been committed to with its phones and its laptops.

28:00And the fact that this desktop is, at least in some ways, less repairable than standard desktop machines. RAM is soldered into place. There are limited CPU choices, at least at launch. but it seems like the reviewers or at least the ones that I read say that it performs well for things like productivity, for gaming even at 4K with upscaling and it sounds like the framework desktop is really like a niche product. Developers, fans of small form factor PCs might want to consider it. You're looking at around $1 ,099 to start if you want to get in on that. That is so crazy because I feel like RAM is one of the things that is most commonly replaced in a computer and it's soldered in place.

28:42But I mean, I do appreciate a lot of this. Like the, the, the, the kind of the, the customizability is actually really great. And I think that's a great entry point for a lot of people. It's just, it's so odd that one of the, the traditionally most swap outable pieces of, of the internals is soldered into place, but Hey, like it could be good for someone. It's cool. Yeah. All right. Well, DJI, who I actually think of as a camera company introduced its first robot vacuum, the Romo With a transparent design and integrated drone technology, it uses advanced sensors like a binocular fisheye vision sensor and a machine learning perception algorithm to detect obstacles, plan routes, and potentially clean more efficiently than competing robo vacuums.

29:23The DJI remote comes in three flavors, mostly differentiated by their transparent appearance. China is first up for availability at around 4 ,699 yuan. To start, that's roughly$654 US with a worldwide release to follow later this year. Be cool if you could like, you know, stream video from this thing to your phone and see it clean. Actually, I don't even know if that would be cool. That might be kind of boring. Here's a vacuum going through my house. it's really neat it almost looks like a nothing thing like if nothing made yeah totally right it's got that aesthetic i kind of want definitely looks different you're gonna have to wait though uh maybe maybe it'll come to the u.s there was no word on official availability in the u.s even that it would come so uh cross your fingers when i'm crossing my fingers and those are the essentials for today let's dive a little deeper In early June, researchers restored partial vision in blind mice and enabled near IR vision in primates.

30:27It just involves sticking wires in their eyes. Yowch, before you say no, let Dr. Nikki explain.

30:34Huyen Tue Dao: Dr. Nikki, welcome back. Hello. Why should we put wires in our eyes? Aren't you excited to find out? Maybe. Okay, so stay with me. The human eye lacks photoreceptors for infrared light. We actually covered this not so long ago with a similar story. So why would we want to see infrared? Well, in some patients with severe eye diseases, adding infrared on top of what they can already see would actually improve low light visibility in these situations. So you could like maybe add in a sensor to do that. So it would be beneficial to develop these types of technologies that would let people see a broader spectrum of light.

31:15Huyen Tue Dao: Yeah. So when we talked about those infrared contact lenses, you know, it was like, oh, it makes sense. You know, infrared can give you night vision. So you're basically giving you night vision. I assume there is the obvious difference of this involving sticking wires in the eye. What else is different about this one? So this is actually really cool. But yeah, the contact lenses we talked about use nanoparticles to reflect infrared light. But in this case, these are implants that use a tellurium nanowire and the nanowire uses photovoltaic conversion that converts visible light to infrared light.

31:54So photovoltaic is like if you have solar panels that create electricity and don't heat water, that's what basically it is.

32:01Huyen Tue Dao: So using light. Yeah, I have photovoltaic panels above me right now. So if you pull out those wires You said nanowire, which made me feel a little better. Really, really, really tiny wires. And it like you can't even see it, obviously, because inside your eyes, but they go behind the retina. And on the schematic, it just looks like almost molecules, how small they are in kind of arranged in like a really thin chip, but not a chip, but in the square. OK, and there's no auxiliary equipment. There's no like batteries. And supposedly they're safe and really easy to implant. Just need to stick a wire in your eye.

32:38Huyen Tue Dao: So the wire just naturally converts the light? That's the idea? Yeah, you just stick it in there. Passively? And through its properties, yeah, it just passively converts visible into infrared light. All right. Not that I would expect this. I find it hard to believe, even though I want to believe. So I assume they tested this. They did test this. They did it in both mice and macaques. So they implanted these nanowires into the subretinal space. So right underneath the retina in their eyes. First of all, they showed good biocompatibility. We talked about this last time. You want stuff that's not going to have a bad reaction to your body.

33:14So the body didn't reject it. And like we said, they didn't need external power sources. So they worked on their own.

33:20Huyen Tue Dao: Big deal. So what they did with the mice is they blinded them beforehand. Oh, sorry. Mice always get the bad end of sight. And then they fixed their blindness, though. Yeah. Like a Stockholm syndrome situation. So the implant replaced the previously damaged photoreceptors, the cells that perceive light in your eyes, and caused a neural reaction in the optic nerve and also in the visual cortex, the region of the brain that reacts to vision. Also in these mice, they found that the ones that had corrected with the nanowires, they had better pupil reactions when you shone light in your eyes. And the ones that had corrected eyesight were better at light-associated learning behaviors.

34:03So they would train them to do something when a light came on, and then they would be better at it.

34:08Huyen Tue Dao: Better than the mice that hadn't been blinded. The blinded control mice, yeah. Than the blinded control mice. Not like a normal mouse, though. Oh, well, I would expect they wouldn't be better since they could see. So, yeah, that's probably not surprising. But, of course, you have to test it. What about the monkeys? Did the monkeys benefit? So they didn't blind the monkeys. I'm assuming that would not be ethical. The monkeys wouldn't have it. They were like, no. Yeah, they're like, please don't. Plus, the story is not about blind monkeys. It's about blind mice. True. So actually, in the monkeys, what this did is they gained infrared vision on top of their normal visual spectrum.

34:42They're super monkeys. So, yeah, so they then did training behaviors where they use an infrared light, and they were able to respond to that.

34:51Huyen Tue Dao: Okay. As with these things, I mean, it's fascinating that you don't have to have a power source that this passively works. That's pretty amazing. What kind of applications are they thinking they could use this for? Yeah, so this is super exciting. In my view, I think in the next few years, like this might be like the, you know, hearing aid for blindness. although again it only like gives you a little bit extra push but sure um potentially future iterations of this would help restore vision and and blind and visually impaired people so really excited to figure out where this goes um yeah you get this implant in your eyeballs you know i probably would if i needed it um there's so many eye surgeries already tested in on humans first maybe well yes i'm already jumping to that conclusion but it's a really good point.

35:39Huyen Tue Dao: Like if it proves safe and effective and I need it. So those three caveats, uh, then, then, yeah, I mean, they, they do cataract replacement surgeries and stuff. And so I'm not, I don't love the idea of surgery on my eye. Don't get me wrong, but, uh, it's, it's, it's proven that you can do that. So this doesn't seem like it would be particularly more risky than anything we already do. Yeah. I like that. It doesn't have like wires, other than the wires in your eye, it doesn't have wires like sticking out. And they're small. They're really, really small. Yeah. And also you just mentioned eye surgery and that made me think, imagine, so the people who have to do cataract surgery on humans, imagine doing eye surgery in a mouse eye.

36:21Oh my gosh. That's so small. Right. Really stable hands.

36:24Huyen Tue Dao: Yeah. I mean, I assume the mice are put out, you know, anesthesia for that. I really hope so. Because man, they're wiggly little. No, I'm assuming that's the case. Dr. Nicky, this is an excellent one. Thanks for bringing this. Happy to bring you all the eyeball stories this summer. Positive eyeball stories. It's an eyeball summer here at Daily Technician Show. If folks want to find more of what you do, where should they keep an eye on? Oh, good one. They should take a look at my website, NicoleAckermans.com, and I'm under the same handle on Blue Sky. Thanks, Dr. Nicky. Bye. Of course, Tom Merritt had an eye pun in there.

37:05Of course he did. He's a professional. No, thank you. No, thank you to the wires in my eyes. At least if it's going to happen and it's going to solve an issue with my sight. Like Tom said, I would agree. I'm not opposed to eye things because I have to wear glasses when I'm not wearing contacts, and I really don't enjoy that. So I'm open to it. But the idea of the wires in the eyes, no, thank you. That just does not sound fun. Yeah, it's tough. I would be glad for people that need them to have them. But, oof. Oof. Oof. All right. Well, if you have feedback for anything that gets brought up in the show, get in touch with us on the socials.

37:46At DTNS Show on X, Instagram threads, Blue Sky and Mastodon. For TikTok and YouTube, you can find us at Daily Tech News Show.

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39:28All right. And we end every episode of DTNS with some shared wisdom today. Andrew and Stim have some stories to share that are inspired by Tom's mention of Microsoft Bob earlier this week. Andrew writes, you resurfaced a core memory for me when you mentioned Microsoft Bob. When my parents first got a Windows 95 PC, I played with the operating system for literal hours. And then I found Bob and played with it for hours until that fateful day that I realized Bob was just a worse UI than Windows to do the same things. Still miss that dog, though. Andrew from Colorado. Boy, this is bringing back some memories.

40:08not like memories of me using them, but memories that this actually existed. Stim wrote on Patreon and said, I've never understood the hate that Microsoft Bob got. I personally found it fun. My now wife, who back then was not technology averse, but largely indifferent and didn't own a computer yet, founded a great entry into the world of Windows 95. Could you imagine if this is, you know, thank you for writing in Stim, but could you imagine if this was the UI layer of the future and we just were used to having our UI locked away inside of a cabin where we would click on a door to open up that application or whatever.

40:49Like I never had, did you have Microsoft? Did you ever use it? I feel like what would happen was like my parents would go to Sam's Club and then I would hang out in the computer aisle and I probably used it there. I have a memory like that, but I never used it like for myself at home on a computer. yeah i it just this does make me think of like things like i don't know like the old movies and like the old net movies like in the late 90s of like um lawnmower man or something where interfaces or even like jurassic park the infamous scene which from jurassic park where everything is just like there's like a very specific metaphor for computer things and that felt so futuristic i feel like we're starting to come back around to that i'm not sure i feel like that that this could be a thing again and that bob might just be super prescient i i don't know i don't know especially since like, you know, with, with agentic AI and assistance being like these kind of increasingly anthropomorphized things, I could see this being a thing again, maybe not quite like a cabin with a dog, but something similar.

41:43Yeah. Maybe something more higher resolution than like VGA quality, you know, I kind of like that part. Yeah, I do too. I do too. Don't get me wrong. All right. Well, what are you thinking about? Do you have some insight into a story? Please share it with us. Feedback at dailytechnewshow.com. Big thanks to Dr. Nicky. Thank you to Stim. Also, Andrew for writing in and contributing to today's show. And thank you for being along for Daily Tech News Show. You can keep us in business. Become a patron at patreon.com slash DTNS. We'll talk to you tomorrow.

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