Jamali Maddix, spiced whole chicken with herby rice, ice cream and a Grüner Veltliner

0:00Turn up the heat this Valentine's Day with a meal that brings a little steam to the table. Impress your loved one with some succulently sweet and slightly nutty tender stem broccoli, giving you that fine dining feeling without the faff. Simply boil, steam or grill your tender stem in just a few minutes and let this versatile veg take center stage on your Valentine's plate. This is Valentine's cooking, but better with tender stem broccoli. Add a pack to your weekly Waitrose shop, subject to availability. Dish from Waitrose is a cold glass production. This podcast may contain some strong language and adult themes.

0:39Hello, welcome to Dish from Wake Troas. I'm Nick Grimshaw. And I'm Angela Hartnett. How are you, Ange? I'm very well, thanks. How are you? Good, thanks. Did you just come back from Italy? Did you have a... Oh, drinking water. It was a charity do. I was cooking with Luke for Action Against Hunger. And these lovely people, Jason and Rachel, bid for the prize. Oh, wow. So they come out to the... where we make our own wine. and so they came out to the winery, we did a nice tasting, we did a cookery lesson, we had some lovely meals and then we flew back. Oh, nice. Where were you? So it was down in Tuscany, southern Tuscany near Groseto.

1:13Oh, nice. Yeah, it was lovely. I went to Milan since the last thing. And how did you enjoy it? It was like a fly-in visit, again like yours, like in and out. My friend had a show there so we went to go and see it. But I had for my tea on the Friday night an amazing saffron risotto served in a, the bowl was constructed from Parmesan cheese. Oh, wow. So it's when you get like a brandy snap. Yeah, yeah, yeah. My mum loved that. So did it all melt into it then? No, it was rock hard. Oh. But it was good. It was like a crisp. Oh, right. It was really good. Yeah. Loved. No pasta for you? No pasta for me.

1:47I will say, I was, everyone was saying, oh, good luck with the gluten in Italy. It was easier there than here. Everywhere I had an option. Everywhere I went. Yeah. I mean, everywhere I went to probably three restaurants. Two places. Yeah, yeah. So three restaurants I went to. Yeah, they all had options. And I had the best gluten-free pizza I'd ever had. Oh, right. It was like an actual pizza. Nice. It tastes like, you know, sometimes a bit like cardboard. Yeah, it was good. Sensational. So breaking news, Italy, good at food. Halloween week this week. Are you dressing up? Well, I do want to dress up because I like her thing.

2:21We're going to get Elsie dressing up. Oh, are you? Well, you live in quite a spooky part of town. We do live in a spooky part of town, but I don't think any of the neighbours are going to be doing Halloween. Well, actually, there's a couple that might, so we're going to get Elsie a costume and we're going to trick and treat with her. What's she going to be? I've left that to her mother and her godfather. How old is Elsie now? She'll be, she's two and a half. Okay, yeah, so it's their choice, not her choice. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, no, she'll like it. She loves gay. She dressed up last year. She had no choice.

2:45Sandra put her in her pink outfit. She looked amazing. But no, I think she'll like it because she's walking and chatting. She loves chatting once she gets it. I loved trick or treat when I was a kid. Yeah. I remember doing it all the time and like no one really been into it. Why don't you have a Halloween party? I'd love to. I might do. Yeah, do that. Make everyone dress up. Yeah, I think it's really fun to do. Yeah, the Americans love it. It's a great holiday because there's no pressure, is there? There's no gift giving. Yeah, no. There's no like, I can't believe that they're spending Halloween with that family.

3:15I actually want to be a dinner table. Oh, okay. Yeah, I really want to be like sort of like in a Lee Bowery way. Yeah. Construct like a wooden circle around me. Yeah. and then set the table so that there's like plates and knives and forks on the tablecloth. Nice, that'd be quite good. And I'm in the middle. Yeah. So, and maybe the table could spin. Spin like a tablecloth. Because I do like something that's... It's quite big though. Yeah, but I think that's quite good. I think an awkward, in the way, homemade costume is good. You won't be able to go to the toilet easily. No. What will you be? I don't know.

3:49I'd have to think about that. You could be someone really scary like Nigella Lawson.

3:57That would be, yeah. Nice. Love Nigella. Anyway, have a think about it. Okay, have a think about it. Before we welcome our guest, by the way, we have Jamali Maddox in to see us today. Can't wait. Do you know him? I've met him. I've been on the telly with him. I went on Nevermind the Buscocks. Oh, right. And I went on and I sat next to Beth Ditto. Nice. And it was quite the night. Yeah, I bet it was. It was quite the evening. Yeah, so Jamali endured that process. with me. But you're known from everything. He's been on, yeah, Nevermind the Buscocks, Taskmaster, Live at the Apollo, 8 out of 10 cats.

4:29He's also made some like really great documentaries as well. And he's got a brand new show. It's him, GK Barry and Jimmy Carr. It's called Am I the Asshole? Yes. But it's Americanized. Am I the Asshole? Asshole. Yeah, it's quite a program, isn't it? Yeah, it's quite. It's quite the program. Now, before we get Jamali in, we're going to talk about seasonality. It's my favorite time of year. Is it? why yeah cozy clothes layering oh right uh pointless events pointless events like halloween mish's birthday and bonfire it's a bit harsh on mish no i'm joking but i mean fun thing i like i really like autumn my favorite my favorite this looks absolutely gorgeous delicious um wow you know what this is celeriac yes so celeriac it's a rooty time root vegetables it is all the root vegetables you see on every menu every celeriac but you can do lots of things with it you make soup with it you can roast it you can salt bake it lovely in salads lovely as an accompaniment to lots of how would you do it in a salad you'd i would i would salt bake it so you'd basically cover it in either a salt crust pastry crust and then bake it or just a salt layer and and then peel it all down and then so it's got that lovely roasted flavor then chop it up mix it with loads of beetroot loads of all those bitter leaves that you like it would work with that how long you're cooking this guy for?

5:48Oh, easily about 35, 40 minutes. It's very, you know, it's tough. It needs a long time. But it's lovely roasted in the oven. I don't think I've ever... Are that salari? Yeah, of course you have. Definitely. But I don't think I've ever been drawn to buy it. No. I mean, you've got to know what to do with it. And also you can make it into a remoulade, which is like a great accompaniment for things like ham and salad. So you peel it all down, chop it really finely and mix it with like mustard mayonnaise. Oh, yeah. And that with lovely ham and like even with a bit of, you know, terrine or something.

6:18I bet you'll see a remoulade on one of the restaurants near you. Oh, yeah. Trust me. It's a remoulade season. It's a remoulade season. With a whole grain mustard. Okay, delicious. Yeah. We're going to get our guest in now. Quick reminder before we speak to our guest that we have at the end the bit where we go through listener questions. Yeah. So if you have any questions and you've sent one in, we may answer it after we've spoken to Jamali. We may answer. We may.

6:44Time to welcome our guest, Ange We have comedian, broadcaster and writer Who did his first stand-up gig in school Well, in year five It's Jamali Maddox, everybody

6:57Welcome Hey, what's up? I don't know if I was at will, I clapped myself Yeah, that's good I am here, actually It is good Happy to be here Worth it, I love that How are you, Jamali? I'm good, bro, how you doing? Yeah, good, nice to see you Welcome to Dish Yeah, welcome Yeah, when we were doing the Jamali research, when it was like, surely not stand-up at year five, but that's a true story. Well, yeah, kind of. So I did the, you know, like, so I was doing a talent show and there was like these two guys doing sketches and my bit was to come in in between. And you know that thing of when kids don't want to go on stage when they're young and they start crying?

7:30Yeah. And then the teachers went, just go on stage. And I went out on stage and it was, it was a bad set. I should have got booed. but I was like I forgot if I flicked up my collars and I was like I'm Harry Hill I wish your comedy was that easy now yeah you just came on yeah I just came on did that and we watched it people just went mental for that so you were crying before it was like no it wasn't me oh you were okay no no no but I was ready for the game you were ready about some lame crying no no no and then did that sort of instill something in you do you think do you think that was something that made you want to I think I was always probably like an attention seeker or something, I've always wanted to perform in some way.

8:11Did you sort of do that at home? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like mum and dad and family and stuff. You were the one. Oh yeah, doing the head in. Yeah. And did they like it? No, no, no. My mum don't like my comedy now. Generally, my mum watches it and she goes, people pay for this. But that's what you want. I think that's good feedback. Yeah. I think that's really good feedback. We don't want comedy that your mum goes, that's great. You kind of want to, you know what I mean? It's probably, I probably should have to push further. But yeah, yeah. So my mum's always saying, why don't you talk about your granddad?

8:38He's fun. I don't want to hear about that. That might be the good driving force, though, because you have that with your mum. Yeah, exactly. With cooking, like Michelin star, loads of bloody restaurants. And she's like, hmm. Oh, really? Yeah. Is your mum a good cook? She's a really good cook. But it's like, hmm, that's a little bit under, isn't it? Or like my aunt might come in and they'll take her, it's a little bit, maybe a little bit more salt. I mean, you know, the criticism you get. I think the salt thing would do my head in the most, because if you're kind of saying my food's not. quite yeah yeah yeah you just have to yeah because as a chef you know when someone you cook someone food and they put salt in it before they've tried it does that piss you off it doesn't really I'll be honest because I sort of think people are your guests so in paying customers that's what they want to do they want to do it I mean it would sort of piss me off I suppose if like it does when my family do it because they know I can cook and they just sometimes do it to wire me up of course or if Neil is like a little bit you know and you're like hello come on I've been slaving It doesn't bother paying customers to do what they want.

9:38It's up to them, isn't it? But it's good to have family criticism, I think. It keeps you grounded. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, then I'm very grounded. Yeah, you're very grounded. I'm the most grounded man in existence. You've got all angles, you know. Oh, all of them. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I've got three sisters. Yeah, oh, gosh. We're going to eat soon, obviously. And we're going to get into your food likes and dislikes. It's always how we like to start Dish. but I wanted to talk to you about food that you apparently like to eat. You like food that's on the move. Yeah, I'm a busy man. What sort of food are we talking?

10:08Just like handheld? Yeah, I like a burger if I'm on the move. If I'm in... I thought you meant for a minute like a sushi cow. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's just running after food. I'm going to get an out. We'll get a live chicken. You only like food that's moving. Yeah, I'm so busy I want to wait for it to come with a slow conveyor belt. You've got to go. How do you feel about eating in public, like on public transport? Yeah, I eat up, but I don't care, bro. Yeah, I'll whack a full roast dinner. Yeah. On the central line, bro, I don't care. All that stuff, like, you shouldn't eat in public. Bro, I've got...

10:41It's a new world. It's 2007, bro. Yeah, we've got stuff to do. You're trying to hit me with 1960s etiquette. I don't care. You know what I mean? I pay my taxes, bro. I'm eating on the train. You know what I mean? I'll eat on the train. I don't care. What do you feel about that? Yeah, I don't mind it. I will eat on the train. I will. I don't know about, not for me. Just whacking a full Jalfreyser, yeah. Yeah, Jalfreyser. I always think when someone needs to eat something a bit wet on the tube, because the tube's windy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. When someone's eating like a banana, I'm like, that's too, like surely there's things sticking to that.

11:10Oh, you think like the germs. The germs are like the wind. I like how you think germs need a sticky surface to land. Yeah, I just thought, I mean, eat what you want. Food likes and dislikes now. So Jamali, you love Turkish and Jamaican food. We got here. Are there any particular dishes, any particular flavours that you love? Yeah, I love, one of my favourite things is I love Saturday soup, Jamaican Saturday soup. What Saturday? I love Saturday soup. So it's basically, it's like, it comes in a packet of cock soup. Oh, yeah, yeah. You've seen that. And basically it's got like dumplings, yam, some meat in it.

11:44Sometimes people put noodles or pasta in it. Right. I like the jerk chicken. The problem with jerk chicken is unless it's come off the grill, I don't really like the oven one. I like the proper grill one, curry goat. and when it comes to Turkish food, like I love the koftas, the sheesh, because it really is like, it's sort of like, because Turkish food is quite basic. It's just rice, vegetables and meat. But it's like, especially if you go to a good place, it's like quality of all those products, you know. And the sort of marinade they put on the meat and stuff. It's a bit like you just said about the chicken.

12:15It's how they cook it. Yeah. You want that grill flavour, that charcoal. And where I live, there's so many good Turkish places. It's kind of, you know, it's kind of spoiled. When we asked you about your food and dislikes, you told us about an alligator cheesecake. Yeah, I liked it. So not a sweet cheesecake, like a savoury... So it's like a savoury cheesecake. I got it in a place called Giacomo's in New Orleans. Because what I'll do is when I'm on tour, I always put out the Instagram, what's like the good food spots. And so it kept on saying Giacomo, Giacomo, Giacomo, cheesecake, crocodile cheesecake.

12:42So I went and I wasn't expecting, I was expecting, oh, it'd be fun. It's all like a Chicago... You ever had a Chicago deep dish? Yes. And you kind of go, I had it once. Yeah. It was all right. But I just want normal pizza now. So I thought it would be like that situation. And it was delicious, man. It had like alligator and shrimp in it. Yeah, it's sort of the texture of a cheesecake, but more salty and savoury. It's a bit quichy. And was it blended? No, no, no, no, bits. Bits? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Actually alligator bits and shrimp bits, it was great. Have you ever cooked an alligator?

13:14No. What, was it chewy? Did it taste like chicken? Was it chewy? Yeah, alligator, I'd say it's more chicken. It's sort of like, I'd say it's like a, more like a fish texture. Right, okay, so soft. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. I can't even, I feel like I've got a good imagining. I can't even see this. All I can see is an alligator on top of a cheesecake. That's all I can see. That's not what it is. That is literally what I was going to say. It's not a cheesecake with an alligator. No, no, no, no, no, no. No, it's in the thing. It's in the thing. Okay, I'm going to have to Google that in a second. Sugar is your guilty pleasure.

13:47Yeah. All types of sugar? It's too much. What are you having? What are you having on the deal? So I used to eat gato for breakfast. You have what? I used to eat gato for breakfast. And then the doctor was like, but have you got to shut that shit down? But I was talking, it was bad. Like, yeah, but I've got like bad diabetes in my family and that. No. Yeah, I've got like proper diabetes. And they were like, do you have diabetes in your family? I'm like, yeah, that's not me. And they're like, nah, you need to stop. So yeah, I used to eat so much sugar, man. Like everything, like sweets, gummies.

14:12Do all of you, like all the family, do you all like 90 years? Maybe I'm not even a part of that family, really. Maybe I'm a doctor. but I know it's sweet biscuits biscuits but biscuits don't last so you're one of those you open a packet oh it's gone you can't have just one I can't buy them no more I've got a chocolate digesters I'll make tea just to dip the biscuit I don't want to lie to you you know what I mean literally I'm having the tea just so I have an excuse to be like I'll go have a biscuit with the tea go have a biscuit it could destroy my whole life it's bad I love gummies and I was just in America and it's like you know they've got so much selection of sweets they're chocolate shit and so huge nothing small yeah yeah it's your chocolate American chocolate is shit man worst chocolate in the world but I heard it's because they don't use real milk they use like powder milk right right right where I think England and Europe still uses real milk yeah and what's your favourite chocolate bar in here over here damn Bo that's a big one I go through phases like sometimes I like to buy you know the you know the box of Maltesers you buy for someone.

15:17Yeah. I buy them for myself. Yeah. So is Nick. And I open it up. That, like a Galaxy, Snickers, a classic. Snicker, yeah. Twix. What I do for Twix, yeah, is I buy both of the ends and use it for like a straw for tea. Oh, yes. It's like a Twix straw. Well, we're going to have ice cream today. Okay, good. We're going to have ice cream. It wasn't a dessert, but I don't know, man, I would have been disappointed. Just leave. Get out of there. I would have done a delivery. Yeah. order it in. Your dislikes now, so no two, mushrooms, olives, raw tomatoes. I can have a raw tomato in a sandwich if I'm really hungry.

15:56Right, okay. But not... Just like a cold tomato is, I don't like that, man. My girlfriend sort of says, she do like tomatoes. I gave you a heirloom tomato and I'm like, yeah, but that's such a rare tomato. You know what I'm saying? I eat that on a daily basis. I'm talking about a normal cherry red, like a red tomato. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Genetically modified. That's what I'm eating. I'm not eating heirlooms on a daily basis. I can't say, yeah, no, I eat heirlooms. If we'd have got that, I'd be like, no, it's just the heirlooms. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's crazy. That is crazy, yeah. This one, huge ranch.

16:29You hate red wine in a capital. I hate red wine. I hate red wine. I've had red wine that's like, this bottle is a vintage. It tastes like Dawson's Creek. Like, it just tastes the same. The Dawson's Creek, what's the? Jacob's Creek. Jacob's Creek. Jacob's Creek. It's like Jacob's beer. Dawson's beer. It reminds me of a 90s sitcom. No, it's... It tastes like Jacob's beer, bro. Just not beer. Everything tastes like vinegar mixed with a bit of butter. Do you like white wine or rosé? You're not a wine. There's this one bottle that my friend got me, and he was like, I don't drink wine. He goes, you like this wine?

17:06I said, brother, I don't drink it. And he got me this wine. It's called Jung and Sexy. Okay. It's like a pinet. Pinet? Pinet? Pinot. but it's like fizzy. Oh, pet nut. Yeah, so it's like fizzy and sweet. It's the sugar. Yeah, that's the only reason I can drink it. Because it's like a sweet, so it's kind of just like drinking, you know, like a K.A. Yeah. Like a drink of K.A. Because you love a red, aren't you? I love a red, yeah. I have to be in the right mood for red. What's the mood for a red? I mean, I think it's autumn. Okay, all right. Autumn onwards. Yeah, with food, yeah, yeah, yeah. My friend Colette came around the other night and she was like, let's get cozy get the fire on and she really brainwashed me into like I was like I can't she's like come on it's winter and I was like oh you're right so I think I just hard season but you're all year round I don't know all year round I know I like it but I like savoury more than all the sweet stuff I don't eat any of that but I like that bitter the tanners we're all different aren't we we are all different I'm going to get you some food now okay food time yeah yeah what about things that tend to happen in sort of restaurant and food culture.

18:18I hate when people, you know, you ever go to a restaurant and you see five people around one dessert and they've all got a spoon? Yeah. I hate that shit. No. Just be an adult and buy your own dessert, and they all do it. What are you doing? And the ice cream's melting. Yeah, and they just like a little bit. Yeah, I hate that, man. Oh, I sometimes do that. I hate that. I know, I feel that guy. I'm like, no. And I bet you chat bears and this, yeah, I hate it, man. Because there's also, I don't like that thing of me and you sharing dessert and I just want to finish it. Yes. But then I've got to be polite and save you some.

18:53I hate that. And there's always a bit that no one wants. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes, yeah, yeah. I hate that diplomacy. How do you feel about, like, you know, you're more and more restaurants now that don't just do a plate for you? I hate it. I hate that. Hate sharing. I hate it. The problem with sharing plate is, is if I like something, I'll give you a fork and go, here, have a try. Yeah. But not have half of this thing. No. I think because I travel a lot by myself, I tend to eat a lot by myself. So I'm kind of used to just having my food. Your food. Yeah. This looks great. Do you want some wine or not so much?

19:25Are you sure? I'll taste some. Yeah, just for research. Just for research. Yeah, if you hate it, it's fine. No? No. No, it's all right. White wine I can deal with is the red. I love this, yeah. But this is also... Wait, you've got to get the pronunciation because that is really, really Austrian. Mösenbergen? Mösenbergen Grunhe Weltliner. I googled it before and apparently this vineyard that this Mösenbergen was made on was monks started it in 90 AD. They love it. Don't they make that Scottish one? Yeah, they love it. Buckfast. Buckfast. I thought they weren't drinking. Oh, they do it to sell. Sell it, yeah.

20:09Yeah, they're allowed, you know. I think they drink. Yeah. Oh, yeah, they body of Christ. Yeah, exactly. I don't think Buckfast is body of Christ. And right, our food has arrived, Ange. Please fill us in. What have we got? So we've got a spiced whole chicken with herby rice, and it's a recipe by Chetna McCann. And yeah, it's whole chicken cooked together with lots of different spices. We've got some, so in the rice, you've got cumin seeds, bay leaf, cinnamon stick, onions and garlic. In the big pan. Yeah, with some rassel. Rassel hanout. Hanout. So you basically season the chicken up with the rasal hanout and then roasted that slightly to get a bit of colour.

20:45Remove that from the pan. Add all your ingredients for your rice, you know, your onion, your garlic, cinnamon stick, as you said, cumin seeds, bay leaf, some stock, chicken back in, and then cook it for about an hour and 10 minutes. So is this like Middle Eastern? I'd say more Moroccans. Moroccans, okay, okay. Yeah, it has that sort of, the sort of spices sort of that Moroccans flavor. It's one of these things that you can get all done. And the whole point about this is that it's sort of developing what was in your cupboard. So there's no real fixed recipe and sort of Moroccan cooking. It can be, yeah, your mum might have her version, my mum might have her version.

21:18My mum's version would be salt. Salt. It would not be this tasty. Yeah. But I love that. A little crack of pepper. Yeah. No, no, it's not going crazy. It's going crazy. But no, it's really good. I use that all the time. It's nice on fish, you know. And I cut on like a pan-fryer salmon. Yeah. Do it quite dry on the salmon with that. Yeah. And then you say you put the ras-al-halu on top of the chicken and then when you do the rice, just before you put the lid on and the chicken back in, you add that to the rice as well. This is mostly dry rub? Yeah, dry rub. A little bit of oil. Yeah, dry seasonings, yeah.

21:50And then we finished it with coriander, flat leaf parsley and dill. You put some in when you cook the rice and then the rest on top at the end. That's an easy dinner. It's an easy dinner. One pot wonder. I love a one pot wonder. And then you're getting all the chicken juice in the rice. Yeah, of course you have. All the flavour. It's really good. Thank you. That was great. One sort of tip is that if you feel like you need a little bit more colour, because it's hard to colour a whole chicken evenly in a pan, just towards the end, I basically put it under the grill just to get more crispy little skin, which you can do that as well.

22:19That's really tasty. Do you like cooking, Jamali? Do you know what? I do like cooking. Because I don't have too much time to do it. Right. Because I'm travelling or working late. Yeah. So when I do it, it's something like a Sunday, and I get to actually have a day off and cook. I think if I was like, you know, if I had to like feed a family of four, I probably like cooking yeah I'm saying like every day but I do enjoy like then it's like a pleasure for you isn't it yeah yeah it's like an enjoyment thing so I do like cooking yeah what do you like to cook yours or what would you say is your sort of signature dish for a long time my main ingredient was mince for whatever reason I just cooked a lot with mince I cooked ackee and sawfish so I cooked some Jamaican dishes sometimes probably Jamaican dishes they take so long to cook are there any sort of dishes from your mum that did she cook for you when you were a kid mostly it would be chicken and rice That's how I kind of grew up on chicken and rice really.

23:09You know it's funny because my mum used to put baked beans in spaghetti bolognese and I used to love it yeah and I was telling my girl and I was like yeah you know you put beans in it and she goes what do you mean you put beans in it? And I was like yeah she put beans in it and I asked my mum I said mum remember you used to do that thing put beans in it? She goes yeah I only did that because we were poor and you need to spread out the mint. And I go oh because in my mind I'm like oh she's it's for culinary No, no, no, no. Just a poke out of me. I went to other people, where's the beans? Yeah, yeah, yeah.