Dedicated to Helping Serious and Committed Entrepreneurs with Jay Rodgers

0:01Boom! Shake the room, Fire Nation. JLD here and welcome to Entrepreneurs on Fire. Brought to you by the HubSpot. Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals with great shows like Business Made Simple. Today, we'll be breaking down a person who is dedicated to helping serious and committed entrepreneurs. That person is Jay Rogers, who I brought into EO Fire Studios. He is incredibly successful and a serial entrepreneur and is now dedicated to helping entrepreneurs grow their companies, create jobs, and strengthen the foundations of our great country. And today, Foundation will talk about our reasons for becoming an entrepreneur.

0:39We'll talk about the profile of an entrepreneur. We'll talk about how to know if our idea even makes sense. We'll talk about negotiating a deal, using the word no as a starting point, not the finish line, and so much more. And a big thank you for sponsoring today's episode goes to Jay and our sponsors. Business Made Simple, hosted by Donald Miller, is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals. Business Made Simple takes the mystery out of growing your business. Join my friend, Donna Miller, each week as he shares value bombs on topics like the secret to making better marketing decisions.

1:15Listen to Business Made Simple wherever you get your podcasts. Is now your time? Visit thrivetimeshow.com to see testimonials of how Clay Clark's business coaching has helped over 2 ,000 entrepreneurs to dramatically increase profitability. It's month to month and less money than an average minimum wage employee. Schedule your free consultation today at thrivetimeshow.com. Jay, say what's up to Fire Nation and share something that you believe about becoming successful that most people disagree with. There are a lot of definitions for the word failure. I personally believe that the only way a person can fail is to quit trying to win.

1:58You may have a lot of setbacks, but a setback is not a failure unless it becomes the cause for you to quit trying to win. To make this point, when working with mentees, I tell them about Edison's inventing the light bulb. You may well have heard this, but he had 2 ,000 filaments that failed to light the light bulb. And some people might look at that as 2 ,000 failures. entrepreneurs look at it as simply 2 ,000 steps forward on the path to success. I love this. And Fire Nation, this is why I brought Jay on today, because as I'll say again at the end of the show, you're the average of the five people you spend the most time with.

2:47And the time that you spend together with Jay today is going to improve your average, period, end of story because he is dedicated to helping serious and committed entrepreneurs. Fire Nation, that is you. You are serious. You are committed. You are an entrepreneur. And Jay, I want to start off by asking you this. We all have our reasons for becoming an entrepreneur. What is yours? Well, even before, I'd like to go back and add another thought to your original question. Is that okay? Yeah, go for it. Most people promote the idea that you should not put all your eggs in one basket. And when you ask me what I disagreed with, that's one of my big disagreements.

3:31I think entrepreneurs should devote 100 % of their time, their effort, their resources to achieving a very focused goal, which is building a successful company. Many of the young entrepreneurs I mentor say, oh, I'd love to do it, but I've got a family, I've got a wife, I've got children, and they look at that as an excuse to not pursue the entrepreneurial world. It's just not a legitimate excuse. Young people have energy, and the fact is most of them don't have much of a net worth, and that that they do have is pretty much absolutely safe from bankruptcy. their car, their home, all the things it takes to move ahead.

4:25So if the very worst thing happens and they have a failure, they're young enough to keep a roof over the head of the family, to feed them and to move forward. And they've got a whole lifetime to get back on track. So I think they should put all their eggs in one basket. Love that. So we all have our reasons for becoming an entrepreneur. What is yours, Jay? I don't believe I became an entrepreneur. I didn't choose to be an entrepreneur. It chose me. And I know that sounds a little off base to most people. But a case can be made for the fact that entrepreneurs are born, not developed. and I think that is a pretty strong case.

5:17In my personal belief, I think it's part nature and part nurture. Gino Wickman, and by the way, my publisher tells me never talk about anybody else's book, but the only reason I exist is to help serious, committed entrepreneurs grow their companies, so I talk about anybody that is doing anything to help them. Gino, who wrote the book Traction, that about 100 ,000 companies use as their guiding light, and he also developed the entrepreneurial operating system, EOS, and there are thousands that now teach that system. In his book, Entrepreneurial Leap, he offers what I think is the best self-assessment to determine if you are an entrepreneur or if you have entrepreneurial leanings.

6:09so again I just don't think that entrepreneurs are something that that you become I think it's determined fairly early in your lifetime and on that note I really want to break down the profile of an entrepreneur can you do that absolutely the best profile of an entrepreneur I I think, I don't know if you've ever heard of Culture Index, but it's a profiling system. And it shows entrepreneurs, they, number one, rate very, very highly in vision. And in my vision on the Culture Index score is three plus standard deviations above norm. that puts it up in the high 90 percentiles. And their detail is lower than norm, which is interesting.

7:15My detail is two standard deviations below the norm. Jason Williford is a culture index provider here in DFW. and like I think he's convinced me that the entrepreneur rating or score is a combination and I don't know just how it would split between two things one is the strength of their vision and the second is their risk tolerance and he points out that some people don't get into the entrepreneurial world until much later in their life when they've already achieved some wealth. And because of that, their risk tolerance can be a little lower and they still can get into the entrepreneurial world.

8:07And I think really, if you're an entrepreneur, great. If you're not a strong profile for an entrepreneur, you just need to be very careful if you start a business to to surround yourself with the people that cover your short areas. So one thing I really want to move into because my audience, Jay, is filled of entrepreneurs, small business owners, sidepreneurs, people that are really looking to get going in this area. And they have some good business ideas. Like they think, you know what, this could work. This might be the thing that takes me to the next level. But what process should we take to see if our idea even makes sense.

8:51First, you have to remember that ideas are really a dime a dozen. I see hundreds of them. I look at business plans every day. More important is execution. And so those things need to be kept in balance. If I get an idea for a new business, after I've done all my research, and I'm still convinced it's viable, and you may not appreciate this answer, I start the company. And my M &A attorney, David Hammer, has overseen the sale of my last 14 companies. And I had a few before David came on board. Only two of them have been mistakes. You don't do anything without risking, and that happens with all of us.

9:43Again, to answer your question, I think the way to find out if it works is to start the business. I try to determine a business plan that allows me to decide how great it is before I've spent too much money. One of the companies that I sold for several million, we opened up with$3 ,000. Fire Nation, I hope you're realizing that there's a lot of ways to go about the process, but Jay's been there. He's done that. He has the experience. He looks at these things every single day. He's seeing what works, what doesn't work, the process to go through. And we have a lot to go into around this topic when we get back from thanking our sponsors.

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13:21Knowledge will not attract money unless it is organized and directed through practical plans of action. Become the next success story. Schedule your free 13-point assessment today at Thrivetimeshow.com. Jay, we're back. And one thing that I found digging into your history a little bit is that you believe we need to use the word no as a starting point, not a finish line. Why is that? If you're not getting a lot of no's, I can guarantee you're missing a lot of yeses. When someone says no, I might say, I'd sure appreciate your telling me why you don't think this is the right move for you. And starting over, if you get a no, it may simply be because you failed to properly address the objections.

14:14but I grew up believing you were supposed to ask for the order seven times I don't know what today's philosophy is but I absolutely believe that I used to send out a direct mailer that I found that if I would send the same mail to the same person four or five times I was getting about the same percent of acceptance on each mailing I mean, this literally just happened to me. I mean, I met this great guy. We got along very fit. And I was like, you know what? Like, I think I might want to work with this guy at some point, but it just wasn't the right time for any number of reasons. And honestly, I would have forgotten about him.

14:52You know, we met at a conference. I went about my life. He went about his life. But you know, he kept following up like every two or three months. He'd be like, hey, John, just checking in. How are your fitness goals going? Is now a good time for us to talk about maybe working together? And I'd always say no, no, no, because it wasn't. I just wasn't ready. and it wasn't the mindset, wasn't the right place. Just last week, he emailed and I'm like, man, it is the right time. My travel is done for the foreseeable future. We're about to have a child, so I have some other challenges that are coming up.

15:19It's the right time. And I looked back and this guy got literally 13 no's from me over the course of over a year. But he's always in a very friendly way, kept following up, stayed in my periphery. And now this guy's getting a lot of money from me and I'm working with them because of that. So I love this. And Jay, you believe that selling a product doesn't have to be about addressing needs. And that actually flies in the face of what other people have said. So what do you mean by this? Before I answer that, you have caused me to think of a great story on the no answer. I went to Canada for the summer and put my ranch house on the market with a real estate agent.

16:06When I got back, it was years ago when the market was absolutely in the dumps. And he'd only had, I think, two or three showings. And he said, well, I had one person look, they really loved the place, but they wanted to sell their home in a nearby town before they purchased. I said, please give me the name of their broker. I will honor my lease or my agreement with you to pay a commission, but stay out of my way. I called the broker. She brought the couple back the next day. In 45 minutes, he bought the ranch house. He's now one of our mentors on our nonprofit Biz Owners Ed program that has a couple hundred people attending each of the 10 sessions we hold each year.

16:57So no is a great starting point. No is a great starting point, Fire Nation. And then Jay, let's talk about that. Selling a product doesn't have to be about addressing needs. And as I said earlier, that actually flies in the face of what other people have said in the past. So what do you mean by this? I think the greatest story I can tell you, and it's in my book, the bet, but before I started a handmade made-to-measure boot company selling organization, a lady that had worked for me that was very bright decided she wanted to join me in the boot venture. Her name was Katie Barkley. We're out selling back in the 70s.

17:46Our average pair of boots sold for 500 bucks. We've got a handmade or hand designed travel trailer that's a showroom and we're going out to small West Texas towns to sell boots. Fascinating story. The details are in the book. The one I want to tell you is that Katie called on a rancher and he said, little lady, I don't need no boots. I got 36 pair of boots. She looked him in the eye and said, sir, we are not discussing need. Sold him a pair of white quill ostrich boots. The thing most of the world misses is that the percentages vary, but between reasoning, logic, good business sense, and emotion both play a role in virtually every sale.

18:43and you need to remember that people don't make buying decisions purely for logical reasons. They have desire and emotion involved and I think she summed it up so beautifully when she told them that we are not discussing need. And Fire Nation, I hope you're thinking of a time when that exact same thing happened to you because then you can see the truth in that story. And that's why I love stories because we can put ourselves in that situation and be like, yes, that is so true. And Jay, you've developed quite the strategy for negotiating a deal. What is that strategy? Years ago, when I belonged to Joe Mancuso's CEO club, Herb Cohen spoke to our luncheon of about 20, 25 people.

19:36And he told me one thing that I have kept close to my heart and repeated and mentored people with ever since. Very simple. But he said, when you're making a negotiation, care, but not too much. And I think there's, in fact, I just helped a young man that was looking at buying a half a million dollar property. And he was so mostly involved in buying this that he cared too much. I was able to talk him out of it. And six months later, he came back and thanked me profusely. Best deals you'll ever make, you will make with smart people. And so that's one of the things I look for in making deals and negotiating.

20:31The good example is it's much, much better to lose a negotiation 59 to 61 than it is to win it 51 to 49. And this simply means that if you have smart people, they can add a great deal of value to the same deal. My book goes into that, too, but it's so true that it needs to be mentioned. And the other thing, when you negotiate, always know what your BATNA is, best alternative to making a negotiated agreement. that and in the book even a more fascinating story is when I was asked to help someone and instead of worrying about his BATNA I focused on how to change the other party's BATNA he had three partners that were taking advantage of him and he owned 25 % of the company they offered him such a paltry amount for his share and he had been the one that came up with the business that he turned it over to me and his long story short I contacted the NAACP and then I when these folks wouldn't talk or do anything I wrote him and said because you've been unwilling to respond to me I have now found a second approach and Norm is much better off to to give part or all of his ownership to the NAACP, who are very, very expert in minority positions than he is to accept your paltry.

22:21We got more. They bought them out and we got more than we'd agreed to take. Fire Nation, I hope you're enjoying these stories as much as I am. And that's why I want to spend the rest of our time here today talking about the bet and Entrepreneurs All in Strategy to Win in Business. Jay, this is your book. Tell us more. It's my second book. And as I mentioned earlier, my first one, I'm proud to say on both Audible and on Amazon, never got a rating that wasn't a five star. I only had about 50 or 60 ratings, so it's not huge. But those buyers were all entrepreneurs. I'm very proud of that. And as I mentioned earlier, at this stage in life, my wife and I have no children.

23:13We plan to leave all of our assets to the benefit of serious, committed young entrepreneurs. And so the book is my effort to help entrepreneurs. The second book, The Bet, I actually narrated myself and listened to it. Get the narrative version. It's cheaper than the one you buy at Amazon, and it is more fun because I added a few punchlines. But be that as it may, the bet, I'm sure, will help anybody in the entrepreneurial world with many great thoughts and ideas that I've shared there. the bet is titled because the publisher gave me an estimate for doing the book. And it was so much a page for this and so much a page for that.

24:11And I knew her well. I said, Millie, two things. If I'm going to hire you to publish this book, number one, it's not an estimate. It's a fixed price. If it costs you more, tough. If you do it for less, great. And number two, she thought about that and agreed. I said, number two, we're going to have a bet. And she said, what do you mean? I said, I'm going to bet you$10 ,000. You've told me that books like mine frequently return all of the author's cost in royalties. and I said great our bet is I'm going to bet you$10 ,000 that by September 1st 1925 I have not recovered the money I'm paying you and with that bet she thought well you're betting against yourself I said yes she thought again and stuck her hand out and we shook Well, it's a bet I can't lose.

25:12I stay up nights trying to think how to help her win. The things that have happened, one, her publishing company and her reputation became at stake. Since that happened and the bet was made, she flew a photographer in from California to shoot the cover shot of she and I shaking hands on the bet. And when I was a little upset with some of the support from the very bright publishing staff she has that don't know that much about entrepreneurs, she brought aboard a lady that had just finished ghostwriting a book for the richest woman in China. And had her be my support and a shoulder to lean on. I write my own stuff.

26:00But this lady was incredible. I can't tell you how much I spent 80 hours on the phone with her during the writing of the book. So that's the book and that's the bet. And the only reason it exists is the fact is Craig Hall, if you know Craig, he's a billionaire. He was a self-made millionaire early on and became a billionaire, was a billion dollars in debt, got out of it without bankruptcy. He now owns, I think, 100 ,000 homes, apartments, pardon me, across the country, and has got 1 ,000 acres in Napa Valley. But that's the type of people that we're bringing on board to help entrepreneurs and mentor in our program here in DFW.

26:52So the bet's a book to help you grow your company. I started to say Craig wrote two books on entrepreneurs, and he points out that even though they get a lot of publicity, there's only half as many startups today as there was 10 years ago. And oddly enough, with over 3 ,200 counties, parishes, whatever the state subdivisions are in this country, how many of those do you think account for half of the startups? 24. My God, you're good. 20. Wow. Wow. And five of them are in Texas. That's the smartest answer I've ever gotten. You didn't know your stuff. Well, listen, I try, Jay, and I'm looking forward for Fire Nation to consume the bet and entrepreneurs all in strategy to win in business.

27:40And Fire Nation, you're the average of the five people you spend the most time with. And you've been hanging out with JR and JLD today, so keep up the heat. And for links to everything we talked about, visit eofire.com. Type J in the search bar and the show notes page will pop right up. Jay, in just one sentence, what do you want to leave Fire Nation with today? Entrepreneurs have more fun in life than anyone. They do things in their early years that other people are unwilling to do so that in their later years, they can do things other people are unable to do. Wow, I love that in Fire Nation.

28:18I want to thank you for listening. And Jay, I want to thank you for sharing your truth, your knowledge, your wisdom, your experience with Fire Nation today. And for that, we salute you, brother, and we'll catch you on the flip side. Thank you. Hey, Fire Nation, a huge thank you to our sponsors and Jay for sponsoring today's episode and Fire Nation. Over the last decade, I've interviewed more than 4 ,000 of the world's most successful entrepreneurs, and I've created a revolutionary 17-step roadmap to your financial freedom and your fulfillment. I put it all into my first traditionally published book, The Common Path to Uncommon Success, personally endorsed by Seth Godin and Gary Vaynerchuk.

28:57The Common Path to Uncommon Success is the step-by-step guidance that you need to achieve the lifestyle of your dreams. Visit UncommonSuccessBook.com to get your copy and I'll catch you there or on the flip side. Business Made Simple, hosted by Donald Miller, is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals. Business Made Simple takes the mystery out of growing your business. Join my friend, Donna Miller, each week as he shares value bombs on topics like the secret to making better marketing decisions. Listen to Business Made Simple wherever you get your podcasts.

29:34Is now your time? Visit thrivetimeshow.com to see testimonials of how Clay Clark's business coaching has helped over 2 ,000 entrepreneurs to dramatically increase profitability. It's month to month and less money than an average minimum wage employee. Schedule your free consultation today at thrivetimeshow.com.