'Parky' Anthony Parkinson MBE | Extraordinary Life Stories

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0:45Get in the game and sign up for the Venmo Debit Card at venmo.com slash college card. The Venmo MasterCard is issued by the Bancorp Bank N.A. Select schools available. Venmo Stash terms and exclusions apply at venmo.me slash stash terms. Max$100 cash back per month. You're aware now London's approaching, you're on the wing of Concorde, you know, the smoke's coming on. And as I sort of looked towards London, the crowd, the millions of people in London saw us approaching and it was almost like London lit up with these flashes. You flew me in a Spitfire. Yep. I'm still buzzing now. You've been in the Red Arrows, Typhoon, Tornado.

1:20How many jets have you flown? Any pilot, the day they write Spitfire in their logbook, it's a pretty special moment. and but you know I look back now and I would still love to have a go flying a Phantom again or an F-16 you know even a Hawk did you ever have any getting used to G-force because you can't train for that right you know first time you pulled a bit of G it was like oh that's a strange feeling you know the blood obviously can pull into your feet and if you keep pulling you can lose your eyesight you gray out etc you know you know to the F-16 or the Eurofighter that is 9G you really did have to strain to stay conscious and you know it was fairly brutal the experience you know and hopefully you'll be able to back this up but you know it lives with you for a while and and you genuine you know in the pub will be able to tell people what it's like to fly spitfire anthony parkinson thank you for joining me pleasure last time i saw you three or four days ago you flew me in a spitfire yep i can't tell you how much of it is i'm still buzzing now so tell me who is Anthony Parkinson?

2:25Well I'm now a 60 year old who spent 33 years flying in the Royal Air Force, had a very very lucky career and flew some amazing things it's almost extraordinary when I look back now slightly dreamlike but a career in the Air Force and then I joined a company called AeroLegends that fly Spitfires and I fly passengers like yourself experience probably the greatest aircraft ever built so um yeah that's me in a nutshell so did you always want to be a pilot yeah there was no real uh plan b it was quite cliche you know i was into the movies into the you know just the raf from a very young age the thought of being a fighter pilot it just seemed a no-brainer the only snag was it looked quite difficult to get there so um you know my routine was very keen through the cadets at school i got a flying scholarship so at 17 the air force gave me 30 hours free flying which was wonderful so i got my my ppl my pilot's license at 17 and then somehow managed to uh pass the interviews joined straight through uh you know pilot training and then um you know i had my my stickies on a phantom at the age of 21 and and stayed flying essentially fast jets for about you know 15 20 odd years so uh yeah take me through because the little I know about you from almost retrospectively getting to know having sitting in a cockpit behind you flying four days ago is you've been in the Red Arrows, Typhoon, Tornado.

3:54How many jets have you flown? Yeah, there's a few of them there. So I started on the F-4 Phantom, then converted to the Tornado F-3, that's the air defence variant, and then did an exchange, which was flying with the Dutch Air Force. So I was the one Brit on a Dutch squadron at Learwarden in Holland, flying the F-16. Did that for three years, came back. Then I was an instructor on the tornado, but I was given the solo display. So for two years, that was 99-2000, I was the sort of, at air shows, you see a solo jet doing an eight minute routine. That was me in the tornado with my navigator, Dave Haake.

4:34And from that, I then sort of, always not by choice, but then sort of drifted into the display world and then applied for the Red Arrows, got the Reds. So I did four years with the Red Arrows. I thought this has got to end because I've had so many good deals, but I decided I got a very early slot on the Eurofighter Typhoon and did that for seven years. And then the final one was whilst flying the Eurofighter, sort of secondary duty, if you like, was flying for the Battle of Britain Memorial flight. So flying the Spitfire and Hurricane for them. So absolutely extraordinary. And yeah, just an amazing sort of generation of jets from the sort of the old Phantom all the way up to the fourth generation, as they call it, the Eurofighter.

5:17And now the World War II stuff. So yeah, blessed, extraordinary. With all that experience that you've had, we're sort of looking back. If there's one plane you could fly tomorrow, what would it be? That's a good question. I mean, I'm so lucky at the moment to be flying the Spitfire on a fairly regular bait. I love the fact you still feel that. For me, it was bucket list. I must tell you that, you know, to have that opportunity and to be flown by you as well. And to make the experience where you knew I'd done a little bit of chipmunk flying when my cadet did. It's lovely to find out prior to flying a passenger, just because you get all sorts, you know, some guys, you know, I've had guys who've got 20 ,000 hours of flying airliners or lots of flying.

5:57And there's some people, I flew a passenger that genuinely had never flown in an aircraft, not even on an airline or anything. So their first ever experience of getting airborne was in a Spitfire, which was fairly unique. But you just it's lovely just to find out that background. And, you know, I knew straight away that you'd done a bit of cadet flying. So in the chipmunk, you'd been upside down. So, you know, we did a few victory rolls and, you know, probably the same as you remember. but it's just lovely to do it and and just to sort of gauge where you know where the uh the person about wants to be at but uh Spitfire is clearly um you know the the all-time favorite that you know it has to be I think in any pilot the day they write Spitfire in their log book it's a pretty special moment and but you know I look back now and I I would still love to have a go flying a Phantom again or an F-16 you know even a Hawk little Red Arrow Hawk they're just fabulous bits of machinery all i've never flown an aircraft i haven't loved to be honest you know i just enjoy flying they're all slightly different akin to you know different types of car but they're all pretty good ones yeah you know they're old they're new some are different got more high-tech stuff in them but generally they're certainly some of the aircraft i've flown the performance has been utterly staggering and just as nice aircraft to fly you know of which the Spitfire as you now know you know it's uh it's up there it's not a difficult thing to fly it's uh well that's what you made so so relatable for as a youngster making airfix kits yeah painting i'm looking out on the wing and having this whole moment of wow i'm in one and then understanding and knowing that the maneuverability kind of won the war in the skies and the messer smith couldn't and he demonstrated that and i've got to be honest with you i lost my stomach and went really lightheaded on the really really banking turn i don't know i don't gee we pull yeah actually probably quite little but it's just something you get used to yeah yeah that's what i wanted to ask you did you that passion you had to be a pilot to then go to to the fact that you've flown almost every fast jet there is so to speak did you ever have any getting used to g-force because you can't train for that right no no you do and again it's stepping stone you know the first jet i flew it's very odd i did pilot training in america so i flew i think with the t37 a little side by side twin engine jet from the sort of back from the 50s uh you know didn't go fast and this was in texas bizarrely a year there and it was hot and you know there wasn't a lot of thrust but you know she'd get herself up to about I don't know 230 knots and you know you'd maybe pull four or five g there was no g suit but you know first time you pulled a bit of g it was like oh that's a strange feeling you know the the blood obviously can pull into your feet and if you keep pulling you can lose your eyesight you gray out etc you know black out lose consciousness so it's something that you you build up to and your g tolerance build up to you get used to it and then you know stepping stone you know to the f-16 or the eurofighter that is 9g and you know you put especially probably more in the the f-16 the the kit you know you just had a g suit that was you really did have to strain to stay conscious and you know it was fairly brutal what are you doing what is the sort of technique is it is it a certain amount of breathing is it a hyper kind of yeah you're straining your abdomen muscles and your leg muscles you're basically trying to stop the blood pooling in your legs to keep it pumping around you so if you strain really hard and breathe and uh and there's a technique to it um you know you can you practice it in a centrifuge first and you sort of you work up you know had to do that in the f-16 so you you basically spin around pulling 9g for about a minute and it's horrid um but uh you know the jet's the same um and and again you know you you need to be on your game you know it's uh 9g is uh it's quite hard work you know you can come up and you've got almost like bruising on your body if you've done an air combat sortie for 20 minutes in a typhoon on f-16 you know it's hard but you get used to it and uh and uh yeah it's fine and i bet if we did a second trip you know you'd be like oh yeah geez easy yeah because i've done a lot of karting done racing i'm the one that will hunt out the sort of more extreme roller coaster ride and so for me i was genuinely quite surprised when we took off i was like It doesn't matter what you'll do.

10:07Yeah. And then that particular turn. And then one of my questions is going to be how severe was that? Clearly it was nothing like the capability of what the plane was. Yeah, probably under 3G. I mean, that sounds bad because you probably thought it was loads, but, you know, probably less than a roller coaster almost, you know. But, yeah, just getting used to it. Yeah. There was a safety briefing, as you can imagine, and that reminded me that any one time when you fly, especially in an old plane or pioneering a new plane there's a danger element have you ever had an experience that's clearly had to eject or not eject jet wise I've had a few engine failures but luckily they've always been in twin-engined aircraft at the time so I haven't with the Hawk or the F-16 which was single engine but the others I think all of them I you know I have had engine failures but you know on one engine they all fly beautifully like an airliner would for example so again not an issue you know you do the drills and that's fine um spitfire wise you know a couple of moments where the engine's not been you know perfect i'm going to get but you know you you do the drills you do what you need to do at touchwood they've uh my number of takeoffs and landings have all been the same good it's a standout experience for you all the things you've done you know doing red arrow displays in probably the most beautiful locations is that if you close your eyes and thought about all things is there one that stands out probably the reds is uh is one that definitely leaps to mind you know there would be big events of which probably uh the greatest privilege maybe to have been part of it wasn't really the most demanding but it was the um golden jubilee of the queen so we flew on the wing of concord down the mall and um you know that was pretty special concord is a was a beautiful looking jet but particularly close to it airborne um I was sort of a couple of outs on the right hand side and and I can remember running in you know it was a big day and it was this was in 2002 so prior to you know everybody having probably they still had cameras around or maybe there was some sort of primitive mobile phones etc but you could really see you're aware now London's approaching you're on the wing of Concord you know the smoke's coming on and I guess I had a cheeky peek out the front you're pretty much concentrating on formation position but I couldn't stop myself and as I sort of looked towards London I guess the the crowd the millions of people in London saw us approaching and it was almost like London lit up with these flashes and you could see the mall you know in sort of maybe about five miles away just lit up and it was just aware of the enormity of the occasion it was that was super special um venues you know with the reds flown low over um you know lakes in canada over victoria falls we've flown over the pyramids flown over the burj al-arab in dubai we did an air show there which was the most breathtaking venue um you know out to to malaysia some places just extraordinary you do get some most fabulous views and uh uh displaying you know my memories of the reds really are just you know lots of red aircraft in very close proximity and the world revolving around it as you're doing aeros but um breathtaking and often it's just the you know the transit back and a decent sunset and you've got nine little jets together and you really get a a buzz of what a wonderful world it is and and how special it is but uh yeah loads of memories i love that and i love the fact you ended on the um the reds in formation because there's a camaraderie there A certain amount of what you do, you're isolated.

13:40If you're in the jet flying on your own, then it's all about you and your world and controlling yourself. But with nine aircraft flying in that formation, there's a huge trust. There must be an element of band of brothers, if you like, going on there, because at the end of one time, you're affecting in terms of lives how your discipline is. Yeah, definitely. The trust is there. you know you'll often sort of see pictures of us sort of formating and if you're sort of maybe down the back end somewhere you know there's a guy right in front of you with his tailpipe quite close but you're not looking at him you're looking to the left and that's a possibly a strange concept because you know he'll be okay he won't back into you or or go low and that's just how it is in your peripheral and most of the formation flying you know or most of the you know fast jet military RAF flying is not a singleton's you know the the the jets that we flew would generally be a four-ship, at least a pair.

14:33So you would always actually be, it was not really a solo thing, you know, you would sort of generally, you know, operation-wise maybe a four-ship or at least a pair that would get airborne. So, you know, you were with other aircraft in close proximity and most of my flying was done, you know, with multiple aircraft together. So, yeah, it was always that sort of band of brothers feeling, I would say, in most of my certainly operational flying. Yeah, a lot of people watching, listening, me the younger version of me would have been thinking I want to be you do you feel cool and I mean that in a very un-ego point of view but you there's plenty of options for us to do in life and what you chose and how it's worked out for you and how hard you've worked to do this do you have a certain reflection where you're like this is cool I mean course no not the word I I generally if somebody had said to me at uh at 17 when I was applying to the air force that you know 40 years later have a look what you would have flown you know I would not believe it and I would have absolutely you know given my right heart to have done I love what I did you know you know it's not lost on me um how extraordinary it's been you know but um yeah I'm just so so you know pleased to have done it you know some of the aircraft now you know they're out of service you know so people go what was an F4 Phantom that thing flew in Vietnam you know what was that like and my memory is you know luckily quite good you know at times it's really weird you do some muse over and you know you every now and again you'll get back into an aircraft you haven't flown in years in the cockpit and stuff just comes back you can remember it's very odd like a car probably if you haven't driven it give it 10 minutes your hand will be moving and you'll be doing stuff that it's somewhere in your brain but no they those memories and the thought of of that career that's uh it's a lovely feeling yeah i love that i mean anyone that cares to listen to me in the build-up to what was flying with you a few days ago and then of course since I sort of described you as a British maverick with a bit of James Bond in there and that's my that's me just saying there's so much that's cool and aspirational and so anyone that is watching and listening that thinks this is what I'd like to do you know sort of what's the advice you could give them coming through I mean I guess you've got to believe in yourself you know I can remember there's a lot of naysayers and it was exactly the same back in the day a series this went out I probably the early 80s called fighter pilot very early fly on the wall documentary and i watched it avidly as these guys you know most got chopped and you know one guy um john mccrae made it to buccaneers and uh you know and it was just you know just a brutal wow that seems extraordinarily difficult but you know somebody's got to do it you know if you believe in yourself and i think you have to at that stage you know so but it's that balance you don't want to be overconfident don't want to be underconfident you know but just give it your give it your best shot you know um that's all I did you know there was no uh that I would do it this way I believe in yourself back yourself um you know but you know that you definitely have doubts at times you know things are difficult you know it's not the easiest but it's definitely a very satisfying rewarding experience it's a it's a real learning curve I always felt you know the first time you fly an aircraft even if you've jumped from you know a phantom into a tornado you'll do some simulators you'll get airborne in the jet and it's a bit like wow that first sort of one hour flying it's like i was behind the aircraft that seemed you know that was a lot to learn by the time you do the second trip it is your learning curve is it's so much easier and then the third trip you know you're almost off and running and it's it's a lovely awareness as you you're getting used to this bit of machinery and and everything you learn generally is stepping stone you know you won't go straight into some sort of advanced combat sort of you'll do some circuits you'll learn to fly the thing you'll slowly build up towards you know big missions for example in the RAF in fast jet stuff red arrows was very much stepping stone you didn't start as a nine ship you'd you know do a four ship initially maybe a five you learn the maneuvers and it was almost about three or four months later that the first nine ship as everybody it all came together and then you did the first nine.

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19:44In your downtime, what is it that you would do? Because there's a huge amount of dopamine hit and adrenaline that comes from the actual kind of peak moments. How do you kind of entertain yourself outside of that? I mean, you sort of, you know, back in the day, you'd be on the squadron, you know, the air force we used to fly a lot so you know it was all fairly full on your whole remit your raison d 'etre was fly and you know we lived to fly and the squadrons you say band of brothers you know it was a wonderful thing um and you know you'd socialize together it really was pretty all-encompassing now you know as you get older it's sort of it's funny you know sometimes you'll be driving back and you've done six trips and it's been wonderful and stuff but it's you You know, it's quite easy.

20:25They're sort of, I can remember our trip because it was the last one we did. But, you know, it's easy now to, you know, go and mow the lawn. It's a strange thing. I can't imagine you doing that. I know, it does seem odd. But, you know, it's every now and again, you know, I can recall with the BBMF, the Battle of Britain Memorial Flight, you'd often do in September sort of just Battle of Britain evening events. So you would guarantee you would be landing after the sun had set and you would come home in a spitfire. And as you sort of broke into the circuit on your own, it would be generally a beautiful sunset.

21:02The sort of the blue exhaust smoke. It was an overload of this is just wonderful. The engine was purring, you'd land and you sort of drive home and it was just you'd just be on your own. And it would be like, wow, it's hard. So I wish I could tell somebody about it. It's just so extraordinary. That was the best hour it felt in my life. but you sort of come home and have your dinner and watch telly it was it was strange you know it's just that's how it was i love the fact that you appreciate it so much though yeah that passion and the purpose behind the whole thing and the appreciation is you can feel that coming off you the downtime question was more like like like the moa scenario so from that are you craving the next time you go up or will you happily then kind of almost take the dog for a walk and chill again i I think the younger Parky was craving the next time, you know, could not wait.

21:48Red Arrows wise, you know, yeah. Get me back up. Yeah. Solo display with the Tornado F-16. I couldn't wait. Just literally. So what did you do? So in between, because there's gaps. I had kids, family life, you know, the usual, you know, there was nothing special on that. But, you know, yeah, absolutely. Looking forward to going to work, I guess would be the analogy on that. But now, you know, we've sort of put the aircraft pretty much to bed now. that the Spitfires for uh you know we're into November and then we'll sort of dust them off in uh you know we'll do a little bit of training but essentially we'll fly them again in about March time and I'm looking forward to that already you know it's uh it's nice to have a bit of a wind down but it's just great every time after a few months not of flying it just you know doing the walk around on the Spitfire the smell of it starting it again it's just unlike marinating it I genuinely I can tell.

22:40I can tell. I can tell. Yeah. A key part of what you'd have needed to have done, whether it's by choice or by need, is to keep physically and mentally fit all the way through your career. There's the G-forces. There's just the very fact of getting in and out of the aircraft. What have you done? What works for you to keep that sort of mental fitness as well as physical fitness? Again, there's nothing special there. You know, a few of the boys are sort of more into the phys, as it were. I think I'm quite a hyper guy anyway. I seem to stay vaguely thin. but um you know again it does probably keep you fit you know flying a lot you know we say pulling g it's it's a bizarrely physical world that that world that i had you know pulling you know the eurofighter you know you'd fly for an hour and a half two hours you know it was probably quite a physical thing you're in an immersion suit you can get quite hot in that especially you know if you're doing various ops etc so um yeah just stay on top of that but hope you pass your annual physical yeah your tick is still good etc but again i don't you know i don't spend hours in the gym working out or any of that imagine you get the mental stimulation from the fact that there's so much that any one time you've got to know is as a pilot so actually you know there's a discipline i've used that word already before but there's a personal discipline because if you forget anything vital or if you're not thinking straight in anything you know any one time you've got to be able to think fast yeah it's a good point i mean i think personally i'm just very aware that for example if I've got a bit of a cold or I'm feeling when I would describe slightly beach bally my brain's just not quite so you know and again just fit to fly but not on top of it those would be the times where you know you're sort of you're watching yourself you're aware it's nice to feel on top of your game I guess in all walks of life you know for example with the Reds you know there was no spare you know it was one of those it was just not feeling it well man up you know you've got to up your game a bit clearly if you're unfit to fly you're unfit but definitely aware when you are on top of it and I think most of the guys we're probably quite good at being there at that level I think naturally to me you know it's such a lovely experience well you know it's easy to to motivate motivate yourself and be in that position but yeah it's it's important to be there I've had a conversation very recently with a chap that sat where you are now about leadership and he has worked with the world's kind of biggest leaders and he said self-awareness is the number one uh kind of thing if you like for leadership and on that there's a there's a lot of a lot of things you'll have that will associate with leadership which leads us to achievement you're an mbe there's all sorts of things you you have achieved tell me what you want mbe for and kind of where does legacy sit with you i mean the mbe it was just lovely to get that was um you know i was fairly early on the eurofighter just uh getting that into service with the so and we went to they they build the aircraft at a place called Wharton near Blackpool so the the RAF there was I was pilot 11 of the RAF you know on the jet this is in probably late 04 early 05 and then we were you know learning how to fly the aircraft and then get ready to teach RAF pilots as they came in so I was an instructor on that so I did a fair bit of work just sort of you know, trying to just, you know, how the RAF would, would, would fly the aircraft and the drills, et cetera, with the four nations at the time.

26:01And then I was, again, my secondary duty, you know, they rewarded me for flying a Spitfire, which seems unnecessary, but it was, it was lovely to get that. So just basically my, yeah, my introduction to Typhoon and bits and bobs I did at calling speed i don't know 15 years ago i mentioned um legacy there is there a key part of anything you've done or a combination of everything done that kind of matters mostly mostly like the greatest achievement if you like i mean a lot of it's just by by luck i was so a lot of my mates um you know when we joined i'm thinking about now you know sort of 40 odd years we uh you know they went on to sort of like maybe the newer tornado at the time so they stayed on that one aircraft the whole time I was very lucky that maybe boredom threshold but I always wanted to not stop flying the aircraft I was but maybe oh I wouldn't mind flying that aircraft or that so it was very you know just pushing to always try and you know um you know I went into the two seat world of fast jet to then go into the single seat world and then the display world um you know it was uh I'm glad I did that it was clearly you know again no brain I wanted to do it but just just driving us i'm not be satisfied with uh maybe the cockpit i had at the time always always nice to do what i was doing but then move on to uh to newer pastures and uh and it just worked out you know there was no uber plan it's just that uh you know at one stage i was uh pretty convinced i was going to be an airline pilot but that didn't work you know i i got my licenses but then then they offered me eurofighter so i decided to stay of course we had a quick chat um at the airfield a few days ago about the sort of typical kind of demographic of people that are coming up in the plane with you so tell me more about that yeah i mean i would say a lot is uh sort of a 60 year old 70 year old bucket list you know and i love it when the sort of the family have uh sort of saved up for to to buy the passenger their trip and it's lovely they're obviously all there on the day as well and it's not just the person going in it's everyone else right exactly and the venues we do you know we can obviously fly at a few of them we can do a victory roll in the overhead over them just prior to landing and you know when we land you can see that they're as much as enjoying the thrill of it but yeah I guess bucket list is a lot but it's lovely you know I mentioned the person that never even flown an aircraft before but you know I've flown some some lovely old ladies who you know late 80s 90s and again just the joy the the ladies are very good with G you mentioned they seem to be amazing they're like you know should we try victory roll and they're a bit unsure and they're like do as many as you like walk in the park you know um to to some young lads you know it is it is a a mixture of people but um you know i would say to to a person they they get a a massive buzz out of it it tends to one of those things the experience you know and hopefully you'll be able to back this up but you know it lives with you for a while and and you genuine you know in the pub will be able to tell people what it's like to fly spitfire you know i'm showing that i'm big on photos i'm showing everyone photos of the day and so everyone's how light and delicate the aircraft is to fly and not difficult but it is just such a a vintage bentley with the lightest pass steering and the best brakes you know it's just that how can this aircraft fly so beautifully taught and be so easy and agile and smooth and every superlative it's a Spitfire.

29:31It's amazing there's a young lad I reckon he's probably about 10 years old when we landed and we came around and what I loved about that is that his excitement his appreciation of what the Spitfire was was so evident I don't know if you remember him and I wondered where that sits because I resonated with that lad you know back to the airfare model yeah yeah do you get a feeling that that that there is still an appreciation of what that plane is and almost the appreciation of what so many people did to fight the war because that lad was quite inspiring to me and you see more of this than I do I wonder if that's a nice sort of ripple yeah absolutely I mean you know you taxi out and there's three year olds at the fence waving madly there's something in that you know the DNA of this country that loves the Spitfire it you know it clearly symbolizes so much you know the freedom that the boys gained for us or kept for us but you know it looks great it sounds great you know it is that incredibly iconic aircraft and you know one of the real privileges um you know of my time with the battle of britain memorial flight you know i was on there from sort of 2007 to 17 and it was that sort of golden era we had the you know for example the 70th of the battle of britain the 75th so we got to know a few of the old Battle of Britain boys and they became like you know the absolute honor of meeting Jeff Wellham and calling him my mate having beers with him and Ken Wilkinson and Tom Neill these these legends and you know we idolized but what was the most lovely thing you know we would literally just have beers with them and dit on about spitfires of which their stories were better than ours you know we just get airborne and and float around whereas they did the biz and just extraordinary stuff that they got up to you know can you remember them what what story that comes so I mean I'm just listening to Jeff just the first time Jeff Wellham he wrote a book called First Light he was um you know 18 in the Battle of Britain had his 19th birthday just incredible but he um you know just the first time he went into combat which was um you know pretty much over Headcorn where you know he flew from Biggin Hill headed towards a raid that was building up at Dungeness and they met somewhere in between and head on there were 10 little spitfires because two there's 12 to a squadron two would you know had done the weather check so there's only 10 of them and there was about 150 head-on attack and he just said just the first time he was you know he saw them about probably 10 miles away and it's like where do you start with this lot where do you go this is just going to be just that the raw emotion and just just utterly extraordinary and you know i remember there's a guy called paddy french just thought of it now and he was talking about he did a rhubarb sort he said just you know two spitfires just to go over and and almost targets of opportunity whatever you could find you'd uh you'd uh you know shoot up on the ground trains and staff cars etc but he said he would fly for about an hour and a half and probably never get above 20 feet 20 feet you know and often he'd be flying with two spitfires and he couldn't see his wingman because he was behind a hedge you know about a mile away but he was they were that low and again just those sort of stories like wow unbelievable flying and uh yeah you know those um and and equally you know you would you would get for example jeff and you'd show him a modern day eurofighter and and just the passion he still had looking around this thing and and climbing into the cockpit and and just his face you know just real special special moments with those boys so were yeah lovely you've had the chance to fly some incredible aircraft and I want to know where the sort of standards of a pilot fit with being able to then match the aircraft my point being in motor racing a driver can outperform the car and in context of the pilot and the plane is they almost like the ultimate combination where someone can actually do something almost beyond the capability of the aircraft yeah it's a good question actually um you know just certainly going back to the to the earlier generation of aircraft you know you you are clearly in air combat for example or you know just low level navigation finding a target in poor weather depending on you know what navigation equipment you've got earlier in the day you know it was a stopwatch and a compass and the boys doing precision bombing you know back in the day that was absolutely a skill and there would be guys that were better at it than others in terms of air combat there's definitely guys who are natural you know it's a very 3d the sport of kings 1v1 air combat you know you merge head on and then hopefully one of you will get behind the other one so that is max performing the aircraft and then it can get into a very dynamic fight in all sorts of aircraft and again that is definitely a a pilot you know akin to a formula one driver can probably race you know get a few tenths better identical cars for example i think as the as the aircraft get more and more advanced you know the kit gets better so in terms of the raw piloting you know fly by wire you know you can't overstress they will maximum these aircraft get clever and clever they almost can build out the the nuances but of the actual pilotability landing them becomes easier you know rather than more difficult for example but there is still probably a workload an airmanship you know it can get very busy in the cockpit and that will be some are better than others at that so maybe it's more moving on slightly from the raw skill of the the piloting albeit air combat is air combat if it's in an f-35 or it's in a tiger moth you know they're the same you know skill set to apply but probably now it is you know as you know that capacity and and being able to cope and multitask and all of those things but that was still you know it probably got pretty busy in uh you know in a mosquito at low level in poor weather you know again it's still very similar attributes I would say you know when you say the privilege of meeting the boys back in the day you really could see there was a a fellow sort of airman there you know that's the same.

35:36My granddad told me and it's really ironic because what I'm about to say is so relevant to the flight we had a few days ago there's an arched bridge across the M25 because the M25 was not there when this bridge is old and it's a double arts bridge and we would every it's right by where my family still live which is kind of near Heathrow Watford and I went through that to come around to you near St Albans a few days ago and I would was told really young that a Spitfire flew under that bridge and I literally have been up and down that road hundreds if not a thousand times and I always think that and I was driving back from our flight and imagining how low it was yeah you know and the fact that someone chose to do it apparently was unauthorized there was a whole story but he did it and so the world moves fast your work day even faster pitching products drafting reports analyzing data microsoft 365 copilot is your ai assistant for work built into word excel powerpoint and other Microsoft 365 apps you use, helping you quickly write, analyze, create, and summarize, so you can cut through clutter and clear a path to your best work.

36:49Learn more at Microsoft.com slash M365 Copilot. AI is incredible. It can teach you how to fry an egg and even write a poem, pirate style. But it knows nothing about your work. Slackbot is different. It doesn't just know the facts, It knows your schedule. It can turn a brainstorm into a brief. And it doesn't need to be taught. Because Slackbot isn't just another AI. It's AI that knows your work as well as you do. Visit slack.com forward slash meet Slackbot to learn more. Back in the day, the piece of cake, it was a guy called Ray Hanna, extraordinary RAF legend, one of the early bosses of the Red Hours, etc.

37:32put on a piece of cake he flew under you know through underneath a bridge up in New Yorkshire they did it but it is a if you ever go to that bridge it's not a big bridge and it's not a particularly straight bit of river to have got down to about sort of five feet to have done it an amazing bit of of a flying ability but equally testimony to the aircraft that you know it has that you know agility to be able to get down to be that comfortable to do it but uh yeah some that i'm tingling from that yeah this is probably the real camera phones and so on where it's not i'm afraid i can't raise your stories on that i take my hat off to yeah to those boys yeah no that's phenomenal and then there was a hunter that flew under tower bridge didn't he back in the day that uh yeah yeah he was a bit annoyed about the defense cuts or something what a great defiance i don't want this to stop i mean i literally those stories coming out and that's the key thing, extraordinary life story, storytelling is how we learn.

38:27It's what my other kind of passion he likes being motor racing, you know, and so the stories that get passed down, whether it's Le Mans or Formula One and Gilles Villeneuve stories and so on that I got brought up on. Wow, yeah. And why I'm interested in the sport, first and foremost, and then you go into the modern era. So I could, you were, you were like the young kid then relating stories from people that are heroes, but I've got to say you're a hero to me you know I've been looking forward to this conversation and the flight with you well I'll never forget it it'll be difficult to trump that we're out of time um is there any one story that stands out that you've got that's a personal one to you I don't think so it just uh I guess they uh you know I've been just so so fortunate and it's been And lovely just to, you know, to dit on about flying.

39:18You know, flying is a wonderful, wonderful job. Yeah. It's never wavered, right? Yeah, it's an easy, easy sell to me flying, you know, best view, best seat in the house and the aircraft. You know, some clever people around who built some outstanding aircraft, you know, the, you know, from the Spitfire cutting edge technology, you know, the first all metal fighter to, you know, through to the modern day jets that we're flying now. You know, it's wonderful. And, you know, to have been a part of it, you know, and still be doing it and to be flying, you know, passengers with air legends. I love it, you know, and come back and fly with us again sometime.

39:52Well, my experience has been so good. I'm telling anyone and everyone that cares to listen. And I don't know how you got here today, Parkey. Probably landed on the real train. But thank you for making time to have this conversation. I loved it. Cheers, John. Thank you.