Goodbye Mr. Armani, Hello Chloe Malle

32:29Gene Pressman:We had to promise them that we'd take their label out and we would sell those top brands in our store. My father sort of got frustrated, and he decided to go to Europe to search out really good, high-quality brands. Well, nobody knew who Barneys was. And in fact, most people had never even been in New York. So they were so glad to sell any store in New York that he ended up getting all these incredible brands first. and it's funny that Europe was willing to sell them even more than domestic brands were and obviously eventually it all came around full circle where we carried everybody but in 1969 my father opened what he called the International House which was a new building adjacent to Barney's downtown, which just featured European brands.

33:33Gene Pressman:And prior to that, there were designers, but designers were hidden in the back rooms. The manufacturers didn't want to showcase them. So the talent was there, but they weren't allowed to come out to the forefront. And while this was going on, there was so many things culturally going on all at the same time. There were only two political parties then, and it wasn't the Republicans and Democrats. It was the youngsters against the establishment. It was the kids against their parents. And, you know, there were a lot of movements. But obviously Vietnam really was the impetus to create a lot of turmoil in this country because we had a draft then.

34:29Gene Pressman:And nobody wanted to go over there and fight that war. They didn't even know where Vietnam was. And that created a lot of positive things in culture because anger usually does. And I think today it lacks that. I mean, there is anger, but I don't see the same protests as I saw then, you know. And those protests created art and they created film and they created great music and great writing and really all forms of culture and entertainment. them. I know there's anger today, but I think that there's been such a good time for such a long time. And I don't want to go over this too much now, but that people got sort of complacent and that hurts creativity, you know?

35:30Gene Pressman:And so in terms of fashion and Barneys didn't get into women's until 76 but that was a big moment for women's fashion as well especially a guy named Yves Saint Laurent because he started a revolution he he took couture and made it into what was called ready-to-wear which was huge he brought it more to the masses uh by by although today I must say designer prices are so ridiculous, they might as well be couture. But he brought it more to the general public by having it come out as more mass produced. And that was a big thing. Anyway, to get back to your original question, the reason I wanted to write this book is because I did want to tell a story.

36:23Gene Pressman:I think there's just wonderful things that I could articulate. For me, I was lucky enough to work hard and play hard. Sometimes I didn't know which was which. Definitely burned both ends of the candle. And I'm probably the luckiest guy ever because I got to experience just so much. I spent a lot of my life in Europe and traveling around the world. taking in all the different culture, everything that people, you know, had to say. I love history and I love European history. And I learned a lot. I learned a lot about architecture, about art. And I also was able to layer Americana over that, you know.

37:24And really, the thing about America that's just so brilliant is the freedom that we all enjoy.

37:33Gene Pressman:And I know that lately it's a little weird out there. But I think freedom has allowed America to be so creative, to be able to speak its mind, to be able to take risks, to do things. and it really has always been the greatest place to be brought up. And so when you have that sort of combo sandwich of European cultures and American freedom and intuition and creativity, it's a pretty special thing. And I think that's what Barneys became or became because of that. You know, America is a much more casual environment, and Europe is, because of their history, is probably more sophisticated, and they're definitely more conservative, too.

38:30Gene Pressman:They have great taste level, obviously, in many things, especially in fashion, but in food and all kinds of things, architecture. So, again, experiencing all of that and being able to articulate it in a book is a special thing. And, you know, I grew up when I did get to Barney's in 72. It was really the beginnings of a renaissance of ready-to-wear and fashion, both in men's and women's. And I got to experience that from the beginning. And I think that very much was part of introducing both myself and the people that worked at Barnum's, all the great merchants, so many fabulous young talent who end up evolving to substantial talent and very influential talent.

39:33Gene Pressman:And I think that Barneys, I think that's one of the greatest things that Barneys did is that it helped to create culture. It was really, it was not only influenced by culture, but it was part of the culture. And it really, it really delivered culture. And the other aspect, which I talk about in the book, is New York City. In the 60s, just to go back for a minute, London was the center of the universe. It was very special. People don't talk about the 60s that much. And for me, it was a huge influence on my life and especially London. So many things were going on. Obviously, I touch on the music, but also fashion, the sensibility.

40:30people were taking such risk the art scene the movie scene and of course it was all over Europe

40:39Gene Pressman:Italy you know Italian fashion and also Italian movie making was extraordinary but I think England I think London especially was the center of the universe and it influenced me greatly and then towards the 70s and the late 60s, America started happening. And by really by the late 60s, early 70s, New York started, it started to shift and New York really just generated so much incredible energy. I mean, it was, it was wild and it was dangerous and it was sexy, you know, and it was all of it. And that combination really, it just made for something very special. I remember, and I talk about a lot of this in the book, but I remember being on a subway and it was really strange to see policemen while the subway was moving, going from car to car, holding police dogs.

41:45Gene Pressman:uh you know that was a little unsettling although you felt good about it because you felt sort of safe there was more graffiti inside the train than there was outside the train um and you know basically new york was almost bankrupt but because of all that there was a lot of creativity again it's always there the more the more angst it usually means more creativity So, you know, it was special time and it depended what street you walked down. That was all of a sudden you had this influence of tremendous nightclubs and the gay clubs started happening. These big dance halls. That was that was really fun.

42:34and if you were a straight guy it was really great because um all the attractive women in new york would gravitate towards the gay scene because they felt safe and so as a straight guy

42:49Gene Pressman:if you went to these gay clubs he was kind of you know you didn't have to bring a sandwich to a picnic it was it was insane and it was just fun it was it was it was so much energy um I talk a lot about New York throughout the whole thing. But I think I'll stop there and let you ask me some more questions. So, you know, I wanted to tell the story. There was so much to tell. Well, I mean, it's interesting. I think that consumer culture being popular culture and being the fabric of what was happening in the world is important context. You mentioned when we first started chatting that you feel like a lot of people get it wrong, like get what Barney's was.

43:43What do you think? I mean, there's so much. I called you a couple months ago because there was something else happening in the world of Barney's. It's owned by a licensing firm now. They have hotels, they have all this stuff, but there's going to be two, potentially two different TV shows, one that you will be involved in or, or pieces of art entertainment about Barneys. What do you think it is like looking as you've been out of the business since what? 95, 98, 98. So since 98, so that's almost 20, almost 30 years looking at it and being on the outside, what do people get wrong about it, about what it meant to the culture?

44:29Gene Pressman:Well, I think I want to personalize that and say as far as I see it, because in spite of the different ownerships and leadership of Barneys, Barneys from 98 until 2019, I think it was, or 20, so over 20 years, the legacy was so strong that people still perceived it and shopped there and, you know, Barney's flourished greatly and they still thought of it as sort of like the temple of whatever. But I'm very much a purist. And I think what changed was that Barney's didn't change. When I was there and all the just incredible people that worked there in all areas, not only in merchandise, but, you know, in display and windows with Simon's leadership, our advertising, and we had some of the greatest ad people on the planet there.

45:42Gene Pressman:I think that there was a drive to constantly, you were competing against yourself and you constantly had to do something new and you wanted to do something new. I know that I always want to do something new because I always got bored. And so boredom kind of drove me. And, you know, even though we were cognizant of, we were aware of what was going on with our competition and other stores, it didn't motivate me. I think we motivated them way more than they motivated us. I would shop them. I would look at them, travel around the world, but I looked inward and other things influenced us, whether it be other cultures, art or music, just generally what was happening.

46:36Gene Pressman:And that's where, or books, that's where I would get my inspiration from um and so you know i would push the people you know it's kind of like what have you done for me lately i i would tell all the merchants don't come back from europe without a new designer or something new or don't come back you know and i'd be half kidding but i was half serious um but there were a lot of talent out there then it was like the wild wild west it was if you weren't lazy, you could find talent everywhere, under every rock. And they were so happy that someone was discovering them and nurturing them because Barneys, you know, Barneys loved new talent and young talent, and we really nurtured it and brought it along.

47:27Gene Pressman:A lot of stores didn't stay with talent. They dropped them, you know, and we weren't about that. We kept staying with them and sometimes things don't sell as well as you would like in the beginning. But if you promote them and you work with them, usually if they have talent, they're successful. And I think that's what Barneys did and they built big businesses about it.

47:55You mentioned at the beginning, again, that you don't like to say things used to be better than they were. And I agree with that. I think like saying that the nineties was the golden age of era of fashion. It was a golden era of fashion, but it's, it's hard to compare the, the world we live in now versus then. But at that time, and this is something you and I chatted about the last time we spoke, like you all filed for bankruptcy in the nineties. Like the retail landscape now is every single department store, every single multi-brand retailer from the big to the small are every other season in trouble.

48:36Some of them in surmountable trouble where they will have to file for bankruptcy and yet they keep going on. And I guess the question for me is when you were still running the business and in the middle of all that stuff that went on in the nineties, like, why is it so hard to make these stores work? Like not, you made it work from a like cultural perspective and a, and a consumer engagement perspective, but why, why is multi-brand retail a hard business? Like, what do you think fundamentally makes it so challenging to the point that like, this happens with so many stores. And I always think about the fact that Barney's went bankrupt in the 90s because it puts into context of like this, what this isn't a totally new problem that the industry is facing today.

49:32Yeah. So it's there are many reasons.

49:35Gene Pressman:It's not one reason. In terms of Barneys, and then I'll speak in general, we had financial difficulty for several reasons. But one is that we overexpanded too fast. And there were a lot of reasons for that. We had an incredibly wonderful Japanese partner. And basically, anything we wanted to do, they would let us do. So it's hard to say no. Having said that, I think that in the bigger picture, I think stores lack talent. They have no merchants per se It's a real estate To me today I call them airport stores The big stores They just rent out space There's no ownership in terms of Buying merchandise Or building a space Or hiring the sales people Or nurturing the customer There's none of that It's arm's length They're like a shopping mall You know, so and there's there's really not a reason for customers to go there.

50:57Gene Pressman:I mean, you've got to give customers a reason to go. You know, I always felt that Barney's was like the magical mystery tour. You know, customers would go in. They would always find something new. They were excited. I used to have the saying that you never give customers what they want because they don't know what they want. They want you to tell them. And so, and this is, you know, we're talking about the most sophisticated customers in the world, which Barney's had. They wanted us to go and show them what was right, educate them to new things. They love that experience. So I don't see that at all today.

51:40Gene Pressman:Not at all. um i everything looks the same uh you know if they do have boutiques it's it's the big guys of the world that are building them so every boutique and every store is exactly the same it's all cookie cutter um it's just boring it's totally boring um you know i'm sure that there some smaller shops that because the owner lives in the store and it's their point of view and they're looking for things that they like that they personalize and to their customer they give the added service those stores have a shot to to make it you know i i the the other thing about Barney's is that our timing was always great, but when we opened up in 93, the timing wasn't that good.

52:51Gene Pressman:And I don't want to blame it on that, but it was just such a bad recession. And it was tough. It was very tough, but we still did a lot of business. The other thing about Barney's that people don't talk about what i did talk about in the book is we were unusual and that we were a left brain right brain company i think we were as good as business as we were at buying things um that is we were very good at making deals and having we we sold we had the highest you know maintained margins of any store in America, big store. And the reason is because we sold things at regular price. And that's another reason for the downfall of a lot of stores.

53:43Gene Pressman:One of the biggest reasons, they train their customer to buy on sale. And after you start training your customer to buy on sale, they don't come in except to buy on sale. And there's no way you can survive and make money. And when the internet came along and I know a lot of people sort of blame it on the internet, but the internet is not the real reason that stores went out of business. It's because they sold things on sale. The internet just pushed them off the cliff. And the truth be told is that most of these internet companies lose money too. They can't survive either. So it's a lot of factors.

54:28Gene Pressman:Barney's was a unique factor, I will say this. There was no reason for us to go into bankruptcy. We should never have been in bankruptcy. We were, and I say in the book, we were a machine. We had beautiful product. We knew how to make money. We sold what we bought. We knew how to serve as the customer. But we made mistakes, some very costly mistakes, and that caused us to have a deficient cash flow. But in terms of general concept, no reason. And if I look back today, there would have only been two alternatives. Either I would have sold Barneys when I wanted to have sold Barney's or I would have still been running it today and it would have been as relevant and more relevant than it's ever been except it would have been different um the retail part of the fashion would have shrunk a great deal it just can't what what fashion world today is it just can't sustain that biggest store there's just not enough product which is fine so that would have shrunk maybe to 50 so what would i have filled the store with well there's so much else you could fill it with because what you you're creating is theater right and you want people to come in your store and be excited so i would have probably opened a 50 000 square foot food hall let's face it harrod's most exciting thing to have in their store in london is their food hall it's incredible and if you go to i don't know if you've been to tokyo but if you go to Japan in the basement the food halls there are just the best part of the store they're unbelievable and they're they're doing so much business um and I would have also created other elements I would have probably built a concert hall not a big one but a unique one I would have had a theater I would have had art exhibitions I would have you know whatever it would have taken to create you know create traffic and to stimulate people's imaginations, I think we would have done.

56:48Gene Pressman:And under the Barneys umbrella, I think would have worked well. And of course, I mean, who wouldn't have gone to a Barneys resort? Well, yeah. I mean, now there's these Barneys apartments in Mexico, which I don't think they have your flair to them. No, I would have opened condos, obviously, and we would have opened hotels. We had the customer. And as long as we kept our edge and made it special, I think, look, we could have gone into media companies. I know this sounds crazy, but, you know, whether we're making books or we're making movies, I mean, it was our point of view. People bought into our point of view, our editorial.

57:37Gene Pressman:So I think that if we had the right people and we had the right funding, I think we could have made a go on a lot of this stuff. But here we are today. Okay. Really quickly on that, and I'm sure you can't talk a ton about this, but do you feel like they obviously very well-documented issues you had with your brother that continue on today? do you feel like the reason it was successful in the beginning was that it was a family business and do you think that the family dynamic part of it is the ultimate reason it wasn't able to go on is the the challenges you all had running it together yeah look everybody always tries to make it a soap opera okay so are there parts that are true yeah what family doesn't have that dynamic identify them anybody to tell me um if this if this function and family aren't synonymous um i think having eight family members working together is definitely interesting especially if you're in charge of all of them.

58:56So what I did is basically let them do their own thing

59:02Gene Pressman:and everybody did their own thing and nobody overlapped because that would be a disaster, a recipe for disaster. But listen, a lot of couples work together.

59:17Gene Pressman:Marriages don't work because for the same reason or work for the same reason, you know. So So in terms of my brother, we did different things. I was in charge of the merchandising and the marketing of the company and the general image.

59:38Gene Pressman:Bob was in charge of finance and the operations of the company. Did we discuss things? Of course. But, you know, there has to be a lot of trust involved that you've got to believe that they can do what they can do and you can do what you can do. And then where you go over budgets, you go over budgets, obviously. I worked with all my merchants on their open to buys, which is the budget they have for buying things. And I worked on the margins, how much profit we could make, you know, anticipating what we would sell at regular place and what we'd mark down. And so a lot of that related to the economics of the business.

1:00:27Gene Pressman:And Bob would plug that into the numbers. And Bob also then would go over his numbers in terms of what the budgets are there. It's not rocket science, I have to tell you. Retail is a tricky business, though, obviously. But the finance part, if it's managed properly, you know, within reason, should be okay.

1:00:53Gene Pressman:We were co-CEO. So, you know, I think that's a tough thing to do because I think you can only have one CEO. But it was a family dynamic. And my father, that's really how he saw it. So that's what it was. And I worked very closely with my father, who was just a brilliant merchant and a brilliant businessman and so understated. I mean, he was amazing, but he was very difficult on me. And that was good because I learned a lot, you know, and I needed to be roped in because I was definitely unbridled sometimes. So but he he got me and he gave me my freedom. So, yeah, I don't, there's not much to say.

1:01:47I'm the kind of person that I don't like conflict. I avoid it.

1:01:58Gene Pressman:I'm not litigious. I walk away from things. There's a lot of good things in my life, incredible things to talk about. So I try and keep on the positive. I'm being accused of being a very positive energetic person and that's what I only know that and I like to have fun I see you're smiling and you know that's what I love and I think I'm good at telling stories that's why I really enjoyed writing the book because it was a fun story to tell and hopefully it'll be a great TV series yeah we're and you know the one thing I didn't talk about that I'm thinking is the other thing about Barney's that Barney's lost a little bit is its sense of humor you know that was such that was such a the irony of Barney's that I was you know I guess a major proponent of that you got to have a sense of humor you can't take yourself so seriously you know and people really appreciate that and we were selling serious fashion let's face it it was very expensive and a lot of young people that walked in the store couldn't afford much so maybe a young gal would come in the store and buy a lipstick but she got the barney shopping bag so she was feeling good about herself walking on the street but sense of humor and everything we did in simon's windows which were amazing or advertising.

1:03:38Gene Pressman:I mean, everything was sort of a caricature of ourselves. You got to laugh at yourself. The Glenn O 'Brien, the Ronnie Newhouse, the campaigns you did in the 90s, people talk a lot about the buying being so influential or the merchandising, but those campaigns and the way you approached talking about luxury was wholly original and, and, um, it's just like another part of why it's such a big cultural force to this day. Yeah. Well, you know, there's so many little anecdotal stories that I remember at the end, I think I mentioned the book, but at the end of every fashion season in Paris and Milan, you would get accost by all the journalists, you know asking you who you thought yeah the best designers of the season and of course I think the heads of every department store and let me get on the record is one of the things I wanted to clear up we were never a department store never never never I find that insulting um for us but they would come up to me and they go well who would you think were their best you You know, as long as it was Susan, I would always say exactly the same thing.

1:04:59Gene Pressman:I thought that quality was. And I never changed. And, of course, Borneys, I think, and people may be, this was so subtle that people didn't get this later on. But certainly when the pressmans were there. Is that Borneys was the leader in fashion and created trends. but it was so not trendy. We believed in buying things that were built to last. So in order to do that, you had to buy modern classic, not Ralph Warren modern classic, but fashionable things that you could wear five years from now, 10 years from now, 20. It's funny that they call it vintage now. I used to call it, you know, secondhand, but you know, that's, that's the craze and it's been the craze and that stuff.

1:05:56Gene Pressman:That's exactly what I'm talking about. And, and the common denominator there is the quality of it. You know, um, people appreciate quality, uh, at any price, whether it's the top of the game, which is Hermes, uh, which is obviously magnificent, takes a year to, to make something and it's super expensive, but it's worth it. It's worth it. There's value there because it's one of a kind of special or something inexpensive also has that sense of quality or value because it is what it is. So, and that's what we tried to do. You know, that that's real. And our point of view was I used to, I used to go into stores and I swear when I'm, I don't want to insult seeing eye dogs, but I swear to God, I think sometimes the seeing eye dogs were, were made the merchants of some, of some of these stores because I didn't understand what they were buying.

1:07:01Gene Pressman:They would buy the most, most outrageous avant-garde things that was not possible to sell, not possible sell, but they thought they were doing the right thing because they were, part they were making a fashion statement and we we never did that do we have some out there pieces of course but we tried to buy things that were beautiful i think that was it beauty and quality was what it was about but we did it under the auspices of fashion and trends so um there was this there's a subtlety there you know a real soldier there and not many people you can do it. Yeah, there's a pragmatism to it.

1:07:51So I have two final questions for you. One is you mentioned at the beginning that clothes are too expensive now. And I understand the value equation thing here, whereas Hermes, you can feel the value. But I was looking at an old Vogue at my mother-in-law's house from 89 and I looked through the prices and I did the, the inflation and, you know, there were a lot of dresses in there that would be$6 ,000 today. So it felt to me, maybe it is sort of in line with what stuff is, you know, a Saint Laurent dress is$6 ,000 in, in the store now and it was$2 ,000 in 1989 or 800 or whatever the inflation increases.

1:08:39But from your perspective, what do you think is too expensive? Maybe not name names, but just generally, what about it is too expensive?

1:08:50Gene Pressman:Yeah. I mean, when I see a blouse for$5 ,000 or a coat for$15 ,000, I think that's stupid. Okay. A blouse for a thousand dollars is a lot of money. Okay. Um, and it, even though I know you can sort of equate prices back then with what they would be based on inflation today, but honestly, no, it's more expensive today. And the reason is, is because I said, I said three guys own the whole industry. And so they're controlling the market and they have a great thing going on the designers because the ones that have that are multi-store they go in with the most ridiculous markup to begin with it's four and five and six times what it costs them to make remember they're wholesaling to themselves so even if they mark everything down 50 off they're still making a ton retailers don't have that luxury okay the multi-brands and so there's no excuse for them to be that expensive and there I don't think it's that much different from their prices in the couture to be honest with you and um you know I I didn't listen I've been naive to the market because I haven't shopped stores in a long time but over the last couple of years I decided to open my eyes a little bit and I was shocked you know i was insulted i i if i was a young person i'd only be buying vintage only be buying vintage because it's beautiful and the prices are more in line with them than you know what you were talking about the late 80s early 90s um by the way i i wanted to say one thing that my opinion is a little different than yours because you're a lot younger than i am but I really think the renaissance of fashion was in the 80s, not in the 90s.

1:10:51Yeah, I mean, that's fair. I understand. I think maybe people think it peaked in the 90s.

1:10:57Gene Pressman:Yes, it did. And then it peed her in the 90s. That's the sad part, you know, and then I completely changed. But no, but if you look at just like, for example, fashion in Paris in the early 80s, there was huge change because you had all these young designers like Mugler, Montana, Gauthier, Alaya. I mean, that was a big change for Paris fashion because Paris was always very conservative. Italy wasn't. So that changed a great deal. But I'm such an old guy, I guess. Well, and the Japanese. And the Japanese, that's true. Which I associate so much with Barney's too. Yes. Okay, so my final question for you.

1:11:44We could do two hours, but you're going to be doing many. How many of these have you done so far? A lot? A few. So out of all the designers, you spent so much time in Europe. You were with these people all the time, and you played with them. You worked with them. is there one that you sort of feel like was the most impactful to your life? Maybe just personally, not even about like how much you sold in the store, but is there one, like maybe it's not a designer, maybe it's a fashion industry personality, but is there someone who you just feel like, wow, that person ended up being like a definitive player in my life?

1:12:28Gene Pressman:Yeah, so I'm going to answer two people, but for two different reasons. In terms of influencing me and Barney's in general, there's no question about it was Giorgio Armani. Giorgio Armani changed Barney's forever, and Barney's changed Giorgio Armani forever. And Giorgio Armani changed menswear forever. Completely different sensibility. We built a huge business with him. He was extremely close with my dad. We were friends too, obviously, but they loved each other and respected each other so much. It was like two peas in a pod. And, you know, it was 1976 and we had a long, long relationship with them.

1:13:18Gene Pressman:and no doubt that he's any I think he's the second richest guy in Italy so I think he did all right in terms of personal relationship and who I thought I was astounded by how talented this person was and also how similar he and I were and that was Azevina Laya and I loved him like a brother. He would always say to me, Gene, when I come back from New York and I go to Europe, he goes, did you bring it? And I go, bring what? And he goes, did you bring my passport? I go, what are you talking about? He goes, I want a passport that says Azzedine Pressman. And he was such a wonderful human being, but he was very shy.

1:14:17Gene Pressman:And he could be very arrogant and very difficult. His middle fingers were up all the time. And I just love that about him. And he didn't give a shit. Excuse my French. Okay, he just didn't care. He didn't care at all. So, and needless to say, he's so talented. And very Barney sensibility. He was that modern classic, beautifully made, beautiful quality, and he set trends. So I loved that. I love both of those answers because they are obviously so sort of a big part of Barney. Like if you did a mood board of Barney's, they would both be at the center of it. So it's nice to know that they were also integral to your life as a person.

1:15:10So that's interesting. Jean, this was such a pleasure. I can't believe it's already been an hour, but hopefully we can chat again soon. And hopefully I'll meet you in New York at one of the, I'm sure there's going to be many, many events for the book.

1:15:28Gene Pressman:Yes. I'm looking forward to now meet you really in person. Yeah. Thank you for taking the time. It was such a pleasure. And again, congrats. And I'm so glad that you worked with our friend of line sheet, Matthew Schneier on this book, because it's a great, great. I'm very jealous that he got to do this with you. Matt, you did a great job. And really, it's a pleasure talking to you. Pleasure speaking to you. And hopefully we'll see each other soon. Absolutely. Fashion People is a presentation of Odyssey in partnership with Puck. This show was produced and edited by Molly Nugent. Special thanks to our executive producers, Puck co-founder John Kelly, executive editor Ben Landy, and director of editorial operations Gobby Grossman.

1:16:14An additional thanks to the team at Odyssey, J.D. Crowley, Jenna Weiss-Berman, and Bob Tabador. If the world were like a sleep number mattress, everything would adapt for your comfort. Your coffee would never get cold. Your flight would always be on time. And your mattress would always respond to you and your unique sleep needs. Sleep Number mattresses are designed to respond to your body and shift with your changing life, helping you fall asleep faster and stay asleep longer. To experience a whole new world of comfort, visit a Sleep Number store or go to sleepnumber.com. Sleep Number, to a good life's sleep.