JAMIE & NICK LAING: DAD TOLD ME THIS ONE THING THAT CHANGED MY VIEW ON FATHERHOOD

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2:13Hey guys, welcome back to Great Company. This episode is a little bit of a personal one. So you probably know that I'm going to be a dad, which is really exciting. and I've never really spoken about how I feel, what I'm thinking about in sort of a solo interview. So today we're going to be doing that, but we also have someone else who's going to be joining us, which is my dad. My dad has never done a podcast with me. He's never spoken out on anything ever really. And I've asked him to come on to give me advice, talk about our relationship. So we really hope you enjoy this personal episode. Remember to subscribe and get ready for this.

2:50enjoy this episode of Great Comfort with me and my dad.

2:56Hello. Hello. Well, this is a special episode, isn't it? You took the words right out of my mouth. There's some news. There's been some news. There's been some news. We've all heard about it. Jamie is going to be a dad. Yeah, it's very, very exciting. And I suppose, so we thought what we would do today is instead of having our usual guest on, we would, I would be the guest. Yeah, we've interrupted the schedule because it's quite a big deal. You suggested to me that it would be a good episode to do because actually, as much as Great Company is about the amazing guests we have on, it's also about, I suppose, my life and it's about being honest and open.

3:35There's a few little through stories that we have. And the story of you becoming a dad is one that we've spoken about at Christmas and we spoke, I feel like we maybe might have touched on it in your run. Did we touch on it in your run? I've been touching it over the last night. And every single person who comes on this show who is a parent, you ask, what's it like? To become a dad. Yeah. Yeah. People are invested. We're doing this today. For some reason, I always find these ones a bit strange when it's sort of turned on me. I don't know why. I'm much more comfortable sitting the other way around and just chatting that way.

4:08Yeah, that's fair. And we've got armchairs in today. And I just said to Jamie just before, I didn't realize I was going to be recorded from the waist down. So I'm wearing shorts and I didn't think that would be. You look great. To be on camera. You look so great. I'm Jemima. I'm producer of the show. You sit behind the camera. I sit behind the camera. So, Jamie, I thought I'd just kick off with asking just a few things about whether you know, how well you know what's coming for you. Okay, give it to me. How many times a day does the average newborn baby eat? Like milk? Yeah. Breast milk? That's what they'll be eating, yeah.

4:41Okay. Not like a waffle. No. Okay. They don't. You've asked me that question, so it feels like it's going to be a little bit. It's going to be a lot more than I think. Well, what do you first think? Well, breakfast, lunch and dinner. Maybe tea in between. So I'll go six. That's how many times you're feeding a baby. So it's about eight times a day, every two to three hours. Wow. What's the average amount of nappies a baby uses in the first year? The first year? I mean, I had a dirty nappy. Apparently my nappy was just horrendous all the time. So if it's anything like me, two a day. So 700? 2 ,500.

5:23No. You've got to change that nappy more than twice a day. I've got to change my business and start selling nappies. Are you joking? That is mad. When should you start giving a baby real food? So off milk. One? Five to six months. Okay. Okay, this is starting really well. Sophie, do not listen. This is starting really well. How many days does it take for a baby to recognize their dad's voice? Well, I have a theory that I talk to the baby in Soph's tummy. So I feel like when the baby comes out, it recognises the voice. 14 days. Oh, what? So what's the point of talking about? So he's got two weeks of bliss.

5:57I'm going to waste my time talking to the tummy anyway. Two weeks of bliss before it's then polluted with me. Yeah, for the rest of its life. Okay. What is the most common food item that pregnant women crave? Gherkins. Yes. Is it? Yeah. Sophie's craving gherkins. Yeah. Pickles. Yeah, pickles. She can't. She's absolutely obsessed with it. Sounds like you kind of know some things and some not, which is about right. Well, sort of my theory with all of this is that we never used to have books or social media or internet or anything at all. And so we just kind of learn as you go. Right. I think that feels like what's going to happen.

6:31But maybe I'm wrong. I don't know. So your plan is no books? My plan is nothing. Well, I think I'll consume a little bit. My plan in life has always been no business plan is the best business plan. so just going into it without really thinking about things so i feel like i don't know that could be a good idea i don't know do you mind i don't it's a wild west for me it is a wild west i'm nervous about the whole thing i'm scared about the whole thing i'm excited about the whole thing let's get into that because at in december we did an episode and you spoke about being a dad being something that kind of um has made you feel quite nervous and you spoke about how it was like the lack of control.

7:09How do you feel about that now? And what changed since December? Well, I think that's the big thing about, I think with maybe typically with more men, right? Is that, and this is my experience, is that it was really nerve wracking going into it because, or thinking about it because there is no control. And being a control freak, which I am, I love to control everything, my emotions, the things around me, things that are going on. I feel like I need to be in control of it. Um, so yeah, it was really, really scary. And, um, that was really scary to think about all those things, not being out of control, but also the biggest thing that was scared about was the responsibility without, with everything typically in life, you can drop it.

7:57If you want to go into the gym, you don't have to do it. A business, Worst comes to worst You can liquidate the business You can let the business fold Friendships, relationships You can kind of move away from them Anything But with a child Typically you sort of have That's the responsibility there for life And I really, really panicked about that And I just couldn't get my head around it I was just like Are you kidding me? I just don't That was the one thing I was like All of my friends All of the people I knew Were just look so tired and so worn down and they couldn't go to the gym and they couldn't do this and they couldn't do that.

8:35And that was really scary. And then I spoke to my dad and I phoned up my dad to ask him for advice. And I said, so I said, dad, so what do you, what do you think about kids? Do you think it's a good thing? And he said, well, I've got six of them. So you're one of them. I'm one of them. But he said the best thing And this changed it all for me He said, well If I Had never had kids You and I wouldn't be having this conversation And I went, oh my god That's so right And I've always been someone in life Who has always just done it Climb to the top of the tree, I'll do it Go Running with the balls and pamphlet I'll just go and do it you know starting business I'll just do it I've always just done things and do I want to go through life and thinking god wouldn't maybe I should have done that like what if what if what if and if I hadn't have done that then I would never know what a conversation is like to hopefully have with my son or daughter whoever it is like my dad did with me so that was the turning point for me and so since then when was that beginning of this year okay and so since then I've sort of succumbed to it.

9:50And it's with all these things, it's like with worrying about exams or anxiety or everything. When you take away the fear from it and you just accept it, that kind of makes it a bit more free, I suppose. So I'm now in a space where actually I'm nervous and scared, but I'm also excited where I used to just fear it. Does that make sense? That makes a lot of sense. Okay, well there you go. So you're feeling anxious about it? Oh, I'm shitting myself still. I'm absolutely... about the same things or is it has it changed um i just want a healthy happy baby and everything else is a positive that's all i care about okay right now and i don't know that that's the thing which i think most people get scared about right is that that's just you just want a healthy happy baby it's all you want and if they're healthy and happy okay that's that's fine that's all i care about so it's a really beautiful amazing time but do i feel prepared to be a dad no like i can't even drive like I but you know I need a license for that don't need a license to have a kid it's wild it's wild yeah it sounds like the fear has moved from the fear of control to now it's a bit more focused of like okay this is happening I don't want to help you healthy happy baby yeah how are you managing that well I think I think life and God and whoever whoever created all of this or whatever reason this was created I really truly believe the reason why we have nine months from conception to giving birth is so people can get their heads around the fact that they're actually going to have a baby.

11:22Trust the process. You slowly trust the process and you slowly get into it and you slowly kind of go, okay, fine, this is actually happening. Because when Sophie told me... Yes, I want to know because in December we obviously spoke about when she thought she was pregnant and you left the restaurant. And I actually left the restaurant, yeah. Which was... Not a good move. Yeah. How was this time when it was real? Yeah so if you haven't listened to that episode that Jemima and I did Sophie thought she was pregnant before Christmas And it really shook me I was not prepared for it And I was so anxious that I had to leave the restaurant Which is not a very good thing to do to your partner Especially in those situations And then When she told me I said to her the one thing I really Would love you to do is to film Film it So she did film it Why did you want it filmed?

12:12Because I just love capturing everything okay i for me i like to watch it back yeah i just love it i love it like i have a really good memory but i also have a bad memory and i get like and pictures for me and like videos my dad and my family like always like we filmed me growing up right with like video cameras i had a video camera the whole time wherever i went so i love capturing everything um and when she told me i was uh it's like an amazing moment of like are you kidding you kidding me what and it felt like the same moment when I proposed where you feel like you're slightly floating and I can only imagine that's like severe anxiety that goes through your body but also excitement at the same time so it was just an amazing beautiful moment it was insane it was insane and you didn't leave and I didn't leave which is the big thing I stood my ground I went I'm so excited really yeah and I was excited and I wasn't pretending or trying to put on a face I was excited but I just want to make it I just want to be a good dad yeah like that's the big I just want to be a good dad I just you said something earlier about um having nine months to prepare and you're like you know whether god or whatever it is gives us have you got more you because you've mentioned this quite a few times on the show about praying have you become more existential now because like life death those two things when you lose someone or when someone new is coming into your life can make us really look at those two ends and get it have you got more existential yeah i i pray um i try and pray every morning and every night and i i don't know if i'm um religious really i don't really know what I am.

13:41And I think being thankful for things is really important. So every night I go to bed, I thank for everything. And every morning I wake up and thank again for everything. And I just say simple things, you know, thank you for my health and thank you for my family's health and my friend's health. I always pray for the baby's health. And I just say, thank you. And I think if you constantly, if you're constantly thanking, I think then for me, you're almost believing that you're never believing the hype of anything because I'm very blessed. I'm so blessed right i have a roof over my head uh my wife has fallen pregnant um you know i can eat food i feel that's so lucky with all the things that are going on in the world and all the news that we hear and all the terrible things that are going on i feel very thankful and so if you keep thanking for all the things that are coming you're you're never getting too big for your boots ever you're never taking anything for granted you're always thanking it yeah also sounds a bit like you're kind of taking control of that situation oh maybe that's is it back to control again no but Maybe that's what it is.

14:38Like the anxiety of like you can't control and wanting to control and you're kind of like accepting that you can't control everything. But you're stopping and going. But I am thankful for this. I am taking a beat. Yeah. It's so important to do that. I swear to God. I just think that's really interesting when. I never did it. Yeah. Like the switch. Like it feels like lots of switches. The lighting system in your head is completely changing. The switches are different. I used to pray as a kid at night. Yeah, I did the same. Oh my God. I used to say, please keep us safe this night, secure from all our fears.

15:08May angels guide us while we sleep to morning light appears. And then I used to say, can that go for mummy, daddy, Sander, Emmy, Tash, Jem? I would go through my whole family and I would do it all. Even including my silkies, which are my teddy bears. I used to say, and keep silky and little silky safe. I would do that every single night. Every single night from about the age of six to 14. Yeah. And then suddenly it just stopped. Yeah. There's building healthy neural pathways as well, I think, doing that kind of thing. I think I was just anxiety and OCD at a young age, I didn't realise. Yeah, but also sounds like you're someone who always wants to like make, you've always wanted to make sure everyone around you is okay.

15:45Always, always. You'll be a great dad. Thank you, I hope so. So I'm talking about being a dad, what kind of dad is that you want to be. So on this show, we talk loads about, you know, attachment style and, you know, loads of things which have happened to us as a child, which impact who we are today. How does that make you feel bringing someone up, knowing when you look back and you're like, oh, I'm this because when I was a kid, this happened to me. You're going to be doing that to someone. I think I was a very needy child. I was very emotional. I think I still am very emotional. And I think I was also like a frustrated child as well.

16:25So I would throw a lot of tantrums and like be frustrated all the time. But I loved being hugged. I loved like just being told that it was, you know, I just, I loved all of that emotional side. So I think as a dad, I will probably be the same to my kid, which will probably be quite annoying. I mean, that's probably means the kid will repel. But Sophie's not very emotional like that. So Sophie and I actually work quite nice in a sort of pendulum. with each other where we sort of swing between each ways, which is quite good. And so one of each, one of each, I think you kind of need that. Yeah. What do you think that your dad did well that you would like to?

17:10My dad was always consistent, I think. And I think for me, and as you grow up, you don't, you don't realize that. Like I tell you, there's no, there are things that I've really learned growing up that I never knew before. So I wrote a letter to my grandmother and I found this letter the other day and I was terrible with money. I spent everything. And by the way, I didn't earn the money. My dad gave me the money. So he gave it to me as pocket money. I never earned it. It was never mine. Never went out and had to work in a shop. I was very lucky. He gave me, it wasn't a huge amount at all, but I had pocket money.

17:49and I wrote a letter to my grandmother asking for money from her and in the letter I said something like uh my train tickets are expensive and I'm running to you granny to like possibly have 200 pounds can you please send me 200 pounds you'll be the greatest grandmother and then I said I've asked my dad for 200 pounds and he said no and what a horrible thing that is I now look at it And I go, that is exactly the right thing to do. But growing up, I think I expected a lot. So I expected that you would go on holiday or I expected that you were just given. If you ask money, surely you'd just be given it.

18:37And so my dad said no to things. My dad didn't like me drinking that much. And so my dad was very liberal in lots of ways. But when it came to serious things, things that in later life, you know, you need to have control over. He was very strong with them. And for me, I really want to try and replicate that. I think it's so important to be a liberal parent for allow your kids to make their own mistakes. You cannot helicopter them. You cannot micromanage them, in my opinion. And if you do, if you restrict them from doing things, trust me, they're going to go and do it. 100%. They're going to go and do all these different things.

19:15And my dad never restricted me from really doing anything. But there were boundaries. And I knew I couldn't cross that boundary. But the boundaries were a good fence. And so you felt very safe in that place. And for me, that's a really good way to parent, I think. Just your kid is going to also grow up in quite a weird world because of who their parents will be. So they'll probably have quite a lot of things that other opportunities and things and have some sort of privilege. How will you kind of make sure you... I will definitely 100 % try and not spoil your children because if you grow up expecting, then that becomes a problem in later life.

20:10And I think work ethic is a really good thing. I try and understand why I have a good work ethic. My dad was an entrepreneur, so he was always going to work. But I definitely want to instill like you have to work towards something. And I actually think for me, sport did a lot of that. So I knew that if you put the work in to do something, at some point you would finally get it. And I think I kind of want to train that into my kids as well. Yeah, that's great. Is that a good thing? Yeah. Oh my God. Oh Jesus. Am I saying the right things? I don't know if I'm saying the right things. I think it's, yeah, I think your instinct to follow your instinct, I think people have a lot of opinions in this space.

20:48Okay. And like, you know, a lot of people have said, you just listen to your instincts. You just listen to your instincts. Well, we have with us today, your dad is actually here, Nick. Yes. Would you like to come on?

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22:41So this is my dad, Nick. Mr. Lange. Lange. Well, I mean... How do you pronounce it? Lange. Lange and egg. Oh! Lange. Lange. It's not laying. It's not laying, but it's near it. It's near that. I'm Lange and egg. Slightly, it's still wrong But that's alright This is my dad I've never invited him onto a podcast Don't really know why You don't love me Okay, come on Here we go The table's not going to turn It's all coming out But

23:16We've spoken about this part We can speak right here We had Amal Rajan on the podcast And we spoke a lot about dads on that and I realised that, you know, we had never had like a conversation about parenting or anything like that properly. And so I spoke about it on the podcast and it was kind of a very emotional moment for me. Yeah, and I think a lot of people were very invested. We've had so many people email in and say, Jamie, what are you doing? Well, father-son relationship is a strange thing, right? Yeah. What was Jamie like as a kid? Nightmare. Really? Absolute nightmare from beginning to end.

23:53It's starting. Tell us everything. It's starting to ease now. Oh, really? I think it is. I actually think it is starting to ease now. Come to me totally honest, how bad was I? Because baby one was, well, Alexander, who's older, your elder brother. So baby one was Tash, who, for my dad's first marriage. Baby two, Gems. Baby three, with my mum, was my brother Alexander. Fine. Then I was the next baby. But Alexander was an angel child. Still is. And still is. So I guess it makes sense the second one's going to be. A nightmare. A nightmare. Yeah, absolutely. But from the get-go? Yeah, yeah. I mean, I think it's, what was the horoscope?

24:30Beware the Scorpio born at dawn. He was born at dawn. I was a nightmare in so many ways. He came out a nightmare and just continued. And I used to steal things from my dad. Like, I used to steal money and keys. It was the house keys, and we found them down the drain. I used to steal things. I don't know why. It's mad How did you Did you understand Why he was like that Were there things That he would do Where you were like Oh I was a bit cheeky Well the answer is You didn't really Bother about Understanding it Just trying to Find the keys Yeah exactly That's hilarious You didn't even think You didn't think Why he was doing it Do you know what's so funny That it's so true Back then You wouldn't You know you're not thinking Like is there something Odd with this child No You're just thinking Where's he put the keys Where's he put the keys?

25:24And now we think different. And when I find them, I'm going to give him the rocket of his bloody life. That's true. Yeah. It's so true. But now we think, and maybe we overthink it. We think, oh, well, there must be something wrong with the child. Maybe there's something going on there. And maybe I was just, I was probably just a naughty kid, I think. Yeah. A lot of energy though. A lot of energy. Yeah. Needy, was I needy? I don't think you were any needier than any of the others. You just were different. But every child's different. Every child has their own characteristics. And whether one's good or one's bad, it's what they are.

26:04And you kind of roll with it. So then, in your opinion, what's the best way to parent a child, would you say? Don't read the books. Really? No. Why? Explain that to me. You remember your childhood. Yeah. Okay? I mean, the thing is, I mean, one of the most important things is you're not going to get it right. Okay? No one does. Perhaps there are a few exceptions, but most people don't get it right. You're going to make mistakes. We all make mistakes. And you will look back at your childhood, and there will be good bits. There will be bad bits for whatever, you know, different reasons. And you learn from the bad bits.

26:44I mean that's you know in sort of traditional societies it was the grannies who helped bring up the children because they've got the experience you know they've done it before so when you we've kind of lost that in our culture which I think is a shame yeah we did you were brought up by the village absolutely and they instilled you know into the child you know the culture and the parameters that you grow up with you don't need books in my view. No, it's actually interesting. That's an old-fashioned view, I'm sure. Yeah, but we've been through centuries doing that, right? And so there is a way of doing it.

27:22And I definitely think there's an argument to suggest that we are too overcome with information, that when there is too much information, we don't really know the good from the bad, the left from the right. And so it's like going through weeds and you're like, well, hang on, do I need to do this? Or do I need to do that? or what do I do here or what do I do there you don't really know what is right and everyone has an opinion yeah everyone everyone has an opinion which is a tough thing do you find that calming when he says don't read the books yeah massively yeah honestly massively massively that's what dads do calm you down and don't over protect yeah but how do you not do that explain that to me just it manifests itself in hundreds of different ways I think I mean I I look at parenting today, parents much younger than me, and they don't give their children the freedom they need.

28:21I notice it in so many ways. Even when it comes around to disinfecting kitchens or not letting their children scrabble around in the dirt and put their fingers in their mouth or get licked by the dogs who 10 minutes before have had his nose up another bottom.

28:39You build immunity. If a child gets its hands dirty and puts the dirt in its mouth, it's not going to die. It's fine. The system will deal with it. Let them do it. It's fine. You were quite liberal like that. You let us climb trees and you let us go on different things and you let us like everything. Everything. We lived on a farm when we grew up, and so it was just like a playground for a kid. You can't imagine growing up on a farm, what that is like, from hay bales to combine harvesters to lambing. I mean, it was a playground. And so many dangerous things. Well, you had a trampoline in the garden with no net.

29:24So if you bounced off, you bounced off. And I bounced off a lot. But it's true, you do, you become resilient. And you learn. because you bounce off once. You don't bounce off again. Okay, so can I ask you then another, so in your opinion, what are the don'ts as a parent? Don'ts. I think it's the, you've got to create parameters. You just touched on that earlier on. But within those parameters, I think you should allow your children the freedom to express themselves and forge their own paths. I think it's obviously age-related. When they're younger, perhaps they need a little bit more channeling.

30:12But as they grow older, they have to be able to express themselves and make their own decisions. Parents are making decisions for their children when children should be making the decisions. You should be there for advice. The one thing that you did care about was alcohol. you always had a thing about alcohol. Yeah, but that's probably because my dad was an alcoholic. Yeah. So I'm conscious of it. I wish you, that was one thing which I wish, I drank way too much in my 20s. Yeah, but you also spent too much money. Yeah, it's true. Yeah, it's true. It's true. It's true. How did you, just talking about letting kids make their own decisions, obviously Jamie made the decision to go on Made in Chelsea and then is kind of catapulted into this very public persona, which he's, you know, absolutely thrived and built this amazing career in.

31:08How was that for you? Because all of a sudden there's so many opinions about your son on TV every day. You're seeing him maybe doing things which maybe you wouldn't have heard about. Like, how did you find him suddenly being from public eye? As I don't do Instagram, actually. I don't know anything that's happening. Probably. But when he first went on Chelsea, how did you find him suddenly everyone knowing who your son was well because in in jamie's way he he rang up everybody he rang me and said that he you know had this opportunity should i do it he rang his mom said i got this opportunity should i do it he rang everybody you could think of saying he'd already made the decision

31:53he knew he was going to do it but he just needed that reassurance um yeah and then And when he did do it, and he's, you know, five years in, he's a known character. Was that hard watching or seeing? Be honest. Were there any moments which you were just like? No, not at all. I mean, you know, pinnacle of my career is, you know, Jamie Lane's dad. I've had my photograph taken. Jamie Lane's dad. I think there were moments, though. I think there were moments though where like I I was just not present I went for many years I wasn't present and dad finds it just to carry it dad finds it very hard to talk about like he dad's not an open book that's why coming on the podcast today is it's quite like a uh dad will come on talk about travel business he can talk about uh countries he's got a plethora of knowledge about different things, but talking about emotional side of things, Nick Lane is not good at that.

32:56A lot of people aren't. A lot of people aren't. But you can be honest, because it doesn't affect me one bit, but I was not present, and I wasn't always there for a lot of the period, was I? No. Yeah. You were. In your early 20s, you were on a different planet. Totally different planet. Yeah, we didn't see you. And you were fickle as well. You would say you would do something, and you let people down badly. and that was um that was not good yeah it's a really bad trait to have it's a big wake-up call at some points that's something i realized it and you don't realize it because you're being selfish and you think well if it doesn't bother me why would it bother the other person that's all you think about it wasn't good yeah but also it's letting people your kid make their decisions and yeah no no absolutely yeah dad never said anything he never said anything dad never you really didn't you really didn't like if I'm being totally honest you never said to me you're being an idiot you're being a bit of a dick or you're letting your family down you didn't really wouldn't have made any difference no probably wouldn't have at the time you know him but there wasn't any of that where my mum made it quite clear a lot of the time which made me retract even more a bit yeah because you were like well hang on so you don't know what I'm going through or what I'm dealing with or all the different things.

34:19So it was a sort of ongoing battle. Yeah. Can I ask? Possibly. You don't have to answer. When you and Jamie's mum separated, how was that experience parenting from when you're separated? That's a difficult one, which I'm not convinced I'm going to air on the show. Do you know what I can tell you about? The one thing about my dad, right? I've said this before. when parents separate right yeah you know as dad said in life people make decisions and people do things and it's no one's had a dress rehearsal they just you go into life and expect you know what life happens um and as a child i think you think that your parents have all the answers all the time and i always say this i think i always think that at 30 years old someone's going to open the door go come on in i've got all the secrets for you then i turn 30 and realize that everyone's guessing.

35:11And that's a scary moment to suddenly realize, right? But I tell you the one thing my dad has never done ever. My dad has never, ever spoken badly about anyone or anything during that time ever. None of my whole life, not even now. Not that he would. I spoke this one on Amal's podcast when I was with Amal, right? I had a narrative in my head that, oh, it was possibly more one side's fault or this is what happened. It's all nonsense. You know, people grow up and it takes two to tango, but as a kid, you don't realize that. And so for me, the growing up and realizing that everyone's just guessing and trying to do their best the whole entire time.

35:59Um, the fact that dad has never, ever said anything bad ever, never, said one thing. Never said one thing about my mum. Never said one thing about the separation. Never about anything and just always kept it to himself is hugely honourable, I would say. Because it's very easy during those times, especially with a kid who's a bit of a nightmare, who is being a... I said on Animal's Podcast, just being a bit of a dick a lot of the times. Dad just knew probably at some point it would come back round. Which I think it has done now. well that's that's why i want to ask you next you guys obviously have a really beautiful relationship but also i'm enjoying sitting with you both um but also he sounds like he yeah he was a bit lost in his early 20s and maybe you know wasn't as present as he is now was there a point do you remember what was the thing when jamie returned or jamie came back to or i mean you I don't think there was a definitive moment.

37:02It's been a sort of gradual progression that he's sort of come back. I have my little brother, George, who is 20 now, about to be 21 in August. He's at Edinburgh. He's the best. So my stepmother, Katya, who is just a brilliant person. That's George, who's my brother with Katya and dad. and he's like you know one of my best friends yeah in the world and i think he was the one that i just like loved hanging out with so much and being around and just being with and so that was like bringing me back to family a lot of the time i think from my side but going back to the parenting side you were very good with him with as a baby was i when he was a baby this he when he was a baby when he was little you absolutely bonded with him instantly alexander wouldn't even pick him up.

38:01Whereas you, you know, you were up, you were bouncing him up and down, throwing him in the air and, and, and, and giving him a hug, you know, when he was, you know, a year old, right from the very beginning. There was this moment where I was asked to look after him for the afternoon and he was very young. And, um, this was when dad, um, you know, dad came upstairs and said to me, he was like, just to let you know, I think I'm going to marry Katia, my stepmother. And my first answer was, don't have any kids. Straight away, didn't I say that? Yeah, you did. Why? You did. I don't know, because...

38:37It would disrupt the family unit? Yeah. Okay. I was emotional and, you know, I was... It would disrupt and I think, yeah, and I didn't... We're okay, we're here now. I don't want anything else coming in. Nothing else, nothing else. Let's keep it here.

38:54and thank God dad did not listen to me wouldn't listen to a 10 year old or whatever it was but thank God he didn't because then George was born and I was looking after him one day and my wonderful stepmother and I she probably had a bit of a handful with me because you know my mum was my mum and Katja was my stepmother and that was a bit this and that at the beginning and when George came along I was looking after him and he started to have a coughing fit and I thought oh my god he's gonna die and katia's gonna think that i've done this on purpose because i'm looking after him so i didn't know what to do and i was like help help and then he just stopped coughing i was like thank god terrifying moment this sweet little baby it's amazing oh um nick how did you react when jamie said that him and sophie were having a baby oh i was thrilled yeah it's the best news it's you know it's the most natural progression I suppose in the world it's so exciting yeah I told my dad how did it happen I we went to see my grandmother up in Scotland who's 92 is this Grandma Scotland Granny Scotland 94 94 about to be 5 there's a lot of fans of Granny Scotland who listen to the show you do yeah I saw it I was in the car And I had told my mom on the Friday, I think it was, and we hadn't told anyone else.

40:25And I then got in the car with my dad. I wanted to tell people face to face. That was my thing. I didn't want to do it on phones or stuff like that. And I got in the car and I told dad in the car when we were driving to see, it was quite late. I just picked me up from the station at Edinburgh. And yeah, you, you, you can't, it's an amazing thing. it's like the reaction when you tell a parent that you yourself are having your own kids, it's unbelievable. And dad just smiled. You didn't say anything. You did the same reaction when I said to you, I was going to marry Sophie. You were getting on your motorbike too, because dad drives motorbikes and he's getting on his motorbike.

41:05And I said, oh, by the way, I got one more thing to tell you. I'm thinking about marrying Sophie. And dad, the same thing, just smiled went at last yeah what's taking you so long i know but it's a it's an amazing i can't tell you it's like it's just a wild moment and for me son telling a dad that first you're getting married but also that you're having a kid yeah it's unbeatable i think yeah it's closing the loop you know yeah it is son becomes dad what dad why tell me now because i told you it said on the podcast right that you said that thing we um you wouldn't be having this conversation with me if you didn't have kids and how many times did i phone you saying is it a good idea kids how many times a week we had that conversation a number of times over a number of years i have to say yeah no no no we did why do you think it's why are kids a magical thing to have if you can have kids or want kids there are some people out there who can't have kids i know i know exactly Um, and when you've got kids, you understand that's very sad for them.

42:14Um, but lots of people don't want kids for whatever reason it is. For me, I, it's so magical. It's, um, they're part of you, you know, you know, I created you. Well, two of us did. um and and and it's flesh and blood and and the excitement of watching a child grow and develop is something that you can't really explain because you know you start there's this little sort of squeaking ball and of nothing and and then you start to walk and then you start to talk properly and then you go to school you wear your uniform and you you know you've grow up and become you don't because you'll get me going that's not allowed dad that's not allowed and then I'll go and that's just weird that is not allowed on this that's not allowed dad none of that that's so beautiful none of that part no it is allowed on here you can it's the one rule no you're allowed your whole run was about it's allowed to do that yeah yeah yeah yeah Yeah.

43:28That's really beautiful, Nick. Your heart running around. You're going to have to talk for a second. I'm going to have to. You've got another question. Let me go through this whole thing. Any baby names? I'll tell you what it is. Making, and I won't be able to look at that, but making your, for me, making your parents proud is... Yeah. Well, I was going to ask you that, but I don't actually think I need to ask if you're proud of Jamie because everything you say, it makes it. I'm proud of all my children. Yeah. Because each of them, I mean, okay, I know he's famous, but each of them in their own way have achieved, you know, what they wanted to achieve.

44:10And that's the great thing. They're all completely different, which is lovely and a joy. Yeah, a load of him would be quite a lot for any parent. Can you imagine?

44:26wonderfully as he is one is enough one is enough okay well i'm just gonna i've got a few last little any tips for jamie okay um so when sophie goes into labor and any do's don'ts that's a conversation in itself it's the most amazing moment possibly in your life to see your child born. And it depends sort of which end you're standing, obviously. I'm going to be fully down. It's whether you're down the rough end. I'm going to be fully down the end. Oh my God. I would be fully down that end with a GoPro on. I would be going hell for leather. I can't wait to see every single bit of it. But that's, I, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

45:17I'm in. I'm in. I'm in. I'm in. Okay. And then I just want to ask, these last few months that Jeremy has with Sophie preparing for this baby, any things, you know, like not to take for granted or to like... This last few months? Yeah, pre-baby. Last few months, enjoy every single second because from the moment it's born, your life changes forever.

45:46forever there's the anxiety back full circle back to the anxiety but in a beautiful way sometimes

45:58it's hard work it's hard work to begin with it's hard work you're tired I get that but I can be tired I'm fine with tired and I'm fine with playing whack-a-mole but the one thing I don't want to do is I want to still I think the one thing that I hear from a lot of couples that they say, oh, we had to learn to fall back in love again. And for me, I just want to make sure that Sophie and I are always the priority. And then there's also the baby as well. It's not going to happen. Okay, well, I'm good. It's like my idea. I'm out. The baby is the priority for Sophie. And you are on the sidelines. Just get used to it.

46:38Okay. You know, you'll be brought back in again. And don't argue back. No. No. No. That's the one thing that I... Just, you know. And do your bit. Which is? Whatever it is. Whatever works. There's no right or wrong. And I think in the early days, it's the baby and the mum who are together. She's breastfeeding. There's not a lot you can do. So just give her the support Bring her the tea Be there for her When she needs you And she won't But yeah, be there When you can Thank you Dad, you're the greatest You really are Is that it? No more? Second episode? I want to say this though You're the greatest You are the greatest dad in the entire world.

47:39I don't think so. You really, well, for me you are, and I know for all of us, he will try and shut it down, but you really are. You're the greatest person. All of us as kids love you so much, beyond. And I said it almost for a second, but if I ever was not quite present over that, I am sorry. And I love you very much. I can't wait to have all these years ahead of you with not just me, but the little baby as well and Sophie and everything. it's going to be the most magical thing ever. Do you think it'll have blonde hair like you?

48:13Thank you so much for coming on. Thank you so much. It's been amazing. That was lovely. That was amazing. Thank you.

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