Can Cleaning Out Your Closet Create a Whole New You?

0:06Kira Mackenzie: Welcome to the show. So excited to have you. And we got you here so quick. I know. I'm so excited to be here. That never happens. I know. It just, the stars aligned. Kismet. It was very kismet. Yeah. And you were just in New York. Like you had such a big trip. Yeah, that was a really fun one. It was in and out. We were talking about it. It was like 36 hours. I feel like that's the way with New York these days. It is the way. Well, you are extremely busy and you have such a cool job and I can't wait to get you. get into all the things. Thank you. We ask every guest when they come on, how are you going to help us get dressed a little bit better today?

0:36Kira Mackenzie: I think I'm going to take some of the fear out of getting dressed. I would hope that I take a little bit of fear. I used to have a lot of fear getting dressed in the morning. I would get anxiety going to bed of what is my outfit going to be tomorrow? I know that sounds ridiculous, but ever since high school and it just continued on. and the past like six months or so I would say I don't get that anxiety anymore because my closet is like curated to me and my needs instead of feeling like I had to fit into whatever my closet had in store for me that day. So I had a very big personal style moment a year ago.

1:16I got rid of half my closet, literally half of it gone within a day. Things that I had held on to since college, things that I convinced myself I was going to wear again, things that I was overly sentimental about. And I was kind of going through this era where I felt like my clothes hadn't caught up to who I was. And I felt like I just had a mishmash of things that I was trying to make work every day. I was approaching fashion from, as you were saying, a really like actually a fearful place. I was like, OK, how do I make this work? How do I make this feel like me? Yeah. So I had this really big closet clean out moment where I got rid of so many things and had a very strategic plan to bring things back and kind of reassess my closet.

2:01And I was scrolling Instagram last week and an article popped up saying that you had done a really similar thing. And I was in that moment desperate to talk to you about it because I do think it's a huge undertaking. Yeah. A lot of people get overwhelmed by it and also might not know the steps or how to start. So I'm really excited to talk to you today and hear about your experience and kind of compare notes about what that was like in an effort to help people listening be able to do it themselves at home and kind of reach this other side of dressing that you and I think have gotten to where it feels really confident and good and like aligned with who we are on an everyday basis.

2:42So I want to start at the beginning. What was that like initial feeling like where you were like things are not working here? Like what was the catalyst for you within your closet?

2:53Kira Mackenzie: I think it had been a long time coming. It was always difficult for me to get dressed and I don't think that there's any reason to introduce like more difficulty into your life. Like there's enough challenge that we're confronted with on a day-to-day like getting dressed should not be another challenge. What ultimately culminated in that moment when I decided I needed a change was I'd had two kids. My closet didn't fit me properly. And frankly, like I didn't recognize myself in the mirror. And part of that was my wardrobe. But part of that was also like who I was as an individual had obviously changed a lot with becoming a mom like that happens with motherhood.

3:32Kira Mackenzie: So it was that sort of like existential crisis. I hate to call it that, but it was sort of an existential crisis for me where I was like none of this is working and so what I did was I went into my closet and every single item I put it on individually I didn't put it on with anything else because I didn't want to be forced into like oh it works with these pants or whatever put it on individually and if it didn't spark joy even if it was like a beautiful piece I sold it and I think I ended up selling over 500 pieces in total oh my god to the real real and I mean it was they were like Tom Brown runway pieces like there was sick stuff it just did not feel like me right why do you think that people get to that point because I resonate with that where like you can have really great pieces that you hold on to because you feel like you have to I had so many pieces that I was like oh this person gifted this to me or it's a one-of-one or this but it creates so much visual clutter in your closet I had so many things that I was looking at that I was never touching and I think that that increases your decision fatigue of like how to get dressed every day you're not even looking at the pieces pieces that are your options yeah so what do you think for you it was like emotionally about having so many things like were you buying the wrong things did your style change like what was it I mean I think your style just naturally evolves.

4:56Kira Mackenzie: Like I was wearing the same heels and no hate. They were actually like gorgeous heels. They were these John Vito Rossi patent black and like nude pumps. Okay. And I'd had them since I graduated college. It was like my first big girl shoe. And I love them because they were so comfortable and there was nothing wrong with them. They just weren't perfect for where I was in my day. Like I didn't really want a patent situation. I didn't really want like that sharp toe and like the rounded foot silhouette it just like didn't work for me anymore but I held on to them because I was like oh they work and they're still nice I've gotten them resold three times why wouldn't I just keep them and I think similarly if you're like buying a new piece because you see somebody else wear it which I did a lot I got a lot of like inspiration from other people and then I would go out buy the same piece and be like confused why I couldn't make it work the same way that they had.

5:52Kira Mackenzie: And then I would buy a whole outfit and it wouldn't all go together. And I just got to the point where it felt like I was like playing Sudoku in my closet or something. I think in my closet, it was more like I had lived in New York for 10 years and I'd come back to LA and half of my closet was New York and half of it was LA and there was no marriage. Yes. Like it's very, your closet is very situational. You dress for the life you live. I think you're a great example. I know you worked at Set Active before and now you're at MPH Beauty. I can imagine that while you were at set, you were probably in like athleisure all day because that was your surrounding.

6:24A hundred percent. And now you're in a very different role. You're in a C-suite. Like you probably are dressing for something really different.

6:30Kira Mackenzie: Yeah. I think I had 40 different sneakers when I was at set. Like that might actually be an understatement. Like New Balance Asics on. I had so many sneakers and now I literally, I have one pair. I think a lot of people keep a version of something in their closet because it works quote unquote yes right like let's use the black sweater as an example say you have like a v-neck kind of like baggy fit sweater and in your mind you're like oh I have a black sweater but does it fit you right is v-neck really your shape does it look good on you and I was holding on to so many of those pieces like I had so many blazers that I was like oh this is my black blazer but did it actually look good on me no oh my god it didn't fit me right and I had the same thing with so many categories of my clothing dark wash jeans that didn't fit right black flats that like just didn't really work for the shape and the style that I was wearing I think a lot of the times we like check the mental box but we're not willing to like make sure it's the perfect fit for our body type and what we do every day yeah and I think the way that social media works is like you're constantly being convinced that you need something in your wardrobe and it's like a okay you need a loafer yeah and then you're like oh I need a loafer let me go on TikTok and see all of the best loafers that people are buying right now and you're like okay Saint Laurent the row whatever you buy one of them because they're popular right but you're not considering like how you style it what types of pants you wear if it is like the right silhouette for your foot and people get suckered into buying something because it's like popular.

8:09Kira Mackenzie: They feel like they need it instead of just taking their time to find like the actual, like for me, a loafer doesn't work. I bought the Kate. You know, I think it's, this is a great question. I actually do not know. I cannot figure out why a loafer looks like Peter Pan on me, but it does. And maybe it's a mental block. That's okay. Those matter. But I went out, I got those like high vamp kind of like flat loafer mixes from Kate. Okay, yes. And they're really, really pretty. And that is my loafer solve. But it's not the type of loafer that you would see if I was searching, like on Substack, the best loafer to buy.

8:46Do you think that this problem exists because we solely online shop now? I mean, yes and no.

8:54Kira Mackenzie: I think solely online shopping is not necessarily the problem. I think like the cacophony of sameness and like the echo chamber that we live in because of the algorithm and because like frankly more often than not we're too lazy to break ourselves out of our norm I would say I'm not going to blame it all on the algorithm but I do think that it is the sea of sameness I think online shopping actually brings so much more opportunity and choice it just requires you to be a bit contrarian in your approach which is difficult to do in today's society and dedicate more time to finding something that might be a little bit different.

9:36Kira Mackenzie: I actually think that's why AI is really cool. I use AI to shop a lot. Not that I'm shopping a ton, but every time that I do shop, I like to use AI to like make it a more seamless process and bring in some other options that I wouldn't have otherwise seen. Can you dive more into that? What does that process look like? So recently I was looking for jeans. Okay. And if you go online like I think Jean Erica is kind of a vibe right now a flalo is kind of a vibe like I was I bought all of those jeans and they just didn't work for me they didn't fit the Eternet jeans I love them I'm obsessed but they don't fit me okay so I was like okay how do I find this vibe I gave it to instinct are you familiar with instinct I have I have not tried it myself so I'm excited to hear your feedback on it so I I built I'm like very into it I built like an AI chief of staff that lives on a computer always on in my house.

10:29Kira Mackenzie: Her name is Quinn. I basically just created a relationship between Quinn and Instinct. So like Instinct is my Quinn. And so all this to say, Instinct has all of the background in terms of like what I like and what I don't like. And it's doing two things for me. The first is like, A, helping me find brands that are not necessarily fully on my radar yet. So I have it striking, scraping Instagram, which is like, I like to find new things on Instagram primarily, um, and on Pinterest. And then separately, whenever I want a piece and it's sold out, like for instance, when the Comforti jeans from Kate sold out and I was like desperate for them in my size, like instinct found them for me and bought them for me, which is cool.

11:15Wow. So does it alert you? Like you got like a pop-up notification when something's there.

11:19Kira Mackenzie: So it's a text. So it texts me and it says like, hey, found the jeans. Like, let me know if you want to buy them. And then it just sends me a link and I click the link and it buys them. Incredible. Yeah, it's amazing. I think it comes back to like being very specific and intentional about what you want. Like I wasn't, even though they were out of stock, I wasn't going to allow myself to settle for like something similar. When I knew that what I really wanted was out there, I just had to find it. Another thing that takes a lot of patience is cleaning out your closet. yeah so tell me what that day was like where did you start how did you set the vibes I think there's a lot that goes into making sure that goes right that's a great question when I'm doing my closet the first thing and I do this with my mom too because I like to help her with hers put music on every time you have to put music on you have to set a vibe I light a candle I would sage if I had any but I would do that um and the first thing that I did honestly was just like throw out the things that I knew that I didn't want anymore.

12:19Kira Mackenzie: So I had dozens of pairs of leggings. I sound like a hoarder. Like, I don't know. This is so embarrassing. I just took all of the leggings that I knew I didn't like and I put them in a bag and just put it to the side. I did the same with sweats. I did the easy stuff first where I was like, I am going to be in an office. I will not have time to wear all of these pieces. This is the easy bit. And then I did jeans because I feel you can very easily tell if a pair of jeans makes you feel good or not. Honestly, you probably don't have to put them on. And then I did, I do tops last, even though I should probably do them first because tops I think are the more difficult.

12:57Kira Mackenzie: And then jackets were easy as well. Were you trying every single item on? Yes. That was something that for me was non-negotiable. You have to. I had to put every single piece on and that's why I say set the vibes and commit the day because you don't want to half-ass it. And I think not trying everything on is the easiest way to kind of do it a little flippantly. There were so many things that I tried on that had a hole in it that needed to be tailored that once I put on, I was like, does this actually go with anything in my closet? And it's so different looking at it on a hanger than it is on your body.

13:33Kira Mackenzie: You have to put it on. Absolutely. The best thing that I did was go through my closet and schedule a real, real appointment for the next day. There you go. So it's not just sitting there. Exactly. Because if it sits there, you'll crack. You'll pull something out of the pile because you need to wear clothes. This conversation is my kryptonite. Yeah. It's just like I. Yes. Amen. Amen. Everything. Everything. This is my religion. Yeah. Cleaning out the closet in the perfect way. Yeah. I agree with you to do the research before of where you're going to send it, whether it's the real real crossroads, Buffalo Exchange, whatever it is, like do that research before and make the appointment so that the next day it's out of your way.

14:08Kira Mackenzie: Yes. That's a big one. I'm curious, did you mood board at all before you cleaned out your closet of like what you wanted the closet to feel like? Yes, actually, great question. I totally missed that. I made a Pinterest board. Great. I'm like, what do I want my vibe to be? Okay. And I went through it with my stylist, which I know we're gonna get to. And she goes, this is literally the same outfit a thousand different times. And I said, awesome. So we built my wardrobe around what I wanted it to look like, which is essentially like what I'm wearing now. It's just like trousers, a nice top, T-shirt, and heels.

14:41Guess what mine was? What? The same outfit in a million different forms. Love that.

14:46Kira Mackenzie: Did you have like a neckline that you gravitated towards? I didn't have a neckline. I definitely had a silhouette. I, through that experience, really learned that I am a skirt girl. I love a skirt. I feel like my best self in a midi skirt. Yeah. And you know what was actually really interesting? When we went through my closet, I have my at the time I had my closet organized dresses and skirts tops jackets pants underneath that and the skirts were sorted in between all of the dresses by color and so I never saw them and once I looked at my Pinterest board and was like wow I really like I really value a skirt like that's how I want to look like that's the projection I see of myself I was like I need to take all of those pieces out of the shuffle and like the skirts need to be up at the top in front categorized by themselves so I can see them and reach for them.

15:36And ever since then, I have like thrived in my skirt life.

15:40Kira Mackenzie: Honestly, I was so intimidated by a media skirt. I didn't own a single one until I started working with my stylist. Now I wear them all the time. Yep. She just said it was a more feminine approach to like this like tailored bottom that I love. And now I'm obsessed. Did that Pinterest give you any very clear no's that were helpful for you in sifting? You know, yes. Well, okay. I don't know if this actually directly answers the question, but I was shocked because I had so many halternecks on my Pinterest. Oh. I know for a fact, because I follow you on Instagram, that a halterneck is gorgeous on you.

16:14That is your shape. I really love it. But it's actually, this goes back to like, I was never so comfortable in my body to wear

16:21Kira Mackenzie: a halterneck, to be honest. I get it. It is very revealing. Yeah. but I think now that I'm done having kids and I feel like I'm in like good shape I feel so good in my body so like powerful in my body that it's like every time I put on a halter neck it feels like a badge of honor like something that I wish that I could have done my whole life and now I finally can like I've earned that right I love that and I love that this journey in life brought you to be able to like embrace that yeah that is the power of fashion I agree being able to reflect back to us like our experiences and what makes us feel good and what a great thing to carry with you when you're wearing a halter a reminder of all the incredible things that your body has given you and gone through yes very cool okay so what were the no's that you that were helpful um no's that were helpful not a single pair of sweats you would be shocked by the amount of sweats that I owned I actually read in the story that now you only have one pair of sweats and now okay and for those of you who are wondering when I say the story you documented your clean out for Marie Claire and so if you guys want to read it I'm going to link it in the description of this episode so you can check it out um but yeah I read in that story that you only have one or two okay now it's grown which is so normal I think it's important to have two yeah I mean sometimes I work from home it's like more comfortable but they're both like Etern French Terry sweats.

17:44Kira Mackenzie: So they're chic sweats. I think they're chic. Yeah. I mean, it's a little, I still do the oversized top. I should probably do like a cute crop zip, but like sometimes you just want to be. Come on, everybody listening. We're not always, come on, we're not always doing that. No, no. But if I go to the park with my kids, some days I do give in and I'll wear like a legging, but I challenge myself to wear like a baggy jean with a cute crop tee yep or a trouser even basic are you familiar with that oh they actually do this t-shirt um it's called basic yeah oh I've seen it I've just not tried it I love it okay they have these really cool like pinstripe trousers that are pull on sweat vibes yep but they look really nice and tailored so I'll wear those with like a cute v-neck like three-quarter length sleeve tee and call it a day when in the past I would have just thrown on sweats I want to make it clear that neither of us are leggings and sweat pant haters.

18:41No. Because I know that we're not.

18:43Kira Mackenzie: No. But I do want to understand for you what it is that it doesn't resonate for the style that you've built. You know what it is about fashion right now? It is a reflection of what I feel I've earned in terms of how I get to show up in the world, if that makes sense. Like it is not a representation of the work I've put in and the intention of my life and my career to wear like a pair of sweats and meet somebody in that way and I just don't feel as though somebody meeting me or seeing me in my intern sweatsuit and like Uggs is like a fair representation of like the blood sweat and tears that I've put into like my life and my career.

19:33Kira Mackenzie: My mom is the ultimate career woman. She's so cool and she inspired me to love my job but my mom doesn't really, she doesn't wear makeup, she doesn't really like dye her hair, she doesn't really invest in like her wardrobe in that way. She has other like interests and wants and desires and I think I was shamed for a long time, not by her necessarily. But just there was there was a feeling of shame associated with wanting to look good. And I think a lot of young women feel that as they're growing up. And there's also the adverse too. I mean, you see it a lot and you see it a lot in current society.

20:19Like a lot of times the way that a woman presents herself, it is conflated as like the reason why a man misbehaves.

20:29Kira Mackenzie: And I think, again, I'm not trying to make it that deep, but there's all of this like pent up emotion of feeling like negative around how you get dressed and what you wear and how it will impact others. And I never thought about the opportunity to dress for myself and to be proud of the way that I show up in the world. I actually have been practicing getting ready every morning and just like, I don't want to get dressed for other eyes. Like I don't want to get dressed for the thing I'm going to and I think we all do that. I just want to get dressed for me and my joy. I love that. Yeah. I'm going to adopt that.

21:08Kira Mackenzie: It's tough. I'm not going to lie. Good luck. Let me know how it goes. Okay. Because it is true. We get dressed. We get dressed. Oh, you have a meeting with Mary today. Subconsciously, that's going to change how you get dressed. I'm meeting Kira for a podcast. that's gonna change how I get dressed it's really hard to untrain ourselves of that but I think the practice of I'm getting dressed for me I don't care about what people think about me I don't care about the stereotype they're gonna give to me yeah get dressed for you yeah but to your point like there's also the element of dress for your situation the situation you want to be in right like it can be a power move totally do you feel like that was this closet clean out yes was you preparing for a bigger role.

21:46Absolutely. Yeah. Because fashion has the power to do that. It

21:50Kira Mackenzie: absolutely does. It opens doors. Yes. Were there any pieces for you that were extremely hard for you to let go? What was for people listening right now that are in it that are sitting in front of the mirror and are like I can't let go of this. What did you tell yourself in order to get rid of them? I'd been collecting dresses like occasion dresses thinking that I would pass them down to my daughter so I had yeah I used to wear a lot of Zimmerman occasion dresses so I had like a lot of those yep and I just thought eventually I'd pass it down to her and I just felt so emotional about it but eventually I just told myself either she's gonna hate them or she's gonna wear them once and by that point like she'll be able to find something that she loves better um I also I mentioned Tom Brown.

22:40Kira Mackenzie: My brother's fiance used to work for Tom Brown. And so I got like a bunch of really cool pieces genuinely from the runway. And I kept them even though they were like two sizes too big because I was like, one day I will wear this like gorgeous cardigan. But it literally did not fit me. And so those just had to go. The rule that I guided myself with through my clean out was if I haven't worn it in a year it's going oh because if you haven't worn it through all four of those seasons it's probably not in your cycle right the thing that was the exclusion to that rule was vintage like specialty pieces right like gowns or things that I collect I too collect gowns yeah my mom and I have that thing we collect them we share them it's kind of our thing and so that too was kind of my exclusion I kept my wedding dress okay we're not gonna have that Of course.

23:30That's in a box. Obviously. But yeah, like if it's just sitting there and you're like, okay, how many of these do I have? Like, is it really going to get worn? Yeah. I think you let it go. I want to talk about the stylist of it all because I'd be remiss if we didn't bring it up. You and I both have the benefit of working with stylists for this clean out. I also do want to say for everybody listening that personally, and I'll get your opinion on this, I don't think it's a requirement to work with a stylist to accomplish what we accomplished. My personal experience was that the stylist I brought on is a really good friend of mine.

24:05And I think we also had that connection. And so I just don't want anybody listening right now to feel like they can't do this if they don't have a stylist. I'd love to hear what your experience was working with yours.

24:15Kira Mackenzie: I mean, 100%. I think that there's so much great style information. And there are almost pseudo stylists that you can find through Substack. I think that you can identify with somebody in that way. and that they can give you their advice through their platforms. I think what you do need, what everybody needs, is an enabler. You need somebody who will stand in your room with you and say, yes, you can give away, you can sell your whole closet, and we are going to reallocate those funds towards something else. You need somebody who will give you the confidence to say this is the right move. Oh my god, I think I needed a disabler.

24:50I need someone to be like, we're not doing that. Get rid of it. Oh yes, yes, a disabler. You need someone who's like a mix of both. I agree with you. You need a hater. You need someone who's going to, yes, be the blunt hater, but also be the person who's going to give you a little bit of confidence. I think, you know, I did it with Thomas Christos Kiki, who's a really good friend of mine, amazing stylist. And I don't think I could have done it with someone who was random. It's too personal. Yeah. My biggest takeaway from it was do it with someone who, like, you really value as a friend. Because, you know, I was able, he was able to come in there, and I was able to be like, this is my top that I wore to prom.

25:23and he just like laughed so hard and was like fine you can keep it you know what I mean like

25:27Kira Mackenzie: oh good I can't my prom dress too come on who's not keeping their prom dress some things you just have to keep because they mark a moment in time yes yes I think you're right I do think for me it was the reason why I hired a stylist is because I knew the direction I wanted to go in and I didn't know how to get myself there okay so the getting rid of things was the easier part right It was what I did from there that I felt a little bit more like murky and unclear on. And so working with Zoe, I worked with Zoe Stewart, who's an amazing stylist in New York. And she, I mean, we were friendly as well.

26:02Kira Mackenzie: And that makes a huge difference. Like she understood the silhouettes and like that architectural vibe that I was looking for from my closet. And she helped me find like the best midi skirt for my shape and the vibe I wanted or the best trousers. and I think because I didn't have to stumble in the dark trying to find those by myself it made the experience so much more enjoyable. I actually would love to hear about that relationship how did that work I know you were very open in the Marie Claire article about the retainer but I think for people listening a lot of people think that a stylist is reserved for like celebrity in the red carpet yeah so we work off of a retainer basis right now we're working sort of a little bit like I'm working on quarterly like seasonal refreshes if you will nice I love that so like that's the focus and then we do like event focus dressing so like if I need something specific but at this stage like my wardrobe is fairly built out and I know the brands and the styles that I like so we're more like pinch-hitting now but for like a good six months it was back to back every single month.

27:12Kira Mackenzie: She was making me decks. She was telling me what the best offerings were. She was finding new niche brands for me. She was actually organizing a lot of gifting too, which was really helpful. Amazing. I think stylists are helpful in the sense that they also have industry relationships. And obviously like that can benefit you long term. I mean, working with her, it changed the way that I think about like curating and crafting a wardrobe. I don't think I would have gotten there without her I would love to hear about the process of what it was like bringing things back in with her yeah after you purged like did you keep a running list as you were purging what were kind of the mental notes that you guys were taking together as you purged for what like v2 of your closet would be well we found a lot of navy in my wardrobe and it turns out I'm not a navy girl like I never wore it it was all over my wardrobe and she was she was very clear she was like okay everything that we buy like it's not going to be navy and there are a lot of people who like hate heather gray for instance i love gray i think gray looks great on me and i love it so we leaned into like gray black white it was more the palettes um and there was pretty much nothing in my wardrobe that we really wanted to carry over to the new one so it was really about like how do we take this pinterest board and bring it to life in a way that for me comfort and feeling like a mix of tailored but still like casual and approachable was really important so striking that balance was our focus so you really had nothing left after you did this clean no I literally had nothing left there were two weeks where I I actually had no clothes yeah what were you I remember during that era I was feeling very creatively stimulated because I was really making magic out of nothing what was that like for you I mean literally making magic out of nothing yeah I can't even recall what I was wearing I think I had a pair of like Kate jeans left over and I actually I had a pair of click jeans I don't know if you're familiar with Lily Adele's brand yeah love they were I think they're called the Kate she makes petite sizes and I'm quite small yeah so I would wear those with like a sweater from wrangly pretty much every day yeah the in-between yeah the in-between for people listening who might not be able to get a stylist.

29:25Is there a big takeaway that you feel from that experience with her that they can do at home just by listening to this episode with you?

29:33Kira Mackenzie: Yes. Actually, a fair few. I would say step number one is bring somebody in that you trust to get rid of things. They don't necessarily need to be the same person who's going to help guide you going forward. I think creating a Pinterest board is really helpful but I also feel like having archetypes are very helpful. So something that I worked on with her is like creating archetypes of the women that would be my Pinterest board. Okay. Like how they operated in their day-to-day lives. I build out consumer profiles as like part of my job. That's your job. Yeah. So I like to build like a profile around everything.

30:10Kira Mackenzie: So I created these like essentially consumer profiles of like what my Pinterest board, who she would be if she was alive. Okay. And I separate them into like it girls and get girls. So like who I already am and who I could become. Wow. And then. What platform are you doing this on? Oh I just do it manually. You're just writing it. Yeah. So. These are just like feelings, vibes, energies. Yeah. So the way that I structure it and I'm trying to like visualize it is on the left I make like a little mood board of tiled like six four to six images of like women that inspire me that feel like they fit this mold.

30:43Kira Mackenzie: And then I name the girl. And then I give her kind of like age, what she does for a living. And then I write a blurb about like her life. And it could be like what her job is. Does she have kids? Where does she shop on the weekends? What Spotify playlist does she listen to? What does she order from Uber Eats? What other brands is she buying in like the beauty space? And so on and so forth. I get really, really deep. And then I build out kind of like the influencers that she follows and they don't necessarily need to be influencers somewhere like Victoria Beckham for instance so like who's influencing her and then that allows me to then like have a very clear view of the archetype that I'm modeling towards even if she's not me and that allows me to like be much more clear about like oh would Camille wear these trousers like yes or no and you're building those out for different scenarios in your life just to be clear so I built like North Star it girl and get girl.

31:38Kira Mackenzie: So like the it girl was what's attainable within the next calendar year, essentially. Like who am I in this moment of my life and like where I want to be? And then my get girl is who could I be in five to 10 years and what direction is my wardrobe going to move in over that time? Because I know this is extremely formulaic, but I don't necessarily want to like just know where I am now. I need to know where I'm headed so that I can make sure that like every piece that I acquire fits the larger mission. Okay. And how did Zoe interpret that? So Zoe takes those like consumer profiles and then finds the pieces that fit within that space.

32:19I love your brain.

32:21Kira Mackenzie: I don't know. I don't know. Actually, that's quite nerdy, but it really does work. How are you noticing that be beneficial in your everyday life? So it's not only in getting dressed but it's also in the way that I conduct myself okay it's changed building consumer profiles for myself has changed my media diet like what I choose to ingest I don't watch tv anymore um that's controversial I feel very out of the like cultural loop I'm not gonna lie but I read a lot more I do spend a lot of time on social media because of what I do but I like purposely push myself out of what I'm used to seeing for contrarian inputs.

33:07Kira Mackenzie: I read a lot of Substack. I follow people on Substack that I wouldn't have necessarily followed in like an Instagram only world. I found that like my followings on Instagram, TikTok, and Substacks are actually like very, very different. Me as well. I think it's impacted even my word choice and like the music I listen to. What I gravitate towards for home design, it kind of begs this question of like are we who we are innately or can we curate who we want to be what do you think i think it's a mix of both i think you gravitate towards things naturally that are just like in your core in your gut but you'd be remiss if you didn't attribute like some of that to outside influence of where you are in life who you surround yourself with so i don't know if i had to say one or the other, I'd say it's more nurture than nature.

33:59I agree. And I think this is how you curate taste. Yeah. I have never looked at it through curating an archetype, but I do think that putting pen to paper on who you want to be and what you want to surround yourself with is a really good way to manifest what you're going towards.

34:14Kira Mackenzie: Yeah. Who you show up as is a choice. If I'm saying I want a journal, I'm very specific about the type of journal that I buy. and it means I'm like splurging versus saving on things, but I buy less. If I have a hand cream in my bag, what is that hand cream? What is the brand and the product say about me? If I'm using a deodorant, what is that deodorant? I mean, it's very specific. That specificity allows you probably to be very aligned with who you are. I mean, that level of curation is not for everybody. Totally. But I do think it's a good practice at figuring out who you are. Yeah. If not for like, you know, the curatorial vision of it all, like I think you've probably learned so much about yourself, about getting very clear about what you allow into your life and your space.

35:02Thank you for the practice.

35:03Kira Mackenzie: Of course. It's very cool. Let's get into the rebuild. I want to just get high level for you the things that you brought into your closet that you've been loving, using, live and die by since you've brought it in. I want to go through category by category. You said tops was the hardest for you. Yes. What were some ones that you brought in that you feel helped fill the gaps to what you wanted? Okay. so almina concept does like a sleeveless v-neck high v tank that is a great brand i'm very high low i would say with like what i like so those tanks are great just casually because they look put together but they're very very comfortable okay i have this like gorgeous halter like sloan crepe i think the brand is by sloan crepe top in a maroon and a black i wear it constantly um and that's sort of like my going out ish top um and then I would say I gravitate towards Saint Agni there's like another holter that just ties in the back that I wore to death in summer and Lisette their Lauren fabric is incredible so soft I have so much of that it's really good um I love that you had this like assortment of tops because I actually think that when I cleaned out my closet tops for me was the unlock to a new world I think we are millennials we grew up in the going out top and the nice top and the one thing I noticed I was missing in my closet once I had cleaned it out was tank tops t-shirts totally in different colors things that go with the nice pants and nice skirts like again if you are going to sit here and say oh I'm a skirt girl it doesn't always have to be a nice top with it yes I got a ton of tinks from that brand floor floor oh I got them in a ton of different colors and that has dramatically changed how easy it is for me to get dressed in the morning I think we all have to find those things as we're cleaning out like what's the thing that's making it hard for us to get dressed every day and for me it was I just didn't have good easy tops yeah yeah I will shout out basic too like their stuff with a k with a K.

37:07Kira Mackenzie: It is so good. Like they're three quarter length sleeve, like V-neck top. I'm obsessed with them. They're so good. Okay. Bottoms. Anything you brought in that you love? Yes. The Click Tommy pants. A lot of people talk about those in this pod. They're always sold out. I know. Lily, come on. I know she's going to be so annoyed that I said that. Good for her though. I'm really happy for her, but I got to put a pre-order little notification on because I've heard they're amazing. They are incredible. Good for her. I like them better than the Rogala pants. Great. Love that. They're really, really good.

37:38And they're way more affordable. So I'm super happy to hear that. Yes. Yeah.

37:42Kira Mackenzie: A good pair of trousers. These are actually, these are my go-tos. They're a Neely Low 10, actually. Great pants. Very good pants. When you walked in, I was like, that's a good, I love a good cigarette trouser. I like just a nice, straight trouser, you know? But Almina concept, actually, too, does these, like, adjustable waist trousers that have, like buttons on the side like on both sides so if I want to wear them like high-waisted with a pair of flats I totally can but if I want to wear them lower on my hips with the heel I can't they're so good I have them in all colors buying those tonight yeah um shoes anything Jude frankly yeah like a mule I love their mules what is that style called you know what I'm talking yes it's what they became famous for it is a splurge shoe for sure but i think so worth it they're so cool i got like a pair of olive satin ones from them and i just they're my favorite shoe in my closet right now i love that i love everything that they do like funky shoe they're not there's a little oh yeah yeah like fame pumps the fame pumps yeah they're really famous for those those are really good people on youtube have gotten to see those shoes this whole episode i'm jealous of them They're really good.

38:55Kira Mackenzie: And Le Monde Barrel is another really good brand. I love their flats. Also a splurge, but worth it. I got a pair of their micro wedge heels and the sandals, and I have worn those to death, and they're amazing quality. Really, really, really good. Anything else that you brought in that you were a big fan of that you feel is really changing the game? I will say a good pair of Kate boots. Or honestly, a Jimmy Choo. you can get really good Jimmy Choo on The Real Real. You absolutely can. For very, very affordable prices. Yes. It's like a good boot from Jimmy Choo, I would say. I needed like a, I like a high heel because I'm really short.

39:34Kira Mackenzie: Same. I'm always in a heel. I'm always in a heel. Yeah. I needed like a heeled boot that I could wear with a trouser when it got a little bit colder or just so that it was a little more comfortable when I was going out. Right. Yeah. Okay. So tell me now, how are you getting dressed? Are you planning outfits? Are you just feeling confident enough the morning to go rogue? What does it look like now? A little bit of all of the above. Zoe actually recommended that I get one of those like hanging racks. Yep. So I got a hanging rack and everything new just goes on the rack or something that I want to style that week goes on the rack.

40:04I call it like the priorities. Yeah. Like this is what I feel like styling this week. You know, it just got cold in LA. I'm putting some of my jackets on there that I'm excited to style. I highly recommend having a little separate area of just things you're excited about. It really helps encourage a little bit of new inspiration.

40:20Kira Mackenzie: Yeah. And it's really easy to lose things in your closet over time and like totally forget that you have them. I did that with my old wardrobe. I realized I had like five of the same thing because I just kept losing it and forgetting that I owned it. Yep. Yeah. There were like five black sweaters and I was like, we don't need five black sweaters. Just pick one good one. Yeah. Are you visually archiving? Are you taking pictures of all your outfits? What are you doing? I really wish that I could say yes but I can't like honestly what I will say is I plan on doing it and that's something that Quinn is actually going to do for me so like you can take photos of each individual piece in your wardrobe and then this like blows my mind and I can't wait to try it on Sundays you just ask Quinn to create your wardrobe for you for the coming week based off of the weather where you're going to be and what you have on your calendar absolutely and it will just make it for you.

41:09Thank you for coming on the show. Thank you for having me. If you guys want to read more about this entire process, you documented it in Marie Claire. Again, I will put it in the description of this episode. Hearing all of this today was so inspiring.