Independence Day at 30: America Saves the Universe | #1071

25:50Adam Kempenaar:And I don't disagree with you. I'm not looking for a movie to be patriotic, Josh. I'm describing why it resonated with audiences, why I think it did then and why it probably still would. I've given my reaction from an entertainment value perspective. I'm really more interested in discussing its potential meanings. the simplicity of it and its formulaic ness is why its value is ultimately limited and why i can only like it so much why i also have some ambivalence towards a lot of ambivalence towards the film i mean at several points i felt like i was watching a movie out of another genre that does similar mythologizing and acts to reassure audiences and that's the sports genre it's it's the action blockbuster version of Hoosiers or Rocky.

26:35Adam Kempenaar:You can make direct parallels between Whitmore as Rocky, who has to rise to the challenge to prove himself, or Coach Dale, except instead of being washed up, he's too young and has to prove himself. And Robert Loge's General Gray is like the mentor. He's Mickey. And Russell's the eccentric drunk. He's Shooter. He's Dennis Hopper in Hoosiers, or he's Pauly in Rocky, the supportive muse. Adrian and Myra start out resisting, but they give in and support their men. And what do we see in this movie? There's Jasmine and Constance flanked on each side of Judd Hirsch, looking on wistfully as their men go off to battle.

27:12Adam Kempenaar:And of course, the First Lady is there in spirit, right? Sports movies are full of stock, goofy sidekicks like Jimmy as well. And instead of the big game, there's the big battle with a big explosion instead of a big shot or big hit. And instead of the impossible to defeat Apollo Creed or the all-black team from South Bend High. It's the aliens. It's all the same formula, and those formulas tend to work, but tend to work and only go so far. And I'm with you, Josh, too. I was thinking about this movie. Initially, I was trying to go back to 96 and put myself in the perspective of a viewer then and thinking about it in terms of the tumultuous time we're living in now.

27:57Adam Kempenaar:I think it's easy to look back with hindsight on periods and only see it through the framework of now and assume always that we're living through a way more difficult time. And I was wondering, was 96 just this vastly more innocent time? Maybe it was. Maybe it was this time, Josh, and the movie seems to reflect this in a way, this time when America developed international coalitions and won wars, apparently, like the Gulf War. They at least weren't never ending. We were we were in and out in in a scant seven months. Josh, this is this is pre nine eleven. It's pre Iraq war. It is definitely as well pre political fragmentation on the heinous scale that we're currently living through.

28:41Adam Kempenaar:I had to look this back up to even remind myself who Bill Clinton beat in 1996. It was Bob Dole, by the way. And that election just it simply didn't fracture the country. We lived through it. It didn't fracture the country the way Bush Gore did in 2000, an election that we really as a country have just not recovered from. And I think the fact that the movie is so determined to sort of reinforce these traditional values and ensure audiences that that they should be comfortable with America's standing in the world as a superpower and a moral compass. I think it's I think it's all there. And the fact that it's not coming out of some major crisis or major tragedy is reflective still of some kind of.

29:31Adam Kempenaar:Collective anxiety, and the question is, what is that collective anxiety? And I'm I'm not the historian. I'm not entirely sure what what it might be, Josh, but I was thinking about Clinton. And when this movie came out, November 96 is when he's going to win his second term. And all through his both elections, there was controversy. Do you remember there was controversy about how he avoided the draft? You want to talk about when? Yeah, yeah, yeah. There was controversy about how he avoided the draft. You know, apparently he had college deferments and a high lottery number, but maybe he worked some angles.

30:04Adam Kempenaar:Not for nothing. Not that anyone thought of George H.W. Bush is like Reagan, the tough guy cowboy. but do you remember what what his role was in the navy he was a highly decorated fighter pilot highly decorated fighter pilot right but in this time in the few years before this movie comes out we've got things like ruby ridge we've got waco we've got the oklahoma city bombing just the year before april 95 and and timothy mcveigh and terry nichols they were responding to what they thought was government overreach in Ruby Ridge and Waco. The biggest thing is we've got five years here where it's post-disillusion of the USSR.

30:47Adam Kempenaar:How does America define itself without a tangible external threat? How do we reveal our righteousness? How do we reveal our grit and determination? I think Whitmore's line is the key line. I think it reveals, it gives up the game here for the screenwriters when he says that when he says in the gulf war we knew what to do it's just not as simple anymore right american life isn't as simple anymore so much easier with a common enemy even easier if that enemy it's easier to fight it too right josh if the enemy is essentially as it is here faceless lacking any humanity whatsoever they show no compassion no empathy all they want want us to do is what die as they say they only want to kill and destroy so yeah he he says we knew what we had to do well we know the characters in this film know what they have to do don't we all want to live in a world where it's that black and white where we know what we what we have to do and to your point about the iconography they stack the deck.

31:50Adam Kempenaar:So it's so easy to root for it all. They destroy the White House. They destroy the Statue of Liberty. They destroy all the things we as Americans hold sacred. And at the end, I love the touch. I mentioned coalitions. I love the touch that what happens at the end, it's not enough that we as Americans save the planet. We actually rally the entire world around us in the cause. Other countries get involved. We're the beacon of hope and courage. And not only that, innovation too because remember it's not just our might but but it's it's an american who figures out the ingenious virus we're the most intelligent to the all-powerful computer virus only we figured it out how to ultimately beat the aliens and their highly advanced technology and so i just love i love the fact that in the end we don't just say if you think about this too remember the touch that they're they're like who is it the silver the silver surfer villain why am i blanking i can see him but i can't remember the name people are screaming out the name who are listening right now i could go but it's it's like that say it's like that villain who just goes and destroys different worlds right galactus i think it's galactus that sounds that sounds right they they just go they just go from planet to planet destroying civilizations right so in the end josh think about this by taking them out we don't just save our planet we're the protectors of the universe because now they they won't be able to pillage other civilizations the buck stops with america independence day is the ultimate america movie perhaps it's fate that today is the fourth of july and you will once again be fighting for our freedom not from tyranny oppression or persecution

33:39but from annihilation.

33:42Josh Larsen:It definitely feels like that. Felt like that more this time around than before. And I think, you know, it did come out during this pocket, as you laid out, of not innocence, obviously. You know, all those very distressing things that you mentioned were happening. But I think this is a key, if you can have such a thing, A key pre-9-11 film in that it's not reflecting on the reality of 9-11, but embodying a cultural environment that couldn't conceive yet of a 9-11, even as its imagery predicted it. Right. I mean, very harrowing to to watch. This is the case with so many films, but specifically this, I think, to watch Independence Day and see that image of the World Trade Center, as I mentioned, with the tops aflame.

34:34Josh Larsen:And I think there's something, you know, to in terms of the anxiety of the time. I'm glad you brought that up because it's so right when when these movies are huge, colossal hits like this. I love just guessing what it is, what might be the deeper thing that it taps into. Even during an age of relative stability, you look at like the day the earth stood still and you get it. You get what that's tapping into, right? World War II had recently ended. The Cold War was upon us. Nuclear paranoia, obviously a lot there to mine in terms of why that would be a resonant film. But why does Independence Day, why did it resonate?

35:14Josh Larsen:then, and maybe a little bit differently now, I think of 9-11 as sort of the loss of innocence of a sort for a lot of people when it came to America's role in the world, partly because of the event itself, but largely for the American response to the event and the military and and relatedly moral choices that the entire world saw in response to 9-11, how American might was used. And it stands, when you look at that history, from the invasions to the torture, all of it, it stands in such stark contrast to the vision you just laid out here in Independence day where America is a leader of moral clarity.

36:08Josh Larsen:And in the sense that the only choice against this enemy is to fight, right? Obviously it's fight or be obliterated. It's a very easy moral choice to make in that sense. And yet I found it more troubling to see how it uses that narrative to couch a culture of warmongering as a patriotic gesture and starts blurring those lines where, again, the president isn't a real president when he's a wimp. He's a real president when he's a warrior. Absolutely. And what that means for everyone else in the movie.

36:47Adam Kempenaar:Those are the values it's reinforcing, without a doubt.

36:50Josh Larsen:Those are the values it's reinforcing.

36:51Adam Kempenaar:Yeah. Yeah. Let me go back to— And the problem—I'll just say, Josh, real quick, the problem for America post-9-11, And to go back to what I was saying about the common enemy that we can all identify is that the enemy is only going to get harder to identify. We're going to have an even murkier, murkier sense of who that villain is and how to handle that villain. And it's just going to become the ubiquitous war on terror. Right. And we don't have them. We can make them up.

37:23Josh Larsen:We're still reckoning with that. Absolutely. So that image we both cited of the spaceship emerging from the clouds, which I think absolutely holds up, is as it's supposed to be, threatening, almost demonic. There's like, you know, red fire crackling around it. And it stands in such stark contrast with Disclosure Day, thinking about Spielberg and his depiction of aliens outside of War of the Worlds. I think we need to set War of the Worlds aside, which somehow makes it interesting, where you have the real bad guys. The aliens are the bad guys there. Obviously, AI and artificial intelligence is a dark movie, but in different ways.

38:04Josh Larsen:In general, I think it's interesting how Independence Day stands in contrast to the Spielberg aliens that audiences had become very used to. There's two references in this movie, one to E.T., one to Close Encounters. Both are pretty corny jokes by Will Smith. I don't know if you have a preference for which one works better if either of them do. But that's the collective cinematic experience of movie aliens is largely through the lens of Spielberg. And we get something very different here. Obviously, alien gives us nasty aliens, too. But we also get it's interesting to me because Emmerich also employs some Spielberg tactics.

38:48So we get the wonder faces.

38:51Josh Larsen:We get people looking up at the sky. I had the same thought. Yes. but mostly out of fear and people immediately turn and run. This is, you know, which is a reasonable response, but it's a different way of depicting it. Whereas in Spielberg movies, it's there's fear involved, but there's way more wonder and there's a hint of transcendence. And I guess I was just curious, you know, how that, how those things sit alongside each other for you in terms of using some techniques here that are familiar from Spielberg, but in very different ways. Did you sense any of that sort of wonder in Independence Day?

39:32Josh Larsen:Or for you, was it more of like almost a horror movie?

39:35Adam Kempenaar:No, you nailed it. The first time I was struck by it was, and I think it is an effective visual moment, even if it's a little bit absurd, of course, that Will Smith would walk out, Vivica A. Fox would walk out and not notice that gigantic ship in the distance. But the shot is very good. And Will Smith's reaction and and I mean the actual reaction on his face, the emotion, the acting moment, the beat there that he gives imparts a lot. There is real texture in what he portrays. That's where I noticed the Spielberg face. I noticed the looking up with a sense of awe. But as you said, it immediately dissipates and turns into fear as it as it should for this movie.

40:27Adam Kempenaar:But that's what this movie is all about. So there there is no sense of wonder otherwise throughout this film, maybe maybe a tiny bit only when we get to the doctor character. Right. Who who is fascinated by. Yeah, right. 51 but i don't think that's enough to to latch on to and this movie just has all these other things on its mind all the other things that we're talking about it it is not going to venture off into that spielbergian territory all it's going to do spielberg wise is give us a few of those nice visual homages at best it's going it's going to ape it's going to ape that cinematography but then it may it may steal a few jokes at its expense and i was going to just ignore because i didn't have anything to add i thought when you when you reference those two jokes but actually i i do want to say when he makes that joke about et when they're getting briefed i i can imagine audiences especially then who wasn't this really will smith's breakout role

41:36Josh Larsen:as a film actor. So I'm looking up his filmography right now because I do want to talk about him a little bit. He had gotten attention for Six Degrees of Separation, which was a supporting part. Yeah, but this turned him into a star. Yeah, exactly. That's what I was going to say. I think that was probably, okay, he can do more than TV. And that was in 93. So you get this in 96. And yeah, it's just huge. Men in Black came in 97 and he just exploded. He was enormous.

42:04Adam Kempenaar:Yeah, he became the guy we look to for blockbusters on the heels of this movie. And when he delivers that thinking on his feet line and he mentions E.T., how he's anxious to get out there and kick E.T.'s ass and everybody laughs, I can only imagine the laugh that got in the theater as well. And that seems like with his natural charisma and comedic delivery, just so perfect for Will Smith. Now, doesn't he say the close encounters line when he has shot down the alien ship? It's after that. Yeah, I think so. It's right after that. Now, that's the other line. The moment when he, I would love to get in a time capsule.

42:48Adam Kempenaar:I probably actually did witness it happen. I just don't remember it because it was 30 years ago because I was wandering the theater cleaning up popcorn or something or telling people to put their feet down. but when he opens that hatch and sees the alien and punches it in the face and then says welcome to earth welcome to earth the audience must have just lost it right yeah like instantly they they that was the moment that made will smith the movie star it had to be that's what i call a

43:17Josh Larsen:close encounter it's great it's and it's the perfect tone and the movie needs that touch of levity by that point. And so I did, I enjoyed him in this then, and I did this time as well. He certainly comes across as cornier, and maybe I'm being influenced by where his career would go after this. And some of the lines aren't great, but he is one of the performers, I would say, that whether some of these are ad libs or he's taking the script, not every line, The stuff with him and Harry Connick Jr. is excruciating. But most of the lines Will Smith sells, to your point, Adam, as that character. Yes, he's playing Will Smith.

43:59Josh Larsen:But you also believe him as this guy who's considering becoming a stepdad, moving into a more serious relationship, but really has the priority of wanting to be this fighter pilot and be part of this fight. I think he's good here. The punching the alien in the face moment is great. That's probably when you were out there, you know, cleaning up the lobby and you heard the roar. That's that's what it was. Had to be. What I wouldn't give to go in a time capsule and just watch you shushing people and tell them to get their feet off the seats. Oh, I had to. My manager was relentless about it.

44:32Adam Kempenaar:Nobody cares anymore. My manager cared.

44:37Josh Larsen:Adam, it's around the corner. Christopher Nolan's The Odyssey. They've set the early press screen, which looks like it's going to work out for me to be able to make that. People are already buying tickets to see it when it comes to theaters. Just imagine seeing probably the most anticipated movie of the year, but certainly of the summer. Imagine seeing it for free. With Regal Unlimited, you could see it for free. Regal Unlimited is the all-you-can-watch movie subscription pass that pays for itself in just two visits. and right now Regal is offering film spotting listeners endless movies for less if you sign up for Regal Unlimited using code filmspot26 you'll get 15 % off now Regal Unlimited is the only truly limitless movie subscription pass with it you can see any standard 2D movie at any time no matter how popular or anticipated it is there are no blackout dates or restrictions also with Regal Unlimited you won't just save money on tickets you will save on snacks.

45:40Josh Larsen:Members get 10 % off all non-alcoholic concessions. Sign up now in the Regal app or at the link in our description code and use code FILMSPOT26 to receive your discount.

45:57Let me touch on just because I don't want to, you know, rip on all of these actors.

46:03Josh Larsen:So I'll say Also, I did enjoy Jeff Goldblum here. Obviously, he's running on the fumes of Jurassic Park, but he's doing it so well. And he's at least going to give you a line reading, no matter how bad the line, that's interesting. And that's all you need here, right? So he's good. I just got to say, I thought Judd Hirsch was insufferable as this Jewish caricature. You see him on screen. The doting father. I just started to sigh when he appeared. Randy Quaid did not work with me for me. Sounds like he worked for you. And part of it was this bizarre family. I'm just describing his character, Josh.

46:41Josh Larsen:Bizarre family dynamic, which I had forgotten about. Like he randomly lives in a trailer with these almost all adult children. I don't know. I am sure. I am sure that James Duvall, who plays his oldest son, has done good work before and since. I'm not that familiar with his career. I don't know if it was his choice or his direction to basically try to be Keanu Reeves, but that does not work at all. And the last I'll say, in terms of a negative time capsule, there is nothing more 1990s about this movie except for the extended screen time given to Harvey Fierstein. It's like the, it's the equivalent of the steel block font that they use for the, for the credits.

47:27That's Harvey and those credits.

47:30Josh Larsen:That's like, oh, we are in the 1990s.

47:34Adam Kempenaar:And the jokes, the one liners he has are so bad. They're just so stale. No, I actually I I really didn't like Randy Quaid's performance, which is unfortunate. It's also hard retroactively to enjoy any Randy Quaid performance, knowing how unhinged he is today. But trying to separate that and just watch the performance, it's one of those that just the volume is pitched just a little bit too high. And he's he's too over the top, I think, even for that character a little bit. I want to mention about Goldblum, though. He shows up on screen. I did forget that he was even in this movie. I have no relationship with this film.

48:15Adam Kempenaar:So when he shows up, I'm thinking, man, America's favorite sexy nerd. We just saw him, you know, in Jurassic Park a few years earlier. It's just like, let's just roll it back. Let's just get it. Let's just get it locked down, right? He's got it locked down. And I could watch him all day play that character. I'm totally fine with it. He obviously can crush it. And I'm watching the end of this movie, them walking out of the desert. And Josh, I'm going to tell you, Will Smith should have asked that Jeff Goldblum had to wear a different costume or something. walking next to him because that shot of the two of them, both in flight suits and the way Goldblum is strutting, he may be, I'm telling you, if you're listening to this and you haven't seen Independence Day in a while, put it on and just go watch this scene that I'm talking about.

49:08Adam Kempenaar:Jeff Goldblum walking out of the desert in a flight suit. He may be the hottest any man has ever looked in movies.

49:16Josh Larsen:Well, and this is coming from a man who has a poster of the right stuff in his bedroom still as an adult. Right. So you're really saying this. Yes, yes. He's hotter than Chuck Yeager. Let me throw something out. I thought in that shot, which is striking because Will Smith plays taller than he looks in that shot, let's just say. I thought, is that Goldblum? Because when you first see them, they're very far away and they're in like the salt flats. And I'm thinking, I wonder if he negotiated that he didn't want to walk across that desert that far because I think in the long shot, it might actually be i don't know if you'd say a stuntman but it might be a double but in the close-ups when they get closer it's absolutely him and he is in the it he is in the whole outfit

49:59Adam Kempenaar:i know he's much younger josh but he looks positively boyish next to the man that is next

50:07Josh Larsen:to him and jeff goldblum he really does does yeah yeah yeah he does yeah he really that's a bit of a painful scene too where unfortunately goldblum to survive in something like this I think really needs dialogue because once he's asked to just stand there and smile and participate in like a hoak fest, I just don't know if he's, he needs to be able to say something to diffuse that in order to look comfortable in the moment. And that like triumphant ending with the two of them doing their right stuff parade. Yeah, it's, it's not, it's not great for him or anybody really.

50:45Adam Kempenaar:I'll give you that. But I do remember being struck in the moment, especially as I was thinking about how the movie from a screenplay standpoint was establishing all these characters. I couldn't believe, you know, and I'm writing this in my notes. I couldn't believe they didn't give President Whitmore and and then through Whitmore, the audience more time to process. His wife's death, and I mean this the first time she dies when when when he's told. told when he's told the second time when both but at least at least there is a moment there's a couple moments with his daughter second and before that when he talks to her he talks to the doctor he talks to her in the bed he talks to his daughter at least there's processing before that he's told that his wife never made it to the air force base and we just go on as if nothing happened after it's it's taken all this time yeah he just kind of turns turns away like that's away from the camera it's like they've spent all this time setting up that relationship to not show him struggle with that moment at all or to consider what he's going to have to say to his daughter for her to process the news now i i then realize what they're doing and that is well we can't spend too much time on that because the real processing is going to come later i didn't know that when i was putting that in my notes that she's actually going to die later in the movie and that's going to come i still think we probably needed more than we got there will smith actually gets more of an emotional moment to process grief when he's told by robert loggia that el toro has been destroyed which i find fascinating like the movie the camera holds on him and we watch him deal with it for at least a few seconds which is more than the camera gives bill pullman i've got a theory

52:37Josh Larsen:There might be some Pullman scenes on the cutting room floor that just weren't good enough. I like, have always liked Bill Pullman.

52:44Adam Kempenaar:Yeah. And I like him.

52:45Josh Larsen:When I saw him show up in recently in the Burrows, the streaming series, which we didn't finish because it went off the rails. I think he's only in a couple episodes. I was like, oh, Bill Pullman. And he's, and he's fun. And so this is an actor I like. I forgot how just invisible he felt here for this role. I know he's trying to go for unflappable as this president, but I don't think his pulse raises maybe a little bit for the big speech. I think he's fine. I don't think his pulse, I would not be surprised if there was a big emotional scene and everyone saw it and just kind of look up at the ceiling and they're just like,

53:27Adam Kempenaar:let's uh let's just leave it out yeah i i can see that can can i do just a couple of nitpicks i i love the fact that everyone's dying to get out of new york city and at imminent destruction you know we know it's coming all these people are getting in their cars and gold bloom and his dad are just like next scene they're heading down the interstate it's that easy as if you could even get out of new york when when aliens aren't attacking it's totally absurd i guess i'm thinking you're

53:57Josh Larsen:right you're right they do comment when they're coming into dc well everybody's going out exactly

54:03Adam Kempenaar:getting out of new york like like there's never any traffic in new york and it's not any worse in in this point i thought that was funny i think was that better or worse than uh jasmine driving

54:13Josh Larsen:the giant truck that she just happens to find she happens to find with the keys in it and of course

54:19Adam Kempenaar:it starts but then also the fact that she randomly comes across the first lady yes we need that we need that screenplay part to work out i i think that there the fact that there's no strategy at all to their to their attack the first attack on the alien on the alien ship i i remember just being like why would they think i know they have no choice because we only have the weapons we have really and short of a nuclear attack but why would they think they could beat them and james rebhorn his character says later there there was no way we could have known our fighters would have been that ineffective uh yeah i think you could have thought that they're an advanced alien species why would you gotta try i guess it's just so i i thought that was dumb and the aliens the alien the the part where they they just randomly of course bring in the jeff goldblum and will smith ship and and somehow yes jeff goldblum does know that it has power windows that he can close so the alien won't see them there are those little things like that that aren't enough to to make you have really any more issues than you might have with this film but they're fun little things you just like you get to shake your head at as you watch maybe that's part of the fun

55:43Josh Larsen:It's become a notorious joke that all this took was uploading a virus to take down the civilization. That very old school virus. I will say in terms of the strategy, I did like, and this is a Spielberg nod too, I felt like the welcome wagon, before they attack the alien ship, they go up to communicate and it's a helicopter and they use different strobe lights to send signals. It was a nice close encounter as a reference. Now, again, this is the flip side, so it obviously doesn't work and goes quite wrong. But I thought that was a nicely staged scene, too.

56:18Adam Kempenaar:I did, too. But I remember also noting, I wish the movie had given us 30 seconds where we understood what they were hoping to accomplish there. Like we understood what the lights were doing or trying to communicate, what the strategy was.

56:33Josh Larsen:I think it was just like a first contact type thing. Right. Like either they were sending like, you know, Morse code or some sort of. Yeah. Yeah. I guess it was a math based, you know, math based thing. Right. There you go.

56:45Adam Kempenaar:So here's my last thing, Josh. And this is either I can't wait to drop this. Oh, this is either one of those things that will get a collective shrug and a shrug from you and a collective shrug from everyone listening. It's like, yeah, duh, of course. Or it's going to be the most insightful thing I've said this entire conversation. Oh, wow. And you can just you can take away everything else and we'll just have this. What is the running gag with Randy Quaid's character? He has claimed that he was abducted by aliens. Nobody believes him. And there's that one guy in particular who keeps hounding him about his abduction and making fun of him.

57:34Adam Kempenaar:And what does he make fun of him for? What does he keep alluding to? That the aliens might have done what? Yeah, they abused him. That they probably experimented on him sexually. Yes. What is the most famous pop culture trope that is associated with alien abductions, period? But I'll be very clear about it. Alien abductions when it comes to sexual experimentation. it is you can google it if you don't believe me josh because you're looking at me a little

58:12Josh Larsen:quizzically anal probing oh yeah sure okay okay okay what is the exact method of revenge that russell gets on the aliens how does he execute it yeah yeah it's it's a little intimate i would say

58:29Adam Kempenaar:yeah yeah i think it's i think there's some symmetry there to the well doesn't he even

58:35Josh Larsen:Doesn't he even yell? Like, does he yell up yours? Yeah, he might. He might say up yours. I think he yells like a variation of that. So it's certainly on his mind. All right, you alien assholes. In the words of my generation, up yours!

58:53Adam Kempenaar:It's on his mind. It was on my mind. And now it's on everyone's mind as we close out our conversation of Independence Day. Any closing thoughts of yours, Josh? Top that. Yeah, let's just leave it there. Okay. Independence Day is currently streaming on Hulu and via VOD on most platforms. Let's take a minute to thank some family plus members. And what I love about this, Josh, is that there are two names here, and one of them goes back to 2012 with the show. And these are new names to me. Not that I know every film spotting listener, but over time, I see a lot of recurring names in the mailbag, entering massacre theater.

59:33Adam Kempenaar:I've never heard either of these names before. And something about just discovering new listeners is fun for me. So let's get to know. Let's get to know Family Plus members Scott Watts in Hopewell, Virginia, and Matt Killen in Chicago a little better.

59:48Josh Larsen:Scott shared that his brother recommended the show to him way back when producer Sam was co-hosting. That far back. Matt says that he discovered film spotting, I guess not new, but mid-life of film spotting, let's say, in 2012. Here's Matt. I was looking for podcasts to listen to on my commute. I came across film spotting. It was episode 394, reviewing Cabin in the Woods, and I was hooked immediately. I could hear your enthusiasm for the craft and joy of filmmaking, and I've been listening every week ever since. Every week, you both bring a personal perspective to your reviews that is often surprising and always refreshing.

1:00:26Adam Kempenaar:Okay. Favorite show segments? Matt says, you mean besides manimals, I assume? Of course. I love that, Josh. Your top five landscapes as characters from 2020 has always been one of my favorite segments to revisit from time to time. If for no other reason than that, it manages to convey the celebration of film as a visual medium on an audio podcast. I really did enjoy that one as well. Close Encounters comes up there. That was one we did with a pretty famous photographer. Gregory Crudson joined us for that top five. So I'm glad that Matt enjoyed it.

1:01:01Josh Larsen:As for Scott's pick for a favorite show segment, Massacre Theater cracks me up every time, he says. They both shared movies that they credit for helping them become cinephiles. Scott mentioned Pulp Fiction and Matt mentioned North by Northwest. So thank you both, Scott and Matt, for being family members and for listening all those years. Matt is on Letterboxd. For those of you who are also there, you can find him at Kormal, K-O-R-M-A-L. Of course, in addition to keeping us doing what we're doing, family membership comes with perks. You can listen early and ad-free. You'll get our weekly newsletter, exclusive opportunities like the FilmSpotting Family Discord, and monthly bonus shows.

1:01:45Josh Larsen:We just released June's bonus show. It was a We Were Wrong Once discussion of David Robert Mitchell's It Follows. So that is available now to FilmSpotting family members.

1:01:57Adam Kempenaar:And coming very soon to FilmSpotting family members, I think we'll hold off until after July 4th. But immediately after that, just for the family, FilmSpotting Madness, best of the 1920s and 30s. That bracket will be dropped just for you. You still have a chance to become a family member and participate in that. And that will shape film spotting madness for 2027. So it's very important. If you'd like to join, you can do that at filmspottingfamily.com. And you can help us reach new listeners by rating or reviewing us over on Apple Podcasts or on Spotify. Apple Vacations, where your story starts.

1:02:38The July Savings Event from Apple Vacations is here. Book by July 23rd and save up to$400 off your flight and hotel package to Mexico, the Caribbean, Central America, Hawaii, or Europe. From all-inclusive escapes to bucket list adventures, Apple Vacations makes it easy to create memories with the people who matter most. Start today at AppleVacations.com or contact your trusted travel advisor. Apple Vacations, where your story starts. you The Declaration, which is full of these beautifully rendered sentences and paragraphs about Enlightenment ideals, does also have this darker history to it. Why is it important for the darker part of the Declaration of Independence and the American Revolution?

1:03:25Why is it important that Americans know about it? Well, if we don't understand the full context in which our nation was founded, we won't understand the full context in which our nation now finds itself. I'm Rebecca Nagle, Goheen Dawadon, Jalika Yetli Kei La, citizen of Cherokee Nation. Are you guys big Chiefs fans? Hell yeah. This is First America, the true story of how the United States came to be and how we got to this present moment. Listen to First America on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

1:04:26eventually get around to the music. That's what I mostly think of when I think of him, the time together laughing. Lawyer Robbie Kaplan. The great gift of being a lawyer is the ability to actually change things in our society in a way that very few people can. I mean, you can really make a difference to causes in the United States if you bring the right case at the right time. Marriage equality. Yeah, Windsor's the perfect example. Director Morgan Neville. Film school teaches you all the wrong things about making documentary. What do you want to say? Documentary is all about your ear. What do you hear?

1:04:58I feel like my job is listening really, really hard. Listen to Here's the Thing on the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Keith Giamanca seemed like a mild-mannered suburban dad. But secretly, he became someone else. A master of disguise who went on a crime spree. At the time, did it seem like a crazy idea? It seemed very crazy, but I felt so desperate that I felt it was the quickest, easiest way out. Did you allow yourself to think about how it could go wrong and what that might look like? No, I didn't want to manifest that. I was trying to manifest success. Every family has its secrets, but what happens when you discover that your dad has been living a double life?

1:05:52That is not the look of an innocent man. This is going to change my life and my family dynamic forever because everything that had existed prior in my reality is now untrue. Listen to Deep Cover, The Family Man on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

1:06:17From Chicago, this is Elspine.

1:06:23Adam Kempenaar:That was the packed crowd just this past Sunday at the Music Box Theater in Chicago, there to close out Film Spotting Fest. What a lovely time screening Wes Anderson's The Royal Tenenbaums for its 25th anniversary. A 35 millimeter print. We got to intro the film with the one and only Michael Phillips and then spend a good 35, I think 40 minutes afterwards talking about the movie with Michael. We do plan to release that conversation and others from film spotting fest in the film spotting feed over the course of the next several months.

1:07:00Josh Larsen:Man, did Royal Tenenbaums look good. I'm going to steal this from Sam. Well, I'll credit him. We were talking about afterwards and he noted, you know, it was a little, the colors were a little dimmer probably then back in 2001. one, but, but Sam was like, it felt like it was from the world of Royal Tendon Bounds looking that way. It was almost like an improvement, you know, in terms of the aesthetic. It had to feel worn. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So yeah, Sam was right on with that one. So seeing that in 35 millimeter was a treat and oh my goodness, the previous day at the Athenaeum seeing Cleo from five to seven and it's black and white glory on a big screen.

1:07:43Josh Larsen:First time I had had that opportunity to see it that big. That was kind of almost like the Padre Panchali at Film Spotting Fest last year. You know, this is a revelation, even though I was very intimately familiar with the movie already.

1:07:59Adam Kempenaar:After Cleo from five to seven, we talked about it with Agnes Varda, biographer, the great critic, Carrie Rickey. And then we screened Crescia with Trey Edward Schultz, the writer and director. we close things out with David Wayne's Wet Hot American Summer. We had a nice intro video from David Wayne himself, who unfortunately couldn't make it. So we sent in that video. But we had one of the stars of the film, Marguerite Moreau, in attendance. Scott Tobias, our critic friend from Chicago, also joined us for that conversation. Again, we'll share those. You'll hear all of them and maybe even see all of them at some point because we did put those on video.

1:08:38Adam Kempenaar:We wanted to share just a little bit of feedback we received about the fest. We've had a couple of emails come into the inbox so far that I think, based on what we've heard anecdotally, reflect overall the weekend, certainly that we had and that film spotting listeners had at the Athenaeum and the Music Box.

1:09:02Josh Larsen:Let's start with this from Fern Josephs. Hi, Adam, Josh, Sam, Sophie, and everyone involved in making Film Spotting Fest a success. Congratulations, and I hope you're resting today. I had a great time, and it seems like everyone who was there for one movie or four did too. Both venues were terrific, the movies were well chosen, and the guests added so much to my knowledge and enjoyment of each of the films. As always, it's good to have time to chat with each of you. I enjoyed talking to Michael Phillips a few times, and I'm thrilled he's now involved with film spotting on a regular basis. I met a few fellow slash sister family members.

1:09:36Josh Larsen:What a great group we are. That's all the gushing for now. Just wanted you to know how much your hard work means to me and how much it paid off this weekend. Rest, recover, maybe see a film purely for joy. I don't know if that's possible, Fern.

1:09:49Adam Kempenaar:That doesn't happen when you do film spotting, but I will share some more details on what she's referencing with Michael Phillips here in a moment. I love that email. And what I especially love about it is hearing that part where she says, I met a few fellow slash sister family members. What a great group we are. I see Fern at, I think, every Chicago live event that we do. Seems like it, yeah. And also some trivia spotting events that we do via Zoom or have done in the past. Always great to catch up with her. I want to hear more because the idea that maybe Fern has been able to connect with some people face to face that she didn't know before that she's befriended and is now keeping in contact with.

1:10:31Adam Kempenaar:Well, that's that's what happens at these events. People meet each other and then become lifelong friends. We have so many examples of it occurring. And that's the rewarding, that's one of the rewarding parts of doing these types of live events.

1:10:46Josh Larsen:Indeed. We also heard from Brendan Fitzpatrick in D.C. Thanks again for a great weekend of Friends Films and Fellowship. There you go. This was my first trip to Chicago ever, and it was an absolute blast. Can't wait to see what's up next. I thought the whole weekend was a great success from an outside point of view. The venue for the first three films was a cool setup with the drop-down projector screen I thought worked really well. And for a first ever experience at the Music Box on Sunday, I was so thrilled. I was sitting directly behind Sam, who was kind enough to slouch and lean for me and my short self to see the screen perfectly.

1:11:19Josh Larsen:Meeting Trey Edward Schultz and getting to talk to him about how much I truly loved his film and even geek out a bit with him on how the film's tone really struck me the first time I saw the film back in 2023 was a moment I'll carry with me going forward. Thank you for all you do. Film spotting is truly an inspiration and a delight to be a part of.

1:11:37Adam Kempenaar:Well, thank you so much for that, Brendan. Another listener we've become very familiar with over the years. And I think the first time, though, that we've ever met in person, as you said, came all the way from Washington, D.C. And that, too, was so satisfying to hear. I think every single person that I met, Josh, who came up and introduced themselves to me was from out of state. And when I say out of state, that included travelers. Yep. You know, that was Wisconsin. That was Michigan and Indianapolis. but it was also Oklahoma. Hi, Jan. That was also San Jose, San Francisco, Oakland. It was Boston.

1:12:15Adam Kempenaar:It was all over the United States. And we just can't say how grateful we are to know that we have that kind of support, that we consistently get that kind of support at events like this. When you think back on the weekend, is there a particular highlight for you?

1:12:34Josh Larsen:I mean, it is getting to talk to people who at this point are familiar faces, but as you said, meeting some new folks too, who were in Chicago for the first time. So that is always a joy and just getting to like debate the movies. People like to talk about their relationship to the show and that's great. And it's always a good chance for us to get sort of some feedback. Right. But it's also just good to mix it up about what they thought about the movie they just saw. and I think the lineup worked well that way, gave us a ton to dig into. We had more space between films this time to have some of that processing that, you know, just saw it processing going on.

1:13:15Josh Larsen:But yeah, I think, you know, our guests added a lot too. You know, when you mention, you think about what Carrie Rickey brought, we did a marathon on Agnes Varda Adam and still the wealth of knowledge she brought was a so much background that was new to me. Um, and so that was really helpful. Trey Edward Schultz, the candor you've interviewed him before. So, so you knew this, but the candor that guy has just about his process and, you know, the vulnerable nature of the material of Cretia. I thought that was just an incredible conversation we got to have with him and man, Marguerite Moreau, you know, you know what, that's what a star is, right?

1:13:57Josh Larsen:We're up here all day. Yes. Just, just trying to get through our intros and not stumble over our Q and A's. We go out there for wet, hot American summer and, and try to introduce that. And then you, you say, let's bring her out. She steps on the stage and it's like, she doesn't do anything, but all of a sudden all the lights are brighter and she just has a different energy. That's true. She gets the crowd going. And I just remember standing there and being like, well, my job's done. Do I like actually leave the stage now? Yeah. She just held court. That shows you. Yeah. She held court. That shows you that sort of charisma that, um, you know, an actor can bring.

1:14:35Josh Larsen:And then afterwards, you know, she was insightful as well about the particular quality of comedy that, uh, Wet Hot American Summer is.

1:14:43Adam Kempenaar:Yeah. I think for me, and maybe this is part of being so involved, so heavily involved behind the scenes with the logistics too and maybe just a i don't want to say insecurity because at this point josh i obviously do have enough confidence in our show and i certainly have enough confidence in what what you're bringing to the show and what producer sam's bringing to the show and all the work ashley has done behind the scenes i'm going to mention her again here in a second but there's something about bringing new people into the orbit who have no experience with us marguerite moreau i don't think it ever heard of film spotting now trey edward schultz has been on the show was a fan before he had been on the show but carrie rickey isn't someone who knew anything about us and she's someone we have a tremendous amount of respect for as a critic and has written this great book about agnes varda and anytime you're bringing new people into film spotting you just want to make sure that they have a great experience and that it's the type of experience where they they feel like they're taken care of they feel like they're respected but that they also respect you and the work you're doing and that they like the community and what they're getting back from the audience and that they possibly want to come back and be part of something like this again and working with carrie working with marguerite they couldn't have been easier to work with they couldn't have been more low maintenance.

1:16:12Adam Kempenaar:They couldn't have been more exciting and fun to talk with. And working with both of them, I know that they would both happily join us if we called on them again for a future film spotting fest. So for me, just knowing that it worked out that way is something that I do cherish. Yeah.

1:16:32Josh Larsen:And you get the sense it was even more than worth their time. That's like the low bar for someone who has no idea who we are. It's like, is this going to even be worth my time? They take that risk by agreeing to come. And so it's gratifying to see that they arrive and enjoy themselves. And I do think this is where the community comes in because that's the common refrain I've heard when we have guests is they'll say, wow, this is a really tight-knit community that you've got here. So it's the energy that the listeners bring. It's that interaction in between screenings, the enthusiasm, the excitement.

1:17:17Josh Larsen:I think that's a lot of what the guests respond to. Yeah, without a doubt.

1:17:22Adam Kempenaar:We will have more about Film Spotting Fest, those recordings, as I mentioned, coming down the road. We're not exactly sure when we will drop them into your feed, but rest assured you will hear them. We want to thank our partners at Inflection Point Entertainment. We want to thank everyone at the Athenaeum Center for Thought and Culture and the Music Box, but especially Emily Anderson and Rebecca Lyon. Ashley McDonald-Bennett was the project manager, and she managed the project. It would not have happened without her. And fortunately, the feedback here again, like last year, has been so overwhelmingly positive.

1:18:00Adam Kempenaar:And we had so many people say, you have to keep doing this. You have to do it again. Fortunately, when I saw Ashley at the end of the day, she was all smiles about that. Now, I don't know when that smile will dissipate, Josh, maybe maybe after year three or year four, if we do continue this. But I will say that we already have a pretty good idea what we want the lineup to be for year three if it does happen. So we are at least talking about it behind the scenes. I should also give some thanks to our former film spotting PA Cat Sullivan, who helped us out wrangling some talent. It was it was definitely a village that made this for sure happen.

1:18:40Adam Kempenaar:Michael Phillips Fern mentioned it we dropped an announcement on the live crowd there at the Music Box Sunday so we might as well share it with the larger film spotting audience here coming Monday July 13th to your film spotting feed will be another new film spotting podcast and it is with Michael Phillips called The Movie Racket he's obviously been a huge part of this show for many years now And we thought, why not give him his own show? He's going to have a recurring or I should say a rotating group of guest hosts or guests on the show. And the the topic will be for this this season. And that's how we're approaching it.

1:19:29Adam Kempenaar:At least through the end of the year, you'll get episodes. Michael is taking conventional wisdom lore around movies going back to the 30s and 40s in some cases and exploring them to see if there's still truth in them if there ever was any truth in them. One of those I'll give you an example because it's the first one that's coming is that that famous true foe line that everyone gives him credit for. And it's a variation on that that idea that there's no such thing as an anti-war film. So Michael recorded a conversation, a very insightful, very personal conversation about that idea with the great actor Michael Shannon.

1:20:12Adam Kempenaar:That's going to be your first episode.

1:20:14Josh Larsen:Talk about fantastic guests. And then did I see that we do have locked in Amy Nicholson for an upcoming episode? It's in the can. Yeah, episode two. She's one of our favorite critics. I mean, if you haven't heard her on a podcast yet, definitely look out for this because she's fantastic. So, yeah, great that Michael will get more of an opportunity to be on the air with us and bringing new people with each show. That's very exciting.

1:20:41Adam Kempenaar:Yeah. So, Mondays. Basically, every first Monday of the month is a new movie deathmatch. And then the other Mondays is Michael Phillips Monday. You'll get episodes of the movie Racket. More info about FilmSpottingFest can also be found at FilmSpottingFest.com. But yeah, the big news, we're excited about Michael and his new show, The Movie Racket. The current deeply flawed FilmSpotting poll asks you to choose a pair of 90s blockbusters, both films from the same movie year. You can vote in that poll and leave a comment over at FilmSpotting.net. There's a link and also a poll embedded right there on the main page.

1:21:21Adam Kempenaar:Now, Josh, you recall that I added the wrinkle just for giggles. I added the wrinkle of international box office pairings to see if that changed anything. And it affected four years. There was one that seemed a little too good to be true. If you recall, it was 1997 where the top two movies domestically were Titanic and Men in Black. but i said based on box office mojo that internationally it was titanic and bean yeah that's right yeah yeah and we were incredulous but also it it may be checked out we know that those bean films tend to do well worldwide well aaron newworth in the film spotting family discord did some fact checking and he pointed out what what we all do know that ever since whenever it was that imdb took over box office mojo.com unfortunately that site has been a shell of itself and it does have a lot of incorrect information bean did make over 250 million dollars worldwide but that actually puts it at 11th for that movie year still very good but not number two the real number two international pairing it's not titanic and men in black it's Titanic and Jurassic Park, the lost world.

1:22:50Adam Kempenaar:Aha. Wouldn't change your, your pick though. You wouldn't go with that. Would you?

1:22:55Josh Larsen:My takeaway is here's why you don't mess with Sam's pole. I knew this, something like this was going to happen. Once you started tinkering, it was a simple pole. I know. You had to throw in the wrinkle. I'm not changing the pole. I'm not changing the pole.

1:23:07Adam Kempenaar:I'm just talking. I'm just talking. It's fun conversation. The other one that seemed off was David Fincher's seven. Remember how I said seven was the number one for 1995 worldwide? Yeah, that's not the case. Did really well. $327 million, seventh. But you know what movie beat? Toy Story even. That's number two. Toy Story is number two internationally, not number one like it was domestically. $361 million for Toy Story. But number one internationally in 1995 with$366 million. happen to have a guess it's a franchise and it's a sequel oh no i was going a different direction

1:23:49Josh Larsen:so give it to me die hard with a vengeance oh okay all right yeah i'm a little bit surprised i heard still bringing in the money okay yeah all right so trust the record reflect yeah trust

1:24:03Adam Kempenaar:that you can't trust box office mojo but apparently sam's options in the deeply flawed film spotting poll they're not flawed they are the actual top two pairings for those years and we would love your vote and we may even read your comment you can vote now at filmspotting.net time now for

1:24:23Josh Larsen:massacre theater where adam and i perform a scene and you get a chance to win a film spotting prize last time we massacred this scene everything you're doing there i have to explain to a room full of men whose first and last question is how can this be used against us kangaroo What is that? In 1770, Captain James Cook's ship ran aground off the coast of Australia, and he led a party into the country, and they met the aboriginal people. One of the sailors pointed at the animals that hop around and put their babies in their pouch, and he asked what they were, and the aborigines said kangaroo. It wasn't until later that they learned that kangaroo means I don't understand.

1:25:04I can show that for now.

1:25:05Josh Larsen:That was Forrest Whitaker and Amy Adams in 2016's Arrival, written by Eric Hesser, adapting a short story by Ted Chiang. It was directed by Denis Villeneuve. That massacre was part of an episode that also included reviews of Disclosure Day and The Sheep Detectives. So why that scene from Arrival?

1:25:25Adam Kempenaar:well if i'm remembering correctly no one did come up with a true connection to the sheep detectives nicole steptler with seattle said i think the movie is arrival admittedly i haven't rewatched it in a while because i'm not prepared to experience that level of emotional devastation again but a movie about aliens with dialogue emphasizing the importance of learning to communicate with them rather than going in guns blazing seems like it's got to be that

1:25:51Josh Larsen:Here's Patrick Barton from Houston. This must be fate. I'm about three months behind on listening to podcasts, but because I had such conflicted feelings about Disclosure Day, I jumped ahead to this episode, and I knew what the title was going to be for Massacre Theater before you even started the scene when Adam talked about how this film did something Disclosure Day was trying to do, but better. I was like, this is going to be Arrival. And indeed, it was. Arrival is in my top three movies of all time. I watch it at least once a year, and thanks to Regal, just got a chance to catch it in theaters again for the first time since its release.

1:26:27Josh Larsen:This movie does do what I hope Disclosure Day would do, show how different countries can come together, because an alien forces them to. Disclosure Day is very U.S.-centric, and I love that Arrival does touch on the international side of things. I wish Disclosure Day was half the movie that Arrival is, but for now, I'll just have to rewatch that amazing film again. Thanks as always for what you do and especially for Massacre Theatre. Never stop doing it.

1:27:17Adam Kempenaar:directors, aliens, and specifically ones who impart a gift of language. A world on the brink of war where a perhaps underappreciated, though always excellent redheaded actress has to save humanity some way. The relationship between Amy Adams and Jeremy Renner in Arrival also has some parallels to the roles Blunt and O 'Connor play in the movie with the man of science and woman of empathy. That's all I got. I'm off to watch Arrival again. Okay, so I'm misrecalling frederick's email but it's actually the the brink of war part that i was referencing during the disclosure day or when we set up massacre theater that's the the arrival thing i think it does really well that you'll recall i thought disclosure day sort of just throws in as an afterthought including that the world's about to end whereas arrival integrates that in in a very effective

1:28:06Josh Larsen:way here's rory dunn from auckland new zealand i knew it within the first two words josh did a great Forrest Whitaker via Joseph Gordon-Levitt. Who knew? I was so excited there for a minute.

1:28:18Adam Kempenaar:You just wanted to stop at great Forrest Whitaker.

1:28:21Josh Larsen:Yeah.

1:28:21Adam Kempenaar:Okay. Finally, here's Ed Savoy from Philly with more comments on your performance. I think you need to get a scene featuring Nick Offerman in this segment as Josh seems to have a perfect impression of him. That's probably closer to what you were doing. That has no tie-in with Arrival.

1:28:38Josh Larsen:Wasn't going for it, but I'll take it.

1:28:39Adam Kempenaar:the film you massacred that connects with Disclosure Day as a communication with aliens movie, but I thought it was useful for you to know. We will keep that in mind moving forward. Reach into the Film Spotting hat, Josh, and pick out this week's winner. Our winner is Jason George from Sacramento, California. Congratulations, Jason. Email feedback at filmspotting.net, and we will set you up with your very own Film Spotting t-shirt, tote bag, or trial membership to the Film Spotting family.

1:29:21Adam Kempenaar:we move on now to this week's edition of Massacre Theatre pretty short scene I think this is going to be a tough one I don't think we're going to get as many entries as we got for Arrival but maybe listeners will surprise us. It does have a direct tie-in as these scenes usually do with our topic this week. I'm going to start it off. Are you ready, Josh?

1:29:46Josh Larsen:Yeah, I think so. I'm a little at a loss here because this is a movie I actually haven't seen. So clearly, clearly we watched it once in preparation. That's, that's our basic research. So I do have that to work from, But I don't have that deep knowledge, that deep well to pull from for my performance. So give me a little grace here.

1:30:08Adam Kempenaar:Do you recall why you might have skipped this movie? It was a fairly major release the weekend it came out. We discussed it on the show that week.

1:30:16Josh Larsen:It's, you know, it was a smaller film and it's probably one of those I knew I always needed to catch up with. And then the end of the year came around. I didn't make it and haven't found the time. So yeah, that's unfortunately not a clue for anyone. No. Unless they think they have it and you want to search if I've ever reviewed it and it doesn't come up.

1:30:36Adam Kempenaar:You won't find it on the LarsonOnFilm.com archive and also FilmSpotting has reviewed it pre-Josh. Okay. So we've narrowed it down a little bit. All right. That'll help. Let's do it. You're going to give me the action. And action. One dollar buys five rings. If one of the rings lands on one of the red bottles, they win a giant ass panda. that is giant ass panda yeah it's the best prize in the park and that's because this game is unwinnable observe drop a ring from three inches away so nobody ever wins someone wins a giant ass panda on your watch you should just go home because you're fired okay and scene is that the voice you

1:31:22Josh Larsen:used when you used to tell people to get their legs off the theater seats that would have been Effective.

1:31:28Adam Kempenaar:I was far more authoritative, Josh. Oh, okay. I'll have you know. If you know what film we just massacred, email the movie's title, your name and location, to feedback at filmspotting.net. Your deadline is Monday, July 7th. We will announce the winner. Next week, we'll select them randomly first and then announce the winner in a couple of weeks. Josh, that's our show.

1:31:49Josh Larsen:If you want to connect with us on social media, you can find Adam and the show on Instagram, Facebook, Letterboxd, YouTube, and Blue Sky. at FilmSpotting. I'm at Larson on Film. We are independently produced and listener supported. You can support the show by joining the FilmSpotting family at FilmSpottingFamily.com. You can listen early and ad-free. You'll also get monthly bonus episodes, a weekly newsletter, and access to the entire show archive. For show t-shirts and other merch, go to FilmSpotting.net slash shop.

1:32:22Adam Kempenaar:Out limited this weekend is Maddie's Secret. Maybe a golden brick contender we'll see writer director star john early's feature debut that premiered at last fall's toronto international film festival i love this description from letterboxd mia lee vicino academy award for john early's cirkian cirkian almodovarian melodrama meets made for tv special meets showgirls meets girl interrupted showgirls interrupted let's go with it okay think i followed all that olivia wilde's the invite with seth rogan edward norton penelope cruz and wild that's expanding to more cities the following weekend now i should say i haven't looked at its metacritic or rotten tomato score the vibe i'm getting is that it's getting generally good reviews and that excites me because i haven't been the biggest fan of either of olivia wilde's

1:33:15Josh Larsen:first two movies hopefully this will be the one okay i i forgot that you weren't all that high on Booksmart either. But yeah, I'm excited for this one, obviously, and seeing it tonight. So I will definitely be reporting back on next week's show.

1:33:28Adam Kempenaar:Outwide Minions and Monsters, the seventh film in the Despicable Me Minions franchise, Young Washington. Back rooms, new longer, everything must go cut. There are 16 more minutes of footage in that, Josh. Are you going?

1:33:44Josh Larsen:You know what? If it was clarified that there only footage in the back rooms, I might actually go. I might do it.

1:33:51Adam Kempenaar:Next week here on Film Spotting, movie deathmatch is back. Episode two, it's Christopher Nolan, Interstellar versus Inception. That's Monday. Tuesday, the next picture show, the new Supergirl and the Cone Brothers' True Grit. How about that pairing, Josh? Oh, wow.

1:34:08Josh Larsen:See, this is what I love. When it's not immediately obvious, then you just got to listen and see how they got to this and what they get out of it.

1:34:16Adam Kempenaar:And speaking of the Cone brothers, since I can't get to the invite in advance, Josh is going to talk about that film solo. We are going to continue our Pantheon project with a 30th anniversary review of Fargo. Little winter in summer.

1:34:34Josh Larsen:which based on how hot it is around most of the country and most of Europe as well, that will hopefully offer a little bit of cinematic relief. Film spotting is produced by golden Joe to so and Sam van Hulgren without Sam and golden Joe. This show wouldn't go. Our production assistant is Sophie Kemp and our special thanks to everyone at WB easy Chicago. More information is available at WB easy.org for film spotting. I'm Josh Larson. And I'm Adam Kempinar. Thanks for listening. This conversation can serve no purpose anymore. Goodbye.

1:35:33package to Mexico, the Caribbean, Central America, Hawaii, or Europe. From all-inclusive escapes to bucket list adventures, Apple Vacations makes it easy to create memories with the people who matter most. Start today at applevacations.com or contact your trusted travel advisor. Apple Vacations, where your story starts. 150 years ago, they were hunting us down to kill us, and now they're hunting down immigrants to deport them. This is First America, the true story of how the United States came to be and how we got to this present moment. Listen to First America on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.