Sara Stokes | Extraordinary Life Stories

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0:40Action! Simon Williams, audition for Wonder Man. I'm gonna need you to sign this, assuming you don't have superpowers. I'll never work again if anyone found out. My lips are sealed. Marvel Television's Wonder Man, all eight episodes now streaming, only on Disney+. Sarah Stokes. Hi. Welcome. Thank you so much for having me. Been looking forward to this. I know, me too. Tell me in your own words, who is Sarah Stokes? I'm a mom of two. I've got two beautiful little girls, Harper and Willow, who are two and five. I'm Irish, very proud to be Irish. They're living in the UK now for too many years that I would like to admit.

1:25and I am the founder of Skin2Skin, which is a skincare brand that I started when I was pregnant, and it's formulated for women who are going through their motherhood journey. So formulated for women who are trying to conceive, pregnant, breastfeeding and postpartum. Why don't I go straight into that? You know, I love championing, being female entrepreneurs, and this is a real kind of lived experience journey you've been on where something wasn't available for you and you weren't able to find something and you were having your own complications with your skin going through pregnancy to then creating something that has solved your problem and countless others I want to talk you through that journey so for the moment you're having your own problems if you like not finding a solution to then going I'm going to create something yeah absolutely so um I was pregnant with my first daughter in 2020 um which no one will ever forget the year of the lockdown and my skin went from completely bomb-proof to suddenly getting covered in hormonal acne, dry skin but the worst part was this insensitivity that I experienced so all of my usual skincare products were like burning my face and it was getting progressively worse as I was going through my pregnancy and no one was giving me answers.

2:42I went to a GP about it, I went to my midwife about it and both of them were like it's hormones you're pregnant kind of that's what it is no one was really giving me any advice on skincare safety or any kind of solutions to to the issues that I was facing and I was getting like contact dermatitis so basically it was like burn marks all around my face and it wasn't until I was six months pregnant with um and I was going to my face just to buy my usual skincare products she saw my pregnant belly and was like, everything you're using is not pregnancy safe. So I was using the highest level of retinol that you can use over the counter, which is a big no-no when you're pregnant because it can have negative effects, the growth effects to your unborn child if you used in high doses.

3:25I was using salicylic acid, which is an ingredient that's really common for people who have acne, which I was suffering from. But little did I know that that is basically like taking an aspirin, which again, you're not supposed to when you're pregnant. But all of these things I didn't know. And it's crazy that you're told you're not to drink, you're not to eat like raw fish or unpasteurized dairy products. And then suddenly, you know, I'm finding out six months pregnant that there's loads of things that you shouldn't be putting on your skin. And your skin is your largest organ and it abdures everything.

3:57And the fact that, you know, retinol is such a big ingredient in skin care because it's fantastic. It gets rid of, you know, it helps with your acne. It helps with fine lines and wrinkles. It does loads of stuff. and women are using them all the time they're in pretty much most skincare products now even products that aren't necessarily marketed as a retinol product there are vitamin a in it so like quality brands will put that in the inky list without you kind of knowing so obviously very upset to find this out especially six months into pregnancy you know we're in the middle of lockdown with everything just being so scaremongered and i went to my local high street looking for pregnancy safe skincare and was told to go to the maternity section.

4:39So went down to the maternity aisle where I found products that were for your body. So stretch mark creams, nipple balms, products that looked like they were for mom and baby. And there's nothing for your face. And also nothing that spoke to me as a young, modern woman. Everything was like, looked like they were for children. And I just didn't feel like I was seen or heard for, especially for an industry where predominantly women are the customers. And it just felt like, you know, another kind of area in life that we were kind of sidelined. You know, you can see it in fashion. When you're pregnant, you're just given pregnancy leggings and like these long floral dresses.

5:17And it's not, you know, it's not something that speaks to me. And it's a lot, not something that speaks to a lot of women. And it kind of felt like that in skincare as well. And then I, you know, asked the sales assistants, you know, what can I use during pregnancy? And 99 % of the time I was told to go speak to my GP, which I had already done. Yeah. And that didn't work. And that didn't work. Exactly. And it was just this lack of awareness. Like even, you know, you go into like retailers that have specialists in there and like majority of the time they wouldn't be giving me the answers like don't use retinol, don't use salicylic acid.

5:51And actually when we were doing all of our R &D for skin to skin, I would do secret shoppers. so I would go in film the grind so see for uh for privacy reasons but I would record what they would say and I probably did it about 30 times and two times they told me about retinol not to use it but all the other times it was like go speak to your GP only use natural products oh yeah the retinol thing it's a myth so like there was a lot of misinformation and it's really confusing especially when you're pregnant and it's already so overwhelming your body's changing your mind is changing brain fog is a thing and you know confidence thing there as well i was just thinking you know you said about a young you know career woman at that point who wants to look her best all this everything happened with your skin knocks your confidence and it's almost like at that point because of pregnancy it's like no one's actually thinking and embracing that whereas you want to carry that through totally and that creates your own sort of mental health yeah yeah issues of moving forward absolutely yeah your confidence is knocked but also it's like you're afraid of what to put on your body especially if you're you know have already gone through any pregnancy complications which is a huge majority of women who don't you know we don't talk about it um so it's just there to support women and it felt like yeah it was a huge gaping hole in the industry that i saw in 2020 and it took me until 2023 to to start us there's a lot of pondering a lot of thinking and um yeah there's a few circumstances that kind of Well, that's the entrepreneur shift, right?

7:26Because previously you are working in the music industry with a salary. Yeah. And now you're thinking about taking something on that hasn't been done before. I think the term is category first. Yeah. So you are looking into, you know, probably with excitement, but also a certain amount of trepidation and dare I say loneliness, because, you know, anyone in your position, and it sounds like a lot of women have just been referred back to the GP and done this whole circle without getting a product that's worked for them. Yeah. You're now trying to create a solution. I want to know I want to know what went through your mind leading up to the 2023 kind of I'm going to do this and I want to know about how easy that journey's been for you definitely not easy but I think between 2020 and 2023 I went back to the music industry after four months of having my first daughter and I didn't know it at the time but I was going through a huge mental shift and I lost myself um I went back to an industry which I loved but it was hard because you know raising a daughter and working in an industry in an industry where you're essentially child-minding adults I worked in management so you know you know my phone was constantly on you know a phone call it 12 o 'clock at night is not unusual um and the pressure is you know wild um and I also had this you know I've I had this image of myself before pregnancy that I would be this you know career woman with a daughter I would be able to juggle it all it'll all be fine but no one tells you of this like mental shift that happens and it's actually something that I discovered after I had my second daughter it's called matri science and like when you're I think I'm saying that right but when you're going through like when you go from a child to an adult you go through adolescence and you change it's the same thing that happens when you become a mother you change your whole your structure of your mind your body your you know you're you've got just a new outlook on life that that happens um so that was a big shift um but whilst I was all happening I had this idea for skin to skin and it just lived rent free in my mind for a long time.

9:41I would. Got louder and louder. Yeah, it did. And like the more I thought about it, the more I would kind of tell a few people that I would trust. Everyone was like, it's an amazing idea. But then the question was, but why hasn't it been done? There's a reason. So I was constantly like doing research, speaking to medical experts, why isn't this? And no one could really give me a straight answer. And the more I kind of did, the more research I did. So actually I got pregnant in 2022 with my second daughter. And again, same thing happened with my skin. But that's when it was like, right, I've got an amazing idea here.

10:17No one's doing it. There's no... No one's telling me the reason why. I have to do it. And I just had this... It's only a reason why you find that, right? Yeah. But that goes back to that almost loneliness. That's a proper risk taking. Yeah. You backed yourself. and I think the I would never I don't think I would have got that urge to do it unless I had kids something happens in your mind that you've got this you know you can grow a child you can birth a child I feel like I felt like I could do anything and I had this opportunity you know when I was when I had my second daughter that we moved out of London we sold our apartment in London and And my husband was like, you know, we had this money from the sale of the house.

10:57Use it. Use it. This is your one chance. You're never going to have this idea again. Someone might do it. You know, now is the time. So, yeah. That's great you had that support. Yeah, it was amazing. And my dad, you know, he's an entrepreneur. So is my mom. And both of them were, my dad was very, very supportive in just being like, just go for it. And like, take a risk. He's very risk adverse. So he's like, just go for it. And I officially started when my daughter was two months old and my other daughter was two years old. But the reason why no one had done it is because skincare is for all types of skin.

11:36No one really owned in on pregnancy because it's an area where ethically you can't do clinical trials. So everything is retrospective testing. so women who have tried products unknowingly that they're pregnant and then kind of report back of the things that they've experienced um but also you know people don't want to take that risk and i just felt like well i want to take that risk because i want someone to take that risk for me so no one's going to do it i'll do it so the first thing i wanted to do was partner up with a medical expert because i'm not a medical expert i will never claim that i am and i would never take that responsibility to say something is safe without having someone with a medical expertise in the background so I met with I was introduced to a consultant dermatologist called Katrina Ryan and she is the co-founder of an amazing clinic in Ireland and I met her for a coffee and she actually it wasn't a coffee it was a zoom coffee of a zoom and she loved the idea and immediately was like, I see there's a huge gap in the market here because I have women coming in all the time looking who are either trying to conceive or newly pregnant.

12:48And I'm probably the first person to know. I have nothing to recommend them. And everything that is on the market is for all skin types, as you say, but nothing's really like, I can't guarantee that something is pregnancy safe because they haven't really done testing on it. It's great validation view at that point, right? Looking in and now getting someone back saying this is potentially what everyone needs. Exactly. And the fact that I had someone who's so highly respected in her field to identify this and from the offset was like, I'm in, let's do it, was like even more, you know, fuel to the fire to really start this.

13:22And then, yeah, the journey began in 2023. And yeah, it's been a wild ride so far. No, I can tell. I used the word easy earlier with a smile on my face because I know entrepreneurship is not easy at all. How much of the previous experience of working with artists, and you use that sort of adult babysitting, if you like, how much of that, and also branding, because to brand your product in skincare, that's a huge, huge part of the business model. How much of what you've done previously then led to you having that experience rather than realizing it at the time to then be successful now with the brand Skin to Skin.

14:00I remember starting being like, I have no transferable skills. Like I work with musicians. I go on like organized tours and merch and records and things like that. How on earth am I going to move to skincare? And it's actually, there's so many transferable skills I did not realize. I managed three brands, businesses, global businesses, you know, from records to publishing, touring, merch, brand deals. And it was a 24-7 fast paced life that decisions needed to be made instantaneously. There was no lagging. There was no such thing as, oh, I'll come back to you in a few weeks time because that opportunity will be gone.

14:42and you know you're dealing with high pressure because you've got artists who obviously this is their lives and this is their art so you have to be very protective of that so it's a lot of juggling a lot of plate spinning and I think that long period of me working under pressure all the time constantly was you know starting a skincare brand became I would not say easy it's definitely not easy, but I think the resilience that I built up over those years of constant firefighting has prepared me so beautifully for this journey, and I think I would have crumbled if I didn't. Well, there was a work ethic there, wasn't there?

15:20It wasn't a shock to you to have, because ultimately being an entrepreneur, it's long hours. Oh, yeah. There's a sense of responsibility. There's lots of things that could go wrong. And I imagine with managing, you know, the merch and launches and brands, you had all that. You had deadlines. You had a lot of pressure in different ways. So actually, that's exactly what you've got and still have now as an entrepreneur with your business. There's any number of things that can come up. Is there one thing that's been almost like the sort of the hardest that you've had to navigate as an entrepreneur sitting here now?

15:52I think since launch, now has been the hardest. I think, you know, it was two and a half years of silently working on this brand. And I didn't respect it at the time. I was you know constantly like I can't wait to be launched I can't wait to do all of these things but then once you're launched you're out you know there's so and the speed at which I was doing things was fast because I was so used to working in such a fast-paced way that like you know everyone keeps saying to me like how did you do it so quickly but to me it wasn't quick it was just how I work and I'm not a I don't sit on things I make decisions quickly and um Um, now that I'm launched, you know, I'm finding sometimes I get stuck and I would, it takes me a minute to get out of that.

16:40And I think like you're listening to so many people, you've got your team, you've got your freelancers who work with you, you've got your customers, you've got the industry, you've got all of this noise that didn't exist when you were starting the business quietly. And then once you've launched, it's loud. And I'm constantly navigating that. And like, how do I move past it how do I get unstuck because the worst decision is making no decision and even if the decision is wrong at least I made a decision and I could learn from it and move on um so at the moment that's that's my challenge I'm really glad you said that because I mean ultimately you're you know the sort of buck stops with you and and you want that that's the bit you thrive on as an entrepreneur and you're the business owner and you're the you're the visionary you've assembled all these people around you but there is I don't use the word loneliness again but there is that element of you either kind of want to hide from that or you've just got to own it and at certain points there's probably a certain amount of overwhelm which I wanted to ask you almost that sort of mental fitness side of things you you had that from previous and you've got it now I can I can feel it for me but what do you do when you need to just spend some time on yourself and do you have like that sort of morning routine what do you do to protect your mental fitness?

17:56Constantly learning how to do that, so I don't have the right answer. I go to therapy once a week, so that's very much like a necessity in my life. It's like going to the gym for my brain. I have an amazing circle of female entrepreneurs that I bounce ideas off, whether they're in skincare, supplements, clothing brands, tech. So community's big for you? Huge. Just to have that relatability. on Friday I got really ill last week, but it was also the busiest week of like the year for some reason, of course, when I'm sick. Yeah, timing. Yeah, so I had like just the worst Friday ever. And at six o 'clock I just called a female entrepreneur that I know and was like, I don't know how to deal with today.

18:46And she was like, take a step back. And like, what is the big issue? And actually after 30 minutes of talking to her, the issue was so minute that it was like, why am I even stressing about that? That's therapy in itself, isn't it? But you made the phone call, you reached out and someone was there for you. Yeah, 100%. And my dad is a big, you know, rock as well. He's started businesses since he was in his 20s and he is a risk taker and he's also just a really calming person that, you know, I had it yesterday being like, I feel lonely. And he's like, it's okay. It's okay to be lonely that's just part and parcel of it and i think like acknowledge someone acknowledging that and making you feel like you're not alone or like that it's not normal then it kind of makes it a bit easier but um other than that it's like trying to work out trying to have a bit of me time but it's hard when you've got two very young kids but valuable to share that because at any one time anyone could pull up an article um listen to a podcast where you are you know talking about the success of the brand and you know that entrepreneur doing really well and i think that that that That humanizing element where actually, you know, I do pick up the phone to people, I do have a day where I just feel overwhelmed.

19:55And then knowing what to do. Physical fitness. So you look like you keep fit and you know, you already said you dropped your daughter off at school before you're coming to here. So you've got a busy schedule, but what do you do to me and what sort of works for you if you like? I try and do Pilates as much as possible. That is like my sacred me time. There's definitely time. It comes in waves. sometimes I have time for it and the mental space for it sometimes I don't at the moment I don't so a lot of lots of going for walks things that are just trying to get me out of my head um but yeah I think my kids are probably my gym at the moment running around after them um but yeah physical exercise I think is so important just to like again when you're mentally stuck sometimes you can then feel physically stuck so if you're sitting at your desk all day and you're on phone calls or zooms or whatever just getting up shaking just going out for a walk even if it's like half an hour like sometimes i do calls um and walk at the same time just to kill two birds at one stone but yeah i think um the weeks that i don't do physical exercise i really feel it not only physically but mentally as well i can relate to that so the physical exercise is so stimulating and helpful to the mental side of things i said to you off camera i'm a dad of two daughters two to those girls.

21:14And so to champion female entrepreneurship is an absolute pleasure. Do you have any kind of feelings towards the fact that you are a role model? And the reason why I say that is that the number of people I've spoken to, both male and female, in entrepreneurship, and these stats that are genuinely looking at, they're improving now, but 2 % of VC funding or less goes to female entrepreneurs. And a lot of women are not starting businesses because they don't have the confidence to back themselves because they haven't been around role models. so to flip that back to you i see you as a role model it's one of the reasons why i really wanted to speak to you today do you embrace that do you feel that trading at schwab is now powered by ameritrade bringing you an expanding library of education with even more ways to sharpen your trading skills access new online courses insightful webcasts articles engaging videos and more all curated just for traders plus guided learning paths with content designed to fit your unique interests.

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22:44Terms apply. Learn more at go.amex.com. No, but that's my Irishness. We're very, very humble. So humbleness as well. Very, yeah. We're probably too humble of the Irish. I think that's an amazing compliment because I see other women doing it and especially Ireland at the moment. there's so many amazing entrepreneurs coming out of Ireland especially females in so many different areas in business and I definitely feel a bit of imposter syndrome sometimes of course I think everyone does but yeah it's seeing other women especially I think women who feel pushed out by society sometimes especially when they become mothers which is a very very common thing discrimination is rife in in this in society when you have kids and the amount of mothers that I have met on my journey who have started businesses because they had this idea when they were on that leave is incredible and again like going back to my you know that power that I felt to start the brand that came from having kids I don't think I could have done this prior to having my kids I just didn't think I would have the confidence to do it but you just get like this incredible confidence after having kids um and I think a lot of women feel like that and I'm in quite a lot of communities um who are all mom entrepreneurs and um they all you know share the same kind of umph that they get after having kids and that kind of drive to just do better in life and for themselves you know for their families um and yeah I think society it's hard to to be a career woman these days and have a family you know there's that pressure of this nine to five job that was created for men for and for women to stay at home and how on earth are women supposed to thrive when we are the the primary parents we're the ones that do pick up drop off you know a kid is sick you call the mom everything's on the mom so um yeah i think sometimes there has to be a space for women to be entrepreneurs because it's the only way to navigate motherhood um in a way that you want to i don't want to have a nanny 24 7 to look after my kids isn't it that's not why i became a mom no i can tell and i think you know drawing into community which i'm big on i i have a community around me and i enjoy growing it you know we're doing that now and i dip into that i i reach out when i want to know something or meet someone or help and i'm more than happy to help when someone reaches out to me and asks um have you had an outpouring of people since bringing your product to market from people saying that this has helped me this i'm so glad this was here what did people do before you brought this out this kind of thing because that must be also really nice and validating and on that the fact that you entwined i guess what you call your sort of personal brand your personal story into what became the product i think is really powerful yeah the for me success is seeing and hearing people who have resonated with the brand love the brand and have said this has really helped me that to me is a success it's like it brings me so much joy and especially you know going back to last Friday when I had a bit of a wobble I got an email on Saturday morning from someone who is pregnant with their second child and was like my skin has been awful since having my kids and I've been using your products for a couple of weeks now and it's already helped thank you so much I was like it makes everything just worth it um but even down to women who you know when I go to these um entrepreneurial events or any events really community events there's actually a few women who have followed our journey and they're like you know seeing you and doing this you know with two young kids has kind of given me the courage to do something on my own so that's really cool um again pinch myself moment when those things happen but goes back to role model you need to embrace that you are is that I just on that and actually that kind of glow you get without in any way having an ego or arrogance for that just the fact that you know you've created something that didn't just help you but now can help countless others with the kind of perspective you've got and the journey you've been on what advice would you give to someone that might not quite have you're back to where you were in that transition period from from leaving the music industry to starting just doesn't have quite that sort of confidence to say I'm going to start this, I've got an idea, I'm sure it will work.

27:11What's the advice you can give to that person? Find your circle and find your support because, you know, going back to what you said before, it can be quite lonely. And I think once you hit a roadblock, unless you have the support and the resilience to get past it, because there's going to be many roadblocks and they get bigger and thicker and more frequent as you go on. but it's so important to have people around you who could help you overcome them because you can't do it alone it because it can become really lonely if you make it lonely um I don't think I could have done this without the support of my family my community that I built um my friends I don't think I could have done it that's why I kind of go go back to prior having kids I don't think I had the confidence to do it.

28:04But then having kids, I got that kind of new confidence. But I think if you have a great idea, go for it. I'm always saying go for it. But just be aware that there is a lot of trials and tribulations ahead. As long as you have the support, you can do anything. So build that support network early. I think so, yeah. Because I think that some entrepreneurs see it, you know, right, this is on me now. And they almost sort of kind of give that sort of tunnel vision. And actually that can be very lonely. So bring that community in early. You're on a journey, and I always ask anyone I speak to what their definition of success is.

28:41And you just articulate that beautifully about me and asking. But the journey you're on with Skin to Skin, have you got a destination? Have you got somewhere you would like to get to? So, whether that's numbers, whether that's being in a certain outlet, you know, achieving something, is there something you want to make happen? Go global. That's it. So, properly ambitious. Yeah. Yeah. I definitely, you know, I would love to see our products in the hands of people all around the world because, you know, everyone keeps saying that what I'm doing is niche, which It kind of is, but also it's not because, you know, a huge majority of women have kids in their lifetime.

29:23So we're not... So you have a huge market there. Yeah. And without interrupting you, the mother is going to be... When their daughters end up being pregnant one day, they're going to say, you must use this product because it worked for me. You have a referral machine built in. Exactly. And also, you know, our products are made for hormonal skin. So beyond pregnancy, they're also great. do you know I mean we have a lot of women who are going through the perimenopause menopause who are loving our products as well so you know it's not not just that time of life I think if people love the products they can continue using them but you know it I get where they're coming from when people say it's niche but it also annoys me because I don't feel like I'm niche I'm a mom I'm still like I use them because obviously I'm biased they're my products but you know I'm still postpartum I've got a two-year-old I'm still breastfeeding um so these products are working for me and and all of these women around the world that's i want to get our products into their hands and help as many people as possible well i wish you every success i feel like i've met you at a really interesting time because you know that whole global it's in your eyes you want to make it happen you're going to make it happen so i hope you do and thank you for making time in a busy schedule to talk to me have you enjoyed it i loved it you're fascinating to talk to you thank you sarah thank you