Another Thing Sofia Coppola and Wes Anderson Have in Common

29:39And when we saw that there was too much of someone in something, we would kind of flip them around or same with like gender and race, et cetera. We were trying to make everything as balanced as possible to kind of, to kind of give like a, you know, overview of like everyone. And obviously like we could make the whole book about Sophia, but then, then that would do a disservice to so many other people, of course. right? But maybe we'll do the Sophia book one day, just the strictly Sophia book. Her book that came out last year is really great. I highly recommend it. Oh, yeah. I look through it. I look through it all the time.

30:11It's incredible. Yeah, so many images there that I still have yet to scan and upload to the page. But when it comes to the research process, though, I agree 100 % what you said about Sophia, that she has this incredible backlog of information in her mind. And when you do like a lot of research online, you start to realize that like, there is nothing online, you know, there's actually nothing there, especially stuff from like 20 years ago. It's like, oh, okay, I found this great interview, but then the link is broken and you can't read it or things are just like servers are wiped and there's no information on the page anymore.

30:50But that's why I've been buying and reading a lot of old magazines, like details and days and index and the face. I'm forgetting a few others right now, but like, just developing my own kind of back catalog of information, you know? And a lot of those things are not online, you know? Like, there's a lot of great interviews with directors in that time that like, the images have not been uploaded to Instagram, or even online, and which is kind of why I think my page took off a little bit is because I try my hardest, my hardest to not share something that's already been shared a bunch of times before.

31:28Of course, sometimes it's like, I have no choice. The image is so great. You want to, or you have something new to say about it. But, uh, I also, the, I'm so lucky to live here in LA because we have, um, an incredible library here called the Margaret Herrick library, which is run by, um, the Academy and they just have the most insane archive of anything related to Hollywood or film, foreign film as well. And I spent so many hours there just searching Cronenberg and then seeing everything that came up and like, or searching like Cronenberg wares, Cronenberg war, you know, like those keywords to kind of like see how people describe, you know, these people that we're talking about.

32:11And a lot of the quotes, a lot of the like random images you see from there came from like uh this like insane research that I've done um I don't want to I'm not the only one who did it of course but like uh I feel like I brought a lot to the table when it came to like just researching these like or I was the only one in LA too so I was the only one who could actually go to that library etc but uh yeah that's that's kind of a little bit how the book came about that's so so fun so on on Instagram what are some of the most popular posts you've ever done in terms of likes or comments or what are the engagement rates wise what are some of the things that have really popped and you were like wow i i i definitely hit a nerve there yeah i think uh definitely sophia stuff does really well especially when it's not like one of the 10 images that vogue has run like a million times or something yeah like all those like 90s red carpet looks they're beautiful but like we've seen those images like 200 times we don't need to see them anymore but not anymore but like you know we don't need to keep posting them every year but Sophia does well the one that's coming to mind is on the set of I think Marie Antoinette she's wearing this like hoodie with a skeleton torso printed on it and I have yet to find who makes it I have no idea who makes it but that that image has done incredibly well for me especially over the last like year or so I posted a photo of Frederick Wiseman the documentary filmmaker at age 93 and and he's wearing this like gorgeous like well-worn like red shirt that's obviously like pink now because of how much he's worn it and then these He's like perfect, like really wide, really, really like also worn in pair of like brown trousers.

34:06And just, just the contrast of the pink and the brown looks, he looks like a Neapolitan ice cream. It looks beautiful. But that photo did so well. And I didn't think it would because I'd never posted him before. He's not that famous. I know people in the film world know him, but like, I don't think like surface level, you know, people know him too much. but he's also someone who Sophia has referenced a few times especially his like Neiman Marcus documentary is incredible if you guys have seen it but yeah that that posted incredibly well Nora Ephron does really well for me which is you know obvious yeah she's big for me yeah yeah and also the costumes in her films and that is something that I'm surprised not more I know Janixa was a costume designer before, but I'm surprised more costume designers don't become directors.

34:56Just I've spent a lot more time with costume designers since moving to LA and they have to be such great communicators and storytellers that I can see that transition so well. But Nora's sort of, to me, she is a great example of taking like preppy tropes, but she's not a preppy and that for me is what is interesting i love preppy clothes but i'm not preppy and so like meg ryan isn't really preppy but she wears like khakis and loafers in in you've got mail or or what have you and and she i just feel like in and out of of real life and on set and in the in the films you could really see who Nora Ephron was through her clothing.

35:45That's what I think is so incredible about film and fashion is like I think designers and directors are both world builders right like they're both have like this huge vision that they have to like portray visually uh obviously in different mediums but like I think that's why they go so hand in hand together and I have this like it hasn't I haven't developed it too much yet but I this like this take that like directors want to be designers and designers want to be directors you know like you've seen already the road art sisters and tom ford etc take an actual stab at movie making but then but then there's something about like anthony vaccarello creating a studio within his company that's like i want to i i want to do this too or i want to at least be involved in this world um and and obviously you see like luca and um uh um jonathan anderson's uh relationship you know um and i wouldn't be surprised if jonathan anderson has a film in the next like five years or something you know like he's not too far off from doing that and i think that's what i noticed in directors as well and i think that's what i've learned from directors is that like especially uh you know people up until like 2010 or something is like what they're wearing is so timeless you know like you could look at a photo of like werner herzog from the 70s and like someone in Silver Lake is wearing that outfit right now, you know?

37:06Or even same for, like, Rainer Werner Fassbender. Like, they wear such, like, it looks like he's wearing, like, Balenciaga boots in, like, 1969 or something. You know, it's just insane. But, yeah, I think that's what I think is so beautiful about this. And I think that's why I am also surprised more costume deniers aren't directors and vice versa. But, yeah, it's such a beautiful crossover, you know?

37:39so you recently interviewed vim vendors right yes like literally the coolest thing i've ever done so it's funny i had charlie who edited the book charlie robin jones i had um coffee with him in Paris a year over a year ago. And he was trying to interview Yoji to do the back. Cause Yoji wrote the afterward or the forward for the book or afterward. And then, and, and obviously Vim had a movie out this year and then the undercover show where it was him reading that piece of writing. Right. I think so. Oh, I don't, I don't know about the undercover show. Yeah. So like at the women's undercover show last season, it was a Vim Vendors poem.

38:32Wow. And, and it was called watching a working woman. I lit, I almost started crying. Wow. I didn't know it was him. Oh yeah. You need to, you need to listen to this. Um, I didn't know it was him cause it was right after perfect days. Yeah. It was in February, um, right after perfect days came out. Um, and I think he read it. It was definitely his poem. I, I was just like, you know, it's Wednesday. I'd been gone from home for all that time. Also the collection was truly incredible. It was so good. And, um, and then it, it just, um, I'm going to send it to you right now, but it was just, it's, it's remarkable.

39:21But what did, I, I obviously read over your, your conversation with him, but for, for those who haven't read it yet, and I encourage you all to check it out on it's director fits.com, right? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So I really encourage you all to check it out, but what did you all talk about and what did you learn about like dressing yourself from him? So with, with Vim, I've never heard anyone, maybe besides Yoji speak so beautifully about clothes before. Um, I, I simply, you know, after doing a little, you know, intro preamble, like, how are you, et cetera. Um, I simply asked him like, what is your relationship to clothing?

40:02You know, like, what, how do you think about it, et cetera. And he literally spoke for like 15 minutes straight, nonstop. And I was like in awe, I couldn't believe it. Like from one question he said so much. But, you know, he said a story about how he was, when he was directing, in my opinion, his most beautiful film, Wings of Desire. It's all in black and white, but then there's one scene towards the end where the female protagonist, you know, wears a red dress to kind of like, you know, impress the angel character. and that's the scene that's in color you know when she has the red dress on and it's such a beautiful part because you know you've been watching this movie for two hours in black and white and all of a sudden there's color out of nowhere and he was saying that like they had a really hard time finding that dress that what was the dress that she was going to put on to like make her character kind of have this like revelation of like she it's more of a scene where she's kind of standing up for herself, I would say.

41:02And he was searching and searching, and he said he was, I think, in Berlin, and he finally found this dress, and it happened to be a Yoji Yamamoto dress, and he had no idea who he was, had no idea, you know, his history or anything like that, but the dress called out to him, and he bought it, and then took it to the actress. I'm sorry, I'm forgetting her name right now, which I should have known, but he took it to her, and she immediately was like, wow, she put it on, and she said, I feel incredible. Like, her, she was able to give that performance that he was looking for in that dress. And then he was talking about how that's the first time he realized that clothing can kind of change who you are in a way.

41:39And, you know, especially if you want to like be ready for a certain occasion, there are certain items you can put on that kind of change your persona in a bit, not change your persona, but kind of uplift you, you know? And he's like, well, I wanted to know who was this Yoji Yamamoto? Who was this guy who like made this thing and of course he went and bought a few things for himself and he said he became like infatuated with it and then later later on they made their documentary together which I encourage everyone to watch it's it's it's incredible um it's it's also beautiful scenes of Tokyo and Paris simultaneously but like it's just a it's just an incredible way of watching one artist um like kind of like peek into the view of another artist in a different medium and then make all these similarities and differences and connections to it.

42:25And then you see their friendship and beautiful. He calls him his brother. You see that kind of relationship form in the film and it's incredible. But yeah, I learned from him that clothing is very purposeful in the sense that you put something on for a certain occasion. He's got certain jackets he wears only for filming. and then he found a couple of designers that he wears that uh you know he feels comfortable in every day he calls clothes especially his yoji clothes his second skin which i think is incredible you know because it's like it's like a protective armor for him almost it's like when he wears this he's ready to kind of like conquer the world um in another way like uh i didn't interview him but i read in an interview wang car why he's he said that like when he puts his glasses on like he's the director Wong Kar Wai.

43:19That's kind of his, the item that he wears that goes from Wong Kar Wai to director Wong Kar Wai. And I think a lot of people feel that same way because clothing is so universal, right? We all have to wear it. And you see people who aren't really interested in clothes kind of recognize that a certain jacket, a certain t-shirt, et cetera, changes their mood or makes them feel good or is their lucky shirt, etc. So I think it's like a principle that everyone has in a way. But yeah, that's kind of what I took from him. And I also kind of took from him, like, try to find something you really like and just kind of make that your thing in a way, without trying too hard, of course.

44:04But like, he wears a lot of Paul Harndon as well, which is someone I learned about and like cannot find any information about except for one like barely barely um you know whatever some gq article that doesn't really say much about it but um but i think it's interesting and like he found he's these two designers that he he agrees with their worldview and the way they build things and he kind of just adopts it for himself paul harndan just came up for me too that's very interesting I wonder who was talking about him. There are like a few celebrities who wear his stuff. Like I know Jeremy Strong wears his stuff, but it's so interesting.

44:49Like no one's allowed to talk about him. It's weird. Like I literally prefaced my question to Wim with like, I know this is sensitive, but like, can you tell me anything about Paul Harns? And he literally did not say anything. I thought these might, it might be the brand that my husband just got a pair of chinos from. This designer just came up for me somewhere too. That's really interesting. It seems like a lot of people wear his stuff, but it's like not something widely available. Like I heard it's in Dover Street Markets, but like I checked the LA store and I did not see anything there. Obviously, I'm not sure if it's in London or New York or Japan, but yeah, it seems like a really weird brand that no one knows anything about.

45:30What is your thing? You said that he kind of said you have to find your thing. And I totally agree with that. I think your thing probably changes through the years. If you are giving it a purpose and your purpose changes, then the way you dress is going to change a little bit. Like I've done my, the way I've dressed has definitely changed since I moved to LA, but fundamentally it's still the same. I'm still the same. You could still see the same person in my clothes, but what are, what are some of your sort of wardrobe staples at this point? Yeah. So I I'm 27. So I think I'm like still developing that a little bit, you know?

46:08But I think I'm starting to get there in the sense that like for the last like three, four years, all I've worn are like Oxford shirts and, you know, similarly cut like striped button down shirts and stuff like that. And that's something that I just feel like 100 % myself in because it's also the thing of like, I don't like trends, you know, I follow them, I pay attention to them, but I don't know, I feel so silly, you know, wearing like extremely wide trousers when I haven't before. Just because Blackbird's five-point is telling me to wear them. I don't know. I don't think I should necessarily be wearing them.

46:41Definitely not. No, I love Jonah. I love the way he talks. But I don't know. I just think sometimes like, I don't want to look like everyone at the Silver Lake bar I'm going to, you know? But I don't know. I think for me, it's just literally, I'm trying to find things that are timeless in a sense where I can have them for like 10 years and then just keep buying them, which is something I already do. Like, uh, like I wear a lot of Mephisto shoes. Um, um, I literally have been buying them over and over again for the last like four or five years. And, and the origin for that is actually kind of funny because there are a few directors like Robert Altman who wore them a lot.

47:20But, um, at my, at my Armenian, uh, high school, uh, in the Valley, we had like a priest that would come to the school like every now and then. And I would be like so bored during those parts of the school that I would literally look down at his shoes and they were Mephisto. And I learned about Mephisto from that. I was like, I Googled it after. I was like, what is this? Are Armenians mostly Catholic or what, what kind of priest was it? They're, they're Orthodox Christians. I know there's a few Catholics as well. That's really interesting. So on my mom's side, they're Russian Orthodox Christians.

47:54So, or Ukrainian Orthodox Christians. So like on my mom's side, it's Russian Orthodox. On my dad's side it's Armenian no religion she was in Columbus so my grandmother who's Armenian as we talked about was in Columbus Ohio but it's just that's really interesting that it's all not not to bring it back back to you that's well if you think about uniforms and the way people dress like Bally Barrett who used to be the creative director at Hermes once I interviewed her and she had these amazing red socks on and she bought had bought them at the Vatican they were like Pope socks and I forgot to include it in the piece and always felt like a real idiot for not including it.

48:35But that kind of like utilitarian purpose driven is what I think excites a lot of fashion enthusiasts. Yeah, no, 100%. And that's something I love, too, is the uniform, you know, especially that's kind of one thing I look for a lot in a lot of these photos. It's like I because because, again, just things that are lived in look the best. and you can tell when someone has their own personal style. They're not necessarily wearing the same thing every day, but they wear like different variations of the same thing every day, right? Like, you know, the same kind of Oxford shirt, but like they have 10 brands, et cetera, or like 10 different colors or something.

49:12But that's also kind of how I like to collect clothes around me is like they need to have some sort of meaning outside of me in a way. Like when I look at the Mephisto's, I think of my high school and the priest. when I wear these Oxford shirts, I look at my grandpa because that's all he wears. And then when I wear certain like graphic t-shirts, like they're tied to like cars that my dad and uncle like or movies that they like, et cetera. You know, everything, everything, like all these things behind me to have like some sort of like connection back to like my life or something. I don't know. I just feel like we're not having some sort of connection to it.

49:51It feels like it doesn't feel as meaningful to me. And I also think you're right. You're in your 20s. You don't you don't need to decide yet. I wore some real stupid shit during that period and and honestly, occasionally still do. But when I really think about it, I always end up going back to the same stuff that I actually liked when I was a young teenager. And and you sort of and so much of my and I wonder if this is true for you, too. My personal style came from watching movies. I watch movies constantly when I was like 13. And I've been all through, but like really a lot when I was little.

50:30And because I'm a single mom, I was home alone a lot. And I watch movies all the time and TV all the time. Like I also watch stuff that you should not watch way too early. And like Twin Peaks, I watched when it was on. Great outfits. Which is I was like eight or nine years old, but I think Twin Peaks in particular really informed my aesthetics and like the way I dress and just the way everything, like maybe you wouldn't be able to tell looking at me, but just visually so much of that is, is still so close. But, um, yeah, it's, it's so interesting. Are there any big movies growing up that you feel like inspired your, your personal style or inspired you to do this?

51:16Yeah, first of all, I'm the same way. Everything, almost everything I've learned somehow has come from movies in a sense. Like my dad loves cars, for example. So we watch like old French films just to look at the cars in the background. And then I started learning what those cars were. And then I started seeing them in real life at car shows and stuff, especially here in LA. There's so much of that stuff. And then my brother is an architecture student and we watch certain films to look at architecturally significant homes. But I think that's what's beautiful about movies is everyone's interest somehow ends up in a movie.

51:53Whether it's clothes, architecture, cars, songs, or even period pieces about history that you're interested in. So much of our interest ladders up to movies because they're like little slices of life in a way, you know, even if they're not 100 % true stories, etc. But I think a couple of movies that like I also watched way too early on, which I think is the way to do things, you know, you should be exposed. Yeah, yeah, you have a little bit of you need to get screwed up in like a pretty harmless way when you're young, like watching Twin Peaks, because my mom's like, this is the best show ever on TV, you can watch it.

52:36Yeah, exactly. I think I think I think that's the way to raise kid. I don't know. A little good. It's like good damage. Yeah, exactly. It's and it's like when you watch it later on, when you're older and in the right mindset, it makes much more sense. You know, I had nightmares for years afterwards. I'm so afraid of Bob. It's fine. Oh, my God. Yeah. Well, well, some of mine are like, for example, I don't know why my dad was showing us this stuff, but like like we watched like body double at a very early age. Oh, my God. Yeah, it's so good. Which is like a crazy movie to show like a fifth grader or something.

53:11But I'm so happy he did. Or like we watched like Basic Instinct and like. Yeah, and Body Heat and all that kind of stuff. Yeah, exactly. He knew those scenes were coming up. Like he knew that was going to happen. But we still were like exposed to it as kids. And it was incredible. But yeah, I think like Body Double, Mahalan Drive, especially Justin Theroux's character in Mahalan Drive, like is a North Star for me. like one of the best dressed characters I've ever seen and of course he's a director in the film which is great um but uh yeah yeah I think I think those like Jackie Brown of course like all that kind of stuff a lot of them also happen to be LA movies if you made that connection but um yeah stuff like a Paul Thomas Anderson stuff as well like Punch Drunk Love or or um Magnolia where like I watched maybe too early um but yeah all that stuff I I you probably wouldn't see it If I if I if I gave you a full fit check or something, but like all those stuff are like ingrained in my head of like, OK, this is like how cool people look in a way.

54:13Totally. Totally. Yeah. Mahalan Drive. I think I was it. That was ninety nine. Right. So I was in high school, but I was still too young because that one scene at the diner when the guy comes. Oh, my God. Yeah. But I just rewatched it. Actually, when before we moved to L.A., we did a bunch of L.A. movies, including a couple PTA movies. And we did that. And there, I mean, they're just so LA has, is just, I mean, it's so romantic. Like it's, it's the cinematic it's your, it's, you're living in the movies and the, the colors and the kind of terrain. And then that combined with the way people dress is, is just like, it can really be movie magic in a way that East Coast is a little harder to pull off if you're not Nora Afron or what have you.

55:07No, 100%. I mean, I'm born and raised here, you know, and watching like a movie like Encino Man or like Punch Drunk Love, you know, like when I was a kid, I thought like, oh, like all movies are about my neighborhood. Like I just thought that was a thing. I didn't realize. But then when I got older, I was like, oh, my God, this is so special. Like we're living in the craziest place. Like people all over the world are watching PTA movies that are taking place, like literally blocks away from my house. Yeah. Like when PTA was making licorice pizza, I would walk. Yeah. I would walk my dog and I would run into the set on accident.

55:46Like that's how close that's how close in proximity all these things are. And yeah, it feels it feels like every day we're in a movie and it's incredible. I freaking love it. This has been so fun. I have one final question for you. Yeah. Do people in their 20s really go to bars in Silver Lake? I would say more like Highland Park, Echo Park, Eagle Rock. Like the Waltz bars. Maybe 4100 has a lot of young people there if you've been there. I've never heard of 4100. I live in Eagle Rock, so I know what Waltz is. I also don't go there. But I was just like, it feels like Silver Lake is too old for young people now.

56:24No, 100%. I think it's more of like Highland Park, like El Prado if you've been there. I've heard of it You know where I have been a lot Is Capri Club I dislike Capri Club so much It's not right No offense The people who own it are really nice But it's like a fake knockoff of a New York place It smells like Welcome to the Johnsons Which anyone Only the people who are my age Who lived in New York in the 2000s Will know what that is And it's fine Like I, I need, if I need a martini, I'll go there. But it feels, it almost feels like even like it's just college students or a bunch of girls. Yeah. I don't, I don't know.

57:07Something about the energy there just feels like sinister to me. I, I, I've been there once and I was like, I, I left within 20 minutes. I couldn't, I couldn't handle it. I don't know. I mean, I'm not a big, like, yeah, no offense. I don't know anybody who works there or owns it or runs it, but I don't know. There's something about there is like a little evil energy, but, but yeah, I would say like, even in a place like El Prado definitely is like a little evil as well. But you can tell like all the cool kids are there. Okay. I'm going to stay away then. This was so fun. Thank you for being here.

57:39Check out Director Fitz on Instagram, the website. Check out the book, How Directors Dress through A24. It's a really interesting, I was, I'd say my expectations for the book itself were exceeded. And a lot of that has to do with all the work you did on it. So congrats. Thank you, Lauren. Yeah. And, and, uh, the book is incredible. It's not like a typical coffee table book. There are actually a lot of words and incredible research in it. Rachel Tashin was a writer. Adam Ray was a writer, Tom Betridge, uh, Sammy Rice, so many incredible people wrote in that. Lynn Yeager. Lynn Yeager. Yeah. Oh my God.

58:14Her chapter is incredible. Uh, it's, it's so good. There's so much great information. It's really fun. Really fun. Special project to be a part of. Thank you for being here. This was so great. Of course. Thank you, Lauren. Fashion People is a presentation of Odyssey in partnership with Puck, hosted by Lauren Sherman. That's me. Our executive producers are John Kelly, co-founder of Puck, and Ben Landy, executive editor at Puck. Edited and mixed by Patrick Antonetti and mastered and produced by Bob Tabador. Special thanks to the team at Odyssey including J.D. Crowley Jenna Weiss-Berman Maddie Sprung-Kaiser Josefina Francis Hilary Schuff and Kurt Courtney