Lando’s champion evolution, Vowles’ podium pride + Brad Pitt’s ‘need for speed’ – The Best of 2025

32:08Nowadays, he doesn't make any mistakes. You know, lap by lap he's within one tenth. If they tell him the tyre, let's say the left one is overheating, okay, within two laps, he does the same lap time, but the tyre temperature goes down. So he also learns his feeling for the tyres, which was, I would say, in 21 a handicap, because in this area Hamilton was a bit better than him. Compare now, if you would, the Max Verstappen of today to the Max Verstappen of 2015 when he first came in age 17? It's a very mature, still only 28, but very mature. He lost all his winning under all circumstances. It comes now more easy.

32:57It comes relaxed. He's far better in his technical feedback and he develops to a real personality and team leader. Tell me about, I was going to ask, is he a team leader? Is he someone all the troops want to get behind? Definitely. And with the success, he got even more confidence. And also he makes comments and his interviews shows how, I would say it's a 20-year-old body, but the mental strength and the experience and the wisdom is like 40 years old. You say he's still getting better. Does that mean that 2025 has been his best season? Even better than 2023 when he won 19 out of 22 races? Definitely better.

33:52First of all, we didn't have a car which was always in a position of win, but he's more calm. And as I said, he delivers in qualifying. We had been on difficult circuits with the tyres. You know, it's also difficult to get the right warm-up, to bring them in the right window. But with him, when it comes to Q3, he delivers. Helmut's been at Red Bull Racing from the very beginning. He knows the team inside out and he knows its personalities, as proven by what he's just said about Max. I think Red Bull will miss Helmut's experience now that he's no longer in the team because he does understand racing.

34:36It'll be interesting to see if they replace him. Now, the biggest story going into 2025 was the arrival of Lewis Hamilton at Ferrari for his first season in red. But despite a sprint pole and sprint victory at the second round in China, Lewis's debut season at Ferrari was very disappointing. The Scuderia wasn't as competitive as they were last year, enduring their first winless season since 2021. and Lewis completed a season without a Grand Prix podium for the first time in his F1 career. When team principal Fred Vasseur came on the show in the middle of the year, he admitted that Lewis's transition from Mercedes to Ferrari was more challenging than they'd expected.

35:20I don't know if we underestimate the importance of the change. Probably. Because that he spent 10 years at McLaren or with McLaren and then 10 or 12 with Mercedes. But it was also a kind of continuity, two teams based in the UK with the same engine, with the same environment and so. It's a complete change for him in his life, to the culture of the team and everything. And this, to do it in three days in the winter period, it's quite difficult. And I think also the expectation was huge. But we have to put everything in place and it's taking time. and we have to also to manage expectation and manage the noise around the team.

36:05I'm fascinated about the change, right? I get that Ferrari is an Italian team and everything that's happening in Marinello is probably very different to things that are going on in Brackley and at Woking in the UK with Mercedes and McLaren. But that bit out on track, is that that different when you change team? No, but we are speaking about details at the end. Because the comments are positive or negative for plus or minus one tenth of a second. Or plus or minus a click of front wing that you did or not. Plus or minus something. But it's always marginal. And this we have to keep in mind. If we are not able to put everything together from the preparation of the weekend, adaptation to the simulator, blah, blah, blah, until Sunday, You can miss one tenth there or one tenth there.

37:00And this is making a huge difference in terms of pure results. I remember the guys at Mercedes telling me that Lewis is incredibly structured in his life. Is he a good motivator for Ferrari? He's for sure. But he's also emotional. It means that it's also us to support him when he's struggling. And we also need to push him when he's struggling. You know, that he had a spa in Budapest were difficult for him, but he can be sure that he has the full support of everybody at Maranello to recover, to be back. I'm really convinced that he will do it and we have to be supportive with him on every single day and I will be supportive every single day with Lewis.

37:45But we've seen the brilliance as well, right? We saw the brilliance in China sprint. We saw, I mean, Silverstone qualifying, you know, it was there. it's still there isn't it when you look at his data no it impresses you yeah but we have to stay calm we did very well or he did very well in china but somehow he was or he will be the next champion we have to stay calm but it's a matter of support and mentality he's fully committed he's pushing like hell he's uh trying to get the best from everybody and uh he will always have my support for this. You know, sometimes in a press conference, you ask me at the beginning of the scene, what was the characteristic of Lewis 20 years ago?

38:28And it was this one, the fact that he was able to get the best from everybody. He's a champion, he's doing very well, he has the pace, but the other characteristic is to try to get the best from the people around you. An extra motivation, an extra push, and so. For sure, these characteristics characteristics already is there and my job is to also to give him my support to do the best job that he can do and do you think his presence in the team is bringing the best out of Charles is this the best version of Charles that you've seen probably yes and clearly I think this helped Charles also a little bit to release some pressure from Charles and he did a very good job from the beginning of the season I think Charles also improved on the on the approach, on the structure, is more mature.

39:21And this, I don't know if it's a part of the contribution of Lewis, but it's coming for the maturity of Charles. The driver who joined Ferrari didn't finish on the podium in 2025, but the driver who left did. For the first time with Williams, Carlos Sainz will stand on the podium. It's Williams' first podium since 2021. and in a full race since here in 2017. Vamos! Vamos! Best podium in my career, guys. You cannot imagine how this pays. This is my first smooth operation in Williams. And not the last. And just six races later, Carlos did it again, taking P3 in Qatar. I spoke to Williams team principal James Vowles after the first podium in Baku.

40:14and as you'd expect he was incredibly proud first and foremost i'm ecstatic for carlos uh you know the pace has been there for a lot of the year and dare i say he needed a result like this for the world to see that he is still the carlos that deserves to be there and that we're fortunate as williams to have him along by our side and he earned it he entered in qualifying and he earned it in the race as well i'm really proud of williams i'm proud of williams because it's a team that was in the dark trenches of survival just a few years ago. And yet this was an earned podium. It wasn't luck or fortune that were there.

40:51Others had 50 laps to chase us down. We were good. And so for me, it meant the most of anything when it wasn't so much on the day on the podium. Of course, it was great to see the team trackside enjoying it. The most it meant to me was when I were back in the factory, we put the trophy in reception and I just came down just randomly every half an hour hour and it was just queues of people just wanting the ability to touch it for a few seconds and have a photo with it and that's what meant the world to me they're individuals who have literally given up their life for Williams and for myself and for our journey and it it's a tiny tiny reward for them on the way back at the end of last year you said often that you thought you had the best driver pairing in Formula One in 2025 and beyond in Alex and Carlos having worked with Carlos now, do you stand by that comment?

41:40Because you've worked with a lot of great drivers and has Carlos surprised you in any way? I still stand by my comments. I know it bores the world when I say it, but Williams is bigger than me. It's bigger than Carlos and it's bigger than Alex, but all three of us will give our all for Williams to be a successful entity again in the future. That doesn't exist with quite a number of other drivers on the grid. My goal in all of this, as is Alex, as is Carlos, is to leave our DNA, our fingerprint inside the team for it to be a championship material, which then allows them to go on and win championships.

42:12But what I mean by that is our two drivers deserve to have an ego. Frankly, they're performant and they're fast. Neither one does. It's an absolute pleasure working with them because there's something far bigger than the three of us, which is the organization. As to what surprised me with Carlos, really good way of working with engineering teams very clear concise feedback that directs us where we need to be i didn't have to ask him to come into the factory he came in at 9 a.m one day he was already sat with the aero team deep in conversations over exactly at this point in the data just there that's where i feel the front wash out and look around turn nine again there that's where i feel it and they start to basically we watched about a team of 15 people then break down into that and go, I wonder if it's associated with X, Y, and Z.

42:57That wasn't me saying, Carlos, I really need you in the factory on a Monday morning at 9am to go and work with people. It's his incentive to do so because he wants the team to be successful. And I think that caught me off guard. I've seen many drivers in my lifetime. It's rare for one to A, be awake before 8am, but more importantly, wanting to spend their time with a team in that way. So what about Alex? Have you seen him step it up this year? Alex, I've had the pleasure of knowing him since 2016. I could tell you from the outset, he was very quick, but he needed the right form where the world isn't questioning his teammates or what's going on.

43:34There's no questioning now. Carlos is absolutely the reference you need. And yet Alex, this year, every time there has been a result, he's gone and picked it up. Simple as that. His pace has been outstanding. I think if there's any doubts, it should be gone by now in people's minds. In what areas in terms of what he's doing behind the wheel, his inputs are they different no i i would say the biggest difference i've noticed with alex is a step up in his confidence and belief that's the main thing in the team and in himself at the same time in terms of what he wants from the car actually he's always been very good at knowing what he wants from the car the best way to explain to you is that every human being goes through cycles where they're more or less confident in themselves in the car and what goes around you cannot waver Alex one bit this year not for a second can you even just push him he is absolutely confident in what he is doing and what the car is doing around that that doesn't mean we're perfect on the car not by any stretch of the imagination but his driving force is one of fix this fix this and I will go faster and it's directing the team in the right way and I think that comes from some of my point is has Alex always been quick yes I guarantee you he's always been quick is he now in a position where he knows how to extract the last few milliseconds from the car because in doing so you can put yourself in a much better place, definitely.

44:51And we have some peculiarities in this car on just how to approach certain corners, simple as that. But he's really, really good at vocalizing that, helping Carlos as well. He's not keeping it for himself. It's immediately straight out there. Oh, look at this, this is what I'm doing here. And then helping the engineers drive the direction of travel. And it's in that way, he's more vocal than I've heard him before. And his direction is absolutely spot on. So that's what I meant by confidence as the driver. 2025 was also a huge year for Formula One off track as the pinnacle of motorsport made its Hollywood debut.

45:24F1 the movie starring Brad Pitt as Sonny Hayes took speed to the big screen. Brad joined us for a very special F1 Beyond the Grid ahead of the London premiere in July but was I talking to an actor or a racing driver? Sadly, you're talking to an actor who has dreams of being a driver. Yeah, no, I always grew up, you know, around it a little bit. I'm from the Ozarks, and there was always, like, stock car racing or demolition derby. You know, those racing sports that come from the moonshine era, you know, trying to outrun cops. and, you know, a lot of dirt roads, you know, driving in rain, ice, you know, dirt bikes when you're that big.

46:10So wheels are comfortable to me. Well, how naturally did you take to the role of Sonny Haith? I had the time of my life, and I will say I'm a little sad. It's, I've got to figure out a sequel. That's what I've got to figure out. Come on, we all want a sequel. But you do so much research to all of your roles, right? How much did you have to prepare for this one from a fitness point of view and also just from a driving point of view? Well, it's not have to, you know, it was pure want to. I mean, this is one of those rare occasions when, you know, it's just a joy to get in the get in the seat. And I think we started four months early, something like that, before we started filming.

46:51And, you know, at that point, we're picking up seconds. and by the end of it, you know, a year and a half later, two years later, it was after the strike, you know, we're fighting, you know, for those tents. What was the starting point? Did you know what a racing line was when you started the movie? Yeah, you know, I spent my lifetime on bikes and a huge MotoGP fan. In fact, it's what got me into F1 because I just wanted enough races during the season. So then I expanded to F1 and now Indy and, you know, how it goes. but uh i spent a lot of time on the track on a bike just you know for play get your knee down yeah oh sure yeah that's a thrill but i understand the racing line and trail braking and so i had a head start you know what was the hardest thing to get your head around from a driving point of view from a driving point of view the hardest thing the first thing is trusting these brakes you know you're flat out down the straight you're at 180 and there's a brick wall in front of you and really trusting these brakes it's staggering what these brakes can do and we're you know in the apex car is not near what a formula one car is and then the next thing is really is unpuckering around those high speed corners and really you know trusting the car and i that just that first month it was just my mantra trust the car trust the car trust the car push push push more because it's amazing how they can stick physically were you okay how was the neck yeah physically all right i mean it takes some sure you're sore but it's a good story you know you feel like you earned it And then, you know, everything builds up in time.

48:17Alex Albon said something to me. He said, even the way he puts his earplugs in, that's how we do it. It's like you'd really studied the drivers. I guess some things you just absorb from watching it so long, because it was never even a conscious thought. I will say this, you know, our first weekend was shooting Silverstone. And I felt a bit like a horse's ass, you know, being on, you know, the national anthem, standing on the line next to the real guys. And he just had to swallow it and go, like, this is my job, this is what I've got to do. Certainly by the end of it, again, we felt like we were in our own backyard.

48:48Tell us a little bit more about that Silverstone 2023 moment. You're on the grid with the other guys. I think, I mean, you had ten minutes, nine minutes? Yeah, no, it's nutty. But it brings, like, an energy to the film itself. It's like a race to, like, make sure we've got these scenes. We're going to shoot it on the grid. We've embedded ourselves in the race weekend. And we have to prove ourselves that we will not cock up the program and slow down the race in any way. And we won't be in anyone's way. And so, yeah, we do the—Damps and I do the national anthem. We turn around. We find ourselves walking with Carlos, which was cool as shit.

49:21And, like, you know, these little accidents that happen. And then we get to the back of the grid, and we have—you know, we get two takes for this scene with Tobias and Javier. But the day before, the very first thing we put on film was going out, taking the cars out on our own in front of the 100 ,000 fans on Quali Day. And that got my attention. Adrenaline? Oh, my God. I had to sit. Again, I was sitting in the car for a half hour just sweating my balls off, waiting to go. Just like, you know, talking myself through it. Because this was make or break. And again, you know, we want to keep the car on the track, but we want to get as much aggression in it as we can.

50:01And I go out. I mean, we've rehearsed this. We've talked it through. We know we're going to do. And I get out and my comms go down and I'm driving deaf and I can't communicate with Looch at all. And and somehow, you know, doing it enough, we just like winged it. And he knows enough to like watch out for me. He's so he's so proficient that we were we were all right. me in. And how does it work in your world when you have nine minutes to shoot a scene? If you'd had 10 hours to do that, would the scene have been any better? Or just can you just nail it first time? I trust in how things shape up. And I like, you know, the parameters that put around us, you know.

50:39And so we get these few minutes and whatever we whatever we get is what's going to be chiseled in granite as far as our film is concerned. There's, you know, there's an excitement to that. it just adds to the need for speed. Yes. To borrow a line. Yeah. Do you have a need for speed, Brad Pitt? I've talked about this. I mean, you know, I got to hit 197 this week. I really wanted to hit two. You know, it hurts me a little bit. Three miles per hour short on the straight. This was at Austin. But that's actually the time you get to rest, funny enough. That's the time you get to, like, just catch your breath.

51:15It's everything else, you know. I've just never experienced anything that's just a more feeling of presence in my life. Because you're so focused. But you're not white knuckling. You're just in this sublime groove. It is really extraordinary. And I try to explain this feeling of downforce. And I fail every time. Because you try to say like a roller coaster. But that's not even right. Because you feel a fulcrum point underneath you. You're in it. I was in an aerobatic plane once. And it's the closest thing. But still, this thing, this is such a unique feeling and an absolute high. How much of a step up was the F1 car?

51:53You touched on it a moment ago. You were in Austin. You were driving the two-year-old TPC car from McLaren. Yeah, I mean. I mean, just how much of a step up from the F2 car? I'm still on a high. I really am. I'm just still on a high. And I can't thank Zac Brown and the team and spent the day out with Lando. And just what a high. What a high. to step up it's it's massive in what area it's massive well certainly the pickup is like is like nothing that that i'd experienced before i mean it's just more and more and more more breaks more speed more cornering power and so it's really um you know i want to go back again and beat i want to beat the time i want to beat the time i want to beat the time you're so competitive right yeah a little bit it happens did you have a favorite track in all the filming i have a real love for Silverstone because you know we got our footing there and we got to live there for a couple of months and I mean what a how spoiled are we and then I have a real soft spot for Abu Dhabi because we spent another couple of months there and we finish up the film there but the high of highs spa oh my god 4.3 miles 100 meter elevation change through the woods in the back this pruon corner it's double it's off camber and you're coming downhill into it it is It's so, such this smooth, like graceful feeling.

53:18And then of course, Eau Rouge. And we went to the bottom of Eau Rouge. Tim Bampton at F1 took us down to the bottom, the base of Eau Rouge. And he said, turn your backs. Just look up the hill and wait. And the cars come right by the wall. And that was Fernando who went by that first one. And it literally sucks the air out of your lungs. It is unbelievable. It is unbelievable. Was that before you'd driven it? That was that same weekend we were driving. Yeah, but had you been out on track at that point? I'd been out, but I'm not doing what Fernando's doing. When I first saw him, like, you know, flat out around cops at Silverstone, it's like, it is staggering.

53:59It is breathtaking. Tell us a little bit more about your relationship with Lewis. I mean, you've said that he helped with the script and he was an integral part of everything that went on, but what about your own personal relationship with him? When did he first meet you? He is such a gentleman, so kind. Even his texts are always so, like, kind and formal. There's a formality even of respect and politeness. But we drew on him a lot. I mean, we had 12-hour sessions in this very hotel in London, you know, where we just, like, what about this? What about that? What about this? And he would take us through, and he would, you know, It had to pass his smell test to keep us within the parameters of reality.

54:42Because we're Hollywood and we like a bit of drama. We found our ending in our film from this description, almost a spiritual description that Lewis describes when everything's in place. And we just wouldn't have our movie without him. Because even in our post, I mean, this man's race knowledge is staggering. He could tell, of course, we're in a, you know, the Apex car is built on a F2. It's stretched, and we have aero package from Mercedes. So we had to re-sound the gears for the final picture to make it sound like F1. His knowledge is so spot on. He would go, uh-uh, no, that's fourth gear. You need to be in fifth gear here.

55:26On a particular corner, on a particular track, he would be going, You know what? Down the back straight there, there's this reverb that comes off the left wall. Add that into the left channel. That's just staggering, staggering. You can watch Brad in action at home this Christmas. F1 The Movie is now streaming on Apple TV.

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58:04We had a three-driver title showdown in 2025, the first time since 2010 that more than two drivers were still in contention at the final race. Back then, 15 years ago, Sebastian Vettel came out on top. He and Red Bull went on to dominate the sport, winning both titles for four consecutive seasons. But after those highs came some more difficult times. And when I sat down with Sebastian, he'd been away from the sport for three years. And he'd clearly been thinking a lot about his F1 career. I came to Formula One in 2006-7 and I would say already by 2010, obviously I won the championship. I was sort of at my peak, but then in 2011 I was much more ready to win the championship than I was in 2010, for example.

58:55And then probably, I don't know, strong years obviously winning the championship. 2015 was a very strong year 17 18 yeah and then 19 and in fairness 20 I was on my way down already and I'm happy to say that now because I didn't have that really last ultimate push anymore did you know it at the time no I didn't I didn't um I remember actually in 2018 I started the season and traveled to the first race and I really I felt like I didn't want to go I wanted to go racing for sure but I didn't want to travel it's like couldn't be bothered sitting a day in the plane again and that was weird like what are you talking about I said to myself you love this of course I do so I went for sure I went and then I won the first race and then I was like all hyped yeah yeah yeah I went to the second race, I'm going to win, I'm going to win, and I won the second race.

59:57And then the season went on and it was a very, very strong season. And then in 2019, maybe it was also a time where the kids started to be old enough to phrase, Daddy, don't go. Before I always had the looks by the dog, like, you know, he knew when the suitcase was in front of the door that I'm leaving. And it was hard to say goodbye to the dog, but with kids it was much, much harder. 2019 I had the same question starting the season that I didn't want to travel and then now I know this much better and understand this much better but it was also coinciding with the time within Ferrari within the team where you know 17 we started off really well we're missing ingredients Mercedes beat us 18 we were more complete our car was better our package was better we didn't make it Mercedes was stronger at the end of the season and Medea beat us 2019 was a strange year because our car was okay, our engine was really really good remember which year I'm talking about so we struggled to just make progress as a team real progress like okay we are closing the gap or we are actually getting stronger in developing the car especially the second part of the season and I really really wanted to win the championship with Ferrari trust me I that was now I now I'm cool but I was I really wanted it so bad and it didn't happen and 2019 was sort of the break year, I would say, for myself.

1:01:37Because for myself, I started to feel like we're not making it. We're not good enough. At the same time Charles comes in, I think it was 2019, Charles had so much energy, completely different time in his career, you know, when we finished fifth and sixth or third and fourth. In fairness, I was spoiled. I mean, I won four championships. I won so many races. I had so many poles, whatever. all I was interested in was winning and that's the sort of athlete I was I wanted to win I wanted the biggest trophy I wanted that you know moment on the on the podium where I knew I I won the race I wanted the Monday morning feeling of I won the last race and feel so good but the feeling doesn't last long enough so you got to win another one and Charles came in and when we finished fifth and sixth he was over the moon with the fifth and sixth because different stage of his career and the first time in a competitive car.

1:02:35I think that's when I started to struggle a bit. Then 2020 comes along, really awkward year with COVID. We're not racing. I get this fantastic break that I never had and enjoy it so much with the family. And at the same time, becoming aware with the kids growing of problems in the world and how they started to affect me and I'm reflecting them. So yeah, I would say at that time, I was probably not on the peak anymore and with Aston Martin starting a new challenge, I think I was ultimately looking for this reassurance that can I still do this? Which sounds silly because of course I can do it, I've proven it so many times, but that's this uncertainty or insecurity is something that we all have.

1:03:23All the drivers have it on the grid today. hey, I was speaking to Michael about this many years ago, and even he had it. And for me, when I say even, it's because he is the greatest. I grew up, posters of him on the wall. He was the best in everything I could imagine with racing. And he was insecure? What? You? So we all have that. And I think those years, from a result point of view, Of course, I would have loved to see the team growing faster, but they were important for me because I started to feel really comfortable again with my driving. And I think I did have peak performances, even at a later stage.

1:04:08But overall peak, probably not anymore.

1:04:14After consecutive years with the exact same grid, 2025 was the year of the rookie. Kimi Antonelli, Gabriel Bortoletto, Isaac Hadjar, Jack Doohan and Oli Behrman all kicked off their first full seasons in Formula 1 at the Australian Grand Prix. Doohan was replaced by Franco Colopinto after only five races at Alpine, but Kimi, Gabriel, Isaac and Oli all impressed over the 24 race season. But it was Kimi and Isaac who reached their first major milestones. And the third youngest Formula One podium finisher is Kimi Antonelli, climbing onto a podium for the first time in just his 10th race in Formula One.

1:04:57Oh my God. Oh my God. Oh my God. What a sentence this is! Isaac Hadjar, you are P3! He is heading to the podium. Oh my God, Mel, what have we done? Think back to the first race of the season. On a wet track at Melbourne, Isaac spun and crashed on the formation lap to the grid. His F1 debut ended before the start lights had even gone out. I asked him about the mental strength it took to come back from that. Melbourne was a hit but not bigger than all the ones I've had through karting to Formula 1 so I'm just, I'm used to that there's been so many moments in my career since very young where I'm like, I'm realising I'm not making it to Formula 1 level is too high Did you doubt yourself?

1:05:52Yeah, so many times I've doubted myself so many times What pulled you through those moments? I'd like to say more passionate about racing than any other drivers. That's what I would like to think. Maybe it's not true. I think it's the only reason. Like when I, after Melbourne, I was just itching to get back in the car in China. That was the only thing I was thinking about was just driving the damn car and go fast. After Melbourne was just, it was a disappointment because I didn't take much experience, but it was not a, yeah, looking back at it, I think during the moment, it was the worst moment of my life.

1:06:31Your world is falling apart, literally. You think this is the end. So you become stupid, right, in the car at the moment. But then you just got to keep fighting. And that's what I did my whole career since I'm seven. So I'm just used to that. I know there's going to be a lot of flaws in my career, many more to come. But now I know how to handle them. Did you find a boxing gym on the Monday morning after Melbourne? no no i wouldn't have been wanting to see you my pillow at home yeah it's the only thing isaac can you talk me through what actually happened in the car in melbourne i mean we yeah outside it just looked like a simple spin but did did something happen in terms of was there a power surge or no i think it was just uh everything put together to end up in that wall i mean at that time tires are not really into temp start of the formation lab i remember being on the white line at that time which was really slippery and for some reason I was in first gear just by upshifting to second I had like this kind of bogged down car went a bit nervous press the steering angle I had and it just went nothing I could do really it was the wall was grabbing me it was uh when the car snapped I knew I was going in the wall and as I was sliding I was I don't know how much force I put into the brake pedal at that time, but I was just praying for the car not to be damaged so I could come back.

1:08:04It was quite a hit, so that was it. And look at what happened to very experienced drivers in that race. Fernando Alonso, Carlos Sainz, they ended up in the wall. Did you get some comfort from that? It's like, yes, because this can happen. It would have been more difficult if I was the only one, but at the same time looking back at the way it happened I think it was nothing I could have done really. What doesn't break you makes you stronger? Yeah it does. You feel stronger after that experience? Yeah, much stronger. In junior categories when you have really low moments I think it feels harder than Formula 1 because you're aiming for F1 at that time and you know every setback you have is actually pulling you back from that target.

1:08:54Whereas you make mistakes in Formula 1, as long as you know you're a solid driver, you know you're good, you can stay around. It's not the same pressure. Honestly, I remember going into the car for qualifying in Formula 2. I had so much more. I was more anxious than ever. Whereas Formula 1, I have stress, but it's the good one. It's the one like, okay, I'm going to fight. Whereas in F2, it's just so much things out of your control. I think it's much harder to handle so when you're used to that at such a young age you go into Formula 1 quite ready let's end this just by throwing it forwards where are your hopes?

1:09:31it seems such a sort of flippant question but what are your goals for the rest of the year? the natural trajectory as a Red Bull junior driver is to end up at Red Bull right I'm so happy within my team I'm just learning so much every weekend I just want to keep doing that just enjoy it enjoy the fights with the other guys and don't disappoint myself When is the right time to make the step up to Red Bull? If you got the call this year would you feel ready? No, but I'll take it You would take it? Yeah Because you wouldn't be in a position to say no? No, because I'm a fighter That's all And when you see how difficult it's been for Liam in the past for Yuki now It makes it, I'm just curious.

1:10:21Curious to drive the car, see what it's like. Yeah. What drives me is fighting against the best in the world. And to have Max as a teammate, I would learn so much. Do you get on with Max? I do. I mean, I think he's a very chill guy. He gets on with everyone. And as long as it's fine on track, obviously. But he's a cool guy, yes. 2025 was also a rookie season for Laura Muller, who stepped up as a race engineer for the first time, working with Esteban Ocon at Haas. An F1 driver's relationship with their race engineer is their most important in the sport. The engineer is their eyes and ears for everything they can't hear or see in the cockpit, and they work incredibly closely off track as well.

1:11:06So when Laura was asked to team up with Esteban in his first season at Haas, they were keen to get up to speed quickly. I told me you know you will work with Laura next year because you guys are very similar in the way you're working and and how hard you know you are working and uh and I was like yeah okay we'll see that's that's that's good but but I've never found an engineer that was you know so hard onto things to prove the point find the point and get the best out of things so Esteban how how did you feel when Io said you were going to be working with Laura from the point of view of she was new to race engineering.

1:11:47Yeah. Were you scared? Yeah, because obviously we were both new, so I wasn't too sure at first. Yeah, it was quite a lot of unknowns because obviously if you have an engineer that has been settled, has worked the whole year in the race engineering job, it's just one side that needs to adapt to it. now you know everything is new on our side of the garage but i really think like we've adapted so well to the situation and so quickly i think we got little details further into the year that we always improve but i think every engineer does that but yeah i think from race one with the amount of work that we've done before we were set and ready to to race and to fight maybe both being new helped yeah actually i'm pretty sure in hindsight definitely i think it's always so because our performance engineer was also new yes so it was just like full new but um i always think if somebody is new the less experienced they are the more you can mold them to to what you need and i think because we were all new to what we were doing we kind of molded very well together and just do things the way we need them to be done.

1:13:04Because we all don't really have a preconceived idea of how it should be. So I think we've taken the positive from that. How many times a lap would you be talking to Esteban? I kind of try to limit it to once. It depends on the condition. It depends, you know, is this a race where not much happens? Is this a race where he's fighting someone? Is it wet? All these kind of things. because normally, you know, once a lap, you say, okay, this is how many laps to go. But for example, in a quality lap, I would never dare to say anything. If not, you know, somebody's literally spinning off in front of him or there's a yellow flag.

1:13:41I think if I'd start talking to you more than once a lap, you'd be like... And always on a straight, right? Yes. That's the hard bit because sometimes GPS is off. Sometimes, you know, you are trying to speak in the straight, but it happens in the corners. But there are times where normal situation, once a lap, as Laura says, but if it's, you know, something critical like brakes are, you know, over the roof, there is an issue with the engine, a critical thing, or there is, you know, a critical decision to take on strategy. You know, we agree to talk as much as we can because that's critical for our race.

1:14:18So there are times where we must have talked like 25, 30 seconds in a lap. it has happened but you lose time doing that you know because you are not fully focused on what you are doing in front so you will lose two or three tenths by keeping on talking but if you gain 10 seconds or 15 on your overall race time or you finish a race well it's just a game how cool are you on the pit wall laura i wanted to ask you about miami you're cool i mean come on i'm pretty or the famous Miami thing so he's busy going around the outside of Lewis Hamilton right he wants that inside line Ocon's not going to give it to him so can he get around the outside and keep a wheel on the racetrack we go side by side is there enough room through 12 and 11 what an overtaking spectacle we've had and that door was always going to close that's a peak reaction as well there the wins we've all done it Laura Muller looking on what are you thinking at that moment well to be honest like in that moment I was just like a fan watching a battle like that's you know everybody's seen that video of me making faces and stuff but like in that moment I can't help him he needs to do his thing so you know there's not something I can look for or whatever so So I was just watching, you know, your onboards and being like, come on, come on.

1:15:43And that's like for me, if I, you know, a race start, for example, is the same. Like in the first three corners, I can't do anything. So all I'm looking at is just, you know, the onboard and hoping he's going to make enough positions. Well, what a year 2025's been. And there's even more to look forward to next year. because 2026 is the beginning of a very exciting new era for Formula One. Fast, thrilling and more sustainable racing with new cars and new regulations and a new team. With the arrival of Cadillac, Formula One will have 11 teams on the grid for the first time since 2016. And in Valtteri Bottas and Sergio Perez, who have more than 500 Grands Prix between them, the team will have plenty of experience for what will be a huge first season.

1:16:34Before he signed for Cadillac, Valtteri and I caught up to find out how he was finding life as a reserve driver for Mercedes, why he was so eager to get back on the grid, and most importantly, whether his hair had changed colour. It hasn't changed colour since last year. Once it got bleached by the Australian summer the other year, it stayed like this magically. Do you know what's quite weird is that the hair is as bleached as it is, the moustache is not. so it looks kind of weird. Kind of weird, but I kind of like it. Sometimes weird is good. It's very Mansel-esque. It's very Mansel. Have you thought about a goatee and sort of doing a Damon Hill?

1:17:18I've thought about it, but I like this current style. Spec, yeah, let's say. You know, I did try actually to bleach my moustache last year, but it wasn't a good look. I think it looked even more weird. Claire Williams was on the podcast recently and she said how much she was loving Valtteri 2.0, this version of Valtteri, and how different it was to the Valtteri she knew. Yeah, I know. I mean, as a youngster, when I started in the sport, I think I was actually quite shy, very reserved, almost like just a machine, you know, who drives the car. Didn't really show much emotion, didn't really allow myself to just be who I am, you know.

1:18:03so I've grown a lot I think as a human being in in the last 12 years or so. Has this always been there or is it life experience that has brought out that the colorful version of Valtteri? I think it's always been there you know especially when I've been if I look back like a long time ago in a comfortable situation with my friends and stuff. We just never saw it? Yeah I think so yeah and and yes for sure life experience I've definitely opened up a lot. For me, life is much more straightforward now than it was, let's say, even five years ago. You know, I'm just, I don't know, seeing the big picture of life, being able to have fun with certain things and not taking myself too seriously, which I think is very important in life.

1:18:49Does that make you a better racing driver? I would say so. You know, I'm very comfortable who I am, how I look, how I drive. But yeah, I'm definitely, speaking of racing, I'm definitely starting to miss that part. Interestingly, in Spain last weekend, Fernando Alonso was talking about how he left the sport in 2018 and didn't initially plan to come back, but he said, I needed Formula One still. I had to come back. let's talk about the year out that you're having now are you in a similar place with Formula One you've taken a bit of a step back and are you realizing how much you want to race again you know I always wanted to race so I don't know maybe that's the difference to Fernando I'm sitting here now without the race seat not because of my own choice and I definitely still feel and that emotion was quite quick after I knew I wouldn't get a seat for this year that I'm not done yet with Formula One.

1:19:51I still have more to give. It's still number one thing in my life. And yeah, that sensation, now that I've been watching a side, has got stronger and stronger and stronger. And now I like really start to miss racing. Let's bring it on to Cadillac now. New team coming in for next year. I've heard your name being linked to them a lot. I would imagine my experience will help because now I've raced in three different teams. with one of the teams had mega success with Williams as well had some great great results etc so I hope I'm in a good position and for me I actually see it very interesting project you know something new to Formula One an American team with a maybe different view to the sport and for me to let's say if I would be there as a driver would be actually very interesting because you can start from scratch.

1:20:48You know, the team starts from zero and you could actually make a big influence on certain things, which direction to go. And that would be very motivating and rewarding when the success comes. Do you think now is a good time for a new team to come into F1 with the rule change? I think rule change is always a good point to jump in because you just never know. You know, if you suddenly get it right, you actually might be doing really well from the get-go.

1:21:21That's it for the best of F1 Beyond the Grid 2025. Thank you so much to everyone who's come on the show. It's been fascinating to hear so many stories and gain so much insight. And thank you to all of you who've listened. We love sharing these interviews with you and reading your comments. And there's so much to look forward to in 2026. The new era of Formula One is going to be thrilling. We'll be back in early 26 with more amazing guests from the world of Formula One. In the meantime, you can go back and listen to all of our interviews in full. There are links to the episodes in the description for all the guests featured in this show, or just find F1 Beyond the Grid on your app and scroll down to see all our episodes from the past eight years.

1:22:06You can also check out F1's other official podcasts. F1 Nation will be back next season for race previews and reviews from the Formula One paddock, And you can listen to F1 Explains to hear your questions about Formula One answered by F1's experts. To stay up to date with the latest news during the winter break, go to F1.com, the official F1 app, and follow at F1 on social media. Thank you so much for listening. F1 Beyond the Grid is produced by Formula One and Audioboom Studios. Wishing you a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. And until next season, keep it flat out.

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