The Warehouse Project and Parklife founder: Dropping Out of School, Petrol Bombed by Salford Gangs, Defying The “Impossible” and Building a Multi-Million Pound Party Empire

0:00Hello there and welcome to Hungry. Hungry is the podcast for the next wave of challenger food and drink brands looking to pull gasoline all over their growth. Each week we'll interview successful founders, thought leaders, unpack their lessons and provide you with a toolkit to scale super fast. I am Dan Pope, I am your host and without further ado, let's get started. Hello, hello, hello. I'm so excited for this one. Sasha Lord has been a dream guest ever since I started the podcast. I went to university in Manchester, I went to Wales Project lots, I went to Parklife lots. I think what he's done for hospitality for Manchester is insane.

0:42So he's been a dream guest since they docked. Sod's law, when you're about to do one of the biggest podcasts of your life, my main audio absolutely bollocksed up. For some reason, I think it's picked up a computer or something, but every 10 seconds it's going ving, ving, ving. Sounds like we're going to fucking Mars or something. So I'm having to use the backup audio, which is annoying, but it's still good. so yeah these things happen it's what happens when you try to build a podcast and then also sash had to like run off uh like about an hour in but he was incredibly kind he was like look i'll give you an extra half an hour on zoom about a week later so this the last half of the uh of the podcast is actually recorded on a different date so that's if you hear the the audio change ever so slightly um that is what is happening but yeah i'm absolutely thrilled and excited for this one um if you get any joy of the podcast please share it with a friend whack on linkedin whack on a whatsapp group whatsapp uh whatsapp group it all really helps thank you so much hello there people and listeners of the hungry podcast today i'm absolutely thrilled to welcome sasha lord onto the podcast and sasha is the the nighttime economy advisor for greater manchester who's appointed by Andy Burnham and he's the chair of Wigginshaw Football Club, co-founder of Warehouse Project and Parklife which as I said before we were hitting record that has some of the best nights of my life you've been the greatest orchestrator of fun especially when I was at uni and you've now got a book coming out, we'll probably try and get this to tie in when this goes live on the 11th of April called Tales from the Dance Floor Not dance floor, it's dance floor My mum's A scouter actually I'm so sorry Having blasphemous things on the dance floor Go to the bath time as well So what I'd like to open with Is Tony Wilson And I was doing A lot of research into how this Mad Chester movement Started in the late 80s and I think I heard on a podcast you said there's almost a match list of two coming.

2:58It's happening. I was speaking to Kim beforehand about I really believe that's happening in food. I think the food in this city is wild. Well, just food though, events. You know, if you'd said to me even five years ago, Dan, if you said, look, you're going to have and it's not even a cup of tea but you're going to have the global Chanel fashion show in the northern quarter in Manchester. I'd be like, man, we've just got the european ncb awards been announced the 10th of november co-op live europe's newest biggest arena is going to be opening it's a really exciting time yeah i also well i went to a place last night i was saying to kim the um black the black fryer yes it's like a park it's basically what a gastro pub should be because it's an actual boozer and an amazing restaurant on the side they haven't tried to to jumble them and i was like yes service the warmth of this city the food um but yeah i want to try and i want to try and go back i want to start with some quotes from um from tony wilson and from yourself actually oh god um so this is what this one i've read in a size interview i don't remember doing this in 2020 and it said this picture shows a cd with tony wilson on the front that brings back fond memories from me also include our hasienda mixtape and a black grape cd given to me by short rider yeah um And we're going to go on to those memories from Tony, because I think he's really interesting.

4:20That's a table in my office at home. Oh, really? Yes. Really? Yeah. That's wild. So I've done a lot of research. He's such a raconteur, a really interesting character. And he has a few quotes. And I hope these are right from mine. He goes, Tony Wilson, this is Manchester. We do things differently here. So just stop you there. Go for it. That's myth. He never said that. Interesting. Everybody used that phrase. He never ever said that Really? Yes I was in the David Lloyd this morning It's everywhere It's everywhere He said he would do things differently He never said it Really? The amount of people who've said quotes And it's not actually attributed to them He said something very similar But he never said that Interesting Let's see this one He talks about the Hacien He says It was like being on a fantastic fairground ride Centrifugal forces throwing us wider and wider but it's alright because there's this brilliant machine at the centre that's going to bring us down to earth that was Manchester how cool was that that is just wild I think it's amazing for listeners Tony was kind of the founder of Factory Records which did New Order Joy Division and then it was kind of the birth of this Manchester but what I'd like Happy Mondays Happy Mondays James yeah which is just it's the best music in the world yeah what I'd love to understand is almost go back 10 to 15 years what What were the tectonic plates that kind of had to happen in Manchester that made it blossom into this Manchester, this fall?

5:53So what triggered Manchester? Yeah, but even before, was there a period of maybe depression in the city? Absolutely. Yeah, what happened? I want to get into that. Can you swear on this podcast? Oh, fucking hell, yeah. There you go. Manchester happened because it was a big fuck-off. That's what it was. Right, so back in that period, Manchester, not just Manchester, Manchester, Liverpool, Leeds, Sheffield, were so bleak, grey and depressing. You've got to talk about Thatcher. We were ignored. The North-South divide was huge. It still is massive. It is nonsense what's going on. But we were being completely ignored.

6:33So it was almost anarchy. We had to create our own fun. That was it. so we started to entertain ourselves hence the bands that came out you've got to reference the Hacienda you know when you went to the Hacienda nightclub it didn't matter whether you were a student, whether you were a postman whether you were a lawyer, whether you were a dentist it didn't matter, we were all there under this one roof to enjoy the music and it was your chapel that was it, the place where you'd worship you'd worship at the E-Jump and that was the moment, it was just us having our fun because we were being ignored we had to entertain ourselves I love that it was all a chapel and I think as well you've got to also possibly ignore you can't ignore the fact that there was also the explosion of ecstasy that's the exact same can you describe the feeling of your first night when you walked into the hacienda what did that feel so this is in the book actually the first time I'd heard all the cool kids talking about the hacienda at school the hacienda is like the place so I thought okay fine we nearly, we have to get sued and a bootie so me and my pal turned up i was wearing my dance suit shirt tie and i ignored what everyone else in the queue was wearing it was a big queue got to the front of the dormant just said listen fuck off you don't have a lot of care i've kind of looked around and everyone else was in t-shirts and jeans so following week turned up in t-shirts and jeans got in and there were 2 000 people it was acid house there was 2 000 people doing the acid house dance arms in the air properly going for it the feeling was just warmth everybody was so lovely it didn't matter that I was a newbie on the block you were welcomed onto the dance floor and I think it was probably only six months later we found out we were the only people probably not in ecstasy yes the what I've always found interesting and we will go on to Tony Wilson because he seems like a super interesting guy but is how you almost took those droplets of magic from the Hacienda in that period and then you start the warehouse project how did you sort of keep those bits of magic but then also forge your own path and your own identity in the warehouse project so the warehouse project came about because i had sankey's yes thank you so in 2000 2006 and during that period um they made a film called this really links into wilson made a film called 24 hour party people.

9:02Steve Figgott. Yes. And Michael Winterbottom, the director, decided if he was going to do it, he'd do it properly. Obviously the Hacienda was closed. So he found a warehouse in Angoats and he rebuilt the Hacienda brick by brick. When I say brick by brick, he was identical. And he invited 1 ,500 people to come down to create a Hacienda dance scene where Coogan was walking around and do the work. Bam was there. Raku made his speech from DJ Box and everything. It was fantastic. And I was there and I actually thought to myself because the Hassan never had a proper goodbye. Bailiff's went in and shut it.

9:39That's what happened during the week. So no one had a final party. What was that? It was the old clothes of money. Right. So he didn't know that Bailiff's were turning up. So that bit in the film is wrong where it said they had that big final party. If it didn't it just got shut immediately. And I thought it would be really cool actually to hold a proper a farewell party back in the rebuilt Hacienda. Found out who the developer was who owned the warehouse, went back, contacted them and said, look, can we do this? Sod lawyers have been pulled down, literally the day after the filming. So we never got to do it, but when it turned up, it was a beautiful warehouse.

10:15It was just a massive empty warehouse. So I was like, well, John Major actually stopped warehouse parties with the criminal justice bill. And I thought it'd be cool to do the first one back in Manchester. So, although I had seen indoors in there, there was still this amazing warehouse. And I went to the council and said, can I have the licence to do the first ever warehouse party? And I think they thought I'd lost the plot and they just kind of played it. Oh yeah, of course you can, of course you can. But the nearest they got to actually putting it on, I think they thought, shit, this guy's actually serious.

10:45He is going to do this. Got the licence and we did a warehouse party in 2003 called Triangle Gathering because it was so raw the sound system was brought on the back of trucks, it felt extremely extremely illegal although the police had to fall license that was also the sea for warehouse projects and i got bored of sun gears 2006 started on warehouse projects hi there guys super super quick one um i write a weekly newsletter called hungry friday feast it goes live at 8am every friday i'm pouring my soul into this bad boy it's probably my favorite creative ender and whatever I've ever done. I basically pick apart all the biggest lessons, all the biggest learnings from all the wonderful guests and throw it into a feast or a newsletter.

11:32We've got over 1 ,200 subscribers. Come and join the party. I'm going to put a link in the show notes. It's right at the top. Subscribe. And if you are already a subscriber, please just forward it on to a friend. Do the amount of favour. It would mean the world to me. Anyway, back to the old episode, boys and girls. So let's talk about Tony Wilson, because he was a character. What was the first day you met him? What did that feel like? What was his influence on you? First day I met him, I was with my ex-paramor, Sanchez David Vincent, and we were talking about putting an event on in the Hacienda.

12:10What year was this? This must have been about 90... Well, I already put a few on on a certain date if it was a joint one together. It must have been about 97. Was it? Maybe. And I remember it clearly because it was freezing and they had an electric heater bizarrely off the desk David was so animated He shoved his pen into the electric heater and shook everything. So I remember it. But My other memories is he had this dog that was What was it now? Those quite big purply colored dogs Bayramma something like that or something I don't know why, I don't know what I did because I love dogs, he hated me and he bit me twice but not even like a playful, like a proper bite but yeah he was just a man on a mission and what's really interesting is everybody talks about Tony Wilson but when he was alive and this is obviously pre-social media where you get your trials and everything.

13:19He used to get trolled quite a lot because he was a hyper, hyper intelligent person. So if you first met him and you were talking to him you'd think, it's a bit patronising some of these words he used to think like, yes but he was just hyper intelligent he wasn't meaning to put anyone down or anything like that but also people also put everything down to him you know the Holy Manchester scene the Hacienda, the music, the label factory, it was also Rob Gregg and his partner I'd argue Rob actually was probably more important how so when he came to the label he was one that was pushing that more but I think because Tony had the airtime on the TV everyone knows him as the face yeah there's always, I always find it interesting with everyone I've spoken to in this podcast there's always kind of the person who gets the the adoration the limelight there's always someone behind the scene who's really kind of the other driving force yeah you said he was a man on a mission you've clearly been or are a man on a mission and uh you've accomplished so many amazing things what were with that man on a mission I'm obsessed with people what drives people I find that fascinating or what gives them the hungry it's reason this podcast is called hungry where did your like relentless drive come from so i didn't really know when to start to write in this book interesting and my co-author luke bainbridge he pointed it out within the first two weeks so when i was growing up my dad went bankrupt so many times and he actually went when i said my grandpa died i don't know he died when my dad was like 21 in his family's business, textile business so everything was handed to him and he was a good business but my dad was a womanizer, an alcoholic gambler, you know he ticked every single box that you wouldn't want as a dad and I just saw everything though you lose a lot so the extent that when he died he died when he was 52 he doesn't need enough money to pay for it and I think seeing that That's not going to be me.

15:41So I'm just trying to find back. And what was your relationship like with your dad? Was it tumultuous? Was it good? Not good at all. No, I didn't speak to him seven years before he died. Just the way he treated my mother. Just not a nice person. Yeah, it's interesting. A lot of people have that, who've had that kind of childhood. It's the, I listened to a podcast with Gordon Ramsay, called it the velocity of jeopardy, which I think is a really interesting way of saying it. there's some hardship that can propel you forward he had all this stuff with his football career going wrong his brother, it's really fascinating you talked about on a podcast this kind of Mad Chester 2.0 talk to me about that it's happening so I've had two bits of luck in my life I always think to succeed you know you can work as hard as you want and that's probably 75 % of it I do think you need a bit of luck as well my luck was two things A.

16:50I've been born in Manchester and B. I've been born in Euromars because when I was in the sixth form that was when we were in Manchester and it was such an exciting moment and you said it yourself the food scene now in Manchester is phenomenal it feels to me I don't know how you I don't know where you drove here You've got the train You drove Yeah But you've seen the cranes And the skyline It's crazy I went for dinner with my mate He lives Like near Salford Yeah Not far from that The Black Friar And We were working out Last time I was there It's 21 Was the last time I'd seen him So you've not seen any Of the skyscrapers In the wild Yeah this is That's crazy But I just think I did an event With the co-op At Part of this podcast is I help we help brands get into the retailers so I do a lot of work with co-op yeah we did an event at our same to Kim at Ramona yes pizza's insane and then there's like a drag show going on it's like it's just it's wild it's like there's more I think down south there's this kind of propensity to be quite up tight and sooty but you come up here it's just it's super relaxed I think we've always been like that though.

18:03Yes, and I think we're realising now people in the north, Manchester and Manchester, you know, Manchester and Liverpool are getting on better than they ever had before. So this is a stand that really annoys me, actually. Looking at the last two decades, there are only two city regions who have a net increase in openings with wider premises. Manchester 10 % Liverpool annoyingly 22 % which creates only being at Manc but the rest of the country I mean London you've probably seen that the chaos over the last couple of weeks where people are calling this out it keeps on the 24 hour city it's closing at half you can't get a pint it's mad and the price of a pint that's the obvious one but it's just ridiculous yes so there's a snootiness to it With the warehouse and park life How did you get those kind of elements Of Manc and Manchester To breathe into those events Because there's not I don't think Especially with the warehouse There's not I can't think Unless you're in Ibiza Of a brand of parties That is so well known Do you know what I mean?

19:18I think that's down to the council That's interesting Yeah So how many You tell me how many other cities in the UK would allow 34-year-olds to walk in and say, do you know what, I now want to start putting on raves between September and New Year's Eve. Every Friday and Saturday, 3 ,000 people in a disused brewery right in the city centre. Then after that, 2007, going back in there, age 35, do you know what, I now want Ruben to put it in the biggest air range shelter from World War II. in the city centre. Then, we moved to Victoria Warehouse, which I hated. Why did you hate Victoria? I had a banging like that.

20:00There is a lot in the book about, he was the landlord, actually. Pretty evil guy. How so? He ran a conservative campaign against the Warehouse project to bring us down. Because when he saw the numbers, we were about two years, when he saw the numbers, he felt he could do it himself. It's my thoughts. behind it yeah that's one thing so we'll get on to kind of the details because this will go live after the book's gone just ending up on that and now they've allowed us to open what was at the time the biggest nightclub in the world in the Tissues Railway Mayfield, 10 ,000 people every Friday and Tatterley there's not another city in the UK that would allow that in the city centre, ok in London you've got drum show it's on the outskirts you know we're right in the middle of the city centre so what I'm trying to get into is what is because right at the beginning when you started this Manchester is different it's everywhere as I say it's in the bloody day for the gym so that difference is relaxing it's not relaxed it's what we can do we can do it now that's my point when I walked in there asking come do this at the Stude Railway most people go no you can't so you can't on the city centre Manchester's attitude is yeah we want more events we need more others we need to be pioneering and that's what makes the difference yeah I was going to add because I think that if I'm diving deep into the well of Manchester it's that we can do it you see it with the bands the Stonehenge all the amazing bands this is my next one who?

21:41Charlie Marr really? yes yeah no way he moved in oh my god I can't believe this there's the Marr's guitar books there. Yeah, as I was sitting up, I was like, that's, yeah. Someone brought that in actually from the security assigned. But a lovely guy. Really? So where are you, are you based in the city now or are you based further out? South Manchester. Right. Okay. Yeah. When he ribbed it, we stopped doing barbecues. I did months. The smell of meat laughing. Around. Yeah. Uh oh, I have just discovered a secret weapon. Please, please, please don't tell anyone. This secret weapon helps you get listed.

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25:13My mate was out of fucking gear, really. We saw us come together, and we looked after each other. And a bit like when I refer back to the Hacienda days, when it didn't matter whether you were posing, student, it was the same then. We were together. We looked after each other. In terms of the tales and the book, what... Let's imagine the tales from the dance floor. I've said that, won't I? if you could pick a tale it doesn't have to be in chronological order that could be when you say this is a film you could pick one tale that would be the opening scene for the movie right what would you pick and then bolstered onto that what song what Manchester based song would you pick to be the opening scene of that film I think the opening scene would actually be the opening chapter of the book which is so the opening chapter of the book was back in 1995 I get a call from Salford gangsters in those days Salford around Manchester there were three there were three gangs Salford Mosside Cheatham Hill all kept themselves in sales there was Salford around the doors and what went behind those doors Salford was money that and I get a call from them to say I'm talking about draws so I get a call from them to say meet us tomorrow three o 'clock outside Drybar.

26:38Drybar was owned by Hacienda on Oldham Street. So I'm stood there, two big 7 series BMWs, tarp, get in the back of the car. It's like okay here we go. So I'm in the back of the car and they set off two cars driving around and they handed me£20 ,000 in cash in a plastic bag. I'm confident he was at Aston Bag, but that's irrelevant. And anyway they said right you're going to hire at the academy on New Year's Eve and here's 20 grand to pay for the rents and the flyers you've got to do that and you're going to sell it out you can take 20 % we'll keep the balance I was like right I don't even promote on you by the way so how old were you at this point you were all right so 23 right so okay I was like right who's going to DJ they went you are you're going to DJ I'm like hey I was like a student promoter I can't DJ what do you mean you can't DJ you DJed us we could have the end of it and sold it out I was like no that's DJ Sasha there's two of us I've got nothing to do with DJ so at that point they stopped the car through me out of the pavement and they realised he's like a rock guy so I think that's a good opening scene and what song would you pick to go with that so from that period it would have to be in Manchester track I think I'd go with 24-hour party people.

28:05By Happy Londays. Yeah. That Hallelujah song. The mix. The mix. I think it's John Carter I want to say. Yeah, I don't know if he's done the mix of that one, but that Hallelujah, but the club mix of that. Yeah. It's one of my favourite songs. It's so amazing. Such a good song. That's an amazing story of the dark underbelly of building everything you've built. Yeah. I read somewhere you got petrol bombed yeah I did well not me personally but the club yeah so look what are those other stories that people don't really won't see do you know what I mean so the petrol bomb incident was when we were going to reopen Sankey's in 2000 and as I said at the time Salford were running the doors and whatever the doors they wrapped they were running what was getting on inside as well it was pretty lawless when you say running the doors that means as in like they were letting in they were basically shotting drugs on the no they had a security company right we did yeah they would get all the security yeah and they'd said to me we want to do the door at Sankey's and the police had told me when we were opening it because Sankey's had been on from 94 to 98 and got shot because of gang issues the police said to me there's no way you haven't solved the door not a chance if you do that we'll shut you immediately so I was like okay fine so I said the software listened to nothing you can do about it I'm really sorry you can't have the door so Sankey's was in an old mill it's called Beehive Mill old copper mill and back in the car park there was a substation that was surrounded by metal fence a steel metal fence so the night before Salford came over they shoved a bed mattress and twined it into the fence poured petrol all over it let the thing go live the substation blew up and what they didn't realise was they thought they'd shut me down I couldn't open well they didn't realise because it was an old mill we had our own generator inside the mill.

30:02So that first night, first two nights, we were partying, having a rave in the middle of an encode. It was completely black because the substation had gone up. So he'd take an encode out, but we were still raving. Really? Yeah. That's wild. What, I listened to a podcast he did, I think it may have been Stephen Bartlett's actually, but it was quite... Do you know what's weird about that? So I did that podcast in 2018. Yeah, I started 2018. I was in an office room in Manchester. It was pitch black. And I remember thinking at the time, no one's having an accident. I'm wasting my time. Most weeks now people go, I heard you on Diary for CEO.

30:43Yeah. I thought it was a great conversation. Really? I thought it was really good. There's a bit I want to talk about, which is the sort of the Ferrari versus bus stop. I don't know if you remember that kind of small story you said. I do, yeah. There's a story of you being in your Ferrari and you naturally, everyone in the bus, in the bus next door to you at the traffic lights, I think it was, looking in, thinking, oh, I wish I was in the Ferrari. And you looking out, we're saying, I wish I was in the bus stop. I still do it now. so by the way I've grown out of my nonsense car periods so yeah that was just probably left about four or five years I'm still doing now so I'm stuck in traffic on the way home most nights my phone like you saw me before we started today I had to like get emails and times I'm pulled from pillar to post so I'm always in the car the phone's going I've got to answer things and then that carries on pretty late at night probably half night or something and I started getting first in the morning at the seminar here and we've got these people on the bus and they're looking at me thinking he's done a lot of himself but actually those people on the bus there's a good chance they're working 9 to 5 and they're going home and that's it they don't open the laps up again until the following morning or they might just walk back into the job before it one night o 'clock don't know how to think about work yeah they've got other pressures like bills and things like that But I always think they're having more fun in their lives.

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34:30What are the other things that people don't see that's hard about running everything you run? I think the obvious one is when things go wrong and we have had very poorly customers. Sadly, a couple of people didn't make it. Most notably was Nick Bonney in 2013, up to anywhere else that we spoke about. And when that happens, obviously for the family and the friends of poor Nick, I can't even imagine what they're going through. But to try and steady the ship in the office, you know, it affects absolutely everybody. And that's always going into events, any event, whether it's warehouse budget or part life, that's my number one fear.

35:22How do you deal with pressure? you seem to be able to deal with from my research I've just listened to some podcasts you seem to have this ability to deal with pressure incredibly well as you say like let's not beat down the bush people go to warehouse and they take drugs they go to part where if they take drugs there's always going to be that risk there and I feel like there'd be a lot of pressure on that how do you cope with that and manage it it's hard it is very very hard I'm not going to lie but we mitigate as much as we possibly can so I'd argue strongly firstly you're never going to stop drugs getting into it you can't if you're getting some strange race prison that's a category 8 prison well am I supposed to do it in the field whoever says stop it you're living in the past so you're never going to be drugs so what you have to do is you have to educate educate educate and I would argue strongly that the warehouse project has got the best facility around at any nightclub.

36:23You walk up now. Even before you walk up and you're clear on the road, you'll wonder why these massive concrete blocks are everywhere. Counter-terrorism. The biggest concern now is a car driving to a ground. That's what we're living with these days. Then you get the security will say to you, go and get a ticket. It's not actually interesting if you're a ticket. It's going to see what you like as a person. It's a bit of a test. If you're a nice person, if you're going to see my ticket for it, you're not going to get in. It's that simple. then you'll queue up and go past the sniffing doors you'll go through a knife arch everybody you know CCTV trail we've got welfare walking around checking people are okay we've got three ambulances we've got doctors paramedics it's like a hospital backstage so we do everything we possibly can to make people safe and I sometimes get criticised of this we do back-up and drug testing and back-up but just to define what that is because we'll take confiscations off the front door.

37:21Yeah. Police will then drive them around the corner to Manchester University where we'll test them on the same night. If there's anything deemed concerning and I get criticised of this, we will put it out on social media. So it might be something like an orange pill with Donald Trump's face on it. I'll go, bang, these are dangerous. Now, a lot of, and it comes straight up on the push notifications on the phone on the Wealth Budget app so people will know that and that and people go, well, you can doubt in drug use you're saying, don't do that. do this i'm not i'm saving lives and i try me on doing this so so you do everything you can to mitigate it for this but there's still a lot of i think pressure not not just even with with with the kind of the horrendous sort of um things that can happen when people as you say get poorly but just even the pressure of running all these businesses how do you i must stop asking for myself because i put myself under a lot of pressure yeah and it's like how do you release that valve do you know i've gotten the most incredible team around me now you met kim for your world teams like kim you've been with me since day one yes pretty rare in this industry for someone to be with you so long um just everybody i think 27 members of staff now and they're all so dedicated and that's the strength of we've got we've bonded as a team what culture do you create to make people stick around for 20 years because there'll be people listening to this who have their own businesses and they're thinking, well, how do we, we can't keep people for two years.

38:48It's almost like the two year hop these days. What did you do differently to keep people for 20 years? Like what should leadership start? Something really resonating with me this week. James Timpson, who I think is incredible. James Timpson, Timpsons. Yes. Oh yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And he said something in a podcast and I agree with him. I think it's the way I've done it. He said most businesses filter down from the top. What's different with Timpsons, what's different with our thing is we've done it from the bottom. So we filter from the bottom upwards. So actually, I think I'm probably the least most important person in this business.

39:30The most important people for me are the people right on the ground. So I think the person putting up the tents at Par Life is more important than me. Someone's doing the catering at Par Life. more importantly they're looking after the troops you know I just come in at the end of the day my confirm year will pay this pay that but I think the people on the ground level are the army, they're the most important people and how do you make them feel that they're the most important because that's two different things do you see what I'm saying? well firstly I know everybody's name so when I walk on site it doesn't matter who you are, you can be the techie you can be the DJ, you can be the guy, cleaners I know everybody and most people know and they'll realise this when reading the book there's probably not one job there that I haven't done myself whether it's stacking the bars so I understand every single element and I respect every single element and there's just no hierarchy here whatsoever and we're doing a podcast saying the door closed that door's not already closed it's always open we just when you've got the music well the music was hit on the wall yeah yeah yeah Kim did say to me she was like do you want to turn that I was like yeah please yeah yeah no it's just because as I say what's fascinating is I've been in Stall Street listening to say Jamie Jones or to things Jamie Jones during in 2014 and I've I've been in in this beautiful kind of warmth as you say this hacienda really this big party but then understanding how that happens from your side is truly interesting the as we kind of talked about earlier the bit about Warehouse being so different and such a unique brand versus everything else, what would you boil the pillars down to, if you could boil it down to these are things that we do differently I can't think of a party in Newcastle, I can't think of a party in Leeds, firstly, we're only between September and New Year's Eve Why was that?

41:3530 shows that stems from when I had Sankey's they were the three months where you actually made money, because it was business reasons that three months where you actually made money for the rest of the year, January's dead February, like March then you come into students' exams and things, Manchester's got the biggest population in Europe with students so they really fed you the exams and stuff so we'd think, right well let's just run September to Christmas, it's un-easy there's no point winning the rest of the year you make money there and you lose it the rest of the year so that's what we did, that was the model we set out but then you break it down, so we take it away from nine months, nine months people wanting it, when's it going to come when's it going to come but also when you look at the 30 events if you're into techno there are five, six techno events with the biggest DJs in the world that you can't really miss, you know it's unavoidable same thing to the room base, same thing to the house so when you look at there's a formula there's probably six different genres that lead into that and that's how it works no one would come to every single way after the party unless you're a drug dealer and they will talk to you yes but then also I'm full of it because I prefer to house and techno right so I'm going to be looking at yeah you're probably right so you wouldn't come to NDC exactly but almost in the consumer's mind in my head I'm looking oh there's only five managers I want to go to exactly but then you're actually capturing all these other kind of sub-genres of dance music.

43:08In terms of the actual venue, you've been at three... Was it three? Was it Bonington's? Bonington's, Store Street, Toy Warehouse, Back to Store Street, Mayfield. So four. Four, though. What's been your favourite party and what's the differences between each? Store Street is our spiritual herb. They were my happiest time, Store Street, most definitely. because it was exciting warehouse budget was relatively new it was manageable we were 2 ,500 there it's now 10 ,000 that's a pretty big leap huge leap huge leap but I think my happiest time was Store Street how big was Victoria because that felt massive 5 ,000 and that's 10 ,000 now and then what's the kind of so we've talked about kind of the scarcity of doing it for three or four months the individual five nights per genre of sub genre but then the actual event itself what you're creating inside how do you approach that what's your or your team approach that that's actually down to sell my business partner you know he's more the creatives so episode we go and most events we're trying to make it feel slightly different so we come to Homer Block for example it's going to feel completely different so if you're coming so worried about Henry the whole production it's not just about the DJ anymore when you get to that site it is about the production and the production scene behind us are phenomenal and some of the light shows I've seen in there even I'm like wow that's really impressive what would you say has been a poignant set or like your favourite set you've seen over obviously you've probably seen some amazing sets I can tell you that people always say to watch a favourite night ever at Storr Street, at Wowsley Bridgeance, and actually it was at Storr Street.

45:09And I mentioned before John Ma, so we had a band coming on called Chic. Yeah. Chic, Chic. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm obsessed with Studio 54. That was in New York. Studio 54. Nightclub. Yeah. and you could probably argue house music came out of that period but it was disco and now Roger's trying to get in one night it was a New Year's Eve and they got not back because his mates had a few drinks and they were in this band so they actually came, they went back to the apartment I think he tells a story, I think they were smoking something and they came out with this track after I coughed 54 54 but actually people liked it so then they changed the lyrics to our freak out so that was it and then bang chic went huge so we haven't played at store street and for the last track the freak brought john bar out and i was like wow this is a real moment this what does that feel like here in your soul um goosebumps i'm so goosebumps moments Oh my god, I am so, so, so excited It feels like Hungary is finally swimming in the big leagues I can't believe this, it's absolutely mental But delighted to announce that Big Fish Yes, Big Fish are part of the podcast Perry's been on the podcast three times Listeners absolutely love it Some of my most downloaded and cherished episodes of all time But Big Fish are behind literally so many brands In your cupboard, in your weekly shop Charlie Bigham, Year Valley, Tyrrells Clipper Tea, Goo, Rana I mean make the list longer than the River Nile But they also share risk and invest In brands that they really believe are a force for good They're brands that they believe are going to be the next big thing Like Howda, the snack that gives back But even more exciting news Big Fish want to speak into the next wave of small Challenger food and drink brands that are destined for big things The Raconteurs, the Movers, Shakers buccaneering visionaries so look if you want to speak to big fish and just have a chat get your brand in front of them then drop me a message my mate louis from local beer amazing beer was in their office aka la fishbowl uh last week chatting to perry freddie and the big fish crew so drop me a message if you would like to speak to we talked a bit earlier about writing the book is quite like a cathartic process I do a lot of writing so I think writing I write every day I think writing is kind of the gateway to the soul and like this creative field of wind that sort of stuff but what else did you learn about Sasha that you didn't expect to learn in the writing of the book?

48:06I think we know lots of funny stories that have gone on a lot of funny stories and it's nice actually because now a couple of people out of the circle so when I said the circle is on HarperCollins circles, there's probably five or six people in there who read it a couple of people out of that circle have now read it and they found it hilarious and the feedback from both those people is they feel like they know me more so it's going to be interesting to see what people say what are some of those stories? I mean there's a lot of funny stories in there I think one of the, one story that wasn't funny actually, one story that was hair raising was 2007.

48:50We, that season, the only night was, well, I'm not even ready at one. Pete Honnick. And we'd sold out every single ticket. No problem at all. And the fire officer came down. We'd sold 2 ,000 tickets. The fire officer came down and said, all your fire exits are on one road here on Store Street. so if there's a fire on Storr Street, you've got a problem, so I'm going to limit your capacity to 1 ,200. We were like, it's not vital. We're going to lose our housing, like literally our houses on this. What's the solution? It's like, well, if you put fire exit through that wall there, then I'll put it back up to 1 ,800.

49:36It was an air raid shelter in World War II, so the walls were about 10 foot thick to start with. So I got in the car and went to see the landlord who waited. The lawyers had changed his name in the book. Don't know why. The person who got his name to Hakeem his name wasn't Hakeem, it was Mr. Tishby. Went to see Mr. Tishby and he's like, not a chance. You're not doing this. If you can't do this, we're going to lose everything. No. He said, furthermore, I don't turn my walk, I'm a war zone by Network Rail. I was like, oh Christ. I said, why don't you speak to Network Rail? He said, you can speak to them, it's probably going to take you about six months to get planning on it.

50:18I said, well, if that's the case, I'm finished. And I got to my car, I was driving over the Mancini Way, and he phoned me back and he said, come see me in half an hour, come see me by yourself. Okay. So I went back to see him, like shaking like a leaf, and just said to me, look, I will not go down to that venue this week. So what do you mean? He said, well, I'm not going to go down to that venue this week. So if anything goes on there, I don't know about it. Do you mean that? He said, I don't know about it. So at that point, me and Sam jumped in his car, a little green or mint green mini at the time, and we found a fir in Salford that had a diamond tip.