Lessons from 102-year-old swimmer Maurine Kornfeld

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1:33you're listening to how to be a better human i'm your host chris duffy before we get into the episode a quick note this is the last episode of season three of how to be a better human and after this the better human team is going to take a few weeks off for the holidays and then we will be back with new episodes for season four in the new year and on a personal note i am going to be taking parental leave for the birth of my first kid which i'm very excited about a little nervous but mostly excited. And I feel really lucky to be hosting a show like this where I get to have advice from all these brilliant experts about how to handle life transitions like the one that my family is about to go through.

2:08When it comes to this podcast, we have been pre-recording episodes, so you will be able to keep listening to our show in the new year as per usual. But I wanted to give you a heads up because I will be out changing diapers and feeding a baby and trying my best to get some sleep. You know, with this big transition that's coming up in my life, I have been thinking a lot about family these days. What family means, what it requires from us, how I want to show up as a family member. And today's episode is very near and dear to my heart because it's with a person who I consider to be one of my chosen family members.

2:40She's also someone who I have learned a ton about what it means to be a better human from. Maureen Kornfeld is many things. She has worked as a social worker, a teacher, a docent at an art museum. but the way that most people know her is as a swimmer. In the pool, they call her Mighty Mo. And Mighty Mo is a world record-setting competitor who was inducted into the International Swimming Hall of Fame. And at the end of this month, Mighty Mo is going to be celebrating her 102nd birthday. And she's still in the pool most days. In fact, that is how Mo and I met. I was swimming laps in the public pool and Mo was in the lane next to me when she called me over to give me some pointers on what I was doing wrong in my strokes.

3:20We started talking and then I started seeing her every time I went to go to the pool to work out. It felt like she was always there and she always worked out harder and stayed in longer than I did. That is 100 % of the time she was there for longer than I was. Eventually, as we started chatting more, she invited me to come over and have some iced tea on her porch. And I took her up on that offer and long story short, now she is one of my dearest friends in Los Angeles and a person who I consider to be a member of my chosen family. There are so many reasons why I love Mo. She's interesting. She's curious.

3:54She's hilarious. She's always got an opinion about a book or an article she's read that she wants to share. And when we hang out, I am always laughing. Mo has a quicker, sharper wit than just about anyone that I know. One of the many lessons that I've learned from Mo over the years is that it is never too late to learn a new skill. I mean, Mo has dozens of world records. She's won world championships. She's in the Hall of Fame. but she only seriously started swimming when she was in her 60s. Until then, she didn't even know that there were different kinds of strokes. In fact, Mo only joined a master swim team.

4:29That's what they call the swim leagues for adults. She only joined a master's team because she wanted to take a dip in the pool on a Saturday morning, but it was closed to everyone except for competitive swimmers. And Mo wasn't about to let that stop her, so she basically bluffed her way onto a team. And I wanted to swim on Saturday morning because I worked all week. And they said you can't. And I said, what do you mean you can't? And they said, there's a swim team, a master's team. Well, that meant nothing to me. And after an argument with whoever was on the phone, she gave me a name and number and says, well, call the coach.

5:07And I called the number and this grouchy guy answered the phone and asked strange questions like, how long have you competed? I had no idea what he was talking about. So I said, not long, which was the truth. And he says, what's your stroke? And I never knew that it was really any stroke. I said, none in particular. And after this prolonged conversation, he says, well, you can come on Saturday morning and I'll look you over. like I was a side of beef.

5:52That was the start of a grand adventure and a chapter that would come to define Moe's life and friendships. We are going to talk a lot more about that in just a moment after these quick ads. Don't go anywhere.

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8:17Today, we're talking about swimming, life, and finding your passion with Maureen Kornfeld, also known as Mighty Mo. Mighty Mo is 101 years old, and she still swims almost every day of the week. She set her first Masters world record in swimming when she was 90 years old, and she has competed in world championships everywhere from Montreal to Budapest to Italy, racking up gold medal wins and record times along the way. But people are often surprised when they talk to Moe to hear that she doesn't really care about the competitive part of swimming all that much at all. What she really cares about is just being in the water.

8:50What do you get out of swimming? A lot of fun. I like the people. I like the feel of the water. It's exhilarating. It's good for your mental health. It washes all the nonsense out for the moment. Something that I've noticed, you know, we met because of the pool. And whenever I talk to you, you have such a wide network of people who are swimmers. You know every swimmer in town. I know a lot of swimmers. So how has that contributed to you being part of a community? Oh, I love it. I love being part of a swim team. I've never been a groupie, I suppose, because we have the same thing in common. and they're all interesting and, of course, all different.

9:40So it's a wide range of people, obviously, and I enjoy them. It's nice knowing people different from oneself. And how do you think that that changes your life for the better? Oh, I think it enriches it beyond belief. I've heard you talk about getting your daily dose of chlorine. Oh, yes, yes, yes, my chlorine fix. Is that what it feels like? Like when you don't do it, you miss it? After a couple of days, yeah, I want to go to the pool. I want to see my friends. I just want to be there. Will you describe what it feels like to be competing in a meet? Like, what do you feel in your body when you get in the water and you're competing?

10:30That's a good question. and it's an important one. I like the fun of swimming. I like to swim well. I like to do whatever I'm doing to do it well. So what I try to focus on is what I'm doing, how my arms are moving, how my legs are, is my head in a good position. It's nice if you win, but it's okay if you don't win if you swim well. And what does swimming well mean to you? Swimming well means you're doing what you should be doing. What life lessons have you learned from swimming? What has swimming taught you? To get wet. Okay, that's one. Oh, I don't know that it's taught me any life lessons. Yeah, it has persistence, the value of routine, discipline, self-discipline, particularly, you know, you win some, lose some.

11:37That's life. Something that I find to be very meaningful for myself about swimming is that if you fight the water, if you push hard, you don't do better. The way to go faster is to be smoother and to resist less. Yeah. To me, that's a very important life lesson. Yes, it is. Yeah. That if you work with it. With the water. If you're smoother and your stroke is well done, you will move faster if you have faster turnover. What do you mean by turnover? Pardon? You mean like the turn at the end of the wall? Yeah. You got to keep moving. Yeah. I'm not good at that part. I'm not going to keep it going.

12:22That takes practice. It takes remembering. It takes thinking about while you're doing it. And I guess that's one of the things I do like about swimming is the concentration probably helps with other stuff, too. But if you pay attention to what you and really think about what you're doing, you're more likely to do it better. Mo is a celebrity at pools all around town. In fact, anytime I hear that someone regularly swims in LA, I ask them if they know Mighty Moe, and you would be shocked at how often the answer is yes. In an LA Times profile that was written about Moe, the reporter discovered that swimmers in Glendale, Pasadena, and Sherman Oaks all claimed Moe as their own, and they were all convinced that that was her home pool.

13:10All of which is to say that Moe gets around town and she makes every single swimmer that she crosses paths with feel special. And I know it's not just me who feels that way. Jim Rainey, the LA Times reporter who wrote that profile of Moe, first met her in the pool too. And like me, he was charmed by her wit. But when he started asking around about Maureen for his reporting, he heard story after story about her kindness too. One swimmer told him how Moe had checked in on her repeatedly after there was a sudden death in her family. Another swimmer talked about how Moe had connected her with a friend who had become a really important relationship for her.

13:45And a third talked about how Moe started inviting him to see concerts together and now they had a regular practice of seeing shows and operas and all sorts of other events together. Mo is a great listener. She loves to hear about other people's passions and interests. What she doesn't love to do as much is talk about herself. And as you can imagine, that made doing this interview with her for this show a little bit of a challenge. It seems like everything that you've done, or a lot of the things that you've done, you care a lot about community and being a part of, in community with other people.

14:17I don't know. Maybe. That doesn't ring true. Well, it hasn't rung any bills up to now. OK, but I guess what I mean is, you know, social work is about taking care of other people. And when I see you at the pool and even I know this for myself, you're always reaching out. You're trying to build new relationships and friendships. That's something that not everyone does. But you you really do that. You put a lot of energy into relationships. Maybe idle curiosity. I don't know. What is that? Tell me more about that. I do care about people and I care about finding things that help people or helping them find that, whatever it is to help themselves.

15:01I will say that I really appreciate you doing this interview because I know how much you don't like for the focus to be on you. Whenever someone wants it to be about you, you're like, no, tell me about yourself instead. You'd much prefer to be interviewing than be interviewed. That's quite possible. Uh-huh. Since Mo would prefer for me to do more of the narrating rather than interrogate her over and over, I'll just tell you a few facts about her life that I think are important to know. Maureen was born in 1921. She grew up in Great Falls, Montana. Her dad owned a menswear shop and her mom stayed at home, raising her and her two brothers.

15:33I guess I grew up in a family where there was a fair amount of laughter. It was during the Depression years, so there wasn't much to really laugh about. But what do you know when you're a kid? In your family, even during the Depression years, do you remember people laughing? Yeah. What kind of things were you laughing about? Who knows? I don't remember. I had two older brothers. One, the oldest of the two, older, was more serious, more introverted. The one younger than he, but again, older than I, was kind of a prankster. He was a redhead with all that goes with it. Okay. Mo would often follow her brothers to the local library.

16:23She's always loved to read, and she frequently lost herself in a good book. After high school, Maureen headed to the University of Chicago, where she got a bachelor's and a master's degree in social work. She loved her time at the University of Chicago. It's something she loves to talk about. But at first, she wasn't really positive that social work was going to be for her. At first, I wasn't sure what it was. And secondly, I wasn't sure it was what I was really wanting or interested in. Why? I was kind of an egghead, and it didn't seem very intellectual. show and also the people I saw enrolled in it at that time were all much older than I was.

17:11I went from undergraduate school from age 20 into graduate school and I had had classes with the president of the University of Chicago and great books. And as I say, kind of the egghead treatment. And social work is not very, it's more scrambled eggs. So what, what changed that made you actually like it and stick with it? It kind of grew on me. And I saw and found more opportunities to do things that were of interest and I saw results. And I can't really tell you otherwise. And particularly after I moved to California in 1970, I began doing more social work in the community rather than in agencies that were more confined.

18:16In Los Angeles, Mo worked at a number of places and institutions, but two of her most memorable, longest-lasting jobs were serving the L.A. Unified School District and Cedars-Sinai Medical Center. We're going to hear more about Mo's life, her career, and her tips on aging well right after this quick break. Don't go anywhere.

19:10We'll see you next time. What's in your wallet? Terms apply. Lounge access is subject to change. See CapitalOne.com for details. The market's uncertain. Revenue's tied and hiring on hold. That's why results-driven companies are using Upwork to keep work moving. Go to Upwork.com today and start hiring proven freelance talent fast. No bulky overhead. No rigid long-term contracts. Just the right expert right when you need them. Work smarter and faster with Upwork. Go to Upwork.com now and find your freelance expert. That's U-P-W-O-R-K dot com. Post a job for free and get started today. I'm no tech genius, but I knew if I wanted my business to crush it, I needed a website now.

19:52Thankfully, Bluehost made it easy. I customized, optimized, and monetized everything exactly how I wanted with AI. In minutes, my site was up. I couldn't believe it. The search engine tools even helped me get more site visitors. Whatever your passion project is, you can set it up with Bluehost. With their 30-day money-back guarantee, what have you got to lose? Head to Bluehost.com to start now.

20:18Today, we're talking with Maureen Kornfeld, a 101-year-old world champion swimmer, former social worker, and current very good friend of mine. A lot of people are interested in you and your story, partly because of your accomplishments and partly because of your thing, but also sometimes it's just because of the age that you are. So what do you think it is that people don't realize about aging and aging well? I think they, people sometimes, maybe often, I don't know, think you're more competent and better shape, whatever, than you really are. But that's rather nice. Yeah. But you are in really good shape and you are very confident.

21:01You don't feel like that? Well, I know all the foibles and all the errors and things that aren't quite so as they were. Of course. How do you handle that for yourself? How do you stay positive? I think one of the ways I handle it is being involved with other people. You know, when you're involved with other people, you don't think about yourself. And I think most of us tend to think more about ourselves than we need to. So what about for me? You know me pretty well. What advice would you give me? Stay as you are, baby. That's nice. What do you mean? What is the thing that I should keep doing? No, I enjoy your smile, your humor, your devotion to Molly, your sense of adventure, and your steadiness.

22:00Thank you. That's very flattering. Yeah. What about talking about sense of humor for a second? You have a great sense of humor. So do you. So there. Yeah. Well, so first of all, what's something that makes you laugh? I suppose it's something unexpected. And why do you think it's important? Why do you think humor is important? Oh, because it gives you perspective. And that big problem you were so worried about somehow just disappears. because it's pretty easy to focus on things that aren't going well, feeling sorry for yourself, which we all do, and I do too much. It takes you out of yourself and gives you a better, different perspective.

22:49So how do you get good at laughing at yourself? You're so good at laughing at yourself. Well, most of the situations in which we find ourselves that are miserable or self-inflicted pain, really, if you look at them from a distance, they're quite different. if you look at what happens in one's life and step away from the immediate you begin to see with some perspective oh isn't that strange isn't that funny isn't that weird mo makes me laugh a lot one of the most recent times she gave me a good laugh is when i was doing research for this episode and i read that she had told a reporter who was researching a story about her that the profile was going to be, quote, a terrible waste of newsprint, unquote.

23:40And then that Mo had self-described as a chlorinated curmudgeon. That's how she described herself. I am sure that she feels similarly about this podcast, that it is a horrible waste of audio print. I'm certain of it because she has told me many times, why would you be doing this interview? Why would anyone want to listen to this? Well, for one, I love talking to someone who doesn't take themselves too seriously, who is so uninterested in praise or attention that they try and convince a reporter writing a glowing profile about them that he is wasting his time. But more than that, I love talking to someone who truly embodies the spirit of this show.

24:16I mean, how to be a better human? To me, the answer is be more like Mo. Get out there, make friends, have fun. Don't take yourself too seriously. Don't ever believe that it is too late to start doing something new. Set records, but also don't worry too much about them. Just do it because you like being in the water and do your best to love who you are in the water with. But enough for me. Let's hear some more advice from Mo herself. And what about if you were to give people three things to do to improve your life? What should you do? Three things to do for what? To improve your life. Oh my God.

24:51Laugh. Okay. Laugh's one. Yeah. Well, you can't get in too much trouble Well, unless you laugh at the wrong time or at the wrong person, then you might get into a little Dutch. Three things. Outdoors, I think, is important. I love the outdoors. I'm kind of an outdoorsy. Maybe because as kids, we played outdoors. Nobody had invented a computer, and we didn't own a radio, and no one had come up with a TV, so we were shoved outdoors to get out from under our parents' feet. Reading, I think, is important. It has been for me. It broadens your world. It opens your world, and it develops skills. For instance, I was talking with a friend who teaches ESL, and I told her that as a kid, how I learned and memorized nursery rhymes and the whole set of poems by In the Child's Garden of Verses, Stevenson.

26:15and that developed the skill, which I didn't know time and where was I, developing skills in my head of memory. So there are many things you can do that are fun and that might improve your life. But they might not, but they might be fun. Okay, so we've talked about reading, we've talked about swimming. What do you think about just the balance between being independent and taking care of yourself and building community and relying on other people? How do you think about that? Well, yeah, obviously you need to take care of yourself or you become a burden for others. You know, you've got to learn to brush your teeth and wash your face now and then.

27:04And doing things for others should just be kind of automatic. It's part of being a member of the human race, of helping people. It was certainly part of our bringing up. It was just kind of automatic. You just did it. People didn't go around with a little phone in one hand and fingers on it in the other and their face. down in it, preoccupied with themselves and with their own activity. Well, that's all that I have. Thank you so much, Mighty Mo. A pleasure. Thank you for being through. Okay. All right. Does anybody ever say that? No, you're the first.

27:55That is it for today's episode of How to Be a Better Human. Thank you so much to today's guest, Maureen Kornfeld. That is it for this season of How to Be a Better Human. Thank you so much for listening. I am your host, Chris Duffy, and you can find more from me, including what I'm up to when I'm not hosting this show, on my weekly newsletter. Sign up for free at chrisduffycomedy.com. How to Be a Better Human is brought to you on the TED side by the synchronized swim team of Daniela Balarezzo, Chloe Shasha Brooks, and Joseph Debrine. This episode was fact-checked by Julia Dickerson and Mateus Salas, who assure me that Great Falls is the name of a real town in Montana and not just a review of me trying to ski.

28:30On the PRX side, our show is put together by a team of aquatic masterminds that includes Morgan Flannery, Norgil, Patrick Grant, and Jocelyn Gonzalez. And of course, thanks to you for listening to our show and making all of this possible. If you are listening on Apple, please leave us a five-star rating and review. And if you're listening on the Spotify app, answer the discussion question that we put up there. We would love to hear your thoughts. We will be back next year with even more episodes of How to Be a Better Human. In the meantime, stay safe, be well, and thanks again for spending your time with us.

29:02Thank you.

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