The Man Repeller Attracts

0:28Hello and welcome to Fashion People. happy tuesday everyone i'm back in los angeles for a minute this week on line sheet i've got the latest on negi's turnaround and their efforts to win back women plus plenty of other fun news and notes from the likes of gap lvmh caring and more sarah shapiro is working on an abercrombie and fitch state of the union report that will probably run tuesday pending breaking news but it will happen someday so you should definitely sign up for puck and line sheet to check that out and Rachel Struyacz will be back on Wednesday with a giant story because what else does Rachel do with giant stories?

1:05Meanwhile, I hope you enjoy this chat with Leandra. I love to get existential with her about fashion. Also, just to know the sort of entrance to this episode is a bit unorthodox. I wanted to lead with our conversation pre the official start because the chat was very good. So you get a bit of behind the scenes action here at the top. Just to set it up, I was complimenting Leandra's Planet Hollywood tea and sheer button up combo, which if you subscribe to her newsletter, Serial Aisle, or you look at her Instagram, it's up there. And she explained that it was from Balenciaga. And then we go on from there.

1:53So I hope you enjoy it. I saw you wearing it on your Instagram and it looked really good. The gray one or the white one? The gray one with like a cropped, maybe it was in your spring dressing column. Yeah, with the low and wise pants. Looks so good. I didn't realize I thought it was vintage. There's one with three of the Kardashian sisters on it. And I can't say I don't want it. Do I want it? I'm interested in them as an art project and a social experiment and what they say about the culture. I'm interested in them spiritually I think that all they're doing is living their own lives And trying to live to the absolute maximum capacity of it And it's interesting to me Or I guess I'm into them anthropologically Why it bugs so many people I think that they reflect a lot of people's shadow sides More than anything else I agree I think Yeah I am also interested in why it bugs people.

3:03I'm also interested in why people are attracted to them. And I don't just mean like sexually. I just mean generally. What is it about them and the image that they are creating that makes people need to look at them versus if you think of someone like a Paris Hilton or something and who is interesting and fun, but people lost interest, even though she's very entrepreneurial and has been doing stuff for the last 20 years. She's not the person, she's not someone that people go back to naturally. She has to sort of create that. Whereas with them, it's every move they make is studied and that is interesting to me too and also like the the changing faces of or the changing social mores of what is beautiful and why yeah and and that augmented face like even i mean even preceding that they did launch a massive deviation into a an like archetypical perception of beauty in the United States.

4:22Yes. There were no Middle Eastern looking bombshells. No. And also the, just the, I mean, there are things about their beauty that are typical, like the hip to waist ratio, maybe kind of, but it's all exaggerated and it's all, I remember I went when I was in Paris in 2019 and I didn't leave Europe for five months and I went to the London after being like in Europe Europe and I was reminded of like how people dress in American culture and in cultures other than like that very particular French and Italian culture where thinness is still, especially in France, very emphasized. And the women in London were so much more emphasizing their bodies instead of trying to minimize them.

5:28And it just made me think of, it was the Kardashian effect. And it was like coming out of Paris totally sucked back into that world of, oh, they really have changed beauty ideals for an entire generation and probably for several to come. We didn't do the intro. Can we use this or do you not want to? Oh, for sure. No. Okay, cool. Molly, we can do one of the Marc Maron style things where we start talking. Okay, let's do the official start. Leandra Medin-Cohen, welcome to Fashion People. Thank you for having me, Lauren Sherman. This is actually your second appearance. You were the first guest on Fashion People in a test episode that no one ever got to hear.

6:17That's kind of no grand is doing test episodes. I did one for the Colbert Report once also. That's so funny. It was so much fun. That's awesome. What was the Colbert Report one? Was it like peak man repeller? Yeah, I guess it must have been like 2017. It was before I had my daughters. So maybe even 2016, it was Peak Man Repeller. And we were just talking about the concept. Oh my God, that's awesome. And wore a big black hemp linen Rosia Sulin jumpsuit. Like gigantic, heavier than me. Well, I want those tapes. Well, someday maybe we'll surface our test episode. Thank you for doing that. It was very helpful to figure out the formatting.

7:01So how are you? We have a lot to discuss today. but one thing is a big project you're working on. I'm pretty good. I have a nine-month-old baby at home, and so I'm in the fun zone of anchoring new life on Earth. I love the name Joelle so much. Thank you. Me too. It's a great name. One of my mom's best friends growing up was named Joelle. I keep hearing these anecdotes from people saying that every Joelle they know, they have a very fond idea of. And I love that for her. Yeah. It's a beautiful name that is not super typical. Yeah, but it's still classic. Yes. But also now that you have named a child Joelle, I wonder, you are so influential if we'll see some more.

7:54You know, I should be so lucky. I'll take it if it happens. So we're going to get to your project soon. I wanted to chat with you quickly about a couple news items. One is it's the end of this round of musical chairs, pretty much. Pierre Paolo Piccioli, Piccioli, I think that's how you say it. And Jonathan Anderson, Pierre Paolo at Balenciaga and Jonathan Anderson at Dior being named officially at women's and men's last week, sort of ended this upheaval in the luxury fashion system of designers leaving, there being open spaces, those spaces being filled, people not knowing, tons of speculation, back and forth, back and forth.

8:43And we've been waiting six months for the Jonathan Anderson news to come out. And I wish you're always very insightful and thoughtful about what's happening in the luxury industry because you are an observer, you are a tracker of it, a documentarian of it, but also a consumer of it. What do you think of how it all netted out with Matt 2 at Chanel, Jonathan at Dior, Demna at Gucci? What are you excited for? What do you think it says about what's happening in the world? I think the thing that's more meaningful is actually that it has netted out it all. Like Change is so difficult for so many people, like for everyone in some ways.

9:27And fashion has just been in such a transitory moment for seasons and seasons. And so I think the fact that dust has actually fallen to the ground and the future of the industry looks a little bit clearer than it has in many years is the part of this that is the most meaningful because it's going to give permission, I think, to a lot of people. to like roll up their sleeves and just run forward. And I think that's what's cool. It's a great point. And I hope it also inspires companies that don't have as many resources as all the ones I just mentioned to be more creative. I will see what the collections look like.

10:14Perhaps they won't, perhaps they'll disappoint us, but I have a feeling they will inspire. And here's hoping it moves the industry in a different direction than where it was going, which I felt like was very much towards it becoming commodity. or it had in many cases already become commodity. And there's no, it doesn't, it can't work that way. It's not, the value system isn't there. It has to feel, these things need to feel special even if they're selling millions of them a year. Yeah, I lean optimistic generally. I'm excited about all the appointments. I love Pierre Paulo. I think that he's like so creatively gentle but clear.

11:02and I love the way that he expresses his like sensuality through the clothes. I think that we're on the brink or like we're actually already in motion with a sort of creative revolution. And I don't know what it's going to mean or what it's going to look like necessarily, but I can like feel that energy. Fashion feels really fun again in a way that it hasn't in a little bit. And it doesn't feel as sad. I agree. Yeah, it doesn't feel as sad because I'd say the thing that people tend to forget is what we went through in 2020 to 2023 and how much that has. it's certainly affected consumer spending patterns because of people had a lot more money to spend on things because they weren't moving around the world as much.

12:03But yeah, and that's obvious. But then there is also the matter of like, psychologically, what we think is valuable changed. And so I think if like you looked at, if a psychologist looked at what has happened in the luxury industry, they'd be able to predict all of this. And they could have probably by the end of 2020. But it's been interesting to... People don't usually apply any kind of depth to this stuff because it's just about buying things. But there is something deeper going on here that fashion reflects culture. And I think that this is going to be a tremendous case study for this era in time.

12:53And you'll be able to sort of see what people were going through by looking at how the consumption patterns in the luxury industry changed. Consumption and also the way of creation. I think that between 2020 and 2023 and even predating 2020, there was a lot of anger that needed to be expressed. and it was you know like your creative work is always the way that your innermost thoughts are expressed and that was coming up a lot through the clothes and i mean i think it's always going to be a map and a driver for creative work but i i do also believe that we're entering a different moment where like the anger has been adequately expressed and they're sort of like uh okay, let's chart this new territory now.

13:42Yeah. Yeah. I think the word you used for Pierre Paolo, gentle, which I also, I used in my note about him. I think there is something gentler that is happening and there is a really great positive energy. So let's see. Jonathan's debut at Dior is June 27th. So that's less than three weeks away. It's very exciting. Tomorrow, basically tomorrow.

14:46So tell me, Leandra, you are the bellwether. To me, you are the ultimate predictor of trends. That is so generous. I mean, it's true. When you see what's happening, you are everyone's editor-in-chief. You are the one who I look at your sub stack, your email, as we would call in Puck World or newsletter, and I see what you're tracking on the streets or what you're wearing. And I can extrapolate what people a year from now are everyone's going to be wearing. And I hope that I know you've done a lot of collaborations and we're going to talk about something that that's launching this week. But I hope that someday you do your own line.

15:36Like fully. And I know you've had you had the shoe brand and but it could be really interesting. I think I think you would do it. I people ask me that all the time. And my answer until this point has been I'm still in a part of my life or a moment in my life where I feel like there is enough amazing stuff at market. and the engines that are covering those things are not so many. And so I really like, how should I say, I really like that I'm in the role right now where I celebrate the creative expressions of others. Like it feels right. There's enough really good stuff out there and I'm happy and excited to just be finding it and to be helping in the small ways that I can.

16:25It feels really rewarding. Yeah, that makes sense. your sort of duty as a creative person is to identify things and surface them for others. Yeah. And then, you know, there's also there's something to be said. I think I've gotten a lot more sensitive in my 30s and in particular around the creative process and closing Man Repeller and then starting a newsletter and the sort of like hierarchical change of like employing 25 people to like taking photos with a selfie camera in my living room, changing 25 times in rapid succession, and then going to pick my kids up from school. It just, it was very humbling in the beginning in a lot of ways.

17:06And I really connected to how vulnerable it is to take any creative risk. And so I feel like anyone who's willing to put themselves out there creatively and really like give something a shot, deserves that shot, deserves a chance to even just like fully express what that thing needs to give to them, even if it's not a line, even if it's just a moment that takes them to the next thing. And it feels exciting to be able to participate in that for people. So tell me what you're seeing in New York right now on the streets. What are the big ideas. What are people gravitating towards? I don't know if it's warm there yet.

17:47It seems like it might be. It goes back and forth. It was a beautiful weekend, but then today is like 65 degrees and rainy or drizzly. It's like sideways mist. I have been gravitating a lot towards vintage looking like shrunken graphic tees with low rise everything like sheer cotton wall pants really short shorts like old school max mara back of a vespa in rome shorts with these like old school looking tees still a lot of bucket hats um it feels like there's a bit of an homage to like Italian tackiness in the air. There's a lot of poochie everywhere on me. But it's hard to say what's actually on the streets.

18:39Mostly I see trench coats and cargo pants, both of which I like, but we've been seeing that for a long time. What bag is the Upper East Side lady wearing these days? Is it still the picoline or is that what it's called? That Hermes bag? Yes. Yeah, you still see those in some places. There's another Hermes bag that a lot of women are wearing with, I guess, like straps that are on either side. I don't know what it's called. Straps that are on either side of the bag. And then you can hold it closed so that it creates like a box or hold it rectangular. I don't know which one that is. I don't know.

19:19There's a lot of Kate on the Upper East Side. Well, she just opened on 69th Street. Do you feel like because seeing from the the runway collection so this would have been spring 20 25 I felt like that runway collection was Really thinking about her customer. I don't want to say more commercial because I don't think that's the right Way to say it, but it felt like okay. This is something That I know the people women who go to the k trunk show in los angeles are gonna eat this stuff up. Yeah I guess like I always look down when I'm on the street. I clock shoes before anything else. And I would have expected to see the beaded loop sandal on every foot up here.

20:05And just last Friday, I clocked three of the Bowdoin. Do you know which ones those are? No, let me look it up. The silver studded sandal. It looks like a very French sandal. Oh, yes. You know who has these is Miss Rachel Strugetts. Yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah. Becky has them too. They're the best. It's a beautiful sandal. It looks like a French sandal, but it's got that shiny Kate party girl-ness about them. So I noticed three pair of those. Those would have been the first ones I went for this season also. I might steal. Who knows? Alex Bigler On our team Over at Puck Bought the loop sandals And she lives near you They're also really great I The sandals I am suddenly like Do I need these Are the Mew Mew Rope ones Oh interesting I just think It's a great sandal I have the Flozy version So they're not Mew Mew They're like a knockoff of the movie.

21:14Well, this is the question. Are they the ones that you and Becky and I have discussed, Becky Malinsky, as I'm sure everyone realizes, but if you don't, that have a very flat, they don't really have a soul? No, this is a different pair. The ones that you're talking about, Becky put in a newsletter last year. Oh, I see the Flozy version. Oh, wow. Yeah. Oh, those are good. Okay. I mean, the Miu Miu ones are, they're almost$1 ,000. Here's my issue. And this is something that is even a bigger issue in New York. But my feet are really wide. And if in New York, especially if I'm walking around, I get blisters like immediately.

22:09Yeah. Here it's less of an issue, but I need a sandal that feels like even my Chacos give me blisters. Have you tried Jamie Holler shoes yet? Yeah, I had a pair of her ballet flats. But I don't know, like the loafer isn't really my style. I think you should try the double buckle sandal. It's very flat, but it's so comfortable. And those shoes are like anti-blister. Yes, I did feel that way about the ballet flats. I also obviously have lots of Emmy Parsons sandals, but you can never have too many shoes. Yeah, that Emmy Parsons Cecilia sandal is it through and through. So good. So that's interesting that Kate, it makes sense that Kate is so big and they just opened a store.

23:02What do you think of the current retail climate on the Upper East Side? Do you go into shops a lot or do you not really have time given that you have three children and they need your attention and you work and you have a life and all of that? I don't go into shops a lot, but I think that part of the reason I don't go into shops is more of like a, an insecurity thing. I don't want to walk into a store and I don't, I don't know why I'm telling you this, but I don't like walking into a store and being like, oh, look, there's that influencer shopping. It's so obvious. I understand. I mean, it's very interesting because obviously you and I have known each other forever and we've had meals together in New York and spent a lot of time together.

23:55But when you came to Los Angeles and we went to Botanica, it was the first time I could tell people recognized you. And I was like, oh, and I'm sure it happens to you in New York all the time, but New York's different. It's not as like for at least someone accompanying you. It's more frenetic and there's a lot of things going on and people just their attention. But it It was interesting there because I could tell people were like, oh, because that is a place where everyone who eats there would know who you were. And it was fascinating. It must be an interesting way to sort of travel through life.

24:41And yeah, I can understand why going into a shop would be a little bit nerve wracking. It's specifically in New York. I don't have it when I'm away. And I really enjoy going into a specialty store or a multi-brand, any multi-brand store and discovering new things. Like it was so fun to go to Mohawk General Store with you. And I really wanted to get down to Descon when I was there. But there's something about like shopping in stores in New York that feels, it feels like I'm playing hooky or something. Yeah. And also like, what are you going to look at? What are you going to try? Yeah. I guess that's the other thing about shopping uptown or I guess anywhere with the exception of the Webster is that you're going into single brand stores.

25:28So the element of discovery is a little bit less spontaneous. Yeah. I like shopping at Le Garcon, but my big challenge there is like, if they're not busy, it's fine if they're busy. I went once on a Sunday and it was really swamped And they were like, it's going to take us 30 minutes to get this stuff for you. Yeah. It's just like, wow, that's wild. Well, I guess it's like, how do you stay in business? You don't hire enough salespeople. You know, I think to your point earlier, I would probably sooner open a store than launch my own brand. Oh, yes. I really want you to do this. Maybe one day. I'm very pro.

26:14Maybe one day. And then that is a mix of you could also launch an in-house brand at some point if it made sense. Or just continue doing what I love to do, which is work with designers and be like, I love this shape that you already make. Let's chop off six inches and make it purple. I'm very pro this happening. I just want the scoop if it does. You got it. I need more time. I've got kids to raise and maybe a book to write. Yes, you definitely have many books to write. I'll keep on you about the store. We'll talk again in two or five years.

27:00So this week you have another project that you've been working on that launches on Thursday. Tell me what you are up to. So I'm launching a fine jewelry collab with Aflalo by Yael Aflalo. Amazing. Yeah. It's a nine-piece collection. And every piece is, it's basically a range of very classic jewelry. The majority are rings and earrings that employ very large lab-grown diamonds. So tell me, how did this happen? You're good friends with Yael. Yes. But how did you end up doing something together? Tell me, the last time I saw you were wearing a lot of lab-grown diamonds, I need to hear it all. So last summer, when I was like eight months pregnant with Joelle, Bakshava Hay reached out to me and was like, hey, my husband has this lab-grown diamond business.

28:01Can he send you something? And so I took a look at the site and I picked something that I liked and was pretty surprised. I was like, oh, wow, this is so I didn't know that much about lab grown. Other than that, you know, my family has been in the jewelry business my whole entire life. And they specialize in these like very precious, rare gemstones like a Pariba or an Alexandrite. And so they always were like, we can't mess with lab groans. That's not what the customer wants from us. So it was always just sort of a non-issue. It never came up at home. And so I picked a piece and I asked him to size it to my pinky.

28:38And he was like, wait, what? You want to wear this diamond on your pinky? And I was like, yeah, if you're going to wear a lab grown diamond, you can't wear it on your like ring finger. You have to you have to be unconventional about it. Put it on your pinky, put it on your thumb, put it on your middle finger. And I think it cracked something open for Alexi, for Batsheva's husband, where he was like, oh, that's so. interesting and different. And so I started basically asking him to just make stuff for me. And I was like, you know, you can do what you want with it. I don't care. Sell it if you want to.

29:14Don't if you don't. Whatever. And after like three or four rounds of making different pieces, Yael started asking me if she could buy them. And I would just put her in touch with Alexi and be like, yeah, sure. And then this is probably like four months ago, I was at her house for dinner and she was like, do you want to do a collection for me? Like, why don't we launch a collab? And it's just like, you know, these big diamonds everywhere. Like we can even do a diamond toe ring. And I was like, we have to do a diamond toe ring. So what started as me just playing around and having fun with this jewelry and really trying to get like an estate look with these lab-grown stones has turned into this collaboration.

30:03And along the way, I was having a lot of fun and found it super interesting because the lab-grown stones were challenging all of these constructs of status that existed in my own head, where I was like, but what is the difference between a diamond and a lab-grown stone? Yes, one is natural and it's from the earth and one is made in a lab, but they're technically both diamonds. And if you don't like this ring because it's lab grown, but you love it when it's a natural stone, what does that say about your taste? What does that say about my taste? You know, it just, it started bringing up these really interesting questions and I love to wrestle with this kind of stuff, you know?

30:42Yeah. I find that fascinating because of the fact that the gemstones that your family deals and are actually rare. Diamonds themselves are not rare. And this is a thing you can read millions of articles about this. Jenny Avins, who used to work at Quartz. Quartz has become a shell of itself, but they used to do amazing, really deeply reported pieces, did a great report on the diamond marketing industry and how that happened in the 50s. And there are many rare gemstones, and there are rare diamonds, but diamonds themselves are not rare. And so it's this idea of only wanting natural when it is the exact same thing and challenging that notion by making something really great and saying buy it because it's great not because it came from the ground or came from you're right and it comes sort of back you like it because it helps push a point of expression that you would like to push forward forward that's that's really what it feels like for me is like these are all really simple classic designs and if if you love them when they're natural, but not when they're lab, what does that say about how much you actually like them when they're natural?

32:10Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Exactly. Totally. And it is, comes back to what we were talking about with the Kardashians and this idea of what is beautiful and what is, is natural better than man-made or engineered and why and what is it about like humanity that makes you think that and and put those ideas place those ideas on something on a physical object or on a body totally and there's no there's no right or wrong answer like it's not it's not a question that I ask myself to be critical or judgmental. It's genuinely in pursuit of like greater self-understanding. Like what does constitute what I find beautiful, right?

33:09There's something really cool about it. And then, you know, the lab-grown stones are just, they're so perfect. That's one thing. I mean, granted, if you're buying diamonds from a calibrated lot, you know, because there are these like giant rocks that are then reduced to these gorgeous crystals. If you're buying a calibrated lot, every stone is going to be the same exact size and the same weight and, you know, the same shape. And you obviously do that with lab-grown stones also, but there's something about them that just reads a little bit more perfect, or like it does read more perfect than a natural diamond because it's from the earth.

33:44And so it's not replicable de facto, you know? And so putting them, doing kind of weird things to the stones, whether that means wearing them on your pinky or like taking a flat surface stone and pairing it with rounded stones, or we made this tennis bracelet that's strung together with nylon cord. So I'm calling it like the racket string bracelet because it looks like racket string is like tying these stones together, it creates this really interesting contrast of how can this feel classic and refined, but also really gritty. Did you hear that? That's fine. It's okay. It was a nice little chime.