Where Have All The Ultra-Slim Phones Gone - DTNS 5132

0:28This is the Daily Tech News for Friday, October 24th, 2025. just from a curiosity standpoint. Earlier this week, Tom and Sarah briefly mentioned on this show that Nikkei's supply chain sources are claiming that Apple is drastically cutting orders for the iPhone Air to 10 % compared to September. Now we have notable Apple analyst Ming-Chi Kuo also sharing that demand for the slim and light iPhone by most suppliers, they're reducing their capacity. by more than 80 % by the first quarter of 2026. Some components expected to be discontinued by the end of this year. So major change there. And so I, you know, I read this and then I remembered, like we actually just talked about on Android faithful reports from last week that Samsung has canceled reportedly, of course, you know, this is behind the scenes stuff.

1:23So not confirmed at this point, but canceled the Galaxy S26 edge, which would be the follow-up to the S25 Edge that came out for the first version of it this year. A swift reversal, I would say, in its plans to try and carve out a new variant for its S26 lineup. And now we have a report by reputable leaker Ice Universe, pretty reputable, I'd say, sharing that the Galaxy S26 series, the whole series, might actually get its release date pushed by a few months to March of next year. Other leakers also pointing to a similar prediction. Some of those reports are suggesting that the cancellation of the Edge series could at least be a piece of the puzzle.

2:07And so I guess the big question that I have about this is how do two major companies who have pretty good track records, I'd say, at getting some of these things right? And granted, you can't get everything right, but they both were on the slim and light train with the iPhone Air and then the Galaxy S Edge. They both, you know, really carved out and kind of made a case for like, this is another major part of our offering. And yet it really seems, in fact, key bank capital markets found, quote, virtually no demand for the iPhone Air. And, you know, we're kind of hearing the same thing about the S25 Edge.

2:52I'm just curious how they get it wrong. Like, that's so crazy to me. Yeah, it really seems like a lot of manufacturers are coalescing on the idea of people want a slim phone just because phones have, I mean, I guess phones have gotten definitely taller and like thinner, but like not a lot thinner. A lot of times, even with a case, they feel like bricks in your, in your pocket. So it seems like they were responding to, you know, something. And then I think even like we, we've covered other companies like Motorola is coming out with their own version of an edge and slim. So I wonder whether this news is going to affect that as well.

3:24Like if they're seeing the Apple, oh no, Apple and Samsung are already getting out of the slim game ha ha ha that means we can be the ones that offer it yay i mean jason you you got to use like the edge like did you i don't is it that maybe they and i've heard so many times over the years that i think a lot of us miss the days of smaller phones that are more easily portable you know lady pockets are kind of infamously small but even just the idea of having you know what can be a big brick in your pocket is not appealing to most folks. Did you find that your experience with the Edge kind of wowed you or made you think of days when, you know, we had smaller phones and less, you know, like stretching of fingers trying to reach these tall-ass screens?

4:11Excuse me. I mean, you know, it's a thinner phone. It's not necessarily a smaller phone was kind of my experience, right? Like it's still more or less the screen is basically the same size as most other phones that I use. It's just the thickness quotient was definitely a good deal smaller. I kind of found my time with the Edge to basically be, oh, that's neat. But it really didn't go much further than that, especially when you consider the trade-offs. It is more expensive. I think we were looking at it prior to recording and the S25 Edge is what,$1 ,100? So it's not priced inexpensive. It's not like you're getting a smaller phone and you're paying less for it.

4:54You know, you're getting one less camera as far as the edge is concerned. You're getting a thinner phone. Yes. But you're also getting a smaller battery and battery anxiety is something that largely I think people have. Thankfully, we have stopped experiencing quite the way that at least in the Android world we experienced, you know, say five or 10 years ago. Even. Yeah. It's different now and it's hard to go back to battery anxiety land. It's hard to like suddenly find yourself considering the fact that, oh, I might not make it through the day when we've become so used to it. But how much is the general consumer looking at an iPhone Air or an S25 Edge and thinking that?

5:35Like, is a general consumer looking at this phone and going, well, that's great, but will it last throughout my day? Will I have battery anxiety? I'm not certain that they all are, you know, thinking of it that way. Maybe they are. It also seems kind of odd. I think we've, it's like, where does this phone fit in the lineup? Because they are not cheap phones. They're like upper mid pricing or lower, lower, lower, lower, upper, upper, upper middle. Like they're not, as you said they're not cheap phones and i i just feel like just compare comparing you know a 1100 1000 slim down phone with some trade-offs but that you know has that you know light very carryable you know characteristic i i just like it feels like i wouldn't say they're cannibalizing their other offerings but it it's a kind of a funny place to sit isn't it like i i feel especially with both samsung and iphone and i mean like most manufacturers but like specifically samsung and iphone have just so many different offerings like it's already so many different levels it just feels like it's kind of confusing um yeah that maybe they don't have a clear even even with the thinness the fact that you know as you said there's plenty of trade-offs like battery it maybe there's just something about it just not fitting in or just it just seems like an oddball and that maybe it might lose out amongst like kind of like, especially for like Samsung and iPhone, kind of like all the, like the, the very long, you know, history of, for example, the S series with the three models, people know it, people understand kind of like the trade-offs of all three.

7:15And then you get this edge in there and just feels like, yeah, I just don't get the story there necessarily unless, and I just don't find thin, not necessarily smaller, as you said, thin, a, I just don't see how it just really distinguishes itself in a significant other than being thin, which I kind of have doubts on whether that's a good story for selling yet another phone within like these very well established like lines of phones. I don't know. That's kind of my take. It just feels kind of an odd duck. Yeah, well, it is. I totally agree. I think really when it comes down to it, it's about value.

7:49And both Apple and Samsung decided, and I don't argue that there's probably some, you know, some really interesting and significant and engineering feats that went into these phones to make them the way they are. Like, no question, that's probably why we haven't seen it before is because they figured certain things out. Of course, the iPhone Air, iFixit said that it was very repairable and very strong, which goes counter to the thought that a lot of people have, which is, oh, it's thinner. It's going to break a lot easier. It's going to be more difficult to repair components that apparently wasn't the case.

8:24So from an engineering perspective, it's probably a really great story. But I think from a general consumer, my guess is as a general consumer, if I go into a store and I see something that is thinner, which kind of indicates something less than a thicker phone, right? Maybe less capable, less camera, smaller battery, all these things. My mind immediately goes to, okay, well, then that should be lower cost versus the more premium things. And I think that these my guess is that these companies placed a premium on the thought that these things were engineered in a way that they can get thin and light.

9:00And that's what people are willing to pay more for is the thinness and the lightness. And maybe that didn't line up with what consumers actually believe, which is, OK, well, that's nice to have. But like at the end of the day, like this just feels like I'm paying more for less. And yeah, you know what I mean? There's not as much perceived value in the thinness and lightness from the consumers as maybe the companies believed there would be. No, I think that's really fair. And I can kind of see how OEMs are kind of getting into a weird spot because, and we've talked about, like, for example, CounterPoint Research, who does a lot of like issues, a lot of reports about trends, like in terms of where specifically smartphone manufacturers are going, like what's driving, you know, what kind of units they're shipping and what kind of like their focus is.

9:45It's weird because it's like from a regular consumer level, we've talked about this at length on various shows about how, especially the last six years, people are much more economically conscious, especially with purchases like smartphones. People want to hold on to their phones longer. They want a little more value and be able to hold on to that value. And at the same time, I think CounterPoint has noted that companies are actually increasing their profits through premiumization, which is basically getting you to pay more for something that may be marginally better or that is perceived to be better, but may not necessarily be better.

10:23And I wonder if this is... Yes, inflation, exactly. And it's so weird because somehow it's working because while most consumers are more price conscious and value conscious, it's like it's a stat that companies are increasing their profits in a significant portion due to premiumization. so I can see as being an OEM how do we keep playing that weird balance of giving most consumers that that the impression of value and continued value for their money but also keep um I guess exploiting this like premium of that's a hard word to say premiumization of the market and I also kind of feel like that is part of it too like part of that they're thinking that hey maybe something else that we can sell is the thinness.

11:14And then as you said, it seems to be not, there's a disconnect there in maybe what they labeled as like a premium feature thinness because it does require a lot of engineering to make it that way. And then it's just, yeah, as you said, the consumers just don't, just see smaller phone, less phone should cause less money. And I just, yeah, maybe that's just the wall on this facet of premiumization is that this is one area where people just don't want to, I guess, this is not something that people want to invest in, like thinness. That's probably it. I should also mention that Tom Merritt, we were chatting a little bit in Discord prior to the show and he reminded me this morning that Samsung used to release their major Galaxy phones a bit later in the year.

12:00So the connection to the Edge stuff going on and the delay, the potential delay of the Galaxy phone release. They could be unrelated. They also could be related or at least partially part of, you know, a whole cornucopia of reasons to push things off. So I wanted to make sure that we got that word in there too. And I guess we'll have to see maybe in a year or two whether they come back to, you know, thin phones, edges. And it'd be really interesting to see, for example, what OEMs like Motorola and other companies that are trying to do their own version of slim slash edge phones do in the next year, given that Samsung and Apple are exiting.

12:38So I guess we'll see. Very curious, very curious. All right, well, DTNS is made possible by you, the listener. And this is where we take time to thank wonderful folks like John Atwood, Pat, Mike Cortez, and welcome new patrons, Valentin and George. That was one clap for each of you. I don't know if you heard that. That wasn't an accident. Now many, okay. There you go. There's more we need to know today. Let's get to the briefs. All right. Well, Apple warned that it may disable its app tracking transparency feature in Europe due to what it calls, quote, intense lobbying by advertisers and regulators in Germany and Italy, among other countries in Europe.

13:22So App Tracking Transparency ATT is a feature that gives users control over cross-app tracking by asking for permission before tracking activity across apps and websites on iOS and iPad OS devices. Apple admits that such a move would be a detriment to European consumers and that they will continue to push for the tool in those areas if they choose to disable it. So this follows a preliminary assessment in Germany that ATT could be anti-competitive in its current form. And Apple received a fine, in fact, in France two months ago related to ATT as well. Yeah. So regulators in this regard, I was kind of looking into this, like what exactly is the anti-competitive aspect of this?

14:06And really what they're looking at is that Apple is potentially using, I guess you could say like the privacy, they would say, as kind of like a weapon or kind of a wedge. Its own apps are exempt. It also applies pressure on ad-dependent competitors. That's why the anti-competitive nature of this exists, or at least the opinion exists. Essentially, they see this as Apple being self-preferential in how this AT &T, I want to say AT &T, this ATT app tracking transparency feature is implemented. Wow, that's a good one for Apple, to be honest, because all of that is a bit hard to read at first. And I definitely was confused when I read anti-competitive because on the surface, letting someone know when your data is moving across apps seems like a good deal.

14:52But wow. Okay. But, you know, as far as consumers are concerned, like I think consumer pushback on this also is, yeah, but we do want to know these things. We do want to know these things. Obviously, you know, if there's an anti-competitive aspect to this that Apple is applying to others and not to its own, that's something to consider. But it's kind of one of those situations where it's baby with bathwater sort of thing. Yes. Okay. Now you don't get it at all. Yeah. And I think consumers do want that control, right? No, and they just, I mean, honestly, yeah, I think we all deserve that kind of level of transparency on where our data is going.

15:27But just interesting that leverage that Apple has on it. For sure. For sure. Intel's Q3 earnings call revealed that the company is in a cautious recovery period. It's reported its first profit in two years. So that's the good news. Intel CEO Lit Bhutan said chip shortages will persist into early 2026, and the company will put more resources into AI server production while also limiting its consumer CPU output. Now, much of its recovery is due to some financial lifelines, much needed lifelines that it got from partners like NVIDIA, SoftBank, and the U.S. government. So that's part of the reason why they're kind of seeing their first profit here.

16:11So I guess you could put a little asterisk next to that. They've helped stabilize company operations after a few challenging years. Intel plans to slowly roll out its upcoming Panther Lake chips, starting with a single skew this year, followed by others in 2026. Intel also said that yields on its 18A process aren't where they want them to be. So they're suggesting that profitability might not arrive until 2026 or 2027. So, you know, slow recovery, more methodical, I'd say, definitely seems to be guided a little bit by AI over what consumer demand is with the company. But that's what you got. All right.

16:52Well, speaking of AI, Anthropic has struck a partnership with Google that gives them access to up to 1 million of Google's tensor processing units in a major expansion of its compute capacity. The deal will bring more than a gigawatt of capacity to Anthropic's service in 2026 and is Google's largest TPU deal to date. Unlike its rivals like OpenAI, which is pursuing a 33 gigawatt arsenal with Stargate, Anthropic is splitting its workloads across Google TPUs, Amazon Tranium chips, and NVIDIA GPUs in a multi-cloud strategy that will allow it to fine-tune for price, performance, and power efficiency.

17:32This deepens Google's investment in Anthropic, which is already totaling$3 billion. Yeah. I mean, I think the diversification aspect of this with the structure, that's important. It could lead to the company just being over time a little more resilient, obviously a lot more flexible when you're talking about a diversified kind of approach. and especially as Anthropic is scaling over time, that could really be a big benefit to them. It's really interesting because I think there's some, because right now we're kind of in the current AI escape that we're in, it's so fascinating to see who partners with whom and it still feels like there's a lot of interesting seeming competitiveness because obviously Google has its own AI kind of offerings, but just how these different companies interact and whether it's like a high tide lifts all boats where the more that they can interact and can be interoperable with each other.

18:31Because I know some like services will offer you, hey, you could use chat GPT or Claude or this. It's just interesting how the landscape is shaping up because they're in competition, but also in collaboration. And I'm not sure if there's some interesting implication from that because I'm not an economist, but yeah, it's just, this is fascinating. The enemy of my enemy is my friend. I'm sure that works on some level across the partnerships that you're talking about. For sure. Mozilla will require all new Firefox extensions to clearly disclose how they collect and share user data beginning November 3rd, 2025.

19:08So that's just a couple of weeks from now. Developers will be required to specify data practices in each extensions manifest.json file using a new data collection permissions key. It will specify whether names, emails, or browsing activity are gathered with that extension. The gathered information will then appear in installation prompts, extension listings, and Firefox's add-ons manager, so they become kind of more transparent. Extensions that collect no data must explicitly say so, and those who do not comply will be blocked. all extension developers must have this framework in place that there's like a mid-2026 deadline for like the must-have in place or else date.

19:54So this is coming up. I mean, as a developer, I mean, I know you probably don't create Firefox extensions, but how does this strike you? I think it makes sense. So I am an Android developer and some years ago, a similar requirement took place, like kind of was introduced to the GoPlay system where we actually do have to fill out very specific or we have to answer very specific questions on what data we use and even give reasoning for them. And that information is available to users in the app store. So I just feel like this is very familiar. It is, in my life, it's slightly onerous, but at the same time, it's, if I feel like it's, it's definitely the way we should be going.

20:39And I just think it's so interesting, like the little things, like if you collect no data, you must explicitly say so, because there is an attempt here from companies to hold developers to account and to, and to introduce some sense of like, you know, responsibility, liability, maybe even, I don't know, but like kind of nearing towards that in regards to you know, being this transparency and owning up to it and honoring that. So I like it. And hopefully it's not too much of a pain for extension developers. Yeah, indeed. And finally, some quick headlines, you know, things that are good to know if you want to understand the news that comes in the future.

21:18All right. Well, the latest update from Instagram has a few new generative AI tools that let users edit photos and videos using text prompts, similar to conversational editing features rolled out by Google to its photo service this year. And Microsoft is celebrating the Windows Insider Program's 11th anniversary with special anniversary wallpapers for its volunteer testers who have spent countless hours testing pre-built releases of Windows. And I just got to ask, like, why not at least like a T-shirt, like desktop wallpaper? And Thrill-Based Cloud now has long-term memory features, allowing it to recall and integrate information from past chatbot conversations for paid subscribers.

21:58Love that. And Netflix has reportedly shut down Boss Fight Entertainment, the studio behind the hit mobile game, Squid Game Unleashed. That's the company's second internal game studio closure this year. Well, you know, we're getting close to holiday times. And if you need a snazzy gift for a coworker or a colleague, guess what? We have dozens of ideas for you over at dailytechnownewshow.com slash store. We have mugs, t-shirts, or mouse pads, all with our new DTNS logo. They're great gifts and a great way to support the show.

22:32We end every episode of DTNS with some shared wisdom. Yesterday, we mentioned the surge in downloads of the Zorin OS Linux distro. And today, Mohan adds some further observations to that. Well, Mohan writes, regarding Zorin OS, That is great news. And I would like to point to, I'm seeing many people migrating over to Linux Mint and Ubuntu as I see the posts on their respective subreddit, rlinuxmint and rumbuntu. It's good for new users of my choice of operating system. Good. I'm happy it works out for you. I have not used that, so I can't wait in, but I'm happy, Mohan. Me too. All right. Well, what are you thinking about?

23:12Do you have some further insight into one of our stories? Share it with us. feedback at dailytechnewsshow.com. Big thanks to Mohan for sharing perspective on yesterday's story and contributing to today's show. And thank you for being along for Daily Tech News Show. You can keep us in business by becoming a patron at patreon.com slash DTNS. This week's episodes of Daily Tech News Show were created by the following people. Host, producer, writer, Tom Merritt. Host, writer, Jason Howell. Co-host, Sarah Lane. Co-host, Rob Dunwood. Co-host, Wintwood Dow. Producer, Anthony Lemos. Producer, Roger Chang.

23:50Editor, Hammond Chamberlain. Editor, Victor Bognat. Science correspondent, Dr. Nikki Ackermans. Social media producer and moderator, Zoe Detterding. Our mods, Beatmaster, WSkottis1, BioCow, Captain Kipper, Steve Guadarama, Paul Reese, Matthew J. Stevens, a.k.a. Gadget Virtuoso, J.D. Galloway. Mod and video hosting by Dan Christensen. Music provided by Mark Bell and Dan Luters. Art by Len Peralta. Acast ad support by Tatiana Matias. Patreon support from Bobby Wagner. And our guest this week, Andy Beach. And thanks to all our patrons who continue to make this show possible.

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