NICK MOHAMMED: How Comedy & Magic Helped Me Survive the Playground Bullies

0:00I could survive the playground by just getting out of deck of cards. Because you started doing magic at four years old. Yeah. Look, I'm short and brown, you know, grew up in the north of England in like the 90s. I could sort of entertain them and just sort of keep them at bay a little bit. And that felt like a superpower. And even the teacher, I remember Mr. Piper saying, Nick, get your cards out. Nick, that is wild. Do you want to do something now? Please. Okay, I believe the card you chose was Jack of Clubs. Do I pick it up? Isn't that mad? No! Isn't that mad? What? Isn't that mad? Hi, I'm Nick Muhammad and I'm in great company.

0:34Please welcome actor and comedian Nick Muhammad. Wow, a traitor. Can we talk about traitors? We can. It was just the most exhilarating experience of my life. Joe. You have no chance of knowing it. I should say about Alan as well. I would love to do an audition with you. So this is Braveheart. You've come to fight as three men and three men you are. Then they may take our lives, but they'll never take our freedom! This industry is definitely surrounded by its healthy share of rude people. Have you seen it firsthand? Yeah. Wow. They were notoriously rude, and it was gross. It was just like watching a school bully.

1:19Can't wait. Who was it, Nick?

1:26You stopped waiting for permission and started building yourself, your dreams, your credit. Experian Boost could turn your on-time payments into instant FICO score gains. Every bill you paid could become proof of your power. Self-made? Absolutely. Self-funded? Experian could help you get there. Download the Experian app today. Results will vary. Not all payments are Boost eligible. Some may not see improved scores or approval odds. Not all lenders use credit information impacted by Experian Boost. See Experian.com for details.

1:58Guys, welcome back to Great Company. Today's episode is a big one because we have Nick Muhammad on the show. He's a comedian. He's a writer. He's an actor. He's been in Ted Lasso, one of the biggest shows in the world at the moment. He's incredible, and he's also a magician, and he performs tricks on the show today. It's an amazing episode. We talk about so many different things, about bullying growing up. It's all in there. Before we start, if I can ask you one quick favour. If you could possibly subscribe to our show. It's completely free and it takes one second. It means we can keep making a better show.

2:24It means you join the community of all the incredible people who are following us. And it allows you to get an alert each week. Okay, you ready for that? Here we go. Enjoy this amazing episode of Great Company with Nick Muhammad. Nick, auditions. So you're comfortable in auditions? Yes, yes. I try to be now. Okay. I try to be. Well, I would love to do an audition with you. Okay. Who's auditioning me or you? We're in it together Okay And I don't know if you've ever Watched Braveheart Is it the freedom speech? It's the freedom speech Okay, yeah You're going to play William Wallace Okay Who's played by Mel Gibson Yeah Slightly contentious character I know In the 90s Yeah, yeah Everyone loved him in the 90s We loved him in the 90s Not so much Not so much Yeah So you're going to Play him I'm him Okay In the remake I'm playing the sort of Side character You don't have that much to do, Jamie.

3:16That's fine. I'm happy with that. I'm the casting director. You're coming in for an audition until you're walking into the room. Okay, so here we are. Hi, who are you? Hi, Jamie. Nice to meet you. Thank you so much for seeing me. I really appreciate it. Big fan of your work. Thanks so much. You've seen my movies. I've seen all your movies. I'm Nick Muhammad. Hi, Nick. Nick, yeah. We've seen you in a couple of things. We've seen you in Ted Lassay. Great in that. Well, congrats on The Traitors. Thank you very much. Thank you. Did you watch that? Loved it. loved it very much so you're playing William Wallace today yes if that's okay that is fantastic I've prepared it in a Scottish accent I hope that's right I could do it Japanese if you want but I think whatever whatever whatever the art takes you you should go with it okay here we go okay I'll just have a tiny bit of water now I am nervous sons of Scotland I am William Wallace William Wallace is seven feet tall Yes, I've heard, kills men by the hundreds.

4:15And if he were here, he'd consume the English with fireballs from his eyes and bolts of lightning from his ass. Ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha! I am William Wallace, and I see a whole army of my countrymen here in defense of tyranny. You've come to fight as free men, and free men you are. What would you do without freedom? Will you fight? Fight? Against that? No, we'll run. And we will live. I fight and you may die Run and you'll live at least a while And dying in your bed many years from now Would you be willing to trade all the days From this day to that for one chance? Just one chance to come back here And tell our enemies That they may take our lives But they'll never take our freedom!

5:05I apologise to any Scottish listeners for my very bastardised attempt at your beautiful dialect. That was fantastic. Can we talk about traitors? We can. Have you been asked to do it? I'd love to see you on it. I would love it. Come on, Jamie. I know the booker, I'll ask. I'm trying to ease my way towards it. I actually wrote about it. Did you? Yeah, I wrote about that final scene. I think you put a really kind Instagram post. I think I remember seeing that. Yes. Because it was just, it was so beautiful because Alan, obviously being the traitor and as an audience, you know this throughout, of course you do, right?

5:47So it's panto. And so obvious when you watch it back. And probably not in there, right? You probably don't see it as much. I mean, categorically not. No, no. But what was so incredible about it is that I think Nick, you felt so wise throughout and you felt, it felt like as an audience member, you had ever, you were like, I know everyone's number I've got this I thought I'd worked it out You thought you were You were playing this Amazing game And when it got to that last bit It was almost like You were looking at Alan Going We've got this Yeah Oh it was so that Because Alan Alan was one of I should say about Alan as well He brightened up Every single day Of that whole experience And I was there for like You know Nearly three weeks It's a long time to spend When you get to the end Yeah And there is a psychological And my wife was just so Phenomenal Because we Obviously we discuss anything That I am going to take on which is possibly going to take me away from home but we were both such big fans of that show but there was a weird psychological thing of and especially with the kids of like you don't you don't know when you're going to go you know whether you're a traitor or a faithful you know your time could be up on day one or day two it could be up you know after three weeks whatever so that was a slightly odd thing but we were like both okay let's just go it's mad like the whole thing is mad i can't believe it felt like are you not competitive well like yes and no i want it i think once I got into my groove I want I'm like oh this is actually I like this I like this and and I'd never done really anything as me I mean I'd done Taskmaster but even then I sort of put Dracula makeup on because I was still a little bit uncomfortable being me um whereas this was just you know warts and all and you very quickly I mean you'll know from reality telly but you just very quickly sort of get numb to the cameras actually and you end up just being quite why are you so afraid to why why do you feel so because having met you now you're the most charming, most easy.

7:33I wouldn't say it's fair. I think it's just more about wanting to just keep something of myself separate. And because I want to act as well and I do character stuff, I don't want to kind of give too much away because I think you know, there was one bit of me when I was offered traitors. I just sort of thought, do I even want to just expose myself in that way? But then equally, I was like, who am I to turn this down? And I think by that point, Stephen Fry had already said yes. Tom Daly had said yes. I think Claire Boulding, Alan and other people and I was like oh I mean like and I loved the show but oh my goodness it was like it was thrilling and there were times and particularly at the start I was convinced I was going to be gone right at the start like right at the start yeah and I think if you watch it back me and um and Lucy were so convinced that we were that was it that was it because I we I remember after watching well I'd watched all of the like British series and I um remember spotting this pattern that the last two in at breakfast uh often the people who've been considered as as being murdered um because they you know that's how they kind of edit it together so there's like oh and who's it going to be out of those three people it could be between this and then the next episode is like and the reveal it's this person and i remember coming into the first breakfast and it was me and like lucy and maybe celia or steven who were the last in and i was like oh god so i'm right and then claudia walks and said no one's been murdered i was like oh relief and she says well actually one of you has but it was done in plain sight so i was already like oh well maybe that still means it's one of us and then i don't know if you remember that whole funeral thing when i got in one of the coffins genuinely believing it was me i see was that on tv it was they did show it because i there was clues as to who it might be getting in the coffins and i and i but i was so dead certain it was me anyway there was like one clue which i think pointed towards taskmaster like well that's me that was forgetting that like four or five people had also been in And I just got in and I was like, that's it.

9:26And I was so gutted. And then when it wasn't me and I got out, I honestly, my heart was raised. I couldn't believe it. And then every day, every morning, honestly, you got this rush of like, I think it's me. I think it's me. Like you get so into the game. Of course you do. Because that's your whole world. Yeah. And that moment where Alan revealed he was a traitor and you all came together as like this amazing, beautiful, like vulnerable moment of just like, There was tears and it was just a perfect example of showing vulnerability and showing what real quality TV can do. And we have slightly forgotten that because of social media and TikTok and everything.

10:10But actually that is... One of the nice things actually about Traitors, and it's true with the most recent normal version, which I thought was fantastic, is that because everyone's now so aware, it's such a beloved show, people are so concerned about getting spoilers. They have to come off social media and they have to watch it when it goes out. So it is literally like the olden days when people would all get together, watch it together, and it's an episode every day or once a week or whatever it is. Because you can't, if you catch up, if you're trying to do catch up on it, you can't really, because you'll probably hear the spoilers or see it in the press or something like that the next day.

10:44So it was just one of those shows. I mean, it felt the closest it must be to be a sports person, I guess, in that it was, there was a real live quality to it, even though obviously it was pre-recorded. But, and to hold onto the secrets as well for so long was a weird thing because I came out of that castle like May the 9th, 2025 or something. And it didn't come out until like mid-October that year. So for a good period of like, you know, five plus months or whatever, it almost became like it didn't happen. It was because we couldn't talk about it because you can't give anything away and the press, you know, don't know anything about it so there's no there's no furore about it until it comes out so it just almost felt like was this just a surreal dream and knowing particularly how it played out and with betraying joe as well and how that kind of came about with alan winning was just madness who do you think is the one to watch for the next series oh my god i just when when i saw that list and i know quite a few of the comics particularly who who are doing it and um i just think it's such I mean, I have no idea because, and I listened to, I think it must have been the Richmond Osmond and Marina Hyde podcast.

11:51Yeah, Rest Entertainment talk about the new lineup of people going in. And they were sort of saying who would make good traitors. And actually every single combination of people you think of, you think, oh, that'd be good. Oh, that'd be good. Oh, I'd like to see them as that. That's what's so good about it. And I think that's the thing about the show is it's all about, it's not necessarily about an individual. It's about like a dynamic of people. and I cannot I cannot express enough how excited I am to watch it Amal Rajan Oh Amal yeah I love Amal I was at university with Amal Were you? Yeah I was Yeah yeah yeah He's so great Yeah he's so great He's so great I just Yeah we had a chat just before we went up and I said look if if his other half if she wants to talk to Becca whilst you're up there because it is a very specific thing I think Totally Like big shout out to partners of people in kind of creative industry because like they are doing so much i mean becca does so much like to kind of just keep the household running and keep the world together and keep me in check and kind of keep the kids just sort of like just you know she makes that so easy she is literally phenomenal she's also the coolest person in the world incredible yeah how she how she manages the world and also because you know one minute i could be trying out really bad mr swallow material and the next we might be like a glitzy event and it's really fun and like to sort of is a slight psychological kind of like roller coaster i think this industry um but she's just very like i mean it helps that she's she's not part you know she's a teacher she's a brilliant musician and so so her stories from work and so on are very different to like stories that we so so we kind of we can offload to each other uh about our own very specific kind of problems and it kind of makes us both realize like oh they're that's fine like those are first four problems really and uh it's all good what is the greatest thing about your wife the greatest thing about her i mean it is her sense of humor i mean for sure i mean she she is she's funnier than you oh oh but like a billion percent my wife is oh i mean like really really funny i mean she's obviously incredibly beautiful talented and has this amazing heart and incredible with the kids and a brilliant musician and teacher and everything but her sense of you i mean that that is undoubtedly like her and i will go to the grave like laughing like laughing because i mean there's one story i will not ever repeat but it was the grimmest thing that happened to both to both of us yeah and um and and we're in the hospital and we were finding some i mean it was really dark but we were and it didn't affect it was us to laugh it was our um you know we weren't laughing at anybody else but oh my goodness and when we all refer back to that sometimes oh god that was proper galaxy and we but she is so funny so funny and like but i I mean like proper like observational comic funding.

14:37Yeah, actually just genius. Oh, like incredible. Without knowing she's probably genius. Like just one-liners. And I'll just like write them all down. Sophie, my wife, is the same. She says these. I'm like, you know you're comedy gold at times. She's like, what? It's like so... Yeah. What do you think the secret is to a happy marriage then? I think perspective. I mean like, you know, it's not to say that you're not going to have disagreements and things like that. Like, of course you are. But it's just that nice thing. At the end of the day, you can still sort of have that kind of perspective on it and just come together and sort of look at things and think, it's all right.

15:07I mean, look, we're really lucky and stuff like that. We're so lucky with our kids and we have such a great time with them. And it is, man. And we're often exhausted and Becca, you know, even more so, but still we'll see the fun side and still make it fun for them and me. And so it's great. What was your first ever audition? Do you remember it? Oh, that's a really good question. Did you have to audition for Footlights? Yes, I did. Very much so. Well, my very first, if you really kind of go further back is, so I studied at Durham University and then started doing postgrad stuff at Cambridge. And you did geology at Durham.

15:41Yeah, geophysics. So yeah, like geology with maths. But yeah, and I auditioned for the Durham Review, which is like the comedy sketch group in Durham. But I didn't get in. And they only had one audition a year. So you could only really audition once a year, which was a shame really. And I auditioned, I think, two years on the trot and didn't get in. But I still quite like mates with them. and occasionally they would ask me to sort of, I think I remember like emceeing one of their gigs because I think someone had pulled out, but I did quite a lot of magic within that. And so, yeah, so I was kind of, by the time I got to Cambridge, and not that comedy was like a big plan, I thought I was going to go into academia, frankly, or if anything, math magic.

16:20You wanted to be a geologist, didn't you? A geophysicist, yeah. Which is what? What is a geophysicist? Oil, I mean, it's probably quite bad now, but I mean, it was at the time, it was, I think my PhD was sponsored by multiple oil companies. and then yeah but i didn't complete it so i don't feel bad yeah yeah hey listen um so so certainly a career in entertainment was not like it's not really it wasn't a thing it was like it was such a hobby almost yeah yeah and even i think i vaguely considered just because i knew some people who were going some of those durham review people actually who were going to go to drama school after university and and i just i remember okay i just remember i have a really vivid memory of just going onto like the lambda website and just having a little look at it and then just thinking absolutely not like i just wouldn't what imposter syndrome complete imposter syndrome i mean but also i wouldn't have had the skill set frankly but but um but yes a a hefty dollop of imposter syndrome for sure but i remember auditioning then for footlights and actually what was great about footlights is you could effectively well the first audition which is called so that the the um the sketch shows that they did every two weeks were called smokers and the first one was called the virgin smoker and it's basically for anyone who was new joining that year and it basically meant everyone got in so you'd still audition but everyone would get in and even if it was like 30 people doing like little two three minute sketches and it would be quite a long night but um so I remember doing that and then and then I just remember auditioning every two weeks and and and I think most of the time I kind of got in and then you became I became really good friends with a lot of those people and then you know the auditions were not that like oh you'll automatically get in but it was just very much like well if you're part of this group who really love doing it because it's not like everyone wanted to do it every week or anything um and you know i all those people i mean i absolutely adore and still good friends so my kind of cohort was like simon bird and joe thomas and johnny sweet sarah solomani so we were all there at the same time and just the year before was like tom basden and tim key and all that lot stephan golejewski so loved him oh god i love them all i mean they're just phenomenal and have all and i say this genuinely all were so supportive back then and to this day are also still support like we'll like tim came to see my miss follow tour like showed like last month like like like we're always wow you guys known each other since you were kids yeah like like like early 20s like yeah yeah so it's sort of it's wonderful that and i feel so lucky and that is one thing and again it's a real privilege to say but one thing that going to cambridge did like like this idea that it's possible to to give you that confidence yeah it did because i possibly didn't have that fully at that point and it did make me think well actually there are plenty of people who have kind of come before me who have actually managed to make it work out for a career so you can sort of dare to dream i mean it's certainly not a guarantee by any means you know just because you've gone to a university a it certainly doesn't make you funny because it's not you know funny is so subjective and so it was it was not a guarantee ever but it certainly did make me think well maybe I can be slightly blindly optimistic about this and that's not so much a bad thing and all that lot have gone into it because you have to be you have to have a little bit of delusion you have to have a slight bit right because otherwise you'd probably give up after your last bad gig you know because it's so horrible to kind of go through but you have to sort of come back and think no no no I can I can do better and and there's definitely a tipping point and it's never really a a specific point it's usually probably over a period of like six months where it's probably the transition between am I going to give this up or is this now my career and I'm now dead set on this kind of being the thing that I'm aiming for and you kind of make you have to sort of psychologically make that decision I guess.

19:57When was that point for you do you think? For me it was relatively early and it was it was because I was doing my PhD at the time so and it was a sponsored PhD so it was you know I was being paid to do it so it was a proper thing and and but yeah a very specific point I remember I'd done one year of the PhD and it was approaching the summer and I got into the Footlights tour show. So that was a show that was, so I'd auditioned for that. And that was quite life changing actually, because basically they could only afford to send five of you up to the Edinburgh Fringe because your accommodation is basically paid for.

20:27And so it can't be like a show with like 20 people in. And so, you know, they only choose five. And so they had quite a rigorous audition process for that. And I remember just sort of wanting it so much. and I remember the day getting the email and I sat in my little office with two other PhD students and I saw that email come through and I sort of scrolled down and I saw my name on it and I could not believe I could not believe it I've got I've got I've got the email I printed it I've got the email and I and because of course I there was no guarantee that that would ever lead to a career in it at all but it felt like this is at the time this was massive for me but I then had to get permission from my supervisor to then take basically two months off because I was going to be away in August for the Fringe.

21:09And then there was like a little tour afterwards in September. And so, and I had a load of fieldwork to do before then in Faroe. So I remember like June of July of that year, pretty much been up in the, in the Faroe Islands. And I remember coming back and then leaving to then basically go up to Edinburgh. I remember looking back at the Bullard Laboratories where I was based and it was such a romantic thing, but I remember so specifically looking back and knowing that I would never come back. I just had it in my, I was like, and of course that's delusion, that's delusional, that's blind optimism, and whatever you want to call it.

21:37But I just had that feeling and like, thank goodness it worked out. I mean, I'm so lucky. But I had that feeling and it came good and I can't believe it. That is like a movie. It was going away and you're looking back and you're like, I'll never be going back there. It was like a voiceover in my head. And actually, where the Blonde de Bontries is. Morgan Freeman probably voicing it. Exactly. Where the Blonde de Bontries is is actually quite picturesque. It's like a field with horses and it was the summer and the trees were swaying and I was like, I'm not going back. And I just had it. And then of course, the reality is that oh well you still need to do enough to do an mfl otherwise you've been paid to do this so i still then had to do another year and then and then and then it's like move to london well i can't afford to do comedy in london and so i was doing open mic stuff but i then had to work for morgan stanley to like pay my way you know i had to go work in the day so it's not nearly as like you know clear cut as but nick this is really interesting for me right because you had this opportunity with your with your skill set and your phd and everything you had to go into probably the corporate world and earn a huge amount of money doing things and working for what I'm building yourself and having this, what you would, people get as a typical career, right?

22:48And you could probably sketch out that career, what it would look like quite easily. But you chose to not do that. You chose to take this other part. It's that sliding doors moment in life, which I find so interesting. And I think now, and this is probably, you know having had kids now like when I like look back at that I'm like oh my god that is just I can't believe I was sort of almost like brave enough to like make that decision but of course you don't have the responsibilities as you do when you're a bit older and if you're ever going to make those decisions great to make them when you're young I mean you know that's the time to make them but but yeah I kind of I sort of look back and almost get kind of nervous thinking about but I wasn't nervous then I was just like yeah that's what I'm doing it's that beautiful naivety so naive yeah like that sort of like wistful kind of like yeah i'm just you know you're gonna go and do this yeah and like what and again just to go back to like those footlights mates that i mentioned that because we all were like that it was just like it was such a nice support network so we were even though again there was no guarantee there was no financial support from it at all but it was just like just to offload and you know we were all trying to get an agent or doing gigs or writing scripts and we were all just doing that at the same time and so it felt that we could sort of share a lot of those very sort of specific kind of concerns or go and support each other at gigs or something and you know like i say we sort of still do that now you know some will be listening right now who like you're their inspiration and they're thinking well how how can i take that leap what can i do what advice would you give that person well like it's so it's tricky and obviously that kind of question sort of comes up a lot i think but it's it's i i always now say just try not to be afraid of failure because when I think of any and it's certainly I'm certainly not the first person to have said this by any means but any degree of success and you can measure success in lots of different ways but it's founded on multiple failures like and it and it has to be like it can't it can't be anything other than that particularly and I think in a a creative discipline for sure and so it's it's sort of having faith in in in yourself and and and knowing that you have to ride the wave and actually you do have to be strong you do have to be mentally strong for that because you know there are things like the Edinburgh Fringe which can be brutal brutal absolutely brutal you've spoken about that a lot where you just you had no you have no money you got no money you got no audience you've got and and you know and you're seeing other people just overtake you all the time and you think oh well what am I doing have you played to zero audience before not zero but close to like I remember I remember one of my first shows at the Underbelly in fact it was it was the first solo show that I ever did Great place though It's a mad place and it I think they came up to me the front of house and said you've only got like two people in do you want to still do the show and I was like oh yeah I'll do the show and one of those people said that I knew and I also had audience participation in that show so they had to keep on getting up on stage so there were probably times when I was effectively playing to no audience because they were on stage What does that teach you about resilience?

25:43I mean it's mad but obviously you do develop a thick skin. You just got to. You kind of have to.

25:55You stopped waiting for permission and started building yourself, your dreams, your credit. Experian Boost could turn your on-time payments into instant FICO score gains. Every bill you paid could become proof of your power. Self-made? Absolutely. Self-funded? Experian could help you get there. Download the Experian app today. Results will vary. Not all payments are Boost eligible. Some may not see improved scores or approval odds. Not all lenders use credit information impacted by Experian Boost. See Experian.com for details.

26:26What is your first ever memory? Oh, that's a good question. My first ever memory, really early memory of, and I think I must have been three or four, of getting, well, I definitely remember being in like the buggy, the push chair with the rain cover on, because I remember liking that. I remember liking the sound of rain on the cover. So I must have been, I couldn't have been much older than three or four. And I definitely remember watching like the Paul Daniels magic show as a kid, which I must have been five or six. So I think those are like my earliest memories when I was sort of three, four, five.

26:58Because you started doing magic at four years old. Yeah. So I got a magic set when I was, my sister would, she got it, a Paul Daniels magic set when she was seven for her seventh birthday. And I basically nicked it. So I would have been four and I was obsessed with it and sort of still am. And it's really interesting you saying about that innocence thing because I think that that's what good magic tricks. I mean, there's a lot of sort of quite sort of corny magic and not great magic out there. But I think when magic is done well, I think the reason why audiences react to it so well is because it does take them back to a kind of a, there's that kind of, that wonder kind of moment where almost anything is possible.

27:36Like you sort of know it can't be possible. Like you can't make things float and you can't make things vanish. But actually, as a kid, those things feel completely feasible. And I think when you see a good magic trick and it takes you by surprise and there's that kind of element of wonder, it sort of takes you back to that childhood sort of feeling of like being in awe of something. And I love being an audience member as much as I do performing. And I don't really perform as much anymore as like a straight magician. I mean, I do it sometimes in character as Mr. Swallow. But they're kind of sort of slightly secondary to the comedy really now.

28:06But I used to work as a magician a lot. but I still love magic and I love watching it. I read probably, I mean, I have a magic book on the go pretty much every day. No, you don't. Honestly, I've read a bit of a magic book probably every day since I was about four or five. You're joking. I'm not joking. I do. That is wild. And I just, and I will, and even if it's like a couple of pages, but I've got like a big magic book collection and I still love it. And I love learning new secrets and principles. I mean, I'm not very good at sleight of hand at all, but I still love kind of reading about it. And often I'll just read stuff and think, that's absolutely amazing.

28:39And because I used to work as a magician a lot, I still, you know, I can still do bits and pieces, but I'm really more of a hobbyist now. What do you think that taught you for life? Like, what skills did learning magic from an early age give you? Well, it was... That was unexpected. That was unexpected. Well, it was definitely a defense mechanism and a bit of a crutch. And I probably didn't recognize that at the time. In what way? Well, I guess being a bit of an out... Look, I'm sure Brown, you know, grew up in the north of England in the 90s. So it's sort of like, you know, it's not always easy being a kid in that regard.

29:15And, you know, went to just a very kind of normal school. So it was very much a, you know, I could survive the playground by just getting out a deck of cards. And I remember specifically doing GCSEs and doing design technology. And it just so happened that I was in a class with effectively all the school bullies. All the school bullies and me. I was like, oh no, I've chosen the wrong subject. And it was absolutely fine. And look, it's not like I was bullied, bullied at all. But it was definitely the class to kind of just be really, really kind of careful about what you're doing, what you're saying.

29:46You just had to kind of keep yourself to yourself and keep your head down. But if it ever got a little bit leery, I would just be, and even the teacher, I remember Mr. Pike just saying, Nick, get your cards out. And I could then, I could sort of entertain them and just sort of keep them at bay a little bit. And that felt like a superpower. And it sort of was. It is. And then when I later got into doing comedy when I was a student, I used to always have magic on me in case the comedy was failing because it's so you're so vulnerable. So it's a bit of a safety net then. And then it's weird how it's now kind of crept back into my comedy through Mr.

30:18Swallow because I was happy to sort of once I stopped doing weddings and stuff to just be a magic fan and hobbyist, really. But it's nice now to kind of occasionally pop it into things like I'm not going to pop it into everything. like it's not it's like slow horses it was like me trying yeah yeah and you could really i think at this point i should really bring it but then oddly enough ted lasso jason snake is is a huge magic like hobbyist and i mean he does it and does it brilliantly as well he'd probably say he's a hobbyist but he is and and i remember him having just like a deck of cards always with him through like read throughs and on set particularly in season one just all the time and we we would like geek out about magic all the time i'm great friends with matt edmondson who's a radio one host he's an amazing magician he he's he loves like kids books about magic and everything totally and he like you he's good friends with chris cox who used to produce his show i think he's also a mentalist he's also a mentalist and it's amazing and i i feel like um it feels to me that that sort of matt edmondson has similar characteristics to you to like it feels like it's sort of similar individuals like sort of geek out to magic well i think as well that you know that kind of magic origin story of mine is quite typical within magic it's often a slightly geeky outsider who wants to find a way to fit in or get attention and and magic is a really fun way to kind of find that and then you suddenly discover that there are other magicians and you know you go to magic conventions or magic clubs or magic societies it's all full of the same personality type but What I find so funny is that we're all trying to do the same thing, all trying to fit in.

31:53Yeah. As humans. Yeah. Do you know, we had Dynamo on the... I love him. Yeah, man, he's so great. I've known him since I was a kid because we went to Bradford Magic Circle at the same time. So yeah, he was, I mean, I was 15. I think I'm a tiny bit older than him. He was like 14, 13. But he has always been that. His shtick, his style of magic, his tone, his performance style, that is him and that has been him. since he started doing magic. Really? Yeah. But same story with him. Same story with him, you know. Oh, goodness me. I mean, he's got a hell of a story. Hell of a story. But, you know, he had bullying experience, racism experience, like lots of different things.

32:30And it was just like brutal at times. And it feels like sort of like, yeah. And he said that magic again for him was the way to deflect. Yeah, completely. He could bring it out. And then suddenly people would go like, okay, he can offer us something. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Definitely. Definitely. You have a magic trick with you today, right? I've got cards with me if you wanted to see something. Are you kidding me? I want anything. Do you want to see something now? Please. Okay. Therefore, you just look after. You can keep them in the box. Okay, so Niggas is handing me a pack of playing cards. Yes.

33:05Let's do... I want you to cut off a big... I'm going to get you to... I'll demonstrate what I want you to do. Cut off a chunk of cards like that. Look at the card sort of secretly and then shuffle what's in your hand. But I want you to cut off like a good amount because obviously I saw all the other cards. So cut off over half just so we know. Okay, I've cut off over half, right? And you're happy with the one you're looking at? Shall I show you? If you want to, I'll turn away. Okay, there we go. And then just shuffle the ones that are in your hand, yes? Okay, then I shuffle the ones that are in my hand.

33:34Yeah, okay. So the one that I'm holding with the thing, yeah? Yeah, exactly. You can shuffle them all. Okay, I'm shuffling them. I'm shuffling them. I'll put these other ones aside for now. Okay, I'm shuffling them. I'm shuffling them. I'm shuffling them. Okay, that feels like they're shuffled. Okay, done. The only thing I know at this point is that the card you cut to, I guess, is in there. Okay, for now.

33:57And actually, if you want to, you can shuffle these into them as well. I can shuffle those into them? If you want. I wouldn't mind doing that. Okay, fine. Yeah, you can do. Are you sure? Yeah, absolutely. Because what I want you to do in a second, I'm going to get you to remove your card and you can place it face up. but I want you to also remove three other cards, which are kind of like red herrings. So you're going to try and sort of put me off. I'm going to try and work out what your card is from what you put down. One of them has to be your card. So you might want to put down the three of clubs with it as well, or you might want to choose something completely different, like the King of Hearts, so that you might throw me off.

34:32And I'm going to hopefully be able to tell from the choices that you make here what your card is. So I'm going to pick, how many red herrings do you want? So let's say, let's do four cards in total, but one of them has to be your card. So three red herrings. Three red herrings. Okay. Okay. And you can put them down in any order. You can keep them face down for now if you want, so that there's no kind of sense of, oh, I've taken out my card first, or a red herring first, or anything like that. Okay. And we'll see how this plays out. It is fun doing magic. Oh my goodness. I love it. Do you like it?

35:05Do you like watching magic? I love it. Do you? I absolutely love it. Did Dynamo show you stuff? Yeah, he did some amazing things. It's just incredible. I have no idea how he does that. Okay, so here's my four cards with three red herrings. So you can put them all face up. You can give them a little mix beforehand if you want. I'm going to face them up to you. Okay, thank you very much. Here we go. So move that out of the way. So the cards that I'm putting down right here, Queen of Spades. Queen of Spades, love it. Queen of Clubs. Oh, okay, yeah. Jack of Clubs. Yep. Ace of Spades. Oh, wow. So that's really good.

35:38Like, that is really good. That's very good. Why is that so good? Well, it's good because it shows that you're thinking about how to throw him off. So, for example, this is good because this is obviously the only kind of card that's not a picture card. So that's quite useful. This is obviously the only... That sort of stands out a little bit as well because you've got a pair of queens. But then it makes you think, well, could it be one of those? But is that a red herring in itself? So it's one of these. I guess you've got two clubs and two spades. So this is very good. Yeah, okay. I'm glad you like that.

36:05I really, really like it. I was going to do all one of the same. And then I was going to do like all of them the same, basically. Right. So you wouldn't know what it was. Like if it was, let's say it was a three of spades I picked, I was going to do all threes. Yes, great. That's another way. That happens a lot. But that's good as well. But your way is great. Because I think there's even more kind of variables in the way that you did it. I want you to, are you left-handed or right-handed? Right-handed. Okay. So with your left hand, can you lower your left hand onto one of these cards? Just onto one of them.

36:35Okay. Yeah. In fact, pull it to one side, but keep your hand on it. Now, I'm going to tell you that I believe that the card you chose off the back of the things that you showed me was the Jack of Clubs. Okay. Is that correct? Do I tell you? Yes. Yes. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Just because of the things that you did. But let's see. Just because of the things I did. Let's see whether you managed to do it as well. Do I pick it up? Oh, my God. Isn't that mad? You are what? Isn't that mad? Isn't that mad? What was it like working with David Schwimmer? Absolutely wonderful. He is the most wonderful person, yeah.

37:18This is an intelligence. Yeah. I had met him doing an improv workshop thing with Julia Davis. He's brilliant as well. Improv? Well, it was a pilot. It was a pilot for Channel 4, but particularly the way Julia likes to work. She likes to improvise around like a sort of skeleton script, I guess. And that was really fun and thrilling. And we'd created this pilot, which was called Morning Has Broken, which was about sort of before the morning show and before this time with Alan Partridge. So it felt quite like an original idea of the time. It probably wouldn't feel as original now because there's been two other really hit, brilliant shows since then.

37:59But it was sort of a spoof of kind of the behind the scenes of morning telly. It's frustrating when you pitch that and then suddenly you see a show and you're like, but you know, it happens all the time. Nick, you can say, I would be annoyed. I knew it would work and here it is. It happens all the time. But it was great fun to do, really great fun to do. We had this pilot and the pilot's great, actually. I think you can find it on YouTube. And oddly, David ended up just watching it. I think one of the finances of the show was Sony Studios and David was doing some work with them in the States. and he just got round to just seeing it.

38:33I think they just said, oh, you'll find this really funny. It wasn't like, it was not like we'd sent it to him or anything. And then the producer just sort of phoned and said, oh, Dave Shimmer really likes the show. He'd like to call. Literally, he just wants to call you and talk to you about it. And I was like, what? And I remember just taking this call and I think Finn had just been born. I remember. This is your eldest. Our eldest, yeah. And I remember turning the phone to Becca so she could like hear that it was like, it's Ross from Brad. It's Ross from Brad. Because he's got such a kind of iconic voice as well.

38:59And, you know, who hasn't, of our generation, like grown up watching Friends? And so it's absolutely mad. But it is that thing of, you know, there's that sort of thing of, well, don't meet heroes, but do if they're nice as Schwib because he was so nice. And A, the fact that he said, oh, yeah, I'll do that. So we got on really well, I should say. So we got on really well. That show, Morning Was Broken, didn't happen. But he just sort of said, oh, if you ever have an idea for a show that could allow for like an American coming in and not feeling sort of too shoehorned, just let me know. And I was like, I'm sure he says that to everyone.

39:31I'm sure that can't be right. And then about a year later, I had a script commission from Expectation Entertainment who produced the show. And I wanted to write this idea of a sitcom set at GCHQ. So it's just these sort of oddball characters, but you've got these huge stakes of national security. I found that quite a funny, just sort of marrying of two ideas. That is funny. And just sort of automatically funny that there are sort of these sort of slightly awkward people dealing with this really serious stuff. And then I thought, well, actually, it's not too like alien to have this idea that an NSA agent might be kind of coming on almost like a sabbatical to work with GCHQ you know the equivalent organization in the states and so I just sort of sent him like I think literally like a one-page treatment not even a script and he's like oh yeah when we're filming it and I was like well it hasn't been commissioned and then I wrote a script and then it went to series and so yeah it was just wonderful just really kind of organic and nice because you've now you've produced a lot you've written a lot you've starred a lot like are you comfortable with being yourself on stage or performing as a character well no as a character infinitely more why though i just find it funny i just don't think anyone wants to hear me like i'm not as funny as me like if i'm swallowed you know it's just instantly kind of more characterful and interesting and entertaining like it just because this is mr swallow your character yeah yeah so i just find that you disassociate yourself almost you You become the character, which means you can just be...

40:53Completely. Really? It's really weird now because I've been doing it for so long. So Show Pony, which is the tour that finishes next week, actually. But I just shot a special for it that NBC Universal are producing. And it'll end up on Netflix or up or somewhere at some point later in the year, probably. And we shot it in Leeds because the character is from Leeds. And the character is based on an impression of a schoolteacher I did at high school. So, you know, I've done that voice, you know, since I was 15, you know, I've impersonated this teacher since then. So, I mean. Can we hear a bit of Mrs.

41:26Swallow? Well, yes. So, you know, he kind of talks like that and, you know, just sort of got that attitude of just being like. And so she's a she. So she, so it's quite camp, but it's only because I'm sort of being her. Like there's no innuendo in it or anything. So, but it is just, you know, like, you know, sort of like that a lot. And obviously, hopefully that is very different to who I am as an individual. and so it became weirdly does the teacher know it's based on her i don't think she ever did she sadly passed away about 10 years ago but but no i don't i i categorically don't think and and there have been teachers who taught me around that time who've come to see the show when i've been up in leeds really and and and they're all over so who's this uh but yeah she taught she taught us gcc english and she was outrageous and show pony is basically about her it's about her being a show but like using teaching as a platform to show off, which was what she was clearly a frustrated performer.

42:17Like a wannabe actor. Which so many teachers. Completely. I know, so many teachers. It was like a real, like, have you ever seen Summer Heights High? Yeah. Like Mr. G. Like it was so, I mean, she didn't teach us, she taught us English rather than drama. But she just liked the sound of her own voice and she would stomp in and just be like, right, we're going to have a debate about capital punishment. And we're like, why? Like, why? Why are we? And out of nowhere. And it's just because she suddenly had this view about capital punishment. she needed to get off her chest and we're like 15 what would mrs swallow say that's like but it's real i swear i'm not making it up that is real and my mate and my mates who are like my best mate lee who who i like was like from like middle school like i've known him since i was like eight he when when becca and i got married he was my best man and he toasted this teacher um and named her i've never named her but like toasted her because he's like he says i owe my whole career and life to her because he says without that voice and without that attitude but he he witnessed all the same things that I talk about in like my shows because we were all just there we all just like lived through that incredible experience it's amazing that that when you when you get a character like that and you can disassociate yourself disassociate yourself so you become the character and then the character can say and do anything yes without you becoming self-conscious almost yes yes and so yeah performing as someone something or someone else is better well it's weird the weirdest thing i found so literally at the weekend we were recording we went back to my old school to record some like talking heads me and characters talking heads as if it's like a bit of a documentary as well which were into sort of kind of intercutting with the live show i think and um and so we're in my old form classroom and and the um brilliant live producer owen donovan uh from burks nest he was we needed like an eyeline for the because it was as if it was like an off-camera interviewer so he was just sort of sat there for the eyeline but I was sort of chatting to him like this like this and then Sonny would kind of go into it and he had to keep a straight face because he knows if he laughed I would laugh and would like ruin the take but I just realised that it is really weird like it is really weird to kind of because I get so in it that I will look at him and I'm making eye contact but I'm making eye contact with him as someone else and that is because it is different to me is it really?

44:25if I'm Swallow even though it looks like me and you know I don't put a wig on can you riff totally as Swallow then so you could totally riff and anything and now I've just got a phone, my phone notes are just, if something happens, I often think of the reaction that Mr Swallow will say, and it's often inappropriate. Not rude or on the edge, but it's the wrong thing to say. But I'll write it down because it'll make me laugh. And so I'll just have like phone notes of ideas and things like that. So what would Swallow say about like the Football World Cup? Couldn't care less. Like just not interested.

45:01I just wouldn't understand it. It's so good.

45:30Results will vary. Not all payments are Boost eligible. Some may not see improved scores or approval odds. Not all lenders use credit information impacted by Experian Boost. See Experian.com for details. Experian.

45:43Nick, listen, thank you so much. Thank you for entertaining millions of us. Oh, God. You really do. And just so many things you've done and giving us your time today. You're beyond great company. So thank you. Thank you. We like to finish the show with eight quickfire questions. Oh, great. Eight. Eight. Eight, okay. Are you ready for this? I'm ready, yeah. what's a saying or phrase that makes you smile or cheers you up well it's a ted lasso phrase and it is it's um be curious not judgmental and i do think it is a very good one that if at any point i feel myself judging even if it's just in my head i'm like judging something or a situation or personal something i'm just like hang on just think about maybe why they're being like that or why this has come about and just trying to try and step i think that's a really good one we didn't even mention the fact that you're a two-time emmy a nominated actor nominated actor well it's i mean i sort of can't believe it so it's fine that we don't mention it i'll tell you what when i found out that it's all for ted lasso we haven't really even touched on that little ted lasso show season four out august um i i found out that i got nominated for my emmy when i was having my first covid vaccination like literally i was walking in to the point where i wanted to tell the person administering the jab and then just thought it'd be really worse I've been nominated for an Emmy.

46:54I've been nominated for an Emmy. I mean, that is proper imposter. I cannot believe that. That was mad. Was it mad? Yeah. And also, like, kind of like, I don't necessarily feel like I've earned that. It's like, I think that everyone got really weird. I mean, maybe season two. Season one, I'm like, I just got really lucky. I think everyone's like, oh, let's just nominate everyone in Ted Lasso kind of thing. But I could not believe it. Is it weird, that whole thing? Yes. Yes. Because it sort of... And when your name comes up, in your head, are you thinking, it's gonna be me well a little bit like yes and no like like the first time absolutely not i was just like i cannot believe i'm even here like to to witness this and um and and brett won who's brilliant and i've known brett since you know we started in comedy together at the same time so i know him for years and and rightly so he won he had such a bigger part and did so much more fun and great stuff in it i was like great and then when we both got nominated then the next year and um and and i had as a part as a role in the show that was sort of the when nate becomes sort of quite dark and it became quite dramatic and stuff and i was like i probably like like if i were to win i'd feel far more deserving because you like there's a bit more depth yes a little bit but but i certainly didn't expect to and um uh and no so is it but there's possible there is i mean it's just it's literally just moments before they they say because they obviously play the clips and you're like there I am on screen and people applaud and you kind of then try and judge it by the whoops because they're playing little VT clips of every single person nominated well no but you're kind of like was that louder than the one that happens for you back you can't help but be a little bit vain in that moment also the camera's on you which is embarrassing so like I'm not thinking about this it's an element of disappointment no are you you're too good i would be like not not for i think i think there were things like i would say the the most disappointed i've been in like in this industry is probably i've never been nominated for the comedy award in edinburgh and i i think i i think it's fair to say that i have been close to being nominated in my head because there's not a set number they could nominate five or six people they sort of just choose and and it's called the perry awards it used to be called the perry yeah and there's been multiple times when i've gone up to edinburgh with I think good shows and probably got quite close to it but never ever been nominated and that's the one that if ever there's something that stings I'm like oh hey I'm like why guys come on nominate me oh I really want to that'd have been great and like but an Emmy I was like I mean I'm just lucky to even be like I can't believe it so to win would have been I mean of course I'd be like that's nuts but just to be nominated was nice amazing best compliment anyone's ever given you oh my god are you Simon Bird?

49:44perfect perfect answer what scares you most about yourself um a slight workaholic as in as in i do sometimes struggle to say say no because because i still have that fear and that sort of has been i guess sort of in me and fear is probably again not the right right word but that desire to succeed and you know when you're really grafting and doing edinburgh and hustling for work and doing open mic spots and stuff like that you're constantly looking for the next paycheck and even you know now when i'm very lucky and sort of financially comfortable you know and you know seem to still be working and stuff so you sort of got to accept the fact that this is what i do for a living and that even though i don't i literally don't know what i'm doing after july like i genuinely don't but i've got to hope that there will be something you know um do you still think that you do you still think that like how am i doing that i've got to take this yeah yeah there's an and again it's imposter syndrome but there is still an element of like well i probably do need to take that gig because just in case i don't have anything else what if i don't get that audition what if i don't get this and what if the series i'm pitching doesn't get picked up and so yeah so so there is then a danger that you kind of just keep working and you don't take the sort of time time off but yeah so great to hear that i think for so many people that doesn't ever leave you it never quite goes when was the last time you cried oh um not not for because often i'll just cry at anything but that but weirdly not for a while um it would have been probably do you cry at movies TV shows oh yeah I was going to say it would have been it would have been telly what's something you can't let go of oh what can I not let go of have you had a role that you didn't get in your life oh I see um what can I not let go of there might be nothing not winning not winning the the well it's just more not even being nominated so maybe that's the one that could be yeah that's it unfinished business there and now I'm not eligible It's really annoying.

51:42What's your guilty pleasure? Made in Chelsea. I'm not joking. Are you serious? Yeah, more recently. My wife and I will watch it, yeah. I've been watching it recently. It's so good. It's great. It's really, really good. It's unbelievable. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We do. It is our guilty pleasure. And we're like, when's the next one? When's the next one? And we're like, are they going away in the summer holidays? We want to watch that. So yeah. Going back to Corsica, whatever happened. It was just phenomenal. What turns you off? uh rudeness yeah just rude rudeness i mean it is one thing i cannot understand and you know this industry as in this industry is is definitely surrounded by its healthy share of rude people and um i find it shocking when i meet people within this industry who continue to do well and i'm just like no it's really disappointing because it's slightly rewarded you know certainly when you get kind of quite i i think i think this of uh i'm not at this stage by any means but when when certain actors get to a certain level and yeah and at the end of it it's still pretend you could be doing it you could be playing whatever role and it could be serious and it could be upsetting but it's still pretend and it's an absolute luxury to be doing this and getting paid that amount i mean correct so to them be to be rude i'm like oh it really doesn't but i think it comes round at some point i hope so but but and and there are elements within the industry where you know where people are like, we just don't want to work with this person.

53:06Have you seen it firsthand? Yeah. Wow. Yeah, particularly when I was first starting out. But I've seen it more recently like that. And now I feel obviously a lot more comfortable to call it out. But there was definitely a time at the start of my career in telly where I was working with someone who will remain nameless, I can tell you off air. But was at the height of them kind of breaking through and they were notoriously rude. And it was gross. It was just like watching a school bully and undoubtedly stemmed from insecurity as it always does. But it's just like, oh, come on. Like, really? And I wish I'd had the guts to speak up at that point, but didn't because I was sort of too junior.

53:48But, you know, there were other more senior people there who were also letting it fly. And it's just a bit like... What turns you on? Sense of humour. 100%. Yeah. What do you like most about yourself? Um, my body. I was going to, it was on the tip of my tongue. My really sexy body. Do you know what? It's my looks and my face. My big nose, my short-statured, my fat stubby hands. I mean, what's not to like? My moles. I think you're beautiful. Thank you. Now, what is it? What do you think it is? Oh, it's difficult. You can't answer that yourself. You have to, you have to. I mean, I like, I, I'd like to think that I, I can get on with a lot of people.

54:29Like I, I, I, I've always liked, like just, you know, had lots of kind of friends or like colleagues and stuff like where it's always just fun and like, you know, lots of different groups of people to kind of just chat to and offload to and tell stories about. Like, so I, I enjoy kind of, I guess that. Nick, thank you so much for coming. Thank you for having me. This has been a pleasure. You're the best company. Thank you so much. Thank you very much. Thank you everybody. Thank you for having me.

55:24Funded? Experian could help you get there. Download the Experian app today. Results will vary. Not all payments are Boost eligible. Some may not see improved scores or approval odds. Not all lenders use credit information impacted by Experian Boost. See Experian.com for details. Experian.