#294: Bobby Long, Partner and Co-Founder, Piedmont Capital Partners – See the best in people

24:53Well, I'm relentless. I'm a relentless cheerleader.

24:58David Novak:And the world has definitely cheered you on too. You mentioned your battery company, and there's a story I want to make sure that you tell about your battery company that literally blew up your investment. Tell us about that and what that experience teaches you. Okay. Oh, my gosh. Our battery. So we set out. Again, a lot of this had a nexus with universities in North Carolina. And Jody Simone, who was like the eminent professor of chemistry, eminent professor of chemical engineering, all three national academies, presidential medal for technology innovation. he and a guy named Natasha Balsera at Lawrence Berkeley National Lab had come up with a way to make lithium-ion batteries safe.

25:51And I liked these guys and the whole bit, so we went into it. And then they tested it, and it blew up. And not just a little bit. And so then I was like—

26:04David Novak:What do you mean, not just a little bit? I mean, it was like— That's a lot. And yeah, and so anyway, so we said, okay, so obviously this fails. And then Natasha said, actually, one of my students came up with something and it looks pretty cool. And if you look at it, the Chinese have won the battle for lithium ion batteries. And therefore, what is the step change? Lithium ion is about played out from a technology perspective. But if somebody could create a solid state battery that is completely safe, then you could leapfrog the world and be energy independent when it comes to batteries. And so that was the premise of this.

26:56And we have pushed it and pushed it and pushed it. And we are ready now for production. Wow. So you're going into production. We're having it come off our pilot line to make sure that it is evident that you can build it and scale it. But we think the price is super competitive. And, David, it has no limits. It has no limits. The charge times can be way better than anything out there now. The energy density can be way better than anything out there, and it's safe. Wow. Wow. So have you had a conversation with Elon Musk about this? No. We had an early conversation with Tesla, and we decided that, I mean, I don't know him.

27:47I obviously respect him greatly, but my understanding is Tesla doesn't like to pay for anything from the outside. And that's not what we're about. Yeah, yeah.

27:59David Novak:Now tell me the story of Carbon, how you got into that and what it's become. Yeah, so Carbon is a 3D printing company. And so early on, Louise and I were sitting in Joe DeSimone's office and we said, what are your best ideas? And he said, this 3D printer that will do things like Terminator just kind of rise out of a puddle. And we said, okay, we want to do that because we like Joe. And the other one was the battery. And so we said, okay. And, you know, Tim was in all this and Tom Ryan, and, you know, we were lucky to get you in some of these things. But on carbon, so we went to Sequoia Capital, and Sequoia jumped at it immediately.

28:52And so we raised a whole bunch of money and off we went. And yeah.

29:01David Novak:Hello, friends. I hope you're loving this conversation. Be sure to stay tuned to the very end of the episode. As always, David and I are going to debrief some of the concepts that he talks about with this week's guest. So stay tuned to the very end and I will see you soon. Now, along these huge projects that you have, you make progress. How do you celebrate progress along the way? Because that's got to be a challenge, you know, because most people wait till the end, right? I mean, but you got to get people inspired to keep going. How do you do that? Not just yourself, but other people. Yeah, you know, that's the tough part because it's like being on a treadmill and having it on incline 15.

29:45At a speed, you can barely stand and then you have to stand it for longer. So we try to set milestones, and the milestones, we say, okay, if we can do this, then does it become that much more obvious that we can get to the next level? But there's no tried and true answer to that. You kind of make it up as you go. And role you do. And you're one that's known for closing deals on a handshake.

30:14David Novak:I mean, can you really do that these days, Bobby? If I can't, I'm not dealing with them. There you go. Can you give an example when you walked away from somebody without necessarily naming the name? I mean, this goes very early. And this goes into the insurance business that we were in. And it was a bank that wanted to do a huge deal. But it was like, just got a bad taste for how they would act and all that. And just, we were like, this is a customer that we'd love to have. We don't really need this person. Life's too short to deal with somebody that is not of the same, I don't know. That was one of those guys, I do like everybody.

31:01I didn't like this guy very much. And so we walked.

31:05David Novak:So you'll do a handshake deal, even in today's times. You don't necessarily, you know, you ultimately, I'm sure you will, will, will allow you up. You know, when you're as positive as you are, okay, and trusting as you are, have you ever had anybody take advantage of that? I've had people say that somebody took advantage of me. And, but I don't generally feel like that. And I feel like maybe it was my own misgiving. But yes, to your point, I will memorialize a deal in writing. But I want to make sure that we have an agreement of the minds before that. And then so there are no battles fought over the written word when it comes back in a contract.

31:54I mean, you know how many times you've seen, okay, let's memorialize this and then it comes back differently. I don't want to see that. So I'm like, hey, we have a handshake. We're good, right? So that's it. Makes a lot of sense.

32:10David Novak:And you've taken enormous effort with your time to be patient and persistent for big jobs. It'll take a long time to materialize. And you've also been willing to risk your own money. You know, you take enormous risks. I'm curious about your view in terms of how you put your money on the line. I mean, how do you think about money, period? Well, I want to have enough money, but I don't want to hoard money. And I like being purposeful. And so if there are some of these problems that are important to patients, I mean, for example, take the Alzheimer's. 52 % of likely voters are dealing with Alzheimer's in some fashion.

33:05And so that's a big one. And if I can make an impact in that, then that is more gratifying than anything. And so I'd like to see that through. And on the battery, that's a matter of national energy policy, et cetera, and national energy independence. And all of that is a part of national defense as well. So if I can be part of that, then great. Now, would I have given money to those things? Probably. But if I can also be involved in making them happen, and I'm just crazy enough to think that I can be additive.

33:45David Novak:And Bobby, I play golf with you, and you love to play this game called Gammons. So that's a game for all of you listening out there where you just keep doubling down. and doubling down and doubling down. And you end up losing a heck of a lot of money if you're playing Bobby Long. But what does it take you, Bobby, to double down on an idea? What's your process? I mean, when do you think you're into something where you ought to be able to say to yourself that, hey, this is so good, I'm going to double down or I'm going to get out? Yeah, I will get out. I do feel like it's not always super clear, but I like to think that the odds are in our favor, our collective favor of a positive result.

34:36And I like to be able to see it. I know that it's going to take a little more time than we forecast, but I like to be able to see the finish line.

34:47David Novak:You know, most people see big trends after they've already arrived. You know, how do you go about spotting them early, Bobby? Gosh, I don't know that I have any fortune telling other than I ask a lot of people what they see. And then if it makes sense, then I pursue it like crazy and try to find out all I can just because I'm curious. I love things that change the world. I can't do a business anymore that is, you know, a grind it out type business just to grind it out for some extra bucks. I like the innovation. I like the invention. And I like seeing that through where it's something that is very new and really helps people.

35:34David Novak:You know, I want to take you back for a few minutes, Bobby. What's a story from your childhood that shaped the kind of leader you are today? I was a kid when you made eight birdies in the Pro-Am. Watching you. That was pretty good. I don't remember that, but go ahead. I do. Hey, everybody, he shot eight under. It was unbelievable. No, I did not. And then gave a presentation. I did not. He was off the charts. I did give a presentation, but I didn't shoot a runner. Yeah. Yeah, and he came up with a great way to say it. He said, what are you going to do? It was so good. Here you go, deflecting. We've got to get back to you.

36:15David Novak:This is about you here. I guess my father was quite the humble listener. He was super smart. He had an academic pedigree that was pretty impressive, and he never flaunted it, And he was always curious and always listening and always giving him the benefit of the doubt. So pretty good. Did you have a job when you were a kid that taught you something? Oh, yeah. Yeah. I was a paper boy at a little at a very little age and and young age. And I did I did all kinds of stuff. I sold everything I could get my hands on. I worked on golf courses, I rolled tennis courts, sold vacuum cleaners, you name it.

37:12What do you think leaders should think about in terms of sales?

37:15David Novak:I mean, you know, a lot of times you say, hey, I'm a salesperson, you know, or I sell, you know, the whole profession itself gets demeaned a little bit at times. You know, what's your view on selling? How can I help you? That's it. How can I help you? And not a transaction. How can I help you? How can I help you in your business? How can I help you? I was in a clothing store the other day, and somebody bought a shirt. And I heard the guy say, made a sale. And I was like, and I know the guy. So I said, no, you didn't. You just helped him. He's going to feel better tonight when he puts that shirt on.

37:57You helped him look in the mirror and see somebody a little different than he did earlier today. You helped him. That's what I think.

38:06David Novak:What's your philosophy when you're dealing with everyone, whether it's a janitor or a CEO? I mean, how do you think about that? Well, as I think that at the end of the day, you're judged by how you treat a defenseless person. And there's a guy named Steve Greenberg that works with her. And several years ago, there was an article, and I think it was in the New York Times or the Wall Street Journal, about a homeless man on the streets of New York. And they asked him, they said, he just happened to be interviewed. Does anybody treat you as a human being? He said, there's one guy. And he comes by every day and we have a conversation.

38:49And it was Steve Greenberg, who's very involved in sports. And I take that, I want to be like that. I want to be one that everybody that's in whatever kind of position feels honored.

39:06David Novak:It reminds me of that phrase, which I love. Don't look up, don't look down, always look straight ahead when you're dealing with people. Period. And you are reputed for doing that. Well, I hope so. You know, in 2007, Greensboro was days away from losing its PGA Tour event. and then you stepped in and you saved it. Take me behind the scenes of that whole thing from a leadership perspective. First of all, you know a lot more than I thought you did. Okay, so what happened on that was that this young guy, Mark Brazel, he came over from the AJGA to be the tournament director. We had a fall date and the PGA Tour was doing this new thing called the FedEx Cup.

39:57And the FedEx Cup was going to wind up before the fall dates. And so I was like, uh-oh. And then he didn't have a title sponsor. Chrysler had been the title sponsor, so that had gone away. And this is a really big deal in our region and in North Carolina. I mean, it's one of the oldest tournaments on tour. So he came to me and he said, will you help me do this? And I said, so do you think you can make a go of it? And he said, 100%. And I asked him all kinds of questions and I believed him. I believed in him. So I said, all right, let's do it.

40:41David Novak:What did that mean when you said, let's do it? I mean, what did you do? Well, first of all, I said, And Tiger Woods is the number one person in golf. He's got all to do with the TV ratings. We're not going to get a meeting with Tiger Woods. Call his agent. So Mark Steinberg. So I said, get a meeting for me with Mark Steinberg. So I went to Mark Steinberg, and Mark Steinberg said, I've only got 15 minutes. You know, he was a little bit dismissive. I love Mark, but he was a little dismissive. And I said, well, I actually need four minutes. And he said, okay. So then, you know, and I'm thinking, he's thinking that I talk too slow to say anything in four minutes.

41:30So I said, what is your biggest fee for anything? And he said, what do you mean? I said, okay, well, you don't have to name it right now, but we're going to pay your biggest fee if you get us inside of that FedEx Cup with a new date and get us a title sponsor. And so he said, that's it. And I said, that's it. So we're gone in like two and a half minutes. So then he calls me back and he says, okay. He says, I got good news and I got bad news. And I said, what's the good news? And he said, the good news is I got you a date. It's inside of the FedEx Cup. It's the last tournament. And he said, and I said, well, why is that good?

42:17Because the week before is this big tournament. And so they're all going to take that week off of our tournament in order to get ready for the FedEx Cup. And he said, there will be storylines there of people trying to get into the FedEx Cup and people that are trying to keep their card. I said, OK. And he said, and I said, so I agree. That's sort of good news. And I said, what's the bad news? and he said, you don't have a title sponsor, so you've got to put up a letter of credit. And I said, okay. And I'm thinking of the people that I can go around to get the letter of credit. And he says, and the letter of credit has to be, and it's like Tuesday.

42:59And he said, the letter of credit has to be on the PGA Tour's desk in three days. I said, so it's got to be up there this week. And he said, yeah. And I said, so basically, they're being nice to you, and they're kicking sand in our face by saying, because they know that nobody on earth is going to give them a letter of credit for that amount of money. It was a total sponsorship, and for four years, and a lump sum letter of credit. And I said, so they're kicking sand in our face. And he said, correct. And I said, okay. And I got a little mad. And David, I've heard you use a term before. I can definitely go from teddy bear to a little bit of grizzly.

43:39And so I said, okay, tell them it'll be on their desk tomorrow morning. And so I signed it.

43:46David Novak:So you signed a$25 million letter of credit, and eventually you brought the Wyndham in as the title sponsored. And as they say, the rest is history, right? Well, Steve Holmes, that's another thing that's a good lesson. You pick a guy like Mark Brazel who had a dream that you believed could carry it out, and then you pick great partners. And Steve Holmes, Steve Holmes did not have to do the deal that he did. And I told him that. I said, look, you know I'm hung out to dry on this. There were some other people that came on that letter of credit after I sent it in. But anyway, so he said, I said, you know that I'm out there on this, that I got nobody else around.

44:30And so you don't have to put up the whole amount. And I'll cut you any kind of deal you want. And he said, I believe in being a good partner. If you don't let us step into the whole thing, then we're not going to do it. And he said, I think you'll be a better partner for us if you do it that way. And I was like, okay. It's amazing. It's amazing.

44:55David Novak:And Steve is the chairman and CEO of Wyndham at the time and really cracked that deal with you. And while we're on the subject of golf, you were inducted into Carolina's Hall of Fame of Golf in 2018 alongside the names of Arnold Palmer. What's the story behind that honor that most people don't know? That I'm the first person that got that kind of award that can barely play golf. That is not true. He's a great golfer. One or two handicapped. Oh, yeah. A one and a two put together for a 12. But I really got it for being a cheerleader. And that was that I cheerleaded Mark and I tried to help everybody, you know, that wanted to get involved, make sure they had a great experience.

45:48That's what I did.

45:50David Novak:I don't know if you've read it. Adam Grant wrote a book called Give and Take. But you are the poster child for what he calls a giver. Has there ever been a time where that belief was tested, where being a giver really cost you something real? You know, I'd rather not think of it that I lost something that because even at a loss, you gain a great experience that you can learn from. and that just goes under the category cockeyed optimist. But that's right. And I don't, I just, if somebody takes advantage of me, I go back to that book and that takers, they can spring out of the gate, but their givers are going to surpass them all day.

46:42It goes back to, you know, Brad Freeman actually made a comment to me one time. He said, always give it the benefit of the doubt, because while you'll be occasionally deceived, it's so preferable to living in constant suspicion. So you're a classic trusted positive intentions. Yes. And therefore, if it goes against me, it doesn't mean that I'm going to hang around with that person ever again. But it also, at the same time, I realize that there's some learnings to be done. And does it change the way I look at somebody on the next deal? No.

47:14David Novak:You know, some people just have to be in the limelight, Bobby. You seem to prefer to kind of work behind the scenes. Why do you stay behind the scenes when so many others really work hard to get that strong public platform, either through social media and other things, so that they can accelerate their mission? You know, what's your thinking about that? Because you are on a relative scale. You're more low key. yet you're accomplishing huge things. I'm trying to do huge things and I hope to accomplish them. I don't need a platform as such like that. But I do have needs. I have needs to, one of my big needs is to try to solve these things.

48:02You know, I want to make my parents proud. And so trying hard stuff and staying with it and making it happen. And I want to go out swinging.

48:13David Novak:Well, I guarantee you're making your parents proud. There's no question about that. And this has been so much fun, Bobby, and I want to have some more with my lightning round of questions. So are you ready for this? I don't know. You've done a lot of homework on this stuff. What's three words that best describe you? Hopeful, humble listener. I mean, that's what I want to be. I want to be a humble listener. If you could be one person for a day beside yourself, who would it be? I think Andy Jassy's got a pretty cool job. He's CEO of Amazon. What's your biggest pet peeve? Rudeness. Who would play you in a movie?

48:51David Novak:Probably Daffy Duck. What's the last great movie you watched? With a positive ending, of course. This has a sort of a tragic ending. I always talked about it being positive, but the positive is in the message. and a movie that I watch all the time. I mean, I've watched it so many times that some believe one. It's a long movie. It's called The Mission. Most memorable round of golf and why? It's probably out there with you yucking it up with some of our buddies. And really because of the action and because of super good nature, everybody playing, you know, playing with each other, but it's just fun.

49:36David Novak:What's something you've been curious about lately that has absolutely nothing to do with anything you're working on? So our buddy, Wick Mormon, we saw him last weekend, and he and I always trade books. And this is a book called Taking Religion Seriously. And so I started listening to it. And not that I shouldn't be thinking about that every day, but I'm deep into it now. Besides your friends and family, what's your most prized possession? You know, that says a whole lot about my friends and family in terms of, I don't know how you get better than that. And my father gave me a pocket watch that he had gotten as a kid from his father and that I gave Robert.

50:29But that's way up there.

50:31David Novak:And Robert's your son. And if I turned on the radio in your car, what would I hear? You would hear classical music. What's something about you few people would know? Oh, gosh, I'm not going to. When I have a problem, I said that I write earlier, but I actually write poetry. And I do it because I can get it to four lines, and then I've got it, and then I tear it up and throw it away. What's one of your daily rituals, something that you never miss? Exercise. And what's something that you do just for you? Exercise. And that's the end of the lightning round. That's great. But one of the things you do, Bobby, that I love is you have an exercise program that you use, an app.

51:21David Novak:And you have trainers. And you offer those up all the time to your friends. When did you start doing that and why? I like to be helpful. You know, it's just I like to be helpful. And you think about exercise, this is a great everything. So anyway. You actually push huge tires. And, you know, you do all kinds of crazy stuff. What the hell? You know, are you an Ironman? Have you done an Ironman? Have you done anything like that? No, John Townsend and I were supposed to run a marathon and he got hurt. And I said, I'm so sorry that you got hurt, but I'm so glad because now I don't have to run that thing with you.

52:09David Novak:You know, I'm fortunate to have a great friendship, not only with you, but with your wife, Catherine. And your marriage literally is something to behold. The way you two love each other is just incredible. what's something that you think that's really made your partnership thrive? I would say communication. Yeah. What really makes it work? Not necessarily with you and Catherine, but, you know, you're a great communicator. You can, you know, like the way you described Alzheimer's, you simplified that. I mean, you know, where did you get the skill to simplify and to communicate so well? I don't know.

52:48So, you know, my dad basically said, if you are trying to communicate something, make sure that it's not for you to hear. It's how to have the other person understand what you're trying to say.

53:06David Novak:I would have loved to have known your dad. He's a special man. He was a great—I can tell you a quick story about him. Let's hear it. Okay, so my uncle, I was coming home from a basketball tournament at Christmas, and I was in the 10th grade. My father picked me up at the Raleigh-Durham airport. He was so excited because my uncle was having open heart surgery. And so we were going to Duke, and he said, the surgery's going great. He's going to be waking up when we get there. My father was a lawyer, and we got there, and we walked in, and there were guys outside of the waiting room that were walking up, and they had on suits.

53:51My father said, one of those guys looks like a lawyer. So he stopped them, and my uncle's family is in the waiting room. My father said, and I'm with him, and he says, are you guys coming to the waiting room, and does this have anything to do with my brother? And they sort of, you know, well, and he said, I'm a lawyer. We're not litigious. Tell me what's going on. And they said that the anesthesiologist had overdosed my uncle. The surgery had gone well, but he had died. And so my father said, where's the anesthesiologist? And they said, he's in his office. And he said, take me to him now. And then I'll come back and tell the family.

54:39So he walked into his office. I'm with him. The guy's morose. My dad says, thank you so much for trying. And my brother would also thank you as well. He went into this and at least he had hope as his last thought. And I am so thankful for that. And we all make mistakes when we're trying to do something that changes the world. And here's my card. And if you ever have a down moment, call me. And that guy did. And my dad stayed in touch with him.

55:10David Novak:Wow. That's an awesome story. And your son, Robert, who's a magnificent young man, he's working at Piedmont, a company that you co-founded. For all the father-son combos that are working together out there in family businesses, what advice would you give to really make it work? I've always tried to make Robert, and we have always tried to make Robert feel safe, that he could tell us anything. And we've always tried to tell him how proud of him that we are. And we really are. And he and Katie are both extraordinary people. We're incredibly proud of him. Yeah. And you've got your kids and you have grandkids.

56:03David Novak:what's your view on just leadership at home? Try to set the example all the time. And then I've had this issue with our oldest grandson who just turned 16 recently, and I'm trying to make sure I communicate to him in a way that he can hear it. And so it's kind of sometimes I throw bank shots to myself so that I can try to get through and have him remember. Yeah. And you've accomplished so much, Bobby. I mean, what's your unfinished business now as you look to the future? I want to get these projects done. I want these things to change the world. I want the people that are working on them to do extraordinarily well and get the recognition that they need and deserve.

57:04And I think that Frank will get the Nobel Prize. I think that, I think, anyway, I'd love to see that through and know that I'd love to have a hand in making that happen.

57:17David Novak:Last question. What's one piece of advice that you'd give to anyone who wants to be a better leader? Be a humble listener. be a humble listener to everybody, no matter who it is. Well, Bobby, you're a great listener, and you're a humble listener that walks the talk. I mean, and you set such a good example. There is not a person that I've ever met in my life that doesn't respect you, admire you, and want to learn from you and be with you. You're just a great guy, and thank you so much for getting on this podcast. It took me a long time to get you on. I was not worthy, but I love hanging out with you.

57:58David Novak:All right. Thanks. Thank you, Bobby. Thank you.

58:07David Novak:David, listening in on this conversation between you and Bobby, just made me feel so good on the inside. He just seems like such a likable person and one who just really genuinely wants to do great things in the world. Oh, I think Bobby Long is one of the best people I've ever known at lifting people up and making them feel good about themselves. So it doesn't surprise me that you'd say that. It's also apparent that, you know, we have a lot of folks on the show who talk about the importance of humility, but Bobby just seems like one of the most humble guys that I've ever heard you interview. And he talks about the importance of listening to others and talking so that you don't hear your own voice, but that you communicate to people in a way that will really land with them.

58:50David Novak:And I just love that sentiment. And I'm excited, David, to get your take on some of these key topics that you discuss with Bobby and some of the stuff that really makes him unique in his leadership style. Well, I think one of the reasons why he's such a great communicator, Kula, is because a big part of his communication is just listening. I mean, when you're with Bobby Long, you know he's hearing what you have to say. He's not thinking about what he's going to say. He's hearing what you have to say. And that makes you feel valued. That makes you feel respected. And I think that's why people want to be around Bobby Long.

59:28David Novak:Well, it's apparent, David, that he has an incredibly high level of optimism in people. And it's apparent throughout the entire conversation. He assumes the best. You know, he does deals on a handshake. He says if the person that he's doing the deal with isn't willing to do the handshake deal, he isn't willing to work with them. And, you know, that's all nice and good. but we all live in the real world. And so I'm curious, David, is that notion of optimism in people and doing handshake deals one that can actually work or can it be naive in some situations? I think that that is the real world. The real world is if you can't shake somebody's hand and believe that they're gonna deliver on the commitment that they offer you, then you shouldn't do business with them.

1:00:14David Novak:And I think that's a principle that he basically lives by. And, you know, obviously, you know, you'll shake somebody's hand, you'll get the handshake deal, but you got to button it up legally and all that kind of good stuff. But that's all over but the shouting match or whatever that phrase is. That's like, that's just a matter of time. But, you know, the fact of the matter is, is if you don't believe in a person enough to shake their hands and know that they're going to deliver, I mean, I don't want to do business with that person. I think that's the real world. And I think it takes great instincts and being a great human being yourself like Bobby Long is to be able to understand whether that person is like-minded, has the same values, wants the same things.

1:00:58David Novak:And when those things happen, you know, you can make a deal. I've heard you say, David, that 99.9 % of people come to work wanting to do good. Explain how that concept translates into this situation. Well, I think what Bobby does is he trusts in positive intentions. He rounds up on people. He doesn't think that people are going to screw him over. You know, he thinks that people are basically going to do good, want to do good. And until they demonstrate otherwise, he's going to be behind him. And, you know, I think that's the best approach that any leader can take. You know, so many times people develop systems or run their company around the 1 % of the people who want to take advantage of it versus the 99 % of the people who want to do well and want to just do the best thing for the company.

1:01:51David Novak:And I think people wake up wanting to do the right thing. They don't wake up wanting to do the wrong thing. Sometimes we do the wrong thing. We don't, that doesn't necessarily mean we want to. Okay. And I think if you run your company and you let people know that you believe in them, you know, they're going to believe in you. And, you know, I think that's just something that, you know, Bobby has in his bones and it works and it works for everybody. David, Bobby also is really intentional with how he spends his time. He spends his time on things that will impact others and have a real lasting effect on the world around him.

1:02:31David Novak:Talk a little bit about that part of his leadership style. Yeah, I'll never forget one of the first times I ever met Bobby, we talked about, you know, how you can give back. And, you know, a lot of people give back through nonprofits. And, you know, that's a good thing. Bobby does. I do. A lot of people, you know, do that. And, you know, nonprofits need your support and your help. But the thing that really impressed me about Bobby is that he wanted to give back by investing his money in things that could change the world and make a real difference. And, you know, for example, both of his parents, as we talked about in this conversation, died of Alzheimer's.

1:03:16David Novak:So he is really working hard on developing a cure. and he thinks he's got the right company to do it, the right people to do it, and he'll make a difference that way. And I think that there's a real great principle that should guide your life. You know, spend your time and spend your money on the things that you're passionate about and will impact others. And that's what Bobby is doing with Alzheimer's. And I think, you know, if you're going to spend your time, do it on something you're passionate about, you care about. If you're going to invest money, do it on something you're passionate about and you care about.

1:03:51David Novak:And I think there's a lot of happiness that comes in that. And, you know, I've said this before, you know, people who impact others in a positive way are the most happy. They're the happiest people in the world. All the research says that, you know, other people, other directed people are just plain happy. And Bobby Long is a happy guy, one of the happiest guys I know. David, that's a great segue into the next topic that I'd love to just get your take on. and it's this idea of relationship building. You say it many times in the conversation that Bobby is just so gifted at building authentic relationships.

1:04:25David Novak:Why are you so struck by that in him? And how can other leaders do the same thing and building authentic relationships with business leaders around them? You know, what I see Bobby do in every circumstance is that there's somebody he doesn't know, he goes up and introduces himself. You know, here's a guy who has every accomplishment in the world and people could be coming up to him. No, he's the first to extend his hand. He's the first to be there to say hello. And as a result, he opens up a lot of doors. He meets a lot of people and he takes an active interest in what they have to say. I remember once he was telling me that he and his wife, Catherine, they were just sitting at a bar and at the end of the bar were two other people talking and they were at this conference.

1:05:10David Novak:He said, well, let's go over and say hello to him. He goes over and says hello to him And he meets Andy Jassy, the chairman and CEO of Amazon, and his wife, Alana. And they've become good friends. And they've done some business deals together that just came as a natural outgrowth. It wasn't like any intention that Bobby had. He didn't even know Andy Jassy was the head of Amazon. But he knew he was a person. And he knew it was a person with his partner there. and he knew that, hey, there are two people he could go say hello to. And his wife, Catherine's the same way. So they're like, they're perfect for each other.

1:05:50David Novak:She's never met anybody she didn't like or didn't want to meet. But I think, you know, if you pursue relationships, if you're the first to do it, the first to reach, you know, to reach out and say hello, it always comes back to you in spades. David, sometimes this term networking has a negative connotation because people might have ulterior motives when they're going after developing a relationship. What would you say to someone who is anti-networking, let's say? I would go back to the beginning. I would say trust and positive intentions that round up on the people that are networking. The people I see network are the people that want to learn the most.

1:06:33David Novak:The reason why they're broadening their reach in terms of the people that they know and the people that they can learn from is because they themselves are avid learners and they themselves are active learners. They're going to put that learning to use and they just love learning. And I know a lot of people that are very successful that are great networkers. So I view it as a compliment, not as a negative. David, as we wrap up this episode, what are the main things that you want our listeners to be thinking about as we close this out? Trust and positive intentions, round up on people and be an optimist as far as being people-related is concerned.

1:07:17David Novak:Second thing is, man, you only have so much time on this earth. So invest your time and your money in the things that you're passionate about and will help others. And last but not least, be the first to build a relationship. Be the first to shake someone's hands and be the first to make someone feel glad that they had the opportunity to meet you. And I'll tell you what, it will come back to you every single time. Well, David, thank you so much. And thank you to Bobby Long for an excellent episode of How Leaders Lead. And of course, thank you to our listeners. Tune in next Thursday and we will see you soon.