LL COOL J: BECOMING THE GOAT

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1:00If you're a smoker or vapor ready to make a change, you really only need one good reason. But with Zinn Nicotine Pouches, you'll discover many good reasons. Zinn is America's number one nicotine pouch brand. Plus, Zinn offers a robust rewards program. There are lots of options when it comes to nicotine satisfaction. But there's only one Zinn. Check out Zinn.com slash find to find Zinn at a store near you. Warning, this product contains nicotine. Nicotine is an addictive chemical. Hello everyone, we're Jamie and Sophie. You may remember us from Nearlyweds and then Newlyweds. But now guys, things are about to get even wilder as we take on our biggest adventure yet, becoming parents.

1:42Yeah, that's right. Newlyweds is now Nearly Parents and we're bringing you the same honest, heartwarming takes on our journey to parenthood, I guess. Join us as we find out what it really means to become a family while trying not to kill each other. Get ready for Nearly Parents, your favourite new podcast.

2:05Hello everyone, my name is Jamie Lang and this is Great Company.

2:13Okay, good. Excuse me, ready, steady, go. Hello everyone, welcome to Great Company. Great Company. My name is Jamie, I'm going to kick it straight off. I'm the host of the show and you are? Jemima, the producer. You're the producer. We are a little bit giddy today because? Oh, we're heading out the studio, guys. We have a big guest on today and what's really exciting is the reason we are getting these big guests is because of you, the listener, who is subscribing to the show and loving the show, that means we can get these bigger guests. So today we have LL Cool J. LL Cool J. Now, if you don't know who LL Cool J is, actor, musician, big American star.

2:50He's a big deal. He's a big, big, big deal. When we mentioned to the team, everyone got pretty excited about it. And even to the point where some people had holidays, were thinking about changing holidays to be in the room with LL Cool J. Yeah. So the room, if you're watching or if you're listening, might sound a little bit different because we are recording in a different studio, which is also quite exciting. It's very exciting. I'm really excited for this one. This is our first international guest. Shania Duane. This is our second international guest. We've had. It's our first guest out of the studio.

3:23It's our first guest out of the studio. Fingers crossed we remember to press record, guys. Oh my God, imagine if we didn't. Hey, before we get into LL, I just, let's calm ourselves because I've been reading through some of our emails. Love this. So I asked, we call our listeners owls. Well, I call our listeners owls. Jamie's quite reticent about calling you that. original wonderful listeners or our wonderful listeners. You don't have to be listening since the beginning. But I've recently discovered that another podcast calls their listeners Owls. So we can keep calling you Owls, but I've asked people for some more suggestions.

3:58How random is that? I know, I know. That's really unique. Yeah, older and wider listeners. Wow, okay. From a different, from Jenny E. Clare's podcast. But... I did Sewing Bee with Jenny E. Clare. I love Jenny E. Clare. I did Sewing Bee with her. Maybe we should get her on. You did the Sewing Bee? Yeah. What did you make? No, I didn't do Sewing Bee. You'd be awful at the Sewing Bee. I did the pottery show. Sorry, not Bake Off. You're not talking about Bake Off. I've done Bake Off as well, but I did a pottery show. You did a pottery throwdown? Yeah, I did that. What did you make? Christmas episode.

4:28What did you make? I can't really remember, but I did it with Jenny Eclair. Wow. Anyway, we've had some people write in, and one in particular I really enjoyed. So this is from Nicky Berry, as written in, to our email, which is... Greatcompany at jamppoproductions.co.uk. Okay, everything in the show description. Exactly. And they said, may I take the liberty of suggesting that as we are in great company, our listeners might be known as companions. Don't mind it. Don't mind it. I still love owls, personally. Yeah, it's a bit better. I think we should go for some animal form, but companions... I just like that.

5:01It's a bit meh. Okay. It's okay. Sorry, Nikki. Sorry, Nikki. I love your suggestion and I love your email, but I'm not... You're not sold on it. It's going to go in the box of that is a good suggestion. Okay, good suggestions, but it's not knocked owl off the post. Not knocked the home run yet. Okay, that's fine. Well, if you have any more suggestions, do let us know. Is that the only suggestion email we have? Oh, there was another I've forgotten. Oh, perfect. So you're just pretending to read it off the computer. No, I just really like that one. I really wanted to bring that one to the table.

5:29Well, if you do want to send us email... I like owlets. Okay, maybe. Baby owls. If you want to send us any suggestions, you can. You just send it into our email or slide into our DMs at Great Company Podcast. And while you're at it, just click, click. It's a good selling right there. She's trying to say... Click and press subscribe. Or follow. Or follow. Exactly, because it does so many things for our show. That would be amazing. Okay, listen, are you ready for this? Yeah, let's buckle up our seatbelts. Okay, here we go. We're going out of studio. All right, here we go. Please welcome to the podcast, LL Cool J.

6:04What up, it's your man LL Cool J. I'm in great company.

6:12The big thing for me right now is that I was saying to your team and everyone, I don't even know what to call you. So I haven't said anything. It's one of those numbers. Do I call you LL Cool J? Just call me LL. I can call you LL? L works. Yeah. Okay, I'm going to call you. Because I was thinking about your name, LL Cool J. There is no way that I could ever pull that off in my life. It depends. I don't know. I mean, if you owned it, you owned it. I don't think I could ever own it. That's the only reason why, though. Ah. That's why. Because you just owned it straight away. 100%. Because, I mean, you know, I'm a little kid, 16 years old, and decided I wanted my name to be Ladies Love Cool James.

6:51I had all these other dudes. My man, Playboy Mikey D. This one's red hot lover. This one. This one's lover that. I'm Ladies Love Cool James. I mean, I just owned it, bro. Just go for it, baby. Make it happen. Wait, wait, wait. So there was Playboy who? Mikey D. Playboy Mikey D. Yeah, and then there was a couple of other dudes, Red Hot, like, Lover This and Romantic This. like in the neighborhood. We were all just coming up together. You know what I'm saying? That's the way, mine was jam pot. So what's wrong with that? That is not sexy. Like, that is not sexy. It depends on what pot you jamming, I guess.

7:24I don't know. It depends. It depends, bro. I mean, I feel you, but it depends. You know what I mean? It ain't the worst. It ain't the worst.

7:37So take me back to, because I need to get into your mind when you're like a kid, right? Yeah. you're like the OG and we're talking to my team the team I can't tell you are so excited especially Jacob he's so excited he can't and we're talking about what you've done and what you've created and it's amazing and staying relevant for so long where did your creative genius come from? truthfully where do you think? you have to have you have to love what you do and have the ability to do it okay Okay. So it's like, it's like, I don't care how many schools you put me in. I was never going to play soccer like Messi.

8:20It just was not going to happen. I wear size 14s, ridiculous, tripping over my, it was never going to happen. There's no universe where I could see that happening. There's no, you know what I mean? So what am I saying? I'm saying that I was just telling somebody earlier, if you, it's one thing to roll the dice on swimming the English Channel, but you better know how to swim. You could talk that LeBron talk. You could talk about you playing basketball all you want. But LeBron was born to do it. I would argue that not every guy who made it that far was born to do it. He was born to do it. Jordan was born to do it.

8:55Kobe Messi was born to do it. Like, there are guys that were just, you know what I mean, were born to do what they do. And I think that that kind of is the difference. And now, how do you find that thing? You find it because you follow your passion and what you're truly inspired to do. And then you learn all you can about the thing that you're truly inspired to do. And you consistently educate yourself in the area of your inspiration. A lot of people don't do that. A lot of people are afraid to follow that internal North Star inside of them. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, but Alan, most people don't follow a purpose because they feel like they're too, like you said, they're too scared to do it.

9:31But you just said, you heard what you just said? Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. And I totally hear it, but they are too scared to do it because typically following your passion, it comes with like a lot of risk. Yeah. Like so much risk. But this is why people love sports, right? You can't win the World Cup unless you risk losing the World Cup. So what do you risk? Every time I put a project out, people could say it's trash. People could say it's stupid. Every time I put a film out, it could flop. Every time I put a book, anything you do, there's a chance that the public is going to not like it. I'm not even bat a thousand.

10:05I've had things that were panned, things that people hated. And you know what? It didn't stop me from moving forward. It didn't stop me because I did it sincerely. Maybe it didn't hit the mark and I kept it moving. I kicked at the goal. It didn't go in the net. I kept playing. I shot the shot. It bounced off the rim or I missed it completely. I kept going. It's like Kobe back in the days. He shot those shots and he airballs. You keep going. So it's like that's the thing. I think people get caught up in the idea. A lot of people get caught up in the idea of figuring out how they're going to do something perfectly so as to never have to suffer any sort of criticism.

10:44and that's like a huge mistake because you're you're basically letting the world dictate to you whether or not you're going to pursue your dreams but it's that resilience right you got to have that resilience you get knocked down eight times you get you get up 10 you just got to keep going you got to keep going and we don't have that in us we stay in like a safe lane because we're too scared right and live a life of quiet desperation right i think it was thorough who said that you live men live in quiet lives of desperation because they're not willing to go out and venture out on the road less traveled you know i'm saying and go after that thing that is that they want you know i'm saying so to me you gotta you gotta go after that thing you want but where did you learn that from was that your mom was that your grandma where where was it from so yes my mother my grandmother you know my grandmother used to always tell me if a task is once begun never leave it till it's done be thy labor great or small do it well or not at all say that one time if a task is once begun never leave it till it's done be thy labor great or small do it well or not at all and my grandfather was like you know this is a guy who shined shoes then worked at an airport as a baggage handler and then went to school for engineering so one minute you you know and my mother like put all of her energy into me and worked two jobs and you know was was was shot and they said she would never walk again and she walked again so you're around a lot of people that that resilience comes with it you learn early on that it's up to you it really is up to you yeah but dude i feel like that's it's an amazing mindset to have I read that your, you know, your dad, as you said, your dad had divorced your mom and he came back and he was so upset.

12:38Well, they separated. They separated, right? Yeah. But he was so upset that he. Yeah, he shot her and he shot my grandfather. Yeah. Yeah. Which. Yeah. Is a pretty heavy thing to experience as a kid. How old are you at that point? I was four, but I was there. Do you remember it? Of course. Absolutely. 100%. And, you know, you learn a couple of things, how to follow directions. Because my grandfather, he was a war veteran. He was in World War II. He told me, go back. He was shot. He was bleeding. Go back. Bullets are whizzing because it's a kitchen. So there's a side door. There's the sink. It's a small, you know, like think about a small house or flat.

13:19This is in Queens. It's in Queens, New York. Small house. Very small house. It's a house, but small. You got this. The door's right here. He's across beyond the door on the dining room floor over there bleeding. I'm walking here. I'm a little boy, so I'm beneath the sink. I'm walking. The bullets are hitting the refrigerator. Mother's laying right there. He says, go back. And he's bleeding and all that. So I said, he said, go back. Go back. So I went back. Went and got some towels. Went around another way in the house. Brought the towels to him. Gave him the towels. And he's like, you know what I mean?

13:53It's just like. that calmness in that in that moment of chaos he's calm he was calm and it taught me to be calm you know i'm saying and i was calm it was crazy does that do anything to you like mentally or do or do you just kind of do because i remember this is this is i can't even i'm trying to compare it but i'm gonna try when i was when i was about eight years old this car reversed into my mom Oh, wow. But it wasn't that bad, but it reversed into... Bro, it ain't contest to see you. A lot of bad stuff happens in the world, bro. It's cool. Tell me your story. Please, everyone feel sorry for me.

14:31My mom got reversed into my van. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Come back, mom. Yeah, yeah. But she did, but the whole... As a kid... It was devastating. Beyond. Beyond. Yeah. Beyond to where my mother, my rock, invincible yeah invincible yeah that she was suddenly injured on the floor yeah and i didn't and i i didn't know what to do yeah i was shouting for help i was screaming for help but you're saying you stayed calm in that moment you listened to your grandfather you stayed calm yeah yeah yeah and you know that's powerful it's it's it's strange it's strange but you know you learn early on man i don't know man it's uh we're all here for a reason you know and you know you look at the genre and you look at what happened with the hip-hop and the role I played in being one of the guys who helped moving around the world and helped do some things.

15:27I'm here for a reason. What do you think you're here for? Really, truly. I think I make people's lives better by giving them an escape. I think that there are doctors who do medicine, who provide one service biologically and physiologically. I think that me as an artist, I provide a service to the soul and to the emotions. I give people an escape from everyday life, maybe the toil of everyday life. People are janitors. People are delivery drivers. It's freezing outside. They're delivering stuff. Maybe they're, you know, they're lifting up crates. They're delivering sodas. You know, this, you know, yeah, we got all of this technology, but you still got people driving vans and delivering pepsi you know i'm saying and moving around and it's like i'm i help people's lives in that way you know write songs that help people that lock in time capsules for people's worlds that's a that's a contribution it's not it's not the most important but it's one of it's one of the things that you know is needed on our earth for us to exist for us to have some fun there's a there's a great thing which is um and i've said it before but socrates says there's two levels of happiness right the lower level is fame wealth all these things that we think we want to achieve and when we achieve it we're not that happy and the higher form is when you help others loyalty love and when you're doing something that actually you realize is helping other people that is like the best form of happiness it's incredible yeah it's incredible it's incredible because what else would be the purpose?

17:09Because, you know, if you think about it, see, this is the funny thing about money and wealth, and everybody, I agree, everybody should have a lot of stuff. I understand that. I am not delusional in any way. There's a guy right now, a family right now in a flat. Times are hard. Refrigerator's not as full as they'd like it to be. He may have gotten let go. She's in a city. I get it. I grew up, you know, staying at a refrigerator happy to have some food in it once in a while. So I get it. But also, the flip side of that is a lot of people want to have, the only reason they want a lot of money is to use some of it.

17:50They want all of it so they can use some of it. You don't even, the majority, think about it, savings. You don't even want to use it. You don't want to use it, bro. That's what we've been taught to do for some reason. Yeah, but if you think about it, it's crazy. It's crazy. It's like, yo, yo, it's like, it's like, it's like, um, let's put it in last meal terms. Okay. What do you want for your last meal? Tacos. Okay. Order them 500 tacos. Then they arrive. And now what? How many are you going to eat? Three. Okay. Do you need the other? So. Okay. But you're more important because you got 500, though.

18:37You feel better because you have 500. You only going to eat three. But you feel better because you got 500. It's the biggest goof in the world. It is. It's pretty funny. It's so funny. And what it is, which I totally agree with you, it's like life is about giving, right? It's so about giving. And we get mistaken. Give energy. Give love. Give wisdom. Give money. Give it all. And, you know, there's this big thing about how the Egyptians used to take the wealth with them. You used to get buried with their wealth. And we're digging it up every day. Totally, right? It's a crazy concept. Look at this necklace.

19:07Thank you. I say that respectfully. No disrespect, but it's like, whoa, King Tut. Nice mask, bro. There must have been a time in your life when, because you had so much success,

19:22albums, crazy amount of stuff, everything. You must have had a moment when that success almost got a little bit to your head. When you were buying things and you, and then there must have been a moment of realizations like what am I even doing here? So let me qualify this. I like money. I like having money. I'm a capitalist. I'm from the West. I'm good with money. I have no issue with it. I attract it. I like to share it. I like checks. I'm with all that. I want to wear jewelry. I love it. I like it all. So I just want to be clear about something. That being said, I only want what I can handle.

19:51I'm sorry. But how much can you handle? A lot, but probably not as much as I want. You know what I'm saying? Like really think about that. You can handle a lot, but probably not as much as you want, or maybe you can handle more than you want. I don't know. It's, you know, the question. I know what you mean. It's one of those eyes, when your eyes are bigger than your stomach. It can be like that, or it could be maybe you can handle more than you think you're capable of. But all I know is that as I've lived my life, by me, like, I'm a big, you know, I'm a big proponent in tithing. I believe. Do you know what tithing is?

20:26I'm a person that, you know, when I get money, 10 % of what I get, I give it to the church. Off the gross. Get out of here. Always. That's amazing. I give it away. So I'm like, you know, like the whole more money, more profit. I don't feel like, I don't have that problem. You can give me as much money as you want because I'm going to give some away. I'm not a hoarder. There are people, and there are lots of people who feel like they give in different ways. Maybe they're not knowledgeable in that area. You have people of different religions who do it in various ways. People love to give. Basically, the reason I'm telling you that, man, is because we're in this world to share.

21:04You know what I'm saying? Like, you can have a lot and share at the same time. Like, they're not mutually exclusive ideas. What you don't want is just, like, people taking it. That's where you got to draw the line. I'm very comfortable saying no, too. I had a lady, oh, Todd, yeah. She called me Todd. Do you do personal loans? No, I don't do that. No. No, no. No, I don't do that. Oh, okay. Is that how you say it? Yeah. Is that how you say it? No, no, I don't do that. I don't do that. I remember one time ago, I was a little kid by Pops, right? This dude was calling me up, asking me for something.

21:37He's asking me for money. Yo, Pops is so funny, man. These guys asking me for money, calling me all the time. He said, is that him again? I said, he said, man, give me that phone. He said, hey, what's up, man? The dude said something. He said, hey, listen, the bank is closed. Clack! And hung up the phone. Yo, the bank is closed. It's crazy. So on 4-3-2-1, I said, you know, my young son's on the side of the bar with Flo. It's a little shorty with the big mouth. The bank is closed. That's because my pop said the bank is closed on the phone to the dude. He's like, yo, the bank is closed. Click. Yo.

22:11I'm saying. But then at the same time, we could give. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. So it's like, you understand what I'm saying? I totally get it. Because there's a difference between being a kind, good guy and being a nice guy. I'm not trying to be a nice guy to be warm and fuzzy. Good guy, yeah, but nice now.

22:30Are you still friends with all the people that you grew up with? A lot of them. Some of them I need to, you know, feed out of a long-handled spoon for my own sanity. You know what I'm saying? But, yeah, for the most part. I think, listen, man, there's no reason, you know what I'm saying? You're going to outgrow people on some level, but on some levels you should be always connected to where you come from. No, because I was listening to something that you spoke about or a show that you were on, and you were talking about the fact that what you realized as growing up is that, like, connections is, like, the most important thing.

23:05And as I got older, I realized that connections is everything. Like, all the stuff like work and things like that we do is great. Oh, I got you. But you need connections, right? Yeah. So what I was saying is that the people you live with every day and that you work with every day and the people you're around, you think that you're around them more than the people that you're calling your family. But you're forgetting. You don't realize that these are your family. And these are real relationships. Like people don't like in other words, like I was on a show for NCIS, you know, for a lot of seasons.

23:39Right. So they have grips and electricians and guys who did other jobs behind the camera that I'm friends with. It does not matter to me whether they were on camera or not. We develop friendships. So what I'm saying is when you work with people, when you're around people, those connections really matter in life. you know i'm saying because we we kind of get caught up in this idea of like people having to qualify for friendship based on some kind of weird standard that you have subconsciously floating in the back of your mind and that has nothing to do with reality the reality is that these are the people you're around every day so you need to just be grateful for that and just treat people with love and keep it moving you know i'm saying yeah because it's one of these things right like not everyone has like a good family life but then you can go out and you can kind of find your friends and find your group and choose.

24:31100%. And you kind of, which is so strange to me, because sitting next to you now, we've never met. Dude, you got a good vibe. You got a great vibe. And you know what I tell you? You got to be a friend to get friends, to have friends, right? Yeah, yeah. Like, part of it is being a friend. But you said that you were a little bit like of a loner growing up. I was. 100%. And I'm still, because I'm, even though I'm a social guy and all that, I'm an introvert. I am introverted. So I like to go home and read. I like to, you know, I'm friends with a thousand books. You know what I'm saying? Like, I like to sit around and read and watch documentaries and, you know, and veg out and get recharged in my own brain.

25:05I like, you know, I grew up like I have little brothers, but they my father remarried. So I grew up in a in a single situations like, you know, as a child. I was the only child. So, you know, I'm not really. So I am alone in that respect. But that doesn't mean I can't maintain these friendships and these relationships. and what happens as an introvert, when people are introverted, it takes a little bit more time to learn how to be friends with people. But explain that more to me. What do you mean by that? So what I mean is that as an introvert, you may not go to the poker game. You may not go to the party that you're invited to.

25:39It's not because you don't like them. It's just because when you go, you get drained or when you go, maybe you feel like, I just don't feel like going. It's not about not liking them or not wanting to be around people. You might just want to be home. But what you discover as you grow up is that, you know what, sometimes those moments matter to other people. And sometimes those moments mean something to them. And because it means something to them, sometimes you got to push yourself a little more to go to that event so that they, you know, they know that you at least got love for them and care about them.

26:11Introverts have that problem. Extroverts don't. Extroverts is out there. Hey, yo, I'm in the, yo, let's get it. You know, they love it. The more people around, the better they feel. but for introverts when they're in social environments it could be a little bit draining yeah in a weird way it's just very difficult to understand if you're not introvert but that's so because that's like a juxtaposition to like who you you want to like you've been in known since you were like 16 years old you're one of the biggest entertainers in the world across music across movies across television like that is like so much energy but yeah you're saying you're an introvert.

26:50Yeah. Because introverted does not mean antisocial. It just means that you're a person who enjoys solitude and enjoys recharging alone. And you're comfortable with that. So I don't mind sharing these huge dynamic bursts of energy with people through records, through concerts, through television shows, through movies, through all of this stuff because I love everybody. It's all love. It's just that when it's time to wind down, I'm very comfortable being alone you know what I'm saying? like I like to walk around you know naked you know yeah well yeah yeah you know yeah you know what I mean just walk around look in the mirror I love me you know yeah yeah look at me look at me look at me look at that me you know I have a mirror in my corner yo look at me look at me look at me gotta be the greatest this is no word of a lie gotta be the greatest Yo, if they do a silence in the lambs 3, look at me, looking at me.

27:54Yo, that's so crazy. I have a mirror. I have a mirror in my corridor and I get naked. And you know when you have those weird thoughts, I was walking towards it and I did a naked roly-poly. And as I got off, I went, that was weird. I was by myself. Yo, yo. Yo, that's too ill, man. Look at me looking at me with the roly-poly. Crazy. Crazy. So when do you feel most comfortable? Because I spoke to lots of performers and people and artists. And lots of people feel most comfortable on the stage. But it feels like you feel most comfortable with yourself, with a book, whatever it is. Where do you feel most comfortable?

28:31I feel comfortable both places. Really? Oh, yeah. Because especially when you're talking about the stage and all of that, because there's a purpose to that. Sometimes, you know, with the other stuff, you just have to be mindful. I'll give you an example. A lot of people work jobs and they're like, especially back in the day, a lot of people work remotely now. But for those who go to the office, you have some people, you know, you show up on Monday and now I got to sit here with you for three hours and tell you what I did all weekend. I don't feel like doing that. You know, like I don't want to talk to you about my entire.

29:04Yeah. So what did you do at noon on Friday? And what did you do at one thirty? And I was two thirty and three thirty. What did you do? So that's the part. Being introverted, you just want to be like, yo, how was your weekend? It was good, man. Yeah, yeah, all good. How was yours? You know, okay. Like, right there. Like, not because I'm introverted. Just stop. Right there. It's just like some people. You would hate me on the weekend. Yo, bro. Yo, bro. And then some people, like, yo, hey, how was your weekend? Yeah? What you doing? Yeah? And we went to this restaurant. Yeah? What you eat? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

29:35Why'd you choose that? Yeah, yeah. Did you like it? Yeah, yeah. Would you recommend it? It's just like, you know, bro. It just gets, you know, so that's the part where you get a little. So it's. But there's a big question there. Then what do you. Because that's like a question between being comfortable with who you are. And kind of not comfortable with who you are. I definitely. It is. It's true. I'm okay with that. I'm very comfortable with that. You're comfortable with being you. Yeah. You are. Because you can sit there. You can sit in silence. You can say a question. you can sit there and be happy with it.

30:06So where does that comfortability for yourself come from? I don't know, man. That's a big question. I don't know. I mean, I got faith in me. I got faith in high power, faith in God. I got faith in love. I grew up in a house full of books, bro. I mean, you just, you know, my mother and my grandmother is like, yeah. It's like, okay. No way. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. You know, I grew up like they used to get these things called the world book of knowledge back in the days. You know what I'm saying? you get the world book of knowledge. I'm sitting there also, and, you know, there's a volcano, and, you know, you just learn all this, you know, Mount Fuji.

30:42Like, you know, the other day, I'm looking at, oh, Mount Fuji didn't have snow for, you know, first time, first October in a century. Like, you just become like, you know what I'm saying, like, just having a good time with it. You know what I'm saying? With life. And so you just kind of... So you were just interested in getting knowledge. You just liked to gain all of that knowledge. You read books because that... Curious. Ah. Curious. Because, listen, if you're truly curious and you really enjoy books and you really enjoy reading and you really enjoy doing that kind of stuff, you go on journeys, man.

31:17I heard you read the dictionary. I used to read it. I used to read back of toothpaste tubes. I didn't even know what the words meant. I mean, you ever listen to some of my early songs, like the original Rock the Bells? I said, I must have been, I don't know, 17, misdemeanor cleaner, women are subpoenaed, no conjecture on my lecture. Name an adversary, Gina. promoter, my tongue revolves like a rota, wild style decoder, the cranium of Yoda. Like, I'm bugging out. This is all just kind of, you know, you know what I mean? I've been doing it for years for the world. You know what I mean? Your stepfather was pretty abusive to you.

31:47Yeah, he was. And your dad, obviously you made up with him, but male role models in your life seem to not really align to maybe what they should have been. I hear you. Mm-hmm. So how do you find your blueprint to be a good dad, a good husband, a good person as you clearly are? Because there's plenty of examples in the world. So who's your... You have to make your own. You have to make a... Like, what I've learned is that... Like, I'll give you an example. You know how Bruce Lee developed Jeet Kune Do by taking various martial arts forms and putting them all together? A little Wing Chun, a little American boxing.

32:26You know what I'm saying? A little Jiu-Jitsu, a little Judo, a little of this and that. and put it all together and made, you know, the way of intercepting fists. He made his own martial art out of that. So you can look at this particular artist and this particular athlete and this particular person and that particular person and say, oh, I like the way he treats that, that, and I like the way he does that, and I like the way this person does that. And then you make your own life, and you figure it out. You know what I'm saying? Like, listen, pressure, you know what I mean? It's like a pick and mix.

32:56Yeah. Is it amalgamation? Amalgamation, yeah. Yeah. It's an amalgamation of many people. You know what I'm saying? And then you decide, you know, what you're going to do. Because also you then recognize what other people have as faults, right? So you kind of go, I don't like this. I don't like that. Here we go. I'm going to be this person. And you then don't idolize just one person. That's right. Like, I'll give you an example. So like, like growing up, like, you know, when I was in my early teens, mid-teens, early teens, formative years, all the way to early 20s, I was in Harlem running around with guys that they make movie, gangster movies about them running around.

33:29But it's like I'm not looking at the hustling aspects of it. I see that, but I'm looking at the kindness. I'm looking at the, oh, you know, it's funny how a lot of tough guys I knew, they were the most gentlemen. They were gentlemen. Oh, give a homeless guy, give him a 50 or give this guy, like take care of this guy. Or, you know, it's the tough guy that I learned how to. See, the thing you learn, especially for me, Queens, New York, growing up where I grew up, is you learn how important manners are. and you learn how important being a gentleman is. And you learn how important, you know, when you don't walk around with your chest poked out, you have a better chance of surviving in the community.

34:07Yeah. It's the guys that want to be tough guys and want to be selfish and want to be, you know, like, I remember a long time ago, this guy got really angry out of me. He said to me, he said, yo, why don't you come up out of the store with one of them 40s or something, man? You know what I'm saying? And he was an older guy. and you know he got I said I kind of felt like he was trying to press me a little bit that's the way I took it so I didn't I didn't get it for him and then he wanted to fight and one of my dudes came like yo stopped him right you know calmed him down but the thing is when I think about it it's like I learned after that that sometimes it probably would have been better to say yo enjoy your beer man give him some love because he wasn't you know I'm saying like It's just...

34:56Funny you remember that as well. Yeah, you know what I'm saying? You just remember those lessons about being a gentleman and about sharing. I'm not talking about sharing where people are pressing you or extorting or doing anything where you're being weak. I'm talking about a real manly love where you share with people in a certain way. But when you do it like that, you know what I'm saying? Life is better for you, especially when you grow up in tough environments. You know, this is the UK. People out here can relate to what I'm saying. Yeah. Dudes in the street especially know what I'm talking about.

35:26You know what I'm saying? Yeah. It's like, you know, so the sharing and all that. Yeah, I get it. You learn just, you know what I'm saying? It's your respect. 100%.

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36:33Work smarter and faster with Upwork. Go to Upwork.com now and find your freelance expert. That's U-P-W-O-R-K.com. Post a job for free and get started today. Shameless is the Pop Cult podcast for smart people who love dumb stuff. I'm Mish and every Monday and Thursday I'm joined by my co-host Sarah. Hello, I am Sarah. Every Monday we go deep on a big culture story like why you love The Summer I Turned Pretty So Much or why you keep seeing so many celebrities announcing they have Lyme disease. On Thursdays we welcome you to the Quick and Dirty, also known as the biggest sugary headlines of the week.

37:07Our episodes have been listened to over 100 million times. Search for Shameless in your favourite podcast platform to see why.

37:20With the album The Force, right? It's 11 years, I think it is. Why now? And also on it, you know, the amazing collaborations you've done it, right? Eminem. Who, Eminem, you were like his inspiration. He dressed like you. He wanted to rap like you. And now for the first time, you're collaborating with him on an album. Amazing. It's big. It's amazing. It's big. Yeah, and I love that song. It's one of my favorites on the record. And, yeah, I just was really inspired working with Q-Tip, working on this project. You know, man, it just felt good to just do some music. But anyone who's listening to this, you can just feel it.

38:02I love it, man. It's like when, how do I describe it? It's like when you know that it's going to be a good night and you're ready for it. I love it, man. Because, yo, like, I don't know, it's fun. I mean, I'm just doing all this for fun, man. But why now? Why an album now? Because this is when the inspiration came. Like, Fife Dawg from A Tribe Called Quest came to me in a dream. You know what I'm saying? I promise you. I'm telling you the truth. I'm not lying. He came to me in a dream and said, Yo, that album you're doing is gonna be dope. But he was talking about another producer. You know what I'm saying?

38:35And actually, he was talking about Dre, because me and Dre were working on a project. But I felt like his beats were amazing. But my writing, I didn't feel like was on par with the beats he was creating. So I was like, ah. So me and him took a little bit of a pause and a little bit of a break. I needed to get my mind right. Then Fife Daw came to me in a dream. He was like, yo, that album you doing with Dre is going to be dope. I'm like, yeah. But then he looked at me like, and I was like, I wonder why he looked at me with that, you know, that Cheshire cat, that canary. Like he swallowed a canary.

39:03So when I woke up, I'm like, yo, I hit my man. I'm like, I'm thinking about Fife. So I can't call Fife because he passed away, man. He rest in peace. I call Q-Tip up. I'm like, yo, what up? He's like, yo, what up, big bro? I'm like, yo, come on, man. I said, I want to do an album, man. He said, well, what kind of album you want to do? I said, man, I want hot sauce, fried chicken, pickle juice, barbecue. I want to have the blackest barbecue in the world and invite the whole world to it, though. He's like, yeah? I'm like, yeah. He's like, all right, say less. So I got with him, and we made The Force.

39:40The Force is an acronym as well, right? Frequencies of real creative energy. when you thought of that you were like hey there we know it felt good yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah it felt right it felt right felt right branny there's an amazing story behind um mama said knock you out oh yeah of course of course because i you know was coming off of an album walking with a panther and it was um it was pan critically it did okay commercially it did well but it was pan critically people always finish and this and that and blah blah blah I told my grandmother what was going on. And she was like, ah, don't worry about it.

40:15Just go knock him out. I was like, oh. I was like, yeah. So then I just, you know, my man Bobcat had that loop. We up in my condo. We got, you know, 900 champagne bottles on the wall. We run around with an old English. And he plays the SB12 on it. And the room full of guys. I'm like, don't call it a comeback. And we just, the beers going up in the air. It was crazy. It was crazy What is the difference Having done the new album now To like back in the day What is the difference I mean there's a lot of difference right But what is in your mind the difference between the two now Not much Oh the music industry So back then when you were starting out With your friends and you were remembering numbers And waiting for someone To give you a chance compared to what it is like now Wow that's a really great question So I think it's so complicated.

41:13I know that's a terrible cop-out type answer. No, it's not, but it's a good one. But it's so complicated because, see, you got to remember, back then. It was free. The music industry didn't know what they had. So you're flying under the radar. Nobody sees you coming. You know what I mean? Yeah. It's like, you know, the FUBU Gap commercial. You know, it's just like, oh, yeah, whatever. Oh, rapper. Oh, yeah. Where's Cameo? You know. What up? You know what I mean? Like, oh, yeah, yeah, what's Cameo? You know, that kind of thing. Whereas now it's like, do you see what I see? You know what I'm saying?

41:52Now it's like, yo, yo, the feds is on us. You know, it's like, you know, it's a different. Because you can't hide anything. No, it's just completely different. It's just completely different. And is that good or bad? Neither. It just is what it is because it only becomes bad when it affects your creativity and it's only bad if you do Bad deals Then it's bad But it's good if you do good deals and you remain creative and you keep it moving So it's you know, because it's like a wave right you can be under the wave Embracing a reef with all your heart or you could be on top of the surfboard doing your thing So the wave ain't bad It's your position relative to the wave.

42:40Everything's about context in life. You know what I'm saying? That analogy. I like that. It's good. Also, apparently, you can say Rick Rubin's number off by heart, his mobile number. Yeah, yeah. No, it was the dorm room number. 212-420-0666. Yeah, I remember that. Why do you remember that to us? Because, bro, I wanted him to answer that phone, baby. I needed him to answer that phone. That's how bad I needed him to answer that phone. I need you to answer this phone, man. Someone listening here, someone listening here watching this, right? Like, that is the difference between success and not success.

43:17Just never taking no for answer. Knocking down that door. Yo, let me tell you something. The difference between success and no success, I know it's going to be crazy, but you can't be afraid to be a pain in the ass when you're trying to make it. And then when you make it, you can't be a pain in the ass. Yeah. I'm telling you. You know what I'm saying? I heard you coined the term GOAT. I did. Greatest of all time. I took Muhammad Ali, Greatest of All Time, and Earl the Goat Managot. He's a street ball player in New York. He was famous, the GOAT. And I took the GOAT and the Greatest of All Time and made the acronym.

43:55And then I made an album in year 2000 called The GOAT, featuring James Tossman, Greatest of All Time. And I put it out, and then that slang kind of went global and worldwide. Do people know it came from you? I mean, some people do, but most people ask me honestly like you ask me, because nobody can remember where it came from. Everybody's just assuming, how could it be somebody? But I did make it up. Yeah. I mean, check out the album. It went number one. I believe you. The GOAT. You're just a pure entertainer. You know one of my favorite movies in the world? You approached 100 times any given Sunday.

44:34Oh, yeah. Oh, that was wild. Oh, yeah, yeah. Oliver had us going crazy and that. And plus, you know what I'm saying is we were sniffing antihistamine. You know, pretended it was another drug, so we had to sniff the antihistamine. So we was running. Yo, sinuses was clear. After a while, he was like, whoa. I don't know what we sniffing up at this. After a while, yo, we was sniffing that antihistamine. And then, yo, we running around in the locker room. Yo, it was crazy. It's your man, Oliver Stone. That's your man. It's your man, Oliver, man. You know? Yo, Oliver's so funny. Why don't you maintain an air of mystery, huh?

45:11You're just walking around. You know the way Oliver was on that set? Bananas. Yo, I love Oliver, man. Yo, forgive me, but I got to tell you this more story. Yo, Oliver. I love you, Oliver. Please forgive me. I got to tell this story, though, bro. We in there, man. So we on the set, right? Oliver's smoking a joint, right? So he's sitting there. So somebody's like, yo, people looking like, look at Oliver's pants. His pocket is smoking. People are like, what's going on? He had put the joint in his pocket without putting it out. Yo, his assistant is beating on his pants. His pocket is smoking. Yo, Oliver put a lint joint in his pocket, man.

45:52Yo, gone, B. Out of control. Out of here. Out of here. Yo. Don't direct yourself, Al. He's talking to Al Pacino. Don't direct yourself. Al's like, Ali. You should have said Al Pacino. Yeah. Yeah, we hung out, went to dinner. Good guy? Oh, he's a great guy. He's so funny. He's so great. Gives. Gives. A loving dude. The best. I mean, he's acting, and I'm sitting there like, I'm like looking at him act. And at first, I'm like, does he remember his lines? And then all of a sudden I'm like, yo, every line is coming out so new and fresh that it's almost like you think he forgot the line. He's so good.

46:36Yo, every new thought is so new that you're like, yo, it was unbelievable working with him. He's amazing. So forget about it. He's amazing.

46:48Oh, listen, I could sit with you for ages. You've been doing this all day. So unless you want to do it all day, I'll sit there all day with you. We like to end with eight questions. Okay. Quick fight. Okay. You can be as honest as you want. Okay. What's a saying or phrase that always makes you smile or cheers you up? Get money.

47:10Whatever. That little Kim Jr. Why for your record? Come on. Get money. Love that. Love that. Best compliment anyone's ever given you? I love your music. And I'll tell you why. Because I was a teenager. You know what I'm saying? and I was in a McDonald's just standing there getting a shake, and I only had about three songs out. And the girl said, hey, I like your music. And it made me feel like, oh, I have music. Not just a song. Music. It made me feel recognized like I had a body of work. It was a very different... It's very different when somebody says, I like that song. When they say I like that music, that was a wider, deeper compliment for me as a little kid with three songs out, you know?

47:54And it's your true love. Yeah. Yeah. What scares you most about yourself?

48:02I'm not afraid of me. Good answer. When was the last time you cried and why? Um, was it Yellowstone I was watching? I'm trying to figure out. I'm trying to figure out. It was one of them scenes. Get out of here. I promise you, one of them scenes or something. Was it 1820, 1820, 1893? I'm not sure. one of them shows and like something happened to do was like i want to do it i was just like he's i want to make it and i was like oh i was like my eyes feel heavy right now this is weird now they didn't even you know kind of snuck up on me i cried at there's an advert about a bank in the uk where someone leaves their scarf on a bus and i cried yo i'm gonna tell you i'm a super foul y 'all gotta pardon me the funniest thing i ever cried to be for no reason maybe just like a Sylvester Stallone daylight man they're in the tunnel human beings working together

49:00it's bananas yo that's bananas bro yo they're working together and you can feel that like Mine's always on a flight. When I'm on a flight, I'm like, whatever. Oh, God. What's something you can't let go of? God. What's something you'd be embarrassed for people to know you like or want? Nothing. It is what it is. Search history wild, B. Go on, check it out. It's what it is, bro. Hell, everybody crazy, man. We all, everybody's out of their mind, bro. That's it. Like, at the end of the day, if we all had cartoon bubbles above us that typed out what we were thinking and what we were doing, it'd be crazy.

49:47Everybody would be different. So, nothing. What turns you off? Arrogance. And that pompous kind of spirit. I don't like that. Because it has nothing to do with talent. What turns you on? Good energy. Sexual energy. You know what I'm saying? If you weirdly talking about it. You know what I'm saying? Like, you know. But, you know. Oh, yeah. I know what you're saying. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Just keep that. Yeah, simmer down. Hey, okay. I'll chill out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, simmer down, baby. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Shit. This ain't Brokeback Mountain, bro. You know what I'm saying? This ain't the Brokeback Interview B.

50:29You know what I'm saying? Make a remake. Oh, my God. What do you like most about yourself? The fact that I still love people and I didn't get caught up in the, you know, the fantasia of fame and fortune. You know what I'm saying? Like, last final one. Favorite ever lyric you've written? Oh, wow. I mean, don't call it a comeback. It's pretty hard to beat, man. That's a pretty hard line to beat. You know, in a lot of genres. Don't call it a comeback. Pretty rough. That's a pretty rough one right there, man. It's pretty good. Yeah, yeah. Al, you're the GOAT. Thank you, man. Much love, bro. Appreciate you.

51:07That was amazing. Thank you so much. Thanks so much.

51:15Wow. Wow. Oh, yeah. Did that knock you out? Oh, yeah. That was fantastic in every single way. That was amazing. Yeah. Professional, unbelievable. I was a little bit nervous in that situation, but I think we did. As you should have been. Okay, good. But I thought it was great, right? Yeah, fantastic. Fantastic guest. Very, very exciting. Listen, I'm so up on energy right now and adrenaline that I don't think I can debrief right now apart from well produced. I hope you have fun in the edit. Thanks. And well presented. Thank you so much. And to everyone who listened, if you can subscribe or follow this show, it takes a click of the button.

51:47It means so much for us. And if you want to send us any suggestions, any questions at all, you can send it to greatcompany at jampopproductions.co.uk or you can slide into our DMs at Great Company Podcast. Everything is in the show description. Well, thank you. Thank you. So much for listening. Thank you to Jemima. And we're going to see you next week for another episode of Great Company.

52:20Hi, this is Knox from the Popcast with Knox and Jamie. And maybe like us at the Popcast, you also know people who have been smokers or vapers. And Zen is the one product it seems like everyone is talking about. Because there are many good reasons to make a change to Zen nicotine pouches. Reasons like Zen nicotine pouches are still America's number one choice for smoke-free, hands-free nicotine satisfaction. And you can choose between 10 varieties, each variety available in either 3 or 6 milligrams. Check out zen.com slash find to find Zen at a store near you. Warning, this product contains nicotine.

52:52Nicotine is an addictive chemical. Shameless is the pop cult podcast for smart people who love dumb stuff. I'm Mish and every Monday and Thursday I'm joined by my co-host Sarah. Hello, I am Sarah. Every Monday we go deep on a big culture story like why you love the summer I turned pretty so much or why you keep seeing so many celebrities announcing they have Lyme disease. On Thursdays, we welcome you to the Quick and Dirty, also known as the biggest sugary headlines of the week. Our episodes have been listened to over 100 million times. Search for Shameless in your favourite podcast platform to see why.

53:36Thank you.