Who’s the sheriff in AI’s wild west? (Equity Live at TechCrunch Disrupt 2026)

0:00Sean O'Kane: This episode of Equity is brought to you by Schneider Electric. Schneider Electric, advancing energy tech.

0:17Anthony Ha: Hello and welcome to Equity, TechCrunch's flagship podcast about the business of startups. I'm Kirsten Korosek, and I'm joined, as always, by our weekend editor, Anthony Ha, and senior reporter, special project, Sean O 'Kane. We're here live in person. Exciting.

0:34Sean O'Kane: Super exciting.

0:35Anthony Ha: Yeah, yeah. What are you looking forward to?

0:37Sean O'Kane: I'm definitely looking forward to the Flock interview tomorrow. I know we have RJ Skaringe on stage today, right?

0:44Anthony Ha: Yeah, in a couple hours.

0:45Sean O'Kane: Very, very soon, yeah. So I would say those are two big ones, and then also the startup battlefield. Startup Battlefield is a big one. And of course, like it's a bunch of founders who are very excited to be here. Companies you probably haven't heard of before. They're going to be going toe to toe on the disrupt stage. Yeah.

0:59Kirsten Korosec: What about you, Sean? We've got a big space gun. I feel like we're rearing the lead. There's a big space gun over here at the main stage. Now, I mean, there's a lot of space stuff, which is exciting for me. A lot of satellite stuff, which is really cool. Obviously mobility. It was such an interesting crop of startups to claw through this year as we got ready for the show. I think the theme, unsurprisingly, is AI, but more specifically, building durable businesses with AI, durable startups, and trying to find a path forward. And I'm excited to have a lot of those conversations this week. I think as we take a look at what's happening in the news, though, we have a lot of questions that still need to be answered about how that technology gets used, right?

1:39Anthony Ha: Yeah, I mean, it brings up like the idea of like, what is durability? And And to me, a key piece of durability is security. And we have a lot of examples, even just a few days ago, of AI agents kind of going rogue. I mean, there was the Anthropic situation that just happened. There's so many situations, though, right? Right.

1:58Sean O'Kane: I mean, it seems like the last few months have just been this cascading series of headlines where it's just like, oh, OpenAI admits that this AI agent did this thing that it didn't want. And then Anthropic has an announcement, and then OpenAI has another announcement. So in this case, there were a couple big pieces. One was that they had reported that they filed a false police report. And that was just, I guess, one of a whole cluster of different rogue AI agent activities. And so what Anthropic was trying to say was, well, I guess, first of all, oops. And then secondly, so moving forward. That's a technical term, right?

2:32Sean O'Kane: That's what we're here for. That's what you need the journalists for.

2:34Anthony Ha: By the way, not to interject, but that police report thing, the thing that caught my eye was the fact that nothing came of it because it was caught in a spam folder, which was like a really lucky...

2:44Sean O'Kane: It always comes back to email. You know, then the flip side of that as well, if there's more and more things like that, then maybe more and more legit things start to go to the spam folder. So that still can do potential harm. So at least what Anthropic is doing for the near term is we're just going to basically all, when we're testing our agents, we're not going to connect those computers to the internet, essentially.

3:04Kirsten Korosec: Which seems challenging, right? I mean, these things need to be able to access the internet to be able to do a lot of the tasks, especially as we talk again and again and again about agentic AI and being able to do things for you. They need to be able to train on that stuff. And I think there is a bit of a question right now of, okay, it can be good from a safety perspective to cut off that access, but what is that going to mean for the models that end up getting released? How are they going to approach training it? I do want to say really quickly, the police report was submitted in Philadelphia.

3:34Kirsten Korosec: I think this was revenge for Pitchbot. This was AI coming back and saying, you murdered our robot friend a decade ago, and now we're going to mess with your police department.

3:45Anthony Ha: Interesting conspiracy theories here on this stage. It disrupts. It's the first of many. Anthropic isn't the only company that is dealing with this. I mean, we've seen a series of these. And it really gets to me thinking about what needs to be happening at the front end instead of this sort of reactive period I feel like we're in. And I don't know if you two have that same sense, but just since this summer, really since the hugging face incident with OpenAI, it just seems like a snowball effect is occurring where it's just we're still catching up. We're still catching up to how to get ahead of this.

4:19Anthony Ha: And then there's, of course, this debate of is this an engineering problem or is this something else a little bit more, you know, Doomer-esque that's playing out in the industry right now?

4:31Sean O'Kane: Right. So just as another example of the discourse around this over the weekend, Microsoft Satya Nadella, the CEO, he put out this kind of long post where he talked about the idea. Again, these sort of I guess we're kind of in this season of like AI executives putting out these long posts, which is like, these are my proposals for how we can fix this.

4:49Anthony Ha: It feels like 2010, like the CEO blogs are back now.

4:52Sean O'Kane: Right, right. And I think like we should talk about the substance of what he said, but also zooming out slightly. I think part of the reason why they're putting out all these proposals is because they're like, if we don't have our own plan, then that plan is going to be imposed on us by, you know, state governments, probably not the federal government, at least we'll see. But I think that and very notably, this plan doesn't say anything about regulation. It's about here are some technical fixes that might give us more control over these agents in the future.

5:18Kirsten Korosec: Am I crazy? Like, why are we talking about this now and not a year ago? Like these models were definitely worse a year ago, but they were still able to do some of the basic things that we're talking about here, like accessing the Internet, doing some of this basic work and getting in position where they could veer in a bad direction. They had that freedom, even in the public versions that were released to consumers. So I feel I feel crazy that we're talking about this. Like, you know, it's just like one of those situations where you've got the ultimate CEO post. You're right. It's like a very CEO blog from like the early 2010s of like, where have you been?

5:52Kirsten Korosec: You know, was Satya too busy trying to make Google dance that like he forgot to check the models that they were training?

5:58Anthony Ha: Yeah. I mean, the quote here is we must assume a model is compromised and contain it from the start. Think of it like an emergency brake. And, you know, as a transportation editor, I like to think of emergency brakes and the components of that being put in place in the vehicle prior to it being sold. Yeah. Not after. That's aftermarket.

6:16Kirsten Korosec: Right, right.

6:17Anthony Ha: Well, I will say that there are opportunities then as a result of this sort of reactive period. And NVIDIA, I wrote a story just a few weeks ago about, you know, their system that is very largely much open source based on reigning in these sort of rogue AI agents. And Jensen Wong, the founder and CEO of NVIDIA, very much falls in that this is an engineering problem side of the debate. And they opened OpenShell, which is this idea of creating these layers that will provide these security layers, the emergency break, if you will, and will allow for the kind of testing that you want to do and not divorce it from the live Internet, which I think is an important piece.

7:01Anthony Ha: But to me, what's really interesting, because we're here at Disrupt with so many startups, NVIDIA the giant is not the only company trying to address this problem. There's a ton of other startups that are, you know, really tackling this emergency break piece of it or security piece of it.

7:17Kirsten Korosec: I mean, if it's an engineering problem, I think we need to think about whether or not those people are going to be held responsible if things get really out of control. And I think that's one of the reasons that this conversation gets so complicated, because the closer you get to treating it that way, the more likely you are to be regulated or held accountable for the actions of the software that you're creating. Again, certainly not at the federal level right now, but I do wonder at what point, you know, what state attorney general is going to do that. Startups don't necessarily have to worry about that as much right now, especially the ones that we have here this week.

7:49Kirsten Korosec: But when you're looking for guidance as to where this stuff is going, you're looking to those bigger companies and looking to see whether or not they're doing it. One thing I would love to know is, are they going out and buying insurance against that? Are they hedging in some way for an eventual future where they're going to have to deal with that?

8:05Anthony Ha: Well, I mean, I'll take the free market position on this as a capitalist and say, sure, there might be a regulatory piece to this. But what about just companies that are not addressing this problem will fail? I mean, is that a fair enough point? Or is it, you know, some of these companies are far too big that we need to have a regulatory stance in controlling sort of the security component?

8:27Kirsten Korosec: I mean, it's just one of those situations where it would be nice to have an actively engaged regulatory scheme at the federal level so that we can figure out some of the answers to those questions.

8:36Sean O'Kane: Yeah, and I mean, I do think it is important to remember that all the CEOs like sort of making this pitch for either no regulation or extremely limited regulation like that is in their interest. and they want to frame this as an engineering problem as much as possible. And I think it is that, but also we all, everyone here also has a stake in the outcome and, you know, the free market is not always the best way to sort of start all of that out. That said, and then, well, I think another question then is to what extent is this a problem then that a startup outside one of the frontier companies can solve versus like they have to make it safer themselves because they're the ones building these models.

9:12Sean O'Kane: Like, how much can you make it safer when you're just reacting to changes in these models? That said, I mean, our colleague Rom, I think, look at Crunchbase and PitchBook, and he saw, like, two dozen companies selling some form of AI agent security. I mean, that's almost certainly an undercount. That's just, like, what he was able to find on a quick search. So clearly there are companies getting funded in this space, and that makes sense.

9:32Anthony Ha: There are a ton of them, and there are a ton that we have covered here, since we do love our startups. And a few of them, like Air, they raised$50 million to vet the tools that agents use. Of course, then there's like Ricoh, which raised$55 million as an AI agent security startup sort of effort. You know, the interesting thing to me is the stakes are higher for these smaller startups, right? And OpenAI can afford a little bit to be reactive because they're well capitalized. But these companies really, not only is there an opportunity, but they have to be sure that their product is sort of working and they can't react to things.

10:15Anthony Ha: So, you know, credit to all the startup founders out there that are really trying to get ahead of this issue.

10:20Kirsten Korosec: Yeah, I mean, again, this is another interesting sort of hedge that we're seeing where Sequoia is backing one of these companies, Symphony. and you're thinking about protecting yourself on letting startups get creative, find ways to help solve this problem while also backing the biggest companies that are, I don't want to say creating the problem, but where these questions are being generated from. And that's good on the investor side. And there's so much capital to play with now, especially among some of those bigger investors and these biggest firms that they can play all of these pieces. You know, it's really like, you know, it's like protecting yourself on the downside risk of like a public markets trade.

11:01Kirsten Korosec: Like it's kind of how I think about it. And I think that's really interesting. And I think that's a really exciting place for startup founders to be because you can say, I don't want to go after this big problem that has big thorny questions. But I think I have a really clever idea how to hedge against it in this way.

11:17Anthony Ha: Yeah. I wonder how many slices that you can make, though, within this. because we have a nice little list here that our producer compiled for us based on our coverage. And the list is endless. And I'm like, how many more, like how thinly can we slice it? How many startups can exist just addressing this issue alone of being less reactive and with security first?

11:40Sean O'Kane: Right. It's probably not a winner take all type situation. Arguably compared to some other areas in AI, but this is where you can imagine that different companies are going to want to work with security vendors. I mean, because a lot of these where the security comes in is they're being bought. The customer is the company developing this model or building agents. And then they're like, oh, yeah, I'd prefer if this agent doesn't go wildly out of control and commit crimes. And so let's buy the software to make sure that doesn't happen. And so, yeah, I don't know that like there's necessarily going to be 20 of these companies, you know, a few years from now.

12:11Sean O'Kane: But I could imagine there being three or five that are successful. so it doesn't, yeah, and then how you slice it, I can imagine you're probably getting into stuff that, you know, somebody maybe knows a bit more about security, but I'm also curious about how much it's going to be new startups and how much it's also, you know, on this list, we have CrowdStrike, you know, other companies that have been around for a while, but if you're a security company now, obviously agents are going to have to be a huge part of what you're thinking about.

12:35Kirsten Korosec: I know it's not necessarily a problem for most of the consumer models, and we're talking more about the ones that are being trained, but have you guys had, have you used anything that has

12:47Anthony Ha: I haven't had some of the high profile incidents like something booking something for me. And the famous one, of course, is the gym reservation. I haven't had anything like that. But I'm also naturally suspicious of keeping up. So I tend to limit sort of access. But you've been playing around with Muse a little bit.

13:08Kirsten Korosec: Yeah. It hasn't really gone rogue, I would say. It's definitely, I think, the strangest experience using Muse is what I've been doing. when it is just like sort of very plainly showing you how it's clicking around. I mean, we're back to like sort of what we saw happening in the back end of like the Rabbit R1 and like lots of these other sort of automated software systems that were being pitched as agentic like two years ago, but weren't really quite there. And so it's funny to see it like break that illusion where it's like literally dragging a mouse around a screen in the app on your phone. The only situation where I've come across something that has made me feel a little worried is actually in the course of doing our job where like I wasn't even meaning to use an AI agent of any kind, but I was calling a police department to try and find more information about a police report.

13:53Kirsten Korosec: And whatever front end voice agent system they were using took me asking for information about police reports at a certain location as me reporting a problem at that location. And it ended with the voice agent telling me that it was going to send somebody to that location. So I very quickly had to get back on the phone and find a human and say, please stand down. I do not want to be involved in this. And that felt a little freaky.

14:20Anthony Ha: Well, so I'm sure there's a startup out there, you know, working on that sort of identity issue, right? I mean, I think Oak is backed in like 60 million in funding. They just came out of style to fix the identity mess that AI agents are making. So you see a lot of these opportunities. It does feel right now, though, as I said, you know, just a few minutes ago, this sort of reactive moment where we're not quite ahead yet. And I'm sure that there may be some startups that are here this week that are, you know, tackling that issue.

14:54Sean O'Kane: Yeah, I mean, I think what will also be interesting to see is whether there are use cases that start to emerge or people starting to talk more publicly about approaches that you said that are more proactive. Right. Because right now it's mostly just like, oh, we screwed up. Like it's just this, you know, one after another. But if companies can actually say, hey, you know, we are much more secure and we've done this testing. I mean, I imagine that probably another thing that will have to emerge for those stories to start to happen is some kind of standardization around kind of like certifications and things like that and ways to be able to say, hey, a third party has verified that my agents are not out there doing bad things.

15:35Anthony Ha: Yeah, in the nerdy transportation world, there are like these third party validators and certification that you can have that meet like certain technical and security quality measures. And I kind of wonder if that will happen in this realm.

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16:27Kirsten Korosec: I mean, you always run the risk of what's the SKCD comic of like, we have too many standards. We need to come up a way to simplify this. We now have one more standard than we already had. There's always the risk of that. I do think there's an element of, maybe I'm reading between the lines here, but if you read Satya's post that we talked about, I think he's like aiming in that direction of some of those ideas. But again, there's this, there's this like trust fall gap of the companies are enjoying the fact that they don't really have to do some of that work right now which is like I personally think is why we're seeing so much reactive versus proactive and so they're they're just trying to luxuriate in that as long as they can and who can blame them right like if you're if you're not being regulated you take advantage of that as much as you can but he's aiming in that direction and so it really turns into a situation of who will stand up and start to come up with some of those standardized things that you know But he makes some good points in that.

17:22Kirsten Korosec: He makes a point in that post about we need to be careful not to have, we can set up these monitoring systems when we're testing, but we don't want to turn it into a black box nested in a black box. He's aware that this could spiral. Just putting raw effort into more monitoring could turn into a situation where it actually gets worse. And so how do you balance that out? Then it just becomes a question of who actually takes that step.

17:46Anthony Ha: Yeah, I mean, right now, I mean, this terrible analogy, but in the era of the Wild West, which was a very short period of time and incredibly chaotic, and there was a lot of mayhem, and then the pendulum swings. You don't want the pendulum to swing so much to the other extreme that it wipes out innovation, right?

18:01Kirsten Korosec: My God, now I'm thinking about an AI Pinkerton agency. Don't go there, sorry. That's all I'm going to think about the rest of this episode.

18:10Sean O'Kane: Yeah, and I think, Sean, one thing you were saying earlier is that obviously this is a situation, this kind of Wild West era, a situation that these AI companies have taken advantage of in a lot of ways. You also use the word luxuriated. I think probably they are no longer luxuriating in it quite as much. Maybe. I think they're a little concerned at this point, which is why you're seeing the flurry of posts and meetings, because I think there's a little bit of a tone of, is this enough? Is this enough? Is this enough? And so, you know, I don't know that it's necessarily the number one thing on their minds, but I think it's up there.

18:48Kirsten Korosec: It's like my six-year-old who's starting to really enjoy testing whether he could swear or not, you know, and it's just like, he'll let it out and you can kind of see his eye trained over to see if he's getting a reaction.

18:59Sean O'Kane: Yeah. And I mean, I think on that question of kind of what does it look like to move from reactive to proactive and also this question of like, why weren't they more serious about this before, because that was also my thought, like reading Nadella's post where there are things where, again, like he talks about the emergency break and like, you know, there should always be somebody who knows how to like turn the thing off if it's starting to go bad. And definitely my first response is like, yeah, obviously, like why, how could that not be something you're thinking about before? But speaking about that transition, there was this great quote that the founder of this company, Hidden Layer, shared with us, which is this idea that when agents reach production, the scale of their cost and risk goes from theoretical to full scale really quickly.

19:38Sean O'Kane: And so like over 50 of his customers have AI agents in production touching critical systems and sensitive assets. And so I think that speaks to just like how we are like at this really, really critical transition point where we're going from, hey, AI is this thing I'm trying out to AI is this thing that's part of my business. And I could really screw up a company's business if it doesn't do what it's supposed to do.

20:00Anthony Ha: Well, it goes back to sort of our theme, which is durability. I think the startups that can solve that and sort of, again, be the answer to these companies that are reacting, not only does it make the larger company that they might be serving as an enterprise customer durable, but it also helps them either raise funding or exist as a company and become more durable. To me, what's really going to be interesting is not just how many little slices or little fragments of this sort of security question, different startups. But then how many of these startups end up getting acquired? Because I don't know if they're all going to fold or fail or whatever.

20:40Anthony Ha: I actually see a lot of opportunity for the Microsofts of the world to go, oh, that's an interesting startup. Oh, that's an interesting startup. Let's just fold this in instead of having them as a customer.

20:52Kirsten Korosec: Well, and that's where we come back to, what do we call it? The morally binding agreement that we saw at the White House. are we in a situation where if a bunch of startups come up with clever ideas that can help the bigger companies reign in this problem and they get acquired by those companies are those companies going to be incentivized in any way to share that approach or that knowledge or that tool or whatever it is because you look at that framework agreement whatever you want to call it it does not seem like it is really putting pressure on any of these companies to do something like that they all say that they want to be able to sort of match each other on these capabilities but you know when push comes to stuff we're already seeing a differentiation let's say between how they're all approaching the speed that they're operating at like anthropics talking about pacing the frontier open ai is kind of talking about taking a more cautious approach but then we have meta you know releasing muse and then releasing its sort of like frontier versions of muse this week and talking about no i'm going to take the foot off the gas like if you have one company doing that, let alone a split of a few, that balance is never going to get struck.

22:01Kirsten Korosec: And so it's just hard to imagine a world in which they're all going to sort of work together.

22:05Anthony Ha: Well, there's nothing like one big company hitting the accelerator, so to speak. All the other companies are going to then want to respond to that. They're not going to kick back and relax and go, yeah, you got this.

22:15Sean O'Kane: Yeah. I mean, I think in terms of durability, I feel like security in general is an area where risk and opportunity are sort of intertwined and the risk is kind of forever, right? Because in this case, the agents, the models, those are going to keep advancing so that you're going to have to continue developing new technology to control that, to respond to that. And again, this is where the engineering challenge meets kind of the bigger world is the attention that this is getting going to be durable or is this something where they will reach a point where they feel like, okay, like people are freaking out about something else so we don't have to worry about this as much, which is possible.

22:51Sean O'Kane: Well, I do think that certainly over the next year, and this is beyond just like enterprise, but I think it affects consumer AI adoption as well. Because if all you're reading day after day is like this AI agent has gone and like submitted like false police reports or what have you, we've talked before about how like, you know, sometimes this kind of doomerism can be a kind of marketing because it is like, wow, like this is how capable. But I mean, that seeing that does not inspire me to want to use AI more in my life. I mean, I think it was last week I was talking about the fact that like I'm not going to let an agent like get my credit card information or like get access to like, you know, to my hard drive, which obviously means that a huge swath of those capabilities are just not usable by me.

23:31Sean O'Kane: And like a big part of that is because I just keep seeing stories like this. And I'm like, why would I let one of those things have, you know, like be able to make purchases for me?

23:39Anthony Ha: Well, OK, so I want everyone to mark their calendar. And this time next year, we're going to see how much has changed.

23:44Sean O'Kane: Absolutely.

23:44Anthony Ha: I'm going to make a prediction that you will have given it access over the next year.

23:48Sean O'Kane: Yeah, I'm not making this as a, this is not a forever promise. It's in the same way that there was a period where I was like, oh, I would never make a major purchase on my smartphone. And then at a certain point I did, right? But I don't feel the need to be one of the early adopters. Somebody else can do that with their credit card.

24:03Kirsten Korosec: Yeah, but Siri's not submitting a false police department.

24:06Sean O'Kane: So far, yeah.

24:07Anthony Ha: Well, I made a prediction, again, back to that sort of durability idea and all these different startups that are popping up and getting substantial backing to tackle this issue of like rogue agents and security. My prediction is that a lot of these are going to be acquired, just sort of like what we saw in the first wave of SaaS startups getting swallowed up by like Salesforce. And what do you think is going to happen? Do you agree or do you think that some other?

24:32Sean O'Kane: Yeah, I think there's going to be a lot of acquisitions, but I do think there's going to be value in independent companies that can like, I think trust is going to be really valuable over the next year or two, and it's going to be very hard for OpenAI or Anthropic or Meta to say, we fixed this, trust us, it's all good now. I think you're going to need someone, whether it's a different company, some sort of government agency, some sort of nonprofit, to say, yeah, that's actually true. I think that if they just hoover everything up and just say it's good, I don't think that's going to solve the issue, at least from a perception point of view, probably not from a technology point of view either.

25:09Kirsten Korosec: Zuck's world is golden. You can take him at his word when he says, trust me. I don't know. I mean, I think acquisitions probably are on the horizon. Also, as I'm broadly curious about this in AI, the tension between a company starting up its own take on security, you know, sort of agentic work, whatever it is, and the bigger companies just being able to create that internally. You know, these models are becoming so much more capable. We're hearing so much about companies being able to create very specific and bespoke tools using this technology. I'm very interested in that tension, too. Like how much of the momentum towards acquisition gets pushed back by the ability to just say, that's a great idea.

25:54Kirsten Korosec: I'm going to go build it myself.

25:55Anthony Ha: Yeah. Well, I'm curious to see how many deals happen here at Disrupt this week.

26:00Kirsten Korosec: Hey, if you want to back my Pinkerton AI agency, come see me after the taping.

26:04Sean O'Kane: It is so depressing to think how much funding you might actually get for that. No, I hate it. I know, I'm not saying it's good, but I bet you could get somebody to write you a check for that.

26:14Anthony Ha: They may be sitting in the audience right now.

26:16Kirsten Korosec: The Pinkertons are actually backstage waiting to hit me with a copyright lawsuit.

26:20Anthony Ha: I am looking forward to a number of things this week. I always look forward to you introducing the Battlefield participants, by the way, because you bring such joy to the role, so I can't wait to watch you.

26:32Sean O'Kane: Yeah, I'm excited.

26:33Anthony Ha: And then in just a couple of hours, I'll be interviewing the CEO and founder of Rivian. And I do think that everyone should watch that one because there's a lot to talk about. This is a company, speaking of AI, that started as an EV maker and kind of is in robotics and building its own AI assistant and building an agentic system for its vehicles. There's a lot going on there.

26:58Kirsten Korosec: And a company that's probably older than a lot of the startup founders that are here. It was founded in 2009. Yeah. We're getting there. Oh, that's depressing. Yeah, yeah.

27:05Sean O'Kane: Wait, if we're previewing Disrupt, what's the deal with the space gun? Is somebody going to get fired into space?

27:10Kirsten Korosec: I do not think somebody's going to get fired into space, but, you know, you can never rule anything out. Knock on wood.

27:16Anthony Ha: Gotcha. Well, is there anything else that you're looking forward to that folks should tune into?

27:21Kirsten Korosec: Oh, I mean, I'm just so excited to get on the floor and see more of the Battlefield companies. It's so exciting for us to be able to watch them come through the process and read about them on the page, but then see them in action and see, you know, the Bolt robot, like go bolt the bolts on the pipeline or, you know, the robot that's supposed, I guess I just like the robots, the robot's supposed to clean buildings. Like it's so much fun to see people in person actually, you know, walk you through their dream.

27:49Anthony Ha: Yeah, absolutely. Well, we have to go, but you can always find us on social.

27:54Sean O'Kane: At Equity Pod on X and Threads. And for those of you who don't subscribe on your favorite podcast app, You can also check out Equity there. And we also are on YouTube, so you can watch us there.

28:04Anthony Ha: Yeah. Thanks so much. Equity is produced by Teresa Locansolo with editing by Kel. We'd also like to thank TechCrunch's audience development team. Thank you so much for listening, and we'll talk to you next time.