Kamala Is a Fashion Person

0:03Hello and welcome to Fashion People. I'm Lauren Charmaine, writer of Huck's fashion and beauty memo line sheet. And today with me on the show is the Wall Street Journal's executive fashion director, Rory Satrin. We're talking LACMA, Kamala, Martha, Fieldcoats, Marc Jacobs, and so, so much more. Let's get started. Hey, everyone. Hope you're having a great week. Today is election day here in the US. I had a couple of friends come over from Paris on Sunday night for dinner, and they were like, why isn't anyone talking about the election? And I said to them, welcome to America. Like in Europe or, you know, anywhere, the first thing you sit down, you talk about like everything that's happening in the world for 20 minutes.

0:53And then you talk about work or friends or love life and all that stuff. It's not how it is in America. We all know that, you know, I know some of you are like that, but not a lot of the people that I'm hanging out with. anyway, it's good to be back in Los Angeles, but I had a really good time in New York last week. I went really hard on eating out and we went to this very fun and kind of funny place in meat packing on Saturday called Chez Margot. It's one of these private members clubs, that guy, Kyle Hotchkiss Carone, who many of you are probably friends with, who's like a hospitality guy in the West Village.

1:31He is the guy behind it. He was around making sure everything was okay. It's interesting because like the interiors were all red, red lacquer walls. Apparently they had like repainted them right before it opened to make them perfect. And something connected to like interiors were done by like the same designer, the design group that did Annabelle's in London. I think there's a Vogue story and that she could probably get all the details. But anyway, it. It's like very, if you've been to Annabelle's, like has that sort of vibe and it's very, there's like a lot to look at. And I suspect it'll be come like very popular place for fashion events and parties.

2:08And we had a great time. We were staying in the West Village. So like it was, it was nice to be close and the service was impeccable hilariously. So John George is the chef and he was at the table next to us the whole night, just like pouring tap water for these people. I have no idea who they were. I tried really hard to figure it out. We did see people we knew. And then I also like saw on Instagram, there were people that we knew there, but we were just, it was like me, my husband, my friend Jody, and we were just hanging out and it was, we had such a nice time. Like I'm not going to be a member there.

2:39I don't think they would take me, but it was really fun to go for the night. So thanks to the people who sorted that out for us. I appreciate it. And New York was great. I was really glad I got to see so many of you. I'm even happier to be back in LA and back to my normal life for a little while until I get bored again. Uh, on Monday online, she, I've got the latest of what's happening at Chanel. It sounds like, you know, there is going to be an announcement someday. It probably won't be this week, but it will happen. And I talked a little bit about like how they've been recruiting generally within the business and how that reflects, you know, what they might do with that role.

3:19Rachel Strugeitz is back with a Goop update. It seems like they have had yet another restructuring that resulted in the elimination of pretty much everyone in editorial. And if not everyone, Rachel will have all the details you can get if you pay for line sheet. The content of commerce, man, it's not what you think it is. Like it's not. I think a lot of people think you have great content, you're going to be able to make a lot of money pushing people to the commerce. And it does happen, but it's not that cut and dry. So it's tough. Anyway, check it out. And I hope you enjoy this conversation with Rory.

3:59We really covered a lot of crap. Let's get going. Rory Satrin, welcome to Fashion People. Thanks for having me, Lauren. I'm so excited that you're here. We have a lot to discuss. So we saw each other last week at, I think, probably just at Innovators, the big event that you and your crew hosted at the MoMA on Tuesday night. I had a great time. How was it for you? You've worked at the Journal for what, like seven or eight years? Seven years. Yeah. So, no, we loved having you. It was so fun to see you there. It was great. I don't know. I mean, the cool thing about innovators is always this sort of cross pollination, like seeing people from sports and business and fashion and art kind of all together.

4:49And this year we had a nice little press contingent as well. So that was super fun. Yeah, I thought it was smart of you all to invite like there was reporters from the Times of Manity Fair and and all these different outlets that are like kind of competitive or whatever. But there was so much there was a lot to write about. Like I didn't even write about Salma Hayek's speech in in my write up, which was very funny and interesting. She did get to a point. It took a little while. But like that was something Aubrey Plaza made like a point about the rally that happened, the Trump rally on Sunday. There were like all these little news moments.

5:33And I thought what was really interesting is like everybody was super, super famous. But as you said, like from all these different industries and it felt like a newspaper party, like which I don't know if I've ever been to a newspaper party before, but it felt like it was glamorous, but it wasn't they weren't there because they're glamorous. They were there because they're interesting. And that's like what you all have to do in your coverage all the time is cover these really glamorous people, but talk about them, like what is actually interesting about them, not just how they look or how they present themselves or the kind of underlying of what that all means.

6:16totally yeah well that's a huge compliment and you probably haven't been to that many newspaper parties because there aren't very many newspaper parties especially kind of well-funded glossy big gallop and it's like this it's kind of one of the last ones standing um yeah it was so it was super fun the food was good i was very impressed um what is like, what were your best dressed? If you had a couple people that you thought looked really good. I mean, I'm a big Sophia Coppola stan. I'm always looking at what she's wearing. Um, and I loved her sort of rumpled black satin t-shirt with kind of dark pants.

7:00Actually, that's one of my three questions before I buy something is would Sophia Coppola wear this? would I wear it tonight and do I have something that fulfills this task already in my wardrobe so like if I have a dark high-waisted jean I can't buy another one so yeah so seeing her was awesome but charlie xcx looked great with the backless black I think it was st. Laurent um what about you well really quickly on the sofia coppola thing I also have been through phases where I would say that it's kind of like, what would Jesus do? But it's like, what would Sofia Coppola do? And I would say like, I go, I have been flow, but the last few years I have returned to her hardcore as, as my guiding light, but that's a really smart way to think about shopping.

7:54I try to do like a one in one out, but, um, that idea of like, do you have something that will already serve this purpose? Cause I do find myself just repeating the same pant over and over again because it serves all the purposes. I thought Sarah Paulson looked great. She was also at the Marc Jacobs table with Sophia. I thought that Salma Hayek looked really good in Balenciaga. It was this beautiful lipstick pink color that I just really liked and she looked great. And I thought that what was sort of more interesting, I thought the SNL people looked good. It's more interesting sometimes to see what the people who don't necessarily have the access to the designers or aren't as interested in fashion wear.

8:42So it was fun. I thought that your boss, Emma, looked really great. She was wearing these Saint Laurent silver pumps, and I mentioned it in my story. But I thought she looked good for editor-in-chief of a newspaper. It was very impressive. Um, but yeah, I thought it was, I also thought you looked great and put you as a best dressed. You had on this Alaya dress in a sort of plum color that I own in essentially Tiffany blue, which is we're both like black and Navy people, but, um, I love this dress so much. Tell me why you bought this dress and explain the dress to everybody and what makes it so special.

9:25Thanks, Laura. That's so nice. I mean, it's kind of bodycon, I guess. It's very tight. For us, yes. For us, it's extremely bodycon. I definitely went outside of my comfort zone to not wear black, which I think I identify with that. I don't know. I mean, on a journalist salary, it takes a lot for me to walk into a store and buy something. um I buy a lot at sample sales I buy a lot on the real real but I think Oliya is having this kind of magic moment uh right now where you sort of just want to be part of it um I think the last similar kind of yeah I mean I think Phoebe Philo for Celine I would do that I would go into the store seasonally and buy a few special things but it's been a while and it's kind of fun to like a brand that much.

10:16I would agree. I was looking, I had some friends over from Paris last night. We were looking through my clothes. So they wanted to know like what I actually owned and I still own and wear a good amount of the Phoebe stuff that I bought that most of it deeply on sale, but there was a blazer that I took to New York last week that I got for, it was still ridiculously expensive. It was probably like her second or last season, second to last or last season, but I still wear it constantly. I have probably two or three pairs of the trousers. But yeah, I had a similar experience. I went to the showroom in Paris in February, the Elias showroom.

10:54And afterwards, the showroom's above the store. And I went down to the store and I was going to try on because I had bought, the first thing I bought was a blazer or a jacket over the holidays that was very deeply discounted. And I was looking for the right pair of pants. And I thought, well, maybe, you know, with the vat, with a discount, all that stuff, I'll buy a pair of pants to match the blazer. And I went downstairs, I tried on pants. And then the person, of course, was like, you should try on some dresses. And I thought, oh, what the heck? And I tried on this black dress that I also wore last week.

11:34And it was just, I don't know about you, but I don't wear shapewear. Because it, I don't think it's flattering. It's uncomfortable. I'm just not a shapewear person. But I tried this dress on and I was like, oh my God, I don't have to wear a bra. I don't have to like worry about anything. I look great. And I like worked it out in my head. I said, I have all these events this year. I'll have the, and it's a pretty classic Elias style. It's like a sleeveless crew neck. not super sexy or anything below the knee, but just an hourglass shape. And I bought it straight out. And, you know, compared to what it cost in America, it was a steal.

12:20And then this summer, I don't know, I was just looking on Neiman Marcus or something. And that dress, which it's, it's has a lot of ruching. It has a high neck, like a mock neck almost. And it's above the the elbow sleeve and they had it in black and blue on Neiman Marcus. And I thought that blue is just so pretty. And I bought a bathing suit this summer in that color. And I thought it looked good. And I thought, again, I have like so many events and things in the fall. Maybe I should just try it. And I bought it. And I was just like, again, it just makes you look like a different person. And it really is sort of the power of transformative clothes.

13:01And also, unfortunately, like spending money on clothes because we think of this stuff as being really overpriced. But in many cases, when it comes to clothing itself, like the margins aren't as great as on handbags and things like that. And it's worth it to buy. I always say this. I mean, buying a lie dresses is a extreme version, but like buy the thing that you want and just wear that all the time. like I've worn both of those dresses I think three or four times this year each already and like I have a Loewe dress that I bought probably in 2017 or 18 and I wore it to events for three years straight and I and I pulled it out last night to show my friends and and they were also like oh this dress is still really good but it does just sort of speak to the power of what he's doing at Alaya.

13:56And, and if people who don't, who, you know, buy one or two things a season, not 75 are buying it and aren't getting stuff for free are, are buying it, then it, it means something for sure. Totally. Yeah, no, it's true. Buy the thing that you completely love and you'll wear it to death. That's true. That's kind of always true of my innovators dress last Last year I bought the Prada nylon nightgown, the black, which is so great because you can wipe it clean with a sponge. Little known fact. But yeah, no, I've worn it several times since then. But I'm a huge, huge fan of Peter Mueller and everything he's doing.

14:34I never, I didn't think about that with the Prada nylon stuff. I bought a safari dress from there this summer. That's good to remember that you can just clean it up yourself and not dry clean only and save money that way. So this is coming out on election day. Great for us. People are going to need distractions, but you had an interesting piece this weekend. I'm excited to chat with you because you were really the first person to cover Kamala Harris in her clothes. Like you had the first really big story on how she dresses back in, I don't know, I guess like pre, maybe even pre, pre Biden. But you, you wrote this weekend about her jeans that she was wearing out and about.

15:33Can you tell me how you see the evolution of her style and culminating with these jeans in the last stretch of fundraising and is that called what they're doing? Campaigning. What you think it meant. Yeah, I mean, Kamala's worn jeans before she wore them on the cover of Vogue in 2021. That was kind of like a skinnier jean. That was the earlier silhouette she liked that she would always wear with her beloved chucks, like her low converse. And it was with a blazer as well. So she's had these kind of moments of casual style. There's the famous photo of her at San Francisco Pride wearing the rainbow sparkly jacket.

16:20So she's had these kind of moments of relatability or sort of dressing down. but in general we know Kamala wears this like extremely consistent kind of uniform of the sleek suit so it's like style that she honed as as a lawyer as an attorney general it really syncs up with a lot of the female lawyers that I know you know who really want the message to be on what they say and not what they're wearing and I would say since August her style has gotten and even sleeker, even leaner. This has been kind of the period that she's working with Leslie Freemar. That's still not confirmed, but everyone knows it's true.

17:06I'm sure Leslie has signed every NDA known to man. So yeah, I mean, when the PRs just are like, we're not going to talk about it, it means it's true. Yeah, I think it's pretty much, you know, we're all, it's true, but you know, she's really whittled down Kamala's style to this like very precise kind of perfect distillation of what she was already wearing. Um, I, you know, she's worn more European designers, which I've also written about. There has been, um, Dior, there's been a lot of Chloe. So I think like any aberration from the standard uniform is notable. and the past few weeks she has worn this like high-waisted dark bootcut jean.

17:52I don't know what brand it is. If anyone knows, please let me know. Looks kind of like a J brand. I have a pair of Jean Ericas. It looks a little bit like a Jean Erica, but I don't know. I mean, she's, you know, she's in the swing state. She's trying really hard to be relatable. So I think it makes sense that she would be dressing down slightly. I will say that, you know, her campaign does not want the focus to be on her clothes. And I think that's apparent in what she wears, especially recently. There's been nothing kind of that sticks out overly. It's kind of like, like when you buy a black Prius so that your car doesn't say anything about you.

18:37Okay. Well, your car still says something about you. So that's sort of how I feel about Kamala. The fact that she's dressing in this very don't look at me way says something else. Yeah. Well, the other thing is it's, it's so very appealing. So she's not wearing this, the traditional politician brands, the like go to those sort of Carlisle collection type things that, or a lot of like she has worn some Ralph Lauren, but like that sort of became Hillary Clinton's thing, but she doesn't look like she's dressing like a politician. I'd say she looks like stressing like lawyer. And that part of it is very interesting.

19:15Like these jeans, I have no idea what brand they are, but it's funny. A, the boot cut is, it is a little bit of a fashion statement. And I was at La Garcon when I was in New York last week, and I saw a couple of women wearing jeans like this. And I actually got a pair of jeans like this at Scout, the vintage store in LA recently, which is, it is a little bit moving away from what, you know, people in the middle of the country are probably mostly still wearing skinny jeans. So the other thing that I think is interesting is it is all nice. Like it doesn't, she wears Irene New Earth jewelry a lot.

19:55She also wears Tiffany jewelry on many occasions. You mentioned the Chloe suits, which I feel like have been the most notable suits that she's worn. And it's just interesting. Like I hope someday Leslie's able to tell the story of why she decided to work. Maybe she's friends with Shamina. I don't the Chloe designer who some people pronounce her name Shemina, but I don't know. Her friends seem to say Shamina. So I don't know. So it's an interesting thing of like, you're totally right because they look nice. It's not as jarring as if it was like a really brightly colored suit or just something a little bit more severe.

20:40There's something very soft about them. And it's an interesting approach. And I think it's been perfect. Like I don't. I don't want her to wear Monse like Michelle Obama did at the Democratic National Convention. Michelle Obama looked amazing and that suit sold like crazy for that brand. I'm so happy for them. She's really into fashion fashion and that's her personality. And so it makes sense on her. If Kamala was wearing that kind of stuff, that's all anyone would be talking about. And that's not not what we want. So it's interesting for people are tracking it really closely like you to have to write about those small nuances.

21:25And you sort of compared it to the work vest that Trump was wearing, which reminded me of the gilet jaune in Paris a little bit. Definitely. I mean, that was kind of... I'm sure they wouldn't like that comparison, him but that's what it reminded me of yeah no I mean Trump is still wearing his brownie suit every day he has a uniform I picture his closet to be the sort of Patrick Bateman thing where it's like identical suits identical ties and he just um chooses one putting on the garbage man vest putting on the McDonald's apron is it's more like a prop that you're putting on rather than an actual style choice like it is with Kamala and the jeans, but she's in uncharted territory.

22:15You know, I try hard not to compare her to first ladies when I write about her because it's a very different job. But at the same time, sometimes that's the only thing you have to compare her to because there hasn't been a woman in that position yet. So, you know, I have compared her to Joe Biden, who does, as you say, wear a lot of Ralph Lauren. When I spoke about whether or not she should be wearing more American designers. The real parallels were first ladies. Yeah. At Jackie Kennedy, when she got blasted for wearing French designers and then had to shift to Oleg Cassini. So, yeah, I mean, I think one of the things that really outs her as a fashion person is her shoes.

22:54You know, she always wears Manolo Blahniks. They're always very high, like a 105 millimeter heel, very pointy. She does like the boot is kind of her casual shoe, the super high pointy boot, but a lot of pumps, a lot of BB pumps. And those are hard to walk in and she does it. Yeah. I love Manolo's, but I have fairly wide feet and they just, they're not like wide, wide, but I have issues with Manolo's. I love them, but it's hard for me to wear them on a regular basis. So good for her. I'm sure she has beautiful feet. It's a very narrow toe box. Yeah. Yes. Very narrow toe box. If you wear Birkenstocks a lot, you're pretty much ruined and can't wear.

23:40Hi, this is Jill Schlesinger, CBS News Business Analyst, Certified Financial Planner and the host of the Jill on Money podcast. With the new year upon us, there's no better time to take control of your financial life. And the Jill on Money podcast is here to help. It's your questions that make it possible for me to provide unconventional and I hope entertaining insights on your money, more importantly, on your life. Follow and listen to Jill on Money wherever you get your podcasts.

24:15So one thing that was distracting a lot of us this weekend from thinking about the election, because, you know, everybody who's listened to this podcast is an American citizen has already voted, uh, was the Martha Stewart documentary, which I, we were chatting a bit beforehand. And I mentioned, I unfortunately fell asleep last night trying to watch it because I, if I sit on my couch and put on a television show, I fall asleep immediately. Uh, cause we have an L shape and the L is for me. So like we bought it specifically for me. and then I sit there and then I'm out in five minutes. But I'm really excited to watch it for real.

25:00Maybe I'll watch it at like 8 a.m. one morning. And I have a lot of her old books, like her home books, just to sort of look in for inspiration and really like the first 80s, late 80s, early 90s iterations. But what did you think of the documentary? And more specifically, like her as a fashion icon in some ways, that's what I was sort of immediately looking at, like how she wore her hair, how she dressed, her physicality was so specific, even for that time. What did you think of the doc? I mean, I'm a huge Martha person. So I was really excited to see this. I did feel, I mean, this is not really about her style, but you definitely feel the, I think, injustice of what she went through watching this documentary.

25:51And then in terms of her look, I mean, she's always been so polished. I thought it was funny in Emily Sundberg's newsletter this morning. She said she and her friends decided to make more of an effort and kind of blow up their hair during the week after watching the Martha documentary. It's funny. And she is, you know, she always looks clean and great. I saw Simplicity City did a little roundup of her clean, simple, pretty looks. But for me, Martha's like someone who had the late in life blow up. Like, I think she looks better now in her 80s than she did in her 30s. I agree. I thought it was interesting looking at her then.

26:29She's so beautiful. Like that, I think, is you can't argue that. But she wasn't. And maybe it was of that time people were so done up. So if you were like a more like waspy or like patrician or like you wanted to look understated, you her hair was not done. Like it was a little puffy and it wasn't like. There was nothing slick about her. And then you could see in the 90s when she was starting to go on TV a lot more and probably was in her 40s and 50s, she started to look a lot more polished. but I had forgotten watching her when I was younger and like how much I loved her clothes and how she looked generally like her thinking about beauty ideals.

27:20It was like a very specific niche of beauty ideal, but she sort of fit into that. Like, you know, wear a lot of makeup, you wear jeans with a cable knit sweater, like preppy New England. And then you're right. Like she gets out of jail, she starts wearing the row and she poses for sports illustrated or whatever. Cause you did a story on that, right? I feel like you, you did a big, yeah. When she was the oldest person on the cover of sports illustrated. But one thing I think of This is a story that I didn't write, but I edited. We did 20-odd questions with Martha Stewart. So it was, you know, it was her beauty routine, her green juice ingredients, all the kind of lifestyle stuff we want to know.

28:10And she had a very, this was, I guess, a handful of years ago. So she was in her late 70s. And she had a very detailed beauty routine. and while I was fact checking it in the course of that Martha called me herself and was like no no no no you got the order all wrong and we spent like 30 minutes on the phone of her going through just like point by point I mean the Korean 11 step skincare routine has nothing on Martha Stewart skincare routine it's like something like 20 steps in the morning 20 steps in the evening and she's so specific about everything. It's like, that's where her perfectionism really comes through now is like in the way she does Pilates, the way she takes care of her skin, the way she eats.

28:56And I think kind of less so the way she dresses. I feel like the way she dresses is just sort of like, yeah, she loves Hermes. She loves Brunello. She chooses something that looks a skinny pant and a cashmere top. And that's kind of it. Yeah. But yeah, I mean, team Martha, it's been like the fall of Ina and Martha and they're both great. I feel like everyone kind of had their, their favorite among the two of them. Yeah. I think Martha was just much more influential on me as a young person because she was on TV so much and Ina didn't really, Ina didn't really get famous until like the two thousands.