How ANY Restaurant Can Survive & Thrive in 2025? - Rosa's Thai, Black Bear Burger, Ole & Steen, Gordon's Wine Bar Operators

0:28I'll give you the mic here. want to say is a big welcome to all of you tonight thank you for coming along thank you for being part of the event I'm Justin from Square as mentioned there and and yes it's we're just thrilled to welcome you all basically this evening really excited by what we've got into up in terms up tonight in terms of some of the conversations that we're going to be having talking about you know surviving and thriving as we touched on there and it's something that we hear every day from the businesses that we speak to too you know what we hear we're in a really lucky position to be working with businesses of all sizes from when people have the dream of opening up their first stalls to actually going on to making their own first restaurants and growing those international brands as well and of course we have people in the room tonight you know who are chefs who are founders and we understand just how much energy it takes to be involved in this space.

1:24So yeah, what I want to touch on really is, you know, what we hear from our customers is, you know, it takes more than just the passion. It takes grit, it takes determination, and also takes community, which is also, I think, part of the reason why we're here tonight as well. So yeah, with that in mind, you know, Square obviously, you know, wants to play a part of that. We want to be part of this community as well. Really what we do is we are really the tech partner to help make the magic of hospitality happen. We want to take the difficult stuff, you know, taking care of payments, taking care of the inventory management, managing staff, banking, the operations side of it, kind of off your plate, so that you can focus on, you know, kind of the interesting stuff and the magic that hospitality is.

2:10So that's a bit about us, and we might touch a bit on that later, but with that in mind, just want to extend a huge welcome to everyone really excited by the conversations we're going to have um and let's eat be merry drink up tonight and um you know connect as well because i think that's a big part of what we're doing here this evening and that's it i think otherwise let's crack on i'll leave it to you thank you so much mate um sweet well thanks guys uh what i want to start with which probably isn't related to hospitality is bruce lee uh bruce lee has got one of the best quotes of all time, which is be like water.

2:43And I think when you don't have 10x budget, you need 10x creativity. And you need to think of other ways when problems are facing you, how do you swim around those problems? How do you be like water? And I think right now we're in that situation where more and more operators are having to be like water. So I'd love to know what's your heart, the hardest problem you're facing right now. And when you may not have massive budgets how are you using creativity um to swim around that and and stew i think i'd love to open that up with you please first mate um hello everyone welcome to black bear by the way um i think probably our hardest problem at the moment is we're kind of positioned as kind of a best in class in the burger category um because of that we've kind of got a premium price in the category.

3:37But there's always kind of a bit of a glass ceiling or a ceiling, sorry, as to how much you can charge for a burger, just the perception from the customer. So our biggest challenge probably at the moment is offering value to our customer. The way we always look at it is kind of value for money. So we think that what we offer is a great value for the money that our customer's spending. But in terms of the kind of the creativity side of things, so we don't really want to be, we don't want to go into kind of that discount kind of war. We don't want to be somewhere where people come and expect to get a discount.

4:21But at the same time, we kind of want to try and offer customers an incentive to come in and try our food. So in terms of the creativity side of things, what we're looking to do is... Creativity side things. So we're trying to... We're about to launch something soon, actually, which is, you know, the classic Happy Meal? Yeah. So we're actually going to launch soon an adult Happy Meal. So it's going to be like a double burger. It's going to come in a nice little box, double burger, fries, barrel-aged negroni that you pour yourself, and a little adult's toy as well. Sounds good. Don't you, mate?

5:13What's these adults toys? I'm intrigued. Things like bottle openers.

5:30or like tattoos or like mini bottles of our like uh garlic mayo or burger sauce things that are hot honey so trying to kind of play on things that are kind of creative a little bit nostalgic for our customers and think of new ways to to get people in without uh murdering them get people in without having to be one of those kind of discount operators yeah so it's always a fine balance but we're we're trying to do those sorts of creative things going forward amazing and graham mate going to you obviously that's why i love this panel it's very different size businesses oienstein how many sites is it oienstein oienstein whatever you want we're at 110 in denmark 26 here five in new york right um so for the uk um i guess our biggest problem is trying to second guess legislation um what's minimum wage going to be like next year the prices of coffee the prices of chocolate a lot of which are out of certainly out of my control and I and I think without I guess my biggest problem is the fear I have of losing the momentum that we have we just hit our sweet spot kind of middle of last year and every morning waking up and looking at figures going, still there.

7:05And, you know, keeping everyone sharp. When you say sweet spot, as in? We just, all the work that we put together, you know, we did some heavy lifting probably for about a year and a half. And it just all came together. And, you know, we smashed numbers. And it's just about keeping everyone hungry. What was that heavy lifting? Sorry, I'm just curious here. As in what sort of things were you putting in place? because this could help just just these guys just the right people in stores um just every single bit you know in terms of supply chain product mix you know we were we were selling we were making a thousand products to throw 900 of them away um and it was just that whole well this is how we've always done it it's like okay so the first thing we need to do is make money um which you know was a bit of a challenge and we hit a sweet spot and it's just about keeping everyone super hungry getting ahead of everything so last year this time last year we had a pretty poor august so when we were doing a brainstorm in november it's like what we're going to do next year let's do something stupid with cinnamon social okay what's stupid and someone went let's do an ice cream i was like yeah that's really stupid let's do that um and then that person came back and went you know badiani i'm like the gelato people like yeah we're going to do a collab with them i'm like okay brilliant so we've got gelato in stores um that's doing great guns it's meant that we've been able to talk about stuff um and just have a lot more fun but yeah for me it's it's that fear of us getting a little bit complacent getting a little bit success syndrome and not, you know, really working on all the things that we put right.

9:00Amazing. Another thing I'd love to talk about is there's Danny Mayer, who did Shake Shack, very famous restaurateur. He wrote the book, Setting the Table, like all should read it. It's insane. He's got a quote I love, which is scale kills magic. And ultimately, when you're super small, you're with your customers, you can be all over them. You've got that human interaction. as you get bigger, it's how do you have that sort of that magic touch? So Safran, I'd love to speak to you. You're at 46 sites now, which is astonishing. So huge congratulations. How do you do that? How do you, because when I go into Rosa's Tire, you have that, you feel like you're in a small kind of family close-knit place, but you're at scale.

9:44Talk to us. Okay, for, hi everyone, Saipi Mo here. and I am very, very grateful to be here. And, you know, for us, these days, everything is just like too expensive. I mean, to be honest, for us, the food-wise, most of it is import from Thailand. and not only the food wise that you know the ingredients that we have to import them in ourselves also the chef it's so difficult for us and how are we doing that how we survive we need to use the local people but not so many local people work and so we just have to train different people who are worked right here and then you know to be honest to have to help us to save a lot of costings in terms of the the staff cost that is cost a lot of money no I mean it's we are dying not so dying but we survived we survived we trained from a kp staff until you know they they want to become a chef they can be a chef then we train them and um yeah so i think rosie is doing we we we we have a challenge about you know how are we survive on this time you know like everything is just too expensive and it's too much for us what are some of those things you're putting in place to as back to bruce lee to swim around that to stay afloat for us um i don't say that i'm follow the year the water i don't follow the water but i swim against the water when i turn a restaurant 2008 i set up the first site and people asked me why you set up the restaurant did you know the economy this time of the year you know 2008 is dead and I said no but I will make it happen so I did so everyone just thinking why are you doing this and I always thinks investment in something it's just like gamble you win or you lose that's what I always do Amazing.

12:24And what did you, if you were to part, because essentially we're in another 2008 right now, if there's one piece of wisdom you could pass on to these guys who may have slightly smaller businesses, but with ambitions to get to a similar size, what would that be? For me, I'm going to be, if I set up the restaurant now, I'm going to be humble. You know, I'm not trying to go big. And I'm not trying to save my costs either. but I use the best ingredients that I can talk to my supplier. Right now, what I did over here, how I survived, I built a relationship with my supplier in Thailand. I work with the farmer, I work with the factory.

13:10So when I need something, I will always say to them, can you please help us? You know, we need your help this time because if you can help me, it means I help you. So they agree with me. So it's that. That's beautiful. Last week, well, a couple of weeks ago, I interviewed Tom Gosney. I don't know if you guys know Tom Gosney, Absolute G, does the Gosney Pizza ovens, and he's just a super charismatic guy. And he said to me, and it's kind of, I've made a note of it because it just, it was super reassuring, actually, in a fucked up way. But he was like, When you accept business is a series of inbound missiles coming through your head, you start to enjoy it more.

13:55And I was like, all right, mate. And I think there is something cathartic about that. But Amanda, I'd love to go to you. You run prodigious Gordon's Wine Bar. How is that as an experience? And each day you're running that place, what are the missiles that are coming for you? Because I think, again, every single person in this room has a slightly different business, and there's so much nuance and texture. Talk to me about that. Hi, everybody. I feel slightly in awe of all these guys, of these fantastic businesses that are big. Some of you may need Gordon's. It's a one-stop shop. We've just got the one site.

14:33And it is like running the gauntlet. Yeah, every day something comes in and you think, I can't believe that. You try and foresee the problems. And you think you've covered it off. No, something comes in left field. and I suppose that's that's my job my job is is to field those things that come in left field and that keeps me in employment basically so um and I remind myself of that because I do sometimes wonder you know there's a resident who's complained the council have come in Thames Water have come in and said well you haven't got the right grease traps things that you think I've you know you think you so so the way I try and um frame it is to think right this is this is a challenge let's take it positively and find a solution so that's what I try and I try and do it graciously there's a bit of swearing that goes on and then I try if I can't do it in house I'll find somebody who can do it who can do it much more efficiently than me so the problems with the grease trap i find someone who who can make a nice grease trap you can fit it in the tiny space that we don't have and and off we go that's a very unglamorous um example but yeah it is like running the gauntlet and i think you just have to accept that there will you can foresee as much as you like um and then as you say a new piece of legislation comes in or i don't know your supplier suddenly okay here's a good one france you can no longer or france are no longer exporting unpasteurized milk dairy products that's one of our key items on our menu and you think i can't believe this you know this is one of our favorite things that our customers love so what do we do you find something else that replaces it for a brief moment in time and make it your special um and the blue tongue in germany again milk can't come out so the milk prices dairy produce goes up say okay we'll push charcuterie as long as it's not got um pork or beef whatever it is so you just have to it's a bit of a terrible phrase but you have to pivot you have to think right what can i do to circumflict this it is i swim i try and swim with the water but i do i pop out every so often i come up for air what's interesting as i was saying like hospitality it's kind of mucking mucking bullets toiling trenches like everyone's just getting battered left right and center but in terms of your um you know you've got a big brand how's it affecting you the current circumstances cost of living crisis what's happening in your specific yeah it's it's huge i just finishing off on that last bit i used to be entitled ops lose and drains it was always loo's and drains so sorting out the really the grotty stuff but yeah at the national insurance hike and minimum wage really we anticipated it in terms of we we did the numbers um and i i work for a family and the family rely on the income from gordon's to furnish their lifestyle which is their right and that's great and then above that we we operate and do what we do so it's in our interest to make sure we bring the money in so employment costs suddenly they just became disproportionate to what we were turning over so we restructured our pricing and when again service charge when the laws changed on the service charge we used to we used to distribute 90 of the service charge amongst the staff retained 10 and that was used to help run costs of breakages, little things that it was almost a way of encouraging the staff to respect the property, whatever was going on.

18:25So now the whole lot goes to the team. And we were looking at what we were taking. And on 10%, it suddenly meant that our glass washers and table wipers were earning, you know, really a value that wasn't commensurate with what they were doing that then kept the value for those who were working and managing and running other sections. So we reduced our service charge to 5%, which seems a bit crazy, but we then levied our prices on our menu. So the customers were paying pretty much the same of what they had, but it meant that the pot sounds a bit bit ass about face but basically the pot actually got higher for the staff so we were able to keep everybody happy we pay the staff above minimum wage even our junior staff get get a little bit more it's about 14 pounds an hour they get a good service charge at the end of the month and then we also do a performance pay every three months which retains them so we've managed to keep the staff keep the prices at a level the customers are happy and people still come so but we've got a good product i think that's the other thing to say we've got a good quality product and we rely on our suppliers to give us a good price so we work hard with them it's a relationship now a quick shout out to our wonderful sponsor square if you're a restaurant or you're in the food game and you're thinking of diving in hear me out because running a restaurant it's not just about great ingredients and it's not just about great vibes it's payments staff menus online orders and that's where square comes in their tools are built to make all of that smoother faster and let's be honest less of a headache square is the all-in-one restaurant tech system with almost everything you need for day-to-day service designed to give business owners time back to focus on what really really matters with square you can manage your business from anywhere all from one platform which gives you access to your sales your bookings orders staff management inventory and reports whether you're a leading fast-paced quick service restaurant or a full service kitchen square lets you spend more time doing what you actually love square's purpose is economic empowerment being the best digital partner through intuitive beautifully designed tech so their sellers can create the best possible customer experience visit square.com to learn how they can help you take your business to the next level and yeah i think the other thing is is staff retention that seems to be the riddle you know wrapped in the enigma what's something to go to you like in in your long journey there's many sites what is the art to keeping and retaining amazing employees i asked you yes Okay.

21:23You know, how I retain our staff, I look after the staff just like I look after my parents, my auntie, my uncle, my friends. And basically, I always, when they came into my restaurant, you know, they applied for a job and they got a job. And if I go into the reductions, If I went in there, I always said, welcome to Rose's family. I mean, that is my family. You work for me. It's just like you are part of my family. So I look up to my parents. I look up to my family. I look up to my staff just like a family to me. That's it, simple. I don't take people for granted. and so is our management team.

22:21They look after everyone, just like the way I look after them. What specific things do you do? How do I look after them? I give you an example. When I opened the restaurant, the first site, I cooked for my staff every day. every single day they eat my food that I cook for them and if I go to the restaurant this day, I do the same thing or I will cook from home and bring it over for them because the food from home is just like you know the comfy food for them far away home you know and it's not only my Thai staff that eat my food. Non-Thai staff also enjoy my food and they think that they never eat the food like that before.

23:20So that's how I look after them and I maintain that until now. Even now what I did you know to keep the staff happy. We have been our staff every year to Thailand, about 15 of them. Last year I've been about 18 to show them my culture, to show them how we look up to them. You know, we pay for the flight, we pay for everything for seven days. So, maintain. And I keep telling our staff that, you know, it's not because we want you to, you know, it's not, you know, people who put heart and soul in it, you need to have a goal, you know. And then, not only that, how I maintain my staff, 10 years anniversary, give them a ticket to Thailand, you know, like, I will go to the restaurant with a voucher and give to them this is and I will say thank you to them from bottom of my heart what they've been doing to roses and I still keep maintain that relationship with them amazing I can feel that yeah it's beautiful and I think Dan what was kind of been touched on upon is I think first of all you kind of said um no it was you you said about your relationships with your suppliers your relationships with your teams and i think that's what it's about you know i i think that you know the days have gone when it was easy because then so many people were doing it it is so fucking hard excuse my french but it's so hard and i think you've just got to have the mindset that it's always going to be hard and do exactly that whole bit of enjoy it just just literally don't even think about it and and it just reminds me you know like being a waiter and you'd have that one table at the end of the night that stiffed you and you'd go i mean i just had the worst shift ever so you didn't you just had one table that stiffed you that was it and i think you'll go into the every single morning every single day or night wherever you work and go this is going to be really really hard and enjoy it and i think the way that you'll get through and get to the other side is relationships it's relationships with your teams which means you've got to have a great culture you've got to be honest they'll smell bullshit um you have great relationships with your suppliers you also got to have great relationships with your investors and you know just go dudes really really come on this is what we navigate that because that's an interesting one honestly again and it's just that bit of going what do you want okay that's not possible tell it this is possible oh i could live with that and you just take out all of the the games and i think you know you asked the question how do you roll out magic you know you how do you keep magic at scale first of all there's got to be magic and you know you look at the people um the the kind of middle not making it was there magic there in the first place how did you grow to 50 sites when it wasn't it was just someone cookie cutting in you got a bit of private equity you opened up sites that you know it wasn't really going to wash their face and now you're like oh you know i think that magic and people people with that in their their heart and have got that genuine hospitality and relationship yeah yeah yeah and and and we'll do it and we'll have that flair of you know let's try it let's you know I think they want different adult toys by the way um but but I think it just gives you that yeah no completely and I think on that note there's a great book by Izzy Sharp who's the founder of Four Seasons I highly recommend it and he's got a quote which is excellence is the ability to withstand pain and I mean this guy's done I mean hotels around the world gazillions right um and I and I think it is it's when you accept there's pain coming when you accept those missiles coming towards your head there's a weird kind of perturbed but cathartic um reasoning for that you're like okay this is going to be hard but we're gonna we're gonna go through it i would love to talk about other than the c word other than covid because i think everyone got ravaged by that what has been the most specific hardest knock or you know gut-wrenching blow you guys have taken so i think this will all you know help everyone who's experiencing that now.

27:56Stu, if you want to take that one, mate. Yeah. Biggest blow to us was probably about a year and a half after COVID actually. So we're still independently owned, just me and Liz.

28:15Post COVID, we actually traded quite well throughout COVID. And then we've grown very organically everything's just been from cash flow trying to open a new site and just kind of growing organically and just and fairly slowly slowly but steadily um our biggest kind of um shit the bed moment was we were we've always been kind of profitable every month um and then we opened two sites quite in close proximity and time-wise so we did canary wharf and exworth market and we spent pretty much all of our money like kind of doing it and we'd only kind of had a few sites at that point um but it was it was at the point if you remember when there was kind of all the train strikes around that kind of november december time uh and we had just kind of i mean i say we forecast we don't we at that point we weren't really kind of forecasting we were just like yeah if I get this just do it one um but we just thought that we were just gonna every site was gonna continue to be busy we open a new site it's just gonna go um and we got very close to running out of money like running out of cash open a new sites and it was that November December November was quiet December got decimated because of the train strikes and then you're going into January which is typically um the worst month of the year so we had this three months back to back of just like breaking even or losing and we weren't ready for it we were like what are we doing and it was it was a scary time is it was a really valuable lesson but I wasn't thinking at the time when we're going through it I was thinking how are we going to get enough money to kind of get through this but how did you get through it fortunately it was not really much that we did it was it was kind of just one of those timing things and extenuating circumstances with the with the strikes and everything by february the sites that had opened started kind of to kick on uh and it just naturally kind of started to get a bit busier but we took stock and we're like right we can't let that happen again this is a close call let's like uh let's learn from this and not get into that situation again amazing um this goes super quickly but i'm almost at time it's been quite a morbid chat but hopefully some good lessons in there but i'd love to sort of end on a positive note then we'll go to some to um go to some questions but like i think with all of this it's like i'd love to know why do you do this why do you get out of bed every single morning and and get after it and put yourself through this toil um i'd love to start with you please

30:53no no no so as you know what like um no no it's all good so like what we were talking about sort of the negative things and the hard things i think that provides a lot of lessons but also there's a very, you know, I think I interviewed Tom Brown, the chef, if anyone knows him, absolute legend. He goes, we are in the business of happiness. Hospitality is the business of happiness. I love that. I think it's such a beautifully succinct way of putting it. But Safin, what's your reason for doing this for so long?

31:20The reason why I do it for so long, I still enjoy expanding. And I still enjoy cooking. I still enjoy talking to people. And I still enjoy seeing the customer eat and then smile and tell me how fantastic the food is. That keeps me going. It's not anything else. I love to see people happy. I think I was born to make people happy. That is my natural. So, to be honest, running the business, if you're in the hospitality, you have to get to know yourself, that's what you want. And I know myself that I want to make people happy by presenting the best food and the best service that we got. Stewie, boy.

32:27yeah as I think as a founder operator you all constantly have to deal with like the shit that comes with it but on the flip side it's just fun so like on your point as well I love when people try our food hopefully you guys can try it tonight don't be too negative I'll cry but you can kind of get to do whatever you want sex toys

33:02but you you get to experience like all all sides of things I think business is fun I think you get to be creative you get to help people grow in their careers like as you expand and you get to look after people so you every part of what you do there's some negatives to it but it's I just find it fun yeah hang on to make brain uh everything these guys said it's um it's a bug at some point i don't know if you're born with it or you just get this little i don't know extra extra bit of your heart that just wants to serve people and whether that's serving your team or your customers or your mates and you know in the last six months mate i'm in the shit yeah yeah i've got a spare rationale no problem but it is a six-month deal okay yeah yeah hours will be fixed by then and it's just that bit where you can can conserve your mates the people that you've got to know and it is a is a little kind of community but it's a bug and once you get it there's no getting rid there's no getting rid and it's you know it is you know i just come back with holiday the last three days on the holiday i was just like right so i think you've got a really good business model but your menu's too big and my wife's going, will you leave the poor guy alone?

34:26I'm just like, but no, you should turn and I'm showing him like somewhere else we went to eat. I'm like, look, they've got two starters, three mains and it's banging and you've got like 50 dishes. He's like, where's that? I'm like, he's like, oh, I've heard of that. I'm going to go there. And it's just, it's just one of those things. It's a preoccupation, not an occupation. It's a constant thing. Wow. Amanda? I can't really bet any of that other than I think it is. it's a joy. I'm a feeder. You know, I want to feed my customers, my friends, the family, the family, Gordon's family, as in the people I work with who are, they are passionate.

35:03They give of themselves. And I think, yeah, it's a great place to be. Lots of challenges. It's always interesting. It's always exciting. There's always something new. It's a good thing to do. Amazing. Any questions? Is that thing working? the uh the power keeps clapping out oh right yeah yeah okay if anyone's got any questions please raise your hand because our little mic's not working sadly but these things happen um and i'll i'll shout it back out and we can go to these guys go for it um my question was very much about your opinions on the way that marketing has very much transformed into this social social world and I remember starting my business when we didn't have Instagram was just just a thing everyone was like lol what um we had old school media we had the Jay Rainers we had the Grace Dens we had this and now it's very much a mixture which I'm not I'm not saying rightly or wrongly but I'd love to know if you guys have opinions of whether you know social media has been so useful for you been incredible for your businesses or if it's been just a brand new echelon to figure out and integrate to everybody who wants to jump in on that um uh so social media for us has basically growing our business from when we started we started when instagram was just kind of um starting to take off 2016.

36:41um and we've just we've had that momentum as instagram has grown and through user generated content um that has basically grown our brand growing our business growing our awareness and we have basically done no marketing up to where we are now and we we have technically have like nine sites but uh and we're now getting to the point where we're like oh shit we actually need to kind of grow up a little bit and do proper marketing because i think the the social side of it is great but i think um we've kind of just relied on other people posting and talking about us whereas i think these days you really need to kind of lean into marketing and not think of it as something that's like on the side and oh should we do a bit at this and by the way we're not actually very good at it but this is something that we're thinking about going forward or like how how do we tell story how do we tell our story to the customer because especially in this kind of day and age where people are very conscious of how much they're going to spend what they're going to spend their money on and you see there's a lot of brands out there that do it really really well and it pays dividends for them so if you can get your story across through marketing through social media then it's it's so worth doing it's so worth kind of telling that story but that's it's a journey that we're starting on now basically so yeah you and social media because it's interesting you started a long time before yes i very much social media person i loving it because the reason why i say that because is how I am presenting Thai food into the world or in London.

38:31If I don't use the social media to expand how fantastic Thai food is. I have been doing this for at least 10 years now. invite all the media like BBC magazines, food magazine Vetros magazine, Influencer about food. I mean basically everything is alerted to the food. Like Thai food, Thai cuisine, Thai ingredients. So I take them to Thailand with me once a year. and we will go into the farm, meeting the farmer who are growing the rye for us, coconut farm, which is we don't use monkey. Pick up our coconut milk. So impossible. But anyway, so that way, social media is really strong for us to introduce our cuisine to the world so I am so glad that this day everyone have the camera they can just take, take, take I am one of them when I cook the food when I cook, my camera eat my food first so put it that way what do you think?

40:03so it's very powerful amazing and you guys yeah yeah we um we've seen that transition from before instagram through to currently and we we use it religiously so we have three guys in-house who are part of the team um and they rotate to create content uh and we have quite a complex plan um that we try and follow but like yesterday you know the lionesses came back so it's like right quick let's get down to um horse guards and take a quick picture of them and and just try we we so we have we react to things that are going on in and around us to try and keep it relevant um and then obviously we're promoting what we're doing the team small little things big things um so we have our trends and then we interject with with random stuff but yeah we love it so we use it a lot and we we do rely on it i think um we sell a lot of gift vouchers and we can we really see the impact of social media when we when we'd have a run on on something with a gift voucher so we generate a lot of income from that um that's quite useful we're just going to be short on time is there any other questions yes mate yeah i'm just gonna ask a question obviously can't not talk about like delivery yeah so i just for the so question is um delivery uber eats deliveroo for a lot of businesses it's about 50 of the revenue coming in how are you navigating that with all the discounts and the offers.

41:41Yeah. Okay, this is very difficult for me to give you the information about, you know, but I tell you something. In the COVID time, every business is dying, but roses keep going we do only delivery. A lot of people tell me shut the restaurant, shut shut, shut. I said no we're going to open. We open only the kitchen right and we only have the person take order and then give the food take the order and then talk to the chef and that time we, you cannot believe what I'm going to say. At that time, we make profit more than we operate the restaurant. And after the COVID, think about it. We're trying so hard to bring the customer back, to sit inside your restaurant, because everybody enjoy themselves, you know, delivery, right?

42:59And it's so difficult. and that time 70 % of our income come from delivery.

43:10So we, myself, the modern, no, the business model, like you said, I prefer not to give the discount, but I prefer to offer something better. you know example like we got our set lunch right saipin set lunch 12 pound but we got a difference dishes that you can taste you can try everything's you know like i mean starter main and then you know all of those drink as well so that that way you know you you offer the customer and you're talking about the delivery, Rosalind is actually, yes, half of our income come from delivery. Because Thai food, one thing, Thai food can pack really well. Deliver it really well.

44:11Yeah? So it's not soggy, everything is perfect. Amazing. Thank you, girl. So, I don't know what restaurant you are? It's from what the pale, we've eaten in the past. what the pit of vegan kebabs oh wow that's good probably travel well as well so it must be very very good delivery you know I mean packaging yeah we'll finish this up with you mate any things I know it's a big part of your business too mate it's a tricky one because it is very much it's becoming a marketplace right where you have to advertise and you have to do offers we kind of try and steer away from offers as much as we can because the margin really does get hit.

44:56But if you can lean on it where you can, it can become a really kind of, really core part of your business. As long as it never interrupts the guest experience, then we find we can make it work because you have the same kind of staffing base and you can transport your brand out of the restaurant want to reach new customers. But yeah, it's a tricky one. It's always a tricky one, balancing that, how much you're going to do adverts or not. And we constantly kind of playing around with it to try and find a sweet spot. But in general, we try and lean into it as much as we can. Guys, we're at time, and I think it's time for burgers and beers on repeat.

45:46And yeah, thank you so much. You're all legends. And yeah, huge round of applause.

45:59Thank you so, so much for listening to the podcast. I really, really do appreciate it. If you liked that episode, only if you liked it, please do give it five stars, subscribe, tell all your friends, families, foes, next door, but one, cat, dog, whatever. Please tell everyone about this podcast. It means the world to me. And I really want to understand what your pain points are as the new wave of challenger food and drink brands. please do hit me up on LinkedIn, search Dan Pope, and hopefully we can together create a more meaningful and powerful podcast for the next wave of challenger food and drink brands.

46:32Thank you so much.