Mel Giedroyc - I Lost My Biggest Fan When Mum Died

0:00And I've never done this before in my life. And I've only done it once. I phoned my agent and I said, I want out of this. And their dad said, could they come and stay with us, please, for half term? Mum said, absolutely. Brilliant. We'd love to have them. And they stayed for seven years. And I was doing that thing where I was half laughing, half crying. You know, that thing where you're just like that. I slightly sharted at Digka Parkway. Can I say that? Hello and welcome to How to Fail with me, Elizabeth Day. This is the podcast that believes all failure has something to teach us in the fullness of time, even if the only thing it teaches us is that we were strong enough to survive it.

0:39Before we get into this episode, please do remember to like, rate and subscribe so that you never miss a single conversation.

0:51This episode is brought to you by Didi's Discounts. Back to school season is officially here and DeeDee's has everything on your list. I'm talking bold styles, cool kicks, backpacks, and even dorm room essentials. All the prices that won't hurt your wallet. So don't sleep on DeeDee's. Whether you've got a second grader or a sophomore, DeeDee's has your whole family covered. Find a DeeDee's discount store near you and go check it out today.

1:19Introducing Meta Glasses. Hey Metta, any last minute tables for two tonight? Sure, there's a great Italian restaurant 15 minutes away. Hey Metta, where's the nearest flower shop? Five minutes away, straight down Broadway, past the bodega. Their lilies are trending on Instagram. Just saying. Hey Metta, am I forgetting anything else? How about setting a calendar reminder for next year? Metta glasses, available in more than 20 styles. Mel Gedroych is a comedian, writer and TV presenter who has been entertaining the nation for over 30 years, almost always intentionally. The youngest of four children, she was raised in Leatherhead, Surrey, where she discovered an early passion for theatre.

2:04Later at Cambridge University, she met Sue Perkins through Footlights. It was platonic love at first sight. They formed a comedy duo and spent years performing at the Edinburgh Fringe as well as touring the country and supporting themselves with odd jobs. Gedroych was variously a barmaid, a telesales agent and a cleaner. Their big break came in 1996 when French and Saunders hired them as writers. From there, Mel and Sue went on to present the hit Channel 4 series, Light Lunch and Late Lunch, and then in 2009, fronted the great British Bake Off, shaping the show with their trademark kindness and humour.

2:46They stepped down from Bake Off in 2016, leaving them free to pursue independent careers. Since then, Gedreuth has written a Sunday Times bestselling novel and fronts the podcast, Where There's a Will, There's a Wake. Now she returns with a new novel, The Comeback, a funny, big-hearted book about second chances set in a community theatre. My whole career, she says, has been random and quite surreal. She got away with it. That's what will be on my gravestone. Mel Gedroych, welcome to How to Fail. Welcome back, I should say, because it's the second time in this chair. It's so nice to be back. It's so lovely to have you back.

3:30And this time it is all about you because the first time was for a round table, but now the focus is on Mel. Can you see me? Because I'm very well camouflaged in the pink. I can just about see you. It's like one of those 90s pixel drawings where I have to focus my eyes carefully and then you pop out because you have very kindly dressed in our brand colours today. So thank you. Very professional. Now, that idea of having got away with it, you don't really think that, do you? Do you? Yes and no. I would say, I mean, Sue and my career together is about our friendship. We were never manufactured and put together by a manager.

4:12We were mates at university. So everything that we've done together, the kind of the core of it, the DNA of it, is about us being friends. But when we get together, unless we are marshaled, corralled, sort of basically positioned, we just chat, laugh, go over old anecdotes, do what friends do. I would say we find it hard to be kind of business people because the friendship is always first. getting away with it I think implies that we're not very uh you know we don't have flow charts and um pie charts in an office somewhere we don't have an office the Mel Sue Collective literally meets in one of our houses or a pub or a curry house there's there's nothing very together about it and I'm not I don't think I'm being disingenuous when I say that but do you acknowledge that you're talented?

5:11I find that hard. I find that hard because I think if you do, you've sort of lost the plot a bit. And I've met people who I admire, some of them, who are very, very sort of sure of themselves and kind of say, I'm really good at this. I'm really confident at this. And sometimes I go away just thinking, bit of a plum. Do you know what I mean? Can I say that? Yes, you absolutely can. Because you just sort of, I just sort of think, oh, really? You know, but at the same time, and I've said this word already on the podcast, so forgive me, I don't want to be disingenuous and sort of say, oh, I'm so bad.

5:51Oh, I'm so bad. Oh, I'm so terrible. You know, I think I am a confident person and I love what I do. But I think the day that I kind of say, I've got this is the day that I'll have to give up. Yes. What does that mean? I do know what you mean. And I think there's something specific about your humour, which is never about punching down. There's a kindness to it that is observational and compassionate that doesn't attract from it being funny. I hope so. Yeah. Well, I think that's why it was so special when you did Bake Off because you brought that into the mainstream and it felt like we hadn't seen it on that kind of competitive reality show.

6:27Yeah. We hadn't seen that level of kindness. it wasn't sentimental okay good it was funny yeah as well yes i think if it gets too saccharine then it it stops being funny doesn't it there's got to be a kind of a balance but i've got to tell you this day one series one shooting bake-off i think the thought was because it was a reality show it would be filmed along the lines of those kind of right go go go get that person they're crying right they're they're having a breakdown get that person move the cameras quickly there was that kind of vibe and I was I was really shocked actually and I've never done this before in my life and I've only done it once I phoned my agent and I said I want out of this this was after day one leave Sue in there but I want out I think I did let her know I said look I'm gonna phone the agent And she was like, yeah, yeah, no, no, that's fine.

7:24That's fine. And I called a meeting in the bed and breakfast where we were. This was the morning of day two of episode one, because it had been like an 18 hour shoot and everyone was in tears. And I just thought, I've never worked like this before. so there was a bit of a summit meeting I have to say which happened between episodes one and episode two um at the BBC where I spoke up and I just said this is not the kind of show that we want to make I'm really sorry we won't get the best out of people I don't like this vibe where everyone's crying and then suddenly they're on camera people do cry on Bake Off but they cry because it's kind of emotional and they've put stuff into it.

8:12We don't want to make them cry because they're so exhausted and they feel, you know, put upon. So I think, I hope, we made it very clear the kind of show that we wanted to make. And I've never done that before. I've never threatened anything like that in my life. I'm just not that kind of person. But I felt in that instance I had to say something because it would have been really grim and things changed. Things changed after that day. So I was really, you know, we were, as a collective, we were proud of ourselves that we'd sort of spoken up because I think it would have been a very different show.

8:49Definitely. Yeah. I mean, well done. That is, because honestly, kindness often gets overlooked because at its essence, it's a very radical thing. You revolutionize television in a way. I mean, it really did. No, I'm saying it, you're not. I know that you can't. But that was a huge thing to have done and good for you. I happen to believe as well, you know, and this is probably with the kind of the slight business head or the TV head or whatever it is on, that you actually get the best out of people when they're relaxed. And that was our prime, prime, number one concern. And what we aimed to do, it was our ambition on that show, was to make the Bakersfield relaxed because then you get the best out of them.

9:34When they're having a laugh and when they feel they can sort of forget they're on camera, I mean, it's a bit of a no-brainer, really. I want to come on to your book in a minute, but just before I do, Bake Off continues to exist without you. Is it a bit like a kid going to university? I feel bad. Hand on heart, I never watched the show when we did it. My family watched it and I'd occasionally go in and just be like, you know, I've never watched it. So I haven't seen it on the BBC. I've seen bits. Of course I have. I'd be lying if I said I haven't seen bits, but I've never sat down and watched like a whole series or a whole episode.

10:12So when it went to Channel 4 with all the kind of the furore and the la-di-da that surrounded that, I haven't followed it. We hoped and we knew that it would do well. I never wanted it to do badly. I don't believe in that, that schadenfreude bullshit because I kind of think it only comes back at you. If you want ill on something or somebody else, it'll just come back on you. So we always wished it well and it's done brilliantly because it's a really good format. We know that it's in safe hands. Let's talk about The Comeback, your new novel, because it really is the epitome of this kind of warm humour and observational kindness.

10:54And it's such a joy to read. Now, we have quite a few things in common, which we'll come on to. Not Leatherhead. Epsom. Oh, I was born in Epsom. So was I. Epsom District Hospital. So was I. Oh my love. I know, Epsom's so special. Oh my God, Epsom. Big up the Epsom massive, no one's ever said, but I feel deeply connected to you. Oh, Epsom. Epsom and Leatherhead. Now the comeback is actively inspired by your experiences as a child of community theatre, isn't it? Yes. So what did theatre mean to you at a young age? I can say hand on heart, even more than Christmas Day, and this is terrible. I'm sorry, mum and dad.

11:35It sounds very irreligious about Christmas Day. But for me, the most important day of the year was the day that we went to Panto. And I'm sure there are a lot of kids who feel the same. It was everything. It was so particular and so special. And it was the first time I ever got onto a proper stage because there's always that bit in panto. It's usually the dame who says, and come on up kids. I don't know if they do it these days, probably with health and safety. I really hope they do do it these days, but all the kids bundled on. And I remember just running up every year and just that feeling of being on a stage.

12:16It sounds a bit pretentious and a bit hammy, but it was just, I just couldn't believe it. I just got the bug really early on. And the comeback is set in this world of a community theatre. And you open the book with a quote from Voltaire, because even though it is very funny, you also are a very learned writer. Can I just say, you make an amazing joke about Hedda Gabler and giving heads. Okay, that's what I was saying. It's so good. Thank you. Thank you. I'm really pleased. It's so good. But you start with this quote from Voltaire, whoever condemns the theatre is an enemy to his country. Is that how you feel?

12:52Definitely. Yeah, absolutely. I believe so strongly in the power of theatre and the power of the arts in general. I believe it should be funded with every penny that we have. I believe it is so important for children, for young people, particularly as a place to belong, as a place to express yourself, as a place to feel free, as a place to feel that you're not under the constraints of your school or your family situation or whatever it is. It is vital for a healthy society. And we are absolute idiots if we don't fight to have it funded properly. You are the youngest of four. Plus you had two foster brothers.

13:36Yes. What was your experience of being the youngest? So mum and dad are sadly no longer with us. But the six of us had a really sort of lively, it was a lively household, lots of gags. My brother's the eldest and he is, swear down, the funniest guy that I know, the funniest. So you had to kind of like, there was a sense of, right, I've got to keep up. I've got to keep up here. There's a lot of bants, a lot of teasing. No one was allowed to have a sort of a pumped up, pompous view of themselves. And as the youngest, you've got to really fight to get yourself heard. Hence, going into sure business.

14:21Yeah. Going into sure business. Loved being the youngest. But then when I had my two foster brothers, that was so good. It was so good to actually suddenly be, you know, older than the two of them. I loved that. It gave me a sense of, you know, status, responsibility. What a beautiful thing for your parents and your family to do. Yeah. Well, listen, it was the 70s, so it was done completely unofficially. They were, Greg and Rob, they were the sons, stick with me on this, the sons of my elder sister's godfather's brother. Got it. their family had some challenges and they rang my mum because that's what people did they always rang my mum she was the go-to phone rosie get her on the phone what do we do what's happening and and and he their dad said could they come and stay with us please for half term mum said absolutely brilliant we'd love to have them and they stayed for seven years yeah it was one of those they were with us in term time they went to their dad in the holidays but they went to my school they were like my little brothers and it was amazing thing of my mum to do when I think of it incredible we'll talk more about your mother yes and I'm looking forward to that yeah an incredible thing yeah in so many ways everything we've been talking about in terms of the community theatre is reflected a bit in your family it's this sort of group of people brought together by an endeavour bigger than them and it's a lot of fun as well it's to do with my dad being an immigrant as well you know coming here as a refugee as he did after the war in 1947 and um joining my mum and she had quite an artistic big lively family so the two of them the pairing in leatherhead it was sort of open doors because dad knew loads and loads of poles that had come over in a similar situation so every house was an open house in a way all the poles we had loads of poles um coming through some relatives some friends there was never a sort of closed door policy until the day my mum died literally and i know we're going to talk about that as well it's so sweet until the day she died there was an open door.

16:54Come in. Yeah. People come in. Everyone's sitting around. Everyone is, yeah, the group mentality, the gang. It's all about the gang. Beautiful. That is the second thing that we have slightly in common. My husband's mother is a Polish refugee. A very, very similar story. Her parents were taken to the Gulag from a very similar place to your father. Goodness me. She lost two older brothers who she never met. And she was born in a refugee camp in Jaffa. No. And then eventually came to England and was raised in Lancashire. And she has this extraordinary warmth and spirit about her that is so special.

17:34Oh, that's really interesting. And I think it's probably because if you've lost your home, maybe it's because wherever you then go, you want to create. You need to create something around you that replicates. I don't know. I'm no psychologist, but there may be something in that, you know. You're a podcast host. it's as good. But Justin, my husband, has always felt very connected to you and has always rooted for you on TV for that reason. That's really nice. That's what I'd like to know. Does he speak Polish? No, he's also half Italian, so he speaks more Italian. Oh, that's a great combo. It is a great combo.

18:10That's a great... The warmth levels must be like... Rocketing high. If you know me, you'll know I love reality TV. I find it's great escapism and just the best way to take my mind off work and chill out. My favourite thing to do after a particularly busy period is to position myself on the sofa with my lovely cat Huxley and watch The Real Housewives. Something that makes this ritual even more enticing is a Lola's blanket. It's crafted with ultra-soft luxury faux fur and a signature four-way stretch that sets it apart. What's more, it's machine washable, which is crucial with Huxley around. He does like to molt, bless him.

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19:33Back to school season is officially here and DeeDee's has everything on your list. I'm talking bold styles, cool kicks, backpacks and even dorm room essentials. All the prices that won't hurt your wallet. So don't sleep on DeeDee's. Whether you've got a second grader or a sophomore, DeeDee's has your whole family covered. Find a DeeDee's discount store near you and go check it out today. Got a Sam's Cafe pizza order up. You know the best part about this spicy Italian sausage? I voted for this topping. Yeah, just another perk of being a member. Come join us. Sam's Club. Let's get on to your failures, Mal.

20:14Yes. Okay, your first failure. In your eyes, you failed to get a decent degree. So you go to Cambridge, you study languages. Yeah. Do you enjoy your degree? I had such a great time at uni. And I know people always, I tend to put the old prisms, you know, the rose tinted prisms on everything. So as far as I'm concerned, everything in the past was great. Everything that happened was great. Nothing bad happened. obviously it was up and down but in general I absolutely loved university I do I have a dream probably twice a year a recurring dream where I'm going to my finals I have the same dream that's so weird isn't it isn't it awful yes and I haven't learnt the syllabus yeah exactly the same but Elizabeth I hadn't I hadn't I genuinely hadn't it was it was really really bad it was really bad for some reason unbeknownst to me there was a whole array of papers of exams I could have chosen things like 20th century French literature I loved reading French books could have done that an art history one would have loved that all that kind of stuff I chose the history of the Italian language which was no offense to any um you know people that do that the driest thing I could have chosen and I didn't attend a single lecture not a single one not a single one so I was in absolute doo-doo and my best friend uh walked me to the exam and I was doing that thing where I was half laughing half crying you know that thing like that all the way to the exam.

22:02And I wrote about 25 pages of absolute guff. I wrote about the goodies who were a comedy sketch trio in the 1970s. I wrote about Monty Python. I wrote, it was all guff. I mean, I wrote lots and lots. But I mean, at Cambridge University, this gift, this gift of an opportunity I don't feel good about that if I could I would go I wouldn't get into Cambridge now absolutely no way that was 40 years ago different times I would go to university and I would do that degree again I'm actually impressed that you got a 2-2 given that must have been so stressful yeah it was awful so that dream I don't know if yours is the same I was literally and this is awful before that exam that particular one there was medieval French as well which I again hadn't I didn't I hadn't been to any lectures anyway I was considering this is awful I was considering if I could fall down a few stairs and get a minor breakage on my writing hand so that I so that I couldn't do the exam I was literally I remember standing at the top of the stairs And then I thought, this is really bad.

23:23I can't do this. I painted on a black eye with some lipstick, which looked shite, some dark lipstick. I painted on a black eye because I thought, if I go in with a black eye, maybe they'll think, oh, we'll bump her up a bit. She's obviously had a bit of a hard time. Ridiculous. Desperate. But also, yes, desperate. Desperate. The way you're talking about it, it's also funny. But I imagine at the time, did you feel a sense of responsibility to make the most of this degree and this opportunity? Partly because of what your father had been through. Right. Yes. Dad came here with nothing. He came here with a sort of Polish army because he was training up.

24:11He was too young. He never fought. Thank goodness. He was training up in what was then Palestine in the Polish military school. So he had his uniform. I think he had one small suitcase, a few little bits and bobs that they'd managed to save from the old life and took through Siberia. A couple of photos and that was it. That was it. He came here with nothing. And he did an aeronautical engineering degree at London University. He was really clever. He got in, he got a grant to do that and he gave half of his grant to his mother so that she could, you know, live. I mean, and then I just went in the 80s and just squandered, you know, drinking, having a brilliant time, you know, I mean, come on.

25:02You say squandered, but you did. I met Sue. Yes. I met Sue. I met brilliant people and I did lots of comedy. I did do lots of comedy. Is that why you didn't make a single lecture? Because you were busy with footlights? But lots of people were busy with footlights and they blooming worked and got a good degree. Did you ever talk to your dad about your feeling of shame? No. My dad, I think because I was the youngest, was actually quite indulgent, probably. He was a bit more hardcore with the elder ones. But I think when it got to me, they were just so like, oh, whatever you know they were tired and just thought well you know she's gone under the radar so be it we also shared a real love of comedy and I think that got me out of jail so God bless him God rest his soul he never made me feel terribly guilty there was the odd you know little gag about it but no that was very that was very good actually I was never made to feel guilty about it.

26:04Talk to me about your friendship with Sue. I described it in the introduction as platonic love at first sight. Does that feel accurate to you? Totally. 38 years at the time of recording that we have known each other. We met in 88 and it was like, so back in the late 80s when we were there at uni, there was a lot of comedy going on, which was great. it was pretty much all blokes it's very different now you know thank goodness I think there's real a lot more parity and equality but then there weren't that many girls who were doing comedy so to find that kindred spirit and share a really strong feeling of humor with that person it was That was a gift.

26:50To find somebody that you can literally just jackknife into a kind of hunched position and cry with laughter is a real blooming gift. We knew immediately that we had that. She has spoken in the past with great love and honesty about discovering that she wouldn't be able to have children around the time that you were having children. Yeah. And it's one of those topics that I am deeply passionate about talking about because I don't have children and went through that phase of trying and failing to have babies when so many of my friends were popping them out, it felt like. How difficult, how ghastly.

27:34It is difficult and you're so compassionate and kind to say that. Honestly, I mean, that's a really, really difficult thing to go through. It is. And some friendships lasted and some friends stayed the course and were so understanding. And I hope that I reciprocally was understanding. And some fall by the wayside. Obviously, yours and Sue's has only got stronger and closer. But what was that like for you to go through that with her? it's an odd one because I suppose when I had children I was so taken up with that and so diverted and distracted by that looking back on it I probably maybe should have been a bit more aware of how she was feeling actually now we're talking about it I think she did the right thing because actually what she did was I was taken up with that for, you know, however many years.

28:38And she made the wise decision actually to just to just work. And she had my blessing. She had my absolute blessing to go and do brilliant stuff, which she did on her own. And again, you know, I'm sure there were moments when I sort of was at home thinking, oh, you know, I wish I was, you know, I was doing that. I'm sure I'd be lying if I said there weren't. But in the main, I just felt this is right. You've got to follow your own destiny, haven't you? And of course, we came back to it together when Bake Off turned up out of the blue. I probably should have been a bit more aware. It's only in retrospect where you think, okay, that must have been hard.

29:23Well, to hopefully help you feel a bit better, I think I only realised in retrospect how I felt not having children, in particular friendships. It's one of those things that just takes a while to understand. And the best friendships, like yours and Sue's, allow space for that understanding to come about. Yeah. And what a testament to... Yeah. She's also bloody brilliant with children. And she's godmother to my eldest. And I've actually basically said over the years, you're kind of godmother to both of them. They both absolutely adore her. slightly annoying sometimes. I'm like, hello, hello, you know, and I'm the naggy one and the boring one and the one that's kind of going, have you filled out your form for this?

30:09And you know, all that stuff. And she is just the fun one, the one that you go to. Do you know what I mean? Yes. So that has been the most amazing thing actually in my life and certainly in my kids' lives as well to have perks there as that kind of just stalwart unfair sometimes she's forgotten their birthdays but that's fine we let her get away with that um they they love her and i think i hope that that's kind of made things really better definitely yeah she's brilliant with her nieces children are very drawn to her actually because she's got a very as well as a very cerebral, you know, grown up side.

30:55There's a very playful, just silly, numpty-ish side that kids just kind of go, okay, we're in the right place here. This is really good fun. Yes. And you're not bullshitting me. And you're not bullshitting me. Yeah. Yeah. But God bless her because she could have shut that off. You know, she could have kind of gone, oh, that's too sad or that doesn't feel right or, you know, but she didn't. And that's that's testament to her actually i love the two of you thank you so much i've even got a pink bra on for goodness sake thank you pink sports bra on brand always on brand what about your pants you don't have to show them to us the pants are gray okay fine they weren't meant to be but no it's just the general soup of gray that turn all on the pants thanks for soup okay your second failure is a very moving one and it's your failure to get to your mum's deathbed yes first of all I'm so sorry oh dear Elizabeth listen these things happen I was doing a musical at the time and my mum was ill when I took the job on and I went to mum and it was uh she she was living in Oxford and the musical was in Bristol and I said to mum I've been off this musical and without hesitation it was always her way she went you've got to do it you've got to do it and I was like okay the the train line between Oxford and Bristol is really good so I knew that I could gets to her a lot but I said mum do you feel okay with this she was like don't be ridiculous you've got to do it in fact she bought a ticket to come and see it and she never got to see it but anyway so I was doing the musical at the time and um she was going she was going downhill and she actually died once the show was up and running and I had 16 shows to go but in a classic mum way she was she was a nurse in her earlier years very practical very together she actually died very very early on a Sunday morning so that I had a bit of a gap before I had to be back on stage on Monday night and I didn't have an understudy and I felt this was a new musical I felt the show the show's got to go on if I don't do it then there'll be somebody that comes on with a script and it'll just, no offence to anybody, but the show, it was a comedy.

33:27The show just would be a bit, and it was sold out. People, you know, so I thought, I've got to keep going for those 16 shows. Anyway, because mum was really ill and I knew, we all knew she was going down. Do you mind my asking what the illness was? So mum had been ill, blimey, for about 35 years. She had really, she had a lot of strokes when she was 54. So her health was always very, but she was very strong-willed and just sort of kept going. I said to my brothers and sisters, you know, well, we all said we had 36 stolen years because actually she was pegging out in 1991. She really was. So we were very, very lucky that she kept going, will of steel.